Beyond The Glass | Tiffany Van Gorder | Barrels and Roots

In this episode of the Barrels and Roots Podcast, I sit down with Tiffany Van Gorder, Director of DTC and Membership for La Serena Winery, to talk about what really makes wine memorable. Tiffany shares her journey from PR and marketing into Napa Valley wine, why tasting rooms matter more than ever, and how wine brands can create real relationships instead of just selling bottles. 

We talk about why wine can feel intimidating, how tasting notes can confuse new drinkers, and why the best winery experiences are built around personal touches, storytelling, hospitality, and making people feel seen. 

From Heidi Barrett’s first tasting room to the changing role of wine scores, this conversation is about bringing wine back to connection, community, and shared moments.

What makes a wine experience unforgettable for you: the bottle, the place, or the people you shared it with?

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I think if you look at any given wine bottle, there's a lot of information, right? There's a lot of information to absorb. There's the brand name, the varietal name, you know, the vintage, the appellation, the winemaker notes on the back, the back label copy from the winemaker. Um, you know, some people don't really understand, I don't think, all of those components. And so right there, they're like, I don't even know if I can dig any more into this. And and then, of course, then they don't even know if the bottle is good or bad. So, and then there's tasting notes. Tasting notes, oh my goodness, they can be so intimidating because how how do you describe what leather or or tea leaves taste like, right? I mean, some of these are descriptors, descriptors in like Anne Noble, I think it has an aroma wheel. I mean, those are some you see tasting notes that say it should be this Cabernet tastes like tea leaves and leather. And that that's the confusing to an average drinker. They don't, they're not knowing what that tastes like. And so I think all of those, those elements can make, you know, combine can make wine feel intimidating. And I think, again, when somebody comes into the door of a tasting room, it's the host's uh responsibility to to make it just like, what do you like? You know, what what do you what what do you taste in this? What do you smell? And and make them be the judge of that.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

Welcome everybody back to the Barrels and Roots Podcast. I am your host, Sean Trace, and I have a very awesome guest with me today. Would you like to tell people who you are and what you do?

SPEAKER_01 1:42

Sure. Hi, Sean. Thanks for having me. This is I'm Tiffany Van Gorder, and I am the director of DTC and membership for La Serena Winery, and it is Heidi Barrett's first ever tasting room that just opened a couple months ago.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

That's awesome. Now, I would love to ask, how did you get started in wine? Like what was it that that took you down this path?

SPEAKER_01 2:02

Well, after graduating at UC Davis, I worked at a global public relations firm, Ketchum, in San Francisco, and I met my um then-to-be husband who was working in the wine industry, he was uh in the wine growing industry, and uh said that Napa was the place to be. And so after some convincing, I decided to um change transfer my PR and marketing skills over to the wine industry. So I started working at um a leading agency in Napa, Balzac Communications and Marketing, and I worked there for about over thir about 13 years, representing wineries like Wente, Family Estates, Jordan, Ravenswood, and um Don and Sons were a handful of my clients.

SPEAKER_00 2:49

That's awesome. Like, and as you you you got into wine, like I wanted to ask you this because you've worked in wine now for a while. Like, if I were to ask a complete newbie to the wine world, were to ask you, like, what do you actually do all day? How would you explain it?

SPEAKER_01 3:06

Well, that's a good question. I guess it really depends on the job I'm in and kind of who my audience is, right? Um in my role now as director of DTC and membership, I really um try to connect with the people that walk in the tasting room and um connect in a meaningful way that that they remember. Um, I think my goal, we have clearly we have some amazing high-quality wines at La S Arena. So they're gonna remember the the wines, but what I want them is to remember me, how I made them feel, and kind of the experiences that they had long after they leave uh the tasting room.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

That's awesome. You know, and it's it's interesting too, because first of all, coming back to the DTC, I I love like how, you know, um there's so much of this experience now that is truly a magical part of it. Like when you come to the winery and you are there and you get to experience just this beautiful um moment. I don't know how to explain it better than that, because I went wine tasting with my mom and my wife about a year ago. And we went to this one winery, and I've never been wine tasting with my mom, and my wife and I will go over out for cocktails, but the three of us had a hilarious time, absolutely hilarious. And just to watch my mom and my sister have this, or my mom and my wife have this experience together was so powerful because you know, we don't always get those experiences. And we came home with three bottles of wine, and it was it was we bought the wine because our experience was just so magical together. It was an easy call, you know, like that wine was so much fun today that we had, and this was our memory. So we're gonna get a couple bottles of it, you know?

SPEAKER_01 4:51

Yeah. Was it the, I have to ask you, was it the wine that was fun, or what made the experience so so laughable or funny and memorable?

SPEAKER_00 5:01

It was just us being together. I think it was like the first time that um it's the first time that I've seen my mom get a little bit too much wine. And we were like, we were like, mom, you're not supposed to drink all of it. And she's like, I like it though. And we're like, all right, it's gonna be a fun day. And like it was 10 in the morning. It was 10 in the morning. We were out at these wineries, and I think it was just like it was this awesome experience that we had together, but it was just that we were there. Like, if I were to tell you what happened that day, I can't remember. I can't, I don't remember the flavors of the wine. I don't remember what the glass was that really popped, but I can tell you every last little moment that we joked about. I can tell you every last little spot. And I think that that's what like I've had a lot of guests who've come on lately and they're like, there's a reason wine is made in the size that it's made. It's meant to be shared. That experience is meant to be shared with other people, you know?

SPEAKER_01 5:57

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 5:58

I want to ask you this because when you first started in wine, what was the biggest thing wineries cared about? And is that still the same today?

SPEAKER_01 6:05

Uh no, I mean, when I first started in public relations and representing wineries like the clients that I mentioned, um, they they really wanted their name and their wines in top national wine publications. That was that was the big end goal, you know, wine spectator, wine enthusiast, wine and spirits, those were those were the big, big boys that um, the big publications that everybody cared about. Um, and those wineries, you know, they all wanted their names and the positive scores and reviews in these uh publications. And I think, you know, I think it's really changed tremendously now that publications are, you know, subscription-based, and there's a whole new generation of wine drinkers who frankly don't care about those scores and they don't care about what critics say. Um, they're they're more interested in what their friends and coworkers and uh people around them, their neighbors, might have, you know, say about a wine, and and they want to be their own judge. So I think with that that change um in in kind of the the generations of drinkers and what they care about, the um, you know, wineries, wineries are not paying as much attention to to those scores and critics' evaluations.

SPEAKER_00 7:21

Aaron Powell I love like you know, it's almost full circle that wineries are getting back to just bringing people in to find joy, you know? And I want to say, uh, what's like before we go any further, like if you were to pour yourself a glass right now or or or a couple of different glasses or for a stranger, what would you pour for yourself?

SPEAKER_01 7:40

Oh, that's I well, I'd have La Serena all the time, but you know, I I had a great conversation um a f you know a while ago with John Williams at Frog's Leap, and he talked about his, you know, process of winemaking, and you know, I love I love what they're doing um at Frogs Leap in Rutherford. I love their Sauvignon Blanc, I like their Cabernet. Um you know, I think the wines that I will care to enjoy have stories behind them, right? And and that's that's fun when I'm sharing it and sharing those stories with other people because like you said, I think wine is meant to be shared. So the more you can talk about the stories and the people behind it, the the more meaningful it it you know it has to people.

SPEAKER_00 8:25

I love that. I love that. Well, I wanted to ask you too, because um for me, I have so many memories. I grew up in the Napa Valley and I still spend a much of my time there. But when I go to wineries, like some wineries are these places that people love and remember, while others are just like another bottle on the shelf. Like, what do you think makes a winery so memorable? You know, like what is it that makes a place pop and makes it like maybe not fun, but just really a place that people like to go to and enjoy?

SPEAKER_01 9:06

Yeah, I mean, I mean, it's that's a good question. I mean, there are more than 500 wineries in Napa Valley, let's face it. There's a lot of competition, right? A lot of competition for consumer mind share. So, like, how in the heck? I ask people, how do you pick La Serena over another winery? Now, we're brand new and we have the Heidi Barrett recognition, so that's different. But for the rest of the people at wineries, you know, I think, I think the wineries that people come, you know, to love and remember off offer something more than just wine. They, you know, they have people that are there that make a connection. They get to know their guests. They personally greet them when they walk in the door, you know. If they get to know who they are, what they like, uh what they like to drink at home, you know, where they are on their wine journey. Some people are brand new. Some people have, you know, have had wines for, you know, 40 years. Um, and I think the more that the hosts can cater to their individual guest as they learn about them, um, I think that is gonna make a difference. And I think that's gonna make those wineries stand out. Um, I also think uh there's a time now in Napa Valley where, you know, wineries I think are paying too much attention to reservations. Do you have a reservation? If I don't know, if you don't have a reservation, I don't know that we can see you. I mean, and that right off the bat is off putting. Right. And so I think wineries that people love and remember are gonna be very welcoming as soon as the guest walks in the door. Um, even if the desk guest does not have a reservation. I understand, you know, the there's there's staffing issues and what all of that that entails, but at the very least, you can pour the guest a splash of something and and make them feel comfortable and and and they'll be very happy with that.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

I uh I I've had a lot of different journeys and careers, and I early in my life, I uh was living in Los Angeles and I was working at a hair salon. Now I know nothing about hair, but I was in graduate school and I knew about media. And so at the media company, uh I was doing media at the spa, and I was also working at the front desk for a period of time and walks this one lady, no reservation. Uh and she just was like, she looked an absolute mess. Like her hair was messed up. She was wearing jeans and a t-shirt with some jacket. She looked like she'd been shopping at like a Target or a Walmart, which is nothing wrong. But this was this was like the fanciest of fancy places in West Hollywood. And I was just like, all right, who wants to to to to help me get this person? She, she's like, I need to get a quick trim. I need to get my hair, you know, blow-dried, washed and blow dried. I need, I've got a meeting that I need to get to and I need some help. And it was wild as like all of the stylists in there were like, mm-mm, no, not going to, no, not mine. And it was like 15 different hairstylists that are all like, no, she doesn't look important enough for me. Do you know how much I charge? Do you know who I am? Finally, it was this guy named Craig, and Craig was like, Yeah, I'm not doing anything right now. I'd love to help her. And he cleaned her up, got her all good, got everything, made her feel like a million dollars, right? And my boss walked in two seconds later, and my boss immediately turns to me and she's like, Who's taking care of her? And I said, What do you mean? And she's like, Who's taking care of her? And I said, Craig. And she's like, Good, how'd he do? And I said, He did great. He's always great, you know? And she's like, That's the head of a major studio here in LA. And everyone was acting. Yeah, and so, and she was like, loved it, had a great experience, went and she's like, Hey, do you have a place I can change? Changed into her business suit, and she walked straight into a meeting with like Warner Brothers. And I was, you know, like, I'm not saying to think that everyone is, you know, super important and hiding, but the reality is, is like, we should treat everyone like as a business, treat everyone with respect and treat them like they're there. And like you don't know who's gonna be the person who might tell someone who tells someone, and that person just brings people organically to your business. And if nothing else, they just have a fun time, you know?

SPEAKER_01 13:34

Yeah. And you never know what their story is. I mean, they have a story on the other side that that may really, you know, be, you know, they're going through a tough time and they they are just there to be seen and be respected. And um, I think that gets uh I think that gets uh overrated.

SPEAKER_00 13:54

I um my wife and I had a hell of a day earlier today. We had a lot. I uh was having a slow month for my videos, and then in two days, we had 250 videos submitted that I have to finish up by Friday. And I just was like, oh, okay, it's one of those weeks. And in my team, I've got 20 editors, they're doing a great job, they're cranking through things. But my wife and I were like, let's just go out and have a glass. And we went to our favorite place. I had a glass of cab. She loves her cocktails, she did a cocktail, and it was just a day that we could go. And in that wine, I was just like, I'm here. Like, and the bartender was like, looked at us and she's like, How are you guys doing today? And it was a question that wasn't needed. We always go there, but she just looked and she saw us in that moment. We're like, we're both having hell uh really crazy days. And she's like, Well, we're glad you're here. And I was just like, Wow, making me feel good inside in that moment. Like, thank you for saying you're glad we're here. And it wasn't just about showing up. Like, we always go to this place, it's our place, you know. But she at that moment saw us. And I think it leads to my next question because like wine in and of itself, and this is like movies do a okay, Buffy, you know, thank you. I just let's just talk about the wine. Thank you. Oh, let's go into my cellar and pull out this. Wine seems intimidating to a lot of people. Like, but why do you think so many people feel nervous about a wine? And how can we change that?

SPEAKER_01 15:28

I think if you look at any given wine bottle, there's a lot of information, right? There's a lot of information to absorb. There's the brand name, the varietal name, you know, the vintage, the appellation, the winemaker notes on the back, the back label copy from the winemaker. Um, you know, some people don't really understand, I don't think, all of those components. And so right there, they're like, I don't even know if I can dig any more into this. And and then, of course, then they don't even know if the bottle is good or bad. So, and then there's tasting notes. Tasting notes, oh my goodness, they can be so intimidating because how how do you describe what is leather or or tea leaves taste like, right? I mean, some of these are descriptors, descriptors in like Anne Noble, I think it has an aroma wheel. I mean, those are some you see tasting notes that say it should be this Cabernet tastes like tea leaves and leather. And that that's the confusing to an average drinker. They don't, they're not knowing what that tastes like. And so I think all of those, those elements can make, you know, combine can make wine feel intimidating. And I think, again, when somebody comes into the door of a tasting room, it's the host's uh responsibility to to make it just like, what do you like? You know, what what do you what what do you taste in this? What do you smell? And and make them be the judge of that.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

I love that because I I remember my first tastings. I was so intimidated. And like someone's like, it has hints of of of like, and this guy was like into it and God love him. Good for you being into it, man. He was describing flavors and smells and things that I have never even heard of. Like, I was like, you're speaking words that I'm not wording right now. Like, you know, it's like, what even is that thing? You know, and it's just like, yeah, and and you you're scared to ask the stupid questions. I went with my friend and I tell this story all the time, and they're like, it has hints of tobacco. And my friend's like, what do you what do you mean it has hints of to like putting tobacco in the wine is like that how they're getting the tobacco flavor? You know, like what is that? And I think, like, right? But he really didn't know. And I didn't, I was like, I have no idea too, man. I don't know how there's hints of tobacco. But then, like, the guy, like, luckily, we had this really good person that was leading the tasting. They're like, nah, man, that's just like what someone described. It's like that's what they associate with it. Like, what do you taste? And my friend's like, Cheesecake Factory. What? What do you mean? They're like, ah, there's this flavor. I remember this thing that comes out. It was a pie. I had this pie once at Cheesecake Factory, and it had this type of berry on the top. And when I taste this wine, it reminds me of that berry. And the and the guy was like, There you go. That's your association. That's what you're tasting in this wine. And don't let anyone else tell that's wrong. You know, that's what you're tasting, and that's your association. Like, stick with that. And he's like, Oh, so that's what you're gonna do. Right? You know?

SPEAKER_01 18:34

Right. I mean, one of the things I tell my guests who are asking about that in particular, um, I'll tell them go into your pantry and take out your baking spices, take out your nutmeg, take out, you know, your cocoa, whatever, whatever it is. And that's an a great introductory way to understand some of these smells. Because everybody use, you know, you're baking with these spices and um see what that smells like. And then when you are getting into the tasting the wine, you may be able to pull out some of those baking spices. And people go, oh, I get it. I that they they seem to understand with that analogy.

SPEAKER_00 19:11

I love that. I love that. And that's something I'm gonna tell people. I've never had anyone tell me that, but that's a great thing to do. I want to ask you this though, because like, in your opinion, what makes a great winery visit that people talk about for years?

SPEAKER_01 19:25

Well, I mean, I think I think there's a lot of personal touches. It's not, it's not a rinse and repeat. Like the host can't treat every guest the same for starters. Um, I think it's really important, like I mentioned earlier, personal greeting, you know, meaning for meaningful interactions where the host is sharing stories about himself or herself and and engages with the guests so that they feel comfortable in a way to also share their stories. And and I also think, you know, a great winery visit goes kind of past the the winery, the actual visit itself, you know, it kind of may it could include a um, you know, I don't know, handwritten note to thank the guests for their visit or a follow-up, you know, on the guest's birthday. I mean, I get people that I send them a uh happy early birthday. I'm sometimes the first birthday in, you know, wish uh before their birthday. And they're like, oh my gosh, I can't believe that you're well you are are wishing me a happy birthday, or or even a personal note that kind of highlights the the visit and and what the host enjoyed about meeting that personal, that um, that guest. Um and I think really a a great winery visit that people talk about is is you know really turns into a real relationship. And and that's the difference.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

I love that. It is a real relationship. You know, I I think that tonight when we went to the bar that my wife and I love going to, that wasn't just a bartender asking us, how are you guys doing today? It was someone that we have sat with and had drinks with hundreds of like hundreds of times, man. We've been there so many times, and we are friends. They care about us, you know, and and I think that that's one of the beautiful things is that like, can you have this organic, and I mean, and marketing, everyone talks about being authentic, but like the authenticity of actually being someone that people enjoy to visit, you know, because you're real. And this was one of the things, like I remember working in in the valley, uh in the Napa Valley. And one of the things that when I was working at this one resort, um, you know, and she was like, You got to just be, it was like that whole be seen, not heard, be here. And I was like, but yet the guests were like, who are you? Where are you from? You know, talking to people and having that true connection. And this one like person that um I let's just say that I didn't stay there long because I was just like, I can't do this. Like, if you are here, if I'm here with someone, I want to hear their story. I want to talk to them. And they and people respond to that. But I think to me, One of the things that is a great part of whether it be PR, hospitality, or DTC sales is like is building this connection with people. And I want to ask you this because like which part of the wine business do you think most wine lovers never see or understand? And how do we connect more with those wine lovers in the wine industry, you know?

SPEAKER_01 22:23

Well, I mean, uh, you know, I think I think people understand marketing and and um merchandise and and hospitality and direct consumer. I think in in the field that I have been in that I don't think um people fully understand is the the three-tier side of distribution. I think um, you know, let's talk people going to a restaurant, they see buy the glass or they see a restaurant wine list. And I think there's a tendency to think, you know, that wine is there because the owner had a relationship with the winery. But there's a lengthy process. Only when I was at Winebow and had to, you know, give my sales team the tools they needed to be successful in the market, I realized that there's a lot of blood, sweat, and tears that goes into getting those placements. I mean, they those salespeople have to determine the right wine buyer, they have to establish a connection, they have to secure an appointment to taste, they have to negotiate the pricing. There's three-tier pricing and that goes into that. And they have to do their homework to know that the winery, the wine that they're pitching is suitable for that restaurant list, right? If there's if it's already heavy on the Cabernet Sauvignons of Napa Valley, don't be pitching another Napa Valley Cabernet. Um so, and then you have to hope that the wine among all the wines in the world, right, gets gets the chosen for that menu. And then these salespeople have to do it all over, over and again for another restaurant and a wine. So that that part of the equation, I think uh the average Joe just just sees a wine on a list and goes, that's that's I that's great, but that's there. But there's a lot of involvement that that made it there. And I appreciate all those salespeople that are out hustling and uh trying to make their plates fits.

SPEAKER_00 24:23

Right. I think people don't realize that the the amount of work that goes into the hustle of the people in the industry right now. You know, and I know it's the showing up constantly, even when like right now the industry is all doom and gloom, you know. But like the reality is that people still love wine. It's just a downtime. It will turn around at some point in time, hopefully sooner rather than later. But you know, if we were talking about talking to people who are just trying to get into the field, people that because I think it'd be great to bring more people into the fold around how and why wine is such an awesome thing. But like if someone walked into a tasting room for the first time and said, teach me about wine, where would you start?

SPEAKER_01 25:06

Oh my goodness, that's a big question. Um I, you know, I think there's different facets of wine. Um, you know, there's the wine growing, there's wine making and and wine drinking. Those are the like the three categories for me, right? So um, you know, I think wine growing is, you know, the farming aspect, the agricultural part of the equation, you know, understanding how to farm the grapevines and shaping the wine's canopy and um, you know, managing the soil and the terroir and pruning and, you know, all of that, all of that that is goes into it. It's a science. I mean, people study this stuff and they they that that's part of the winemaking process. And and they're those farmers, you know, are really want to make sure that they're picking the fruit at the right time to get all the right levels of, you know, sugar and acidity. And then there's the winemaking aspect, which is kind of where I see the magic. It's like bringing it all, you know, together, right? Controlling the fermentation and deciding whether to age the wine at oak or or barrels and stainless steel blending, you know, all of that. And the winemakers process is to kind of understand that the the they're getting the best possible flavors that they can to ensure a high quality, final product. And then at the end of it, what do you know, what do you have is the wine drinking. That's the consumption, and that's the the final thing of where it all comes together. So, and understanding like, you know, what are you tasting and what what do you like about this wine that you may not like about that wine? And um I think those are the three like categories, if you will, for for a basic understanding. Because I think there's there's farmers and there's winemaking, and they're they're very critical in the the the final product.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

I love that. And I I think that one of the things too is like for me I like to understand the stories, I like to understand like why things are are interesting. You know, it's like I I love, absolutely love, and because you're working, you know, with Heidi Barrett, my one of my favorite movies is Bottleshock. Man, I love that movie. I love Alan Rickman. God, it's one besides Snape and Hans Gruber, it's one of my favorite Alan Rickman roles, hands down.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

Yeah, great movie.

SPEAKER_00 27:43

It's a great movie. And it it's like, and to me, like understanding the story behind what what you know what they did in this what was the name of the um what is the name of that whole, the competition or something? Like uh something in France of Paris?

SPEAKER_01 28:02

Just the Par the Judgment of Paris.

SPEAKER_00 28:05

Judgment of Paris tasting.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

It's huge. It's what it's the 50th anniversary of that event, Sean, this year.

SPEAKER_00 28:10

Really? That's awesome! I gotta go watch that movie again. Oh god, I love that movie. And like it's the 50th anniversary. But the coolest part is, is like when you understand what that was, a bunch of Californians that the French were like, you have no reason to be here. Just in a brine taste testing, just smoke them, you know? And it's just like, how awesome is that, you know? But that story is interesting because it's this beautiful underdog story. It's this beautiful like story about like, I don't know, about a place. And, you know, everyone's talking about terwat. Well, like that's the coolest thing, like learning where the roots of Napa come from, man, you know? So I don't know. I think we need more storytelling like that.

SPEAKER_01 28:53

Yeah, that that storytelling is the is the key piece. And um, yeah, I think, I think uh there the fact that there was there was one um uh American writer covering that event, uh George Tabor was his name. And uh had he not been at that table, Sean, I'm not sure the uh history folks would have gone down quite the way they did, because uh to your point, I think some of these French judges might have uh done something with their votes.

SPEAKER_00 29:23

Right? I mean, right? You know, uh the the truth is there. But I want to ask you, like, if if uh you had a friend that was coming to you and you were gonna pour three glasses, three varietals for them, what three varietals would you pour? They don't know a lot about wine.

SPEAKER_01 29:42

Uh I would, I probably would um, I would I think I would probably pour the typical, you know, Chardonnay and a um maybe a Grenache and a Cabernet. And um, I think understand, you know, fake maybe two different styles of Chardonnay, I think, because you have that, you know, Burgundian leaner kind of uh Chardonnay, and then you have the like bigger wines uh that go through more of that malolactic fermentation. So they could understand, you know, maybe what their palate prefers. And then um a lighter style red wine would be a Grenache and um and then of course, you know, like the Cabernet Sauvignon, um, and see, you know, have them understand the difference between the three. And I think it's a good, a good starter for education.

SPEAKER_00 30:32

I love it. I love it. But yeah, I wanted to ask this so too, because like you've worked with some incredible wineries and now with Heidi Barrett at La Serena. What do the best wine brands do differently when it comes to connecting with people?

SPEAKER_01 30:45

I think it just goes back to all those added touches, you know, that I mentioned earlier. I think they really do make a difference. Um, I grew up with um, you know, my mom found this uh red, you know, you are special uh today plate, the red plate, right? And that that always made a difference in my life growing up on birthdays or if I got a big great um A in a class or on a on a project, and she would just put that little you are special today plate in front of me at dinner time and oh, that made me feel so special. And so I've kind of recreated that at La Serena, and we have one of those plates. So if I know there's an anniversary or if I know that there's a birthday, milestone birthday, or people are celebrating special events, um, I'll put that in front of them and they just think that is like amazing. They uh they they walked into heaven. It's and it's just a small little thing, right? It's a those those extra personal touches, or you know, say I'm I meet a guest. I just a couple of weeks ago I met a couple who were celebrating an anniversary of the following week. And I, you know, I made note of when their anniversary was. So on that day, I reached out to them and said, it was so great to see you. And by the way, happy anniversary. Hope you guys are having a wonderful day. And they, you know, they love that. And that's the feel special connectivity, authentic uh gesture that I think people really do appreciate. It goes a long way. And I think those wineries are the wineries that connect in that way are um those that people remember.

SPEAKER_00 32:28

I 100% agree. And I think that it's everyone wants to feel special. And I wish that I had that red plate to eat off of every single day. I would I just I would love it. I would love it. And you know, um I have this big cup that is so ugly. It is horribly ugly that my mom bought for me a long time ago. And I think it says you are lucky on it. It's got these big four-leaf clovers on it. It's horrible. But I love it, you know, and it makes me feel special inside when I pull up this hello. I don't mind if I do. But it's it's that power of that, you know. Um, I want to ask you one last question. At the end of the day, is wine really about what's in the glass, or is it about something bigger in your opinion?

SPEAKER_01 33:17

Oh, I think it's more than just what's in the glass. I, you know, I think it's I think it's about people coming together who are that are around you that are also enjoying wine. Um, I think the symbolism of wine, you know, it's about community, uh, celebrating an occasion, and it doesn't have to be a special occasion, right? I mean, it can be any regular day, but it's I think it's time spent with friends and coworkers, taking time to talk and share, share stories and share life. I mean, that's really what it's all about. And um, you know, I think um, I think we need to get back into doing that more because at the end of the day, you remember that glass, but more than that, and you remember the wine that's in the glass, but more than that, you remember, you know, who you were with and and what kind of experience and how you made each other feel. And and that's really, I think, what what is so special about wine.

SPEAKER_00 34:16

I love that a lot. Well, I want to say thank you so much, but I want to ask you this where can people go to find out more about you and what you do and the wines that you work with?

SPEAKER_01 34:26

Yeah, it's um so go on to our website, lasarinawine.com, um, book a reservation. We do take walk-ins, we're very welcoming. Heidi was very um adamant about uh not having required reservations, and um, so we would love to have people come in, see our new, you know, whimsical, vibrant, colorful tasting room in Calistoga, and uh enjoy the vineyard views or all of the art and of course the high quality wines that we have. Um but yeah, lasarinawine.com is the best place to go and uh ask for David or me, and we would make a uh we'll really make sure to make everybody feel special when they come in the door.