Episode: 9 - Jack Scarcelli on Moving Beyond One Host, One Vector, One Process for Today’s Cell Line Development

In this episode of Bioprocessing Unfiltered, Jack Scarcelli, senior director and head of cell line development at Sanofi, speaks with host Hussain Dahodwala, professor of upstream process development at University of Maryland’s Institute of Bioscience and Biotechnology Research, to discuss technical and strategic challenges in the next gen cell line development in the biopharmaceutical industry. Scarcelli traces his career journey, shares lessons learned over a successful career, and offers thoughtful advice for early career scientists. Plus, some highlights from the upcoming Bioprocessing Summit in Boston in August and hope for collaboration to shape the future. 

 Links from this episode:  
Bioprocessing Summit
Sanofi 

Bioprocessing Unfiltered: Covering both upstream and downstream processing, analytics, AI and digitization, cell and gene therapy and more, Bioprocessing Unfiltered is your insider’s pass to the researchers tackling—and solving—the day-to-day challenges in the bioprocessing industry. 

Transcript

Views Disclaimer And Welcome

Announcement 0:00

In today's conversation, the views and opinions expressed are those of the presenters and not necessarily those of Sanofi. Welcome to the Bioprocessing Unfiltered podcast. Each month we host conversations with the researchers and leaders tackling and solving the day-to-day challenges of the bioprocessing industry.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 0:28

Welcome to Bioprocessing Unfiltered. I'm your host, Hussain Dahodwala, and this is my first time in the interviewer's chair. And yeah, I'm fired up for this. This series has already had a few famous voices. And I'm here to continue this conversation, which takes us outside of the slide decks, which honestly you will have plenty of in the Bioprocessing Summit coming up in Boston between August 10th and 13th. And today I want to go into the honest behind-the-scene conversations with some of the innovators and builders behind the future of bioprocessing. Kicking off things today, I'm joined by somebody whom I've seen where absolutely every hab that exists. He's an incredible scientist with numerous publications in a very applied field. I have known him to be a motivating leader of a large team, and I've personally had the pleasure of knowing Jack as a thoughtful mentor and a very insightful collaborator. Jack is currently head of cell line development at Sanofi. And here is Jack Scarcelli. Hi, Jack.

Jack Scarcelli 1:38

Hey Hussain, thank you for the kind introduction and looking forward to our conversation as well as the Bioprocessing Summit later this summer.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 1:46

Absolutely. So,

Jack’s Path From Academia To Pharma

Announcement 1:48

Jack, I looked you up on Google Scholar. And what we don't see in your LinkedIn is that around somewhere in the mid-2000s, you have had a large number of publications with hundreds of citations in the mRNA transport nuclear poor complexes field. So, can you tell us a little bit about how you went from a PhD scientist seeking knowledge and into the so-called dark side of biopharmaceline development?

Jack Scarcelli 2:20

Yeah, sure. You know, I, you know, I kind of think of it as almost very consistent, if you will. I've always had an interest in gene expression, which of course mRNA transport is. And I see that, you know, even my function today is really all about gene expression just from a more applied bend. Yeah. So, you know, when I was a PhD student, as you noted, I studied nucleocytoplasmic transport of mRNA. From there, I went on to do a postdoc at New England Biolabs, where my focus was really more still in gene expression, but more in post-translational modifications. I studied glycophosphatylinositol anchors and also kind of got a introduction to m-glycosylation, n-linked glycosylation, which, as we know, is very important for biotherapeutics. After my time at New England Biolabs, I worked at a very small startup called Tetragenetics. And one of the focuses that I had as part of that organization was to build out more human-like N glycosylation in the ciliated Protus tetrahymena thermophila. And a very interesting organism. And it was kind of set up really nicely to do this type of work. But, you know, as you can imagine, with a with the startups, it had its ups and downs.

Jack Scarcelli 3:45

And ultimately, I decided to pivot into big pharma. And this was boy about 12, 14 years ago or so. And at that point, I decided to take kind of my learnings and my interest in in gene expression and move towards cell line development in a large biopharma. I was at Pfizer for many, many years where I worked in cell line development the entire time and kind of got roles of increasing responsibilities. And when I left, you know, I was a group leader there. And today, you know, I came over to Sanofi heading a department that was really focused on innovation in the cell line development space called cell science and technology. And about a year ago, I had the opportunity to kind of combine my old team with the team that was really responsible for delivering our pipeline in the cell line development space. And now I'm the head of cell line development at Sanofi. So I don't see it as really jumping from one from academia to industry. I see it much more linear than that. My interests have been what they've been for the last almost 20 years now. And you know, the work that I do today excites me just as much as when I was a grad student.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 5:05

That is amazing. I want to delve more into this background, but you know what? Let's rewind it a little bit

The First-Grade Moment That Stuck

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 5:12

more. How far back do we have to go to find that moment where you were like, okay, I I'm going to become a scientist?

Jack Scarcelli 5:20

That's a that's a good question. You know, I have this memory of when I was in first grade in art class, we were asked to draw what it is that we wanted to be when we grew up. And I attempted, I guess, to draw myself as a scientist. I think the reason I remember this is because the teacher had no idea what it was. And so, you know, he asked me, what is this? And I try to defend it. I, you know, I remember being kind of upset about it, but you know, I don't know. I guess it it speaks to, you know, maybe it certainly wasn't a traditional career path. And I don't even know if I really realized what it was that I wanted at the time. I think really what kind of appealed to the six-year-old me was the idea of just kind of being able to work on something that you know you knew the most about, you know, just delving into a topic and being the the kind of the the you know, having the opportunity to be someone who who knew the most about something new, working on something, you know, novel, exciting, even though I didn't really know exactly what that meant back then, obviously.

Jack Scarcelli 6:33

You got to do that as a grad student, of course. You know, I worked on projects that you know were you know small, and you know, I was probably a foremost expert on. And you know, I think moving to a field like cell line development, there's a lot more of us, but you know, there are probably still some some nuanced things that you know we're we're still breaking ground, you know, as we speak, not just my team, but all teams, you know, around the world in this space.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 7:00

Wow. What a what a wonderful story. I believe it when you say you're always a very curious person. Before we get into the specifics of the various roles you have had, one thing that always stands out to me when I look at your career trajectory is that I mentioned you had so many grad school publications, but you never seem to have stopped. And you do have a strong publication record in a very applied field. So,

Publishing Versus IP In Industry

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 7:30

what's your philosophy on sharing knowledge versus intellectual property and the competitive edge?

Jack Scarcelli 7:38

Yeah, that that's a good question. You know, publications have always meant a lot to me. Obviously, they meant they mean a lot to people in in academia. That's kind of you know their their currency, if you will. I don't I mean, today, obviously that's not quite as true for me in my role today, but I still they they still hold a very important piece. I think there's a lot to be learned from you know what we do to the other, you know, to the other groups, you know, either academic or industry. And in turn, you know, there's a lot that we can learn as well from from other teams.

Jack Scarcelli 8:20

So I see publication as a very important piece of what it is that we do, whether that be, you know, journals as as you described, or presentations at you know, conferences such as a Bioprocessing Summit, or even you know, just things like book chapters and and application notes, that that sort of thing. I think it's important that we learn from one another. You know, it's I understand the intellectual property and competitive edge, and yeah, there's a piece to that, right? I mean, we're you know, we're in we're in a business. It's a luxury that we get to be able to to publish when we can. But I think there's really something to be said for publishing from industry. It's you know, personally, I'd much rather do that than have a patent application. That's just kind of how I operate, even though you know that that can't always be. For that too.

How Leadership Expectations Change

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 9:17

So as you have transitioned from your various roles, and you have had the absolute privilege, I would think, to lead some very large teams at some of the world's largest organizations. Looking back, what kind of a leader did you think you'd be early on? And how has that evolved or changed over time?

Jack Scarcelli 9:42

Oh boy, that's a good question. You know, I think when, you know, especially when you're not in leadership, you kind of have a view or vision of what you think it ought to be. And I'd imagine most people that actually start to lead large teams quickly realize that they, you know, maybe had just pieces of the truth from their previous perspective and it didn't really appreciate everything that was that was a part of the job. So I'd say, you know, when I was an individual contributor, I had a a view of things that I might do differently from managers or or or leaders or mentors, but I feel like I was relatively grounded in that, you know, I did know, hey, I don't have the whole picture here. You know, I think that when I think back to to some of the the leaders and and mentors I had that kind of shape shaped me, you know, one person I think of was obviously my grad advisor, Chuck Cole. If if you know him, he was very good mentor, I think, but he was very hands-off. And I'll just be brutally honest to you, there were times where that really frustrated me as a graduate student, but now I can look back, you know, all these years later, and I have should probably thank him for that because I think it built me in a way. And it kind of gave me some independence, and this it trained me to think more broadly than the work that was in front of me. And that probably ultimately started to equip me towards being able to lead larger initiatives, larger teams towards success. Very, very insightful. I'm I I'm thinking you might be the right person for this question. I've always wanted to ask somebody.

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Announcement 11:50

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Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 12:07

As

Knowing When You’re Ready To Move

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 12:08

you're transitioning, as also an advice for somebody younger in their career. How do you know you are ready for the next change?

Jack Scarcelli 12:20

That's really tough. I don't know if you really, you know, I'm not sure that you ever are certain, but you know, I think I think that, you know, some people even myself included, you know, could have some doubts, right? I mean, you might get comfortable, you might get you might you know have a day where you say, geez, am I really the right person for this? And you know, I think my advice has always been to just stay curious, give yourself some grace, but you know, really try to, you know, better understand the big picture. I think a lot of it comes back to that. And if you don't know something, ask. Don't be afraid to ask. You know, not not knowing is not the issue, not doing something about it is.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 13:18

Very cool. That's that is food for thought. H . All

Keynote Prep And Automation Wins

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 13:24

right, shifting gears a little. I think we are all very excited about attending your keynote coming up in the Bioprocessing Summit. But beyond the slides, is there something while you were putting your keynote together that a story or a background anecdote that you think didn't really fit into your keynote presentation that you'd be willing to share with us today here.

Jack Scarcelli 13:55

Let me think. Yeah, I mean, I'm just starting to put it together. You know, I think that you know, some of the things that that you know maybe don't quite quite fit, you know, we're we're doing a lot of stuff, right? I mean, it's it's and I've got what 25 minutes to to speak. So I won't be able to do justice to all the great work that my team is is doing, obviously. But you know, I think if I if I think about some of the stuff that I'm not talking about, that I'm probably most proud of that I just won't have time to speak on is really some of the the great advancements we're making in automation within cell line development. We've got a you know, really great strides I've seen this team make over the past couple of years and now just a couple of months, that I'm excited to maybe talk about in a future event or you know, hopefully maybe even better, and one of them come and talk about it.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 14:55

Yeah. No, we keep hearing, we we hear more and more about the need for automation to get us out of this labor-intensive deficit that we face. But

Moving Beyond One Vector One Process

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 15:07

beyond that, do you think today in cell line, are we at that point where, according to you, did does the field need any fundamental changes? And is there a question that you think we are not asking today when it comes to cell line development?

Jack Scarcelli 15:25

Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, I think there are probably it depends on, you know, this could this could be a very specific question for you know different groups. And when I say groups, you know, you have to consider things like the portfolio that they're trying to develop, the the the the molecules, the breadth of them, and you know what, what what are the needs? Is this you know a clinical, preclinical group that you know is really just racing to get the ind and and you know, maybe taking some risks up front, or is this a more mature organization that yeah, they want to go fast, but they you know have an eye towards commercialization, you know, always in in what they do. So I, you know, I think part of it is is really balancing that that need is probably something that that is that is still something organizations struggle with and you know that goes beyond cell line development. You know, in terms of the technical within our field, , you know, the way at least you know some of the things that that we're facing, you know, when I started in cell line development, you know, you kind of had one host, one vector, one process. And that worked really well for monoclonals.

Jack Scarcelli 16:51

But, you know, as you probably know, we've advanced beyond a lot of those modalities and in that format. So, you know, I think probably themes this theme will come out in my keynote that I just feel like this one vector, one process mindset is is dying. And that, you know, as a as cell line development organizations, we need to be much more flexible to accommodate the demands of our portfolios.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 17:23

So that is a really great example of a type of a mind shift that is needed. Are there any technological advancements out there that people should be leveraging to achieve this ease of transition from one modality, one mindset, even?

AI Needs Structured Data First

Jack Scarcelli 17:44

Yeah, well, I mean, I think the obvious one that's on everyone's mind is AI and machine learning. But, you know, I think the the bottleneck there for applications in the cell line development space, and you know, I'm not the only voice saying this, is just the the structuring of data and having data available to feed these types of models. So, you know, that's something that I'd imagine a lot of us are thinking about today, and trying to, you know, and and then the question then becomes well, how much data do you need?

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 18:16

Sure.

Jack Scarcelli 18:17

You know, but my philosophy is if you don't start building it, you're never gonna have enough, right?

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 18:23

Yes, yes, and that takes us back to our original talking point, where you emphasize the need for more publications, more knowledge output. And I'm glad that you are a leader in a space where your voice will be heard about these questions, and hopefully we can make great strides in just the large language models that are required for these AI trainings. That is amazing to hear. Thinking more about your keynote talk, what is the one question that you would like people to walk away with after attending your talk?

Jack Scarcelli 19:04

I think what I what you know, I'm again I'm still putting it together, but if I, you know, if I had to project today, I would say that, you know, I think as we talk about these, you know, what I just mentioned in terms of flexibility and and building the capabilities to accommodate a large number of molecules and formats. I think there's a lot of fundamental learnings that still need to be done in order to really consistently and robustly do it. And I hope to show a little of that during my keynote.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 19:45

Back soon. I don't know this is going to be one of your first Bioprocessing Summit just because of the timings of things. But looking at your session track, there are a couple of real powerhouses in there without playing favorites. Is there any topic or people that you're looking forward to hearing in these conferences?

Jack Scarcelli 20:07

Yeah,

Conference Talks They’re Excited To Hear

Jack Scarcelli 20:08

sure. This is gonna be my first Bioprocessing Summit. This is the first year it hasn't conflicted with my family's vacation. So I get to come. But yeah, I took a look at the at the schedule, and yeah, you're you're right. There's a lot, there's gonna be a lot of good talks in there. I'm humbled to be able to be among them. You know, when I took a look, I saw Nathan Lewis is presenting. He always tells a great story, regardless of the topic. I mean, he he works on a large breadth of of topics within the cell line upstream bioprocessing space. So it it will be, you know, I'm sure his talk will be well received and and looking forward to hearing. I recently had the opportunity to interact with Christina Elvis at a day-long session of round round tables and and that sort of thing, and you know, looking forward to to hearing her talk. And then also within my session, it'd be remiss if I didn't mention to one of my former colleagues at Pfizer, Laura Zellowitz. I saw she was going to be presenting. It's always good to see what my former team is up to.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 21:17

All right. No,

Bioprocessing Summit Plans And Closing

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 21:19

it looks like a fun-packed conference, and I'm really looking forward to both continuing our conversation when we meet in person. It's been a few years, I think, since met you in person at a conference.

Jack Scarcelli 21:31

That's a launch.

Hussain Nuruddin Dahodwala 21:34

I look forward to hearing from you, and I hope to catch up in person because there are so many interesting things happening both in your organization and in your previous organizations. I would love some introductions with people. And for everybody listening, I thank you for your interest. Both Jack and I are going to be at the Bioprocessing Summit in Boston, August 10 to 13. Please, please, we look forward to interacting with you. Come and catch up with us. Jack is way more friendlier in person than you have seen him even in this conversation today. Thanks, everybody.

Jack Scarcelli 22:08

Thank you, everybody. Thanks, Hussain.