Chondro, BVD & The Truth About Mini Highlands — With Annie, FW Cattle Company

Going from boat days on the river to calving checks at 3am is not a small leap — and Annie from FW Cattle Company is here to tell you exactly what that transition really looks like. This week Lori sits down with Annie to talk fencing failures, BVD testing nobody warns you about, and the uncomfortable truth about chondropositive calves that social media will never show you. If you're new to Highlands or thinking about getting started, this episode is packed with the kind of hard-earned lessons most people only learn the expensive way.

Annie and her husband traded city life for a farm in Stillman Valley, Illinois, and built FW Cattle Company from the ground up — fencing, infrastructure, education and all.

Key Takeaways

Build your fencing and infrastructure before the animals arrive, not after. 

Always BVD test incoming cattle, even from reputable sellers — a negative mom doesn't guarantee a negative calf. 

Confirmation matters more than size or color when choosing breeding stock. 

Quarantine new arrivals for 10-14 days, even if they look healthy. 

Chondropositive does not always mean small — thick, structurally sound calves can carry the gene and still be substantial.

Episode Highlights

Annie shares the real story of trading river life for farm life and what nobody warns you about with fencing. 

The conversation gets into MooCall calving sensors, why a health certificate doesn't always mean what people think it means, and the heartbreaking realities of breeding chondro to chondro. 

Lori and Annie talk honestly about the financial side of this hobby — including embryo losses, bull calf pricing, and why "this'll pay for itself" rarely holds true. 

Plus the social media myth of the apartment-sized mini Highland gets fully busted.

Timestamps

00:01 — Welcome & Annie's transition from city to farm life
 03:35 — Building proper fencing and infrastructure from day one
 08:07 — Designing pastures and dry lots that actually work
 12:53 — Why a headgate is non-negotiable
 13:55 — The truth about social media and "teacup" Highlands
 16:22 — Confirmation versus color and size
 20:01 — The real cost of embryo work and low success rates
 22:13 — Bull calves, collecting semen, and realistic returns
 24:29 — BVD testing and why it matters even with reputable sellers
 28:08 — Health certificates: what they actually guarantee
 33:04 — Chondro to chondro: a hard lesson learned
 35:39 — MooCall sensors and why they're worth it
 44:20 — Supporting customers long after the sale

Learn more about FW Cattle Company at fwcattlecompany.com

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Find us on Facebook: Horns N Hooves Instagram: @hornsnhoovesauctionpodcast TikTok: @Hornsnhoovespodcast
 Website: hornsnhoovesauction.com

Production Credit: Edited and produced by @the32collective_ / https://www.the32collective.co/

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:05

Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Horns and Hooves. We have today a special guest. We have Annie from FW Cattle Company. And we brought her on to talk a little bit about going from city life to farm life and having to learn that farm life. I feel like she's got a really fun story. And I also, there'll be some other things in the end that I really love about their operation that we'll get into and talk about too. But let's start off with Annie. How did you guys Kai? How did you guys go from city life to farm life?

SPEAKER_02 0:49

We have kind of a wild story. Um we lived in town um on the river actually and spent most of our free time boating and guests relaxing. And we gave all that up. I know it's wild. Um so that our children could have a simpler, better life out here um in the country with these animals that we love so much. So yeah, it was a big, big transition for us.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

That is a huge transaction. Yeah. Or transition, I should say. That is absolutely huge. I've been from both sides of both realms too, the boating and fishing life to now. I have a whole lot of I can't go anywhere. That basically I cannot go anywhere anymore. I have gone to locking myself down to not being able to go anywhere unless we get very lucky and like my daughter is covering for us, so we can go to San Diego um to watch our Highland show very fun next week. But you guys switched or you guys flipped lives. Did either one of you have any knowledge whatsoever?

SPEAKER_02 2:06

Yeah, so I had agricultural background. I went to college um for animal science. Primarily, I grew up riding horses, and that's what sort of um brought me into the animal science degree um that I went with. Front, my husband, his um his animal knowledge was mostly confined to like dogs. He and when we were growing up, he would help me in horses through your high school sweetheart. So um he knows about horses and dogs, but he knew nothing about cattle. So it was kind of a a fly by the seat of your pants, learn on the go thing for him. But I was blessed to have some knowledge to bring into this. We weren't completely flying blind.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

So what would you tell people if they asked you? I feel like we do this a lot for learning purposes. Yeah. And so to help new people that are starting out, and even I mean, I learned something from you guys that come on as guests every single time. So, but for new people starting out, when you guys made that transition, were there things that you wish you would have had in place before, or did you have all that in place before you said, Hey, I'm gonna start purchasing was your first purchase, the Highland Cattle?

SPEAKER_02 3:31

Yes, so we had horses. I was boarding them at the time at another stable. So they were our first sort of animals on the farm. Things I would tell people is make sure that you have the proper infrastructure in place before you send them home, right? And we talk to our customers about this all the time. Um, making sure your fencing is sound, making sure you have proper shade, proper, you know, structure for them to get out of the weather, um, shoots, that sort of thing. We had fencing, but it was not what it needed to be initially. And our cattle taught us that very quickly. We had we had one that was definitely um a fence jumper. Um we're like, okay, this is this is not working. If they can hop over it like without thinking twice, probably we need um something a little bit turvier.

SPEAKER_01 4:29

That's how we know when our electric fence is not working.

SPEAKER_02 4:32

100%. 100%.

SPEAKER_01 4:35

We know when our electric fence isn't working because we do, I mean, corn stalks, we have to put electric fence in some of our other areas, but when we get phone calls from people driving down the road, um, your cows are out. Yeah, the hot wire's not working.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

Exactly. We had um actually one of those situations last fall where our bull decided that he was going to make his way into the pasture he wasn't meant to be in. I was like, I don't think the hot wire is on because he's just like crawling through like it's no big deal. So they'll teach you really quickly where your weaknesses are, the things that you need to change because they take advantage every opportunity.

SPEAKER_01 5:21

They do. I also had so we bought because I have a problem. I we need a Highland Anonymous um program. So my husband said I could start with four, right? But I don't know if you've heard my story. No, it was 44, and then it was like 144, and now it's like 214. He didn't tell me where the four had to fly had to land in that, right? Okay, and the progression of yeah, so then we had to go buy new land, and that fence wasn't real great. Well, my neighbors, big Angus bulls, were breeding their cattle and the next uh the pasture over. Yeah. Well, uh Vinny, which was mid-sized bull, probably closer. I mean, he was mid-sized. I'll just he he was going over there. He knew how to use his horns. Must have been the bulls must have been thinking bigging, his bulls must have been afraid of him or something, because they ended up with like 12 or 15. Stop it. Hi, Angus. I can laugh about it now. Oh, because thank goodness they were good friends of ours. Yeah. But and it was quite funny watching David's face, and they have a screensaver, and I think it's to root. I don't know what it's to. We ended up having to put Vinny down because he ended up he ended up jumping, he would jump six foot panels. So after that, he would not stay in. So we ended up having to take a what do you do?

SPEAKER_02 7:06

Set him free range. Like good luck, buddy.

SPEAKER_01 7:09

Yeah, I mean, I don't think my neighbors, because we have everybody has Angus around us, yeah, and my brother-in-law has dairy. I don't know how thrilled they would be with that combination. Well, I already know they did they uh thank goodness they were understanding we got our fence fixed and have brand new fencing all the way around up at that pasture.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Same, same after our um initial experience. And my husband put that fence up. God bless him. He tried so hard, but and he did a great job, but you just cannot pull wire by hand to make it um sturdy enough that it's gonna work. So we quickly learned that we needed some help and we had a company out to do all of our fencing. So um it works just fine now.

SPEAKER_01 8:00

My br we had my brother-in-law out to do, he's uh does fencing and he's the one that did that pasture. But over the weekend, our other pasture up north, there's one part of it. We usually don't put cows in there, but we had to because we have cedars in them and we didn't want to separate or run them back in, so we had to separate them. I was already getting phone calls. Um, you have really cute baby calves out on the road that you might not want out there on a curve. And I'm like, oh, here we go again. So we we need to fix that fence too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

We were in Cincinnati this weekend seeing my son's doctor up there, and we got a call also. Hey, you got a cow out. I'm like, oh my gosh, making a hundred phone calls, trying to find help, get the cattle back in.

SPEAKER_01 8:57

Yep, never ending. And you know what? It seems like all the cattle, as soon as my husband leaves, and it needs I need more than one person to wrangle them in. It seems like all of a sudden they hear, boss man's gone. Let's have a party out of the pasture. Not in the pasture, out of the pasture. Every sinking time.

SPEAKER_02 9:22

This past fall, my husband, he was out of town, and I went to check cattle in the evening. We had a couple heifers too. And I looked at our round bale feeder, and this heifer was standing there, and you could see the hole in the hay where she had been eating for like a really long time. She kind of had a rut underneath her, she had her head stuck in the dang round bale feeder. I'm like, Oh friend, how long have you been there? What is even going on? Yeah, I've said I had to call the neighbors and they had to come over and cut the dang thing and get her out. Like, you guys knew dad was gone. Yep, you did this on purple.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

They do, I swear. I swear. Boss man's gone. Let's go have a party, let's go see what we can mess up or get stuck in. Absolutely. It never fails. And I and then we have some Houdinis that it doesn't matter what you put them in, they would get out. We no longer have those Houdinis, but yeah, uh, yeah, it just gets old. And I also don't want anybody to get hurt on the road, but exactly make sure that you guys have the capability to keep them in. I have talked to um some of our transporters, and they will show up, and people have have like a big cardboard box for these cows.

SPEAKER_02 10:43

I have heard these stories. Have you heard these stories too? Yes. I, you know, I was talking um to Victor Ash at one of the cow cowgirl confident events, and um he was talking about he'll show up to pick up a cow, and they're just like out in huge fields. They don't have that confined. They have absolutely they're like, oh yeah, they're out in the back 40. They have no way of getting them. It's just an absolute nightmare. So we um were very purposeful with how we designed our fence, um, our how our pastures are connected. They all sort of feed into one central dry lot where our chute is, which a trailer can easily be backed up to. So when we were designing all of this, we're very thoughtful um about the way it would work and how we're it's a closed system. You know, you can get from every pasture one fence or one gate at a time, and it just works. So all of that stuff needs to be thought through when you're building it, or else you're gonna be going back and changing things, and it gets real expensive real quick when you're messing around with that stuff.

SPEAKER_01 11:58

And I do really recommend having a head gate.

SPEAKER_02 12:03

Oh, you have to.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

So many people say they can get by with just panels. You can get by, but sketchy, yeah, and you're way better off. Like right now, we are dealing with pink eye, which yeah, with the pink eye, I we have a dark gun. We can use a darken for for it. But if you don't have that and you need to get them in for some of these that do have pink eyes so bad, my vet comes out and gives them a shot in the eye, which I just cringe every time, but yeah, it has to be done, and then patch the eye so then they don't lose their eye. So there's so many things to think about that you don't realize, you know. Oh, I can just put them out there and pet them and all that.

SPEAKER_02 12:53

I know, and it's so hard with social media, and people get the wrong impression about these cattle that they're teeny tiny and you can have them in your backyard. I I've had people call and asked about the minotaur ones that you can keep in your apartment. Have you seen that, TikToker?

SPEAKER_01 13:18

Yes. Oh my gosh. I have seen this so many times. I'm like, but what they're not showing you is I'm just gonna say it, all the shit you're gonna have in your house. I could have said PCs, but guys, really, it's disgusting. Um I was gonna go to AI school, like I was all for it. And till I watched my brother-in-law literally doing AI on one of our cattle, and it exploded all over on his face. And I'm like, I'm out. Yeah, so that can happen too. That's what's gonna happen. All your furniture, your flooring, and heating. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 13:58

Exactly. They call and I'm like, I'm so sorry, but you gotta get off social media. That's not real. Even these micros, like, they're not they're not that tiny. They grow up and they're still small livestock, and they require all the things that big livestock do. And um, yeah, so social media, it just does everybody a disservice, honestly. But that's it can, and especially now that we have AI to add to it. Exactly. Oh my gosh, some of these images I see in my face, faces off.

SPEAKER_01 14:33

I get sent a lot of um, oh my gosh, you need this. Yeah, it's a T cup Highland. Um, I know maybe my dream tonight I can catch one. Yeah, because it's not gonna be in real life.

SPEAKER_02 14:50

Laura, if you can make that happen, you got the market in your pocket. Right.

SPEAKER_01 14:55

That's just magic. But I don't love that idea, and I think you don't love that idea either, because I know that you're like us, and we're not breeding for the smallest in the world, we're not breed breeding for color, we are breeding for confirmation, and I've seen you guys do the same thing. I feel like people overlook this. So I wanted to talk about this a little bit. Um, people overlook confirmation. I have a group, it's hard for me to let a lot of post through. There's so many bowls that need to be cold. There is so many, so many bowls that need to be cold. There's so many of those that need to be cold too, to be honest. And they think everybody thinks everything should not turn into hamburger, and it's been a hard lesson for me. I won't eat my own steers, and we have commercial cattle. I get mine from the neighbors because I get attached, literally get attached, but I also know that it has to be done or the market's gonna be flooded. And with that, just stopped naming my steers.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

Oh, that's a great idea, actually.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

And some of them, if they're because we have um the mini crossbreed highlands, this the chondro positive, and with those, I'm not beyond sending a steer as a mate with a heifer so they're not alone. Then later, when that heifer goes to calf, you've got that steer to be in the pin with what you're weaning.

SPEAKER_02 16:42

I love buddy steers. We're actually um getting ready to to band one of our calves that we have right now to go live in Rhode Island as a buddy steer. Um yeah, and honestly, he he might be a nice bull, but for every nice bull, you know, there's 10 excellent bulls. So you have to be really cautious with what you're passing on as breeding stock. And you know, people when they eat or send a message or call about these calves, they they're not always asking the right questions. They're not asking about their structure, they're not asking about their feet, they're not asking sometimes they're not even asking about temperament. They look at color, they're like, Oh my gosh, they're so cute. How big are they gonna be? And those are the questions I get. I'm like, oh my goodness, gracious. So there's a lot of education that goes into it as well.

SPEAKER_01 17:38

And it's hard choices that it is, and I feel like our community needs to get stronger with this, stronger with educating people. And I I understand that people want to start trying to earn their um investment back maybe faster than what it really should be. Literally, we've been doing this for my brain, four or five years. I don't know. But I still am really not I really still don't have my investment back. I know it takes time, it does. This is probably it's more of a hobby in all in all honesty, because of what you have to when you start talking about the feed and the vet bills and the oh my gosh, how you're gonna produce and all of that. And we got into the embryo world that is very costly, it's so expensive.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

It is, and especially when those embryos don't stick, yes, which you know 50% of them don't.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

And we just had an incident where we went and let a company that does this put our embryos into their cows, and then we can buy the bread cow after 60 days if it's still bread. Well, we know that these embryos have been fine in the past, but you never know what weather, you know, the climate, the even the cow, all of that, if it's gonna be, you know, there's so many variables that can fall into place when you're doing embryos. We ended up with only five out of 30 sticking. Yeah, that was oh lord, that was a terrible loss. And we know from past experience that we don't know what happened with these, you know, you don't, right? Um, but our other ones that have the same pairings have stuck, so it just depends. So you get wrapped up into a lot of money with that, but not just that, when you're first starting out, you have got to make those decisions, and those decisions, I feel like you know, if that bowl, you can grow him for a while, not just selling straight as soon as they as soon as they fall out. I have people asking me, what should I sell this bowl for? And I will say, you want me to be honest right now with the market the way it is, take them to the sale barn. And it's hard, it's hard.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

They're tough to sell, and you really don't make a whole lot of money at them. So we have gone to collecting our bull and getting heifer semen, and you just get a better yeah, you just get a better return on your investment that way. You know, we were on the subject of you know what we would tell people when they start off. Um, and and the other thing is maybe don't buy calves, you know. It it's really and we did this. We started off with three um calves and then we bought some older cows as well. But if you're looking to really know what you're gonna get in the future as far as you know, their offspring, and you're looking to get a return on your investment faster, you know, buy older animals so you can see what they actually are gonna mature to be and so you can breed them sooner if that's your goal. If you're just looking for, you know, fun, fluffy pets, we'll get calves. That's amazing. But if if you're looking for this to be a business sooner and to really make sure you're protecting your investment and you don't buy a calf that grows up to be something you don't necessarily want to be breeding, and now you're you're out that money.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

Exactly. And I will I'm gonna put in there make sure you're buying from reputable breeders.

SPEAKER_00 21:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

We have a Highland page, Gara Webb has a Highland page that, and there's some others, but those are really reputable places to find. Good breeders. Make sure that you get a reputable mentor. I mean, I have always been more than happy to help people find the right animal. Yes. Even if it's not from me, I would rather have them find right animal and start off correct by something just because it's available right now. Exactly. And then also, if you do buy that cow, the older cow, make sure that you know that it's coming from a place that has checked their cattle for BVD.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Because we did come, we did when we first got started, and I've shared this before on our podcast, we had the mom can be um BVD negative or pie negative. But that baby, if it's around anything that is sick with BVD, the first zero to a hundred days, they can be BBD pie and a constant shutter, which is an absolute nightmare, and you're heard. So there's yes. No signs, no nothing. She was actually one that was constantly getting out too. But yeah, but we decided to, we kept hearing about this BBD. We we were we didn't know anything about it. And we started testing our herd. We found out that we did have one out of those that was back when we had the 444-ish one, and it was the bottle calf we had bought was BBD pie. It was not, I'm not blaming this on the owner because the owner actually purchased the cow bread from an auction. Sure. And so they didn't know what yeah, and that was before I realized now anything that comes to my place, they get BBD tested before coming near here. But that was that's one thing about when you're purchasing the cows, and I think another thing, do you see this a lot too? Like um, with confirmation, they're telling you that this calf's gonna be 42 inches, but their legs are like this long already. I know, I know.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

I can't with the measurements. So especially when one of the parents is contrapositive and they come out, the calf comes out negative, and now you're telling the customer that they're gonna be, you know, in between the mom and the dad's height. But realistically, you know, if one of them is contrapositive, you don't know where they're gonna end up. So unless I have two negative cattle parents, um, and then I can give more of an accurate estimation of what the calf is gonna end up being. But yes, I see that a lot in posts where they guarantee they're gonna be a micro, they're gonna be so tiny. And I have chondro positive cows that are about the same size as my chondro negative bull.

SPEAKER_01 25:18

If you look at that, Chondra does not always mean small.

SPEAKER_02 25:24

No, it doesn't, and and people really just need to do their research. Yes, and again, that comes down to reputable breeders. You're buying from the right people, they will be honest with you about that kind of stuff. So, yeah, and you just need to be to be really cautious. And back to the BVD, um, another thing that people need to realize is that these health certificates, you know, a vet can write a health certificate on an animal that they have never seen. If they have been to your property within the last 30 days and you call your vet and say, hey, I'm shipping this one out next week. Can you write me a health certificate on them? They'll do it. So you just have to be cautious and make sure you're asking the right questions and asking for the correct testing and proof, realistically, proof that this stuff has been done before they end up at your farm. And then we always quarantine adults when they get here, away from the rest of our herd, and you know, we're gonna be able to do that.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

Even if they don't look sickly, yeah, and even if they come from a reputable place because there could be something in transport, it might not be obvious, and it's not the transporter's fault, because I guarantee you every transporter that I use they will not let a sick animal on. But you just never know. They don't know, like DVD pie if they're showing those symptoms, they may not know that that cow is or cow, calf, I guess, um, is that and now you've infected and your cattle might not come up with being have any signs of illness, runny nose, whatever, until or diarrhea. Um, until they're it's okay, until they're a couple um a week in. It's just like us when we get exposed to a cold, we it's you know, two to five days, whatever gestation usually.

SPEAKER_02 27:24

So yeah, exactly. So 10 we do 10 to 14 days um in quarantine before they're allowed to have any even over-the-fence contact, like they are away from the rest of our herd. Um until we can make sure that they don't have any symptoms and that they're doing okay, because then you know you're putting the rest of your herd and your investment at risk.

SPEAKER_01 27:45

You just have to be cautious, and that goes for water troughs too.

SPEAKER_02 27:50

Yeah, sharing water troughs, yes, absolutely. I'm sorry, I'm just letting my son know to come get this dog that's that one. Oh, that's okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:02

I probably have some running around here too. I don't know where they're at. I seen how much um you have the high beliefs and the confirmation. And for me, as as you, I think I would rather have that confirmation have them be structurally sound than have them be teeny tiny. I mean, I've got some teeny tiny calves.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

The goal is yeah, I have teeny tines, but I probably won't breed them. Yeah. And and that's the other thing. You have to be really cautious when you're buying these calves and they're teeny tiny because if you're looking to breed them in the future, you could run into trouble. I I was speaking with um potential customer about this. They came out over the weekend and they were saying how they wanted to get two counterpositive peppers and a negative bull. Which okay, but I was like, I strongly encourage you to go the other way. Yes, yeah, way easier to manage a smaller bowl, and you're gonna have much better outcomes for your your heifers, um, if they're bigger.

SPEAKER_01 29:21

And my vet does pelvic checks, and you need to do a pelvic check on those. Yep. And that could be three to four years before they're ready. Yep. And we talked about it. Yeah. And we've learned, we've learned some hard lessons, some very hard lessons. With we were never gonna have chondro in our herd whatsoever. We ended up with an accidental chondro to chondro. So the steer I still have, he's negative. But he was okay, right? Then I've had one that was bred, and we went and did a aborted it. Um, and when we aborted it, it ended up um we lost the mom too. Because we thought, okay, if we abort this, then we we don't have to worry about it, right? Yeah, well, we lost the mom on that. And we're not sorry to hear that. Yep. So there is so many things, and usually, you know, I don't like sharing this. I don't like people to think differently about farms that have these things, but I do this for education. I share my experiences because I've lived the hard side of it. I've the couple of the incidents that we've had, and I want people to realize what can happen when you do that. We actually have lost some calves that were born from a conduit mom because they were hard poles.

unknown 30:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 30:56

And or the calf grew so big that it came out and was, and we had we use, I mean, small bowls, and my bowls are normally they're gonna throw smaller calves, some of them, like what we've ran into. This should have worked out better than it did. But they were so curved under, and there was nothing we tried rehabbing, we everything possible, and we had that happen, and he was a beautiful, beautiful oh, that's hard. Yeah, yeah, it was a gorgeous calf, but and it was our dream calf. Um course, but he was worn bigger, and he was a hard pull, and then we took him in, or we took mom in for the C-section. We had a newer, we had a newer vet. She tried the polling too. We we mom's fine, and we'll keep her, she'll never leave. And she can probably be bred back. I'm just not gonna breed her back. We may use use her and take some ocytes because I love mom, but um, I'm not gonna put her through that again. So that's traumatic. It is so we've had enough issues that Sean's like, you need to you need to sell all these Condro girls as pets.

SPEAKER_02 32:19

It's tough, it really is. It is so we actually um we use a product called a mucall device, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:30

So I have two of them.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

It's fantastic, and we make sure that they go on all of our first cathoppers, and definitely we only have two contrapositive mamas, but they go on them, and they have worked for us every time. It's really fantastic. So if people don't know how these work, they go on the the head of the tail, and just the way the tail twitches when the mamas having contractions, if it goes on for an hour, you get an alert to your phone. I think it's hysterical because my phone moves. Does yours move when you get the alert?

SPEAKER_01 33:07

I'll be honest, I haven't set mine up yet, but I got them after I had my I had got them after I had that in the instances.

SPEAKER_02 33:15

Yes. So it literally will move and it scares the crap out of me every time. It'll be like 3 a.m. I'm like, is there a cow in the house? What did the kids do this time?

SPEAKER_01 33:26

Oh my gosh, that's hilarious.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

It saved us a couple of times um with mamas that have had trouble and have really needed help, needed the calf to be pulled, or we had one that actually needed a C-section. She came to us unbeknownst to us, she was bred. The people had AI'd her, but they thought she came back into heat. She did not, and we went to go sink her up. And I was like, Oh, hey, there's a baby in there, alright. Fantastic. She caught it before they gave the meds. Oh, I know, right? Um, and she's a small heifer, and they had brought her to a full-size island. Full size island.

SPEAKER_01 34:12

So that's another story. Do not always believe people when they tell you that their bowl throws small caps.

unknown 34:25

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 34:26

I am very like, I won't even breed mine yet to my bowls that I have now because I don't know the percentage, like the birth weights. I wish we did more of this. I wish we kept track, even in the registered world, because we also have uh the registered um our show highlands. I wish they kept track of birth weights a bit more. I mean, I I keep track of them, but a lot of people don't.

SPEAKER_02 34:54

And and you never know. So they tell you they throw small calves. But you know, they might be small calves that come out with huge heads and huge shoulders, and they're like these little brick sit houses, but they're tiny. Yeah, you know, so so they're not easy births, they might be contrapositive, but again, they're thick.

SPEAKER_01 35:16

They are thick, they are thick, and that makes a huge difference.

SPEAKER_02 35:23

Yeah, absolutely. And that's again something that needs to be talked about. I spent over an hour on the phone with another farm that's just getting started the other day, and they were just asking all sorts of questions and um wanting advice on things, and that's kind of one of the things that we talk about. It's you have to be aware that it's not always sunshine and roses when it comes to these birds, you know, you need to be aware of when your cows are calving, and a lot of times you need to be there, they could need help. And if you don't know what to look for, you know, to even recognize that they're gonna calve, and if you don't know just a little bit of basic knowledge about how to help them while you're waiting for a vet to come, you know, or get them loaded.

SPEAKER_01 36:15

That's another thing. There's a lot of vets that won't come to your place. Yeah, mine, I'm fortunate if it's late at night, they want me, they want me to go to the clinic. So if they have to do a um for to have their sterile equipment and stuff. I mean, if it's an absolute dire emergency and they need to come out, they will. But some vets you've got to figure out you have to figure out how to take them, and those mamas are not getting up sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 36:43

No, not at all. And a lot of you know, a lot of folks don't have a trailer when they're just getting started. So they get into these situations thinking that there's never going to be a situation, you know, there's never gonna be an emergency. It doesn't even occur to them. So it's really important that you're educating again, goes back to education and making sure people are aware and they're prepared. And that's one of the things that we focus on.

SPEAKER_01 37:13

I feel like as a community, we can all do better about educating versus just trying to sell that animal.

SPEAKER_02 37:20

100%. I think if you're a buyer and all they're wanting to do is, okay, how soon can you send the composit? How you know, when do you want to pick them up? If they're pushing and pushing, I I would walk.

SPEAKER_01 37:34

Yes. Or my husband said, if I sell them tomorrow, then I can sell them for this price, or things like that. I think proper education about sizes, like I tell people, I'm 5'4. My sisters are five nine and five ten. Right as far as as far as I know, we came from the same parents. That's what they they've always told us. But you're the milkman daughter, what's happening here? Yeah. But you know, some of us are shorter than the other two. And we can't we can't predict that with Highlands. Um, when I first start when I first got started, I had a high expectation that I wanted everything to be under 42 inches. I learned real fast. They grow to 42, they can grow to 42 inches real quick. Real quick. Real quick. Like what just happened? Yeah. I have a high, I had a high park. He's still um, he's breeding some dairy cows and stuff right now. Actually, he's I sold him to somebody else. They had a different purpose for him, and it's works for what their purpose is. So, but he was supposed to be around 42 inches, and um, he's 50.

SPEAKER_02 38:57

Holy moly.

SPEAKER_01 39:00

Yeah. He's 50 inch bowl. That's wild. Yep. He was this, he's a sweetie, absolute sweetie. We had some neighbors that came and asked us if we had any bowls, and I said, Well, we have this one, he's kind of big. Oh, we just need something that'll breed our jerseys.

SPEAKER_02 39:21

So okay. If if that works for them, excellent. Everybody has different purposes, and you know, that probably saved him from being hamburger. So whatever.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

Yep, it did. But yeah, I think we just need to focus more. Um, and I really like that you guys um under you guys understood that or understand that just from looking at uh your posts and stuff, and I think that's awesome. And I love how you educate your customers and the right way. Um, yes, it's so important.

SPEAKER_02 39:56

We actually went out to Virginia and we sold a couple of heifers to a family in Virginia, and these were their first cows on their farm. They didn't have anything set up, but they wanted to make sure they were prepared. So we worked with them and Four Rivers to get a chute and everything set up, delivered at the same time that we were delivering the heifers. We drove out to Virginia, we stayed for four days, we worked with the family to set up their chute, their pens, did a ton of education with them. You know, we just want to make sure that they are on the right path. And since they've called me a couple of times, I adore them. Um, she called me one time late at night and had a cow that was having a tough time in labor and was like, I don't know what to do. And so we FaceTimed and, you know, worked with them to get that calf out. And that's kind of what we tell all of our customers. Once you are part of our family, we're here for you. Whatever you need, even if it's a silly little question or if it's a big ass, just let us know because we want you to succeed. We certainly want our animals to have long, healthy lives. Absolutely, whatever we can do to assist Matt, we're here for it.

SPEAKER_01 41:17

100% agree with that. That is so awesome. I'm trying to think what else. What have we not covered about you guys? You guys are in where'd you tell me you're at? Northern Illinois. Yep, Northern Illinois. And you guys have a website, don't you? Do you have a website? I think you do. Yeah. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 41:37

fwcolocompany.com. Check out their website. Yeah. I try desperately to keep up with it, but forgive me if all of our calves aren't posted in a timely fashion.

SPEAKER_01 41:48

We won't talk about my website. We have our we have our creekside highland haven that's for the mini crossbreeds. And then we have our uh Creekside Highland legacy that is our for our registered, because you don't want to put those two in the same category. You get you get a lot of heat um for that. So we have two, and I uh I need to update ours. Um, I have a fabulous gal that helps me out, but she's like, I can't do this unless you send me photos. Like, I need your help.

SPEAKER_02 42:25

Okay, I'm on it. Exactly. Can't read your mind of what you've got on the ground.

SPEAKER_01 42:31

Yeah, exactly. Well, Annie, I appreciate it so much. Is there anything else that you can think of that I think we covered almost everything on new people, like helping them to get started and getting started on the right foot? And that confirmation is way more important than size and color. Correct.

SPEAKER_02 42:55

If you want an animal that's gonna have long devity, structural soulness is where it all starts, and be produce great calves, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 43:07

It's so goal, and yes, some of us have certain colors that we like more than the others. Personally, I like them all.

SPEAKER_02 43:18

Once you get started, it's like you want your pasture to be like a crayon box, you know, you want a little bit of everything out there, yeah, and want it to be saturated with one color or another, and it's you know, if you have a a calf crop of all white and silver, that's boring, people are gonna get bored.

SPEAKER_01 43:41

I love black, like gorgeous, and I have produced, we have produced so many gorgeous black bowls. If I could keep them all, I would. But black bowls, black cows, I love them. I love them.

SPEAKER_02 43:58

Oh my gosh. We had a black that um wild type a couple years ago, and she had almost like this red um hue to her is absolutely gorgeous. But yeah, love black, love all the colors. I do too, so fun, and yeah, just structurally sound animals is weird.

SPEAKER_01 44:15

It is, and highlands are noted for not having the best feet. So if you don't know anything about feet, have somebody help you because Highland feet are so important. Um, they are they are known to have bad feet, and you don't want them to be super bad because that's important on both sides, the um uh maternal and paternal side of it, on having good feet.

SPEAKER_02 44:46

Yeah, absolutely, and then run into big, big problems, and you don't want to have to have them, you know, trimmed multiple times a year, you get scissor toes and nasty stuff going on, and it's not worth it. So those are questions to ask too. Ask to see pictures of their feet and of parents' feet when you're buying video, yes, 100% video. I love the FaceTime with my customers if they're far away.

SPEAKER_01 45:15

Side views are important, the front view of how cute their face looks is not that important, honestly. It really isn't. Um, at this time of year, if you want, if I have to send a picture of my calves, I call it the teenage stage that they're going through.

SPEAKER_02 45:35

They're wonky.

SPEAKER_01 45:36

They yeah, like they're it's the puberty stage, you know. The kids that have the greasy hair and pimples or you and our or when we were growing up, same thing happened. Yeah, right now my calves are kind of going through that stage. Yeah. So I'm like, don't hold it against the calf. They'll get there. They'll get there.

SPEAKER_02 46:01

Yeah, yeah. All right.

SPEAKER_01 46:04

Well, thank you so much. I appreciate you hopping on with us today. This has been so fun. Oh, I'm glad I got to meet you in person.

SPEAKER_02 46:13

Yes, ma'am.

SPEAKER_01 46:14

Yeah, we'll have to talk again soon. Yeah, I see you guys on the internet, you know. I see you guys on the Facebook, on the book of faces on on the Facebook or out there on the Facebook. Yeah, I see you guys there, but it's always great to put um a photo with the with the an actual human for real live people, not just AI apples. Right, exactly. That too. All right, thanks, guys. We appreciate you hopping on again, and we will see you next time with another episode of Horns and Hooves. We have another farm coming on to talk to next week. Thank you guys.