The Chaos of Season 4: We Have Thoughts

In this episode, I’m joined by my friend Amanda as we dive into all the drama from Season 4 of The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. From shocking twists to messy breakups (and even messier “makeups”), we unpack everything that had us talking. We also get into the frustrating reality of how toxic men somehow still manage to keep pulling girls—and yes, we have opinions. It’s an unfiltered, honest, and sometimes hilarious breakdown of the season, plus our thoughts on where things could go next. And of course, we’re already looking ahead to Season 5.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Hi guys, and welcome to Let's Laugh with Valentina. Today I have my friend Amanda here. Amanda say hi. Hi. And a lot went on today. We're gonna get into it. We're gonna talk about Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. We're not gonna make it all about Taylor, even though we know Taylor is definitely at the forefront right now, but we have a lot, a lot to get into. So I think for starters, like just give like an explanation on what Secret Lives of Mormon Wives is. Some people don't know what it is. Essentially, it's a relatively new reality TV show about these Mormon moms who came together, I think during COVID, and then started making TikToks together, and they call themselves Mom Talk. Interesting that the show's called Mormon Wives because they're not all wives. Some are single, some are a lot are divorced, um, they're not all wives, but they're all moms. So pretty much the show should probably be called mom talk. Yeah. Yeah, would you agree? I agree, yeah. Um, but that's that's pretty much it. They're Mormons though, in the sense that they don't follow regular Mormon cult culture because like someone made a comment to me the other day and they were like they're trying to break the Mormon culture, they're not gonna be able to do that.

SPEAKER_02 1:27

They're trying to break that whole stigma of Mormons and what they should follow and the church and this and that. They're trying to break that.

SPEAKER_00 1:35

Exactly. So they some of them do drink. Um they they a lot of the women are the breadwinner, which is like very off culture for Mormonism, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 1:47

It's yeah, it's usually the husband that's brings in the bread and a lot in this show and in this part of life, like they bring the money in, and their husbands are like the stay-at-home fathers in a way, which is not normal for Mormons at all.

SPEAKER_00 2:01

Exactly. So now you get the show. So now let's get into it. I think, like, for starters, like just too like off the bat, did you expect Dakota to ever see Taylor's friend? Like to be seeing one of Taylor's friends.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Looking back at it, I'm not surprised, but I am in a way. Like, I'm disappointed. Like, I'm like, I didn't expect it, but now seeing like all of his patterns and like everything that he has done in the past, like I'm not surprised.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

No, you're right. When like you look back and you look at the patterns, like that's definitely on par. Yeah. That's definitely on par with his past behavior. It's just so unfortunate because like I would learn from my mistakes.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

Like, you would think like somebody would learn, but at the end of the day, like, Dakota is an addict, and like he does have bad like addiction type.

SPEAKER_00 2:58

I think he's addicted to making Taylor upset.

SPEAKER_02 3:01

He's addicted to Taylor, he wants Taylor, they like to fight, they like to argue, they like to just be that toxic couple. That's why he's always like, we should just be together because we won't be toxic. And it's like at the end of the day, you still will be toxic no matter what.

SPEAKER_00 3:14

Yes, I just watched episode 10 last night. I just finished, like, obviously in prep for the podcast, and yeah, you're 100% right. That's literally what he said. It's so fucking nuts. Going through season four, I think for starters, I'm so happy that Demi's not in it. See, could I can't stand her? No, I actually I can't fucking stand her. It's like not to like discredit like anything she's been through, but like it takes two to tango in some scenarios, and I do find it interesting that like Lisa Vanderpump has come out thousand percent.

SPEAKER_02 3:51

I feel like Lisa coming out said in sewn and like literally confirmed it for everybody that Demi, you're a liar, liar, liar, like you're a liar, and you're not telling the truth right now. Yeah, and she was there through Vanderpump, she was there through the villa, she was there through all of it where she knows that. She said I watch every single image, exactly, and the girls have a reason not to fully believe and she's trying to make Jen look like this liar and this crazy person where Jen is just speaking the truth, and like I think that she's just like a bullshit liar.

SPEAKER_00 4:24

Yeah, I do and so like not having Demian this season honestly was like amazing for me because I feel like there's so many incidents where like she just would make me so mad, like she would just like piss me the fuck off. And honestly, it's like for the better. Like, don't even don't she goes in circles, like the girls have been saying, like, you're just going in circles and you're literally.

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Your story never makes sense. You're crying for within yourself. Exactly. Your story's constantly changing, you're never making sense, nothing's ever adding up, like you're just making things up as the day comes, and you're a liar at the end of the day. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 4:57

And then also potentially an unpopular opinion, I'm not totally sure. Curious. Um, I think Whitney's really come back this season. She used to be on my shit list. I season one hate, hate whitney, hate, hate Whitney. Love Demi actually. So really like opposites right now.

SPEAKER_02 5:15

Wait, so I I feel like I hate to be the person to be like I'm not sure. No, like I'm following the crowd, but like genuinely love Whitney this season. Like Whitney and Connor, like I just like that. They are like so true. And like I, in a way, see myself in Whitney where she's just like, let's just like be honest, like, let's just not have this bullshit and be straight up and like call each other out for what it is.

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Wait, by the way, like, sorry, we're kind of jumping, we're not really jumping, but like in I think it was like episode eight or nine, when Whitney says to Jen, like, okay, fuck you. I'm like, I'd be the same way. I'd be the same way. I didn't think she was wrong for that. And I wait, I can't even believe that she was gonna apologize.

SPEAKER_02 5:59

Same, and I think that Jen was in the wrong, and Jen pissed me off. When that whole thing happened, Jen pissed me off. What? I was like, wait, time out. You're literally trying to act like a victim right now where Whitney's eating you up and stating facts.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

Wait, eating you up and stating facts, and then and all you have is you just look at her, well, maybe I didn't do that because we I didn't think that we were friends. What? Literally crazy.

SPEAKER_02 6:22

What? Make it make sense.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

If I ever went to somebody, any one of my friends, and I go, Well, maybe I just don't think that we're genuine friends, and they didn't respond to me. Okay, fuck you, I would say, is there something wrong with you? Like, like that's a very normal response. Whitney thinks that she's friends with you, Jen. You respond to her, well, maybe I just don't think we're genuine friends, and she responds, fuck you to fuck you to you. That is completely normal and valid, and I stand by it 100%.

SPEAKER_02 6:53

I agree. And I feel like at the end of the day, it comes down to jealousy within the dancing with the stars.

SPEAKER_00 6:59

It was so very fucking clear that you were jealous because I watched every second of Dancing with the Stars, and no offense that you were not that fucking girl. No, she was not.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

Her opening act, I would have literally she got a higher score than what she should have had. I kind of agree. Whitney should be. Whitney's actually really fucking talented and good. I don't know what else to say. Sorry. Uh hello, she's on Broadway now. That's exactly why she's on Broadway and she got the offers that she did because she is good at what she does.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

She is like, are you also then gonna be mad at fucking like I just feel like it doesn't even make sense? It's like, I listen, I get it. Be upset. Like it's thousand percent.

SPEAKER_02 7:31

I think that in in some she took her anger out on jealousy within Whitney and within mom talk. Like it it just became like a rivalry within mom talk of like who got the opportunity. Like, Jen wasn't happy when Whitney got that opportunity as well. Like, Jen wanted to be the only mom talk that had this opportunity, and once Whitney got it, sh that's when her demeanor went up, and she was like, eh, actually, I'm not having this.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

110. And also, I feel like, and you can I don't know if you agree or disagree with that. I think that jealousy is a normal feeling, like to an extent. Thousand percent. To an extent, like you can still be happy for someone, you can still be happy for someone and be like, oh, I wish that was that was me. What about like the it's normal?

SPEAKER_02 8:14

It came from like when she went on the live and was like, I'm not voting for Whitney.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

I always voted for Whitney from day one, and I stuck with it because I fucking felt always like Jen was like manipulative and conniving, and also the fact that she said former mom talk member, like putting mom aside from dancing with the stars, Whitney is a great fucking dancer 100%.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

So also I vote for the best dancer, sorry, Jen that you weren't it. I don't know what to tell you. Dancing with the stars is about the dancer, it's not about the mom talk, it's not about the drama, it's not about who I like more, it's about the dancer. At the point, Whitney was the better dancer. Did I like Whitney at the start? She wasn't my favorite. I loved Ben Jen. I was voting for her, but Oh, you voted for Jen. Like I was rooting for her.

SPEAKER_00 8:53

And like I know it's like it's a safe place. No, it's a thousand percent.

SPEAKER_02 8:57

I was rooting for her, but at the end of the day, like Whitney was the better dancer. And a hundred percent to me, Jen wasn't, she wasn't that good.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

Okay, so different topic. Things that shocked us this season. I think for starters, it shocked me that Taylor was gonna be the bachelorette, which doesn't really happen this season, but we can kind of see. We can kind of get into it. I feel like when she first came out, even though I hadn't obviously seen season four yet, it's just I think that The Bachelor was.

SPEAKER_02 9:31

She should have said no. The Bachelor.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

I feel like that almost put more pressure on her to make terrible decisions before it was almost like her the entire season four was Taylor's bachelorette party where she was like acting like a lunatic because she was like, I'm gonna be tied out in like six weeks. Yeah, and I feel like I get why she said yes, because it was like her way out of Dakota. Unfortunately, we're seeing it unravel where it was not your way out of Dakota, and unfortunately, we can't even watch the fucking show now because of how much you were still unraveled in Dakota, literally. And as a fan of Bachelor Nation and stuff, it's like that fucking sucks for me.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

I was looking forward to so I can say from the other side, I've never watched The Bachelor, Bachelor. Never no, I'm I'm not a I don't watch that, and I was looking forward to this season because of Taylor Frankie Paul. Like I was like, you're a Mormon fan fan fan fan fan.

SPEAKER_00 10:30

I'm a Mormon wives fan, and I only was watching it because she was gonna be on it, and I was looking forward to the season, but now everything's happening, and obviously the Bachelorette's not coming out, and I do feel like unfortunately she was she has shown symptoms of being too unstable to too unstable to handle something like that, and I get that the network wanted to like get views.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

But the Bachelorette Nation and Bachelor Nation like was very disappointed in the fact that they were taking another famous influencer-esque, like somebody that has a past in social media, like they were not happy that they were bringing somebody else on the show. Well, I have a lot of things that had a past. I have that was going to bring them a lot of views because, like I said, I never watched it, so like it was bringing my views, so that's another view they got.

SPEAKER_00 11:20

Okay. Another shocking thing is Jesse and Jordan slipping together. I I don't know. What do you think is gonna happen? I fucking love Jesse. I just want to say this here.

SPEAKER_02 11:31

I I'm a Jesse fan. Same, and I think that I stand by I at the end of the season I watched the whole thing through. I feel bad for her because she did that the prenup was not signed. Because I do think that at the end of the day, he could be that type of person to bounce back and take that money from her and her children.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

She's just can it's just like you're caught up. You see how amazing. I'm not gonna lie, I do feel like she's an entrepreneur. And and I feel like she's finding her, like, like what you get from a relationship. I feel like she's finding it in her career. Does that make sense? Thousand percent. Almost like, almost in like the old school, I feel like man thing is like he's like, I have a wife at home, but like I find my purpose in my career.

SPEAKER_02 12:13

Like, not that you're her purpose, is her career, she's thriving. She does not need him. If anything, he's holding her back a hundred. Like, he bothers me. And and and while we're on this talk of him, yeah, let's talk about the the truth box that he brought out. Pissed me off. That pissed me off so bad because you're literally trying to be just like the wives. Like you're just trying to be in it for the plot, you're just trying to be in it for the drama, like you're just trying to do this for the views, and like that just goes to show you, and you bring that out at like a very low point within mom talk, like knowing that that was gonna stir shit up, and I know that's why they do it, and that's why mom talk does it, but then for dad talk to be bringing that in and him to bring that out was actually.

SPEAKER_00 12:57

I could have had anyone else bring it out, and I feel like I would have felt differently. But the fact that Jordan like initiated it, it was just like so lame and weird.

SPEAKER_02 13:04

Same. Yeah, I agree. I just I'm just not a fan of him. I don't like him.

SPEAKER_00 13:09

Well, I just feel like Jesse's so amazing, and like a mat picture this picture Jesse with like a guy that like work like literally worships her. Like, I feel like everything with Jordan is like you did your best. Like you did your best. It's like it's always like it's like it's like a it's like a compliment with like a setback. A setback, yeah. Yeah, I just like I picture she's so amazing. You can tell that she has a beautiful, beautiful heart. Like, she's the friend that goes and finds Layla, uh eating therapist, or like whatever it is like the best one. That was so but that's the kind of friend I can tell she is. I can tell, I can sniff it. Yeah, I can fully tell that Jessie's like, she's the friend that's like fuck unwell. Obviously, like if you need me there, like I'm gonna be there. Yes, a hundred percent. She's like, I don't fucking need that. Like, a hundred opportunities come all the time. Like, I love you, like you're my friend. You can tell that that's the type of friend she is. She's a girl's girl. She's a girl's girl. Through through, and that's I and I almost feel like that in a way has kept her longer with Jordan than necessary because she gets that from current, she's thriving in career and thriving in friendship, and like doesn't really need him, and he's and it's just like, okay, so I have this like gnat following me around, and like I swat it a couple times and like whatever, but it's like just imagine also, like a guy should be the whipped cream on your Sunday, not like your whole Sunday, right? Yeah, so like imagine this guy with her that's like loves her, worships her, thinks she's the most amazing thing, only makes her life easier. And like, you know what I'm like, you know? Yeah, like I feel like she can get better, and I don't think I think that like she's thriving, but I almost feel like I could see it even more.

SPEAKER_02 14:47

But you also can see at the end of this season that she knows that like her talking about the prenup, her talking with her father about the divorce, her mentioning like I don't know where the future is going. No, you know where it's going, you know it's coming to an end. I don't know because I think I think she's worried about the whole situation of him taking things from her.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

Do you know what I also have to say? But she doesn't think she's scared to be alone. Oh, I don't think she's scared to be alone at all. Really? No, not at all. I don't do I don't think she's scared to be alone. Um, I think that she's very selfless and she lives for other people in moments, and I think that there's probably a part of her that's living for her kids on having a together household because she got a divorce before, but she didn't have kids with that person. True. So I think that there's probably a part of her that's like kids having a messy, not messy, but like a technically broken household. A broken home, yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, I totally that I she doesn't talk about that, but I bet I bet that goes through her head. That goes through her head and 100%, you know. I don't think she cares about being alone. I think she probably spends a lot of time alone traveling with work. I think it's probably her best moment. It's a good point of view because that is very true. Like looking now, she probably spends a lot of time alone, actually. And that's probably literally the best her best time.

SPEAKER_02 16:07

Hello, wait, time out. She actually does, and you're not wrong because she's at the hyatt most of the time.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

Oh, yeah. That's it.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

So yeah, she is she is more alone than she is with him.

SPEAKER_00 16:16

So yeah, it's not her worrying about being alone, but it's more of the fact that I mean it's also I do understand like her, she's talked about this on pod podcasts before that I've listened to, and like her, like when she says, like, this is gonna affect my family, like the financial stuff. Her family all works at the salon. They all are like I mean, her dad is, I guess, her business partner, but like they're all like doing well, like being.

SPEAKER_01 16:42

Oh, they're successful, like her family.

SPEAKER_00 16:44

Like, she's she's basically paying her family like very, very, very fucking well, more than I'm sure like any of us would get paid just to work at like a hair salon. Yeah, so I think that that would also affect it, and like I just feel like she's living a little bit for other people. Like, I think she's a super selfless person, almost to a fall. I feel like that's what a thousand percent agree. That's like what her downfall is, but it's like a weird downfall to have because it's like an amazing quality, exactly, but to to any extent, it's too much. Okay, another oh, this shock the fuck out of me. Layla and Mason breaking. Wait, I was just they obviously don't talk about it on the show, but they need to. I wish they did because I'm sure they will season five.

SPEAKER_02 17:28

I hope they do because I want to actually know what happened.

SPEAKER_00 17:32

I love them together so much. Like, one, they physically look perfect together. Like, that's a separate note, but that's just something I gotta mention. And number two, I feel like actually Mason's like a really good guy. Like him in like the last episode going up to um going up to Macy and being like, I'm like, I only have an hour left of your book. I'm doing the audio.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

That was so and and Macy opened up her eyes to Chase and him at that point, and we're like, wow, maybe the family isn't so fucked up. Like maybe they are actually good people.

SPEAKER_00 17:59

I mean, whatever about Chase. Chase is sexy, I don't know. But Macy, or not Macy, Mason, right?

SPEAKER_02 18:08

I feel like he's I like he was great, and I do feel like Layla was a little hard on him in the part of like when he made it. See, I disagree.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

I don't think that she was hard on him.

SPEAKER_02 18:17

No, in the part, and he took it well, he took it well, but I'm just saying I felt like she was a little too much like I don't care about your opinion about my kids because they're my kids, but at the end of the day, but he's not wrong, where it's like you shouldn't let your kids walk all over you. And maybe you do need that father figure in your life to say, like, oh, he don't know. They do have a father like involved.

SPEAKER_00 18:37

Do they? Yes, I think that that was kind of her point. It was like they have a father that loves them, and they have like I don't need you to be their father.

SPEAKER_02 18:43

Yes. But like that's a thing. Like, I don't know anything about their dad, like I never hear about their dad.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

I don't think he wants to be on social media. I think it's the same as like Taylor's ex-husband. Like, Taylor Okay, that makes sense. I think that that's all it is. Like, that makes sense. I don't think he wants to be on social media, but I don't think that's it. Because from my point of view, I think if the father is absent. If he was absent, I think they would talk about it on the show.

SPEAKER_02 19:02

Yeah, well, that's how it seems from my point of view.

SPEAKER_00 19:04

Because I don't know like Taylor never talks about her ex-husband. Why? Because I don't think he's an absent father, I think he just doesn't want to be in the spotlight.

SPEAKER_02 19:10

Yeah, but we also know about the whole swinging scandal. We also know about that whole thing with we know nothing about Little's ex-husband's name, though.

SPEAKER_00 19:16

No, I don't even know Taylor. Taylor's ex-husband's name, though, even though he was in the swinging swinging scandal. Yeah, but you know what he looks like. I don't know what he looks like. Oh, I guess I could look it up. I didn't know it was even.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Wait, no, he was on TikTok with her. Like he like they posted videos together in their old house where like Oh, I did not know that. Their haunted apartment, and like they were like the I did not know that. What was it? Uh I know the vampire diary, not vampire diars, like uh, what was that movie with the vampires? Yeah, I don't know. Not the Twilight? Twilight. Like they looked just like the Twilight family. Like they that they made that dupe of the Twilight. Like, oh her family looks just like them. And he was very involved in her TikTok prior to the swinging scandal.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

Wait, so are you a fan of like did you find Mormon wives because of TikTok first? Because I didn't. I did. Oh no, I'm just a I'm just like a reality. I found it from like scrolling and being like, oh, this is a cool show to watch. No, I followed. I didn't follow, I didn't know them at all from TikTok prior to the show.

SPEAKER_02 20:16

I knew them because of the swinging scandal on TikTok.

SPEAKER_00 20:18

And I don't even really understand what happened.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

Really? So Taylor and her husband, her ex were friends with Miranda and her ex-husband and Chase. Yeah. Her ex-husband. They all like would hang out, and then they ended up just like being in the Mormon community. Like they never really like experienced, I guess, like other people other than their like actual wives. This is what I'm grasping from it. Okay. I could be wrong. I know nothing. From what I'm getting from. I know there was a swinging scandal. They all went away together, and then Taylor ended up hooking up with Chase. Or Miranda's husband.

SPEAKER_00 20:57

Is that not fine because they're in the swinging scandal?

SPEAKER_02 20:59

Yeah, but then their feelings were involved. Like then Taylor ended up grasping feelings for supposedly Chase.

SPEAKER_00 21:04

And but I thought that there was no, I think that there's another husband she got feelings for. Because remember when Miranda said in one of the this is like I just clocked this, so like if you didn't, that's totally fine. But Miranda was like, I feel like right now I'm in between like the shit with Shania and the shit with Taylor. She was like, I feel like I'm in between again because when Taylor had feelings for the other wives, husbands, I had to keep it from the other wife who's my friend.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

Now I think that a lot of the husbands were for Taylor because like her outgoing, I think that all the husbands were drawn towards Taylor and that they were all hook up with each other. And I feel like a lot of the husbands got feelings for Taylor. That's what I that's what I feel like because Taylor was very outgoing, she was a very big personality, like she clearly is a big personality, and I that's what I I'm grasping from it.

SPEAKER_00 21:51

And then what was the scandal that came out on TikTok?

SPEAKER_02 21:54

Like, what did they say on TikTok about it? Like when the divorce happened, because somebody got feelings for another a coup another couple's husband got feelings for another couple like I don't know what down to the T.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

I don't judge but like catch me never swinging. No. I can barely like I don't give a fuck. I'm just not for me. Not for me. I'm not I'm not into sharing. And yeah. Not my not my forte. Not my forte agreed. Um okay and this is like kind of the end of my shocking little segment. Shocking that Dakota can still get fucking girls. Shocking that Shania wants to hook up with him. Shocking that Jenna wants to hook up with him. So like maybe an unpopular opinion I'm gonna say it because this definitely is unpopular and you might fully disagree with me. But I don't want to say Dakota's not that bad. Dakota is clearly who he is he's consistent as fuck. He's the same person every single fucking season. He the same shit the same shit every single fucking time and what's shock that's not shocking to me.

SPEAKER_02 23:06

It's not shocking to me. The end of the season literally that is the Halloween party agenda and he's like I am the walking red flag his costume and he said I am word for word a walking red flag.

SPEAKER_00 23:15

I am not gonna change this is who I am and you know that we all know that I am the red flag shocking to me is that girls are so fucking desperate to get with him. He's hot that's why though like sorry he's not that fucking hot he's not that hot but I'm sorry he is not that fucking hot I'm sorry and also no offense like maybe this is just me but like maybe this truly is just me. I don't care like Dakota is so ugly to me because of all the things that I've seen him do. Like if Dakota was in front of me being like Val get with me and I was single like whatever and I had no reason really not to get with him I'm not friends with Taylor.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

I'm not personal friends with Taylor I still would not get with him me single Dakota in front of me I would still never kiss that man because I'm just like ill like you have no morals saying that like knowing his morals or you're saying that just like looking at him as a person. So like I'm like I just were to walk past him at a bar no I think I'm just a very emotional person.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

So like I feel like I'm attracted to people like in like but like answer this if you were to walk past him at a bar never knowing who he was the type of person he is he would be attractive yes yeah but now I know what he did thousand and also the whole world does and they still want to get with him I'm sorry he's not that fucking hot he's not as hot as Rob from Love Island.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

I a thousand percent agree like Rob from Love Island I would not ruin friendships for that man. That is so fucking crazy.

SPEAKER_00 24:48

I would not this girl Shania literally needs to be in so much serious therapy did that just to get her name out in the world.

SPEAKER_02 24:58

My opinion Wait I just W why would you want your name out in that way? She wants to be in mom talk she wants to be in Mom they're never gonna but why would the mom talk group ever want and you said that after the fact yeah but didn't you hear that now she also hooked up with um Macy's not Macy's I'm so sorry. And what Miranda Miranda's Chase supposedly her and her and Chase have hooked up I mean that's truly not crazy but I have not heard that but like that's what the girl's giving but that's what now has just come but no offense what do you want to you're not gonna be that famous you're gonna be famous for a couple months and being a s like being like an a not a girl's girl yeah and like and like by like nothing is weirder to me I'm just never I'll never get over it. Like wait can I say that I I disagreed with Whitney when they were going to film their whole intro for the fifth season of when Whitney's I don't think she knew the whole story. Taylor why were I don't think she knew the whole story either but when she said Taylor why are you mad? And it's like wait time out because the day before she fucked my ex-baby daddy about it.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

She had every right to be upset and to be mad and then for Whitney to turn around and not know the whole story and then make that she was just with Dancing with the stars I think and she was so in like graved in that life I think she literally like that was the vibe I was getting getting was like she's like you had a friendship with this girl like I literally the vibe I was getting was like a genuine person being like I've been M I A because she has she's been with Dancing with the stars and like she's like I literally don't know what's going on because I was you were watching her process like you were watching Taylor be like don't you think that's fucking weird and her going like okay yeah like okay yeah yeah yeah right like yeah so honestly I feel like Grace like I don't I really feel like but I also feel like maybe she shouldn't have put her two cents in then if you didn't know the fucking situation because like Taylor was not wrong feeling the feelings that she had I I see like I I see what you're saying. I totally see what you're saying. I I think though it was kind of more like like a friend like I'd say to my friend and be like wait what's the deal because I don't get why you're upset I thought like are you really even friends with this girl? And then my friend would be like you've been gone for a minute yeah you've been busy doing your thing but I am friends with this girl and having talked yeah like and then I'd be like oh like I could see that just being like a genuine normal conversation and not like malicious or like like I feel like literally genuinely Whitney was like I don't think she was coming from malicious point I actually don't get why you're upset I don't think she was from a malicious point whatsoever but I just think that like her saying that it was just like I see that would have drove me crazy if I were Taylor to be like wait it's how do you not know what's going on in my life but I get it you're in dancing with the stars your life has a lot going on right now you're going with Chicago Broadway but also then don't make a comment if you don't know the full story. You would rather the friend like what like get me like literally talk to like get the full story.

SPEAKER_02 27:49

Like you'd rather her get it from like somebody else no you can ask me you could ask me but like I just a thousand yeah I get that but like I just feel like I'm only saying it's there and make her feel dumb. I feel like she was like like almost in a way like making Taylor feel dumb where she was like wait like why are you so mad?

SPEAKER_00 28:06

And it's like yeah no you mean you're missing out like you're so yeah being in your own little bubble right now like you don't know what's going on like no I don't know maybe some maybe subconscious like the only reason I feel like you can kind of read someone's energy was like was once Taylor said what it was she shut down. Whitney was like oh she understood okay yeah no I get that no like you're right like like I feel like you saw Whitney like literally like clock it clock it and was like oh no you're right that is fucking weird. Yeah so Whitney who's Shekina who's who's this girl what's her name Shekinah Shekinah I think no Shina no I think it's Shekinah I don't know random whatever I'm sorry that girl is a fucking nut case that actual girl's a toit I'm sorry I can't stand her pissed me off I don't know who the girl generally but you know how he fucked her too or almost fucked her or something yeah she was like random but then he but then my point is fuck these guys sure but I feel like fuck guys in general to an extent obviously like you know like I have a boyfriend I love him he's he's a very respectful young man but it's like you expect that from men you don't expect that from girls like that's my shocking part my shocking part is not what Dakota did because like fuck you Dakota you're an asshole shocking you were another you're an asshole exactly shocking part to me is that girls are so fucking desperate for fucking attention from a guy that like and and and I'm a girl I'm a girls girl so like that's hurting me like it literally hurts my feelings like seeing a girl so motherfucking desperate like for a guy yeah that like even even them talking at the Halloween party and her going I know and her going like you ended things not me I would be like hello I wish I ended I I'd be like I'm sorry I'm sorry I was having a stroke during that time like I literally would have made up something literally I would have been like please excuse my behavior I was having a stroke and like sorry like I've not even talked to him talk to anybody else you want to be in mom talk so bad weird because you're only in the corner talking to Dakota literally and that's just shocking to me that he can still get a girl like after everything people have seen him do and how manipulated he is and also to be honest like you look fucking stupid because he clearly loves Taylor like so toxic. It's gonna be Taylor it's even though it's so toxic like you are like that man and I hope one day that there's I hope one day like I pray like even for Taylor's sake like that they both can like let it fucking go and move on. I know but like to be honest I'm we I think we all have to be honest it's gonna be years. Yeah like it's gonna be years hello she went to the fucking bachelorette and she couldn't even fucking like you know how they say I don't know if you've ever heard this it takes two times like if you were with someone for a year it takes you two years to get over them. I've heard that I don't know how true that is but I did hear that before they've been together for three years. Yeah probably four at this point because who knows when they're actually but it's also fucked because they have a baby together. So they're always going to be tied together they're always going to be tied together because they have the baby together like this is why it matter this is why it matters who you have a kid with exactly it's hard because I think that they both are good good people. Like I want to like and not end on the Dakota and Taylor note I think that they are both good people.

SPEAKER_02 31:23

I think they both deserve to be happy and they both deserve healthy relationships I think that people but they need to yeah not be together because they are way too toxic.

SPEAKER_00 31:31

They bring out the worst in each other thousand percent thousand percent and maybe it's because they're too similar like I don't know why I'm not a therapist I don't really understand the reason but like at the end of the day like I don't think that they're bad I don't fucking know what I think of Dakota I don't think Taylor's a bad person though and I think that like he literally just brings like brings out the worst in her and I think that she brings out the worst in him I think that they Yeah like I think that like I bet you like I don't know maybe them being in different relationships they would be great fucking partners like honestly I think the bachelorette could have been like such an amazing experience for literally both of them I think that like I think he could have like he went out in person though he went for the friend just to get a tail no he he has he gets a heart on from pissing her off yeah it's literally like I don't know if you've ever heard this before I I don't know where I heard I don't know if it was a movie I don't know what maybe it was like in my not my not my life but like I think people talking some people I truly think literally their their foreplay is fighting like some oh yeah I feel like almost that's what the toxicity that's what it is for Taylor and Dakota like their their foreplay is like being asshole they admit that though they admit that within the show of like Taylor said she literally gets off on the fact of like them biting.

SPEAKER_02 32:41

Oh really I've never okay I missed that yeah she's like I like they just like love like she wanted to hear about him getting with another girl because it turned her on and like them biting about them biting about it turned her on.

SPEAKER_00 32:55

Okay so I completely missed that part and that's fucking us. Yeah it's insane that's fucking that literally was like a thing in the show okay done with the season is already too much for Dakota and fucking Taylor on to the next so who do you feel is like authentic versus performative I'll start just because I already like thought of somebody and then yeah think of someone in the meantime. Okay so at first in the season I I really like Michaela but when Michaela kept saying like was that Taylor is representing mom talk and like they like it almost felt like Michaela was quote unquote being a good friend because she wanted to make sure that Taylor was gonna represent mom talk in a good way versus like just being a good friend and like whatever now today now today the bachelorette's not fucking airing number one number two they had to halt filming for season five like all like obviously the bachelorette doesn't make Michaela money but like the season five of Michaela like does and so like at first I was like is Michaela fake as fuck and that kind of bothered me. Now all of like full circle moment Michaela is right like I didn't realize to be honest like that like they're halting filming. Like I thought honestly they would just keep filming and being like Taylor's fucking out but like I think Taylor's like so involved in the storyline they're like we can't continue filming until you get your shit together.

SPEAKER_02 34:27

Wait but I didn't realize that until now wait but it came out that she's an executive producer did you not want the Good Morning Show.

SPEAKER_00 34:33

Taylor wanted the good morning Yeah but she was like I didn't even know I was we all are executive producers of our own story.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

That didn't add up didn't add up I but she Wait do you think she was lying I don't think so I don't think she was lying but I do think that she is yeah a per uh I think they're all producers of their own storyline.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

I think that I think that Michaela gets to say like these are things that I'll film. I'll film stuff about my skin like I'll film stuff with Jace but like I'm only gonna film up to this example yeah yeah like or or I'm gonna film the whole of it or whatever it is I think they get to have like some say yeah in like what's in like what's filmed.

SPEAKER_02 35:07

I mean how could you not like it's your own life like you could you could say yes or no I feel like like you could put your foot down and be like I'm not talking about that or I'm not saying this like or we'll talk about it.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

100% and I think it's honestly like I think somebody like Michaela like talking about her skin and like her past experience honestly is one of those things that's like you opening up is there's somebody out there that's that is helping. And I ensure that's her only reason for doing it. What else is the reason like exactly and that's like that's less like tea quote unquote and that's more like relatable relatable and like I don't want to say the word like it's not inspired it's kind of inspiring that she's like got the courage to to talk about her story versus where I feel like Taylor like most of not all of it but most of what Taylor's talking about and like her storyline is just like drama that like it's the God forbid ever happens in any one of our lives like that we're like with like this we're like addicted to this toxic man and then have a kid with him and then have to play this fucking back and forth game.

SPEAKER_02 36:10

Like I feel like Taylor's is like for entertainment unfortunately and it is her true real life and so like obviously giving grace but like different like you know what I'm saying like Michaela's is like helping probably a young anyone a girl going through whatever they're going through whether it's acne whether it's the same skin condition whether whatever it is yeah like an immune disorder you can't figure out exactly like she's trying to figure it out and like that's just trauma childhood trauma. You have all that money to figure out what's going on and she still can't figure it out and like that and like that just goes to show like that's a good point.

SPEAKER_00 36:46

Yeah like money can't fix your health money can't fix your happiness I always say money would buy me happiness but like if you look at it like the richest people have the highest rate of like suicide yeah like depression suicide like I don't know like yeah they just like well because their life is a microscope and like we make a mistake we go out drunk on a Saturday we make a mistake we're a little bit of an asshole we make a mistake whatever it's not broadcasted for like Bill Schmo in his fucking basement yeah to give in a comment where yeah they they mess up they make that mistake it's all over no you're right like it's it's being broadcasted everywhere you make one little mistake you make one wrong move you say one wrong word yeah I'd be canceled on a heartbeat oh I would be heartbeat I mean not tailor level no no no no that's or demi level I would never I'm I'm always a girl's girl and I'm never a liar same I would be more like same I would be probably I'm just like too upfront.

SPEAKER_02 37:46

I'm way too upfront like and I'm way very too blunt that's why I would be canceled. I would be canceled I'm not aggressive I'm not mean I'm Jen would hate me.

SPEAKER_00 37:54

Same Jen would hate me because no offense I thought we were fucking friends Jen. You're gonna tell me oh maybe you didn't think we were friends I would say a lot more than fuck you. Yeah Whitney would be like I would say a lot more than fuck you so you should actually be thanking fucking Whitney for not saying more. Time out what about Zach showing up to the fucking brunch and I'm sorry Jen I I oh my god I love my Zach I'd like to think if I ever was so fucking delusional that I asked him to do that I think he'd be like I'm not doing that that's fucking weird. That was wrong that was in all it's wrong on all levels. It's wrong on every fucking level then don't like say no to the meeting say no then but to surprise her and like sucking and also like he's such like oh my god he's so fucking he was so wrong he couldn't even look at her in the eyes this is him talking and like sorry guys there's no camera right now but like literally like I mean this is my right imagine me just like looking straight this is him well I don't think that your apology is like genuine you hey by the way you weren't even fucking there. So how do you know what you and the show has anything because the um because she sent the voice memo wasn't genuine of the apology of her saying fuck you what how much more genuine do you want me to be what do you want me to do?

SPEAKER_02 39:06

Literally do you want me to get down my hands and knees? Because I'm not doing that.

SPEAKER_00 39:09

So this like and honestly I feel like Whitney apologizing was more like I thought we were friends you let me know that we weren't that caught me off guard. So I overreacted but listen I don't want to be friends with anyone that just wanna be friends with me. I feel like that was Whitney like I'm sorry I did overreact. I shouldn't have told you to go fuck yourself because if you don't want to be friends with me no problem. We've all been there done that we've all been there done that listen I've like begged for like I've done that too I've been like fuck you to somebody that doesn't want to be my friend and like and then going back and being like I'm so sorry for acting that way like I know you don't want to be my friend good like yeah but also we've all said things that we like didn't mean and like okay maybe I didn't mean to say fuck you at the time but like did I at the time and the place yeah I said it because that's how I felt but at the end of the day do I feel like fuck you fuck you fuck like I don't mean it like that. Like it's a different type of situation and like wait so I um you'll laugh at this because also just like to the audience Amanda's Italian um so I did a segment like a couple weeks ago on like who would survive Sunday dinner and like famous people like Chris Jenner 100% would survive. Yeah Rob from Love Island probably not survive. No. Nonetheless yeah I also did actually funny because Harry Jowsey happened to be on season four I did Harry Jowsey too whom I think would survive he's so good he's so good I'm obsessed with him like he is like but I don't think that he would survive long I think he would maybe survive only one. Nonetheless not to bring the whole segment back but like one I don't think Taylor's would survive Sunday dinner because like you see how the way she talks to her mom? It's horrible horrible I would never talk to my mother that way and listen I've been like an asshole to my mother. I've been an asshole to my teenagers to our mothers we're all girls we've all been like little I'm 26 I would never talk to my mom that way now it's been yeah it's disgusting and you have skins I feel so bad for her mom the way that she talks to her if I told my mom I hooked up again with my baby daddy who is so toxic my mom would do a lot more than what your fucking mother did uh Taylor so point blank like funny just like to bring in the segment for a second like Taylor would never survive Sunday dinner.

SPEAKER_02 41:13

No because no and another person Jen no Jen would never survive Sunday dinner Jen would never survive Sunday dinner way too soft way too soft to to be there at that time I used to think Whitney wouldn't I think Whitney wouldn't oh she would eat it up she'd be so good she'd be so good she'd be so good her and Jesse I think and her Jesse Miranda Macy would be perfect. Macy's so up front and honest a thousand percent Michaela I think that they would all thrive where Jen and Taylor I think would I think Taylor would I actually like Taylor but I know she wouldn't survive because someone would tell her the truth she can't handle the truth she would get mad or anger where she would come out. She'd be like it would be like where Jen would just shut down and she would cry and make herself feel like a victim.

SPEAKER_00 41:56

Yes Jen would be a victim and also like the Taylor gets super defensive like I do fe I do actually I do I do actually like Taylor. I do too I just feel like there's I feel like she's fighting against the truth some sometimes like do you know what I'm saying like it's a lot of like like the whole thing with her mom like it was so embarrassing. It was like it was so embarrassing.

SPEAKER_02 42:16

It was like well have you ever been through this have you ever been through that and it's like hey by the way I've been through it's fucking worse by the way actually her mom has been through a lot yeah and and also no offense it's not a game no trauma's been no exactly exactly that was so weird to me like if my mom ever told me like the way you just screaming at her in the car on the way to meet her bother her father's friend it's like hey do you not know by the way this is probably very traumatic for your mother like your mom is now reliving her past to make you happy and make you sleep at night and now here you are yelling She left this guy for you.

SPEAKER_00 42:49

This is the same thing with like well it's hard I think it's a little different because like Dakota's not on drugs and Dakota wants to be in Ever's life.

SPEAKER_03 42:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:56

So it's definitely a different situation but it's like your mom is openly talking about how she's like feeling personal guilt for like the shitty mistakes you've made yeah like I would like every day be like mom like you can't take the things I've done that are wrong and like put that blame on your I need to learn for myself. Like and all she does is tear her mom down and like listen I know we're judging at the end of the day though like we're not in their shoes so I think like just like a PSA is like this is what happens you watch reality TV show you give your two cents but like at the end of the day we are not in their shoes and like how they choose to handle things like I don't know exactly what I would do if I was in I don't know how I would feel if my dad was in my life like do you know what I'm saying like oh yeah I can't say you can't judge when you're in their shoes as we're sitting here like as we're sitting here judging but like I just want to give a PSA that like at the end of the day I think we both know that like we're giving our two cents but also back to re back to like reality we're humble enough to be like we are not in their shoes and like exactly that's not exactly we can only say so much like because I don't Know what it's like, and maybe I would be a big huge asshole too to my mom if my dad wasn't. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 44:05

You don't know because we're not in those.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

Because there's no she doesn't really have two parents to like compare. Like, do you know what I'm saying? She doesn't have two parents to blame. She only has the mom, and the mom is.

SPEAKER_02 44:13

Hey, and do I think sometimes that her mom is in the wrong? Yes. Yes. And do I think her stepfather sometimes over like says things that he shouldn't say? Yeah, but everyone says things sometimes like that.

SPEAKER_00 44:22

But I do not agree with the way that she's gonna be like in the past, I've seen the mom and the parents and her fight, and I never thought it was as bad as it was now. See, I agree, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:31

I thought it was like this season really showed you how bad their relationship really was. Yeah. Like even her throwing.

SPEAKER_00 44:38

I just feel like there's also in the level of like emotional maturity. Like, why are you throwing? Like, there was a point in the car where she was like, the therapist said you're supposed to be a mom! It's like it's like don't you're not that's not exactly I mean listen, I wasn't in the therapy session, but I doubt that the therapist was like, and Taylor, if the mom doesn't act that way, scream in her face that what I said was to exactly so it's like you can't start preaching the therapy shit, Taylor, if you're gonna fucking act like that. You know? Like that, like, like, come on, there's gotta be a little emotional maturity of like, come on, a little growth. Like, I'm waiting, I'm waiting, I'm waiting to see a little growth through fucking Taylor.

SPEAKER_02 45:14

Do I think the mom needs to also have a little bit of maturity? She does, yeah. The mom has issues too, but at the end of the day, everyone has their own story to write. Everyone has their own issues. I'm not perfect.

SPEAKER_00 45:25

There's somebody that could be listening to this being like, Well, I've seen you fucking pop up, pop off. And like, I have, and I've been there done that. It's been embarrassing. Like, been there done that. But you kind of like, I definitely have to say for myself, like, I can confidently say, like, I've grown and learned from it. So a hundred percent. And I'm not perfect. That doesn't mean I I'm now perfect, but like I definitely things have happened that are like I'm like, I've thought to myself and reflected that's embarrassing. Where I do feel like Taylor's not Taylor's having that incident with her mom, and she's not it's a circle, it's like she's not really thinking after like is that embarrassing?

SPEAKER_01 45:56

Like, yeah, no, it's just like a repeating cycle.

SPEAKER_00 45:59

Okay, I'd love to end this podcast on like a high note, yeah. And I don't know like if you have anything, but something I do have is Connor practicing magic. Oh I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed with him.

SPEAKER_02 46:15

Wait, so I I love in the least like sexual way, like as a friend. No, a thousand percent, like almost like a gay best friend. Yes, like I love that he is there fully supporting Whitney. Whitney clearly is the breadwinner at the moment, but he is finding his own joy in all of this where like he can have his own moment, and like Whitney's so letting him have that, and I love their relationship, and I feel like they really came to a full circle moment of like them going through their issues and then working through it, and like that is a healthy relationship where they talked through it, they went through the bad shit, the good shit. They don't have a perfect thing, they they don't they didn't broadcast the perfect thing, exactly, and like it's so good, and like he found his little thing, and it's the magic, and like she's there for it. And I love watching her. I watched a video of like him doing the magic tricks and and was like, I always have my cards on me, and she like sat there in the back smiling, and I was like, This is so cute and so full circle, like even though this is so little, it's so big.

SPEAKER_00 47:15

I agree. I feel like it's like honestly inspiring. Okay, so is there any like final thoughts? I'm trying to think. I feel like we did cover a lot. We covered Oh, wait, really quick. I guess back to it was I brought up Michaela and like authentic and whatnot. At the end of the day, I ended with like, I do think Michaela was authentic, but for that per that question, at first I did think that she was being inauthentic and a little fake for the show, but I don't feel that way now. Full circle moment, I don't feel that way, but in the first couple episodes, I did feel that way.

SPEAKER_02 47:44

I and I get that. Like at the end of the day, dude, I do love Michaela. Like, I just I love her and Michaela feel that I'm gonna do it.

SPEAKER_00 47:50

I love Michaela. We're gonna end off this episode. Season four. A lot happened. Season five, I hope they get back into filming. I pray. I love this show. I love it. I think this is probably one of my favorite reality. To be honest, I feel like I would be friends with a lot of them. I think I think I would be in mom talk. Ah, I would move to Utah. I would be in Mom Talk and I would be friends with them. Okay, guys, thank you so much for listening. Hope you enjoyed. And if you didn't watch Mormon Wives yet, you should. All right, bye.