What Feelings Reveal About Us

In this episode of Full Fledged, JC and Priscilla talk about a viral clip that unexpectedly started circulating online after it was posted by ESPN. What began as a light moment quickly turned into something much bigger once people on the internet began reacting about what the moment meant and who it was about.

During the conversation, JC opens up about feeling embarrassed when the clip started spreading and how uncomfortable it can be when a small moment suddenly becomes public discussion. Priscilla and JC unpack what actually happened and why the situation was never really about JC in the first place.

This episode is sponsored by:

Liberty.edu/FullFledged - Get your application fee waived and join the family

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

A lot of our feelings, negative ones, is if we feel embarrassed or we feel lonely or we feel not comforted or we feel whatever, it's because we're not believing a promise or a truth that God has already said. Hello, hello.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Hello, JC Shire. How are you?

SPEAKER_03 0:22

I'm doing good, Mom. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 0:24

Good. I hope all of you guys are doing well too. Welcome to our conversation and welcome to Full Fledged the Homie Podcast.

SPEAKER_03 0:31

And I want to explain this real quick because I was talking to my uncle in when I was in LA and he was like, Where'd the homie podcast come from? Like, I thought it was full fledged. I was like, it is full fledged, but it's also the homie podcast. He was like, I'm confused. It sounds like two different things. I was like, okay. So now I feel like I have to explain myself. So full fledged, we talked about with the meaning last season, but we're going to do it again this season because we have like a lot of new viewers, which is great. I love y'all. Y'all are amazing. Um, but full fledged is basically fledging is the process of a mother bird kicking the baby bird out of the nest. So it's like this whole conversational tone is like um me trying to figure out life and her knowing a lot of stuff. And so me, we us wrestling and talking about what life holds and why life sucks sometimes and all the things. And so that's great. But then it just became the homie podcast because we do it at home. Like I literally, we literally come to a home. This one's our grandparents' house. We've our first season was in our house, and we just are at home talking about this. So those how those two things combine. I feel like I'd explain myself on that one.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

You you talk really fast. I hope everybody got that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:30

Okay, I'll talk slower.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

We are also in our onesies, we're in pajamas because we're, like you said, at home. So we're cozy. We hope you're cozy too. We have a great conversation today. Um first. Oh one more thing.

SPEAKER_03 1:46

Yeah. So I just got a new whoop. I don't know if y'all know what that is.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

I didn't know what a whoop was before you mentioned it.

SPEAKER_03 1:52

And this is definitely free promotion. So maybe I shouldn't do that, but it doesn't matter because I like it. Um, so a whoop is basically a health tracking device. You've probably seen a lot of people wear it. Um, basically, what it is is a band that goes around. It's super comfortable, easy, and it tracks how many calories I burn a day. It tracks my sleep, it tracks my heart rate, my health, my stress levels, all those things. And I love it because I love health a lot. And so it helps me know how much I should eat a day so I can keep my body looking right and all those things. It feels like we're doing an ad, but I'm not. I just am very excited about it.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

Yeah, I was about to say no that it's no ad to it. It's just you just got it, so you're happy about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:29

Yeah, I'm not even happy.

SPEAKER_01 2:30

Why are you tracking stress levels? What do you have to be stressed about, JC? Okay, so are you stressed?

SPEAKER_03 2:36

You want to get super nerdy real quick? So, stressed, when you're stressed, it produces what's called cortisol. And when cortisol comes in your body, it like you can it does stuff with like a lot of it. Yeah, it can make you sick. Yeah, it can make you sick, and it does like it stores fat or something like that. So it's like, I don't want to be stressed a lot. Like normal stress levels are okay, but don't want to be stressed, overly stressed, because then it releases the cortisol thing, and then your body just thank you for sharing. Yeah, and I I don't know if that's scientifically proven. I think it is, but cortisol is not an over exaggerated amount of cortisol is not good, I'm pretty sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

In your system.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, no doubt. That's actually not what our podcast is about today, but I appreciate that. Yeah, um, we've started, but we can't really officially start until we've done our opening song. Are you ready?

SPEAKER_03 3:24

Let's go. Hey, hey, hey.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

Hey, hey.

SPEAKER_03 3:31

You know what's funny? Hey, um, dude named KJ Osborne reposted this, and I was like, I texted him back, I was like, bro, like, I really don't even want to do it a lot of time. It's really my mom who loves it, and he said, We gotta do it, we gotta do it, and reposted it and thought it was hilarious.

SPEAKER_01 3:46

Yes, it was because you were offbeat. That one, the one I saw KJ Osborne repost it, and it was the one where you could not catch the rhythm. And I was like, Do you have no rhythm?

SPEAKER_03 3:55

No, I have it, but I was trying to hit it on the off, like the one in the three, and I just couldn't I couldn't find the one in the three.

SPEAKER_01 4:01

But we're black. Why would you be trying to hit it on the one in the three?

SPEAKER_03 4:04

My my heritage and culture didn't didn't didn't it didn't rise up. It didn't rise up in the moment, but it's back now. I I I've been doing a lot of things to figure that out. That was that was an off moment, not off.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Anyway, okay. So welcome. We're having a great conversation. I'm actually looking forward to this one because I think it's gonna, I actually think it's gonna help a lot of people, but also it's gonna tell them a lot of things about you and the process of helping them. Inside my life, yeah, which is good. I'm glad what we've had this conversation over the past year several times. So, first of all, we're gonna set this up for you. Um, I'm gonna let him tell you how they got to this position, but it is about a clip that went viral, like for real viral. He happened to be in this clip. Set up the clip, JC.

SPEAKER_03 4:47

Okay, so basically what happened was um, so if y'all don't know, I played Division basketball for four years now. And um this one particular year, which is last year, my third year junior year, we went to Seattle for March Madness because we played Oregon. And my whole college basketball career, I never got significant meaningful minutes. Like I played spotty minutes every now and then, but it wasn't like starter role main player minutes for sure or not. That was Zach Cleveland. Um, and so Zach. Yeah, and so I was like, okay, cool. We went to March Madness, we went to Seattle, great experience, got the police escort with the bus because it was the biggest tournament of yeah, it was crazy. And so we go, we're playing Oregon, and we're getting absolutely smacked. We're getting smacked. It was not good at all. It wasn't a blessing, it was it was bad. My mom was there, my brothers were there, it was not good at all. Dad was there, yeah. So I'm just sitting on the bench like, man, this is really not good. And so, was dad there? I think dad was at that one. Anyway, I don't know why I feel I don't know. I guess he was. I don't know, I don't remember. Um, but anyways, okay. So the end of the game comes and we're down like a lot of points. And the coach is like, okay, so whenever the end of a basketball game comes, usually, um, the coach will put in the guys who didn't play a lot just because give them an opportunity to play. Give an opportunity, and also in the middle of the season, it's so that other guys don't get hurt in minutes that aren't really meaningful. It's like a lot of strategy behind that. But, anyways, so he put in like five of the guys who weren't playing that much during the whole season. And so he, I was one of the last people to get in, or second, I don't remember, it doesn't matter. But it was just me by myself sitting down and waiting to be checked into the basketball game. And the time was running out. So I was thinking, oh, I'm not even about to get in, the time's gonna run out, and then the game's gonna be.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

When he says time's running out, it's like a minute left in the game.

SPEAKER_03 6:46

Not even a minute, not even a minute, it's in the seconds. So I'm thinking the time is just gonna keep running out, whatever. Because the game is still going. As long as the game's going, like you can't get in. Only on a dead ball where the ball goes out of bounds, turnover, like stuff like that where you can actually get in the game. So, anyways, so I'm sitting there and the game's still going on. I'm not gonna get in, I'm thinking. And then all of a sudden, the ref stops the game and acts like there's a wet spot on the on the um ground on the ground. Yeah, act like there's a wet spot on the court, and then stops the whole game, blows his whistle, puts his hands up, and then helps me up off the thing and then tells me he's like, You're gonna remember this for the rest of your life. And I was like, Oh, that's cool, that was fun, you know, whatever. So I'm like, I'm not even thinking about it necessarily in the moment.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Like, I'm just like, oh, it's just so he gets the ref stops the game to get get him in for the last 20 seconds, 30 seconds of the game.

SPEAKER_03 7:36

You're just like, why not? So he just like you remember for the rest of your life. You're playing the March Madness game. Like, not many people in the world get to do that. So it's like, okay, whatever. So I wasn't thinking about it that hard. I just wouldn't, I had to play the game. So I was like, let me just go in and do what I gotta do.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

So at the time, of course, we were just glad we were like, that's so cool. JC's getting the game. No big deal. We didn't see the the ref that, you know, in the midst of all those thousands of people at the game, we didn't make out that he made up the fact that there was a wet spot on the ground or that he we didn't know he whispered in JC's ear, you're gonna remember this for the rest of your life. We didn't know any of that. We just, oh, he's in the game. No big deal. The next not I was about to say the next day, but it might have been within an hour or two.

SPEAKER_03 8:15

Oh, oh, I mean, I remember getting back to the hotel and being like, What in the world is happening?

SPEAKER_01 8:20

This clip of the coach stop of the ref stopping the time to let this kid in at the last few seconds of the game immediately starts going viral. When we say viral, we mean I mean uber viral.

SPEAKER_03 8:34

Let me go pull and get my pull my phone out. Where's your phone at?

SPEAKER_01 8:37

I mean like Sports Illustrated, ESPN, CS, CBS News, some celebrities started reposting it, and everybody was just like, how cool for this kid that the ref was that kind, basically, to make up a reason. Because then, of course, you're hearing the um uh the commentators explain what was happening, and they're basically just applauding this ref, like, good good get his good get his boy a chance. That's great. Give his player a chance to get in the game. And I mean it just keeps cycling and cycling and cycling until hundreds of thousands, if not millions, millions and millions of people are watching this video.

SPEAKER_03 9:17

I'm just I'm I'm gonna just read out the views. These are all on different platforms: 7.2 million, 5.6 million, 12.8 million, 10.6 million, 207,000. Like it it's in that way. It goes on and on on. That was just this year. Then it goes like it last year is when it happened. So last year when it actually happened, it was more than that, and like 6.6 million. Like I'm just like, like it went like Uber, yeah, Uber viral.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

So of course our phones are blowing up. People are like, JC, it's a JC is this is awesome, JC. Okay. So it's going viral, viral, mushrooming, mushrooming, mushrooming again. Celebrities are posting, reposting it, all that. Yeah, meanwhile, we're talking to JC. His feelings about this were layered and complex. Blown. He was blown away, not in enthusiasm that he was going viral.

SPEAKER_03 10:10

No. Your first initial feeling about it was Yeah, I was mad because I don't think it it made it, it made people be like, aw, look at him. You know what I'm saying? Like, sweet little boy, mad me. Oh, I hate oh I'm getting mad at it about it now again. I wasn't mad when we were talking about what we were gonna talk about, but now I'm mad again. Yeah, it just I hate feeling like, oh, look at him. Like the the like a hundred. The ref had to make a little exception to the rule. I hate that. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

Like So it didn't it didn't put you in a good light. It made it look like the ref was doing you a favor.

SPEAKER_03 10:53

Yeah, it was like it was it was it, yeah. It was I don't I'm trying to figure out how to describe it. Basically, I was just mad.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

And you were embarrassed.

SPEAKER_03 11:00

Yeah, and embarrassed is is is the right one because I was like, people are sitting here looking at me, being like, he you like he doesn't play. Clearly, he doesn't play. The reason why this went so viral is literally because the ref let this kid in the game who does not usually play. That's literally like why it was so meaningful. Yeah, so it's like, okay, bruh, like now people are looking at the thing like, oh, he don't really play like that. Um look at him, uh, like, you know, what a good moment for him. This is gonna make his whole life. I was like, I was like, bro, it's not I was like, it was cool, yeah, but don't make act like this was just the the the redemption of my humanity.

SPEAKER_01 11:36

Like I but people, you know, then they're looking up his name, they're seeing who this kid is, he's getting tagged on everything. And and of course, from everybody's broad perspective, it would be like, oh, that's super cool. But here he is on the other side of this, and he felt embarrassed. That's the bottom line. The anger kind of stemmed from the fact that you were embarrassed that it put you in this light, that it looked like someone has to do you a favor in order for you to be able to get in the game.

SPEAKER_03 12:00

Well, I guess, yeah. And I don't I don't know if I've ever thought about it super, super deeply since it's happened, but I'm let's let's try to break down the root of, I guess, the embarrassment of the problem. Right? That's what I was about to say.

SPEAKER_01 12:12

We need to unpack those layers and then how you got out of that because I was really proud of you for the way you handled this, and that's what we're gonna get to because that is a while people might not go viral all the time, there is a universal, there are universal lessons in this when you feel embarrassed. How you I watched you work through that and then utilize it differently. So, yes, go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 12:33

First, I just want to say there was, I think I got a text message or I saw a comment or something right when it happened that talked about favor ain't fair. I was like, this is not favor. I don't know what why you trying to tie some who try to tie some spiritual element and be all religious in this, but that is not it don't feel like favor. So I thought that was funny. But anyway, um, yeah, so it embarrassment. Why I I guess why was I embarrassed because of how I thought people perceived me? Um, and I guess that's a problem. I guess I have a problem in in general a little bit with pleasing people. I guess that kind of is is a sub-layer of one of the issues, like being so concerned, so concerned and being so um just just like emasculated. That's not the right word at all. Um I don't know. Being so overwhelmed with how people feel about me or how people perceive me or how people because at the end of the day, it really shouldn't be um it really shouldn't be that it shouldn't matter that much about what someone thinks about you, but it does for me. And I think people pleasing is a thing that a lot of people deal with. I was about to say that's not just you, that's yeah, that's what that's why I'm trying to break it down because I think everybody has a a level of of course, or most people, some people just really don't care. But I'm like, okay, so then how do you stop people pleasing? When is it bad? When is it good? Like, what is the what is the relation to using it for your advantage or in this moment using it and it's embarrassing and now it makes you want to just be mad and go away.

SPEAKER_01 14:05

By the way, we're gonna put the link for this in the uh caption of the description below. So if you want to go actually see the clip, you can just click on the link so you can see what we're referring to. Um but that so that's one of the questions you were asking yourself as time went on. You're feeling embarrassed, you're realizing it's because I have a perception that I think people have of me in my basketball career, and this is sort of poking a hole in it.

SPEAKER_03 14:28

I guess people pleasing the the root of people pleasing is that people's perception of you is more potent or more pertinent than God's perception of you. That's the that's the the the issue. And so in something that's so that's magnified so much, um, it makes it seem like, first of all, it makes it seem like everybody's thinking that about you, and it's not true, even though it's tens of tens of millions of people, but it also makes you forget who God says you are. So I think whenever people uh when people pleasing is a problem for you, like it is for me, it needs to there needs to be a constant reminder in your head of, oh wait, no, this is what God says about me. Let me repeat it to myself, let me read it, let me see, because ultimately what God says about me is what is the most important rather than what other people say about me. Also, I think it's important to note that whenever it comes to people pleasing and what God says about you, that God uses every circumstance and every embarrassment to his glory and to his favor. And so it's like you could ruin what God has for you in the midst because you're too worried about what other people have to say about you. So I'm like, okay, cool. In that moment, I learned that no matter how no matter how embarrassed I feel, or how sadly or badly I feel, based on how people perceive me, I need to reiterate, pull down the thought and replace it with God's truth. Because what God's word says about me, not only is it true, make me feel better because it's the truth and I can believe it, but also it'll change how I react and I respond within the midst of the circumstance or the embarrassment or the anxiety or whatever I feel.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

I love that because it sounds like you had to be, well, I know you had to be incredibly intentional, like you recognized I feel embarrassed. Like this whole moment is being consumed by me feeling insular, basically, when we start concentrating on ourselves so much in the in the context of whatever is happening. We feel embarrassed, and you were intentional about combating what you were feeling with what God says about you.

SPEAKER_03 16:40

The last four years of my life have been nothing short of incredible and impactful. I've I've grown and strengthened in my faith so much, and a major part of that is because of Liberty University. I went to Liberty University for the last four years, and it's been nothing short of incredible. Uh the staff there, the teachers, the coaches that I've encountered, everybody really just seemed to have a genuine heart for Jesus and wanting to pour in to their students, to their team, to whoever it is that they're, you know, being over, they really just wanted to make an impact on the students there. And so it was an amazing experience from all of the events that they host, like campus community or convo, you know, anything that they host, they really just make sure that their students, you know, strengthen their walk with Christ. If you want to join the Liberty family as I am, because I'm an alumni, click the link below and you'll get your application fee waived. Um again, click the link below, get your application fee waived, and join the family.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

But explore how you got there. Because it's like I don't want people to think you felt embarrassed and then you started being intentional about replacing the lies of the enemy with the words of God. No. Explain the process of the days after as you're watching this go super viral. Well, just how you got to that eventually.

SPEAKER_03 18:05

For me, I just don't like feeling any feeling that doesn't feel good.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

Yeah, who does?

SPEAKER_03 18:12

Yeah, I just don't. And so I was it was it was making me so mad and irritated that I'm just like, I don't want to feel this anymore. So there has to be a solution. That's kind of how I most of the time I interrogate my feelings. Well, I didn't know I was doing this at the time, yeah, but now I can articulate it. That I interrogate my feelings with the question, what do I believe? Um let's wait, hold on. Yeah, it was good right there. I'm not, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Yeah, we all okay. So when you're feeling a feeling that you do not like, so let's we could put this in someone else's uh life as there's a bitterness there. You don't know it at the time, but every time you see this person, ooh, it just something, your whole skin is crawling, something's rising up on the inside of you. Every time you're around them, you can't function well because you just are whatever. When you feel that and you don't want to feel that, you have to interrogate where that feeling is coming from. This takes time and intentionality to really explore why I am responding this way, why am I reacting this way? Why what is this unearthing that I need to deal with on a deeper spiritual level?

SPEAKER_03 19:17

1000%. I gotta, I got I got some Bible for this because I've been thinking about that a lot. Yeah. Um it's right here. Hold on. Yep, it's right. I know where my Bible is, I know what's going on in my Bible. You take your time, sir. I know what's happening. Uh we're scouting the land. Yeah, that's right here. So basically, where I'm looking at is Numbers 13 and 14, where the Israelites have gone through the whole process of Exodus, and God has shown them so many things, and uh like, you know, miracles, the manna, the the Red Sea, all that. And then they go about to be the land of Canaan, and they send the spies to go in. And then the spies come back, and then there's 12 spies, right? Two of them, Caleb and Joshua, they were like, Oh, bruh, like, you know, we we can take them. And the other ten were like, absolutely we cannot take them because they got high walls and they got giants and all the things. And so they gave it says they gave a negative account. I'm gonna read this verse because I want to make sure that we get it correctly. Um, oh yeah, it's right here. I got it. I got it, Ma. Don't even worry about it. Um, yeah. But the men who had gone up with him responded, we can't attack the people because they are stronger than we are. So they gave a negative report to the Israelites about the land they had scouted. The land we passed through to explore is one that devours its inhabitants, and all the people we saw in it are men of great size. And then you go to a couple verses after it says, Then the whole community broke into loud cries and the people wept that night.

SPEAKER_01 20:51

We are like grasshoppers in their sight. That's one of the other verses where they're they're describing their own selves, saying we are like grasshoppers.

SPEAKER_03 20:56

We're like grasshoppers in their own sight. And so, because of their belief that they weren't going to be able to inherit the land of Canaan, or they weren't they didn't trust the promise that God had said, they then the whole community started to weep. So there's a lot of things in that. But what usually it's hard to identify immediately, oh, we don't believe this. But what's so pertinent and um what we can feel so easily is our feelings. And so it says they wept. Why were they weeping because they didn't believe? And so I think that that is the root of a lot of our feelings, negative ones, is if we feel embarrassed or we feel lonely or we feel not comforted or we feel whatever, it's because we're not believing a promise or a truth that God has already said.

SPEAKER_00 21:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:39

Or the circumstances seem so big that it's making us forget what God had said.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:44

So that is a practical thing that I didn't know I was doing then, but now I articulate it and try to do, you know, intentionally is every time I have a feeling of fear, every time I feel sad, mad, angry, uh, like I like. Justice has not been done for me or whatever it is, um, I try to interrogate the feeling. Why am I feeling this way and what am I believing that's making me feel this way?

SPEAKER_01 22:09

That's great. That's great.

SPEAKER_03 22:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:11

And don't you also think, for example, with people pleasing that you were talking about earlier, which is what was causing you, once you explored the feeling you were having, it got down to, oh, there is a perception that either I thought people had or I want them to have about me in this basketball career. And now this is poking holes in it. And I wonder, don't you think that sometimes when we don't even realize we have a problem with people pleasing in this um, in this uh particular illustration or something else, that God will allow circumstances that reveal it to us. Like He will allow something to show you your character's a little weak in this area. You don't even know it. But I'm gonna allow something to kind of poke a hole in it or bring it to your attention or rattle it a little bit so that you have to then take the time to go, Oh, I haven't forgiven this person. Oh, I actually um don't trust God to bring me through this situation. I keep manipulating everything and trying to control it. Why? Because I'm afraid God won't do it. So sometimes I wonder if we will, like you said, take time to explore why we feel away. We'll find that sometimes, not all the time, but the Lord, well, he always either either causes or allows something. Nothing happens in our life that he hasn't at least allowed. But if he allowed this in your life, could it be to spotlight and bring to your attention, oh, you really have concentrated a lot of energy on coiffing this perception that maybe could easily become an idol.

SPEAKER_03 23:48

You know, it was. Yeah. It was for sure.

SPEAKER_01 23:51

It was. I know. So you're feeling embarrassed, you start interrogating because this feeling goes on for quite a while because it keeps spying, it keeps mushrooming.

SPEAKER_03 24:01

Yeah, it just keeps getting bigger.

SPEAKER_01 24:02

It's like every day we wake up and a bunch more people have posted at like news stations and celebrities and all that.

SPEAKER_03 24:08

We're just like, oh my gosh, what is happening here? I'm getting tagged and I'm just like, brother, stop this.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

Yes. So you're what you're interrogating your feelings, you're having to deal with it individually because everybody else thinks, oh, this is so cool. So you're having to deal with this, you and the Lord. We talked about it a lot. Once you started interrogating your feelings and realizing this has to do with people pleasing, then it seemed to me like you made some very conscious decisions about what you wasn't gonna allow this to do and what you were going to utilize it for. Could you tell everybody about that? Yes. I was very proud of you because this is a very mature choice that everybody has to make when we don't feel good.

SPEAKER_03 24:49

Yeah. So basically what happened was What had happened was I interrogated the feeling. I paper pleasing was one of the root issues, uh, perception of me and how people viewed me, all the things. And I was like, okay, well, I need to replace the lie with what God's word says. God's word says that I am loved, that I that He is proud of me, you know, that I am righteous by faith, all the things. And um as a result of that, I subconsciously changed what my identity was, and then I was like, huh. And then all of a sudden, I started to see the situation for as an opportunity instead of as uh me being the victim. Because let me just stop right there. Because before I go into that, I think that's something right there.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

It's a huge deal. Okay, go ahead. You say what you're gonna say.

SPEAKER_03 25:40

Okay, so so whenever we we need to start looking at life, me especially, but a lot of people out there do it. Um need to stop start looking at life not from the fact of life is doing this to me. Like I'm the victim, like I'm a victim to all my circumstances and the fact that I am I passively cannot do anything. When instead I think that the mind frame is as children of God that God ordains certain circumstances and God ordains certain embarrassments, and his it was actually his grace that made that revealed to me this idol that was in my life and all the stuff, that now I can use it as an opportunity not only to grow further in my relationship with him, but in this situation, it was to actually have an opportunity to amplify his name, which I'll get to in a second.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

But yes, because when you think about it, again, if you click the link and you watch this video, you'll see it really isn't about JC. The video is about the ref. Ooh, ooh, ooh, mom, that that we got that's a whole thing. We gotta wait on that. I gotta wait.

SPEAKER_03 26:42

This is let me know.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

I'm just talking about how in embarrassment, a lot of times, it's because we center ourselves in something that ultimately, but we we can only see our part of it.

SPEAKER_03 26:53

Right.

SPEAKER_01 26:53

And we have to broaden. Okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 26:56

Okay, because I got so much to say, and I don't want to go ahead. I'm gonna finish this. I'm sorry, you had you had to get on the mic. Get on the mic. You had a different format of the podcast. I did.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

We didn't we didn't we clearly we didn't talk about this before because I'm like, I have so many things. This is what's supposed to go a different direction.

SPEAKER_03 27:11

Go ahead. I thought this was the direct, the only direction, chronological order. But I'm the mother. But okay, so basically after that, I was like, huh, how can I use this thing that is making me feel terrible, that feels like a circumstance, a situation where I was the victim of it to an opportunity to where I can be the aggressor, for lack of better words, and using it to spread the gospel. I was like, well, the video had two million views at this point, I think. 2. I don't know why I remember this, 2.3 or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

This is in hour four.

SPEAKER_03 27:43

Yeah, like it is like hour four. And so I was sitting on my hotel room floor and I was like, JC, what the heck am I doing? At least it's out loud. I'm talking to myself, my team, my teammate heard me. He was like, You're you're weird. But I was like, JC, what are you doing? And so I went on the thing and I commented, I was like, haha, yeah, that was me. I did not want to do that. Ha ha, yeah, that was me. Jesus Christ is the way to life, by the way, just in case you didn't know. And I just did that and just commented.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

Actually, what you said was, ha ha, that was me. You said the ref is the goat. The ref is the goat. And then you said, then you said, and since y'all are all here anyway, oh, let me just say Jesus Christ is Lord.

SPEAKER_03 28:23

Yeah, that's what I said. So I I was like, uh, you know, I didn't think it was gonna go that much.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

I need to screenshot that caption. I need to go find that comment. I should have screenshot it in the moment because I saw you posted that and I was like, because I knew you felt embarrassed. Yeah, I sure was. So the fact that you came out of that to make that comment, I thought it was a very big deal in the moment.

SPEAKER_03 28:43

And there were, I mean, I was like, it's 2.3 million. I caught the tail end of it. Sorry, God, I was late. Like, I I, you know, it's it's gonna be like a couple hundred more thousand people, and then it's yeah, it's gonna die down. I didn't know it was gonna get to 10 or 12. So let me just say that right there. I have a lot of side notes as I'm going through this, that a lot of times we think it's too late to respond because we didn't do it at the beginning. And usually, like, I was like, oh 2.3 million. Like, that's not that that's as high as it's gonna get. Like, I'm at the end of this. There's there would be no point in me doing this because not many people are gonna see it. When guys like, no, I got 12 million. If you just do what I gotta say, uh, you still got a bunch of time left that I have for you to make an impact. Just because you didn't do the two, don't mean you can't do the next 10. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

So and you could have never thought that during this current uh a year later, when March Madness Final Four all get kicked up again, this clip goes viral again. Again, a year later. So your comment has been seen by so many more people because you didn't let the fact that you waited a little long keep you from making that comment. I think that's encouraging. I wonder how many thousands of people have liked that comment now at this point.

SPEAKER_03 29:55

So it was thousands and thousands when like last year. So I don't know how many this year. I'm gonna have to go find that. Yeah, who knows? But yeah, I just I think it's encouraging because it it it it was a it was a very like small snapshot to me of God being like, don't don't be discouraged because you disobeyed just here, just because you like, bruh, yep, you were wildin'. Cool, sound good. Change it now, and you still got I still got so much for you here, but don't miss it because you're still like rooted in shame and guilt, and because like like don't there's still so much more left after that. That's great, JC. Commented it. A lot of people saw uh saw a whole bunch of comments, negative, positive, all the things, whatever.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Negative comments? Oh, yeah, of course. What would they negatively say? You mean about your Jesus Christ as Lord comments? Oh, yeah, like religious comments.

SPEAKER_03 30:42

Okay, yeah, it'd be like, no one asked you, bro. Uh, and then they'd be like, You that's why you got in the game, you know, stuff like that. Yeah, whatever. But uh, you know, it was it was funny. Yeah, but yeah, so that that was the end of that. But now let's get to the the thing. The about the the video wasn't even really about me. Like I went through all this stuff, and everybody was like, I was looking through the comments a while afterwards, and they were like, Oh, it's the best ref ever. Like the whole thing was the ref the caption was the ref, the title was the ref, all that was the ref.

SPEAKER_01 31:10

It really was about the the the whole post was to show this ref who we have learned since we got to meet him actually recently at a game. Um, and apparently we have heard this particular ref has such a great reputation because he cares so much about the players, he cares so much about them as individuals, about cultivating them beyond basketball, making sure they have opportunity. Like he's the kind of ref you want, you know, in in the game. And so we've heard so much about him. So the the whole post was really to show this ref giving a kid opportunity. The thing is, when we are in something, individuals, whether it's a viral moment or just something that happens in your life, when we're in a moment, all we can see, because most of us are so self-absorbed and self-focused that in the moment we don't see that the conversation isn't really about us. We just see the moment that we felt a little ping of embarrassment because we didn't show up the way somebody thought we should, or we didn't say the right thing, or we did. We're so consumed with our part in it that unless we are intentional about taking ourselves out of the center, it ain't about, it's not about me. The only reason I feel overwhelmed or shameful or guilty or embarrassed or all those things that are just crippling me is because we have a tendency to center ourselves in the middle of everything. Everything. And we live in a culture that encourages us to. Uh-huh. Talk about it. Talk about it. I'm just saying, you know, we're the center of our own universes. You know, if you get on social media, you kind of make yourself the center of, of course, what you're posting. You're the center of that. You're trying to build a following around that. We're used to sort of being in the vortex of whatever world we're crafting. So then anything that happens or is that that is set around that, we can't help but to feel like a spotlight is on us. And most of the time, everybody around you at the party you went to, they're thinking about themselves too. They're not think about you, they're not thinking about what you have on, they're not thinking about what you said. Everybody's so self-absorbed and sticky and not able to relax and enjoy a moment because everybody is thinking about themselves. So if you and I come into situations, whether it's a viral moment or whether it's a get together, whether it's a party we're at, and we will focus our attention on the other person in the video. In your case, you start looking at the ref. Good for him. Good for him that he got highlighted in his career in this way. Um, we're in a room full of people. Good for her. She looks great. That's a great suit. Instead of being consumed, that your stuff doesn't match up. I wish I would have worn something different. We're so consumed with ourselves, we can't even enjoy the moment. And if we focus on others, we'll find that our embarrassment or feeling of whatever, it really does lessen when we take our attention off ourselves and focus on other people that are in the mix.

SPEAKER_03 34:04

Yeah. Okay, let me spin this right. Yeah, that's that that's great. Let me spin this another way. Also, a lot of the times when we look at the bigger picture of life, like let's say the real is a snapshot of your life. A lot of the times you're so focused on yourself when the whole per the whole reason is for the ref who I'm gonna use as God in illustration, supposed to get the the the glory. Like you are so worried about you in the background and your little thing. Like, no, no, you and me in that video was just a piece to make the glory of God God be more pertinent. Like maybe it caused you a little embarrassment. Maybe it was your circumstance that was off. Like it, like you may have not felt how you wanted to or how you think you should have felt in it, but ultimately it brought God more glory, which is the main point in the first place. So a lot of times it's it's like if we just focused our attention on the right thing, which is God, in the midst of the snapshot of our life, it would be it would be like, oh, it would make your negative feeling or whatever it is, embarrassment, whatever, feel way less overwhelming. Overwhelming, or you care less because you're not focused on how it makes you feel, you're focused on how it makes God look.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

That's right. So it's like and they're I mean, come on, we could give illustration after illustration in the scriptures of that, starting with like David being out in a field shepherding sheep, and he's a nobody in his family. All these brothers, taller, smarter, handsomer, whatever. And they are highlighted when Samuel comes and says, one of these is king, not even his own father thinks of him. And so he's just highlighting the brothers, highlighting the brothers. And David can either sulk and be mad that he wasn't thought of. Or in that moment, based on your illustration, you know what? The fact that I'm out here and nobody thought of me makes it even more meaningful that the purposes of God called me out of obscurity to put a crown on me and to anoint me for his glory. God's work is seen in a much broader way that he takes the lesser and does something with the lesser. Um, that illustration can be true all the way through to the New Testament, where the Apostle Paul, I mean, persecutor of the church, ravaged the church, was trying to pull people into prison, you know, killing Christians, persecute, you know. Because he was Saul, because his reputation was so jacked, he could either stay in shame and guilt once he became Paul, shame and guilt and self-absorbed. I can't believe I was like that. Oh, sob story, blah, blah, blah. Or, you know what? Now I'm determined to know nothing among you except Christ and Christ crucified. Let me go ahead and write one-third of the New Testament. Let me go ahead and use this point moving forward to highlight the name of Christ. And he kept pinning his own story of being Saul. He kept saying, Here's who I was. Look what I did. Can you believe this? Not to bring the attention to him, but to use all of that as a platform to say, God must be gracious, he must be merciful, he must be patient. Look how amazing our God is. That if I was Saul and He has allowed me to be the Apostle Paul and to serve his kingdom, not what does it say about me, what does it say about him? Illustration after illustration after the world.

SPEAKER_03 37:20

You would just go and crazy.

SPEAKER_01 37:23

But I'm saying that's like the story of scripture. And if we never take our attention off ourselves and what we did or what happened to us, not that it's not real, like it's real. Okay, Lord, I shouldn't have done that. Thank you for you know the fact that your grace covers my sin. Or I wish I hadn't gone through that. Lord, couldn't you have chosen another way than to embarrass me? Why I have to be the kid sitting on the sideline and the ref gotta help me. Like I didn't really love that. However, Lord, I'm gonna shift my focus and make it about the ref and not about me. And you know, I think that's a great observation.

SPEAKER_03 37:59

I don't know why this is this this illustration this illustration, this Bible story is coming to my head. I don't even know how it connects all the way. We're just gonna figure it out as I go along. Um but right, uh oh. Uh Hannah, whenever she is feeling embarrassed because she can't have no kids. Right. And then she ultimately is like, Lord, I'm just gonna give it back to you, focusing her attention on God instead of her own embarrassment, her own shame, whatever, and prays and calls him the Lord of hosts. Like, like, like the Lord is fighting for you. Most of the time, I feel like the Lord is fighting for us, like like the ref was stopping the game to help me and pick me up. And the Lord is trying to stop the game, help you and pick you up, but you're so focused on your embarrassment that you're not even doing the situation right. Yeah, and so a lot of times I think even in in from a prayer aspect, if it's like, okay, I can't do it by myself, I'm still feeling anxiety, I'm still feeling shame and guilt and all the things. And then you go to prayer and be like, Lord of hosts, I know you're fighting for me, even for my emotions. Help me, Lord of hosts, be my military God. You know what I mean? And so I think that's even something that I thought about of acknowledging who the Lord is in prayer so that He can so that it reframes my mind of how of his attributes and how those actually help me practically in life or the emotions and circumstances, whatever.

SPEAKER_01 39:11

Because we we really do either have to trust or not that all things are working together for our good. We either believe it or not, it doesn't mean that we feel good about all the things that have happened. It just means all I can just hear your grandfather in my head. Like what he would talk about Nani, my mom, making a cake, and he was like, All the ingredients by themselves wouldn't taste good. Like, who wants raw eggs? Some people do, probably you with this whoop. Um health, health people might want to be able to get it. Oh my whoop got to do it, raw. I'm just saying health. Some people do drink raw eggs for health cake. Like I've seen people like just raw eggs.

SPEAKER_03 39:48

Like that guy salmonella, salmonella. I don't think I wouldn't do it. That sound that sound like Ebola or something.

SPEAKER_01 39:52

But anyway, who's gonna eat three cups of flour? Who's gonna have, you know, two tablespoons of vanilla extract? No. Yeah, that's right. So but it's the combination of all of those things together once put in the oven of the heat of the oven. So even trial, the heat and fire of life's hard circumstances has something something to do with the process. All of those things aren't good by themselves, but you put them together and give them time. And it's the the best thing you've ever tasted. So we either trust that all the things are coming together for our good and that God is the Lord of hosts and He's fighting for us and He's got us and the individual situations in our life. We either trust it or we don't. Yeah, we either trust it or we don't. Yeah, because we are gonna our flesh is gonna feel embarrassed, angry, mad, all the things you explained that you felt in that moment. I I really appreciate you being vulnerable about about that because um not only because it's interesting for people to hear your perspective, but it all and how you had to fight with yourself to get out of that and stop centering yourself in it. But also, I think it's interesting in these last couple of minutes for us to talk about the fact that everybody, probably millions of people you don't know, I know a lot of people we do know, they all they saw was this is great.

SPEAKER_02 41:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:12

Okay. Right. You, the person, felt a stab of embarrassment and frustration and anger, and I can't believe this is going more on and on on. Nobody would have known that. I think that's interesting too for us to all remember that in situations where it sounds like everything's fine, there's probably a person in the middle of that who has such a different perspective. There are layers happening in their life or their thought process or in their heart. You would have never known they brought to that moment. And while everybody's like this, there's something in them that's like and for us to be sensitive and conscious about that. Um, because it's easy to overlook that.

SPEAKER_03 41:52

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:52

With all the fan fear around a thing, it's easy to overlook there's a person back there.

SPEAKER_02 41:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:58

And that person might not feel the same way. Um, I wish, you know, I was glad you had your family around you because you know, you were 20 years old at the time, maybe 19 still, I don't know. But I thought it it made me think about I'm getting so off task. Okay, but in that moment, watching you go viral, knowing on this side of it how you felt, I wish that there were more people who had asked you how you felt. Um, people that know you, instead of just being like, look at that, that sounds great. I was like, they don't know, you know, it's not they're bad. I'm just saying I wish somebody would have said also, you okay, you good, you know? Um and then also I it made me think about people who are actually in the limelight all the time.

SPEAKER_03 42:47

Oh, yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_01 42:48

Okay, that's good. So I don't know what people's perceptions are about our family, but we're not in the limelight all the time. We're not media, we're not outdated out there on red carpets and doing stuff that draws public attention to our family all the time. And I know that's relative because for some people, you're like, yeah, y'all are you? You got a podcast and all that. But no, no, no. I'm talking about people whose their daily reality A-list, A-list boys. Yes, and I don't even mean celebrity status, but just what they do has them sort of in an arena of conversation amongst strangers all the time. I cannot imagine that. It's a lot, it's a lot because on the other side of all those conversations and all that attention and everything that looks glamorous, there's a person who's dealing with internal stuff, who's dealing with feelings of maybe insecurity, like you said at the beginning of this conversation that you hadn't been a a first string player your whole college career. That probably didn't feel good. You were probably already wrestling with that. You know what I mean? So as you're wrestling with all that, and then this converges, people have no idea. It doesn't feel the same to you as it as the perception is. And I think that's true for a lot of people in our lives. And it should also make us sensitive, I guess I'm saying, as a just a little random thought. No, it's not true. To people who are in the limelight all the time. Yeah. There are humans back there.

SPEAKER_03 44:12

I mean, yeah, I think it's important, even in uh the the Bible story uh in numbers that I referenced, like it was the people that spread or influenced the negative feeling also. Yeah. Like people are important, like whether it was from the spies' leadership position and telling the the other community, which is the whole community wept, or whether it was the other way the community was listening to leaders who they shouldn't have been listening to, so they wept. And then as a whole, community, the peers, they wept. Like all the layers happened. Right, however, the layers of it happened. Like it's it's people influence and can impact the way that you feel and what you believe in the situation. Yeah. And so it's like be be sensitive and know, like, oh no, I have real impact for people because it does it in the Bible, and the Bible's true. So if you don't believe me, believe that.

SPEAKER_01 45:01

So the moral of the story is when you feel embarrassed, decenter yourself. Put your attention on some other people that are a part of that story. Um, that will help diffuse some of the feeling. And then ask the Lord, why have you allowed this? Yeah, interrogate it. Interrogate it, interrogate the interrogate the feeling so he can put a spotlight on what's in you that made you feel embarrassed in this moment. Is there anything I need to deconstruct that doesn't reflect my character? But then also, Lord, how can I use this as a platform? If these people are looking at me because I'm embarrassed, yeah, I'm embarrassed because people's eyes are on me about something. Okay, well, now what am I supposed to do to make your name great right here? And then go ahead and do that. And I just, you know, I'm gonna tell you. You always are like, oh my God, my mom is always talking about me and telling me how proud she is of me. And I want to tell you, I think I forwarded it to you. There was a DM. I don't get to respond to or even read most of the DMs that I get. There is one that came across my eyes. I think I screenshotted it and forwarded to you. It was a mother saying to me that she watched one of our shows where you were saying, Oh my gosh, mom, stop talking about how proud you're of me. Nobody cares to hear this anymore. And that mom sent a DM to say, Tell your son that I appreciate your mom bragging on you and saying how proud she is of you and your brothers. And she said, That whole show, I don't know what that topic was about. We were talking about that day. She was inspired by the pride that I was willing to vocalize. She said it made her go to her son and go, you know what? I just actually need to affirm you and tell you how proud I am of you. So thank you, ma'am, for that comment.

SPEAKER_03 46:41

And on that note, I'm glad that I could be embarrassed for God's glory.

SPEAKER_01 46:45

I want to say I'm proud of you. You handled that at that young age very maturely. It was a lot of pressure, um, a lot of eyes on you, a lot of people thinking it was fantastic. And I it could have made you crumble, it could have made you feel real internal and get small. It could have made you kind of, I don't know, react negatively and differently. And you made a decision. I'm gonna go ahead and use this for God's glory. So this is happening. And also I'm gonna decenter myself and make it about this ref and celebrate him instead of letting it cripple me.

SPEAKER_03 47:17

I'm proud of you. Thanks, thanks. I I'm not good at taking compliments. I know you're not. I like the earring situation you got going on. No, don't try to compliment my earrings.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

Anyway, thank y'all for listening to this conversation. I hope it was a blessing to you, and I'm proud of you, then.

SPEAKER_03 47:31

Thanks. Yep, have a good one. We'll see y'all in the next episode.