You're Probably Losing Clients in the First 5 Minutes

Most clients have already decided whether they trust you before you ever pitch.

Sometimes it happens in the very first interaction someone has with you. The email confirmation after they submit a form. The tone of the discovery call. The way your process makes someone feel before you've even pitched your services.

In this episode of Honest Brew, we talk about the quiet moments that shape whether someone trusts you enough to move forward. Not funnels. Not ad strategy. The small touch points that either make someone feel supported or leave them wondering if working with you will be chaotic.

Because when someone feels heard and handled well, trust builds quickly. And when they don’t, even the most promising lead can disappear.

If you’ve ever had a lead that seemed ready to work with you and then suddenly vanished, this conversation is for you.

A candid conversation between three seasoned business women who've been in the trenches of entrepreneurship. We bridge the gap between the glamorous just market and sell advice and the reality of what it takes to build a sustainable business. While most business content focuses on marketing, branding, OR operations in isolation, we bring all three worlds together. Because your brand culture needs to live in every system you create, your operations need to support your brand promise, and your marketing needs the infrastructure to deliver on what it sells.

We're here for the solopreneurs ready to grow beyond themselves, the partnership survivors rebuilding stronger, and anyone tired of business advice that treats branding, marketing, and operations as separate planets when they're part of one ecosystem.

HOSTS

Cheale Villa, Visual Caffeine, visualcaffeine.com / Monique Johnson, MoJo Design, ...

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Most people think that they lose leads because of their pricing or their website or because they didn't follow up fast enough. But what if the real reason is something that happens in the first five minutes of conversion, or even before you even speak? Welcome to Honest Brew. I'm Shell from Visual Caffeine.

SPEAKER_02 0:27

I'm Onique from Mojo Design, and I am Sarah from Indigo Elephant.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Today we're getting into something that every single one of us has learned the hard way. Your brand and your process are either converting leads for you or they're quietly costing you. We're not talking about funnels today. Just heads up. I think I'm I personally am so tired of that term, I can't even stand it. But we also are not talking about the ad spend or the Instagram strategy. We're talking about what happens in those first touch points: the email, the discovery call, the proposal, and how the way you show up either builds trust fast or make someone quietly ghost you. If you've ever had a lead that seemed so promising and then just vanished, you've come to the right place. Or if you're even struggling with lead generation, welcome home. We are ready to make some brew. I think the first place I think would be great to dive here. And it's funny me saying this being a branding person, but a lot of times the the engagement someone has with your company is not your logo, it is not your website, it is actually you. And that's that's a piece of this that I really love because what I'm pointing to is it's the first impressions. Let's ticklip ladies.

SPEAKER_02 2:02

First impressions are huge. And if you're not clear-minded, you have a concise message, and you are conveying to them that you have your stuff together, then they're gonna feel like, why would I want to work with that person?

SPEAKER_01 2:20

For me, I feel like when people think about like my branding has to be on point, my website has to be on point. Like I was in that mindset when first starting my business. But I've realized the confirmation when you book a call or do a contact form is so important because people don't want to think. I don't want to think. So simply seeing after you submit a contact form, like, thank you so much, I received it. I'll get back to you in 48 hours. Or you book a discovery call and they're like, here's your confirmation. I'll remind you an hour before at the time. Like, people want to feel supported. And for the people I work with, which maybe most of you, you're a service provider, you deeply care about your clients, you deeply care about the experience, the transformation, those little operational things can be so impactful. That's why for me, my website was clunky AF for a while, because I was so focused on okay, if they click this button, what happens behind the scenes so that I feel supported, but also they feel supported in that Sarah's already taken care of me before I even pay an invoice. So that's where I feel all of this has a time and a place. It's almost like phases. Like once I felt good about my back end, it was like, okay, visually, how do I want people to see me? What colors do I want to have that evoke in a certain emotion? Because yes, I do CRM build-outs, but what I'm actually giving people is relief.

SPEAKER_00 3:43

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 3:44

Kid call.

SPEAKER_00 3:45

Yeah. And I and I echo that in the, you know, we had a rebrand. We didn't have much time for building out the website, so we just got it to look and just got the the main stuff there. But we did want to make sure that that connection to our CRM system and all of that, like that was smooth and they're, you know, and we have our own like internal processes of, you know, how we move forward when someone reaches out and stuff like that. And yes, that stuff is totally valuable because I will say I from day one have been a relationship marketer. Not that we don't do other things that are marketing-wise, but that has been our core marketing strategy is relationship marketing. And so hence why I find customer service extremely important. And, you know, one of my team members, like that's part of her role. And she's actually I talked to Sarah yesterday about this. Her role is customer service and project management because those two tie together and it actually helps the customer experience be better that she's not only customer service minded, but that she's also minded about everything that's going on with them and their projects and all of that. And the reason I say this is yes, those that customer journey is extremely valuable. And I actually, when I support clients in figuring out what their customer journey is or figuring out where their gaps are from a brand perspective and a marketing perspective, like where those opportunities are missing, um, I don't start at the point somebody enters the door. We go into the touch points of where everybody is, where everybody is engaged with your brand. And for those of you that when we're using the term touch points, you may not understand what I mean. What I mean by that is that it's when someone somehow gets exposed or touched by your company in some way. Could be a conversation somebody has and they mention you, could be even a conversation they overhear, could be your website, your social media. It's a myriad of ways. And I that's actually something when I work with people, I really like to map that out of like what are your current touch points? Because it also can help you. It's a way to see where your blind spots are and also opportunities are too. Just wanted to put that as a side note. Yeah. But with that said, when you look at things from a relationship standpoint, and honestly, with AI entering more and more, we know that authenticity is becoming even more invaluable. And actually, authenticity has never been more important in a brand. But what is authenticity at the end of the day if you're not making about a connection in a relationship? Because that's ultimately what it's about. The reason they know you're being authentic is because they're connecting with you and having a relationship with you. And your brand should be rooted from those essence, those values, all those things that they're connecting with and actually truly make it authentic. So, what does that look like in the before times? Meaning the time that when someone finally becomes a lead, that first impression. But that first impression, you have to think about it in the terms of any touch point that you that someone could potentially interact with. And what is that experience with that touch point? But let's say that's the traditional way we think of first impressions. Traditionally, we think of a first impression as you have met me at an event. That's traditional, you know. But coming off of SEO efforts being successful and coming to your website, there's another first impression. But with that traditional first impression, it's not about telling them about your services. That that's a very uh, I think that is a place that we can go when we're feeling either insecure or we're so early in our business we don't know what else to say. So we lay them like, let me give you the list of my services. Like you're reading my website, right? The best way for someone to really engage and really like understand what it is to work with you is to you to ask the right questions, you to show interest in them, in what's going on with them. Because think about when you get on a discovery call, hopefully you're not sitting there selling yourself. You're actually like engaged with it. Yeah, understand your company deeper. I really want to like, right? And I think all of us in our businesses, that is how we approach things. I will say I have the moments when I network and I'm exhausted and I'm just like, yeah, this is what I do. My brain just doesn't want to function. Even 27 years later, do not worry about if you have it those days. We all do. We all like here we'll go into the list because I'm just too tired to even have this conversation, or I've got too much going on. With that said, does this bring up anything for you, ladies?

SPEAKER_02 8:23

One of the first touch points with a new potential client for me is the call, the first initial call. And you know, no one wants to get in a call and then just hear me rambling about all these different things about myself. The one of the first things I say is, I want to hear about you. And so I think genuinely listening to the person is like a huge way of not only supporting them and hearing them out, but getting the gut feeling if we're gonna be a good connection, um, and being able to work together and just really hearing their story. Like, what has their path been? Like people like to talk about their path because it's easy for them because they've experienced it. And I think that is a huge part, I mean, of what I do, branding and storytelling is learning about that person, capturing the essence of them, and then bringing it out into their visuals and their you know, strategy. And so I think just really truly is listening to them. We got a guest speaker, and I am listening, Monique.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

So it's David. Everyone, this is David Rose. This is what we're being distracted by. If you're listening on a pod-on, like you won't know that there is a black pug face in the in the in the video. So that means you need to jump to our YouTube channel.

SPEAKER_01 9:52

I echo what Monique said because even in my onboarding, I do discovery calls and I have them in the forum say like what their business is and give me links so I can stalk them a bit. However, I always want to them to share it on the call because they often are more open. I'm able to ask like better questions about them. Because especially for me, and I feel like for all of us, how we work is it's not just me building out an automation and go a high level. It's not like, oh, here's a brand kit or like here's a strategy. It's like, where do you want your business to be? While also factoring in what season of life are you in now? Like, are you looking to have a child soon? Are you gonna be moving? Do you have a sick parent? Because for me especially, I want what I create not to not only reflect the sustainability of having a successful business, but also have it aligned with how they want to live outside of it. And I don't understand that information unless I ask that on the call. Because that's where I am very much relationship first. I'm like, I don't really care about your industry. I don't really care what you what you do. I'm like, do we vibe? Would we be best friends? Like, would I be like, hey, let's go get a coffee together? Because that's so much more important because then it makes the experience fun. It doesn't feel so serious, and it's just an overall better partnership.

SPEAKER_00 11:11

Yep, agreed. So, what is the one question? I will tell you mine and you tell me yours. My favorite question to ask people is where you want to be in 10 years. There's nothing more that like someone will like hesitate but also flood from.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

The question is about their life experience, their journey. How did they get to where they are now? I love asking that question. It's you're like a past and I'm a future vision. Yeah, it's well, it's their backstory and they know it already, and they and it builds, it creates who they are, all their experiences, whether it's their past jobs or I traveled for five years of my life and I learned all these things. Like all of that makes each person unique. And so, um, yeah, that's my favorite question. Nice.

SPEAKER_01 12:01

Mine is what is suffocating you in this season of business?

SPEAKER_00 12:05

Oh, nice. Especially in operations. Operations is always suffocating people. Well, that's true. You're solving problems. She does suffocate the creatives, like, you know, or we just ignore it. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

Oh, people always ignore it. They're like, I'll do it later. And I'm like, honey, you're never doing it later.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Well, one reason I like the tenure question is when you ask someone where they want to be next year or when they where they want to be in five years, it's too close and they tend to stick in their story.

SPEAKER_02 12:38

Right.

SPEAKER_00 12:38

Whereas when you say 10 years, it's so far away, that's when they actually will like it will cause them to shift out of the box. And uh, and what that allows for is actually for them to pour out things that I'm like, you know what you just said you actually could do this year. Not don't know why you're seeing this. But the reason is that it's like they're their insecurities are hiding it over there in 10 years. Yes, which is pretty typical, which is such a beautiful place. So, hey, you listening, I see you there. Glad you're here. Get your paper out, write down these questions, answer them. You won't believe what it can tell you. So jumping into listening is a conversion strategy. So getting into that part that most service providers are waiting to pitch, and clients can feel that like that, like yeah, and what it actually means to someone to feel heard, feel handled. So, and we've touched on this. This is actually where our conversation went, which is what I love, but the calibration that you have with someone, be it it's the very first time you talk to them or it's a discovery call, you're not taking over their business when you're doing something for them. Uh, you're trying to build with them. And that's also it's like you're setting in place the way you talk to them the very first time to discovery call to whatever. You are establishing the foundation of that, that that relationship. And weirdly, that's a conversion strategy.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 14:13

I feel so connected. This with oh my gosh, I trust this person. Oh my gosh, this is the person I need to work with, right? Um, so what does it look like when a client feels like collaboration versus when they feel like it's transactional?

SPEAKER_02 14:32

Yeah. That's especially when it comes to branding, because you're so much of it is storytelling, but you're it's genuine storytelling. You're not making up uh this mythical whatever character. So just collaboration is a huge part of my, I mean, my process, because if the client feels like I'm not supporting them and I'm telling them this is the way it is, then they're not gonna feel like they they can trust me. I mean, I it's really about nurturing that relationship and um and them be able to trust me and that I can be a conduit to opening up their path and expressing that into their brand. That's so important in creating a unique voice for each brand, really.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

For operations, I feel for me, what I experience a lot is that they're embarrassed because I see the lack of I don't have SOPs. What are those? Like, I'm banding this together, I don't know if it works. Like, don't judge me. Like, there's a sense of embarrassment. And I also feel like in this industry as a whole, in operations, I see a lot of language and energy of like, let me just take ownership, let me do it for you. Or like, here's a snapshot for your high level. Here's just this a tutorial. As women, and I can speak for myself and some of my clients, they don't want someone taking ownership, they want someone to partner with them. Because to me, when I hear ownership, it feels like I'm taking something away that they no longer have control. Whereas for me, I'm like, no, I want you to feel empowered to use your tools or hire your dreamy team members because at the end of the day, I am honored to be a part of your business journey and being able to support your business getting to the level you want it to be, whether it is scaling or just feeling peace of mind that you're not staying up till 9 p.m. trying to fix an automation or waking up at 2 a.m. being like, I never sent a follow-up. You deserve peace in your business.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

And I can speak from personal experience. It's just, it's really, I mean, if I can brag a little bit about Sarah, it's showing options and then allowing the customer, which in case was me, to explore and then pick my own journey, my own path, right? Um, and I I think that's a huge part in collaboration is it's not just empowering them to do these things, but it's like educating them as well. I think education is a big piece of it. Feeling like I I value that Sarah allowed me to see these options and choose which one I think will work for me because no one knows your business better than you do. So I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

Thank you. I appreciate you. And I a hundred percent agree with everything you say because sometimes I identify as a go high level expert. So some people assume I'm going to force them into high level when it's like, yes, if you want to build out, I'm doing it solely in there. But if you're coming to me and consulting, like Monique does, for her case, go high level made no sense for her. I'm like, this is too much for her. It doesn't make sense. And when I said honey book, she literally lit up and was excited. And I'm like, that's how I know she will use it consistently.

SPEAKER_00 18:00

So I I do I do want to touch on some things before we close here. Being methodical and warm at the same time, they are not opposites. Uh and when you think of these touch points, these engagements, like Sarah mentioned a website or like the discovery call or all of those things, things to think about just in general. And I know this is coming for me and not Sarah, but I'm just to me as just a business owner. Um, you know, think about things like what is your email response time? Uh, you know, do you have a calendar link? Like is there is there a fast way for someone to grab on to you? Um your follow-up sequence says a lot about your operations. So, you know, it's like, and this is like the I feel like the first impression, we talked about it being the old-fashioned first impression. The first impression leads up to, I think you have been officially hired. You know, it's a longer, it's like the longer first impression because I think it's it's it's an overall experience at the end of the day. But just know that the comfort that comes from the client is knowing what happens next. Uh, when people are left with with like, not saying that they're not gonna have questions, it's not gonna be perfect, but when people are left with asking and stuff too much in their head, they're getting insecure about your ability to serve them. And none of us want that. So just remember impressions are not just your smiling face, your visuals, it's actually logistical. So, with that said, what is one operational touch point in your process that you've intentionally designed to build trust?

SPEAKER_02 19:41

Action items after a meeting.

SPEAKER_01 19:43

Nice, she literally stole mine. Mine is having after a call, whether it be a discovery or a coffee chat, showing my appreciation for them spending time with me and then what they can expect from me next.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

Nice. And the first one that comes up for me is scheduling that follow-up call. Yes, I second that. Because in weirdly, what that does for me is it's not just designed to build trust, but it confirms to me that there has been an established trust. And it's almost like the, but it to me, it's it just is is a beautiful uh way of continuing the relationship. Kind of like you text me and I respond to you, you know, like the guy that doesn't call you back, you know, you know, like I'm not calling you back. We have a we have a triangle here of action, is your brand clarity, your marketing conversions, and your operational processes and all these things working beautifully and succinct, and not thinking that one is not important or I'll get to it later. Because, like Sarah said, if you think you're gonna get to it later, you never will. And that's coming from someone who has been in business for 27 years. And I leave you with this quote to brew on the Discovery Call isn't just for you to learn about them, but it's for them to see how you think. And with that, last sips.

SPEAKER_01 21:17

So if you're feeling overwhelmed, of everything feels chaotic, I don't know what to do, what can ground you is coming back to your values and being able to audit your site to your onboarding experience. Do those values align? So for me, integrity and transparency are very clear. So if my website is very transparent on my process, and then I don't gatekeep anything in proposals or anything like that, so they're not blindsided. That is how you can have a cohesive experience because it's all grounded in your values and mission as a business owner. And that's what always will keep you sane when you're like life is too crazy. I feel lost, I feel confused. Come back to your values.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

Lovely as always. Next time you get a discovery call, pay attention to whether you're selling or whether you're showing. There is a huge difference, and it can mean the difference between a new client or someone that'll ghost you next. And with that, like, subscribe, all of the things because we want to stay connected with you. Thank you so much for being here.