When Expectations Become a Burden with Jude Shirer

In this episode of Full Fledged, Priscilla and JC sit down with Jude Shirer for an honest conversation about navigating life with expectations. Together, they discuss the pressure of trying to meet other people's standards and how to find purpose in seasons of uncertainty.

Jude shares personal insights on learning to let go of the expectations that can leave us feeling stuck even though he feels the pressure from others or himself. Whether you're questioning your next step, feeling behind in life, or trying to discover your purpose, this episode offers encouragement and practical wisdom for the journey.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Like if someone asks you to describe yourself and to define what what are the things that you feel like the Lord is pointing out to you that are things you're good at.

SPEAKER_03 0:08

I really have just always thought I'm good at everything.

SPEAKER_00 0:11

I such humility.

SPEAKER_03 0:14

I think that if you put anything in my hand and tell me to do it, I can do it. I I I don't I don't I don't I don't think I'm not good at it. If I gave you a fiddle, I can fiddle. Give me 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_01 0:34

Hey JC.

SPEAKER_02 0:36

Alright.

SPEAKER_01 0:37

How are you?

SPEAKER_02 0:38

I'm doing phenomenal. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 0:40

Why why do you sound kind of like low-key and kind of like I don't know?

SPEAKER_02 0:45

I'm pretty relaxed right now. You're relaxed? I'm pretty chill. Relaxed and chill is good. You know what's interesting because usually when I'm so I have like a okay, how do I explain this without sounding weird? Um I have like two tones. When I'm like super like this, like this, it's because my brain is very free. But I'm super like this and something like this, it's because I'm thinking a lot. So what are you thinking about right now? I'm thinking about a lot of things. I just got sended the real estate thing, so I'm thinking about that like halfway, and then I just like a bunch of social media stuff just happened. So like I was thinking about that, and now we're about to go on the podcast. Yeah, so I'm thinking about it.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

So what you're saying to me as we enter into this uh recording for this podcast is that you're actually not fully present with me in the conversation yet.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Okay, and y'all, this is how the assumptions and stuff gets read into because I didn't say that. I'm good, I'm locked in on what we no, I didn't say that. I just because is your mind, I guess. Yeah, that's not a good question. I'm fully present. Okay, anyways.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

I know what will bring you into the moment though. This theme song. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, all right, thank you for doing it with me. I'm so glad. Welcome to the homie podcast.

SPEAKER_02 2:01

Only do it because it makes you happy.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

It does make me happy. I like our theme song.

SPEAKER_02 2:05

It makes you so happy.

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Um, it makes me feel like Tabitha Brown. It just does. It makes me feel like, you know, I'm just doing a little beginning song. If you if you did like the um on the table, you know, just maybe.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

We just copied them like that.

SPEAKER_01 2:16

Yeah, we couldn't copy them completely. But thank you, Auntie Tab, for the inspiration. Um, welcome. We're so glad you're here, full-fledged. Today we're thrilled because we have a guest with us that I'm looking forward to talking to. Are you gonna you you do the honors, JC?

SPEAKER_02 2:32

Okay. Um, well, when I do the honors, you always overdo it anyway. So do you are you really gonna? Yep. Okay, yeah. So here today we have my brother Drew Shire. Hi.

SPEAKER_01 2:46

He he literally did not do that justice. What? You just said his name. You didn't say that's my brother Jude Shire.

SPEAKER_03 2:54

You didn't say I think we're both just collectively disappointed in that theme song.

SPEAKER_02 3:02

Okay. Well, let's get it started off right because Jude is the funniest person in our family. Yeah. By far. Jude is the funniest person.

SPEAKER_01 3:12

And you know, we've had a lot of people request that we do a podcast with you.

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Jude right now you're the most requested for sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

Absolutely. Jude, just so everybody knows. I know. I have three sons. Jude is the baby. He's the surprise baby, actually. Jude, tell everybody how old you are and sort of what your life looks like right now, what you're doing, what you're headed into, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_03 3:33

Uh I'm 17. Uh, I'm going to my senior year of high school. Um, I really don't have like a designated area that I'm trying to go in when it comes to my life. Um I'm trying to I'm trying to figure that out right now. So you are. Yeah. Um really got a title.

SPEAKER_01 3:51

And it's it's okay to figure it out when you're finishing your junior year, going into your senior year. You're still like just trying to figure out what you like, what you don't like, where you're headed. Yeah. Very good. Um, how would you describe Jude? You just said that he's like the funniest person in the family. Like, what do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_02 4:07

The the the most outlandish, um, the most comedic. Um I would say the most. Hmm. I can't say unfiltered because Jackson's pretty unfiltered.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:22

Um but he is filtered.

SPEAKER_01 4:25

He's a little unfortunate.

SPEAKER_03 4:26

No, they're they're both very unfiltered. I literally was thinking, so like our aunt is at our house right now, and as I came downstairs and she was talking to me about the podcast, I literally was thinking in my head, I'm not PR trained enough for this. Like, I don't know what questions they're gonna ask me or what I'm gonna do. We don't know what questions we're gonna ask you.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

You could just relax and be at home and be in conversation with your mom and brother. That's what this is, and just a few friends that are watching, you know, it's just a conversation amongst friends. How does it feel to be the youngest brother? We asked Jackson how he felt being the oldest brother. How do you feel being the youngest brother? What are the like either the responsibilities for that or the like I guess the not the negatives and the positives of being the youngest?

SPEAKER_03 5:08

I feel like the positives is that since they're out the house quicker, there's more food. Jackson eats everything. That is true. There's nothing, there's nothing that Jackson doesn't eat.

SPEAKER_02 5:18

I literally did not think about that.

SPEAKER_03 5:20

Like, actually, he gets more food. Not even exaggerating. I feel like like the cons though, is I feel like there's more, there's more, it gets more expectation as y'all two get older, you and Jackson. Because y'all two, since y'all are like older than me and y'all like have gone through a lot more lives than me, y'all kind of figured out what y'all want to do. But then I'm kind of sitting here trying to figure out what path I want to go on this, then the third. And so I feel like I gotta do something.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

You know, so I don't know if you'd agree with that, but I can see that. So you're saying you feel like you have to kind of keep up with them. Yeah, I feel like, yeah, in a sense. Do you feel like other people are putting that expectation on you, or you feel like that's just something you internally are putting on yourself?

SPEAKER_03 6:00

No, it's it's myself. Because I I've never been the type of person to think, like, oh, this person thinks this about me, so now I have to I have to be this. If that were the case, I'd be speaking right now.

SPEAKER_01 6:12

Because you think a lot of people think you're supposed to be a speaker because you come from a family that does that? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:17

Okay. And so I just feel like I haven't kind of figured out what you know my my my thing is. What about them?

SPEAKER_02 6:23

Do you feel like they may put pressure on you to to figure out what you gotta do? Oh, for sure not. You said no? Oh no.

SPEAKER_01 6:29

Oh no, we don't. I'm kind of like, I love the fact that at your age and stage, even at their age and stage, I think that when you don't know, it's such a fun place to be in where you're like just exploring. Explore all the things that you have. It's stressful, it's so stressful.

SPEAKER_03 6:46

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 6:47

What a gift to have the opportunity to explore a few things that you love and enjoy and just wait and see how the road leads you, how God leads you.

SPEAKER_03 6:55

But you gotta think everyone, like most everyone in our family is successful in something.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 7:00

I feel like every one, everyone in our family is great at something. I'm just I feel like I'm just good at everything. So like I'm not, I don't have like a specific, I just it's very stressful when it's just like I don't know where I'm going.

SPEAKER_02 7:12

You know, I don't think I agree with that. I think you're very good actually at um like anything that has to do with entertainment. I think you're very good at entertainment, which is why I think you should still stream.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

Yeah, I stopped doing that, but Priscilla doesn't want to buy me a new computer.

SPEAKER_01 7:29

Did you say Priscilla? Who are you talking to? Priscilla don't want to buy me a new computer. No, you didn't. Buster. Okay. One of the ways, let's go. This is very interesting, actually. Okay. You you just said you feel like you're in a family where people are great at what they do. But those people that you're referring to were 20 years old at some point, they were your age. The greatness that you might perceive that you're enjoying watching in your family members, that would have been honed over a lifetime. So when we look at your grandfather preaching, and he's one of the greatest communicators I've ever heard anywhere, and I think a lot of people would say that, he wasn't that way when he was 20. He wasn't that way when he was 30. So if if in fact he didn't know what he was going to do at 20, he would have said he didn't want to be a preacher or a pastor when he was 20. So here is your grandfather who you're looking at in his greatness right now, and this is the same for any of us. We look at people who we admire, whether they're in our family or not, because they're great actors or great lawyers or whatever they are, and they're great. Well, they didn't know what they wanted to do, and they had to hone that through their 20s and 30s and 40s. So I'm just saying you got to give yourself a break that it's okay to just explore right now and to find that sweet spot that God's gonna introduce you to as you go through your senior year and your college years and into your 20s. Does that make sense? That makes sense. Yeah, I feel like I'd give yourself a break. So, does it feel intimidating to be around people that are great in their craft or great in their field? Does it feel inspiring to you guys?

SPEAKER_03 9:05

It's definitely not intimidating. Okay, I don't think it's intimidating, but I feel like I don't think it's inspiring in a sense of like, okay, I see it and now I want to get there. Like, I like I I've never been the type of person like I never want to be in second place. Like, I feel like now a lot of the things I do, I'm always second. I always want to be first. I hate being a second. That's literally the worst thing ever. I'd rather be last and second. It's not it's not a crazy take. I'd rather be last. It's not a crazy take. I was just talking about some of this.

SPEAKER_01 9:32

I think that's a guy thing too, a competitive guy thing.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

It's either first or last. I'll say, like, you either won or you lost. Like it's it.

SPEAKER_03 9:40

You either won or you lost.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

You can't take any pride in a silver medal.

SPEAKER_03 9:44

I think every time I've got like in a basketball tournament, every single time I've gotten a second place medal, I threw it away in the trash can immediately. I don't think I've ever, I don't think I have one. Yeah. And I don't want to give it to you either because you keep everything.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Of course I'm gonna.

SPEAKER_03 9:57

You hoard everything. You are a little bit of a hoarder.

SPEAKER_01 10:00

No, no, I'm not a hoarder. I want to keep what I think you guys will appreciate later.

SPEAKER_03 10:07

Mom, I'm not gonna appreciate my fourth grade Abiyana roll.

SPEAKER_01 10:11

You will because one day you'll have a fourth grader of your own. And you'll be able to show, you'll be able to show him or her. Look, I was in fourth grade. Here was here's what my grades were.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

I I I I want I want to know who has the improper perception because I don't think I'm gonna do that. And you say, no, y'all gonna want to do that when you're there, but I really am like, no, I don't think I'm gonna want to do that. So I wonder who's gonna be right.

SPEAKER_01 10:34

Uh it it will be interesting to see who's right. And I know we're off on a tangent right now, but let me just say, we found your grandfather's uh report cards from when he was like second and third grade. Two mama save you.

SPEAKER_02 10:48

No.

SPEAKER_01 10:48

No, I'm right, but that's what I'm saying. But I'm just saying his mother had the foresight to save them, and now his grandchildren, we so glad we have them because the teacher was like, You got ADD, you got like all this stuff that was written down by this teacher about your grandfather in his second grade year. And we were able to actually see some of the stuff his grandchildren got going on is connected to what he had going on in his third grade. And that's the thing.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

I don't I don't know if I disagree with the fact that maybe my children might appreciate it. I'm just not gonna give it to them.

SPEAKER_01 11:16

You might not, but your wife might appreciate it. She might be like, I'm so glad to see what my husband was like when he was in sixth grade.

SPEAKER_03 11:22

Right.

SPEAKER_01 11:22

Because his mother had the foresight to save the silver medal. That's the point of this whole thing.

SPEAKER_03 11:26

So you don't like to- I would never want my grandchildren to see my silver medal. What? Yeah. I would never, I don't I don't want my grandchildren to see I'm in second. That's horrible.

SPEAKER_02 11:35

I ain't gonna lie. I'm gonna gas myself up so crazy to my kids and grandkids. I can't give them nothing at second place. I'm gonna be the best thing that ever was.

SPEAKER_03 11:43

I'm talking about the first man on Mars, something.

unknown 11:46

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 11:46

Wow, some crazy accomplishments that I never did. I'm gonna just lie to them. Not crazy. I was in the I was in the league and won MVP uh year 2020, but you can't find it. You can't find it, the internet. It wasn't around back then, so you can't see it.

SPEAKER_01 12:01

So just lying. You're gonna lie to your kids.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

I'm not gonna do that. No, I'm not joking. I'm just saying.

SPEAKER_01 12:06

So, Jude, how do you deal with the expectations? You if you don't like to be second. Also, you said you feel a level of expectation that you put on yourself. Um, just so you know, I can relate to that because Auntie Chrissy, my older sister, your aunt, she was a high achiever. So she made A's without trying. She didn't have to study and made A's. I studied like a crazy person and barely would make a B. She just was kind of excellent at everything she did. She had clear skin. She never had pimples. I had pimples everywhere. She had this long flowing hair. I was always struggling with my hair. Like, I was always trying to keep up with Crystal. She was the like standard to me. So I know that feeling that it can be can be kind of crippling. And I know you've struggled with expectation. So what do you do? How have you tried to manage that and not let it sort of control your life and make you feel this constant need to strive or prove something?

SPEAKER_03 13:03

Well, I feel like I've just been really great at I've always been really great at not letting people put me in a bubble. Because uh, like I will like y'all know, like I've always been kind of like an outgoing person, wherever I am, like it really doesn't matter who's looking, I'm always the same person. Like I uh but I feel like it's just it's just kind of a natural thing not letting other people uh put a standard on me that I don't have on myself, even though that my standard for myself is through the roof, I'm not gonna let anyone lower it or hire it. You know what I'm saying? Like but um I I I really I really is it something that you struggle with though like that you have to constantly be aware of that you don't let expectations determine what you're gonna do or yeah, I definitely I I definitely have to be aware in a sense because like the other day, um I'm I'm I'm not gonna get too specific, but a woman came up to me. A woman, like it was perfect 2026, guys, and uh she came up to me. I think I told JC the story, and she started asking me what my aspirations were in life, like what I was doing, what I was doing with my life currently in that moment. And I looked at her, I was like, I don't know. And then she was like, You're not speaking, you're not doing nothing. I was like, I I was I was just trying to sell it a CD. And she like was getting red, like she was mad, like she was actually angered that I had no clue what I would like what I was doing, and I was just living my life. Like actual anger. Really? Like like tell me this. And then another lady came over and was like, Don't don't worry, baby. I'm I'm I'm just I just want a C D. I just want the C D. I'm gonna but like that just blew me away.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Yeah, it blows me away while we're that you're you're sharing this, that this woman expects you at the season of life you're in to have full clarity on what you're doing with your life.

SPEAKER_02 15:01

Well, you do understand that that's pretty regular for us, though. It's not I think we all handle it differently, but I think it's pretty regular. Like there are the same thing about people expecting me to be a pastor or like something like that. Like it's kind of it's the same principle. Like people just think that think that they have the ability to tell you and foresee exactly what you're supposed to be doing and what you should be doing. And it's like actually, nah, you don't you don't know me, and I don't I don't actually want to do that.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

Yeah, and you also don't owe anybody an explanation about what you're choosing to do with your life, or that you have to feel like you have to have that all figured out. So I'm sorry that that pressure was is put on y'all. I I had some of that too when I was your age, you know, people just thinking, this is what you're gonna do, you know, whatever. But yeah, I would hate for that to, like you said, box you in because you you shouldn't know what you're gonna do right now. But here's the question I have for you. That you are careful not to let the expectation and the pressure of it steer you in a in a direction out of rebellion that is away from the possibility of what God is asking you to do, meaning we've talked about this before, that sometimes you can be running so hard to make sure you don't do what people expect you to do, that actually you miss the fact that, oh, actually I am good at communication. Let's just say that, let's use that as an example, because you actually are a good communicator. So let's say as you grow up, it becomes apparent that you're supposed to be communicating in some way. Um, you've been around that all your life, you you're good at it naturally, and you kind of go, oh, I do enjoy this. But there might be a part of you that's like, I'm not doing that because that's what my family has done. I'm not doing that because that's what people expect me to do. How are you gonna manage the idea that the pressure is not fair, but also I don't want to want it to allow it to make me run in the opposite direction of what could be something that God is opening up the door for me to do.

SPEAKER_03 18:42

I definitely still gotta figure that out because I'm definitely like if you tell me this and I don't like it, I'm gonna do the exact opposite and win. Just to so just to show you that. I'm the same way. I'm the same way. That's I I I don't I I don't even have an answer to that question. I don't know. I just gotta I don't know, I guess learn.

SPEAKER_02 18:59

Also, another thought in my head is like, I mean, the most cliche saying ever, like pressure makes diamonds but bust pipes. You know what I mean? Like it's kind of like the the the pressure of you know, like people telling you what you're supposed to be, or the pressure of the the stuff that you feel on yourself, it could either be used to like break you or go into rebellion and just do something totally outlandish just because someone said that you you shouldn't do it, or like, you know, the exact opposite. When it's it kind of should be like just a way to, I kind of look at it as a way of like, hmm, okay, let me figure out how to deal with the pressure. Because there's gonna be pressure in every area of life. I feel like whether you go into whatever field you're in, you're gonna be have the pressure on yourself to be great. It's gonna be pressure on everybody else when they know what you're doing to be great at whatever you chose to do anyway. So I kind of just look at it as like a way to learn how to um deal with pressure, how to internalize pressure, and how to use pressure like in in a positive way. Does that make sense? Yeah. So that's kind of how I view it a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

But so, Jude, what do you think you are good at? Like if someone asks you to describe yourself and to define what what are the things that you feel like the Lord is pointing out to you that are things you're good at?

SPEAKER_03 20:13

Uh there's actually not one specific thing I could think of. I really have just always thought I'm good at everything. I such humility. I I think that if you put anything in my hand and tell me to do it, I can do it. I I don't I I don't I don't think I'm not good at it. If I gave you a fiddle, I can fiddle. Give me 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_01 20:35

I will say, I was about to say, I will say you are very resourceful. I know that if I can't, for example, put you're like this too. If I can't put something together like it's complicated, I can give it to y'all and you'll go on YouTube university, like you're gonna figure out, like you said, how to fiddle. So I feel like one of the things that you are, yeah, honestly, that is such an important characteristic in a person is the ability to be resourceful, to figure things out.

SPEAKER_02 21:03

And you're a true, you're a figure out, yeah. That's true. I remember I was looking at because you had a YouTube channel, and uh I was doing the the podcast joint, and I saw his page and I was like, these clips look real good.

SPEAKER_04 21:16

How is he doing this?

SPEAKER_02 21:17

Because he does all that stuff in the city. I call him, I was like, How are you? He was like, I just use this one thing. I was like, wow, he just kind of figures stuff out, yeah. He just kind of does it. Yeah, and it's just the most random stuff ever. Like, nobody knows, and then all of a sudden, bam, dude doing something. I'm just like, wait, what? Where do you get that from?

unknown 21:36

How do you get that?

SPEAKER_01 21:37

Well, just so y'all know, that that's one of the most important characteristics for people to have. Like, even in the workplace, employers are trying to find people who maybe don't know it all, but they're resourceful enough to figure it out. You know what I mean? So the fact that you have learned that skill is really cool. Um, I have a question for you. What is the hardest thing or the most important things in? Impactful things that you think people your age are wrestling with right now. People that are 16, 17, juniors, seniors, 18 years old, what are y'all wrestling with right now?

SPEAKER_03 22:12

I feel like most people my age are trying to fit into the bubble of what like social media has like portrayed onto them. Because I feel like there's a standard that most people on social media, whether you want to be an influencer, whether like whatever you want to be, there's always a bubble that you have to fit in or else you're not gonna fit in at all. And so like I uh I feel like especially a lot of the people that I'm connected to, they they kind of they kind of feel like like I do in a sense that they owe they have to be like something at some point, because either no one in their family is really significant in any way, or maybe they do have a lot of people in their family who are like you poppy high achievers and want to be everything, you know what I'm saying? And so I feel like a lot of people just in my uh generation struggle with identity for sure.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Yeah. Do you feel like when you mentioned social media, do you feel like the inundation of social media in their orbit and y'all's orbit is contributing to that? Like comparison is so through the roof that it's hard to just relax into your uniqueness because it's like you're constantly comparing yourself to what the norm is portrayed to be on your phone.

SPEAKER_03 23:36

Yes, but I think people look at compare like people look at that like comparison a lot differently. Like some people look at it and say, Oh, I'm not gonna be as good as that, like I can't be as good as that, as good as that. And some people look at it and say, Oh my gosh, like you're you're trash. I'm a hundred I'm better than you at this.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

And then they just kind of then the humility the humility part of aspect of everything comes into place, and then they just you know, I mean, yeah, because comparison's a is a is a tricky thing because comparison inherently isn't bad, right? Like if we weren't able to compare ourselves to Jesus, then we would kind of be screwed. Um so comparison isn't inherently bad, it's just how you use comparison and what you use it for. And so, like most people do it like you're saying, like they go on socials, and I'm like, oh, that guy sucks, and they needed to uplift themselves, or they're they compare it to where they are currently, and then it makes them have this um the this this um feeling of wanting to be more, but for the wrong reason. And so it comparison is is a tricky thing, but like so when you for you, when you are do you feel yourself comparing yourself to other people a lot, or are you like, oh yeah?

SPEAKER_03 24:54

Mm-mm. Not really. I feel like in a sense I have my own story. And this this sounds a little bit like cliche because of the podcast and all that, but you talked about how Aunt Chrissy, you kind of compared yourself to Aunt Chrissy a little bit. I actually like my entire life, except for like the past like year or so, actually compared myself to JC my entire life. You did copy my swag. I did everything JC did you copy my swag as soon as he as soon as I watched one of your basketballs, I was like, oh, he's kind of good at that. I want to be good at that too. And so I started playing basketball at everything.

SPEAKER_01 25:22

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 25:23

And so like JC was like, I still now like I'll compare my freshman year stats to your freshman year stats on max preps. Just to let you know, I'm better than you. I ain't gonna lie to it. You was definitely not better than me, bro. I'm better than you. I'm better than you at every year.

SPEAKER_02 25:39

I'm not gonna lie. KCA, I mean, would Grace Prep would be KCA by 50.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

So you're saying because he's in a different district to school district, so the comparison is.

SPEAKER_02 26:01

I would have beat y'all by myself. You're crazy. I also no, that's crazy. That is crazy. I would have beat y'all by myself. My freshman year. That was prime. Come back, gentlemen. That was prime year. It's just not even close.

SPEAKER_03 26:17

It was prime, it's just not even close. It's literally not close. You're lucky you have the knees of an 80-year-old man. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 26:25

Come back, gentlemen.

SPEAKER_03 26:27

Apologize. Apologies.

SPEAKER_01 26:30

Okay, so what was the question?

SPEAKER_02 26:32

Uh oh, comparison, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 26:34

You we were talking comparison.

SPEAKER_02 26:36

You're talking about you comparing yourself to people.

SPEAKER_01 26:38

Yes. Oh, you were talking about your brother. You were talking about basically that you found yourself throughout your lifetime trying to live up to whatever standard you perceived your older brother to be. But don't you feel like that could also be, to your point about comparison not being inherently bad, it could also be inspirational that if you have a prototype, which an older sibling can be that in a great way for people, you have a prototype and you're like, you know what?

SPEAKER_03 27:02

I'm aspiring to accomplish what my older siblings was less of aspiring and more like, I have to be better than him.

SPEAKER_01 27:09

You just want to be better. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:10

Like because he was like, JC was the standard to me. And so I'm like, okay, I have to be better than the standard. That's not you know what?

SPEAKER_02 27:17

That's not crazy.

SPEAKER_03 27:18

I've never been like, okay, I have to meet the standard. I've never said I want to meet the standard. I always said I want to be better than the standard.

SPEAKER_01 27:22

Why do you think that JC for you was the standard? Like, what was it about him that made you feel like this is duh.

SPEAKER_02 27:31

I'm just playing.

SPEAKER_01 27:32

Go ahead, Jude. Answer the question.

SPEAKER_03 27:34

I actually don't know. I don't have an answer to that question. It's kind of like.

SPEAKER_01 27:37

Well, why do you think he's a good standard now? Like as your older brother, because I still look up to Auntie Chrissy. Like, there are things about Chrissy. Um, man, there are people, yeah, that I look up to and I'm I'm inspired by them. So when you look at JC now and where he is now at 21 years old, the values he has, the work ethic he has.

SPEAKER_03 27:54

Dang, but you're 21. Start a family, man. 21. Start a family or something, but you're pushing 30.

SPEAKER_02 28:00

21.

SPEAKER_01 28:02

30.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

That I can't even accept that as reasonable. 21.

SPEAKER_01 28:07

21, he just got into his 20s.

SPEAKER_02 28:10

So as soon as you turn 20, you're pushing 30. Yeah.

unknown 28:13

What?

SPEAKER_02 28:13

That's three years from now. You'll be pushing 30 in three years? I guess. But you're gonna be closer to 30 than me. I mean, I'll always be closer to 30, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 28:24

What things about JC are still, you know, in a good way, like aspirational for you?

SPEAKER_03 28:31

Uh, I think that even like if you can't, even if like you can't see that he doesn't know like what direction he's going in or what he wants to do, it always looks like it. Like he always composure, like he's just a very composed kind of person. I feel like when I'm stressed out about something, I'm everywhere. I'm trying, I'm doing everything at once. JC is kind of like calm. Yeah, like that's true. Like that that's that's the part that still is like inspirational, I guess, for me.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Okay. Anything else?

SPEAKER_03 28:59

Um I feel like uh like when I my my drive is really great because JC's drive was great. Like I saw him working out outside, uh trying to play get better at basketball or whatever that was, just throughout the through the window, and just like, hmm. Like, I can do that too.

SPEAKER_01 29:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:21

I think like those those two things specifically.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

We were talking about people your age and what they struggle with. Was there anything else? Because you said you mentioned the comparison thing that they're constantly trying to fit in. Um, but was there something else that you feel like when your friends are talking? Um, and I'm thinking about the parent that might be on the other side of this conversation, and they're listening in and they're like, I'm wondering what my 17-year-olds maybe aren't telling me, like my 16-year-old isn't telling me. That is a conversation them and their friends are having regularly that it's something that's hard for them or they're trying to manage or work through.

SPEAKER_03 29:56

I feel like that since some adults haven't been kids in so long, they forgot how hard it is to be a kid. And so, like, like the expectations of school, like their academic like academic success, whether that's sports, and just then come coming home, and then sometimes their home life isn't as supportive as it could be. I feel like then that just leaves a lot of stress on the on the kids. And like I said before, y'all haven't made kids in so long. You specifically.

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Now they're old, that's basically.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Yeah. Um, yes, guys, Priscilla Shire is turning 70 next December. He's really aging both of us, isn't he? Right. Goodness, gracious.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

Yeah. So just yeah, basically that not recognizing that it feels stressful sometimes to be 17 years old.

SPEAKER_02 30:49

Okay, so flipping it on you, um, like what or I guess maybe it's different, but how did you actively like if you can remember? I had to raise Jackson this way. You know, it's a Jackson, he's not here, but the difference between how me I was like my personality and Jude's personality, and how you had to like parent differently for each like kid.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

Yeah, that is one of the hardest things about being a parent, is that you I I wish I could have been even more specific and diverse in the way I parented you guys. Because a lot of the differences in how y'all are, you don't know until the kid is growing. Like that their personality is being shaped as they mature. So then you get to 14 and you're like, oh, this is what would be most helpful for this one. But you you miss 14 years because you just it's a blanket parenting, you know what I mean? Um, but you are less sensitive than Jude is. So there is an awareness that I have that something I might say, your dad and I talk about this all the time, something that that I might say, the way I say it is gonna matter more to Jude. It's gonna impact him differently than it is to you. You're it's gonna roll off your shoulder pretty easily. Now, there's still some things obviously that matter, but I'm more conscious. And this is more your dad, even than me, because I think the way I talk to you is it it just works with us. Your dad has to think about how sharply he might say something, because while it might roll off his shoulders, you might absorb it and you're not as much of a talker as JC is. So we might not know that actually you felt something really deeply, or it was hurtful, or it you kind of absorbed it into your, you know, your your thinking and your processing, and we wouldn't know because you wouldn't say that. So we'd never be aware of that. So that's one of the ways is just watching the way something is said.

SPEAKER_03 32:42

Um talking about my deepest feelings. That's my worst nightmare. That's my biggest fear. I hate it. Wait, why? It's so uncomfortable. It is I hate like if something hurts me, I'll just like what about what about it?

SPEAKER_02 32:54

It's like scary. Like talking about afraid that what they'll what they'll think about you or how they'll use it against you.

SPEAKER_03 33:01

I think it started as like, okay, I'm Jude Shire. I'm supposed to be smiling all the time, happy to meet people. Like, I'm like, that's just kind of how we were raised. Like, it doesn't matter if you uh beat the black off my butt at in the parking lot. I have to come into the church, smile to greet people as juge.

SPEAKER_01 33:22

You mean if you got in trouble? Yes. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 33:24

And so it's just kind of like, okay, doesn't matter if I'm sad. I kind of just have to I I kind of just have to hold in. It started like that, and then it came to a point where it was kind of just like, okay, it's always been like this. I'm just gonna keep doing it because it seems to be working out fine.

SPEAKER_01 33:40

This is so interesting. So did you feel like you had to kind of perform, like put on a performance?

SPEAKER_03 33:45

Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Really?

SPEAKER_03 33:46

And you felt like we required that, or do you feel like you sort of just felt that way in the I feel like there's there's just one specific time where, like, like I just said, that happened, like I got in trouble in the in the parking lot or whatever, and then I came in, and then the first thing you told me was fix your face, you're about to have because you're a part of the church, and so people are gonna walk up to me and talk to me in this and therapy, and I can't look like that.

SPEAKER_01 34:08

And so do you feel like I would have said that if we were going into a restaurant? I feel like yeah, I feel like it was a good one. It wasn't because we just like get yourself together.

SPEAKER_03 34:14

It was like us, it was just it just happened to be at church. And and I think just ever since then I was like, okay, I'm I gotta I gotta fix, I gotta I gotta fix what I got going on to not put on a mask and per not perform, but be be who I am without the insecurities, without the uh the the hurt in my heart, all that to other people, you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 34:45

Do you feel like that less now that you've gotten older? Like where you're aware, okay, I in some ways have put on a mask. So I need to not live like this. I need to, now that I'm aware of it, I need to make myself actually just be real, be honest, be vulnerable, be authentic. Like, are you combating that tendency or are you just going, I don't, it's uncomfortable for me?

SPEAKER_03 35:07

I hate it. I still hate it.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

But despite the fact that you hate it, are you willing to do it because you know that it's important for you to be able to be real? Or no?

SPEAKER_03 35:17

I just uh mm-mm. I'd I I'd rather just keep my mouth closed. Do you have anybody that you can be real with?

SPEAKER_02 35:24

Uh yes. I thought you got like some you have friends.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

I have like one or two friends that I could be real with. It's just so uncomfortable for me to say it that even with those friends, it's kind of just like I'll I can we can scratch the surface a little bit, but you can't go all the way deep.

SPEAKER_02 35:36

Yeah, you know, and that's uh yeah, yeah. I I I don't I I don't think that I internalize this. Is my thing. I always say, like, I don't ever feel like it's that serious enough for me to say anything in the first place because I can just deal with it and figure it out in a way. That's exactly how I feel.

SPEAKER_03 35:52

That's exactly how I feel. Like it's like I can figure it out. Like if it's something that I feel like I can't figure out on my own, of course I'm gonna say something about it. Yeah, but I I feel like I can.

SPEAKER_02 36:00

So it's just yeah, and sometimes there's an unrealistic um like there can be an unrealistic expectation on ourselves that we actually can figure it out by ourselves. Yeah. Um like I I I am I am I'm apt to that. Like I I can get that, but I still think I can't figure it out by myself. And I'm gonna try to figure it out by myself first. And I don't know if that's bad or good, and I don't really know how to differentiate between maybe I should say something or shouldn't say anything. So I guess I guess I would ask the question for both of us from someone who maybe doesn't struggle with that, how would you know, like, oh, that's worth telling somebody, or I'm just yapping, I don't even need to yap because I can figure that out by myself. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 36:39

Yeah, that's a good question because I think each situation is different. Like it depends on what the thing is, it depends on how it's if it starts to cause you to implode on the inside, meaning you're you're really it's really causing a sense of anxiety. It's it's a little bit crippling. Like you could find you find that it's starting to eat away at your ability to sleep well at night or function during the day, you know, like it's just it's on your mind constantly. So if it's starting to impact you um in that way, you you have to get it out of your system. You know what I mean? You have to talk it through with someone, hopefully, who can offer some advice, some wisdom, some context. What do you think that your parents in this sense, but other older people in your life could have done that would have helped you to feel free? Like even now, I feel like I'm the kind of parent where I'm like, dude, what's going on? Talk or whatever. And you're not much of a talker. So is there any way that you feel like the people who love you could make more of an opening that you would take advantage of to really talk about some of the things that are going on in your heart and mind?

SPEAKER_03 37:46

I feel like usually with my friends, it's like it kind of because I used to like to most of my friends, I used to just say everything I need to say. And usually it was just the same answer every time. It's oh, just ask God, pray about this, then third. It was always the same answer, which isn't a bad thing. It isn't a bad answer. Yeah. But if I already know what you're gonna say, why would I ask you in the first place? And your your solution is usually like, oh, let's start therapy, this, that, and the third. I don't want to do that because that means I have to talk to another another dude or a female about what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 38:18

And then But we process. That's not always like the the answer. You need to go to counseling. That was about something really meaty, like all the grief that you've had throughout your lifetime. But just you and I sitting and talking, when we do talk, we can process together through whether it's a relational struggle or um you know, we we can talk through it together and and weigh out solutions that might help you on a daily basis. Do you think that or no?

SPEAKER_03 38:44

I think you help with some things, but not like not the things that I feel like I can't I can't handle on my own.

SPEAKER_01 38:51

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_03 38:52

Like the things that I feel like that like I I can't handle or whatever. I feel like I don't feel like anyone would be able to actually help me with that in a sense.

SPEAKER_01 39:04

Really?

SPEAKER_03 39:05

I I really don't.

SPEAKER_02 39:08

Okay, I have two things. Okay. Uh maybe I should wait to those two things because you should talk to about that. No, go ahead. Um, two things. One, I think that if for people like me or you or people like us who are listening, um if if we if we are gonna choose to internalize, whether bad or good, if we choose or redeem the situation that we're in, doesn't need to be said out loud to anybody else, so we can handle it ourselves. And then like, I don't know, a friend or someone asks, how we're doing, like, and we just be like, Oh, just work, you know, I'm chilling. Me and God's working it out. That may be like God trying to bring someone in to actually help with the thing. So don't ignore God's God's like sovereignty of you trying to use his people to try to get you help, or maybe it's not even help, maybe it's just like pray for me. You know what I mean? You ain't gotta tell them all this, just just hey, pray for me going through this little situation, not that big of a deal. Just pray for confidence in me, whatever it is. Um, and so, but I also will say a lot of times we can just internalize it and to us, internalizing looks like forgetting instead of actually working it out with God ourselves. So I would also encourage people like us to actually like if it's something that doesn't maybe feel that deep to us and we would be good if it just rolled off our short shoulders, maybe we should actually just bring it to God and actually pray about it. Because I'm super good at being like, oh yeah, I'll pray about it, and then just leave it alone and just forget about it. And I think I solved the problem.

SPEAKER_04 40:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:43

When in actuality, me or you or people need to be more like, um, oh no, you know, I actually I don't think it's that big of a deal. But even though I don't think it may be that big of a deal, let me still go pray about it, let me ask God about it, let me take a second, let me work through, let me see what the Bible says about how I'm feeling and what I should do, and then I can do it. You know what I mean? Yeah, like not just allowing it to leave, yeah, but actually dealing with it in the process. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 41:08

That's good advice, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:09

Yeah, like that's probably what I need to do because I just am good at forgetting. I am good at forgetting. Moving on to the next thing.

SPEAKER_03 41:14

Yeah, like I forget until it comes to I forget until something happens and I'm like, oh, like like there's some places like a lot of our family members have like that passed away, it happened at our house. So I can't even go and like I can't go in certain places for too long in the house anymore.

SPEAKER_01 41:30

Really?

SPEAKER_03 41:31

Like I I can't like like I'm never in the like the guest room, I'm never in there anymore. Yeah, like that like one hallway like from the game room. Like I hate, I hate that my room is right there. It's the worst thing, waking up in the morning having to walk down that hallway.

SPEAKER_01 41:45

Really, really, that's very interesting. You don't think that that's something that would be worth saying out loud? Like, this is the first time you're telling me that right now. And I think people who've watched the podcast know this already. But if this happens to be your first episode, we did have two family members in our house that passed away different times, but they passed in our house, their grandmother and then their uncle. And so it was it was very hard. So now here I'm hearing you say that you're having an actual emotional, mental, physical reaction to those spaces where that happened. So in your mind, you don't feel like I should tell my parents that I should tell my parents that I'm really struggling. When I wake up in the morning and come out of my room, there's something happening to me when I see this area. You don't feel like that's worth trying to do that.

SPEAKER_03 42:33

I feel like I've said that before, have I not? This is the first time I've I not told you. I've never told either you're all like the story of like my perspective of what happened. Am I allowed to say that?

SPEAKER_01 42:41

Yes, please.

SPEAKER_03 42:42

Okay, so it was it was like Eastern Conference Finals, it was Miami versus Boston, it was the third quarter. I remember this specifically. It was like a Wednesday or something. And uh I was sitting there watching the game with I think I don't it was you, Chris, yeah, I think was there, you, Chris, and Jackson. And y'all just started leaving the room like like one by one. Because I think what was trying to happen, I think what Jackson was trying to do was he was trying to keep me from going out there. And so I remember I was walking to it. I was like, Where'd everyone go? Because I was like, I'm just sitting here by myself, this is boring. And so I walk out of the uh the game room and I'm about to walk, I'm about to walk out the doors, and then Jackson stops me. Jackson has always been the one that's like, I'm gonna take care of Jackson has always been the one to take care of I don't know about you, but me is specific. No, for sure. And so he was trying to get me, he was like, I drew nah, not right now. Stay, stay, stay in here. And I was like, what's going on? And I looked out, there's a bathroom next to the door, and I looked at the bathroom windows and I saw a bunch of ambulances, like a bunch of ambulances, a bunch of lights, police cars. I was like, Whoa, what is going on? Because last time I saw this is when what happened to Granny.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:47

And so I walked out the door, and then I looked because my room is right at the end of the hallway.

SPEAKER_00 43:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:52

And so I'm walking into my room trying to figure out what's going on. And I look to my right, and then I see Ogavon just sitting there on the floor. And he's he's sitting, he's he's sitting there like he's Like the ambulance there. He's alert. He's alert. But the part that got me was when I looked at him, I literally saw him as like he looked at me right before his eyes closed. The last time he closed his eyes, he looked at me and like smiled a little bit. And then closed his eyes. That's what like got you. Yeah, that's what that's what got me.

SPEAKER_01 44:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 44:20

And so then just like kind of standing there, I was standing there in shock for probably like 20 minutes. And then I watched them as took him downstairs. They had to move chairs out the way and rushed into the hospital. I got in the car with Chris.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 44:32

And he took us to the thing. And what's crazy is every every family member that has passed away in our house, I've had like a dream or like something before that's happened. That's kind of like I feel like that's kind of like God warning me. Like for granny, uh, you remember how Chris um Castillo used to uh work for dad? Uh there I had a dream one night one night that um me, I was crying for some reason. I have no clue why I was crying, but we were walking to the pool house, right? And he was like comforting me, this and third. And I woke up and I was just like, okay, that was stupid. Like, what is that? And then later, uh I remember I was filming a TikTok in the pool house, and I saw Jackson come outside and get Chris, and they both ran inside. And so I'm like, oh, that's interesting. That's a little worrying, actually. And so I walk in, uh, I walk out of the uh pool house, I walk to the room, and I see Jackson sprint across like sprint across my face and like kind of push me out the way and like run out the front door. I'm like, okay, what's happening? I walk through the back and I look at Granny, and Dad is sitting there over Granny trying to figure out what's going on because she's not breathing.

SPEAKER_01 45:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:41

And so then I start crying, and then Chris grabs me, and then we walk out the back door where the exercise room is. You're hitting your head. Oh, my bad. Uh, where the exercise room is, and then I just stopped crying because I'm like, okay, I've been here before. That's weird. The same thing happened with Oklahoma. Like, I kind of like knew it, but I didn't believe it. You know what I'm saying? Until it actually happened. It was like deja vu, but like it was a little too like real.

unknown 46:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:06

You know what I'm saying? And so, but that happens a lot. I don't like I always expect when I have deja vu, I always expect that something bad to happen. Like, I'm not gonna say specifically what happened, but what happened on the tour? Like, I knew you. Huh? I'm trying to figure out what happened on the tour.

SPEAKER_02 46:24

Yeah. The group chat.

SPEAKER_01 46:27

Oh. You look like your dad just then.

SPEAKER_03 46:31

Like I wish you can tell you. I literally had I literally had deja vu that day, and I was like, okay, something's gonna happen, but I have no clue what it is. That's weird. Like, and I like I was like, okay, I'm so blown. Like every time I have deja vu, I'm like, okay, something's gonna happen. Something eventful is gonna happen, whether that's good or bad, something is gonna happen. And I I think and I truly believe that's God's way of speaking to me. Maybe so yeah, I feel like, yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 46:56

But so you don't feel like like what you've just shared, you've never really processed that in that way, and you don't feel like it would be important?

SPEAKER_03 47:05

No, because it doesn't it doesn't hit me as hard as it used to. Like when it first happened, I just slept downstairs. Like that's why I was on the couch, and dad had to keep getting me off the couch and taking me upstairs and making me go upstairs in my room. I just didn't want to go upstairs. And so I feel like, but after that, it kind of like now it's a little easier and it just keeps getting easier. So I'm like, if I keep doing the same thing, it'll just go away at some point.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

I think it's easier in general. This is a huge stereotype, but it's easier for women to process things and talk about things than it is for men in general. That's not true of all men and women. But you need to know that it's gonna be important for you, particularly because you're men and because you are internal men, you you are, you where you process things internally, you're gonna have to discipline yourself to be in relationship and communicate things. Because when you are housing stress like that and emotions like that, it can actually impact your physical body. I mean that in a like sickness in our cells gets held from emotional stuff that we're not dealing with. It feels like it's two different things that aren't related and they very much are. It can make you sick. So you you kind of do have to for your emotional health, but also for your physical health, have to teach yourself to be a person who communicates and outwork some of the things that that are bothering you, you know, in your life.

SPEAKER_03 48:23

So yeah, that's something I definitely have to work on. I definitely have to work on trying to be disappointed. I'm good at telling the story of what happened, just not good at how you feel about it. Yeah, because at this point I don't even know how I feel about it.

SPEAKER_01 48:36

Yeah, and that's okay. That's okay, but that's part of what the conversation can be about to help you to digest that, absorb that, get that out and deal with it instead of just trying to forget about it and hoping it goes away. Because it's getting stored somewhere. It's not just going away, it's getting stored somewhere. And then it comes back up. Like when you have a kid one day or you experience another loss in some way in your life, then all of a sudden people get angry or people get un unbelievably depressed. And it's not just the thing, it is the thing compounded upon all the other things that they actually never dealt with. So it it it will be important for the health of your marriage in the future, the health of you as a father to be able to be well-rounded in terms of addressing the things that are happening in your life. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_03 49:21

That makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 49:22

Okay, one more question. What do you think that God is doing in your life right now? Like, what is he doing in terms of how is he stretching you, challenging you, growing you up as a man right now?

SPEAKER_03 49:34

I feel like he's definitely keeping me a little bit more humble than I used to be. Because I feel like no matter how hard I work in anything I do, I always like I talked like at the beginning of this podcast, I always end up being second. I feel like I was I was first for so long, and then I started like to be prideful about it, and then he kind of just pushed me back to second in everything I did, and so that's kind of humbled me a little bit, and that's kind of made me think a little more, and like kind of I guess, yeah, be have a little bit more humility in what I do. And so I feel like that specifically is what God is doing in my life, teaching me how to be more humble in certain things, which is still very difficult. Oh, yeah, for me.

SPEAKER_01 50:16

It's that's very difficult, but that's an awesome lesson to learn. Like, that's a big deal. Like humility getting worked into your life. Um He he seeks out the humble, he seeks to show his strength and his grace and his favor to the humble. So the fact that he's teaching you that right now is has it been has your reaction been to resist that lesson or to just go ahead and fold into it and learn it?

SPEAKER_03 50:41

Depends on the day.

SPEAKER_01 50:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:44

Yeah. It's easier to do it with a basketball game than it is later. I'll tell you that much. I mean, not that I've experienced it like that, but I can uh I can I bet you could people could attest that it just seems like as life gets as you get older, things become more serious, things become a little bit more not to say do or die, that's that's extreme, but like a little bit more responsible weight towards this situation. So to learn that with the basketball game, I would assume would be a lot better. So definitely do that.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

Well, I'm proud of you, Gita. I'm proud of the man you're becoming, I'm proud of the strides you're making, the transition phase you're in in life right now. Going into your senior year is a big deal. Um, and you know, you're doing you're managing a lot of things. Your athletics, school. I see you taking on more responsibility just around the house, trying to do your stuff you're supposed to be doing without having to be asked for everything. Like it's super cool watching you mature and become a young man. So I'm proud of you. I hope you know that. Your brothers love you, even though they torture you half the time. They love you. And uh we gotta take Jackson out his Taekwondo.

SPEAKER_03 51:53

What? We gotta take Jackson out of Taekwondo. It's not Taekwondo, is it MMA? I don't know what he'd be doing, but he'd be trying to kick me in the face every three seconds. I don't know what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 52:04

That's good brother.

SPEAKER_03 52:05

We gotta take away his credit card or something. No more payments.

SPEAKER_01 52:09

Thank you for joining us, dude.

SPEAKER_03 52:11

Appreciate it, big dog.

SPEAKER_01 52:12

Love you.