Christ in Cancel Culture

In this week's episode, Sam and Blake talk about how to stick to what matters in a world that argues about everything that doesn't. What are the things that make you angry? What do you try to defend? What do you spend time thinking about? Let's dive in and explore these questions in this episode together!

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

The weather is so much warmer now. And I'm really excited about it. Me as well, Blake. It was over 80 degrees a few days ago.

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 0:15

Yesterday it was sleeting in the morning, which was random and dumb, but it warmed back up a little bit today. Uh next week is spring break for my wife and kids. I will be off work. Sam, are you on spring break? I am on spring break. Got any plans? Going to the beach, Hilton Head Island. Whoa.

SPEAKER_01 0:37

Whoop whoop.

SPEAKER_02 0:38

Is that like a yearly thing for you?

SPEAKER_00 0:41

A new thing for you? Yeah, pretty much. My my family goes about once a year to Hilton Head. It's our favorite place.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

Dang. I remember going to Hilton Head as a kid, but I have not been in forever. Is there a lot of things to do at Hilton Head, or is it mostly just the beach?

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Almost nothing to do, actually. Oh. Yeah. But it's it's a very restful place. It's a fan favorite.

SPEAKER_02 1:02

So this is good. We talked about Sabbath last week. You can put some of those things we talked about into practice. There we go. At Hilton Head. That's awesome. We don't have any spring break plans. We might do a day trip or something, but we'll just hang at the house mostly, I guess. Hopefully, weather will stay mostly warm. We'll see. If you guys have any spring break plans, if it's your spring break, I have no idea. You might just be working. And I guess that's fine too. Maybe your spring break is later. I don't know. But whatever your plans are next week, if you're working, if you're on spring break, if you are going to a funeral, I'm sorry. What my condolences. I shouldn't be laughing about a funeral. If you are going to the fair, there's something that's happier than a funeral. Right? The fair is happy.

SPEAKER_00 1:58

Anyways. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:59

That's uh what's he what's something else happy and not a funeral. Yeah, a wedding. If you're going to a wedding, congratulations. If you're going to see the birth of a child. Ah. That's that's happy. Huzzah. Huzzah. Congratulations. Whatever is going on in your life, let it be what it is. Let it be good. Let it be good. Anyway, here we go. I'm going to list off some things, and I want you to feel these things in your body, in your soul. Did that sound weird? If that sounded weird, I'm sorry. That probably sounded weird. It's not, it's not weird. Just embrace the things that I'm about to say, okay? They might make you feel a little bit uncomfortable. They might make you I don't know. Just feel what you feel when I say these things, okay? Here it comes. Reproductive rights. Why are you laughing? Why are you laughing over there, dude? This is serious. Reproductive rights. Climate change. Immigration. Gun control. Educational policies. Election integrity. Economic disparities. You could list a whole bunch of other things. When I say these things, how do they make you feel? Do they make you feel angry? Sad? Upset? Argumentative? Something totally different? How does me saying these things make you feel? You might have felt different with each thing that I said. Some things might have made you angry, something else might have made you sad, something else might have made you argumentative. I don't know. I don't know how these things made you feel, but it's no secret that these things are hot-button topics in our world, in our country today. We live in a society that is full of these hot-button issues. And our society loves to talk about and focus on these hot-button issues. I mean, we see them every day. We see them on our social media feeds, we see them on our news channels, we talk about them at work. I mean, we see them all over the place. And rightfully so. I mean, they involve people's lives. They're important. Uh they involve our well-being a lot of the time. They involve our finances, they involve our safety, they involve other people's safety. I mean, they they involve things that are important to us and to the people around us. But are these things what's most important? I'm not so sure. I'm not so sure that they are what's most important. Maybe they are. I'm not so sure that they are. And I think and that's what we're going to dive into in this episode. We're continuing our series called Grounded. It's what our series has been this spring, which we are like, oh my, I don't know if it's first day of spring or not yet, but we're getting into spring weather. This spring series is called Grounded. And this specific episode is called Christ in Cancel Culture. And we're talking about how can we stay grounded in Christ in the midst of a society, in the midst of a culture, that loves to throw around these topics, that loves to judge people, that loves to get angry over all of these things, how can we stay grounded in what's most important, which is Jesus Christ? I think you might have uh some good scripture to throw in right now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:02

I think that um like like Blake said, I mean, eve even just the hearing just the words, not not even not nothing happened, not no no whole conversation, just the very um naming of of these words, it just it makes me feel on edge, just because I I feel like in the country that we live in today, there's so much division and um so much tension amongst so many topics, not not only these. Um but I don't know, it just feels like everywhere I turn, somebody is always angry and somebody um is is always uh relationships are ending, friendships are ending, um names are or names are being called, I don't know. It's it's just there's there's a lot of division, um, which I think is um you know a tactic of the enemy, of course. Now we're gonna get in today, um into this episode of of finding the right the right balance um between not caring at all and and caring, there there's it you can care a little bit a little bit too much if it let if you uh let it get in the way of of your relationship with God and of other things. But um But yeah, we're just gonna talk about that. We're gonna talk about walking that line um and the dangers of it. Um but also the importance of if once again, like Blake said, um some of these that all these things are really important and they're they're they're important to talk about, um, they're important to know about, um, but it's all about um if you're letting it rule your life to be uh to end with. So I found uh I did some research, I found just some scripture on the topic of arguing to begin with and and division and whatnot, and and this is 2 Timothy chapter 2, 23 through 24. Paul says this don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels, and the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome, but must be kind to everyone, able to teach and not resentful. Now, once again, I don't think that any of these are stupid topics um or or or foolish to even um consider or foolish to know about. But on the other hand, um not speaking about these, but but in just in general, if you let things that that are not that are not crucial in I don't know. I don't know what I'm talking about, Blake. I don't I don't know anything.

SPEAKER_02 8:24

No, I mean, yeah, I mean I th I think it's I think it's a great verse. I mean, Paul I think is showing us here, you know, when you are spending so much time arguing back and forth, getting resentful with other people, maybe because they have a different opinion, because they think something differently than you, you're spending time quarreling with them, it does become foolish and stupid when you're just constantly going back and forth. And maybe what even started out as important and meaningful, I mean, you look at our society today, it is stupid and foolish the way that we go back and forth constantly. Important topics are not, because I think that a lot of these topics are important. The way that we argue back and forth and quarrel back and forth constantly is foolish. And it and all it does is lead to resentment. I mean, you just talked about Sam. I mean, yeah, don't don't don't say you don't know what you're talking about because you just you made a really good point a minute ago about how you know relationships are being damaged, friendships are ending, people are getting hurt because they're going back and forth constantly and getting resentful towards each other because they're just spending all their time arguing. And Paul says here the Lord's servants must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. When we're quarreling, when we're resentful, when we're going at people, when we're arguing with them, we're not able to teach them anything. We're not able to show them who God is. I mean, I I I think that's what Paul is showing us here. And and I yeah, I mean, I think I think that's a great verse. I think it's very applicable for what we'll for what we'll get into here. And you know, I think what that verse is hitting on and what we'll try to hit on in this episode is this idea that, you know, what if by focusing on all of these hot button issues, what if we've lost sight of what is most important? You know, what if we've lost sight of what's most important? And and you know, I'll say that one more time. I I I want you all listening, and I want myself and Sam to hear this again too. You know, what if we've lost sight of what's most important? And to me, I hope to you all, what's most important is becoming more like Jesus. And I don't personally think that getting angry, that arguing about, that focusing on all these hot button topics is helping us become more like Jesus. What I mean, what do you think, Sam? I mean, I don't think that focusing on all these things helps us become more like Jesus. I think that it helps us become more anxious and worried and angry and judgmental and things like that is what I think. I I definitely don't think that the intense focus on all of these things going on all the time helps us become more like Jesus. That's just my opinion. I don't know what you think.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

Yeah, yeah, I I completely agree. Um I think when you look back at uh the time that Jesus was was walking the earth, um, what I think of, and Blake and I were talking about this before we started recording, was um the oppression that that the Jewish people were under under the Roman government. Um I think that government is obviously a huge topic of discussion within um any circle uh today and and and most controversy that we have going on in the world, it is most of it um goes back to government. And did Jesus ever say, I don't care. I I don't care about the Romans, I don't care about any of this. No. Jesus cared. He cared so much. He cared more than more than any of us probably ever will. Um but he did not let it get in the way of his ultimate mission, which was to bring a different kind of kingdom, not not to overthrow the current one that the Jewish people were under, which is what they were hoping and wishing um that the Messiah would do. You know, if you look, we're uh we're about to go into the Easter season. And when I think of Easter, I love um, well, you know, I don't know if if love is the is the right word. I I think of the story of Barabbas, Jesus and Barabbas, uh, Matthew 27, Jesus is on trial. Um, and if you don't know the story, you know, Barabbas is a convicted criminal and a felon. And um Pontius Pilate, they he puts Jesus and Barabbas on the stage and he allows the Jewish people to um because of a tradition that on the holy day they uh Pilate will release a prisoner on death row. He allows the Jewish people to decide which prisoner they want to release to the public, either Barabbas or Jesus. And the interesting thing about this passage is that the name Barabbas means, if you break it down, Bar means son, and Abba or Abbas means father. So Barabbas' name means son of the father. So you have over here in Barabbas this gross imitation of what the Jewish people were hoping the Messiah would be versus the actual son of the Father, Jesus, who the Messiah actually was, which is the savior of mankind. And they chose Barabbas because they at the end of the day they thought that what they needed was an insurrectionist and per and somebody to lead a political revolt. But ultimately we know that Jesus um said he was bringing a different kind of kingdom, not not uh an earthly kingdom, not one um that would that would cause um violence, not the not one that would uh obviously Barabbas was a murderer, you know, but he was bringing um a heavenly kingdom. He was um he he was doing all these other things. He was he was our our redeemer, the savior of mankind. So um, you know, I just think it's it's important that we don't lose sight um of what we're ultimately here to do, like Blake said, which is um is to become more like Jesus, which is to give God the glory, to love God with all of our heart, soul, and strength, and love our neighbor as ourself. So yeah, it's it's all about um and it takes reflection. I think I say that every single episode, but it takes reflection and taking a step back and thinking, okay, what am I truly prioritizing? What's what's my goal with this argument? What am I trying to accomplish here? Or am I um trying to give God the glory? Am I am I trying to point others to Jesus? Am I trying to become more like Jesus with that? It's all about your motives. And I think that most of us, if we take a step back at the end of the day, um many of our motives are skewed, um, not only with um with argumentation, but with uh many other things.

SPEAKER_02 14:49

So Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's good. I hadn't hadn't thought of the Barabbas stuff that way. That's pretty interesting. I need to to look at that more. And you know, you mentioned towards the end there becoming more like Jesus again, you know, because I think I think what we'd like to hit on this episode is you know this idea that, you know, what if becoming more like Jesus helped us see a lot of these issues from a different perspective? Um because Sam, you just mentioned, you know, seeing things from this skewed perspective. You just used the word skewed, right? Yeah. Seeing things from this skewed perspective, um, whether it's this desire to be right or um yeah, to to be angry at somebody else, to think we're better than somebody, whatever this skewed perspective is, what if by becoming more like Jesus and showing people who Jesus is, what if our perspective on a lot of these issues changes? So we're gonna continue to get into this in this episode and and and hear us both say, Sam mentioned it a minute ago, Jesus cared. Sam and I care. Sam mentioned finding that balance between not caring at all and caring too much. We're not advocating for this uh, you know, stick your head in the sand and just hope everything works out type of thing, which is how some people operate. Um, and I don't really think that that's healthy either, you know, just completely ignoring the world and saying, oh, I'm just not gonna be a part of it, because the reality is we're here. We're here in the middle of this brokenness. We are people in relationship with other people. We live in the United States of America of America with other people who live in the United States of America. I mean, it's just we're here. We're we're we're in the midst of this. That's unavoidable. We're in the middle of these issues with everybody else who's in the middle of these issues. But do these issues, do these hot button topics have to be the center point of our lives and identity? Do they have to be what we build our arguments around, what we get angry about, what we try to defend, what we judge people about? Again, I don't I don't think so. Um, I don't think so. And and I might be ruffling some feathers by saying that. I don't know. Um but yeah, I don't I don't think so. I don't think that should be the center of what we're basing our beliefs on and what we're getting up in arms about and trying to defend. Um, you've got some more scripture to to throw down for us. Um and you might have more more to share too. So I'll pass it over to you.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

Yeah, yeah, I think that um, like Blake said, you know, um and and I I personally when I look at the ro the world around me, when I look at the pe some of the people that I know, I see a very wide range of over here um we have people that completely like lose their minds, they they let their entire lives be consumed by what's going on around them. Um they lose sight of of what we're saying what's most important, which is Christ. Um and they let the circumstances of of themselves and not only and of themselves in the world determine how they think, what they say, how they act. Um they're they're consumed by it. But then on the other side, we have um almost people that are that are reaching this state of apathy, that are taking it way too far and saying, okay, you know, I just don't even care. I don't I don't care about this stuff. I I'm I'm not gonna be involved, I'm I'm not gonna care about it at all. And I think that is just as unhealthy, like Blake said too, as we were never um called Jesus never said, thou shalt not care, um, right? Um we are we are never called to reach apathy about the people around us, that about what's going on. Jesus said the very opposite that we're supposed to stand up for for for the oppressed, for for the widower. Um we're we're we're supposed to care about those things, but it's it's a difference. There's a huge difference between caring about something and letting it consume you. Caring about something and and giving something your your time and um and caring for other people in the process but then letting it become what's always on the forefront of your mind and letting it ultimately get in the way of your relationship with God and and and your your mission on this earth. Um so yeah, I I just think that um we're not just talking about people that let it that that let it and I myself included, I've definitely done this. Um I'm preaching to myself, letting it consume your every thought, but on the other end of the spectrum, um not caring at all. Re reaching a state of, well, I just don't want to give the n the brain power to this, so I'm gonna remove myself. Because like like said, we're in the world. We're here. And and we're we're we're even if you're not being directly affected by something, somebody is, so we're not at all saying um don't care. Because that's not the message that Jesus taught in the Bible. Oh amen.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

You guys got some scripture? I do.

SPEAKER_00 20:13

This is Philippians 3, 20. This is one of my favorite verses, this is Paul. But our citizenship is in heaven, and we eagerly await a savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ. So as Christians, we live in a country, whether it's uh it's America or or Spain or wherever. We live in a country, but we belong to the kingdom of God. If politics become our identity, then we've misplaced our citizenship. It's all about um I have I have a t-shirt that says, in the world, not of it. You know, we we are we are living right here, right now, but that that does not mean that this is our home and we shouldn't make our identity our we shouldn't make our political beliefs, we shouldn't make what's going on around us, we shouldn't make the the latest news headline what we're placing our identity in, because that is a recipe for utter disaster.

SPEAKER_02 21:05

Yeah. Yeah, that's that's really good. And I don't know. I mean that's that's tough to think about, uh but I think it's really true because even when you think about well, first when you think about God and who he is, like we are so infinitely tiny and small in our issues, whatever they are, whatever yeah, whatever any of the universe's issues are, they are nothing compared to who God is and what our worship of him should be. But even when you look at the world, our part of it, the United States, is such a small part of the world. It's like, yeah, when I when I look at this verse, yeah, it kind of makes me think, yeah, our citizenship is in heaven. And you said we live in a country, but we belong. To the kingdom of God. Like, yes, we live in the United States. But we live in the kingdom of God. Like that's the ultimate goal, the kingdom of God. But even here on earth, like the United States isn't even the whole picture on Earth. So if you are so focused on what's going on here, like that's not even the whole picture on Earth, much less, like the kingdom of God, you know? Like it just doesn't make sense when you think about it to put so much stock in like what's on the news and what's going on. Like, yes, it sucks. Yes, there is so much crap going on, and yes, it it should make you upset and bother you. And am I talking loudly? Yeah, I'm giving a lot of feedback there. Sorry. It should make you upset, and there should be things that bother you. You should care about it, but you shouldn't care more than you should care about proclaiming the kingdom of God and God's loved people, because that is so much bigger than what is happening in the city of Johnson City or the Tri-Cities or the State of Tennessee or the East Coast or the United States or North America or whatever. I mean, it's it's there is so much more than all of that. You know, you know what I mean? I mean, yeah, I don't know. This verse just puts that in in perspective for me. Um anyway, you know, as as as we keep going, let's look at the life of Jesus a little bit and just kind of see the example that he set for us. Because when we look through the Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, that's that's where we see most of the life of Jesus. When we look at his life, when we read through the gospels, we can see that Jesus had a way of being with people without getting sucked into to everything that they were involved in, if that makes sense. Like he was there with them, he listened to them, he empathized with them, he healed them, he performed miracles, but he wasn't in all of the details of their life doing everything that they were asking him to do, um, meeting every goal that they wanted him to meet, going to every rally, uh, fighting for everything they wanted him to fight for. Does that does that make sense? It's like Jesus was there with people, he empathized with people, he showed them God's love, but ultimately he kept the main thing, the main thing, which was showing people God's love. Like that was always the big goal. The big goal was never looking at all these political things and whatever news headline was going on and and being swayed by whatever was making him angry at the time and whatever was drawing his attention. He always kept God's love and showing that to people at the forefront. I don't know, that's kind of the example that I see, and that seems so different to me than what I see people doing today. Like what I see people doing today is looking at all these stories, getting angry about so many different things, arguing about so many different things, and it's just like, what are we doing? You know? Yeah. I don't know. Yeah, it just it just seems so different to me.

SPEAKER_00 25:37

Yeah, yeah, I I think that um you're exactly right. You know, I I I if I'm putting myself I don't want to say putting myself into the mind of Satan, but if if I'm thinking about how sorry. If I'm thinking about um Satan's goal, it's it's to kill, kill, steal, and and and destroy, right? To kill something and destroy. Um Are you No no no? No, no, no, no, no. Um But once once you accept Christ in your heart, you're Jesus', right? You are you b you belong to God now. Um so if Satan can't steal you from God, he's gonna make sure that you can't um spread that message to other people. He's gonna make sure that you um cannot, that you remain ineffective at um preaching the gospel to other people at evangelize and that at leading others to Christ. And the way that he may do that um is distractions. He's gonna try to distract you. He's going to um um put all the this anger in your heart. And your when I say your, I mean mine as well. I've I've definitely felt this before. He's going to keep making these constant negative news headlines popping up um on your phone. He's gonna he's gonna put you in situations where you're being challenged where um, you know, where we're constantly having hatred being spewed at us because ultimately he just he wants you to be consumed by what's going on around you and not take a minute to step back and and remember um just ultimately, like like Blake said, who God is in the first place. Now he's so much bigger than all of this to begin with. And yes, we're in it right now, and yes, it is a big deal, but in this in the grand scheme of things, um, we have the the creator of the universe on our side. And and and Jesus, he's defeated death, he's defeated sin, and that's something to celebrate every single day of the week, even if um the world seems like it's all going out the window to begin with. So I don't know, I I think Satan distracts us with these things for sure. Um and and he he divides us using them. He he divides not only um unbelievers and believers, but he he divides believers against each each other um because he knows um that when the when the kingdom of God is is united then uh they'll make some some waves for sure. They will do some damage for his agenda.

SPEAKER_02 27:58

So Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And you know, I as you were talking about that, just the distractions, it made me think of Jesus when he was tempted by Satan. I doubt that was the only time he was tempted. I mean that's that's the time we read about, but I can't imagine that's the only time Satan tried to t trip him up. I can't imagine he tried once and was like, eh. Oh well, I tried. I guess I'm done now. I mean, I'm sure I'm sure he kept trying. And I I can't even imagine all of the poverty and the injustice and the inequality and the sickness and just I mean, all the things that Jesus had to have seen walking through the streets that he didn't do anything about. He didn't he didn't heal everybody, he didn't have a conversation with everybody. How could he have? He was God, but he was also man. He couldn't he well he wasn't everywhere at once. He couldn't have every conversation with everyone, he didn't have unlimited time, he couldn't do everything about everything. He had to realize I have a limit. What's my goal here? Am I gonna be upset about everything and bothered by everything and try to do all of this stuff? Or am I gonna keep the ultimate goal in mind? I mean, I I don't know. It's just it's really interesting when I think about his life and how he did things and the things that he didn't do so that he could accomplish the big goal of showing people who God was, you know? Because there were a lot of people he had to leave behind and say no to to do that, which kind of sucks. But I I don't know. It's just really interesting to think about that. And when he died, people were upset at him. People wanted him to be that guy, you mentioned it earlier, people wanted him to be that Barabbas that overthrew Rome, that was that uh, you know, let's rise up and you know, bring this army together and and overthrow this Roman government. And then when he didn't, people said, oh, he was just another pretender. Now he's gone. Oh well. And you know, now we know today he wasn't. Um and he was for real. But when people die, but when he died, you know, people thought he was just some other dude. But anyway, you know, I I I think I think the way that Jesus lived his life is is really tough for people to accept today because it's just all about, well, we need to do this, we need to do that, we need to to be thinking about this, we need to argue about that. And to me, I'm just I I again I just I just don't think that's true. I think the most important thing we can do is show people God's love. Cling to Jesus and show people how to live like him and how to show God's love to people. I I really think that's the most important thing that we can do. Um and I don't do that perfectly every day. By no means do I do that perfectly every day. Um But yeah, I think I think that's the ultimate goal. Um Yeah. So anyway, I'll pass it back over to you, Sam.

SPEAKER_00 31:24

Yeah, yeah, I I think that um all those are great points. I I really I liked it when you said um you're talking about how, you know. We are limited as as humans, and and whether you like it or not, and it stinks that we're constantly being flooded with bad news that are it's not it's not only in in the house next door, it's from across the the country. There is constantly bad news that we have to look at. Um and that's just the one of the many tragedies of of social media and and of the internet and what the world has turned into. Um and the internet's great in a lot of ways, but it's also um it just stinks that we constantly have to be looking at that stuff, but ultimately it takes accepting that we cannot change the world by ourselves. We alone cannot save everybody. So why on earth are we letting our every thought be consumed by what's going on around us if we are limited? Why why are we focusing on what's going on in the Middle East if um if we're ignoring the person that's right next to us? Ignoring how we could possibly be loving on them and and and showing them the love of Christ? Why are why are and why I say we, I mean I, why are we so consumed by what's going on hundreds and and thousands of miles away when we're not even a little bit concerned about our own neighbors and our own friends? It just seems like it's all flip-flopped. Um you know, I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 32:54

Yes, I am.

SPEAKER_00 32:58

You okay, Blake? Yeah. It's on you, dude. It's all on me. It's it's it's all it's all on my shoulders.

SPEAKER_02 33:08

No, when you when you said that about yeah, focusing on what's going on thousands of miles away and ignoring the person down the street who's really struggling, yeah. I mean that that hits home for me for sure. I mean, yeah, how often do we do that? We look at our phones and get so upset and angry. And then yeah, we walk out the door and ignore someone who's struggling right in front of us. It's just, yeah, you're right. It's flip-flopped, it's backwards, it doesn't make sense, and I don't think it's I don't think it's how Jesus did things. I don't think it's how he lived his life, it's not how he showed God's love to people. Anyway, um you've got some more scripture.

SPEAKER_00 33:56

Yeah. I have one more, and I've mentioned I mentioned this earlier, um, but but a Pharisee was asking, I think it was a Pharisee, somebody asked Jesus what um the greatest commandment was, and this is Matthew 22, 37 through 39, and this is how Jesus responded. He said, Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it love your neighbor as yourself. If we always have these two objectives on the forefront of our minds, we're gonna be okay. If if we're if if our number one mission in life is to overthrow the government and to save the world, it's not gonna work out. I'm I'm sorry. But as as in and as Christians in specific, um, this is the the the greatest and second greatest commandment that we have to live by is to l number one, love God with all of our heart, with all of our soul, and with all of our strength, and love our neighbor as ourselves. If we are doing that, then I truly and honestly believe that that will have a ripple effect on into every other facet and and area of our lives. And if we're only focusing, solely focusing on that, um, then I think we will become more like Jesus. I I think that um and and once again we can I'm I'm not saying that, you know, the world is helpless, you can't change the world, you can't do good you can't do good in the community around you. That's not at all I'm saying, but um but I am saying um when you let yourself be consumed by the wrong things, and when you get things out of order and you don't have this at number one, um then you're gonna be ineffective. So, you know, it's it's all about um remembering why we're here in the first place, what we're called to do as Christians, number one, and then building off of that and not off of social media, not off of the the the latest news headline, not off of politics or or the current state of the world, but off of God and what he what he's done for us and what he's calling us to do now.

SPEAKER_02 36:00

Right. Yeah, I mean there there's definitely a there there's some kind of disconnect. You know, I was thinking of it as you were talking, Sam. I mean, when you think about the I mean, I don't know. When you think about the billions of dollars and all of the people I think about just the United States, all the people and the money and the organizations that have tried and are actively trying right now to do good things, to bring people out of poverty, to rebuild homes, to help people who are sick, anything and everything you can think of. And the world is still so crappy and broken and messed up. There is some sort of disconnect. It's like, okay, the way we are trying to do this, by our own effort, through money, through what we can do, through what we can drum up on our own, is not working. Right? I mean, that that's what it seems like to me. It's like, okay, we need a different strategy. Maybe the different strategy needs to be we forget about all the stuff we need to do, and we try to lean into God and trying to be more like him. And that seems really backwards. And I know again, that's probably gonna make a lot of people mad. Like, what? We're just gonna and I I don't think that means you stop doing good things and you stop trying to love your neighbor. That's the second part of that's the second commandment, loving your neighbor as yourself. But like you said, if you if God is not at the center of it, it's not gonna go anywhere. It's just not. So I don't know. I mean, there's some kind of disconnect, and yeah, we need more people who are living like Jesus and showing his loved people. I mean, I think, yeah, I mean, I think it's as simple as that. So, what are some practical ways that we, me and Sam, you all listening, what are some practical ways we can show the love of Jesus in a really polarized world today? We'll end with a few practical tips for you all. One, we can stay humble and be okay with being wrong, even if we might be right. So, you know, I think that means uh when we talk about staying humble, you know, being okay with being wrong, you know, to me that means when you are in a conversation with somebody, when you are meeting somebody, when you are um when you're trying to love somebody, even if you disagree with them, even if you think differently than them, putting that aside and deciding, okay, I I'm not gonna worry about that first. I'm gonna worry about them first. I'm I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna be humble enough to say, okay, my opinion on this, their opinion on this, is secondary to showing them God's love. I don't know. I think I think that's a great way to try to maybe interact differently with the people we meet and maybe just kind of reset the way that our culture interacts with each other right now. Anything to add to that, Sam?

SPEAKER_00 39:58

No, no, I think that's good. Just um first and foremost, looking at somebody like a child of God instead of um like another adversary is is definitely um a huge thing to do. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:10

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so stay humble and be okay with being wrong. Number two, give people the benefit of the doubt. You know, I think today, I mean, we have such a tendency to look at somebody, and if if they look a certain way, if they say certain things, if they believe certain things, we automatically go to this, like, oh, here we go. You know, here we go again. Okay, this is uh this is a supporter of such and such, or this is a blada blah blah, or oh man, you know, I can't believe we're going down this road again. Um We tend to do that. I I definitely do that. I judge people based on all of those things. So let's try to give people the benefit of the doubt. Let's not make assumptions based on the initial 60 seconds of a conversation. Again, let's try to look past what they look like or what they might think about something and try to actually see them as a human being who needs the love of Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 41:20

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think, you know, when I when I look at um when I look at my own heart and when I look at my own interactions and my own mistakes, um, I believe that, you know, politics, most of these issues can be can be brought back to politics. Uh and I immediately, as soon as I find out, or that even I've I've I've caught myself in my mind, that's that's one of the main things I'm wondering about somebody is hmm, I wonder which side they they land on, right? Like like that is somehow a key aspect of their identity, like like that, like that matters in in changing how I should view them, which it really shouldn't. It and it it's silly that we've that we've let that we've let ourselves get to this point in in almost identifying people only as either red or blue, you know, as as only on on one side or the other, and um that determining whether we want to respect them as a human being or whether we want to um listen to them at all, whether we want to have a friendship with them. Um it's just it all seems very, very silly and backwards and wicked, honestly. And and that's something that I've fallen into absolutely. So yeah, I I think giving them the benefit of the doubt, ev even if they um have differing beliefs with you, remembering that they're a human being um and and that we are called to love them, um, and that and that some something something like how they think the government should be run should not determine on whether we want to um on how we treat them and on and on even whether we whether we would um, you know, like to be friendly with them.

SPEAKER_02 42:56

So Yeah. Yeah, I agree. So staying humble when you're interacting with somebody, giving them the benefit of the doubt. Number three, conversing with people with the goal of learning, not of proving them wrong. This this kind of goes into the first two. You know, a lot of this is just about um, you know, when you're interacting with someone. And this this can be with someone you just met, or this can be with a close friend or a family member, conversing with people with the goal of learning, not of proving them wrong. You know, if you can go into a conversation and think, okay, what is this person maybe trying to tell me, or what can I actually learn from this person about what they believe or why they think this way, instead of this person's an idiot, I'm going to tell them why they're wrong. I mean, that is the furthest thing from showing them any type of love. I mean, if if you can go into a conversation saying, maybe I'll learn something from this, I mean, that that is a way clearer path into Hey, maybe we can have a conversation about Jesus and how much he loves you. But if you immediately go into a conversation with, hey, uh, let me teach you why you're an idiot. There's no opportunity to show the love of Jesus there. I don't know. That one seems pretty simple to me.

SPEAKER_00 44:19

Yeah, yeah. I and I I believe in once again, I'm preaching to myself right now, guys. I think that um sorry, there was a there was a weird sound. I think that when I look around, everybody instead of pursuing truth, they're pursuing being right all the time. Um and I think that that would help us to avoid a lot of hatred that's being s that's being spewed, a lot of division, um, and a lot of, you know, disagreement. I think that if we were all truly trying to determine what is the truth, what is right, instead of constantly just trying to prove each other wrong, um, then we might find ourselves two land on the same side of the fence um in a lot more areas. So I don't know. I I just I think that if you go into any conversation like Blake said, with the attitude of th this person is wrong and I'm gonna prove them I'm gonna prove them wrong and I'm gonna come out of this on top, instead of the attitude of, you know, I don't know everything and maybe I have something to learn from them, maybe not. You know, if if and and I I've you know, I've I've definitely learned that if I truly think that I'm right and I'm going into it a disagreement with somebody, then I shouldn't have to worry about not listening to them. I should truly give them the benefit of the doubt um and listen to what they have to say. So Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:43

So yeah, staying humble, giving them the benefit of the doubt, trying to learn something when you're talking to them, and then number four, doing your best to see that person the way that Jesus would see them. And this this again, it it ties into the other things we've been saying, and we've we've mentioned this a few times, but seeing people the way that Jesus would see them. You know, uh it when you walk up to somebody, when you meet somebody, if it's a family member, someone you work with, trying to see them as a child of God, as someone who needs the love of Jesus. You know, maybe even starting your day tomorrow and deciding, okay, who am I gonna try to try to see differently today? Who am I gonna see, you know, not as somebody who aligns differently on the political spectrum than me? Who am I gonna see, you know, not as somebody who annoys me because of this, that, or the other, but who am I gonna see as somebody who needs Jesus' love? And and again, this is what this episode has been all about. There are so many things in our world that we can get upset and angry and and defensive, judgmental, all of these things over. But ultimately, I think if we can cling to Jesus, if we can try to become more like him, share God's love as much as we can with other people, that's gonna put a lot of these issues in a different perspective. And I think, like you said, that ripple effect could change the world.

SPEAKER_00 47:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:34

Yeah. Agreed. Awesome. Well, we're right at about 45 minutes. That's where we usually try to end. Um, we appreciate you guys listening to another episode of the Narrow Road Podcast. We will be back in a couple of weeks, the week after spring break. Again, let us know what y'all are doing for spring break. Let us know what you thought about this episode. Let us know if you think we're crazy. If you think we should be doing more politically, should be doing more in the world. Maybe we should know. I don't know. Um, but yeah, just just let us know what you guys think. We love to uh to hear from you guys. Um, but anyway, I think that's it. Alright, y'all. We'll see you in a couple weeks. Alright. Bye.

SPEAKER_00 48:21

Bye.