The Luxury of Water | Jeremy Chen | Barrels and Roots

In this episode of Barrels and Roots, I sit down with Jeremy Chen, co-founder and CEO of Leveto, to talk about why premium spring water deserves a real place in wine tasting, fine dining, and intentional hospitality. 

We get into how naturally alkaline water can cleanse the palate, balance tannins, and actually enhance the wine experience between sips, while also exploring the bigger idea of ritual, presence, and why the smallest details can completely change how a meal or tasting feels. What really stood out to me was this idea that water is not just an afterthought or a filler on the table, but a tool that can elevate flavor, conversation, ambiance, and the overall guest experience in wineries, restaurants, and everyday life. We also talk entrepreneurship, brand building, mistakes, persistence, Napa wine culture, and what it takes to create a product that people do not just consume, but genuinely remember. 

This conversation made me think differently about water, hospitality, wine pairing, luxury dining, and the power of intention in every sip.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Our water is very unique, and I'm sure a lot of water brands probably say that. But uh we have a private spring actually here local in Northern California, and it has this very unique property where it's naturally alkalined. So we have like an 8.8 pH, and as you can take a very basic chemistry class, um wine is a very acidic product, right? It has a lot of tannic acid and tannins, and because of the natural magnesium that's ingrained within our spring water, it's actually able to neutralize those tannins in the wine to allow you to balance out your palate between sips of wine. So, for example, if you're going to a tasting, right, you're going through reserves, you're switching through cabs and Pinot's and Merlot's, and your tongue is getting that, you know, hamburger tongue as they like to call it. It's getting a little grainy. It allows you to keep your palate very clean throughout the tasting. So that's where it shines.

SPEAKER_00 0:55

Welcome back, everybody, to Barrels and Roots. I have an awesome guest with me today. I'm your host, Sean Trace, by the way. Uh, and can you tell people who you are and a little bit about what you do? I'm Jeremy.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

I am the co-founder slash CEO of Le Vito. We are a premium spring water company designed to elevate intentional experiences. So pleasure is all mine.

SPEAKER_00 1:17

That's awesome, man. And like, you know, I I had seen your product is is not wine, and I might have you on a wine podcast, but like that's the interesting thing. Like they're they're they go together in a weird way. And can you talk to me about how your water heightens the experience for people that are drinking wine or other things?

SPEAKER_02 1:35

Yeah. Our water is very unique, and I'm sure a lot of water brands probably say that. But uh we have a private spring actually here local in Northern California, and it has this very unique property where it's naturally alkaline. So we have like an 8.8 pH, and as you can take a very basic chemistry class, um, wine is a very acidic product, right? It has a lot of tannic acid and tannins, and because of the natural magnesium that's ingrained within our spring water, it's actually able to neutralize those tannins in the wine to allow you to balance out your palate between sips of wine. So, for example, if you're going to a tasting, right, you're going through reserves, you're switching through cabs and Pinot's and Merlot, and your tongue is getting that, you know, hamburger tongue as they like to call it. It's getting a little grainy. It allows you to keep your palate very clean throughout the tasting. So that's where it shines.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

Yeah, that's awesome because it's like something people don't think about. I remember um I grew up uh a little bit less uh cultured in the ways of interesting things like that. And I remember the first time I went to a store and I was trying to smell cologne, and they pulled out this. I I had smelled this cologne, this cologne, and I started to notice like it was hard to differentiate things. And suddenly the lady pulled out a bag of coffee beans, and I was just like, what is this? And she's like, Smell the coffee beans, and I smelled the coffee beans, and then afterwards I went back and smelled a cologne again, and I could actually smell it. And the idea was like you're kind of cleansing your your nasal palate, you know, and the same thing for you know, cleaning out everything because if you kind of get overloaded, you know, with something, you can't enjoy it as much. So that makes complete sense to me. Absolutely. But, you know, uh when you are, you know, I mean, this is an interesting thing. As as you grow your brand, and you know, people spend their lives learning about wine, thinking about wine. But, you know, um, how should they be incorporating water and things especially like your water into a tasting session? How how how does that work to to kind of really experience the wine better?

SPEAKER_02 3:43

Yeah, that's a good question. Um, and I'd love to give you a straightforward answer, but I kind of need to take a little roundabout answer to give you a little story of how we even got into the wine world, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:51

Like, I love I love the roundabout answers. Those are the best, man.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

Yeah, that's that's kind of where it all began. Um, you know, we've been around for about three years now, and to be quite honest, you know, open with you and your podcast viewers, it took a long time to get a strong foothold because water is one of those things that no one really cares about. Right. If you think about it, it's always an afterthought. You get served water, what would you like? Water's fine, and you know, no one really bats an eye. Um we thought with a product like ours that's you know very luxury, nice glass, you know, patented, you know, technology with a cap cell coin, we're like, why don't we just strike the Michelin tables? Let's try to get in front of you know affluent people and see where we can grow our brand. And immediately we were shot down because, well, we don't really have a brand and they still don't really care. We're not Aquapana, we're not San Pellegrino, kind of like the big names up there. And about a year ago, we decided to take a pivot and kind of reimagine where we could position our water because it's so difficult without capital, without influence, without strong branding to get into the places where we actually want. Um, we thought to kind of go back to our roots a little bit, if you will, and uh go into Napa. And one of the biggest reasons with that is we found out that winemakers are very intentional with their wine. Every single wine is made differently, every year is different, every, you know, right, every reserve is different. It's all so different. And they can appreciate these fine nuances, maybe a little more so actually than maybe some of these restaurants would within San Francisco, for example. Um, and as we began to talk to winemakers, wine growers, and tell them, and you know, not pitch, right? Just like show them this new idea of, hey, I know when you're back in the the barrel room and you're just tasting and tasting and tasting, you're getting a little drunk, you're getting a little dizzy, you want to make the best wine, but you can't really make the best decisions. Um, try this between sips of wine. And this is how we began to slowly pilot and kind of build a foothold within Napa, where winemakers were realizing, oh, in the backrooms, actually, this is a pretty, pretty interesting technique, pretty interesting product to slot within my winemaking process. So therefore I can, you know, get a better wine score. And as they began to learn that facet is when we started to pivot more into like the front of house, where we would say, Well, you know, some people, some wineries have very exclusive experiences. You have to book, you know, six months ahead, you know, like Ovid, for example, or Realm, they have like twice a year releases. Um why don't we make that as pristine as possible? And if we bring in a product that is so unique that elevates such a particular moment that winemakers already know work, or that winemaker already knows is an effective product, um, why couldn't we do the same for guests who have waited half a year to come here just to taste the best wines? Let's make the best wines taste even better. So that's where it typically sits.

SPEAKER_00 6:34

I I love it, man. And one of the things too that when there's something to be said for this simplicity of of of flavors and tastes, I I had the weirdest, wildest thing, it's like it's actually gotten a lot better. And I do not know why, but for many years I had horrible food allergies. Horrible. And I couldn't eat or drink most anything except for the the worst years. I could eat beans and rice and some veggies, and that was all that my body would let me have. But like it was amazing that one of the things that was um a real treat for me was like really good quality bottled water or sparkling waters. And the interesting thing is people like, isn't it so boring? And one of the things I pointed out to them, I said, what you consider boring for me, I'm able to see uh some of the difference in textures and refinement. And like, like we aren't taught to taste like how different and special water can be, you know, but yet when you have really, I remember the first time one of my my daughters, we we came back to the States and she had some really fresh water from a natural spring. And you know, it was just something that came kind of straight out of the ground and she drank it and she's like, This is good. And I said, Yeah, you know, that's kind of what it's supposed to taste like. She's like, I've never tasted water like that. And you're like, right there that someone says, I've never tasted water like that, it's a sign that maybe we should be doing water better, you know?

SPEAKER_02 8:03

Yeah, that's a really good point. And I feel like I've heard a lot of people have that exact same story, right? People, you go to Taho for the first time, you drink some water from some natural flowing spring, they're like, this is the best I've ever had. But how come when you go into, you know, some fine dining restaurant, they just like throw a lemon in there, right? They just like take the reverse osmosis from the tap, and then you got this like pasty, plastic, you know what I'm talking about, right? It's like this doesn't really.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

I've been to some fine dining restaurants around the world and I was blown away by, I mean, granted, a lot of place uh places offer, you know, really nice bottled water. But I when I'm still anytime that I'm offered like tap water at this fine dining place with like a lemon in it, and I just taste it, and I'm just like, are you for real right now? Like, are you for real? Like this is something that you've incorporated into, you know, this is a you know, a$500 dinner or you know, whatever price point, but you're like, you're giving me this. And it's like it's interesting because you talk about water for people who notice the details. Like, what are the details that most of us miss when we sit down at a table with a great bottle of wine? And why, why is that water important there?

SPEAKER_02 9:12

Yeah, I think this this is probably the most resonant within dining. Um, and in particular the exact moment that you talked about, we like to call it the first touch point, right? You spend all this time and you're taking this time out of your day to go to a nice dinner, for example. And if you think about it, from the moment the guest sits down and is served right water, everyone gets water, right, to the point that a first beverage comes or the point that the first dish comes, there's this huge gap of time that they are not being treated an experience that arguably they should have been. And instead they sit in front of this like lemon pitcher water, right? And then they just have to kind of talk with their buddies or scroll on their phone or wait for, you know, look around the restaurant. But there's just this huge gap there where I feel like if you're a fine dining restaurant man, like you should really take advantage and elevate that moment. And with our product, because it's so complementary with um tasting menus, courses as they start to go through each plate, it refines the palate between each dish. Um, it's a talking point. It's so new, it's a very luxury product, which you know obviously adds to the ambience of the entire restaurant. You get to essentially encapsulate those waiting moments, that waiting time that the guest has and keep them entertained up until the point where you can actually begin your quote unquote full dining experience. And that's I think that's where we shine out the most. And that's our main differential point.

SPEAKER_00 10:34

That's awesome because it's like if you can help something shine. It it's like one of the things that is interesting is that um, you know, I mean, in wine they're always talking about food pairings, right? That's a big thing for wine, you know. But yet what other things are we don't always think about pairing the other things. You know, it's like someone will go all of these great lengths to have uh nice glassware, or you know, you'll have the right, the the right, you know, setting for the table, the right forks and knives, or if you go to like the other day, my wife made me some spaghetti, and uh, and then I was trying to eat spaghetti with chopsticks and a spoon, and I was just like, I need a fork right now, you know, kind of twirl. And I was able to do it, man, because I'm gifted like that, and I've lived in Asia a long time, but it was a different experience than what I was used to with spaghetti, and so it was just something I changed up, you know. But it was like I I was just like, man, I need this thing. And so I went and bought a uh surprisingly, we only have like two forks in my house, which is you know, should it's a Vietnamese chopsticks, man. Yeah, chopsticks, chopsticks and spoons are where it's at. But one of the things too is like I wanted to be able to enjoy that experience in a way that was meaningful to me, you know what I mean? And like I love the twisting of the fork, and that was something that I grew up with, you know. And so um whether it's the right way or not, and I'm not gonna talk about whether I I broke the the noodles before I put them in or not, but you know, it's interesting because the the right sacrilege right there. Yeah. Um, before the first sip, you know, between pores and and when the glass is empty, what are some of the things that, you know, you you talked about that first experience. Um how do you make sure that that first experience is so special? You know, should it be the presentation? Like, are you guys focusing? Is it like with your is it the bottle? Is it the like because that first experience, you know, is it the bottle? Is it the taste? Is it how do you really go about making sure that first experience is just powerful?

SPEAKER_02 12:38

Yeah, that's a good question. Actually, this is a very, very good question. Um, and I'm gonna answer it the way that I believe, which is it's actually neither of these. It's not that the cap is, you know, physicist designed, it's just this like amazing levitating thing. It's not that our glass is hand blown and made one by one. It's it's none of these like kind of surface level things, if you will. It is a luxury product. It is made very, very, very well, handled with care. But I think the main differentiating point here is intention. And this is what I always like to spark on, right? Like our water is a water worth looking at. Great. Why does that matter? It's because it shows that somebody cared to put it in. The same way you talked about, well, why don't restaurants, you know, restaurants are pretty much just upgrading, you know, like glassware or, you know, some of the curtains or putting in new carpet or whatnot. How come this moment, this gap has never been touched? Well, it's because people don't care. And if you show that you care, then the guests can see that this restaurant has intention. And that's how they make a good first impression. That's how they let that first touch point shine.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

I I remember when I was in um college, I was living in in St. Helena, the Napa Valley, and there was a cigar shop on Main Street, and my friend worked there. And I remember when I walked in, like I knew nothing about cigars. And like that was the high point. Michael Jordan was out there smoking cigars, and everyone was like smoking cigars at that time, and it was just like, and I was sitting there trying to learn a new thing and step into a an area that I had never been. And I remember like my friend had worked there for two months, and he sat us down and he went through this whole process. You know, he's like, you know, he the he's like smell it, you know, he's like sniffing across, you know, and like doing all these different things. And I was sitting there going, is this necessary? And he's like, it might not be, but he's like, if you do it, he said there's something in the ritual as well. There's something in this process that is a beautiful thing that if we can start to um I I loved, I'm a big fan of martial arts. I study a lot of martial arts. And one of the things that when I right it's fun, man. It's a lot of fun. And one of the things that for me is so special about the arts is the, you know, it's the the formalities, the the bowing, the tradition, the tradition, when I go to Muay Thai class, everyone, you know, we greet each other in that manner. When I was in judo, you know, it's the you know, you bow to the teacher, you bow to the to the to the shrine of the ancestor, you know, uh uh of the founder of the system. And one of the things to me that like it's that process that makes things special as well. And I I wish that we could bring that process back into the mundane because like it we're talking about water for wine, but like, why not every dining experience having that level of touch to it? You know, like man, I I and I think this is something that in in Asia, the dining experience is more um, I don't know, there's a little bit of a in America, I feel like people still eat to live, but in Asia, people live to eat.

SPEAKER_02 15:49

Oh, yeah, and I mean we could we could have a whole other podcast on this, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 15:53

Right. And you know, one of the things too, like when my wife, when we go in and like there is that experience of that water is just slapped down as an afterthought, you know, this is where if you're thirsty, but like there's something to be said for heightening that experience, which to me is why I was like, I was like, how this is a fascinating conversation to have um, you know, on this podcast. But like I want to ask this too like in your experience, what separates uh, you know, truly world-class, you know, experiences, places that feel world class in hospitality from places that are just just kind of going through the motions, you know? And where does water fit into that gap, you know? Because again, that was like I'm talking about the you walk in a room, slap something down. What makes some place really have that extra thing, you know?

SPEAKER_02 16:42

That's a really good question. Um, you know, I haven't dined in the best dining halls of all time, you know. Like I haven't even been to like Quints or Garidonko in San Francisco. Like, I haven't even gone to these places yet. So I personally don't know. Now I can only assume that what we're doing, because it has traction in maybe two missions are one mission star, you know, slightly under is working, that that would be the general ethos, if you will, of where that water service would fit. Um I think it really boils down to, without using the same word so many times, um, an intentional experience. There are, maybe I'll take your parallel here. I think like in Asia, right, if you're gonna go eat bumbowe, right, at the street stall, okay, you're there for the product. You're there because it tastes good. You're not really there because, well, I waited six months and I can't wait to have the best thing ever. You're there because it is truly, truly a great bowl of food and you're there just for that. If you're in San Francisco, LA, Las Vegas, and you're going to, you know, the house of Prime Rib, yeah, you're you're obviously already assuming that it's the best prime rib in the world, but you're also hoping you kind of get a little more, right? You're like, ah, well, they better like all dress up nice and serve me and treat me like I'm the king of whatever. Um, and I think that's maybe just like a cultural difference with between, you know, America and Asia or Vietnam in this case. And I think because we have that cultural difference of we want to be the best, right? We want to make the most money and have the best restaurant, that we should provide that quality and that level of service that we should, honestly, quite honestly.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

I'm gonna ground on a limb here and people are gonna laugh at me and people in fine dining are gonna throw me under the bus for this one. I I think my greatest experience in in restaurants, and I like we my wife and I travel a lot, we've eaten places around the world, and I mean, and not like you know, the super, super we've had some nice places though. We went to a place that was like a 16-course meal and it was very fancy, but my hands yeah, that was last week, that's what I'm saying. But like my hands-down favorite dining experience was in high school where me and classmates yeah, we went to medieval times and oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:55

Well, they're jousting, right?

SPEAKER_00 18:59

And because there was a couple things, it was a immersion in an experience, and I think that that's something that restaurants have forgotten. Like when you go to like right over here on this, like right down that alleyway, right over there, hands down, is the best. It's not boomboy, but it's boom v, which is like duck boon. And so boom v is like duck boon, and like qijang that sells it over there, yeah, dude. It no one knows about it because it's a small little shop. She could easily have a Michelin star. Like it is that quality level. The food is is that good. But when you go down there, you're eating in this alleyway. You know, you got dudes that have been drinking from the night before that are sitting across the the way. Spawn on the little one-inch high chair, plastic carrot. Still finishing up their beers from the night before, but you know, she serves it in the morning and it's just fresh and it's delicious. And it's that's that's the experience. When you go to medieval times, you know, you're you're there to like watch this jousting and you're like, you got this. Like, I think it's like a quail that you're ripping apart with your hands, you know, like we don't have silverware here. My point being like, there is this adventure, there is this experience around the meal. And I think that that's something that that wineries understand, like to a degree. Like when you go wine tasting, it's not just it's it's this like this experience, it's this adventure, you know? And like you're right, when people are doing that, but I think that the the the flip side is is about like what you touched on earlier, is about that being present. And for me, having those allergies for all those years, being present with a glass of really good water is a powerful thing. And then you're present with this, and then you can be more present with the wine that comes after it, you know?

SPEAKER_02 20:51

Yeah, that's a good point.

SPEAKER_00 20:53

But it's like a zen in the art of water right now. I didn't think we're gonna go this way, but why not, you know? Yeah, yeah. Um you you you've seen Lovato placed alongside reserve flights at top wineries. What does that signal to you about how serious those winemakers are about the full guest experience?

SPEAKER_01 21:11

Hmm.

SPEAKER_02 21:13

Yeah. I think uh it's a bit tricky to answer this because I think as we've talked to a lot of wineries, um, and you're in St. You've you were raised in St. Helena, so you actually know that there's slight cultural differences between Napa, St. Helena, Uentville, Healdsburg, okay? Yeah. They all kind of care about their wine a little differently. And it's it's incredible if you think about it, because it's only just a difference of 30 miles, 50 miles, right? Um, and some people, they always love that, you know, our winery was built. I think you had a podcast about this, you know, our dog's name, and you know, we're the farmers, and this is our story, right? And then some other ones are like, well, we're the bougiest, we've imported the French vines and whatnot. And there's just so many flavors almost of, if you will, like these little gems across the entire. Valley of everyone's doing wine a little bit differently. And to be quite frank, it is a bit difficult to find out where that fits because every winery is just like such a niche use case. Some of them are like, well, we just want them to look great alongside our wines and make our wine stand out. The other ones are like, well, it matches our decor. The other one is like, well, the winery really cares about the water. Like they're so different as opposed to restaurants, which maybe I'm bashing on restaurants too much, but they're there to just serve the same foods over and over again to many people and not care as much as a winery, if you will, about that dining experience. So it's a little, I don't know if this is the best word, but like easier to slot in or provide a value point of where water would be the most effective. So the wineries have been particularly tricky, actually, on the flip side, because while the buying is great and it's a fantastic product, like it's like, how dare you disturb our ritual? You know, like when the guest drives in from the mountains, they have to be greeted with the X, Y, and Z. And if you throw the water, then it'll damage our reputation. They kind of have that little uh mentality, if you will. Some of them do.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

It's so true. And I mean, I think that's an interesting thing with any business, you know, you have to see how what you're uh creating, um, you know, it kind of fits in with what they their ethos, you know. It's since it's this interesting match. But, you know, winemakers obsess over soil, climate, barrels, and time. Do you see a similar philosophy emerging around water with intention, sourcing, and presentation? You know, do you think that we're gonna get a shift like that as well in water?

SPEAKER_02 23:34

Well, that's what we're trying to do, kind of, right? Like we're we're trying to change the perception of water by taking an angle that no one else has taken. There are millions of water brands out there. There's millions of good water brands, you know, some Icelandic waters, some European waters, some Eastern European waters, whatnot. Um, there's also a lot of bad water brands, right? Like Fiji crashed. Um, I don't want to bash on, you know, I don't want to name bash on all these different, different plastic bottle waters. But people just think of water as one thing, which is water is just water. It's there to quench the thirst, it's there to just drink, it's there to just be there, it's there to just have. And even if the water is very good, right? Like there are I've had some really, really good waters. I think there's some like Mountain Spring. I'm I like Mountain Spring, that nice green bottle that we have. It's like up and coming, new with the past three years. I think it tastes pretty good. Um, but their branding is the same. It's that the purity, right? Like we've got this secluded spring and it looks great and drink it and it's healthy for you, right? And actually, that's the same, you know, as you can imagine, that's kind of the same way we started. We're like, well, we got this great water. It took me two years to source through this one wine guy that I talked to who talked to another guy and it's a private label. Oh, it has tons of magnesium. Let's just be like, let's be the neural water. Let's be like that magnesium water that makes people healthy and whatnot. But then you realize that it's still the same. It's still the same as any other brand out there. You're just hoping that one product identity will be the gap that you fix. But when in reality, people don't really care about that, right? Branding is about what you think about. You know, when you close your eyes and you think about fries, why do you think about McDonald's? You know, when you close your eyes and you think about ketchup, why do you think about Heinz? It's because their brand is strong. And it's because they believe in something that is not productized. They don't say, well, McDonald's doesn't say like we've got the best fries, right? They deliver the fry experience, right? We don't have the best water, right? We deliver the water experience. And I think that's truly how, and especially kids now love experience more than maybe previous generations. I think that's how you will really end up scaling a brand in the future.

SPEAKER_00 25:37

I love that. Well, you know, it's interesting too because um you're you're thinking about this, you know, it's great, great business lesson figuring out to how to fit into that place that this, this, this product needs to fit. But, you know, it's interesting too because it's needed. You know, it it's a very much a needed product because, you know, when people are dealing with palate fatigue over the course of a multi-wine tasting, um, are are there any things that you've learned uh or any feedback that's been given to you about how your product can help that for palate fatigue in particular or for palate fatigue? Or just to enhance the wine tasting experience?

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Yeah, I think just, I mean, we actually have a whole technical document written out. We did a lot of research with winemakers on how to best slot in Levito water with, you know, Chardonnays or whites or reds. There's different amounts of water. We should serve our water at this particular temperature. And in the end, without getting, you know, all snobby and wall wine-like, it's just how do we make the gastronomical experience better, right? Like how do we have them experience the notes better? It's like your cigar thing, right? Sure, you can sniff it across and maybe you'll get the different things, or you could just smell it head on and maybe you get one note. For wine, obviously it's the same thing. How long you let it sit, how you if you do your little aerating, right? But the water just makes those things more apparent, right? Not everybody is a wine snob. Maybe some people are trying wine for the first time in their lives and they just don't know. And it's not to their ignorance specifically, it's it's up to the winemaker, you know, the the person pouring their wine to show them how to best experience it. And having something like libido is a tool for them to present the best experience. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

It makes total sense. I love the idea of having a tool and a toolkit, you know, and and I think that that's the thing that I think speaks to um wineries as well. You know, when they go in and they're trying to give someone not a cheap experience, too. Some of these tastings are, you know, are very premium. And I think that if you can give people the best experience, I think that speaks to something because like medieval times, man, uh, you know, it's all about the experience. And I think that you give people tools to enjoy something, you know, you've got this, um, you've got your your nice glass, you've got, you know, all of the other things that they're doing at the tasting. And to be able to complement that with, you know, a great water. I mean, think about like if you're gonna not gonna hate on them, but you know, you go to a uh uh a wine tasting and they you get some cheese and crackers on the side, right? You don't want, you know, you don't want writs, you know. I mean, like, you know, I'm not gonna label like still sitting there.

SPEAKER_02 28:20

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_00 28:22

You know what I mean? Is you're like, wow, okay. Um, you know, you want things, the toolkit that make it like the best experience you can have. Because one of the things too is like when when my wife and I went out to that restaurant the other week, um, it was fancy for us. Like we've eaten at nice places, but it's because we're intentional about it and we'll set aside money and we're like, this is something fancy we want to do, because we're not always fancy people, you know? But like at the same time, the reality is that it's still a special thing for me. I wish that I had the money that it was an everyday thing, but no, I'm not there, and I'm probably not gonna ever be there. But you know what? The reality is is that I am very happy to be able to, when I do enjoy things, have that full experience, you know, and and to let it be special. Like if I am going to eat at a noodle cafe in in in in Saigon or in Bangkok, man, I want to be in there and like having this full authentic experience, you know. And I think that just having that that powerful experience, like I don't want to look off to my left and go, oh, you need to cleanse your palate. Here, you know, someone busts open uh uh, you know, some uh, you know, some just Costco water, you know, that's not what I'm looking for. And I think that that's kind of like I love what you're saying. And I I think the experience is so important, but like, um, do you like one of the things too is like you had talked about the the quality of your water being more like uh naturally alkaline? Is there anything else that makes for an ideal like neutrality for water when paired with wine? Because it's like um, you know, I've had water of all different flavors, and sometimes the flavor, it's it's weird, like even from high-end waters, there's like some different flavors in there. Uh is can the water ever be too minerally or or or or or like too flat? You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 30:24

Yeah, no, absolutely it can. Um, and I'm not a water sommelier by any means. I know they exist out there. Um, and without getting too you know in detail with the mineral content, uh essentially what makes up the taste, if you will, of water is the TDS, so like the total dissolved solids. And every water, natural water, should right, have a different TDS number. And higher number doesn't mean better, lower number doesn't mean better, it just means there's more minerals within the water. Um with Lovito, we've sourced hundreds of springs across the states, and they're all different. And I hate to say that we're just lucky, um, but sometimes you just get lucky. I think we were pretty fortunate to find a local spring that does have a TDS that is able to solve this palette neutrality issue because there are a bunch of other ones that are quote unquote better or costed more to ship over that didn't do the same effect that we had. And when we were just starting out, we're like, well, we need to solve a problem. What's the one problem we can start with? At least we had an anchor of a very unique water with a particular identity, you know, local value prop, great TDS, palette cleansing, wine pairing, that we could at least kickstart and begin our journey, you know, into the wine world, into the restauranting world.

SPEAKER_00 31:37

So I love that. I didn't know there was there were water experts out there, but it makes complete sense, man. But that's actually rad. Like I think that that's probably one of the most I I gotta now like go and find one of these people to interview because that's just where and I now have so many questions on my mind. But it's interesting too because um, you know, it's interesting because again, going back to tools, and I love that you, you know, you came in with that idea of uh of providing people another part in their toolkit. Because I think that in life, you know, if you are gonna be a business person, you know, there are certain things you need. You probably need a smartphone, you probably need a laptop or tablet of some sort, you probably need in whatever experience you're looking at in life, um, you have the certain tool set. Yeah, I my friend was a chef, and I mean, his, his, his, his knife set that he would roll up and take home every day and then come to work and unroll it. Dude, it was it was an essential thing. And I think that the in more areas of life, if we can look at what are those things that help us do our that task better, it's a powerful thing. And I I don't know, I just wish we had more care put into all of the things that like our our our experiences, you know. I I was going to, we went to a an amusement park recently, and like it was wild the care that went into the design and the outside stuff, but the inside experience felt hollow and flat at so many levels. So yeah. If if you were to go back and and to try to um give yourself some advice as you were getting this business started, what what what things might you tell yourself to really focus on as you were growing this this business?

SPEAKER_01 33:31

Oh man. What would I focus on? Um what would I focus on? It feels almost like a trick question.

SPEAKER_02 33:44

I think, you know, I probably wouldn't go back and tell myself to do things one way or do things another way because now I know that doing the other way is better. I think there's a lot of value in making the mistakes that are bound to happen so you are able to make the changes to become the better, you know, business owner entrepreneur, for example. Um, I made a lot of really bad mistakes in La Vida. We burned tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars, like sourcing the wrong things, having shipments break, you know, like it's all gone bad, right? There's a whole bunch of very, very poor decisions that I've made. But I think without those decisions, we wouldn't have gotten to the place that we are now. We wouldn't have learned to pivot back into Napa, pivot back into SF, change, you know, like all these various pivots that we did for a business to succeed, um, we never would have made. We probably would have just given up, you know, like me and my co-founder. We're we're getting bankrupt, and what do we do? We should just uh, you know, call it. But I think the one lesson, if I could answer your question, or the one thing that I would tell myself is it is 10 times harder than you will ever think it is. You know, the beginning, you have this golden dream, and you're like, well, I'll just start a business and I'll build a great brand. Everyone's gonna love it. It's gonna be that easy, but it's never that easy. And once you think it's getting better, it's still not better. And once you think it's getting better, it's still not better. Um, and I think the persistence and the discipline is what you need, especially within entrepreneurship. I I strongly believe this more than any other job that I've had. Uh, that's probably the most difficult lesson to teach. It's that when things get difficult, it's actually a good sign because it means something good is about to come and you just need to stick with it.

SPEAKER_00 35:20

I love that. I love that. And and I think that, you know, right, as I've been growing my business, man, you put in the hours. And there are decisions that you make that you're like, wow, that was that was not right. But I think going back to the like joint, enjoying that fine glass of water, enjoying that fine glass of wine, it's about finding that present moment, going, well, how can we, how can we still sit here in this and enjoy the process, you know? So it's always a fun journey. Where can people look for your product or to find out more about you and what you're creating?

SPEAKER_02 35:54

Yeah, so you can visit our website, libidowater.com. Um, this year we're starting a new program. So it's called a palette pilot. Essentially, we have specific allocations for restaurants and wineries across Northern California. If you're interested, we have a form. Feel free to reach out and we'll share some more details with you there.