Napa’s Gilded Gatekeeping | Mallory McEligot | Barrels and Roots

I sat down with Mallory McEligot, the force behind Bang Wine Country, to pull back the curtain on why the wine industry feels so inaccessible right now. As a fifth-generation local, Mallory saw the literal roots of the valley before it became the high-end Rodeo Drive of Northern California. We explore her journey from cocktail waitressing at the iconic Balboa Cafe to being trained by a Master of Wine at just 18, and how those connections inspired her to build a massive networking ecosystem that thrives on genuine referrals.

The conversation gets real when we dive into the industry downcycle. We challenge the current obsession with prestige bottles that alienate younger drinkers and discuss why the refusal to offer entry-level experiences is basically a business death wish. Whether you are into creative production or finance, there are major parallels here in how businesses must meet people where they actually are. This is about the hustle, the history, and the human connection that keeps an industry alive when the bubbles finally burst.

What was your "aha" moment with a specific drink or hobby that made you realize it was a serious passion?

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

I think it's a real injustice to wineries to be so helbent on not necessarily the hospitality effort of trying to sell your product, which and just thinking that, oh, our Cabernet is so special, this vineyard is so special. We don't need to focus on anything else. This is going to completely sell itself. We're going to make people pay$300 to come taste it. And we're going to not refund their fee when they buy a$1,500 three-pack. It's asinine. It's offensive. And honestly, it's not what I want to be a part of, like in the industry. And I feel like we're going to go largely away from that, hopefully, because in Napa Valley, we weren't created as an institution of all$300 bottles and$200 tasting fields. We have a mirage of winery experiences and wines for a reason. However, you have all these really wealthy investors coming in. Look at us. We're so cool. Look at us. We're making$300 bottles. Like it's silly. It's silly. And to be honest, I think that it's part of the reason why we're here today in this kind of downturn. It's a really weird time that we continue to push a narrative that clearly isn't working.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Welcome back, everybody, to Barrels and Roots Podcast. Uh I'm your host, Sean Trace, and I have an awesome guest with me today. If you'd like to tell people who you are and what you do.

SPEAKER_00 1:38

Absolutely. I am Mallory McGillagott, and I am the founder of Bang Wine Country. We are a networking organization that started in 2014 and is essentially a combination of about 100 maybe to 200 businesses throughout Napa and Sonoma. We host networking events to get people together, to connect and be able to taste each other's wines, be able to see each other's properties, and most importantly, refer each other guests in the kind of strange times that we're in. Personal referrals are hold their weight in gold, basically.

SPEAKER_01 2:19

We have to start somewhere, right? Well, how you know we had so many, like we were diving in a cup for like some good conversation even before we started rolling. And I want to I want to back up. Like, how did you get into the wine industry? Like, how did you start down this path?

SPEAKER_00 2:36

Yeah, I mean, it's funny, my parents did not drink at all. I had born and raised an app of five generations. I come from a cattle ranching family. Um, my grandfather was kind of well known for buying a lot of land and in the early 70s and 80s and selling it off um to bittners that were coming in to start making wine and start wineries. And so um I'm fifth generation born and raised in Carnero specifically. And basically, my family, our homestead was Artes Winery. Um, so Artessa winery, you've probably heard of, I'm sure it's distributed where you live. Basically, Artesa was where my uh grandfather was born, my great-grandfather was born, and um my mother spent her childhood growing up there. And then they moved about five minutes away down the street uh to Old Soma Road, and our uh current homestead is there. So we're right in SmackDown, Little Carnero, and um I've always held Carnero's very near and dear to my heart. And that's kind of, you know, when the wine industry came calling in 2010. Um I had been working for the Plum Jack Group already for a number of years, since 2004, uh, at their restaurants and hotels, the Carneros Resort. We had mentioned I worked there for a number of years and then moved to the city, um, San Francisco, for anyone who's not familiar with the city. Uh, and I worked at the Balboa Cafe, which is a very famous kind of hub that was originally purchased by Gavin Newsom, our lieutenant governor. So Gavin, founder of the Pump Track Crew, um, I basically, as a 21-year-old, was cocktail waitressing and waitressing at this hub of politics um in 2007 and six and eight. And basically um did that during college, came back and uh immediately from the restaurant industry. The perfect transition, of course, after getting my education was going into wine. And I was pushed into the restaurant industry to begin with by my parents, who were like, that is a great industry to be a part of as a young person. It's gonna get you a lot of great skills that you can apply to so many other careers. So, you know, that's what you should be doing as a 16, 17, 18-year-old. Um, and that's what I did. And then as I graduated, it was time to, you know, move away from that and done that for about six years. Um, I started working when I was 15 at a pizza place here locally. So I've just always um been a worker and have enjoyed working and making money and kind of you know had that entrepreneurial spirit very early on. And um I in 2010 when I graduated college, I moved back to Napa and um I worked for a very interesting company called uh Wine Leverage, which is a basically company that calls you and tries to sell you wine over the phone uh and is a broker for other wineries, kind of in a DTC model. And to be honest with you, it was like very cutting edge at the time because there were only two companies doing it. And so I went to work for them for about six months, and then right after that, um, I got picked back up by uh a winery for the first time, Mahoney Vineyards, uh, which used to be Carnaros Creek Winery that had been in the Napa Valley since the 70s, and actually Carnaros Creek, uh, the original owner, Francis Mahoney, purchases the property from my family. So it just full circle kind of I was always maybe meant to work in wine at some point. Um, and now I work very much for myself uh supporting the wine industry, which is honestly the best part getting to support and you know enjoy it from afar.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

It's wild that your family was had roots that were so deep in the area selling these properties to these wineries. And like the the the cattle rancher, we have this weird family like um uh similarity. Like my great grandpa uh and great-grandma were cattle ranchers and they were from Arizona, and they were moving out, they were looking at buying out in LA, except they didn't buy in LA because my grandpa was going and looking at that land. And this is like there will be time, blood time, you know, like Daniel Day Lewis, you know, coming on prospecting in LA, and LA still wasn't anything. And he had this chance to buy all this land out near this one region, and he's like, it's too much oil on this land, I can't farm. And so he didn't buy the land, and it was like the land was Signal Hill. I was like, oh my goodness, if my family had to bought Signal Hill, we'd have been a whole different story. We'd have been like, hello.

SPEAKER_00 7:29

Uh wouldn't be there, cracking.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Yeah, right. I would be some I wouldn't, I wouldn't exist. Like, let's be real, wouldn't even exist. But one of the things that's that's interesting there from what you're talking about is um, you know, the roots there. And that was like one of the reasons that I started this podcast. The whole idea of barrels and roots is to to look at the roots isn't like the vine roots. It's the people that have been in this industry, the roots of the people that have like been a part of it. Barrels represents the wine, but the roots, everyone's no one's asked me about the name yet. So I'm like, I'm gonna use this opportunity to talk about the name. Um barrels obviously represents the wine, but the roots represent the people because you know I the the roots of the vines are important, but so are the people. That's why I wanted to talk to the all the different types of people that work in and around wine. And it leads to kind of my next question. Like, you know, you talk about this story and but was there before wine became your career, was what was your first real like, oh wow, moment with wine? You know, something that made wine feel like more special.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Um working at the uh boonfly, um, when I was 18 years old and came from a family that did not drink wine, had no wine stored in our home, uh, my parents did foster care for 20 years. So there was never any alcohol in our house. So I didn't have that connection and that pool. And so when I went to work at the Carnerois Resort, I was really um very in a, I was in a very special moment where um I was actually trained by master of wine, Gillian Balance, who was the sommelier at the World Trade Center, um, at the restaurant that was on top of the World Trade Center. And that's where she started her career. And so she came, started working with Plump Chat Group, and was the kind of sommelier for the Plum Chat Group. So when I was an 18-year-old, knew nothing about wine, had no reason to be in her presence, um, I was trained by one of the best people in the wine industry at that time, um, just because of where I was, what job I was doing, and who I was working for. And so that alone, having that experience of um, of course, I wasn't able to drink the wine, but we would go through these very classic tasting experiences where she would bring out a plate of different, you know, kind of tasting inhibitors, so like lemon and salt and mango and just different herbs and things, and have you taste the wines and have you, of course, then taste whatever the item was on the plate, um, and make that connection, mind-body connection with wine. And so that I would say was one of the first moments um where I just started to really understand it. And then I would say one of the wines that um made me kind of fall in love with wine. And very early on when you know I was tasting, not drinking, obviously, this was prior to being 21, um, was uh a Pinot in Carneiros uh called Bosuji the Shop. And um, it was just, you know, being a young person, getting to taste a lot of different wines. It was that one vintage of that one wine, that like a ha moment. This is so beautiful, this is so unique. Um there's just, you know, something you can't explain, or it's like on the tip of your tongue, right? And so that was one of those wines for me in the very beginning, after having that training from Jillian, and really just that training that I don't want to say that isn't available now, because I'm sure there's a lot of training that happens at, you know, all of these different restaurants and hotels and wineries that we all work with. But um, I definitely see, you know, a training and passion connection that could be a little bit more intensified kind of in the industry now where we're at. But that's also me probably being 20 years past that, and then seeing people that are young, and you know, it's it probably was very similar. Like there was only individuals that were really into it versus the masses, where it felt to me like everyone was into it at that time.

SPEAKER_01 11:54

That's interesting. I think that there's so much information out there nowadays that people are getting scattered. Let me explain what I mean with that. I had this one guy who came on my podcast, and he was a master, he he did makeup for everything. He was an Oscar-winning makeup artist and like prosthetics and like doing like stuff like you would see in in The Hobbit and things like that. Like he did Lord of the Rings, he did a bunch of stuff. It was amazing the stuff that he was making. Now, when he started learning about makeup, he there was no classes near him. He had to drive across town to get a, you know, and then to this place, he got a book, and then he looked, you know, there was no online, then he read up about this place that was a couple towns over that they could do some classes, he would drive there. And then he just kept digging and deeper and going deeper and going deeper, and he started to learn more and more. And when I talked to him about that, would he say I said, Would you prefer to do it the same way again? He's like, No way. There's so much more information available now. But he said there is a problem though, too, because people don't know how to go deep. They don't know how to deep dive into something, you know. Uh, so you can go online and have Chat GPT tell you what, you know, different red should taste like, right? Well, you know what? I promise you, AI's never had wine before. Like, again, like, you know, and like versus you sit there and you go and you know, go old school and try a hundred different types of red wine and sit there and start putting together tasting notes. And I'm not saying it has to be like whatever someone else tells you, but like getting your own perspective on things and having someone there who can guide you on that path. You know, there's something to be said for that.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

Well, like you said, I think the scattered aspect, right? Like we are in such a different world than when I started in wine only 16 years ago, which is not that long ago. But at the end of the day, in 2010, I got my first iPhone, right? Like or maybe maybe it was a little earlier. No, I think it was 2010. I feel like it was when I graduated college, I got my first iPhone. And, you know, maybe it was two years into Facebook at that point. I learned about Facebook and Instagram in college. Like it wasn't like, oh, I already was supposed to know those things. I learned about those things in college. So completely different world. Um, you know, I think the idea that you have to put effort into something, and it's not just right at your fingertips is completely representative of, you know, probably my generation, you know, born in the 80s, and then, you know, maybe still somewhat into the 90s. But um, yeah, I I mean there's so many things that I can remember doing that I wouldn't even think of doing now. There's a concept that got I was taught very early on, which was work smarter, not harder, very early on. And and of course that's always helped me a lot, but there are some things that you just have to do manually. And one of those things is selling wine. Wine doesn't sell itself, it really doesn't, even if it does get to a point of selling itself, it's still it's not selling itself because it had to get to that point. So there had to be selling along the way, or then it now sells itself, right? So I think that there's a lot of um, you know, mystification in the wine industry that you start a brand, you come to Napa, and you'll be able to sell it because you're here. And that's just so far from the truth. I mean, yes, you can come here, you can have a great location, um, you can have the right people, you can have the right views, but you still need the person to talk to the person and to evoke an emotion in that person that gets them to want to buy that model.

SPEAKER_01 16:19

I uh I love what you're saying. I had a guest come on recently, and like he was saying, you know, so many people have that field of dreams. Kevin Costner, if you build it, they will come. That shit doesn't work in real life, you know. There have been so many people that built things in so many areas of life, and it doesn't happen. Like, and this is one of the interesting things. How do you share something that is like the other day? I am I I I my team, we were just going getting ready to go on holiday, and it's the uh the lunar new year here in Vietnam where I'm at, like where my team is based. And so we're getting ready to go on this holiday. And one of the things is I I opened up a bottle of wine for my team, and I was like, all right, guys, we're gonna enjoy this. And it was a company that I loved, it was the wine that I normally love, but this this year, this vintage was not good, it was not tasty, and so I poured it for all my team, and I was like, you guys are gonna love what I'm pouring for you right now because you're gonna enjoy wine, and none of them are wine drinkers, you know, and so I poured it for them and they were just like, the hell is this? And I was just like, Yeah, that's pretty rough, man. And uh, no, it was alcoholic, right? Um, but it was interesting because they they that experience, like they were like, I wanted something sweet, and I should have picked something that was a little bit more easy for them to ease into. And like that's what a salesperson has to do. A salesperson has to meet people where they're at and figure out how do you bring them in, you know?

SPEAKER_00 17:58

Absolutely. Well, like wineries, for instance. I admittedly love white wine. Like I am a white wine fan. I will drink white wine all day. That is my favorite wine, and it could be Sauvignon Blanc, Chanin Blanc, Alberino, Vermutino, Chardonnay. I prefer Sauvignon Blanc, but I could drink it all. I love it. But if I go to a winery as a person, as a wine professional for over 16 years, if I go to a winery that doesn't have a white wine, like it kind of just pisses me off. Because, I mean, honestly, who are you? I mean, sure, yes, you make these amazing cabs. They come from your estate property. That's awesome. Um, however, and yes, we all hope that we're gonna get that whale buyer that's gonna come and buy 20 cases of your one estate cab. I think it's a real injustice to wineries to be so hellbent on not necessarily the hospitality effort of trying to sell your product, which and just thinking that, oh, our Cabernet is so special to vineyard is so special, we don't need to focus on anything else. This is gonna completely sell itself. We're gonna make people pay$300 to come taste it, and we're gonna not refund their fee when they buy a$1,500 three-pack. It's asinine, it's offensive, and honestly, it's not what I want to be a part of, like in the industry. And I feel like we're gonna go largely away from that, hopefully, because in Napa Valley, we weren't created as an institution of all$300 bottles and$200 tasting deals. We have a mirade of winery experiences and wines for a reason. However, you have all these really wealthy investors coming in. Look at us, we're so cool. Look at us, we're we're making$300 bottles. Like it's silly. It's silly. And to be honest, I think that it's part of the reason why we're here today in this kind of downturn. It's a really weird time that we continue to push a narrative that clearly isn't working.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Right. In my opinion. One of the I I I love what you're saying because one of the things that I've been trying when I grew up in the Napa Valley, the most of the people that I knew, the winemakers, were not pretentious. Like they were really awesome, cool people. But when I've gone back to visit my hometown, the place that I thought that I it has changed. Like, you know, so many local shops have been pushed out. I I remember like there was a video shop on Main Street, St. Alina, that was just like this dude that sat in there and had these little videos, and you know, he had cassettes and DVDs, and we'd go in there and rent movies. That business couldn't exist there now, you know. And I I wanted to get my my wife forgot uh a jacket, so we flew when we flew back, and I was like, well, let's let's go. Um there's some places on Main Street, like you know, normally there's some cool stuff. And I was like, Man,$2,000 jackets, like wow, you know, and I and and not hating on that, dude. There's a place for that, but like the entire Napa Valley doesn't need to be Rodeo Drive because there's a problem when you start doing that. When you hyper focus on one segment of the population, you cut off a huge group of people that can enjoy your product. You know, it's like it's really like let's look at this. I want to spin a little bit because because this is something that rich people understand. Like, so I'm talking to you rich people right now, super, super wealthy people that are in the wine industry that want to like get in here. Guys, I I have a money podcast, and one of the core principle principles of finance, of money, is you have diversification. You don't put all your eggs in one basket. So, like if you get a dude who's like sitting there going, I'm gonna invest everything in Bitcoin, that's some stupid shit because you want to have a little bit in this, a little bit in that. But Napa and the entire industry has put all of their eggs in one basket. And the problem is, is that basket is not drinking or they're getting old or they're just not showing up anymore, you know?

SPEAKER_00 22:22

There's too much in it. Like you said, the scatteredness. Like, how are you going, you know, you get your email blast from your collection, from you know, whatever it is, scarecrow, screaming eagle, the mentality for these people that are in their 70s that like, hey, buy this, you know, six-pack and don't drink it for 20 years when you're dead in the grave, that it'll be ready. That's them. And I I mean, we've been doing that for years. Granted, that 16 years ago, boomers say that are 65 were 50. So, you know, their spending power was a lot different. And they had that longevity to be able to age the wine, enjoy it. And I'm not against, like, don't get me wrong, we have a lot of wine saved. We love bringing wine out for any occasion. And, you know, personally, I love to host and have people over. So I love that. Like, I don't have to worry, like stocking wine and having wine stocked in my house, like an inventory of it, that's just a normal thing. Like, oh, I've got my rotor club shipment coming up. I need to add six bottles. So I've got my case of bubbles so that, you know, if someone comes over and we need to celebrate something, I've got a bottle of bubbles ready to go, or I've got my, you know, Sauvignon block for my desire to drink that. But like, I think there is, you know, such a um a wide variety of beverages out there these days that weren't around even 15 years ago.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

And I I I want to frame this as something because like, and this is the tricky part because I get business. Business is business. And I know people want to invest and they want to get returns. But the problem is, is that, and I'm not complaining about high-end wineries. Dude, I love what you're doing. I love their wine. I think that we we need to make stuff like that. But we also have to have people that are like looking at how you can bring everyone in. Because maybe I'm not at the place that I can afford one of those wines right now, but that doesn't mean that I don't want to learn about it. That doesn't mean that I don't want to aspire to having one of those bottles. I remember that I was uh I was like in college and I was working at Meadowwood in the summer, and some dude busted out a bottle of screaming eagle, had one glass, and then was like, Oh, I'm done. And then he was like, You guys want this? And I was like, Yeah, yeah. And I mean, I I went and me and my friends, we polished that bottle off, and we got to enjoy it. And it was wonderful, and like it was one of my favorite bottles of wine. It was amazing, you know. But that's being said, like, I then said, Well, what can I do to start working in that direction? You know, I would love to have one of those again someday. But like, right now, where can I go? And I think that's where my thing is with if as the wine industry is looking at all this stuff and trying to bring people in, you have to meet them somewhere. And I think that that's one of the challenges. And I see this like it's not just the wine industry. Like, I have a money podcast, like I said. And the same thing happens to personal finance. Like, no one's talking to the people that are like Gen Z. No one's saying, hey, let's let's figure out how to help you invest. Everyone's like, we want to talk to baby boomers because they have a lot of money. But the problem is like when you do that, very soon those baby boomers are gonna be, you know, gone. And where do you go from there?

SPEAKER_00 25:57

We inherited um a stock portfolio. Uh, my husband and I, a couple few years ago, we took care of his mom. She had to mention, we were caregivers for a number of years. And when she passed, we inherited all these financial things that maybe we should go on the podcast and talk about these and what that looks like when you inherit, you know, a portfolio, if you will. And um the person who managed her stock portfolio is one of our neighbors, and he's the sweetest man ever, but known for only, you know, taking care of people who were wealthy and had a certain amount of money. And that was gonna kind of, you know, certain things were gonna happen and it wasn't gonna be that big. And it was like, will you still help us? And so it's just so interesting to even have, you know, a an already managed account come to you, but you know, knowing that you're not, you don't have all these other assets to add to it, and being in a position of like, that's so intimidating. I couldn't imagine someone younger than me having to kind of understand, you know, like how do you even get to that point to then talk to someone that would manage your stock portfolio or have a stock portfolio? And I have that, but am I going and making trades individually myself? Uh no, but would I love to? Absolutely, because you see people doing it all the time. And it's just about having the confidence. And I feel like there is a lack of training and a lack of confidence. And definitely, you know, going back to your kind of claim earlier about how do you get people in that aren't at that level and start them off. And, you know, kind of shameless plug, but um I will say I'm very proud of my husband and his team. Um, he's the director of operations for Reverie Winery and Air Winery, which Reverie's been around for 20, 30 years at this point. He's worked for them for 17. And he facilitated and helped the original owner of Reverie sell to Grant Wong Jr., who is the founder of Air Winery and now the current founder and owner of Reverie Estate Winery. So Grant, young guy, grew up here in Napa, literally down the street from my husband, where we live now. Um, they knew each other since they were eight years old. His parents, he wasn't coming from this billionaire, you know, amount of money, if you will, or big pot of money, if you will. He was just a, you know, kid that yeah, came from an established family that had like the means, but at the same time didn't own a winery, weren't in the wine business. He wanted to get into the wine business, become a winemaker, and he made it happen. And he now owns two wineries and did it all by himself without investors, without outside money, with literally a team of individuals who all grew up here and were born and raised here. And what I love about it so much, and this kind of a two-point, a two-part story, because kind of the whole, you know,$300 bottle thing, not having like entry-level wines as part of your portfolio and only starting at the top, you're like cutting your feet off before your legs can grow. Like it just doesn't make sense. And with Grant, their brand started with everything being under$100. They only just recently elevated their reserve cab to be$125 a bottle. Like, oh, where I I can remember working at um uh I worked for Pfeiffer Papit and Switchback Ridge about 10 years ago. And they made beautiful wines. And one of the things I was running into coming from the Plumpjack group that had all of these very high-end reserve wines mixed with estate wines and a price point of probably 100 to like 400. When I went there, all of their wines were$100. So all these clients I was bringing over from Plumpjack that were used to paying$250,$300,$350,$400 a bottle, were like, Do you have anything better? And there was nothing wrong with the wines. Wines were fantastic, but it was just the mentality of the price point in people's heads. So going back to Reverend Ainair, you know, having a winery that is an established brand now for so many years, they have so many wine club members. They're doing great right now, they're still making money, they're growing. Um, I think there's something to be said for having that you know, option and how many people want that option. It's the proof is in the pudding.

SPEAKER_01 30:52

I love what you're saying. And so I want to make a good example of two different business models, and that it's gonna highlight uh exactly what you're saying. So uh the first is I I I love I use Samsung. I've got two Samsung. And I'm gonna tell you why that I've been using Samsung in the Android system for a long time. Because when I was tight financially a couple years ago, and I was trying to get a new iPhone, I couldn't because the iPhone only has the the one, you know, it's like you buy the iPhone, the newest model, and they have the Pro or the Pro Max. And then the for a long time they didn't have a base model. There wasn't a different level, a different entry level. It was the new iPhone, you know? And so, but versus Samsung, this Samsung I've had for so long. This is a hundred dollar Samsung. And when I was really having a tough time financially a couple years ago, I was like, I gotta get this phone. It wasn't this one, it was the one before this, but I got a really basic Samsung. Then I started doing my business, started doing better, started making more money, and I started growing my business and I was like, well, I can upgrade. And I was like looking at the iPhone and I was like, but you know what? Samsung served me right. Like I really like what they've done. So I what did I do? I looked at the more expensive Samsung, you know, and now I've got the flagship Samsung, but I still have my cheaper phone because I was able to get in the door with them versus the iPhone. Like right now, I was looking at the iPhone Pro Max for my work because I do a lot of video. It's the same price as a laptop, you know, it it might actually be more. It's ridiculous. It's like, I mean, and granted, it's a great product. And see, this is the challenge. And we're not saying that you don't have a great product, but when you don't have entry-level things to bring people into your ecosystem, and I'm not just talking a winery, I'm talking the wine market in general, because right now everyone puts down on those budget wines. Everyone, oh you know, that's the stuff that we don't, but it's in a box. Oh God, you know, I mean, granted, you know, screw cap, right? You know, you know, I mean, I'm not a big fan of wine in a box, but like, hey, I'll take a screw cap any day, you know? Because but it's getting people in the door. When I last week, I I poured my workers um a little bit of wine, and they were just like, what the hell is this? And it was not something that they could relate to. You know what? But if I had had something that was sweet and simple and inexpensive and just said, hey, try this, here you go, they would have been like, ooh, I like this. And suddenly I've got a person with a foot in the door. You know, and I think that that's where I I love the analogy you brought up, but I think that the one of the iPhone versus Samsung is such a uh a state market because also, like you think about the car market. Like, what happens if the entire car market said, you know what, car market's not doing so well, but we we think we can make money. Let's just stop all of the poor people cars because we're not gonna really talk to them. We're only gonna make like Bugaris and Lamborghinis and Ferraris. That's all that's gonna be out there. And I mean, it's certainly it's gonna be really, you know, interesting to see all that on the road. But like, first of all, not everyone can get there. And the second thing is those companies are slowly gonna drown because they just don't have always the market, you know, and I think they're gonna be like, well, new people will find it, the new wealthy will find it, but they're not bringing those people in. Like they're not bringing those people in because they're a whole different generation. It's a generational thing, it's not even a socioeconomic thing, you know?

SPEAKER_00 34:37

Well, and it also shifts the demand, right? So if you just have, you know, anyone can get a Lamborghini, anyone will get a Ferrari, well, it doesn't make it a special. So, you know, there it's like luxury, the luxury market, there is there's a science behind it. And I think that sometimes gets missed when winery owners come in and they want to buy a brand or it's a VC company taking over. They don't understand the training of the luxury market that needs to happen for maybe your people that you're hiring that are not trained to work in a luxury market. But you're telling them, you know, it's like you're hiring someone who worked at Walmart to work at Louis Vuitton, and they're not gonna know what the hell to say. So it there's definitely, I think, a lack of training that occurs, but at the same time, not. But there's also when you've got so many brands that need that skilled type of individual, it's gonna be harder to find them. I think it's going to create a lack of jobs because they're so niche to that specific person you need to work at it. It's not just a position where, you know, the masses could apply and have a fair shot, right? And that's all jobs, of course. Um but yeah, it's a it's a really interesting kind of concept, I think, that everyone um try to only follow that luxury model versus a model that would work, say, for their property, for their income level, and you know, kind of go from there. It's also to a thing that I used to talk about a lot in the wine industry was that um I would kind of explain to people why wine was priced the way it was to kind of open their eyes because they just didn't get it. So, you know, you've got a winery over here that's owned their land since the 1940s, they don't have a mortgage on the land, their insurance is low, like they own the vineyards, they have a bottling facility, or they, you know, have a winemaking facility and they have all those things, and maybe they're somewhat paid off, or who knows how much debt all these wineries are actually in. But that gives them such a leg up, right? To be able to price their wines at a price that is affordable or at least approachable to the extent, but then that confuses people when you go from that winery that is priced at, you know, maybe$90 for their cab because they own their property and they, you know, own the vineyards. And then you go over here next door, and you've got literally vineyards touching their vineyards. And this veterinaire's bottle is$300 because they just bought their property three, four years ago, and they've got a you know,$30 million mortgage now, and they have to pay full price for everything because they don't have any relationships in the industry. And so it's just uh that gets missed so much. And now there's just so much more of that. Whereas when I started an industry in 2010, you still had more of an established base of your long-standing mentors. Now they've all gotten bought out. So then why are the prices racing? Well, because those people need to make money on that investment. It's not the same people owning it anymore that can price it the way they did.

SPEAKER_01 38:03

It's interesting. And it's it's it's interesting to see where I I don't know where it's gonna go. Like I I I have no idea, but I do know that I kind of have, and I mean, this is sad for me because I I'm from the Napa Valley, but I I'm gonna throw this out there. I kind of have faith in some of the other wine regions around the US and around the world that they're, you know, I I love the people like I love what they're doing down in Paso. I love what they're still doing in Sonoma, I love what they're doing up in Oregon, you know, because it's more of what Napa used to be, you know, more of what the wine industry used to be. Like, you know, when I go and meet people and that are doing wine up in Oregon, man, they're chill as hell. I'm going in there and people are like just pouring me a glass. And I remember it being that way when I was growing up in Napa. Like I would roll into someone's house. They're like, dude, I just made this wine, you gotta check this out. You know, when I roll into a tasting room up in Oregon, it's the same. Same thing that I get a lot of that in Paso, you know? It's like people are just way more down-to-earth, you know?

SPEAKER_00 39:05

There's still a lot of that, I will say there are a lot of brands that are being made by people that are my age, that are amazing wines and they're great price points. And the funny thing that's kind of coming out now is that you've got all these bittners that don't have a winery, don't have a tasting room, they have a brand. And they're either a winemaker at a very established winery, so they have access to all the tools that they need, and they don't have to pay an arm and a leg to make their wine. So then they can turn around and sell you a Chardonnay at$35 from you know, some amazing vineyard in Oregon, but they're the winemaker for let's just say a big brand like Farniente or something. And so you're getting Farniente quality wines made by a Farniente winemaker in this private label. Um, Accurso wines are really good. Uh and so you get to have access to that. And those are the underbelly, I think, of what's kind of occurring right now. Um, a lot of that Walden wines just came out by Chris Walden, who's a vineyard manager who owns a vineyard management company that farms a ton of the most established vineyards in Napa, and they just produce their own label. His brother is the winemaker for Elusa, which, you know, is up at the Four Susans and made wine for um O'Shaughnessy before that. So you've got these incredible, you know, people making wines that are approachable, are accessible, but you just don't, there's nowhere to go taste them. And that is kind of where the rubber meets the road, right? Of right now, like Oregon, you can still get a property maybe where, you know, you can I think even Oregon's getting kind of priced out and and Washington too, but I still think there's a lot of that positivity in Napa, and it's kind of coming up from my generation. It's just about you can't do that and not have a full-time job. Like go, I have my company bang. I also consult for multiple brands, I have my personal influencer page where I get paid to do content creation and you know sponsored posts. So I have three jobs, right? And do like that's not uncommon. But that's also that's a lot, I think. And back in the day, people didn't there was not an expectation for my mom to ever have three jobs or to ever have a job outside of her job. And I still do my kids' homework with him and made it through the Valentine's spread this morning and got him ready for baseball and you know, did all the things that I have to do. Um, but it's we're it's living in a different generation of and different expectations for us than what was expected for the generation before, but that's common, right? Um, but it's how we evolve in the wine industry, and that's kind of how the wine industry is evolving right now.

SPEAKER_01 42:05

I love the to be able to look at this and to to to see where it's going. And you know, I have hope. I have hope because I see the people I'm interviewing those people, and I believe that the people I'm interviewing are people that care enough about this product and care enough about wine and care enough about the stories that are involved that, you know, I just have hope that it's gonna turn around and that on the other side of it, people will have learned and this will be a new group of a new group, a new direction, you know. Well, I want to ask you the one last question. Um, because we've been all over the place, it was a fun conversation. I looked down at my watch, I was like, okay, where what do I go to next? It's like 11:30. And it was like, I was like, it's 1145. Jesus Christ, but that's awesome. Uh, those are the best conversations. If you had to a person sitting in front of you that has not been around wine much, and you've got to pour three glasses, what varietals, what you it can be specific wines like from wineries, what three glasses are you pouring for that person who's never really gotten into wine before?

SPEAKER_00 43:07

Well, first off, I'm gonna take them to Silver Trident Winery in Yachtville, um, where I work for the last 10 years, and is a place that I know gives the best hospitality to not just the, you know, person that has a massive cellar, but to the bachelorette parties, to the young kids, to the older people traveling from Vietnam who clearly aren't gonna be able to ship wine back home because they're from Vietnam. But we are still gonna give them the most exceptional hospitality experience. And they have a such a fantastic lineup of wines. Um, Carrie Oranger is the winemaker there, and she uh was with Scarecrow making Scarecrow underneath Celia Welch for a number of years, so comes from a very well established, massive cult following brand. Um, she started working with. Silver Trident, which was founded by the owners of Oceana Winery in 2009. They make a rose, a Stavin Blanc, a Pinot Noir, a red blend that's$50, an all Beckstoffer fruit. You know what I'm talking about. And then they do a cab that's$90 so or$95 right now. That winery, in my opinion, also every experience comes with food. So you're getting a potato chip tasting with all these different varietals, getting to understand food and wine pairings and why that works, why potato chips would work with wine, obviously, salt, fat, you know, acid done. So to me, I feel like what Bob has done at Silver Trident in the last 10 years is an example of someone coming into an industry that they don't have experience in and meeting the industry where it's at and trying to create something that will evoke emotion in people, bring them back, create a family. And they've done that. And those wine bridles, Rose, Sauvignon Blanc, Pinot Noir, that is where I will start.

SPEAKER_01 45:11

I love that. That's awesome. Well, where can people find out more about you and what you're doing?

SPEAKER_00 45:15

Oh, they can go to my website, um, www.bangwinecountry.com. Um, I throw networking events monthly. We're gonna be at Air Winery this month on the 26th. Uh, these are private member events. Um, so you join, you get access to them. We help with marketing, all that fun stuff. And then, of course, follow me at Mine Living.