Coffee and Camouflage Part I: Service

Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Department of War, Department of the Air Force, or any other agency of the U.S. government.

Grab your mug and pull up a chair — this episode kicks off our Coffee & Camouflage series, where leaders get honest about what it means to serve, lead, and grow through the chaos.

In Part I, Kelly and Terra sit down with Courtney Strickler for a candid conversation about authenticity in leadership, vulnerability behind the rank, and the lessons learned from both life and service. Between the laughter, the stories, and a few spilled coffees, they unpack how staying human is the key to leading with strength.

Whether you’re in uniform, leading a team, or just trying to lead yourself through change, this episode will leave you inspired, grounded, and reminded that leadership isn’t about perfection — it’s about connection.

🎧 Tune in for:
• Real talk on leadership and life in uniform
• Why authenticity still wins — even in tough environments
• Lessons from the “mother of misfits” "catwoman" and the “powerhouse Chief”
• A few laughs, a few truths, and plenty of caffeine

Transcript

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Hey everyone. Welcome to Trail Talks, the podcast where we talk about growth, the messy, the beautiful, the funny, and everything in between. I'm your host, Kelly Krueger, founder of Kelly Michelle Coaching, where we specialize in mindset, emotional intelligence, life and leadership. And I am joined by my co-host. I call our Catwoman. She's got sas, she's got strength. She's my good friend, fellow misfit leadership trainer and founder of Leading People LLC. Welcome back, Tara. And we are doing something a little different today because here on Trail Talks, we're all about change, growth, adapting, and advancing. So today we are joined by our very first guest, a powerhouse Air Force chief, mother, spouse maintainer, first sergeant personnel. I'm gonna keep going. Recruiting chief senior enlisted leader, and don't let her near the kitchen unless you're ready to be humbled, because she's a chef too. Please welcome Courtney Strickler. Welcome y'all. Thank you. So nice to be here. Yeah. So, it is Sunday morning and we are doing a little coffee and camouflage type episode in honor of Veteran's Day and our service. So before we get into that, how are you guys feeling? I'm feeling anxious. She's great. I'm anxious. Excited. Courtney's ready to go. She's ready. Tara, you're anxious. Why are you anxious, Tara? Well, because of the topic. I don't Yeah. Yeah. This topic is hard. Service. Service, yeah. Yeah. Service. Just, just be you. We love you for you. Yeah. And it's the longer I've gotten in the tooth of my career the more I've understood the importance of sharing each of our stories, it's always hard. But it becomes a moment when you're getting towards the end of your career that it becomes, a moment of great pride and yeah, it's awesome. But why is it hard? Is because we don't like to talk about ourselves. Like I know, Courtney has asked, Kelly, why haven't you talked about Air Force? Mm-hmm. Why haven't you talked to you about your background? I'm like, I dunno. I dunno. Your whole career led you to this place where you, I know are a life coach. None of this I don't think would happen without your experiences, without the journey and the leadership that you've been able to I don't even wanna say display. I mean, you're just, you're one of the most iconic leaders that I've got the chance to work with in the Air Force. See, please. So now there's humility. Like, this is why we don't do this. Exactly. Why can't we accept a little bit of hype up? You know? Yeah, I know. I'm working on it. That should be my answer to one of the questions is just accepting, compliments and. Anyway. Well, and that's the thing, like listening to your first few podcasts, I think that's what's so exciting to me, is to hear what you have to say. But then I wanna know how you got there because it is pretty incredible. You gave my resume. I sure wanna hear yours. Hmm hmm. Oh, okay. Okay. In time we'll do, we'll do like a three part series. How about that? We'll do coffee and camo three times in the next, you know, week and a half. And I think that would be really good if we just stick with leadership and like how we got here, our journeys here. Wearing the uniform. Yeah. Alright. Coffee. Let's start with coffee. What do you do in the morning to get moving? Do you have coffee? How do you take your coffee? I think it's so important to know how somebody takes their coffee. It's important. It is. Well, I like more sugar and cream than coffee. Oh, okay. Yeah. So you like the candy part of the coffee? Yes. It tastes so good. Like where do you go to Starbucks or do you go to a local place? What do you get? If I go to Starbucks, I get a caramel macchiato, see more sugar than coffee. And then, but usually I make coffee at home. Oh, okay. What do you make? Yep. Oh, sometimes Busillo. Oh yeah. It just depends. I shop at Aldi's, so, just cheap coffee. Good for you? No. My dad keeps telling me to shop at Aldi's, like for years he's been telling shop at Aldi's and I just don't, but I need to, I keep saying I'm gonna go to Aldi, Aldi's, Aldi, I don't know. How about you, Courtney? Do you drink coffee or energy? Yeah I love all of it. Right now I'm having a Snickers flavored coffee with a hairy, my God, pop creamer. My the sweeter the better. I'm like Tara. And it is caramel Brule latte season. They just came out with the holiday flavors at Starbucks, which is my favorite. I think I had about seven. I got my, my fill of PSLs from Starbucks over, over the fall or over Halloween. I think I had about seven pumpkin spice lattes and pumpkin. The last one, pumpkin. I tried to get pumpkin spice. Yeah. The last one I tried to get. They were done. It was already, it was limited, so I was like, oh, okay. Well, I did get my fill, but I do, ello. With, the sweet Italian cream, you know, the nut Sweet Italian cream. Cream. This is fancy. It's just a K-cup. Just a K-cup. Sometimes I'll do a cafe cone leche in the mocha pot, but I forgot to get milk. So we're feeling pretty good. Talked about our coffee. Hey, so as we, lean into Veteran's Day and, talk about our journeys here and what got us here, let's do a tribute to our veterans out there. So let's take a pause to honor every man and woman who has ever worn the uniform past, present, and future. Thank you for answering the call, choosing service over comfort and for carrying a weight that most will never understand. And then also to our brothers and sisters in uniform that are deployed right now, far from home we're thinking of you and we're proud of you. And then also the families who stand beside us thank you for your unwavering love, sacrifice, and strength and you all serve too in every moment of waiting and words of encouragement. So to all veterans out there, thank you for your courage, your leadership, and your legacy. And the trail we walked today was built by you, so thank you and happy Veterans Day to All. Happy Veterans Day. Happy Veterans Day. Okay, so, how did we get here? Let's start with that, courtney, how long have you been in? Can we talk about that? Or is, would that kind of show our age a little bit? I, I don't care. But how long have you, how long have you served? I'm going on 23 years. 23 years, okay. 29 for me. So that's 14 for me. 14, 29, 23. All right. So we have 66, years of service between the three of us. So going back Tara going back 14 years and you, so you came in. When I got back from deployment, I had eight airmen and I believe you were one of'em. What year was that? I was 2012. Yeah, it was 2012. I got back and I'm like, oh my God, I gotta grow up here. That was like a quick growth moment for me. That's when everything shifted. 14 years ago what was your reason for raising your right hand? I was in college and I had a good friend that wanted to be a Marine but she wanted to go the officer route and you have to have a really good PT test, a score, a PT score, I guess. And so she was like, Hey, we, you go with me to the recruiting office. And they like, they did PT every morning or something like that and she's like, will you go with me and just support me? I'm like, yeah, sure, no problem. Yeah, mistake. They were marines and we were running from Cincinnati to Kentucky and back. Kid. You not, it was wild. They had us running. Oh, it was wild. Anyways, so we were working out with them and, I actually started, I played sports all my life, and so I was in a space where I was no longer part of a team and I didn't know what to do with that. And so when I got into it and I started running with the Marines and working out with them, the camaraderie was just amazing. It was really, truly amazing. And I was like, I like this, but which branch runs the least because I'm not running this four mile, 3, 4, 5 miles that you have, who runs the least? They said the Air Force. I said, okay, I'll go find a recruiter. And yeah, look, we are real on this podcast. Thank you. We are real. I kid you not. But also with that learning that a lot of the certifications and all of the opportunities and things you gain from the Air Force can then move into the civilian world with you. When you decide to get out or as a reservist, they all transfer to the civilian world. So I'm like, okay, this is probably a good choice. That's what got me here. Yeah. Thank you for that. So, you did four years of college and then you joined, right? Since we're being real, I'm not the smartest, I'm the brightest Korean in the box. No, I was like, you're brilliant. Three and a half years in college and I went to bootcamp over this summer and I get back and because of the credit you get from bootcamp, I was able to come back and immediately graduate. Nice college. Okay. I could have just waited half a year and went officer route or something, but I don't re regret that at all. Yeah, I was gonna ask,'cause you, I remember when you came in and you know,, I always was looking at everybody's records and you had your bachelor's degree and I was so impressed by that. Back then, 14 years ago and I think in our career field, I mean we're misfits and I know I didn't have my bachelor's degree back then. I was really impressed by that and I'm like, I wonder why didn't you ever commission. I actually had two op I had another opportunity to commission it would just wasn't in my plan. Remember I won deserving Air? Yes, yes. And somebody got pregnant and they were supposed to go on deployment and she couldn't go. And they were like, Hey, you're next in line. Would you go on this deployment? I'm like, well, I'm waiting on officer school. Like I literally am waiting on my dates. I've been selected. Good to go. Oh, well they'll be here. Your dates will be available when you get back from the deployment. That was not the truth. I went on the deployment. They ended up giving my position to Mullings, Celeste Mullings, she's captain now. Shout out to her. They ended. That's my good friend. I wouldn't want to go to anyone else. I was like, okay, girl. At least it went to you. But yeah, so I never got to go to officer school, but to this day, I look back and people ask me about it. I'm like, I wouldn't change that. Like I wanna be with the people. I want to be boots on the ground with the people. I wouldn't have had the opportunities that I've had throughout my career if I would've became an officer. So I literally, I, wouldn't even try again. Yeah. I'm okay with where I'm at. Yeah. No, you know, I hate always saying everything happens for a reason, but you're right where you should be. I remember when that happened and yeah. I mean, good for Celeste. Hi Celeste. Right? We're so proud of you. I can't wait to salute her. I could wait. I already did. She came to MacDill and I seen her and she was like avoiding me. She didn't want me to salute her. I said, she was like, Hey, Celeste is outside. I run outside, put my hat on, and I make her salute me. She was like, oh my gosh. Yeah. I am very proud. Deserve it. I'm always so proud to salute officers, don't avoid us officers. We wanna salute you. Come on, you're bad asses. Let's do it. Yeah. And you are very athletic. I've seen you just posted something on Facebook with you dribbling the basketball. I was like, oh, look at Tara. Go. Oh, yeah. I played three sports throughout high school. Yeah. Volleyball. Volleyball and softball. You're competitive, man. I am. All right. We're gonna shift over to Courtney. So Courtney why did you raise your right hand? Sure. I don't have quite a nice story. So I came, I grew up normal pretty strict household. I got out the door as soon as I turned 18 and I went off three hills a bitch, as they would say. I was in the restaurant industry and I was in Dallas and I was just, I was getting up to no good, quite honestly, you know, I was bartending and that just breeds that lifestyle. And it was, it was not going well. It was not going well at all. And then when I landed myself in jail one night, I realized that that was probably rock bottom. My friends were like, excuse me, you've been to jail? I was like, yeah, orange jumpsuit, whole thing. So that was definitely the rock bottom moment where I was like, oh gosh, something has to change. So my mom and I are driving down the road and she's what are you gonna do with your life? And I was like, I don't know. And there was a guy that I was waiting tables with and he had been an F 16 crew chief in the Air Force. And I was like, that is insane. You were a what? You know, like my little 19, 20-year-old brain just couldn't even conceptualize on a whole fighter aircraft. Dallas just doesn't have that much exposure to the military. And so I started thinking about it and thinking about it and I was like, I'm just gonna go sign up. And so it was not just to get out of Dallas, but it was also I wanted to travel. I wanted to see the world.'cause he had lived in like Japan and he was just telling me all these cool stories and I was like, that's what I wanna do. I wanna get the heck outta here. Yeah. And I wanna keep it moving. So I ended up going to the recruiter and I was supposed to be a flight engineer on helicopters, which I thought, I was like, oh, I'm gonna be an official badass. This is amazing. I'm gonna go to basic training and I'm gonna go to SEER school. I was ready. I am not athletic. Unfortunately. Basic was a little hot for. Also my face is broken. So I was doing lots of pushups. Like this is just fix your face. Fix your face. That's what they kept telling me. I would be like, what? Fix your face, Wallace? Oh my God. That was the hardest part of boot camp. Not laughing the whole time. Oh, it was terrible. I was laughing the whole time. I was constantly in trouble. I was so scared. Oh no. Oh, I had laughed the entire time. Constantly laughing. What, what was crazy though is I got all the way through basic, and then on the day before graduation, they were like, the school's gone. You have to pick something else. And I was like, what? Excuse me. And so they were, it's yeah, pick from this list of things that you can do. And I was like, I wanna be a, combat pa, you know, cameraman. Like I was picking all these crazy things. And they're like, that's cute. No, here's a list that you can actually pick from. And I ended up picking F 15 Crew Chief because that was the one of two options I could do. Or I could leave basic training without graduating. So I just picked F 15 crew chief because. That's all that was available. And it was funny because my recruiter's like, whatever you do, do not become a maintainer. Don't, don't do it. And then voila, all of a sudden I became a maintainer. And because of that job, it gave me everything good in my life, from my husband to my children, to the insane travel to gaining a confidence that I didn't know I had because yeah, I can change that tire. Yeah, no problem. I can change that. I can change out that whole secondary power system, matter of fact. Hmm. Then it pushed me to be harder, stronger, faster than any of those boys could be. I'm gonna out tow you. I'm gonna, I'm gonna do the best I can. And actually that even led to one of the greatest honors in my military career was, being in Afghanistan. The first time I put out a fire on a jet. Clearly we, were surrounded by lots of other jets. They're all fully loaded with ammo. And that led to me garnering. I got the Leo Marquez award for the entire Air Force. Yeah. So it was like one of the biggest honors. But what was funny is in a moment that should have been like, oh, this is so exciting. I ended up getting called Princess on the Fly line, and I was like, you guys suck. Y'all really suck. So what, what should have been good? It kind of became a bummer because people, there was some haters out there. So I learned a lot through that experience as well. Don't be ashamed when you do great things. And I, and I was, I truly was. And so that, but for every, you know, one jerk that was out there on the flight line, I had 50 big brothers. So it took me a while to understand and, and see that. But yes, I was at Eglin Air Force Base, which is in Florida, in the panhandle. I was in Lake and Heath for three years. That's where I met my husband. He and I were senior airmen. We've been married now for going on 19 years, so for two crew chiefs to make it that long is pretty incredible. That's awesome. So that was, congratulations, my wife. Thank you. Yeah. I mean, it really, it saved your life. It saved your life. It 100% saved my life. Tara, what options were you given from the recruiter for career fields? Oh, to have a bachelor's degree. I sure did score real low on that Asab school process. So bad. It was so bad. I had two options, services and personnel. That was it. Oh gosh. That's how low it was. Yeah. Not, yeah, it was low. And I've never retaken it and I don't care to, I'm not, I love my services folks. I oh my God. It was bad. Yeah. There was no studying. It's not a secret that when you don't get the high scores on the asvab, what your options are. So we're just being very real right now. Yeah. Yeah. Kelly, why did you join? You knows she's trying to avoid answering I know. Questions. I was like, are you gonna ask her or am I, you guys know I don't talk like this is the only time I talk. Were gonna pull it outta you. That's right. I barely got through high school grew up just very blue collar, buffalo, New York. College was not something that we ever talked about. And it would probably surprise you, but I was voted laziest in high school. Every senior year when they do the yearbook and they do prettiest and most likely to do this dah, dah. They had laziest, which was crazy because I played like all sports, but there was a point in my, teenage years and it could have been just things that were happening around me. And I know it was that I just got lazy, had trouble in school. going from a Catholic school until eighth grade and then going into public school was very hard for me. And I, wasn't getting good grades. I was always in the year, previous, where all my friends were in advanced classes. I played sports and even then, I went from, MVP this and MVP that and starting this to, barely being able to, to hit the ball in softball, and then riding the bench and basketball and then just not, getting good grades at all. So there were some things. And so I barely got through high school, but I think that was more of my brother and I too. Like he was so good at sports, like he was so good. My twin brother Corey, and he didn't play sports in school, but he was such a great athlete. And I think we always used to tell the joke that I think they just wanted Krueger's out of their school because of my older brother who tended to get in trouble and my dad who got in trouble. So there were teachers there that had those generations of the Krugers and I'm like, you know, they're just graduating us'cause they want Krugers out of their school. That's why they really graduated us. But anyway, so, yeah, all my friends were going off to college and I just, I didn't have a plan. I just didn't have those conversations. Corey was gonna go in the Marines and then he told me about, the Air Force Reserve and, just a little bit about it. I had no idea back then. I mean, I don't even know if we had internet back then and I could look it up and, went into the Yellow Pages, got a phone number and called the Recruiter Yellow Page. I mean, that's really, I think, what I had to do. Oh my gosh. And I called the recruiter and said hi, Kelly Kruger, and I'd like to join the Air Force. They drove to your house back then, right? They got in their Air Force recruiting van, and the next day they show up at my house and had a conversation. And then I think it was 30 September is my RR date. So I went out to the base and they gave me options. I also did not score very high on my asvab, which was not surprising. So my options were services and life support. And they sold me on services. Holy cow. They're like, you're happy. Yeah, they did. And I loved cooking. Like I loved cooking all that stuff. And that was really how I was raised. Half of the family is Italian, so it was all cooking and family and gathering. So they're like, oh yeah, services is awesome. You're gonna going in the woods and setting up kitchens out in the field. So Tara, if you ever wondered why I had you guys always set up kitchens in the field, it's because that's what other recruiters told me that we were supposed to do. And Oh man. And I was like, heck yeah, I wanna do that. That sounds fun. And I met my art that day too. My senior art, who is amazing. He just retired two years ago and I went to his retirement. And he made me wanna be an art. You don't meet many people that say I wanna be a dual status technician. He was so passionate and cared so much about us and really had a family environment at Niagara. And I was like, oh my God, I wanna be him. But anyway, so I really joined'cause I, I didn't have a plan and I really needed purpose in my life. And it has been my purpose, 29 years. And it's been my solution to life. And I love serving. I mean, it's, in me. And I know it's my purpose to serve and help people. So I spent, eight years at Niagara, in services as a tr and I was gonna go active duty at one point because I loved serving and loved wearing the uniform. Utas were my favorite. And'cause I was around my family. Like it was my safe haven. My, art said, ah, you know, why don't you just sit tight? I know you wanna go active duty but why don't I just give you some opportunities? Like backfill at active duty bases back then is when they started the innovative readiness training. So I like took advantage of every opportunity there was any opportunity to travel, and he gave it to me. I spent three summers in Montana cooking on a reservation out there for IRTs backfilled at bases when active duty was deployed. I, mean, any opportunity, I also, deployed a few times, mobilized all that, so the first time I went to Silver Flag, I think it was in 2000, and I get to Silver Flag and that's where it was setting up the kitchens in the field and doing all that stuff. And I was like, oh my God, they're so cool. Those instructors, I wanna be that. And they were just, there were so much pride in what they did and so I had to wait a couple years and as soon as I got my seven level, I applied and, didn't get it the first time, but got the next opening and that's what led me to Silver Flag and be an instructor. And it scared me. Anything I've done in my career, it's been because it's been a challenge, like mm-hmm. I doubt myself and I'm so like introverted, so being an instructor and being in a classroom, freaked me out.'Cause you always had to be on your game. And I loved it. That's when I really just dug into the books and research. Any job I have, I wanna know everything about it, the why. And I loved it. God, that was so much fun. And then I got my opportunity to be the art at Wright Pat. And I was so blessed. I went there as a tech and I think my biggest shift in leadership was coming back from deployment when I was out at Manas. And that Manas was a beast. I you guys know, and being in sustainment there they moved me up to the sustainment flight chief. So four dining facilities, two fitness centers, 10,000 bed spaces. It was insane. And here I am, that was the biggest growth I had to make in leadership, was there because 25 airmen and then managing all this stuff. it was a beast. And I was like, all right, cal time to grow up, and then coming back and having all the new airmen, I was like, okay, time to grow up more, you know? So then, yeah, that was seven years at Wright Pat, and that was when the commander gave me an opportunity to be the SEL l and retrained into personnel for that. That was when a one was opening up and I was like, y'all don't know what you're doing at headquarters. I wanna be there. I need to see what's going on. And that was a challenge too. Every assignment I've had has been a challenge and it's been my favorite assignment, every single one, you know? So then after a one, group, SEL down at Homestead, and then Command chief at McDill, and then here I am at the PDC and really like every single one, like the what? Say what the PDC is too. The, oh, the professional development Center. Mm-hmm. So every single assignment is like I have a family there. The connections, like people I still follow, Yeah, so many though, it's crazy. And make a trip outta that and every single one is my favorite one. It's my favorite assignment. And right now being at the professional development center, it's, this is, this has been a huge growth for me too. And just losing confidence and the, that journey of my life post-divorce, rebuilding myself. This was like the reset for me where, I went from. Just very low time in my life to just every day just trying to get better, being more self-aware, removing alcohol, like just really being with me and learning and growing. And so this has been probably like the biggest growth for me the last two years. And I'm so thankful to be where I'm at and I could dump, 29 years worth of lessons learned onto commanders and chiefs and everybody. So it's an honor. That was a long story. So are you guys happy now? I talked very much so, and I am gonna brag on you for a second because. Within one of those many jobs that you've had, you took a chance on me and you single handedly changed the trajectory of my entire career. So coming from maintenance, I was on orders at a personnel center and I was like, okay, wow, there's an opportunity to be able to impact so many others. And I got really excited about wanting become a personnel list, but personnels are not very happy about bringing in outsiders. And you truly took a chance on me when nobody else would. And when I say you changed the trajectory, I managed to be in some really amazing programs and have. Really far reaching impact quickly working at headquarters. So I personally would like to say thank you for taking a chance on me when nobody else would. I became a chief within personnel pretty quickly. So thank you. Thank you for taking a chance on me because even when you think you are at your worst, you were changing people's lives. So things Oh my gosh, yes. I mean, that's what it's about. It's about helping people and not everybody's gonna agree, right? People can disagree. And I remember, as a non personnels, and I look, I admire personnel. Like they, it, it's a lot. It, it's a beast. And, and you're at fault for a lot when you shouldn't be. But, it's human resources, right? Instead of personnel, I say human resources. That's really what it is. And it's about risk though, when I'm sitting there as the functional and that's how I would do it. And other people do it different, and that's fine. We don't have to agree with everything. But I look at risk and I remember getting your waiver package and I look at also who's submitting it. And if your supervisor is fighting for you and advocating for you and their supervisor is, and that command chief is, and you have all of these people behind you and wanting to support you in advocating for you. I look at that and I'm like, okay, yeah., I trust them and I look at the risk. And some, and maybe most career fields probably shouldn't be waived, but for some where you can assess the risk and say, okay, they're going into personnel, this is where they're working, and is this risky if I waive it? And to me it, it wasn't because most you can learn, sometimes you don't know until you're in that situation how you would handle it. And I think we have it pretty good in, in personnel where some of the stuff that we do, we can fix it, we can go back in time and fix it. That's right. So, yeah. So for me, and maybe I waived more than I should have. But I did. And I did and that's what I looked at is, just give people a chance. I've given many chances and, and I think I always, and Tara can say I will always give the benefit of the doubt. There's been times where it's come back to bite me a little bit but I do. And I think it's the right thing to take a chance on a person and, within your control, take that chance and let them decide what they wanna do with it. Yeah. She tends to do that. She sent all airmen to, what was it, a challenge? It was all airmen. And they were like, you cannot send them kids to this challenge down at Dobbins. They're not gonna win. We came out on top. Bet. That was probably one of the best. Yeah. One of the best moments of my career is always like witnessing the accomplishments of the team underestimate us. I dare you. Yeah. And they did and I, yeah. I remember the first time we did that competition, it was a readiness competition. I think we came out in second, and then it was two or three years later, we went back and it was a totally different team and it was all five levels, all airmen. And and I remember the commander asking, are you sure? And I'm like, oh, I guarantee other wings, our and senior NCOs and some levels, right? And I said but boss, this is about heart. And you have to have a team that they're gonna fight for each other and they will not wanna disappoint each other and they are going to win. And I remember I was at tech school, so my tech school didn't get waved, so I went, I was, a senior at tech school. And I'm like, oh my God, I wanna be there so bad. And I would sneak to the bathroom and get on my phone and I'd be like, you guys, gimme an update. How are you doing? Oh my God. I was so nervous the whole time. And, what a proud moment. I, in our commander and our, two two or three of our officers and then the actual, the team was there and it was so cool. They were so proud. And my commander during his change of command, I think he mentioned that moment, that was one of his proudest moments as a squadron commander was that moment when they won because it was about people coming together and fighting for each other. And that's throughout my career. Same thing. Every time I watch one of my troops. Move on to the next better, bigger thing and then, and watch their growth. And then watch them pouring into others. That's hands down the highlight of my career. Yeah. It's just watching others and then staying in touch and every now and then getting a random email from somebody, you're like, how do you even remember me? So it is, always about pouring into others and taking a chance and taking those risks. You know? It's for you to do that with a bunch of airmen when nobody else would've done that. And, watch them shine it's incredible. Yeah. I have goosebumps too. I got little Ah, I love it. I love it. It was awesome. So, another question before we go on the detour. What has kept you guys in? What keeps you serving? I'll let you go first, Courtney. Sure. So I was on active duty for many years, probably about 11 years. You kind of like you were saying, Kel. There's times where when I was the most I guess under prepared, like public speaking for example, was one of my biggest fears in life, hands down. So I was like, okay, how am I gonna get through this? I'm gonna go become an instructor. I'm gonna have to like, shake through it like all my classes, until I get through it. So I would always put myself in worst state scenarios to try to grow and to try to get through things. So being a maintainer for many years and then getting to finish my active duty time as an instructor was, it was huge. I grew a lot. I had two kiddos back to back. My husband and I had two kids. And at that point in time, I'd seen enough of my friends. Raising their kids behind screens in Afghanistan. And I wasn't strong enough, I have so much respect for the parents out there that could do it. I just couldn't. And that's when I joined the Reserve. I just started cold calling bases. And I found a base in Colorado that would take both my husband and I, so he and I both at the same time with two babies. We just took a leap of faith, but we wanted to stay connected to the military, of course because that, that had given us, like I said, everything good in my life and I just, I couldn't walk away. But I ended up going to culinary school while I was a traditional reservist, which was amazing. I started my own business as a personal chef, but I was lonely in those kitchens. I just didn't have this sense of being, connected with that larger purpose. And I realized how much of an extrovert I truly was, because I do gain my energy from others. Hands down. So when I was by myself, my battery was just depleting. And while it's an enjoyable job, I will go back into to the chef realm upon retirement, but I wasn't done yet. And so that's when I had the opportunity to really reengage with my military career. And it's just been like one thing after another. The more challenging, the more fun as much impact as I could possibly give. I was ready to bleed out. And it's been the most fulfilling journey of my life pouring into others. And it's, and that's why I'm about to hit the retirement button. And so in moments of reflection I'm happy that I made every decision that I made along the way. Not only for myself, but just because of the community that we've built. It's a true honor. So that's why I stayed. You should think choice about retirement and just re retrain to services. Like why would you choose maintenance over services, Courtney I don't if you like cooking, you were talking, it's very funny you were talking about, setting up kitchens. So when I was maintainer we would literally be in Bulgaria, Romania, like raw dogging it out there, setting up on nothing. So services was no joke. And if you have hungry maintainers life is not good. So hands down hat off to the services troops out there. Because setting up those kitchens when we literally had nothing, I'm talking about outdoor showers we had, tents we straight went bare base. So service is wow. Truly incredible. So thank you to so y'all's service because thank you. But I'm not fed. Life is not good, that's for sure. Yeah, Tara knows, I would have them out in the snow when we were, training at Wright Pat. Yeah. I would find any place on base and we would be out in the snow and I'm like, set it up, set it up. Is this horrible? Is this gonna suck? Perfect. Yeah. Literally. And there was one time, like the gate to the training site was closed. And I had do, I don't know if it was you, but it was like three or four people and it was locked and we weren't gonna be able to get it open. And I think it was like five or six feet high and everybody's, and it was just a few people out there. And they're looking at the tray ration heater, which is alone 400, 500 pounds. And they're looking at all the equipment and looking at me, and I'm looking at them. They know, I'm about to tell them, I don't care how high that gate is. You're getting the equipment over because we are setting up this gate. And they looked at me and I'm looking at them and they're like, oh my God, she's crazy. SAR is crazy. And I'm like, you know what? They got it over, didn't they? Yeah, exactly Right. They got it over except, oh God. Oh God. You know what though? Those moments are, that's what shapes me to be who I am and how I lead people though, because you used to have us wearing, you make us do relay races in the gas mast. Oh, in the chem gear. Oh yeah. We would run around these days. Chem you could really even breathe just sitting still. And she has us running down the street in full blown chem gear. But you know what, I can put that chem gear on the fastest and I am good at it because of that. Like literally. And it also taught us to be very like strategic and think critically and problem solve because we didn't have a choice. Yeah. I would make them watch eight hour long videos of like ores and the why things happen and how the measle is built. And I'm, no, it's important for them to understand all of this before we go out there. And then yeah, we would just run around outside on a non UTA weekend. I would bring them in and I don't care, run around. We loved it though. We had so much fun and we had a saying for our leadership style. Back then was literally ww KD, what would Kelly do? What would Kruger do in this situation? And that was our leadership style. And we'd be like, okay, she probably would do this. And then we would figure it out from there. But that was really early trauma. Trauma bond, y'all? It was, no, it was. And then when they were all deployed and they wouldn't do their travel vouchers, I'm like, don't you come back. I don't wanna see you. She was strict. Yes. They still remind me of that. They're like, chief, you remember when you didn't want us to come back? Because we didn't do our travel vouchers don't come back from overseas at all because of that travel voucher. Come on now. Oh, I felt so bad. I felt so bad. Didn't care. Okay. How about you? Back to the question. Yeah. The reason I stay in because of the people, and that's just what it's always been. My goal was to hit E seven and become a shirt. I'm E seven and I became a shirt. So I'm like, I met my goal, like what's next? And I'm, and just recently I was like, I dunno if I got the fight in me anymore to do this, because I was going through some things with, within my career, but I couldn't quit. Like I couldn't leave because of the people pouring into people, and then seeing them actually use, the tools that you gave them that is so fulfilling. I just had a tech sergeant reach out to me the other day and he was like, yeah, I used some of the nuggets that you told me about this, that, and the third. He goes, I hope that's okay. I said, of course it's okay. I wouldn't have told you if I didn't want you to use it. I'm so proud that I taught you something. I'm so proud of that. And so basically, the people is what keeps me going to be honest and all of the experiences, all of the travel I've been, the parts of the world I probably would've never gone to for sure. Yeah, so that's pretty much what keeps me going. That's awesome. Yeah, for me it's, I always think I have more to give. That's really what it, it's the purpose. I always know that this has been my purpose, this is my why, it's my solution to life. And every assignment, although it's like my favorite, because of the people, because of the job, because of the responsibility. And I love the responsibility of caring for people. But for me personally I always think I, I'm a better version of myself. And right now how I feel I've been saying this for the last five years, is I feel like I'm just getting started. That's how I feel. And I don't know it's every single one. I just feel more energy. I feel younger. I just get more inspired, like every year that I serve and every assignment that I serve. And now this is probably. The best, emotionally, mentally, physically, everything. The most confident, self-aware, it's probably the best I have ever felt since I have, started serving. So for me, I feel like I'm just getting started and I have more to give. They have not gotten the best out of me yet, and I wanna give my best. So that's mine. Hey, so we're gonna take a detour. Sometimes the best lessons in leadership really don't come from books and doctrine. Sometimes they come from movies. So let's talk movies. We'll start with Courtney. What's your, favorite military like war movie? Or, it doesn't have to be about war, but military movie and why? Yes. Definitely major pain. You know, I'm, that is a good movie though. It's so funny. I was like rewatching it a little bit yesterday'cause I was like, oh my gosh, this is hilarious. I'm gonna have to like, make my children watch this. But then when I really sat through and was really thinking about it, putting heart to it, it was, American Sniper and it's American Sniper because I feel. Most connected to that being our generation, our War. And having been in Afghanistan multiple times, that one just really, it hits home with me makes me emotional to this day, and it brings back memories and it brings back really hard memories. But also those moments that really brought us together, when you're in a deployed environment, the stress that goes on is insane. And so that's hands down. One of the, one of the best I think in knowing what Chris Kyle went through, like even through trying to help somebody. And in the outcome of that, like it really started to highlight the importance of caring for mental health for our military members. And I have seen a shift in that. I'm proud to be a part of that. Yeah. And I'm proud to be a part of those times. Yeah. Nice. Tara. Mine is American Sniper too. For different reasons though. The same reason, like she said, it's our generation as our era. It really wasn't that long ago. And that's wild to think. And I actually I joined after nine 11. I joined in, yeah, after nine 11, directly after in October. What resonates with me is looking at it from a First Sergeant lens, I guess, is that he went on four tours with clear signs of PTSD and it just reminds me to pay attention to your people. Yeah. We really have to do a better job of taking care of our people and paying attention to what they really have going on.'cause in no way, shape or form should he have kept going on tours when he was already showing signs of PTSD. Clear signs. Yeah. Yeah. It's, we had to lose a lot to get it right and that's not Okay. And what we have to do is we have to focus on the people. We have to look deep and we have to acknowledge the signs. Absolutely.'cause if our people aren't okay, then the mission's not gonna be taken care of. So we really have to take care of our people if we want our mission to succeed. And I think we're doing a better job at it now, yeah. How about you, Kyle? Well, I was gonna say major pain too. I love it. I'm actually gonna watch major pain. Okay. And you guys could do major pain trivia on me, but I haven't seen it in so long so I'm gonna watch it. I have two. So in Air Command and Staff College, we actually had to do a film study in the class. Probably one of the best classes I loved was leadership and warfare and how you show up in different en environments. Unbroken. Angelina Julie directed it based on a true story. Louis Zini, I would have to say that one gets me every time. So I have two. So unbroken is one, and there are just different reasons, but because his leadership, and it could be how he was raised, he was kind of like a rebel when he was a teenager, but his heart, his internal compass was so strong that it didn't matter any environment he was in. He gave his all he did not change, he did not waver. His bomber was shot down over the Pacific in World War ii, 47 days in a life raft to survive that. Then POW camp. Survived that and he was beaten and interrogated and just didn't matter. He came out on top, he was so resilient. So for me, that one, and we actually did a film study, a couple students, and I think there were like three or four films you pick. And a few of us did Unbroken and that was like really good. And we talked about how any environment he was in, it wasn't about the position, it wasn't about titles. It was about like his internal compass and what he stood for and his values and he got through it. So that one was really good. And then black Hawk down and for different reasons. That's a good one. I mean there's, yeah, two things, battle of Mogadishu, but those soldiers, Warriors on the ground and they had heart and they fought for each other. But you have to have a good plan. And we talk about this sometimes in our strategy class that if you have a plan, know that it could change. Mm-hmm. And if you can't adapt that quick then your soldier suffer. And that's what happened was communication breakdown, not enough intel, for the local militia and they didn't have a good backup plan. And when that changed, those leaders that were not on the ground,'cause the leaders on the ground, they fought for each other, they weren't gonna give up. But the leaders not on the ground. They couldn't adapt quick enough and change plans. And so that, yeah, that was, it was just good. And just shows that. You can fight hard and we will fight for each other. But when strategy breaks down, we gotta be able to adapt and we will talk about that next, when we talk about change and adaptability, that's why adaptability is a strong competency of ours because you don't know when things are gonna change and be uncertain. And you gotta be ready for it and you gotta be able to adapt. So I thought that was good. That's one of my favorites. And of course great cast and just a great movie. Have you guys watched Boots on Netflix? Love Netflix. It was cute. It was cute. Well, not all of it, I'm just now getting to it. Oh, it's cute. It really is. Yeah, I've been going back, I watched two weeks ago full Metal Jacket. I think one of the first like military movies I watched was Platoon, so I'm gonna go back and watch that one. But yeah, full Metal Jacket. I watched the very first time when I was probably eight years old. And you wanna talk about traumatizing? I should not be watching this, and it started showing the reality a long time ago. I just can't believe how long it's taken us to get better, but I'm glad to be a part of getting it better. Yeah. We talked about that last week ke where we were like, oh, we probably shouldn't have watched half of the things we watched when we were kids. No. Our mom, as I'm explaining to do, that's what's wrong with us. I know. We should have, I wish Cocoa Melon was on back then. We should have just watched Cocoa Melon. Oh, miss Rachel. Don't even get me started on that lady. My kid. I have a boy, little boy. So luckily we don't get into Miss Rachel, but Coco Mellon was definitely a thing. Yeah, I know every single song. Oh, it's, it was a great show. But anyway, yeah. Those two were my favorite. I could watch those movies like all day long. I mean, so good. There are so many out there. You guys wanna get back on the trail? Let's get back on, we've got a couple more questions here. Let me pull this one up. So going back, 66 years. Tara 14, Courtney 23, me, 29. I don't know. I feel like I've been saying 28, 29 for the last five years. Going back you guys talked about BMT, I was so scared., It was my first time away from home and, introvert, first time away from home, I prayed the rosary every night, the entire rosary. So I commend you guys for just trying to hold in laughter and think it was like so easy. I just, I prayed every night. Just get me through each day. I didn't think it was easy. Don't get that wrong. I just, oh my God. I think humor and laughter is the, my coping mechanism for life. Oh, it's mine too. It is. Well, it, that's good. So what is one thing, you would go back and tell someone entering the service? Courtney, this is going to be hard. This is going to be very hard. Stick with it and understand that every single one of the challenges that you come across is gonna make you stronger. Pressure creates diamonds. Become the diamond. Yes ma'am. Yeah. I would say milk it. Take every, seriously. Milk it. Take every opportunity that's given to you and freaking milk it. Okay. Also take benefit. Yes. Yes. Take all the benefits. Take every opportunity that's given to you. Every certification you can get. Go for it. Yeah. You can't go wrong. Milk it. That's what I would say. And then also bad times are just a phase, like challenges that you're going through. It's a phase in time. Just and I'm not gonna get political, but like the administration, that's four years. Okay. And another four years is gonna be another administration, just like your leadership. You have a commander, he's only there for, so he or she's only there for so long and then you get a new one. So it's only a phase. And just if you remember that and keep that, in the back of your mind, then life will be a lot easier. This is just a phase. Yeah, I like both of those. And I think both of'em, it's just, like Courtney said, it's, this is gonna be hard and that's okay. We gotta do hard things. That's how we're gonna get through this is just keep doing hard things and being uncomfortable. And it's just a hard thing like. Everything's gonna be fine. I think for me it's like a combination of both of those and it's build your foundation. Don't forget about you. Anything can happen. Physically, medically, anything. And for me I waited a while to go to school and build my foundation and strengthen my anchors because at the end of the day, all of that explicit stuff can be gone. And now it's about implicit and who are you when you take off that uniform who are you, what is your purpose? What are your values? Who's your family? How do you support your family? To me, that's the, that is the most important is don't forget about you in all of this and building your foundation because it could be gone. And that is a good combination of both. And then what, so it is doing those hard things. It is going to school, it is diversifying yourself and your talent and getting out there and doing different things. Couldn't agree more. I love it. Okay. And last one, so when we talk about like leadership lessons everything that we've been through and exposed to, like between our own airmen, our own leadership, and then the leaders that we've worked for and worked with, what is the number one leadership trait that we would say is the most important in us, but also in other leaders. It's authenticity. I know that's me and I know that's you guys. It is about being real, approachable, relatable, honest, being fair. And it doesn't matter, if you're in uniform or not. It's that responsibility of showing up and serving regardless of the uniform. It is being you. And I think that goes all the way back to us knowing our values and our purpose and why we joined and how we were raised. And I know for me just growing up i'm so fortunate to have such a loving and generous and kind family that has carried me through. Who you see now is who you see when I put on the uniform and in any environment I'm in. I can't change that and I will stand up for things that aren't right. I feel it in my gut. It is a yucky eng gross feeling when something isn't right. I would say authenticity is number one. And I want that. In my bosses too. And I want that in everybody around me because people can see right through it if you're not. Yep. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Authenticity is what it is. You can't fake it. So that's the biggest compliment I've received when in leadership positions is like you're very authentic. You know, people always talk about this work life balance. I just, I don't think it exists. There has to be presence where you're at. When I'm at home, I am present, I am authentic, and I am present with my family when I'm at work. Mm-hmm. I'm very much at work and I'm authentic and I'm present there. And you must listen, like listening. That's also authentic. And you really have to hear, not to respond. And I always like to say I can't tell a lie because my face is broken, and you're gonna know exactly what I think anyways. So I've never been able to be anything other than authentic. And that is absolutely a hundred percent what I respect or what I expect out of my leaders as well. Oh, I love it. Yeah. I couldn't agree more. You're gonna get the same me in every situation. Yeah. And they have tried to change me. I'm telling you. They have leadership that's like, um, no, you can't get up there and say that. And I get up there and I say it and it's, and it works out fine. You know, if you're taking that risk though. But I wouldn't take the risk if I didn't think, if it wasn't calculated. So for example, I had to get up in front of everyone during a commander's call. So the entire wing. And I had to speak, talk about scary, and I had to speak about my program'cause it's brand new, the resiliency program is new. And I had to tell everybody what it's about, and I couldn't, they were trying to make me do this script and I'm like, I can't do that. So I went rogue, of course misfit. And I used one quote that floats around MacDill Air Force Base. I just said, life, be life in. Stuff happens and I get it. And that's when you come to the Resiliency office, you know, it's simple. It was so simple. And literally we wrote, we put it on stickers and passed it out because people just loved it. I was like, that's just me being me, and that's okay. Relatable. Yeah. And people love that. They want quotes. They wanna be inspired. They don't want a script. Everybody wants to be inspired. But what's our favorite quote? they don't Until they care how much you know, until they know how much you care. And that, and it's so true. It's fact. It's so true. Oh my God. I just think John Maxwell says everything. All right. I gotta fact check myself. Sydnee. No, you are probably right. And look, my, so my favorite Roosevelt quote is the man in the arena, which is right above me. But this one is the woman in the arena, and I love that. So next, next episode, when we talk about, leadership through change, leading through change we'll share some books too. Which will make me look up books, because my go-to is, any Simon Sinek, any John Maxwell. So as we wrap this episode, just keep coming back to the idea that leadership is not a position, it's a reflection of who you are when life gets lifeing, there you go. Authenticity, humility, service, those aren't traits you turn on and off. They're how you live, lead and love every single day. So to everyone out there wearing the uniform, supporting someone who does, or just trying to grow into the best version of yourself. Thank you for what you give. Keep leading with heart. And remember, your authenticity is your superpower. Thanks for tuning into Trail Talks. Until next time, keep walking your trail with courage and purpose. See ya.