Trail Talks
Trail Talks is your weekly dose of growth, purpose, and mindset mastery.
Hosted by Kelly Kruger, life and leadership coach, speaker, and owner of Kelly Michele Coaching, LLC, and creator of the Buffalo Trail Coaching Program, this show helps you rise stronger, think deeper, and lead better - in work, relationships, and life.
No fluff. No filters. Just real talk about growth, emotional intelligence, and self-leadership for people who want more than motivation - they want transformation.
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Trail Talks
Fitness Accountability & Culture
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In this episode of Trail Talks, Kelly sits down with Jason Ham, Air Force Chief Exercise Physiologist and longtime human performance expert, for a conversation that goes way beyond push-ups, run times, and checking the fitness box. 🏃♀️💪
They talk about the difference between a culture of testing and a culture of fitness, what really gets in the way of our health, why sleep matters more than we want to admit, and how small habits quietly shape the way we show up every day. 🧠🌙
And because it is Trail Talks, there is also a Memorial Day detour involving celebrity BBQ teams, backyard games, and just enough chaos to make you question who should ever be trusted near the grill. 🔥🍔🇺🇸
Listen now to Episode 25.
Hey everyone, welcome back to Trail Talks, the podcast where we talk about growth, the messy, the beautiful, and everything in between. I'm your host, Kelly Kruger, founder of Kelly Michelle Coaching, where we focus on mindset, emotional intelligence, and leadership, all grounded in real life and real science. And joining me is my co-host and partner in growth, founder of Leading People LLC, Terrace Tonet, the leadership trainer and facilitator who brings insight, curiosity, and real-world perspective to every episode. So wherever you're listening from today, we're glad you're here. And thank you for joining us on the trail. Hey everybody, welcome back to Trail Talks. I have a special friend here I want to introduce to you and join to the Trail Talks podcast. He's a good friend of mine. We've been friends for almost 10 years now, Jason. This is my good friend Jason Hamm. So Jason has been serving the Department of War in different branches of service for about 32 years in the fitness capacity, whether it's a fitness exercise physiologist, now he serves as the Air Force chief exercise physiologist, good friend of mine. Welcome, Jason. Happy to be here. I also forgot to say he also um just found out. I just let him know that he will be our recurring fitness expert, human performance expert for the Trail Talks podcast. Surprise, Jason.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, happy to do it. I love talking to you, Kelly. So fire away and let's have a great conversation.
SPEAKER_01All right. Well, let's share with the listeners your background. So 32 years. I think you said you started supporting the Navy in the fitness capacity for 32 years. Give us like a one-minute snapshot of the last 32-year career you had.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, too easy, and I'm dating myself, right? So um you can go ahead and judge. I do. I'm grayed out now. I'm I'm the old dude, but I started as an intern in it with the Navy in Japan. Then I went the next summer and I did some work with the army, and then my last internship was with the Air Force, and I wanted to be a part of services, right? And they made me be a CDC director, like you gotta know this. And I was like, What? And so I was actually number two for cyclergometry. There were three of us hired initially, and then from there, you know, life got good. You know, I just I was mentored by the right people specifically. My greatest mentors were always enlisted chief mask sergeants, and they would always tell me, Hey, when doors open, walk through them, trust the process, and I did. So here I am, you know, never thought that anybody had ever give me the title of you're the dude, and I'm the dude, so but I have a lot of passion. I've never worked a day in my life.
SPEAKER_01Aww, you gotta love what you do, man. And you didn't absolutely and it shows, it shows every day you're very well regarded among the Air Force community. Uh, and the Air Force just went through probably the biggest fitness policy change in what three decades?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, no, it's so interesting, Kelly. This was the statement that came to me like through multiple people to my email, and I I can quote it because it it made me so happy that it was quoted that the change to fitness policy is historically the most significant reform to fitness since the birth of the air force.
SPEAKER_01Oh my god, yeah, I'm like, so there are roads mountains, yeah. And we're gonna and we're gonna talk fitness in general in this episode for our listeners, but sticking with Air Force military theme, what led to that within the air force? And and also can you talk about other services and if they're following the same trend, or are we were we kind of behind in in fitness and we needed a change?
SPEAKER_00We're not behind in fitness. If I'm gonna just like put one, there's two parts of fitness, right? There's accountability, which would be an assessment, and then you have a culture, which is physical conditioning, right? So we lead on the assessment side. Uh so we're we're based in science, uh, we're heavily involved in literature, it's the other side that we are lacking, right? So if I went into a room full of Marines and I said fitness, they don't want to talk about the tests, they'll tell you about PT, what we did this morning. And so when I took this job and I came in, and my boss was amazing, I knew her many, many years ago. She said, What's your mission? I said, uh, I want to remove the culture of testing and the culture and replace it with the culture of fitness, and so that our airmen can embrace the concept of this is a part of your military service. I always tell airmen, hey, look, it's like a hairnet at Dunkin' Donuts, it's uh job condition, guys.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. So, what what kind of trends are you seeing? I mean, what why was it a culture of testing versus a culture of fitness?
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, I mean, I really think if you look at like strong epidemiology in America, right? You're using big words, my bad, health trends in America, right? Yeah, so yeah, so America's getting more and more overweight, and this isn't a worldwide issue, it's actually an American issue.
SPEAKER_01Why are we getting more overweight?
SPEAKER_00It's the it's the toxic environment, right? And it starts and it's so subtle, you know. I I tell people like, do you remember the day that you had you drove a car that didn't have a cup holder? Oh yeah, right here, it's the super size me generation, right? What was the first thing that was supersized? The big ult, yeah, right, and then automotive companies recognized it, and they gave you like a cup holder that like you could take the insert out and like slammed out a keg in there. Like, well, I got five thousand ounces of Coca-Cola, right? That's how right it's so subtle, but it's also generational. I was raised eat everything on your plate, so I was actually taught overeating. And if you've ever been to BMT in in Lackland Air Force Base, I've never seen a kid swallow a pancake in two seconds, you dipped it in water and just right, and then you know, for the listeners that are military, how many times do you go out with your friends that are non-military and you and your spouse are done eating like super best?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00So there's a lot of that goes into this, yeah. There's a there's a social economic issue, is that a big word? People look if I have ten dollars in my pocket and I'm a single mother living in Brooklyn, New York. Am I going to the store to buy vegetables, things that are healthy, or am I going to McDonald's where I can literally feed my kids for six bucks off of a value menu?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think it I mean, I think it works both ways. You have people that want to spend less money, so they will do McDonald's and fast food that's cheaper and get all those value meals, or you have the younger gen, uh, I don't want to say the younger generation that don't mind spending ten dollars on a on a sugar-loaded drink at Starbucks. Absolutely. When they could be using that money for something else. Yeah. What about what leads to it as far as social media, stress? I I feel like we are very tired these days. What are you seeing among people, different kind of cultures, sedentary lifestyles, alcohol culture? Let's talk alcohol.
SPEAKER_00All right, well, alcohol is a tricky subject, right? And I really love the fact that like sober is the new flex for the younger generation.
SPEAKER_01For the listeners, Jason, how long have you been sober?
SPEAKER_00It's been a few years, yeah. So like I don't, I don't, I'm not a uh a time counter, if that makes sense. Yeah, like I just it was fun until it wasn't, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. For me, I'm I'm going I'm going on two years, and uh best decision I've done.
SPEAKER_00Best decision I ever made in my this is how you're on this podcast right now, because you you have access to yourself.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I would not have been able to do this, I wouldn't be where I am in my personal health if I if I hadn't stopped drinking. So, what yeah, tell me about the alcohol culture.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, the alcohol culture, if you're in the military, it's very accepted. So I'll date myself, go back years. I remember parties at the park that the wing commander was like, it's down day, everybody show up, and there was like cattle troughs full of beer, right? You just dug your hand in, found the beer you wanted, and that's what we did, right? And it just it's hard to remove be from the culture of the military, and it's we're getting better, at least airmen are informed. This isn't good. I think 100%. Yeah, we tested we tested airmen during COVID, and our aid app rates went up. I mean, a lot of people didn't do well on COVID, myself included, right? So it's a matter of hey, look, take dry January and then just stay on it, and then tell me how you feel. Yeah, like I can tell you, I could never do the job I'm doing right now if I was a regular drinker.
SPEAKER_01I don't do absolutely we move more, eat less, sleep better, think better, all all around. Our our lives are just completely better without alcohol.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you just it's kind of like that uh whatever that allergy medication commercial is where they lift the screen off and voila, you see the world differently. Yeah, bright, it's beautiful. That's it, man. It's the brain fog that you don't know you're going through.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. And I just read recently you mentioned the alcohol-free culture that it is growing, and I forgot the statistics, but it is less adults are drinking.
SPEAKER_00No, and absolutely, and so you know, I'm up here in Washington, DC. There's actually uh bars, I guess you call them a bar, but they're alcohol-free, so you can get a mock tail, yes, you could get a non-alcoholic beer, and it'd be amazing to see. Like, I'm still kind of cool, I just don't have to do this to be cooler.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yep. Yeah, that's great. What about uh energy drinks? So I and I will be honest. This is my so I'll talk about soda. Let's talk about soda first. This is my this is my fifth day without without soda.
SPEAKER_00No, I'm done for you. Look maybe forever.
SPEAKER_01I will be so honest, and I and I'm missing it. I love the mini Coke Zeros. So not not drinking, I leaned on, besides water, of course, uh, and coffee, I leaned on Celsius energy drinks, and also Diet Coke or Coke Zero. And I found that lately in the past few months, I've been really leaning on Coke Zero or Diet Cokes like almost every day, and no more than one, but either a mini or regular size can. And and um, I don't know what it was last week, but uh I'm just I decided, you know what? I need to stop with the everyday soda. I it because I feel it at like two or three p.m. uh in mid-afternoon when I when we hit that slump, and I would always just go for the Coke or the Diet Coke, or not the regular Coke, the Diet Coke or the Coke Zero. And I'm like, oh, I feel better. When really probably I didn't feel better, it's all in my head. And I said, you know what? No, like stay away from it for a bit. And so this is the fifth day. In the first couple of days, I felt it like I really wanted it, and I'm like, Kelly, don't. Um, I do like my liqueurs, I do like uh sparkling water of some sort, and then I also have not had an energy drink in in oh gosh, um probably a week and a half, two weeks. And for the listeners, you were probably thinking, What is she about to say a year? No, no, I haven't had an energy drink in probably a week and a half, almost two weeks. So, yeah, let's talk, let's talk energy drinks first, and then we'll hit the sodas.
SPEAKER_00Well, so this is what I'd say like you need to really connect energy drinks to alcohol, right? Yeah, okay. Caffeine is a it's a drug, it's a substance, and we can get addicted to it. And there are withdrawal effects of stopping you drinking those, right? But I'd say the thing that with some of this is very self-inflicted in the military. Like, I the most interesting picture I had from a buddy of mine, he was deployed to fill in the blank, right? And he sent me a picture, and there was a palette of rippets right outside of the feat pack. Look, yep, yeah, and so they had rip-off rippet challenges like how many can you do in a day, but it really goes back to if you're not sleeping well, if you're not taking care of yourself, but you know you you need a job, you gotta get up and go, right? And I think a lot of people don't understand the military in the sense that this isn't an NFL team that gets a preseason, season post, right? Every day is season.
SPEAKER_01It is.
SPEAKER_00Are we ready to fight tonight? So then we look at our bad decisions, so to speak, and say, Well, I gotta fight tonight. So I'm gonna drink a rippet, I'm gonna drink a name 'em. There's a hundred of them out there, right? And that's what they see as stimulation. Like, I this is what gets me going. Now, I love coffee in the morning, yeah. But I don't need it.
SPEAKER_01What do you take? I always like to ask people, how do you take your coffee, Jason?
SPEAKER_00Uh, with everything but coffee. So what I'm like, can you put like 10 pumps of French vanilla there and a hundred packets of Splenda? Then you're like at the very top is probably the coffee part. No, you know, I mean, I don't know, it's a bad habit myself. I'll be honest with you. I don't like the taste of coffee, but yeah, but I don't drink sodas at all. Go ahead, yeah.
SPEAKER_01And you don't need coffee. I mean, I remember it was a few years ago. I just stopped drinking coffee and would drink the the the mushroom coffee or whatever it was. It wasn't coffee, but it was you know something along the lines of that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, to know me is to know me, right? I my idol is 85 all the time, so I don't need a stimulant to go to 100, right? But my idol is driven on passion. That's it. Yeah, I love I love what I do, and I want to help people, yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I and I like what you said, such a great message about being ready to fight every day. And honestly, I I for the military, absolutely, for us serving, absolutely, we got to be peak performance, high performance every day, and we get to be that, yeah. I think it should be for every human, every human should should have that mindset of I want to be at my best every day, I want to be better every single day.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, Kelly, you nail it on the head, right? And I know that there's so much discussions across all the services, and I was at a symposium, I don't know, a couple years ago, and the whole discussion of resiliency came up, and then you know what's the definition? Do you bounce back? Do you bounce? Do you work through it? I'm shaking my head the whole time. I'm just the old dude in the room, and they're like, What are your thoughts? I said, Do hard things, yes, just get up, do something every day you don't want to do. That's and maybe my generation, my dad called it grit, right? Yes, I'm giving you the ability to handle anything. You don't want to do it, but you're gonna do it. Yeah, but do hard things in everybody's not that simple.
SPEAKER_01In everybody's hard is different because we've all had different experiences in our lives, but it's it's doing something that is hard to you and it makes you uncomfortable. The problem is though, Jason, we tend to be on autopilot and we tend to do easy things because we don't understand how our brain works, or realize that what your brain can do for you. Yes, we don't know what our potential actually is.
SPEAKER_00We don't know what yeah, no, that's 100%. I mean, I don't think a lot of us, and you know what? I'm not here to say I figured it out. No, we haven't like, but I work really hard to say how do I access all of me, right? And not change who I am, yeah. And yeah, every American doesn't matter where if you wear the uniform, great for you. Every American should stop and say, Look, you know, and I've said this a million times to a lot of friends, you get one shot at this, one shot at life. So figure out how you can be great for you. Not that somebody says you're great. It's just like when you wake up in the morning, can you smile and say, I'm a good person? That that's what matters.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely, absolutely, yeah. So we talked about doing hard things, and let's connect that to stress and how stress plays a role in overall health, but also fitness.
SPEAKER_00So I'm not gonna nerd out on you, Kelly, right?
SPEAKER_01You can nerd out, nerd out.
SPEAKER_00Well anyway, so stress, it is the silent killer, right? And so there's cultural things, right? The big thing is you start doing better in your career, and the expectation is don't unplug. In fact, if you don't unplug, it's a badge of honor. I don't know how many Fridays I'm walking out of my office. I'm like, hey, what's your plans over the week, you man? I'm just gonna sleep. Oh, yeah. It is like, ah man, you're really not doing this the right way. And I understand expectations, you really need a job up. But the Air Force said, What keeps you awake at night? My response is nothing. I go to bed, I sleep, right? And so stress is no, if it if I went nerdy on you, stress creates cortisol in the body, right? And you're going to gain weight.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I mean, you can you could be so stressed out, never change your diet. You still have the same PT routine that you do on a regular basis, but oh my gosh, I am gaining weight, right? There's hormones that get affected in the body when you're under stress, but like I said, so there's you stress and there's just stress, right? Either way, all of those are not good. Uh stress is great, man. It hits you, it's a shot of dopamine to the body, like, oh man, I'm doing great things. But uh are we being very transparent when we say work-life balance? I'm not sure.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and that's a great point. Some have you know, people have opinions about that phrase work-life balance, and and I've said it before on the show, and I'll continue to say it, and and I wish that someone had told me years ago, you you remember when we worked together, I carried a lot of and I didn't stop working.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, no, you were you were on the job all the time, but we have to be able to tell our leaders I don't just need leave, I need to take the knee.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I tell my team, you know, every two weeks we'll leave. have our staff meeting and I see and I see leave on the board or leave on the calendar and I always say I love to see you guys take and leave yeah and if you're on leave be on leave yeah enjoy absolutely you earn leave to take leave you need a break so the work life balance piece is when people ask what I think about work life balance or work life harmony the first question I ask them is and for them to think about what do you want your home life to look like that's a great question it is and I forgot where I got that question you know what it's probably a question that's a hard question right so you're naturally gonna get uh oh I'm not sure right you're you're gonna get an I don't know and I and I think it was and I think it was the great John Maxwell that came up with that question and I was like oh my god like I wish I heard that many years ago but it's always in any any plan that we have we start with the end in mind and that end in mind is are the most important people in your life and that's your family so what is your home life look like and then how do you get there? Yeah no I agree I mean I think that you know when I so this is just my opinion of work life balance is work is work right and if you're passionate you love it right and that's the majority of your life you're spending you know serving something greater than yourself which is amazing but but the life side is we don't give ourselves grace we don't give ourselves peace yeah we don't give ourselves the ability to say I'm not okay and being not okay is okay yeah yeah and myself I I eventually had to do it like I'm not okay and so it's not unmanly unsoldier marine unairman to say and this is too much I need to take a knee we don't do that and we well we talk about it but we don't embrace it support it if you work for me and you said sir I need to take a knee I'd be like you don't need to say anything more go yeah yeah what do you do to recharge or how do you know I guess how do you know Jason that you need a break what triggers you to say hey I'm gonna take a day off or my mental energy is depleted and I need to take a day of leave or I need to take a break or I just need to rest to recharge all right so the funny thing is I'm very different than most uh my burnout comes as I just became the stand up comedian in the office so performance you're when you're when you start performing versus yeah I just start getting weird and telling jokes and the people that know me they're like oh he's burned out right yeah that's what I know and I'm not the best at it but I recently took some leave and I had to tell the boss like hey I need to take a meet I've been in a you know dead sprint for almost two years on fitness I need to take a meet and you know I mean I got out policy and everything but but I'm how I have to defend all this stuff now right so that's the hard part right is to inspire you when you disagree with me so yeah there will be skeptics out there yeah you don't see so what I guess without sharing too much what is the overall response regarding the skeptics and then how how would you inspire them so because and just for the listeners three decades ago when I when I first joined the air force I remember doing the cycle ergometry which can you explain what that is for the listeners and then we went to a three mile walk I want to say because I remember walking a lot on the floor and then and then we went to the mile and a half run and now which again all of this is also pushups and setups and stuff and then and then now we're at the we're at two mile right two mile still pushups and setups. So I guess explain the evolution of fitness throughout the air force and and then share about the skeptics and kind of what you're sharing to inspire inspire that yeah absolutely so the revolution of cyclergometry so we did the 12 minute run from the cooper institute for years right I was I was certified as a fitness instructor from the Cooper Institute by the remember okay yes yes you know Dr.
SPEAKER_00Cooper's great and he his team was very much so involved in the standards that I just put out but yeah yeah there were more people that dropped dead in 1991 than Desert Storm wow yeah you know the air force the air force doesn't just hit targets they like decimate them so they're like oh we're gonna go with this cyclergometer and and young Jason M went to a job fair and some colonel grabbed me and said you want a job and I was like I'm broke and I have loans yes and he said we're doing cycloergometry and I'm thinking in my head because the only time that I ever did cycloergometry was in cardiac rehab phase three I had to do rotations in school I'm like holy cow man the military has people in cardiac rehab and then quickly found out that yep it was the test it was flawed I pushed back against it thankfully the air force was kind enough to say hey we know you don't like this well we'll send you the spec war and the you'll do okay there and so we knew that cycologry if you smoked right before you got on it or slammed and I didn't have energy drinks back then but if you slammed a cup of coffee you got on that bike and you looked like Lance Armstrong coming off oh yeah yeah but if you were really fit you bombed that thing yep you know so to my life I'm very simple two plus two has to equal four and I was like this is so bad. So I fought and fought through that process and being bold at a young age young career that this is not military and thankfully we had a chief staff of the air force that couldn't pass the bike test general John J. Jumper right general jumper said we're gonna do something different and I got an opportunity to go work for him and that's for the mile and a half the abdominal circumference all that and then circa whatever 20 years longer than that whatever the air force called me and said all right you're the dude with the pedigree you've done all of it now give us alternates and I was like okay and Kelly you know this the 20 meter shuttle was a huge project that General Scoby said go for it. It is my baby I did not name that after me it was somebody else I know the team the team that put it together called it the hammer for those right yeah no and General Brown CK Brown said oh yeah we're doing that yeah so now is my one at bat so I got up and said man I'm gonna swing at a ball I'm gonna swing at any pitch that comes in yep but if I hit one it's going out of the park the energy behind all this so where we're at today look the bottom line is this we can get here overnight and we can't fix this overnight and I need airmen to know that there's a reason why I remove minimums for waist height ratio hey I get it many of different stacks you're just a big person right but I'm giving you 80 points just kill it right so when I hear human performance I mean body composition means something because it's reciprocal but I need folks to embrace the fact that hey man the test is in your hands yeah and the other part is you know we're doing this diagnostic baseline and everyone thinks I'm collecting data to make things easier I'm not doing that right I'm not doing that what I want is how are you doing yeah and I will stagger you out right but take the Degum test and change your routine and when you stand up and say well we can't do regular PT in my unit yeah you can yeah you can but that requires creative solutions drill it all the way down to the back shop the staff sergeant that's in charge of three airmen let him do it let him figure it out I'm going at nine you go at 10 you go at 11 right let that happen i never wanted this Afband that went out all this stuff I never wanted it to be a commander's program everything's a commander's program unsaid right but what about our non-commissioned officers yeah absolutely that's really where the effort works and believe me I've talked to the Marines I've talked to the army and they're like we keep it in the ranks yeah and I I and I embrace that I spent time around pear rescue men they call the pilot by his first name it was just how it was so all hands on deck let's do this we have a Secretary War that says we gotta do this I it's my job make sure you don't get injured and there's just not bad things happening to you.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely yeah yeah and I don't know if you've listened to our last episode yet it just it was just released two two days ago but it was why teams stay stuck and it has to do with changes anything that affects our companies our organizations our team members our employees then this is actually a good example and we tend to just sit in the problem and discuss the problem and end up with a well described problem versus somebody in that room saying how are we going to make this work absolutely how are we going to embrace this and that's what we need to do that's what we need you know what for fitness in the military it's so personal and I understand that I don't have a dog in the fight right I don't wear the uniform I you know some some days I wish I did yeah right but I serve my nation differently but the bottom line is this is if you really look at all this stuff we've passed along generationally oh we don't do that i mean it was actually probably a recruiting tool at some point in the air force like hey don't go to the Marines you got a PT every day come to the air force you just be smart and not do it yeah so it's when I say the culture of fitness it's a full reset of the brain and how you look at it yeah I I remember when we were when you had called into one of our briefings recently and you were talking about covet and you know what was the result of covet and fitness and and warfighters you know airmen and you said well we're either gonna have three three things three types of people coming out of covet we're gonna have hunks drunks or chunks or a combination of or a combination of yes for some reason that just stuck with me all right well let's talk sleep for just one minute so for the listeners we are gonna have Jason back on to talk sleep here in a couple weeks and I can't wait for that but let's talk sleep and how that connects with fitness how that aligns with fitness sleep connects with everything.
SPEAKER_00Yeah you know it connects with fitness I get there we're a sleep deprived nation it's biological you have to but you have to learn a habit right you know the uh we have to get to a place where it's an un an unplugged military we have to get to a place where like if you email me at 1 a.m why are you on your computer at 1 a.m and that doesn't make you better than me right yeah we need to remove that badge of being sleep deprived we need to stop saying things like what keeps you awake at night we hear that right now sleep the minute you focus on it and there's so many wearables and I'm wearing one right now right or uh right there's good information out there embrace it and I I promise you if you focus on seven to nine hours a night you're going to be okay but there is no human that can say well my body only needs five hours that's not true right I I hear that a lot so what is your before we shift to some um rapid fire questions on fitness what is your most important sleep habit you personally I my sleep habit is to get to a place where I no longer need an alarm to get up that's that's always my goal right I set my phone it reminds me at 745 every night start getting ready for bed and I do and I put my phone away I stop staring at it I don't need the blue light the dopamine everything that's gonna make my head go in a million different directions my goal is to not have an alert clock wow that's a great goal yeah and when you do that man you got there yeah absolutely I would say that huh yeah yeah you got there you're doing great that's incredible that's incredible all right want to do some uh rapid fire questions here all right do we need to work out every day yes is walking underrated absolutely physical activity is underrated if I had 20 minutes a day what would I do if I had 20 minutes to exercise what should I do depends on your goal right so it look if you're just targeting health and trying to be healthy yes uh then you know what go for a walk go for a bike ride go get on a rowing machine whatever you enjoy do it don't do things that you don't enjoy now trading for fitness all right there's a little bit of specificity right so uh you might need to start running a little bit right don't overdo it if you're due in six months don't wait five months to get ready do something on a regular basis just remember nobody dies from small biceps the most important muscle in your body is your heart you do that you're gonna be just fine the standards on upper body strength core endurance they're not hard yeah train your heart movement whatever it takes yeah movement to get the heart rate up yep purposeful yes the way I'd say it they do something that's hard do hard things how about cold plunges overrated what I mean I've done a couple and that was horrible yeah I know I look I've tried man if I was doing it as a part of my job so I'm uh I'm a navy diver right and I know I'm jumping into super cold water well I wouldn't mind learning some level of acclimization to it the idea that somehow it makes brown brown fat adipose tissue go away like I jumped out man I want many skinnier all right cold plunges I a few years ago I had done the cold shower thing but it was just toward the end of the shower and I turn it cold and I'm like nah I'm not you know I did it for a couple weeks and I'm like nah no more but yeah you know I love Mark Wahlberg I love you know I love Mark Wahlberg he's amazing and he does the cold plunge every morning there's a lot of folks to do it yeah we have cold plunges with our PoTIF teams but I still I need to see evidence I'm a scientist so show me that you dump somebody into uh a cold plunge and they hated it and got out and they gained benefit like health wise yeah I just I don't see it yet yeah somebody can connect those dots and I hope they do yeah so many fitness trends that you've probably tracked or observed over the years over the decades right now what's underrated and what's overrated in your opinion I think a lot of what's overrated is manipulation of your diet so we're seeing like keto diets paleo diets so that's food manipulation I think we've gotten better about going to GNC and buying every stimulant that's on the shelf that is also by the way not approved by the FDA all they have to do is put a label on it saying this is a supplement and they get away with it. Yeah right yeah and we take these things because we're on you know we're on social media and it pops up yeah right like right now we're talking about this kind I guarantee I'm gonna go on Facebook and it's gonna say nothing about a diet of sorts because my phone's listening to me there's no way that you can get results without doing hard things I would be out of a job my profession wouldn't be here if you could take a pill and you know or a supplement or whatever right that just magically you're fit right and I feel the same way about GLP1s and I I do see fidelity in GLP1s however coming if you've never done a GLP one you don't inject your gut or your arm or your thigh and the fat just melts away you have to change your diet which you will because you're gonna be nauseated all day you still need to exercise absolutely you still need to have an exercise lifestyle just lifestyle just a physical activity lifestyle do you go out for a walk right you know fitness is not king diet is diet's king fitness is queen yeah or if your diet's not dialed in your fitness is gonna show right I used to train a guy years ago Kelly years ago you would get on the treadmill and he would run until he met the exact calories of a six pack of beer wow yeah he told me I was like there you go um all right if you were going to the grocery store what are the probably top 10 items and you it doesn't need to be 10 I'm just putting a number out there top items we would see in your grocery cart I would say yeah for me like I shop on the perimeter of the grocery store. Very good yeah so that means produce that means the seafood market if there's one there it means maybe the butcher right it's the perimeters that you look at I stay out of the aisles unless there's something very specific it's normally spices yeah that I'm searching for because when you eat healthy it can be bland if you don't do that you know I I I've worked with great dietitians and they're like oh no there's a way to make things very healthy for you and that's what I do.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. What about intermittent fasting? We've got a couple more here what do you think about intermittent fasting which we do hear a lot of people follow that uh I don't know if we call it a trend but where they probably don't eat until noon or they have that fasting window or the eating window of like noon and 6 p.m and then they don't eat outside of that yeah so you know intermittent fasting was really kind of born in religion right especially in the Muslim culture they do that month of Ramadan they really do that but here's the thing your body doesn't know where you live right so if Kelly Kruger's body is in Tampa Florida your body will say no she's in the desert and she doesn't have food everything comes down to your basement
SPEAKER_00metabolic rate your metabolism right so your metabolism your metabolism is reciprocate it reciprocates back to your behavior yeah I would say most important meal of the day is breakfast eat something yeah yeah if you really if you saw a four-year-old kid this is how we should all eat they graze they don't really know oh five o'clock's when we sit down as a family for dinner right they just uh oh I have a hunger they'll grab a snack and they'll just keep on going but once again back to cultural right dinner time's at five o'clock we're all at the table we're all gonna pray we're all gonna eat our food finish everything on our plates right so I'm not I'm not a huge fan of the intermittent stuff yeah my you know my kiddo Jordan he's six and he loves breakfast yeah and when I have him his typical breakfast is it's like a king's breakfast it's scrambled eggs and I put some cheese in it oh yeah bacon I've tried sausage but he likes bacon so bacon it is hash browns potato rounds which are right uh yogurt blueberries and that's a grown boy right here yeah I mean yeah yeah I know you know what I've told people like if you miss breakfast and you start doing it and I'm not a I'm not a journaling type dude right yep but just record that in your brain how did you feel for the rest of the day yeah yeah I love breakfast love it what do you think about protein bars for me during the week and and sometimes I I food prep Sunday sometimes I don't I'm not consistent or disciplined with it but I definitely eat better during the week when I do my food prep but in the morning I I typically don't eat breakfast during the week I will have either almonds and blueberries and I just put them in a little ziploc bag uh I love blueberries and nuts like that if I can have that every morning I do if I just don't happen to have them on hand then I'll have a protein bar built bar or something else like what's you what do you think about protein bars what's your opinion on that I think everything is like you you need to first understand like organically what what is the definition of a protein bar supplement that means it is adding to your diet it is not a replacement you still need to have a meal yeah so I myself I I enjoy they're always in my you know in my briefcase going to work I have a protein bar because sometimes I you know I look at the computer and it's 10 o'clock and then I look up again and it's two right so I'd like totally missed lunch but I know I need energy calories but that doesn't give me permission to just not eat yeah yeah I used to and I'd like to start doing this again is you know I love eggs in the morning I could eat eggs every day and I used to make a fritata for food prep and then it would last me throughout the week and just put different vegetables in it and just throw eggs are great we can eggs are great sources of protein also a lot of cholesterol in them we um we can uh oh god we could do a whole episode on right on food so we will we will another ton of milk dig into my brain and um I have opinions yeah based in science yes well that's why we have you on here we need to hear that but let's do a couple more and then we are gonna do this fun detour what are the fundamentals people should focus on it as far as fitness and exercise fundamentals for one example it could be consistency over intensity so some fundamentals that you think we should focus on I've always said this consider your heart a motor right and so you might be driving a pinto right now with a four cylinder but we want to get you to the Camaro super sport right big block V8 that everyone sees is like whoa look at that so I would say focus on things a you have to do something you enjoy or you won't be compliant with your exercise program find something I mean do you like to swim get in the pool do you like the elliptic rowing do you like fill in the blending right find that knowing that like I can actually transcribe this over to a military standard of running right yeah do things that you want to do that that you're happy with but the basic regimen is this you need to have something cardiorespiratory in your life right do that uh you need to do some level of calisthenics I'm not saying strength training calisthenics do push-ups do some burpees right do some sit ups yeah it doesn't have to be the test right do all of those things it's well rounded and based on your age you gotta really focus on other things right so I would say man I'm a old dude and I should be doing more strike training right because I don't want to break my hip and fall down I'd rather fall down and break my hip if that makes sense right frailty all the things that happen with older age hormone levels etc but for the most part just round it out do something you don't have to go to a gym or a fitness center and and that's been a huge discussion well our fitness center capacity is X so we can't PT in the Air Force but there's wide open spaces yeah well and the and the best equipment you can use for fitness is your body absolutely and everybody's got one of those yeah I know it's it we are so highly overanalyzing it but we're just misunderstood still yeah yeah all right thank you hey I'll ask you one last question before we close out but are you ready for a detour?
SPEAKER_01I'm ready all right Jason does not know what this detour is no so when this episode is released it will be leaning into Memorial Day weekend so while we honor the fallen and their families one common thing that that people do are have barbecues have Memorial Day barbecues and what we like to do on this podcast during the detours are fantasy drafts have you heard of fantasy football oh yeah oh yeah well who's your favorite team uh you're a uga fan yeah so i'm a college football guy okay i mean i grew up loving the steelers yeah and you're and uh jason is a uga fan right how about them dogs uh how about them dog there you go you can do the bark let you do the bark for the yeah all right all right go dogs okay so the guy in the commercial he's like go dogs oh and the boss is like what oh my god best all right so we will do a memorial day fantasy barbecue draft we will have five categories and this is for us putting our Memorial Day barbecue together and who will be in charge of those five areas and we put in some famous people and some athletes it'll be a snake draft so if you pick first on the first one then I'll pick first on the second category there are five categories the five categories are round one is the grill master so who's gonna be doing the food number two is playlist and vibes director so the music round three are the backyard games round four are the sides the food sides and round five is the wild card so somebody who's gonna kind of be the maestro of the event and I'll tell you the names here in a second right so do you want to pick first or second first all right okay so you got the first pick here so round one is the grill master so who are you drafting to run the grill your options are Gordon Ramsey Bobby Flay Guy Fieri Dwayne the Rock Johnson or Martha Stewart I gotta go with Ferrari right guy fieri he's uh right triple D I gotta go with him he is awesome oh my god I don't god I want Martha Stewart there so bad oh she's amazing she is she good on the grill I don't think so I mean I would do I'm gonna go with Gordon Ramsay yeah I gotta go I gotta go with Gordon Ramsay he's pretty animated he's pretty funny he could be rude that would be uh he'd add a little something to the party as much as I love he would be my number two but in theory like he's a dude he's yeah he's he's awesome I would um maybe I'll have some Martha Stewart plates there or something but um or a picture of her it would be right out of the garden yeah yeah so all right jason's got guy and I've got Gordon Ramsay this is a heck of a detour I love it though all right and what are they cooking on at yours what are they cooking on the grill oh back uh I would do a low so can it be just food outdoors instead of just on the grill I would do a low country boil oh man that sounds good yeah and just let everybody huddle around a table with their hands and eat my god that sounds fun getting hungry now I'm drooling I know I you know it took me a while to learn how to do it yeah I was basically at Charleston Air Force space and I ruined like probably three pots and then I took my timing down exactly and it's so good. I taught my dad and my mom how to do it they do it in Iowa and their friends are like where in the world you learn this yeah yeah no it sounds amazing all right round two playlist and vimes director who controls the music and the atmosphere options and I'll I'll draft first for this one uh my options are pit bull taylor swift luke combs post malone or DJ Khalid oh gosh I already I already have Gordon Ramsey so I'm gonna do um I love Luke Combs I love Luke Combs all right so you're going with Luke I'm gonna go with Luke I'm gonna go with Luke all right well no I agree I if George Strait was on that list yep so I I'm a country kid from Iowa went to Georgia I'm uh I'm a redneck I only listen to country music I love Morgan Wallen oh Luke Combs has a really great story yeah yeah who's who are you picking you've you've got I'm going with Luke Combs you can't I already picked somebody else give me the other names oh yeah you're not post balone i'm screwing you over right now because I picked Luke Combs you've got pit bull taylor swift post balone or DJ Khaliet I'm gonna have to go with pitbull yeah yeah that's a good I was that's a ton of energy I love him you know I mean look if I'm in a bad place in life I'll listen to Taylor Swift and nickelback back to back by uh oh my god we could do a whole episode on nickelback yeah man they were great they were great and look this we canceled them America canceled they were canceled we yes we have we praised it oh nickelback sucks you game it turned into that no they were awesome okay for our next episode when we talk sleep we're gonna we're gonna our detour is gonna be on nickelback and that cancel and how that why that cancel happened anyway all right so um so I've got Luke Hombs and you have pit bull oh so great that's why I couldn't decide if I wanted Luke Hombs because I was gonna choose pit bull too all right round three this is where you go first games and backyard competition so who's running the cordhole can jam backyard chaos water balloon toss all that stuff your options Rob Gronkowski Shaquille O'Neal Mark Wahlberg Serena Williams or Josh Allen Jack all day I wanted Shaq I wanted no he's such a kind soul yeah no I'm going Shaq sorry he is hilarious I think he's he's funny as heck and but he he just he's a good dude but he loves his mom like he i don't think that Shaq ever really got stupid i mean i other than he made the largest purchase at Walmart and the history of Walmart i uh I love Shaquille Neal I would normally pick Josh Allen because he's my favorite ever but I'm also thinking like yeah he would be very competitive he would be a lot of fun I'm torn between him or Gronk because Gronk is hilarious too um but I gotta go with Josh Allen I would feel guilty and I think the listeners in Bill's mafia would be pissed if I didn't pick Josh Allen so we go with Josh Allen. Yeah you're endeared at this point yeah I'm I'm in there too and I think Jordan would get mad if he listened to this episode he would be mad if I didn't pick Josh Allen. So Josh Allen it is so you've got Shaquille O'Neal I have Josh Allen all right round four the food and side dishes so who handles side dishes and the food logistics of putting it all together and setting up my options are Paula Dean Emerald Legossi Reedrum Rachel Ray or Wolfgang Puck what are you going with I'm going with Paula Dean I'm going with Rachel Ray oh yeah she's good oh and she'll be so organized too but Paula Dean yeah yeah I mean she's like old she's just a southern girl you know but Rachel Ray has a great personality I like she yeah yeah she's awesome all right I've got Paula Dean Jason has Rachel Ray and so wild card last round wild card you draft first here so who brings the unexpected energy to the cookout your options are Kevin Hart Joe Rogan Jelly Roll and I don't know the fifth one so I'm just gonna say Steve Harvey so you got four Kevin Hart Joe Rogan Jelly Roll or Steve Harvey oh I'm going Kevin Hart yeah he's awesome I'm gonna go what what the problem is right yeah he's the he's the short king I love him oh my god he's hilarious I'll go with Steve Harvey because he's also very funny all right do you want to do a bonus round sure all right bonus round who absolutely cannot be trusted at the barbecue they show up uninvited and we're like uh oh who invited them and not sure if you can trust them Kanye West Antonio Brown Tommy Lee or Flavor Flav it's my do I get a choose yeah oh Kanye Kanye Kanye I would have chosen that one too I'll I'll go with still make this barbecue political all right I'll I'll go with Antonio Brown oh A B yeah yeah I get it now I get it all right so Jason's team for the listeners is Guy Fieri Pitbull Shaquille O'Neal Rachel Ray Kevin Hart and Kanye West that's a really good lineup mine is Gordon Ramsey Luke Combs Josh Allen Paul Edine Steve Harvey and Antonio Brown who shows up uninvited all right rapid fire questions for the barbecue how do you like your uh hot dogs ketchup mustard relish chicago style all of it everything yeah loaded loaded dogs warm it up man chicago yeah what's your favorite backyard game cornhole cornhole all right absolutely throwbags yeah favorite side dish I'm gonna go with potato salad but only my mom can bring that like she does it different she's awesome yeah yeah do you believe in the you gotta wait 45 minutes after you swim or after you eat to go in the pool that's bullshit i don't know whoever came up with that i'm sorry i use profanity i don't believe anybody i don't know where that came from what's your favorite pool game i would say i like sharks and minnows i know they call it oh that's a classic yeah i i think the kids call it something different but sharks and minnows no it's still it's still sharks minnows all right pool yeah you gotta yeah if you're shark you gotta tag somebody underwater yeah yep we do um every summer when we're in buffalo and and i love teaching jordan all the different pool games but still sharks and minnows uh marco polo and in categories is a fun one that's always a fun one yeah all right all right let's uh thank you for that that was fun and let's hop back on the trail and close this out so one last question for you Jason before we close this out what would you tell someone who feels overwhelmed trying to get healthy i i work i do a podcast family everything what like i am overwhelmed i'm trying to find time to exercise food prep all of that like i feel overwhelmed what are you gonna tell me i would probably say give yourself grace give yourself the ability to say this is too much and i don't want to do i or it's not that i don't want to do things but give yourself grace don't leverage so much on your soul right yeah find a way to be happy through this process but at the same time look at you know look at your life in general like where are you to dedicating something to that maybe is not valuable yeah right so grace and peace right we should all search for that we should all become comfortable in our own skin we need to love each other so that we can love other people you know so yeah that's what I would say don't be so hard on yourself thank you thank you yeah we we tend to uh be our own worst enemy absolutely our own worst critic if you miss a day of exercise or two days or three days it's not a problem it's not a problem just restart yep restart baby steps just even take a walk around the block and absolutely you didn't fail yeah just you things happen period they happen all right so are you gonna join us again you're the you're recurring you are this is i i love this i'm so happy and honored that you would reach out to me i love what i do for a living and kelly you know i think you're the best ever yeah bring me back we can talk about anything your listeners want to talk about in the world of holistic health beyond running and we can talk about sleep we can a lot of things so yeah please absolutely yeah for the listeners be on the lookout for our social media posts where we will release the episode and we will ask you what do you want us to talk about absolutely we will talk definitely talk about sleep and and nickelback on the next episode with Jason uh the whole thing is nickelback oh my god oh so much to talk about thank you so much for joining me and let's uh let's close this out so hey everybody happy memorial day coming up this memorial day we remember that freedom is not free behind every flag is a name a family and a sacrifice enjoy the weekend with friends and family but also take a minute to pause to honor those who never made it home remember the fallen honor the families that carry that loss every day and never take for granted the freedoms that their sacrifice made possible thank you for joining us and we'll see you next time on Trail Talks. Thanks if today's conversation resonated with you you don't have to walk your journey alone I offer emotional intelligence assessments with personal Coaching, one-on-one mindset coaching, and leadership development for teams and organizations. You can explore all of that at Kellymichelle Coaching.com, linked in the show notes. And I'll leave you with this. Awareness is powerful, but support is transformational.