EV Interest Isn't Just Gas Prices with Andrew Wright

Gas prices passed $4.50 a gallon in Pennsylvania this spring but according to Andrew Wright, that's not what's actually moving EV shoppers like some people suspect.

In this episode of EV Insider, host Scott Case sits down with Andrew Wright, Managing Partner at Vinart Dealerships in the Lehigh Valley, to unpack what's really driving EV demand six months after the federal tax credit expired. 

The conversation digs into the real barrier to adoption — what Andrew calls "refueling parity" — why charging perception matters more than charging reality, and what's exciting about the EV market right now. 

Subscribe to EV Insider for more conversations with the leaders shaping the EV market: https://www.recurrentauto.com/about/ev-insider

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

They can hop in their car in the morning, they can drive to work, even if it's an hour away, they can drive back, plug in, charge up, they're on the road the next day.

SPEAKER_00 0:08

Welcome to EV Insider by Recurrent, where we make it easier to buy and sell electric cars by giving you access to leaders from across the industry. Let's get started.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

Thank you for joining the EV Insider. Um, really excited to hear what your sort of perspective is on the industry and the transition uh coming from where you are in Pennsylvania. But sure, just giving the big picture, you know, is early 2026. We're supposed to be in the EV apocalypse year after the rebates um, you know, ended last year. Like, is that right? What's going on in your market these days?

SPEAKER_02 0:42

You know, there's definitely still interest in the product. And I think that uh, you know, especially with uh the elevated uh gas prices that we're seeing right now, uh EV demand is is definitely ticking up a little bit. So that's encouraging. And, you know, I I think it's a good thing as well because you know, the product is so good, the technology is uh fantastic. I mean, I would argue that it's superior to internal combustion engine technology in uh in so many ways, not only just um the the quality and stability of it, but the uh the driving dynamics and uh all kinds of things like that. Um, but the reality of it is that we're still uh dealing with uh the number one obstacle, which is um which is uh charging infrastructure anxiety, right? I mean, just I think uh as I've been saying uh before, you might have heard me say it on other forums that uh until someone can drive around and see charging stations at WaWaz and all over the place and have comfort in knowing that there is refueling parity with an ice vehicle, um, you know, until that's until that day comes, I we're just gonna struggle uh to garner the adoption rates that we'd all like to see. As far as Pennsylvania is concerned, yeah, I mean, largely this state is um it's not a large EV state. Uh, we have pockets of of EV strength in areas outside of Philadelphia and the suburbs there and in parts of Pittsburgh. But, you know, there's a there's a common sort of refrain that, you know, a lot of people that have been in Pennsylvania for a long time uh have are accustomed to hearing, and that you know, Pennsylvania is basically uh Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, and Alabama in between.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

So, you know, it's kind of a uh that still makes me laugh because I have not heard that as much as you have yet.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Yeah, yeah, we hear it all the time. But um, you know, hey, listen, that's just the reality of uh the demographics of the state.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

You know, you guys are 50 miles from Philly, uh what? Yeah, 90 miles from New York City in that sort of market. Like, what's the average commute? Like, how does that make it a good or bad fit for full battery electric or plug-in hybrids?

SPEAKER_02 2:39

You know, back during COVID, this area uh really started to blow up because we had a lot of people that were leaving the major metro areas. Uh, they were seeking refuge in the in the suburbs. You know, now as we're starting to see work from home beginning to uh to dissipate and become less popular, we're starting to see people commuting more. And of course, because of that proximity and because of the range of so many of these EVs, EVs have become an attractive alternative for transportation, particularly for that daily commuter. I mean, think about it. They can hop in their car in the morning, they can drive to work, even if it's an hour away, they can drive back, plug in, charge up, they're on the road the next day. So I think it's uh it's a compelling uh alternative to an ass uh a nice vehicle. And um, I think we're gonna see increasing consideration in that respect.

SPEAKER_01 3:24

Over the last like month or two since gas prices have spiked because of the conflict in Iran. Like, have you noticed anything different in terms of the shopper interest? Like uh whether that's new on new or used, or like what's what what feels different, you know, in the last couple of months?

SPEAKER_02 3:41

Um, I would say on the new side, there's been uh a marginal uptick in interest. I don't think that the gas price increases that we've seen, uh, I don't think people are confident that they're going to persist. I think there's there's probably an expectation that they're gonna be gonna come back down again. And I think uh I think they probably will. So, but it's still, it's uh, I mean, we'll we'll take anything we can get. So, you know, marginal increase in consideration is a good thing. It's a good thing for the product, and uh we'll go from there. On the use side, a lot of it is being driven by price. And uh, you know, I think EVs offer an attractive uh price point for people that are extremely budget conscious when it comes to uh needing a new vehicle or a replacement vehicle or or things like that. And again, I mean, I think when they couple uh, you know, the the the value of what they get for for buying an EV that was, you know, forty, fifty thousand dollars, that in a in a lot of cases is less than half that price now, the value proposition is tremendous. And then you couple with that, you know, fueling, it's a pretty good package. So, but you have to be open-minded to EV and you have to be willing to consider it. But I think we're seeing more and more people do that for all the right reasons, and the reasons I just I just uh explained.

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Yeah. So Carf Commerce just came out with their Q1 kind of like numbers on uh average price points and average days to turn, and that used EV segment has just been absolutely on fire. So, like the the um average used EV is at 35,000, you know, across the board, with 48 days sort of like hold time, uh, versus the average used ice car uh 29,000, so a little lower, but average of 54 days of time of hold time. And that's actually just as I read that out and look at that report, that's actually really opposite. Usually you have a situation where the lower the price point is, the shorter the hold time is, right? But this is the opposite for the first time. Is that what you're seeing in your in your stores?

SPEAKER_02 5:37

We don't uh we don't sell a tremendous amount of used EVs, and and the the primary reason for that is I don't stock my used car a lot normally outside of my trade-in channels and my service departments. Okay, you know, we do from time to time trade a Tesla and it flies out of here. So yeah, um, you know, you you cited that Cars Commerce uh report. You know, I'd be curious to know within those metrics uh for days to sell and for price points and things like that, you know, how much I I'd like to see Tesla broken out from that. You know, how much how much of those EVs, uh both from a a turn percentage or velocity and and from a price point are Teslas versus everybody else?

SPEAKER_01 6:17

Yeah, that's a great question. I will let's we'll this we'll we'll ask Cars to to comment on this video when when it comes out to to answer that because I don't know what the breakdown is. I mean, you guys have a Hyundai, a Hyundai store as well, right? And you're and and I I actually think that there that is the recommendation I make now is like when people I've gotten two phone calls from friends and family in the last week saying, okay, that's it. We have seven dollar a gallon gasoline here now in Washington State. So it's it's uh like when I when my brother-in-law calls and he's like, he's like, I just found out that when you go to a gas station, that the highest the credit card authorization will work is $200. And I hit that and I had to start a second fueling session. He's like, Wow, I'm out, I'm out, no way, you know. And the recommendation I'm making is they used Ionic 5. Like that's to basically to everyone, it's a fantastic car. And by the way, like those just not on the used side, but then on the new side, like the Ionic 5 sales are up uh 11% year over year in a market where all new sales, all new EV sales are down 30%, you know. So like there's really something opposite going like, what's the what's going on with that car? Why is it why is it doing so well? Well, I would point to two things.

SPEAKER_02 7:30

Number one, uh, Hyundai's built a fantastic product. Uh it's you mentioned it a moment ago, it's a fantastic product, right? Number two, they've done a great job in really incentivizing and supporting that model uh to ultimately transact and sell at the rate that it's selling, and they're fully committed and they're invested, and they've built a plant and they need to keep that plant running. And um I think they really see an opportunity to position themselves as the brand that uh can offer something for everybody. Hyundai's done a fantastic job. I can't give them enough credit for the products that they've developed the last couple of years. Their engineering team is fantastic, their design team is great. I think they really have a good finger on the pulse of what consumers want in terms of capabilities and then the price points that uh they want those capabilities at. So yeah, it doesn't shock me that you made that recommendation or that uh we're seeing the the sales increases that we're seeing with Ionic 5.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Here's the the behind the scenes data-driven view from the recurrent data on what we see for the Hyundai as they age. That I I actually think is like an untold story. So the average Hyundai at three years old, the average Hyundai EV is beating its EPA range by like 20 miles still, right? Like they they the Hyundai was very conservative, I think, in setting their EPA range estimates, and we're seeing at three years is doing better than its EPA still. And then the second is their charging speed is like off the chart. So it's very strong. The average, um, we with the the recurrent way of looking at fast charging speed is like how long does it take to add 100 miles of range at a fast charger? And so the average for the 2025 model year was 16 minutes to add 100 miles of range. Hyundai's average is sitting uh just below 10 minutes. So like like across the board, like they're they're out charging uh Teslas, you know, from a charging speed perfectly.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

They absolutely are. I mean, I I look at uh I look at charging technology and uh I definitely put Hyundai uh at the forefront there. And uh I I think Porsche's doing a great job in terms of what they're offering in terms of uh charging uh speeds and things like that. I mean, obviously now that's a premium luxury brand, but right, fair point.

SPEAKER_01 9:37

I was thinking of the mainstream brands, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:39

But for the mainstream brands, well, Hyundai, I mean Hyundai's charging. I think um the last time I looked, they have some charging speeds that are even beating some of the luxury brands. Yeah, that's right. That's right. So I mean, hats off to them again. I mean, I think it just speaks volumes about uh their capabilities and their commitment.

SPEAKER_01 9:53

The average uh price. So with this, we this is gonna date exactly when we recorded this video, because you know, a month from now it could be different. But the average Pennsylvania price right now is uh four dollars and fifty-seven cents a gallon early May, right? Sure. Um, up from a three dollars and thirty cents uh a a year earlier. Um so at that pricing, a used uh, you know, a 2024, just as an example, 2024 Ionic 5 saves about $162 a month in Pennsylvania, right? That's correct versus a comparable ice car. You know, that's less than my where I am in Washington, but it's still pretty meaningful given that what would the payment on that car be? $400 a month if you bought that used. Like Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

I mean, you have to figure out that.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Is that causing people to really like? I mean, are you able to communicate that well enough to to say look at how how big of a chunk that is of your monthly payment?

SPEAKER_02 10:44

Listen, I think communicating is not a problem. I think it's being receptive to listening and hearing that is the challenge, right? So um, you know, we just have a we just have a we just have a a much bigger job to do, uh, despite our best efforts uh of the last few years of educating people. And um people don't like change, they're resistant to change and um they're accustomed to things and they grow comfortable, right? I mean, that's just human nature. And uh, you know, that's why I go back to what I said earlier about, you know, people that are open-minded, progressive, uh, you know, that lean into technology, that are not afraid to sort of challenge the status quo, you know, that's our ideal uh EV client. But um, you know, again, even those people, the big challenge is it really revolves around just safety, security, and comfort of knowing that if I'm out on the road and I need to charge, I have access to a charger.

SPEAKER_01 11:39

Yeah, so so you brought that up earlier. So let's go into there. Like, what what is your impression of the charging scene in your area of Pennsylvania? Not you know, the Alabama part, right? I don't know if you consider you're the Alabama part or not. We're not well, so some people may be. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so so so Tesla has three superchargers in Allentown, including a 325 kilowatt one that I'm jealous of because I that's faster than I get here. Yeah. Um, are there like char are there any like big charging deserts that um that you kind of feel in the surrounding area that you're like boof, you don't want to go there because you're you're not gonna be able to get there because it's missing a charging station? Or like, where's that more perception now?

SPEAKER_02 12:20

It's a perception issue. Uh well, let me take let me let me rephrase that. It's a perception issue because of the realities that I mean, Scott, think about it. You know, if you drive around your hometown, right? You'll you'll drive around and you'll see a gas station. If you live in a suburban area or particularly in an urban area, but in a suburban area, if you drive around, chances are you're gonna run into multiple gas stations along your journey. There's a comfort level there, right? They're not seeing enough charging stations to give them that comfort. They're seeing the Tesla charging station, they're seeing um, you know, some EV GO stations, they're seeing some Electrify America stations, but nowhere near in the numbers that they're seeing gas pumps. The other the thing I try to explain to them is, you know, when you have an EV, especially if you have charging at home, if you are out and about and you need to charge, you don't need to charge all the way. You know what I mean? So you stop in, you you you hook up to the charger, you sit there for five minutes or whatever, you get enough juice to get home or to your destination, and then you charge you you plug in and charge all the way. But people are so accustomed to going to the gas station, filling up the tank, right? You know, so that's kind of a mindset change that I think some people have a hard time wrapping their mind around. So, again, refueling parity and refueling uh abundance are really, in my opinion, the two impediments now to broader scale adoption, because in a lot of instances, EVs represent a more affordable option than comparable ice vehicles. So, you know, I I don't really see that so much as the impediment, as much as I do see the the concerns about refueling.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

It's so interesting. Like, this is absolutely fascinating that I think that that there is a psychology here, you're right, that that and early on, I mean, I remember like taught having this conversation five years ago, and it was like all the charging stations were sort of in these like back, yeah, it's like the back of the parking lot, you know, you couldn't really see it. And it was like, well, what you really need is you got to put them right up front so it's really visible, highly visible. Yeah. And uh because because people need to psychologically know it's there, even if they're not gonna use it. Yeah, Andy, it's great to talk with you. I appreciate the time.

SPEAKER_02 14:25

Likewise, Scott, appreciate the invitation and uh appreciate the work you're doing.

SPEAKER_00 14:31

Thanks for joining this episode of Eevee Insider. Be sure to like, comment, and subscribe. And we will see you next time.