I remember finding out I was pregnant with my second child in the midst of all of that. Some people say, I'm glad that happened. It taught me this and that. I am by no means glad that happened. It was horrible. I cried myself on the way to work every single day.
SPEAKER_02Every owner has that in them, right? We're gonna get there no matter what. You have to.
SPEAKER_00Nobody gets where they are by just finding an easy way out. So it's not all for nothing. If we didn't go through some of these times, we wouldn't really be like the business professionals that we are today.
SPEAKER_03I remember if we had a $20,000 day, it's like, holy shit, you know, I'd jump off the roof. And then if we had a zero, it's like, oh, it's the end of the world.
SPEAKER_00So one of the questions I hear a lot of people say is, Do you think anybody can own and run a business? And honestly, I really don't think that. But not everybody's got it in them.
SPEAKER_02Almost everything that we're doing is all mindset. Like it's all belief and it's all interpersonal communication. That's it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you absolutely have to learn in this business how to sell on value.
SPEAKER_02Looking into the future, what are you excited about? And what do you have on your radar?
SPEAKER_00I am not threatened by so the wildest thing that's ever happened to me since I became an insurance agent is that I opened my doors with my carrier in February of 2015 as a scratch agent with zero customers. Uh in August of that exact same year, my carrier threw out a 60% rate increase in my state. So the vast majority of the customers who had signed up with me for those six months canceled. And then they threw out uh tons of limited guidelines to where it was almost impossible to write any new business policies. So for the first 12 to 24 months of my agency ownership uh were back-to-back to back rate increases, probably close to a hundred percent uh by the time it all evened out in those uh renewal cycles. And I couldn't write hardly any new business at all. And my husband and I were in the agency together. We had put all of our eggs in the same basket. There was no outside income coming in from anywhere else. And by the grace of God, we made it through. And here we are, 10 and a half years later. We are still with the same carrier. We are uh business is booming, we're doing phenomenal, and it's just a story of a miracle of a young 25-year-old girl who somehow made it through a really tough insurance cycle at the beginning of her career. And my name is Kathy Hitchcock at the Hitchcock Insurance Group in Rome, Georgia, and I am an insurance dudet.
SPEAKER_03That was incredible. That's probably the best best told story that has ever been done on this podcast.
SPEAKER_00No way. No way.
SPEAKER_03It sounds like this is the thousandth episode, the way that this just came together.
SPEAKER_00I'm here.
SPEAKER_01I am a dude.
SPEAKER_03This this may be the first of season four? I don't know. I don't yeah. That's above my pay grade. I don't know. The exact table.
SPEAKER_00You're just the owner.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we have a lot going on around here.
SPEAKER_02Well, that is that is crazy. You know what? I I love the story in the sense of a a couple things. One is who has not felt like that at some point? I mean, especially if you've been around for a while. I've been around for almost 10 years, and there has been a couple times where you feel like you you're the most expensive that your retention goes down to to nothing. You know, like like you just feel like you're circling the drain, which wasn't too long for me, uh too long ago for me. But then also what's crazy is the uh just the fact that uh you know, like having your all of your eggs in one basket, like that feeling you know, of uh being all in on this, you have nothing else, and you need to pull yourself out, which is crazy because it's also like a lot of our clients when they come in, the most successful clients that come in are the ones that feel like that. They're like, dude, I'm gonna lose my agency in a few months if I don't make a drastic change. Those are the ones that have the most success because it's that go time. It's that like fire to the feet, it's either this or nothing.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And usually you learn your best lessons through that period of time. When there's no plan B.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, your back's against the wall, you gotta figure it out. You cannot fall on your face. There is, I mean, there is simply no other option. I remember finding out I was pregnant with my second child in the midst of all of that. And I thought, well, here we are. Here we are. We well, I mean, and this is it. So um it is, it's it's a lesson. I look back on that. I'm not I, you know, some people say, I'm glad that happened. It taught me this and that. I am by no means glad that happened. It was horrible. I cried myself on the way to work every single day, but I um I made it through, so it built my confidence a little bit in myself to let me know, like, I'm gonna figure it out. I'm I mean, I'm gonna find a way to make it work.
SPEAKER_03I mean, there's seasons to everything, right? Yeah. And uh I'm sure that just before all that started happening, it was it was feeling like a pretty good, nice spring, you know, and and it was already you're like, summer's coming up, we got some money, and then cold winter, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and you know, that's kind of what our staff have to learn the hard way too when they come in, is this is a really cyclical business. And until you've been through it, you you really don't get it because the kind of the notion coming into this is it's recession proof, it's pandemic proof, it's everybody's gotta have you gotta have insurance because you're on the road, you're driving, or if you have a mortgage on your home, that you gotta have insurance. But that doesn't mean that your carrier wants new business all the time or wants the you know household. Jason can speak to that, I believe. Yeah, probably so.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah. Yeah. Little California struggle. And and the two the two things to that is one is you you have to have you have to build your book to the size that um I mean I guess that's the it's the whole premise of insurance, right? The law of large numbers. Like you have to have enough policies in the book to where it's like, okay, I'm losing some, but I still have some, and we're still being able to cross-sell and stuff like that. So you you have to build it to a certain size. And you the other thing, and I just there's so many agents that do this, and there's so many agents that don't. But it's like in the season that you can uh that you have the opportunity to grow, take it. Take the opportunity. Don't buy depreciated assets.
SPEAKER_03Oh, I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_00No, I was just saying make pay while the sun shines.
SPEAKER_03It's like the human condition. Everything's great, I can take my foot off the gas, right? And then collapse, right? Because you don't even see it. There's such a lag, right? Where every a lot of folks are always looking at the lagging indicators when, you know, on the other side of it, we need to be looking at those at the leading indicators, the ones that are actually gonna make the difference, like the activity, right? I mean, you could be you could be crushing it today and think, oh, and I've done, I'm guilty, and I know probably both of all of us are guilty, is you're crushing it. Hey, you know what? I'm gonna turn the leads down, not get quite as many leads, save a little buddy, and then a month later, you get wham, you know, nothing. And you're like, oh no, what did I do? It's a big slap.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the reminder is is wild. I actually had somebody say that, and I don't, you know, you people will tell you things, and then all of a sudden sometimes you're just in the mind frame to hear it. And so I purchased an agency at the beginning of this year, and I basically doubled in size. I had a huge growth year last year. Um, we probably grew a well, I call it huge. We probably grew, and there was rate increases in there, but we probably grew about three million dollars organically with very few producers last year. Wow. And so um I was feeling like, you know what, I think I might can go about this organically. Like I think I might can just really throw all the cash flow into organic growth. And then I started, you know, looking at at book purchases because we were doing so well. I thought, well, now's the time because you never know when that dial is going to turn and like no purchases. And um, I remember the broker selling the book said, Look, you gotta buy, you gotta buy while you can because you never know, you know, when the higher ups and the powers that be who make these decisions will just come in one day and say, All right, we're not writing in your state anymore. Or we're not gonna be able to do that.
SPEAKER_03Even after they've told you you can buy, they can tell you that you can't.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, they can do that. Imagine that. Yeah. So you do I do. I agree with that sentiment, and and I am a big advocate for the people who are able to purchase a book and they have the staff and the the resources to handle it, um, as opposed to the organic, you know, route, simply because they can they can flip their switch and and make a choice to, you know, change things in your area or change your guidelines or your rates at any point, and just having that cushion is a big uh just peace of mind, really.
SPEAKER_03Kathy, have you watched, like, have you kept your eye on the difference? Like, okay, you have your primary book that you that you've worked on and built, you know, blood, sweat, and tears, and then you you get the purchase. Have you separated it and then watched that and see what the you know, is the retention different? Like, talk a little bit about that because it's not just you know, rainbows and unicorns when you buy another one, right? Because now you took on some debt and the debt doesn't go down, but often that retention dips a little bit after the purchase, there's a little attrition and all that. So I'd love to hear a little bit about that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I wish and to be honest with you, I am uh a very rigid kind of operational type watcher, but that is although I did keep these specific two books separate, I have not kept a very close eye because we're running everything with the same team. I did not separate the team. So even if I saw that one book was having, you know, maybe some I don't and I don't think anything honestly is gonna be super different because I have the same customer service team handling both books, I have the same sales team selling in both books equally, and so I'm just kind of watching the right now, and I'm only I'm only seven, six, seven months in. Um, and I did keep them separate for that reason, so that if I need to, you know, sell off one, I can. But I've got the same team running running everything, so I'm looking at my overall numbers, and my numbers are not bad, but I have uh I I I um I have very high standards and we've always kept good numbers, and so anytime the least little bit slips, I'm kind of I mean, Georgia's just spectacular because your your rates are so you know, I mean it's huge premium.
SPEAKER_03So, you know, we're in you have you have Jason of California where it's probably what 500 bucks an item and Arizona's pretty close, a little bit higher. I think we're getting maybe at 700, closer to 800 sometimes.
SPEAKER_01Like seven, seven hundred.
SPEAKER_03Oh, okay. Yeah, it's a good I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_00I don't know what the other states, I know that Texas is a big, you know, talking point a lot, and I know Ohio is for the opposite reason that they have very low premiums. Um but you would think with all this explanation to customers, why is my rate going up? Why is my rate going up? But it has. I mean, we have a lot of Atlanta is just this spot where I think I read somewhere that Atlanta has more interstates coming through it in all different ways. Um so there are a lot of auto accidents, and the rates do tend to go up because of that.
SPEAKER_02That's where my grandparents are from. Oh, fine.
SPEAKER_00Hot Atlanta. Hot Lana.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, hot Lana.
SPEAKER_00Well, if you're ever out here, you'll have to let me know.
SPEAKER_02I haven't been out there since I used to play drums touring with bands, and I remember Atlanta had a Del Taco. We have Del Taco in in California, but Del Taco's nowhere else. Now there's one in Tucson.
SPEAKER_03What's that? There's one in Tucson. Now it's been there since I was in college. I mean, it's been there a long time. Oh wow. I mean 10 years it's been since college.
SPEAKER_00So there you go.
SPEAKER_02And I remember putting up the in our van, in our tour van, we'd I put up the placemat in there to remind me of home.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_02Little little teenage boy not knowing what he was doing back then.
SPEAKER_03And then there was no in and out anywhere else at that point. Right. Yeah. No, it's all over the place. A lot of waffle houses.
SPEAKER_00We have a lot of those.
SPEAKER_02Well, cool. Um I I want to kind of go back to that beginning where you were. I mean, I think we've all been there. Well, not maybe not as extreme, but like you're crying every day. You you've started this new agency, uh, people are leaving left and right, they raise the rates, the walls are caving in. How do you dig yourself out of that? Like, how how did you get out of that situation?
SPEAKER_00Honestly, um, grit it and I know that's kind of cliche to say, but I will put my work ethic up against anybody, and that's what did it because I didn't even have a team. It was my husband and I opened the agency together. We had his sister, uh, we hired her on day one as a customer service representative. We didn't even have the first customer. So um, she spent a lot of time doing telemarketing and sending us um people to quote, and we just worked tooth and nail um quoting it because the I mean you the close rate was very low because no one qualified and the rates were outrageous. So it was nearly impossible. I mean, I remember closing probably forty to fifty items a month, and it probably took the work of closing for both of us, probably what would be three or four hundred items a month now, but it just we couldn't close it, was just very hard to close business during that time because no one qualified or the rates were you know too high. Um, and uh honestly, just that work ethic. I I I do not I I hear I listen to a lot of business podcasts, and one of the questions I hear a lot of people, you know, say is do you think anybody can can own and run a business? Like, can anybody do it if they just and honestly, I I really don't think that. I think that you really that not everybody's got it in them. And if you cannot, you know, kind of put your nose down and blinders on and wear 10 million hats during the day at work while also going back home and then walking into your house and acting like everything's fine when you get home, making dinner, going, you know, school drop off the next morning, crying on your way to work between school drop off and work, and then coming in and yeah.
SPEAKER_02So um I think that it took it took a lot and it took a lot mentally, and it was it was very stressful, but um if somebody if you were talking to yourself back then, because I think a lot of people find themselves in this position at some point, something like this, this kind of like it's either all in or all out, like I'm you know, like like I'm gonna lose it. Like, what were the tangible steps? Like what what were those things that got you to the next level? And what levels were those that kind of like the stepping stones out into the position that you're in now?
SPEAKER_00Um, one thing I think that matters a lot is just having a really good support system. And I just don't think everybody has that. So, like if you don't have a an A player spouse or a good home life, you it's gonna be really hard for you to go into work and um and and still be able to put your best foot forward at work because the stuff that really matters in the thick of things it and right, you know. And that was one thing that I that I do have and have had is um my husband and I, we walked in every single day hand in hand. Okay, let's let's pound it out. Like let's, you know, here we are. We're you know, and we had a really great support system at home with child care. I didn't have to necessarily worry about, you know, getting my kids from school to daycare, you know, strangers watching them and things like that. So I was able to kind of focus on the business by knowing that my kids were with family members and and uh grandparents and stuff like that. And um, and so honestly, if I I I think if um if it hadn't been for just being in a really stable marriage, good home life, very peaceful life outside of work, it would have been really hard to turn on um, I guess that mentality walking into the office um because uh I would have been struggling elsewhere. And so that was that was helpful. And I I I still I'll tell my kids, I'll tell everybody the biggest decision that you could possibly make in your life is who you choose to marry. And um it it just matters in every aspect of your life. So that was that was good, and so it made it it made it okay. We were working alongside each other. We had his sister there, you know, there wasn't this um I I think it also matters just going a step further than that is be careful who you hire and don't hire out of desperation and don't hire people that maybe give you bad vibes, but you know, you you've you're just desperate, you know. And that's one thing that I've always tried not to do is like if I don't have a good feeling about somebody or I don't feel like I could go to dinner and enjoy my evening with them, then I don't hire them because um I'm not one of these people that can just turn on one face at work and then leave. And, you know, I I really need to get along with the people I work alongside. This was 2015 and 16. Nobody was working remotely, or I we weren't at least. I I mean I'm sure there were people working remotely, but we were all in the office, and so it really mattered to me just having people at work that I could count on that I knew were there who cared about the business, and then having people in my home life who cared about wanting to make sure we were okay.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, you gotta remove that drama, right? Because you get the drama people come it in, and you're just like, uh, it just makes it yeah, it's traded, it makes you not want to go to the place that you own, right?
SPEAKER_00You're just yes, and it's yeah, and you know females are bad. I mean, I'm a female and I can say it. I mean, uh, it females are I would never say that.
SPEAKER_03I know I would never say that.
SPEAKER_00I know, I can say it. I'm one of them. I'm difficult myself, I'm complicated too.
SPEAKER_02I think every owner is though. I mean, every owner has that in them, right? Like the I'm like, we're gonna get there no matter what. You have to.
unknownRight?
SPEAKER_02That's the first the the first part of this, and even like hearing your story is that you committed. You committed to doing this no matter what, you committed like I'm gonna make this work. And I I feel like I I can hear it in an agent's voice when they might like come into our program or something like that where I don't I know they won't make it, where it's like they're not committed. They're like looking at other things, like, oh yeah, you know, I don't know if it's gonna work out, kind of like talk, like the talk isn't all in, you know?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's no silver bullet, and a lot of people think there are, and they try several things, and those things help. Um, you know, put a band-aid on it sometimes. But um the real I mean, like nobody gets where they are by just finding an easy way out, you know. And um and and then within that personal growth and professional growth comes. So it's not all for nothing. If we didn't go through through some of these times, we wouldn't really be like the business professionals that we are today. Um we learn a lot in those times. I know you know y'all have both had that. And Jason, I'm I mean, y'all have been through a f a tough few years in California. I mean, I I you know, I know it it and you've probably learned and and kind of developed your skill set even more through learning pivoting skills and things like that, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, I almost I almost sold. I'm like I he was angry. I I definitely had that talk, you know, a couple, you know, last year and uh it was but yeah, I mean then I it was I had that coming to God moment of like you're either all in or all out. And I'm like, all right, well, then I suck right now because I'm not all in, you know.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, and there's those moments too. You have to give yourself grace, and I'm not good at that. I am not good at it, but we have to. I mean, we can't beat ourselves up all the time, you know, and um nothing lasts forever. And even if we did, even if even if you sold and decided to go another route, you've still got all this experience and you know that you've that you've learned along the way, all these lessons and uh the brand that you've built. So, but you're right. You you do have to be all in or out, all out because on the fence is really where I mean that's honestly one of the most toxic places and and dangerous places to be is waking up every day and either, I mean, I'd rather just check out and move on with my life or stay in and move forward with a lot of you know tenacity than wake up every day doing something different because then I'm stagnant, right? I don't get anywhere.
SPEAKER_02That's how you go crazy. There was a quote, something about it's easier to be a hundred percent than it is 98 because the it that 2% leaves so much. Yeah, it just it messes with your head so much. I'm ADHD, so I need to either be I like that's how I am. I'm like, I'm either all in, I'm either not eating carbs, I'm not eating bread, or you know, very extreme.
SPEAKER_00Yes. Yes, but honestly, I mean a lot of professional uh a lot of successful professionals are like that and they have that discipline to kind of stick with it once they make up their mind. And that's what helps them, you know, be really successful. Is like you, I mean, you know, like you said, I'm either, you know, on this on this meal plan or I'm not. And you know, if you stick, if you can hyper focus, ADHD can be a can be a really great trait to have in business because of the hyperfocus aspect, is what I've learned.
SPEAKER_03There, I mean, there's a much higher percentage, I think, of folks that have ADHD that are entrepreneurs, right? Yeah, number one, we're not employable. Number two, no, right? That would be the worst. We'll go. Yeah, like I like it. Oh shit, I'm doing this thing, right? Like you're 150%.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. No problem.
SPEAKER_03But uh, you know, that's the learning part. We're all that journey. Yeah, my toughest thing, and and I think, you know, probably the reason I put here is to learn balance. And uh it's a struggle, right?
SPEAKER_02Because that's the flip side, right? Like you can go all in on your job, on your work, and you can become super successful, but then it's like, what about at home? What about with your family? What about with it's like, well, then there's like too much stuff, and then it's like, okay, I need to learn how to be able to clock in and clock out at certain places.
SPEAKER_03Very difficult, you know. And I think also why most like regular the normies can't handle uh this this like doing this, right? Is because you they want to check out, they want to turn off turn off the noise and and just do their thing at home, right? The whistle went, yeah. Time to time to chill. And it's like, dude, I mean it's never time to chill. I I have another idea and I've got to freaking write it down or go find something to put it on. And you know, so there's always something. The the committee's always working up here.
SPEAKER_00Oh it doesn't ever turn off. I'm sure the notes app on y'all's phones looks about like mine because it's like I'll open it, I'll give it a little heading, tap out some ideas.
SPEAKER_03We have shared notes. You should see those.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I bet. I bet. But also on the same note is um it just on that topic is I think entrepreneurs have also have to have a little bit of OCD like obsessive, because you also it would be also very hard to um run a good business if if you're not kind of obsessed with it. Like in you know, all the aspects. Like I want my customer experience to be great. I want my sales to be high, I want my marketing to be perfect, I want, you know, the the development within my office to be on point. I want the culture correct. And and like you said, Craig, like we're always just throwing these ideas around. And what I've learned about myself, I got on myself for several years about work-life balance and okay, I just need to, you know, go home and do that. And I realize that's just not me. I'm just not built in a way that I can just turn it off when I walk in the door. And so now it's more about like, and I'm sure y'all have heard this, more work-life harmony. And so, you know, we take our kids on a lot of really great trips, as I'm sure you take your family. You know, that's one thing about owning a business, running a business. We're we're able to travel, we're able to do some fun things. But I tell my kids, like, look, you see this place, you see this hotel, you see this resort. Like, it's not free. So it's good the the sacrifice is I'm gonna have to get up and work for a couple hours in the morning before we hit the activities because that's just what comes with this gig. And if it weren't for this harmony, we wouldn't even be able to go to a place like this, you know. And so um, I'm sure y'all ran into that too, just taking your family somewhere, like you're never just you know, the whole time you're gone, just this carefree, you know, forgetting about what's back at the office.
SPEAKER_03I'm in San Diego six months and I'm in the garage because if I go sit out and look at the ocean the whole time, then I'm just gonna sit out and look at the ocean the whole time, right? I I need to be in here where the best thing is the computer.
SPEAKER_00You know, you might get inspired, you might have some really cool ideas hit you while you're out there. Yeah, it might spark some creativity and everything. Maybe the garage. I don't know. Whatever your thing, Craig.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean, I kind of like this garage.
SPEAKER_00I I like being at work, so I I enjoy working, I enjoy my desk. I know that's weird, but I do. I'm kind of a workaholic.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I found my myself in like 2022 or 2021, where we were doing the um we're doing this podcast, we're doing the you know, the the teledudes, we were doing um our agencies, and everything was growing, and it was like so much stuff. And we got this uh EOS to like kind of unwind everything, right? To to make everything um a little bit more streamlined. And that whole process definitely like we figured out how to really streamline everything to where we we were not doing that much.
SPEAKER_00Okay. So that's very interesting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but then I realized for me was I I mean, I like there's a lot of stuff I like to do. Even though I don't have to do it, I definitely shouldn't be the bottleneck in it. It it shouldn't be like if I don't do it, it doesn't get done. Right. But I like doing a lot of stuff. So like my part of what I like to do is is work on stuff, you know, and I'm a builder. So uh removing myself completely from some stuff was not a good thing for me. I did not like it, and it almost created uh self-doubt and like you you wonder I I don't know, like maybe some depression.
SPEAKER_00Maybe a little.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, a little bit, yeah. So I like I like being able to um you know have the business run without me, but I like I like working. I just do. I like working.
SPEAKER_00It is, it's kind of like a hobby.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, a hundred percent. I mean, there's that point in in agency ownership where you're where you're doing everything and you're also an LSP, basically, right? Where you're you're on the phone, you're talking to clients, and and I remember when I said, okay, I'm not gonna, I'm I I remember talking to somebody, I can't remember who it was, but you know, another agent that was really doing well and I wasn't doing that awesome. And I'm like, but I work 40 hours a day, you know, I don't understand. And he's like, you can't talk to the like you're at the point now where you can't talk to them. If you talk to them, it takes all your time. You need to spend your time working on it, right? Work on the business, not in the business. And like, like turning that off was very difficult, you know. Like, and I mean, for even until fairly recently, I think I still had a couple that were friends that would text me still about their stuff. I'm like, look, I I love you, but I no, you got to call the office. Like, I I don't even know how to log in anymore.
SPEAKER_00You have to have that boundary.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. But I mean, it's it's it is like no nobody died. The the it still works, you know. Yeah, maybe maybe it's not 99% or whatever, you know, wherever I had it, it might be at 80%, but I have a hundred percent more time. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00If somebody can do it at 80%, let them do it, you know what I mean? And then just spend go spend your time finding another person to go do it and let your efforts work on compounding stuff instead of the the very you know granular. I mean, hire other people to do the things that they can they can do, and and you go work on the things they can't do that you can't hire out, you know.
SPEAKER_03And contrary to our own belief, we're not the best at everything. So we need to.
SPEAKER_00We would think we are. I mean, you ask you know, ask anybody around here, and yeah, I get it. We like to think that, but there are people who I mean, there's better sales. I mean, I've you know, I've found people who I'm like, dang, I really like the way you worded that. I never thought about it that way. And you know, you're like, okay, maybe I don't know it all.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, you let go a little and all of a sudden you start learning some stuff.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, I agree. And that's really when um I think when you can kind of start, I was listening to a Grant Card uh Cardone Park podcast this morning where he was just talking about how you kind of graduate from salesperson to business person. And so the skill sets that I'm working on now and that I've been in, you know, kind of the trenches with the past several years, which I'm sure you know y'all are the same way, is like, you know, this the sales stuff. I'm kind of graduated from that now. It's not really what I'm doing on the day-to-day, but I'm still I'm learning skill sets now that really help the business grow. And um, and that's what I need to be doing, and that's the fun stuff, like you said, Jason, where you kind of you like to be doing it because that's kind of our cre our creative outlet in a way, I think.
SPEAKER_02A hundred percent the creative. I used to do graphic design and play in bands, and I I love the I I always hated business stuff. I hated school and and stuff like that, but like, yeah, when you when you start working on the business and you're not the bottleneck, and now you can start looking at it holistically and like you know, how how how can we move stuff around and make this work? And what what where can we take this money and and reinvest it either in the business or outside of the business and grow it, and like you're just more of a strategic creative type person. It's it's really fun.
SPEAKER_00It is, and it's challenging in a way that um it's it's the same, I mean it's the same ongoing, you know, challenges, but it's also a new challenge every day, and new things come up every day, and um and that's why I really like podcasts so much. I think it's awesome that y'all have this podcast for insurance agents. You know, you're talking about insurance because you know, we can log on to the business podcast, but some of the stuff doesn't apply to us. We don't have a singular item that we sit on a shelf and sell, you know, so we need things that are very topic specific and particular to our industry. And I love that you all offer this to the insurance community because it's kind of this little world that we get, you know, that we can talk to like-minded individuals, learn and grow together.
SPEAKER_02Oh, thank you. Yeah, thank you. It's crazy of the intangibility of what we do. True. I mean, we don't have inventory, we're selling a promise. We're not, I mean, it's a piece of I would say a piece of paper, but it's not even a piece of paper these days.
SPEAKER_00Right. It's a paperless contract. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So almost everything that we're doing is all mindset. Like it's all belief and it's all interpersonal communication. That's it. Yeah. Um and then it's just all the head garbage that comes with that, and making sure that that doesn't veer you off or get you sideways.
SPEAKER_03And well, yeah, and Kathy, you were talking about it like call after call when your rates double, triple, whatever, right? Like it was so ridiculous. Like many people will go, oh, you know, like they'll quote them and go, oh, you know what, we're we're triple or whatever. But I'm sure that because it was that case every time, you had to get used to delivering the news that it's it's 4,500 for your pinto, right? And and they're like, What? And you go, well, you know, and you you worked through that and became so much better at selling, and then now probably so much better at coaching your team so that they can do it. Uh, because it's so critical like like to always take those swings at the bat, right? A lot of people, and I've I mean, Jason's heard it from one of my guys, he's not with me anymore, probably because of this, but um, you know, he would he would do that. He'd go, Oh, we're uh we're double, so you're probably not gonna, you know, like it's like, what are you doing, man? I mean, if you ask enough people and we're double, some of them are going to buy.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, they're gonna see some value, or they're gonna be that turned off by their prior company, or they're gonna be that mad at some, you know, or they're just gonna like you enough. Yeah, you absolutely have to learn in this business how to sell on value. And um, I heard many, many years ago that, you know, salespeople, they can either sell, like there's uh among many, many ways. There's two kind of ways that salespeople sell. Either they sell based on relationship building, where you know, you ask all the questions about their family and their occupation, you know, things like that. You get to know them, you become friends, or you can sell by way of having just a really um, I guess, um, polished uh product knowledge. And that was kind of the way I was. Like I'm a real type A person, and I really am ready to just um, I guess, move move and shake. And so I did not necessarily spend a whole lot of time on the phone with people asking them a bunch of personal questions about themselves, but I had a way of being able to explain our products in a way that conveyed the value and how things work. I knew, you know, insurance laws and policy and you know, things like that so well that people earned I earned that trust that, hey, if something happens, I think she, I think she knows how it's gonna shake out. And I kind of want her on my side. And um, and so yeah, just kind of piggybacking off you have all these conversations and you've got to be able to bring something to the table because your price, you know, it may be double, it may be triple, but you know, we've got a killer customer service team. I would put our team up against anybody. I mean, we will advocate for you, and we also know how things work. And um, yeah, you can't talk yourself out of a sale. I mean, I yeah, we've all said don't sell out of your own pocket, don't sell out of your own pocket. You're you're putting yourself in a bad position from the get-go.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. I mean, they people are gonna buy.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's a law of large numbers and in some cases to a certain extent, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, it's definitely a sport. Like, I I really I really relate it to a sport, especially from not having a sales team get back to rebuilding a sales team. So, like when you don't have a sales team and then you gotta start again in a market that like everybody says that sucks, it's like there's no one to do that. Except everything sucks, right? Like so, like when we were building up and it like over this last year, it was I I really realize it's like it's such a sport in the sense where nine out of ten people say no. Like you know, like nine out of I mean, I don't even know what we're closing here right now. It's not it's not fantastic, but twelve. But but it's it's less it's less than it was, right? Like we're we're like half we're selling half as much uh as we used to just because they had a giant rate increase. Whatever, whatever.
SPEAKER_00Regardless, um, you're like I'm just happy I can sell now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, 100%. But like it's just managing the nose. Like the whole job of an LSP is like if they're even getting two sales a day and they're making uh a couple 150 calls a day and they're quoting eight people, like uh almost nothing's a one call closed. Yeah. So if they're quoting eight people a day, eight to ten, they're hearing all nodes. It's just all nodes. So then it's like, of course, they're not going to operate at 100 percent every day hearing all nodes. We're feeling-based creatures, so the feeling that they're gonna get is this stocks. So then it's just managing the this stocks to like, hey, you're putting in the reps. Let's get this. You're doing good on this.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02100 percent. So it's like when it comes to sales, I just I just tell everybody like like don't look at like there's not a good person. There's not a you know a perfect script necessarily, but I mean, really favor comes to those willing to put in the reps. And just put in the reps. That's it. That's all that matters. Like guaranteed you'll make, you know, uh one or two sales a day. If you're getting, you know, eight to ten quotes, you're guaranteed to get one to two uh sales a day.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, just put the put the work in, talk to people. Um, I mean, uh, you know, I am I I am favorable of this career. I tell people when they come to interview, um, you know, this is not gonna be like selling cars or selling real estate. Like you're we're gonna give you a base pay and we're gonna give you leads. And all you gotta do is talk. Like, I will literally give you a tool belt just stacked with all the best tools. I'll give you a super competitive salary, I'll give you the benefits, I'll give you a great employee value proposition, I will give you, you know, paid time off, I'll give you a, you know, work from home, a great desk, a great office culture. But this is gonna get grindy sometimes, but just talk to people, follow the talk path, and you can make a lot of money, and you can move on to grow in other ways. I mean, maybe you want to open your own business one day. I'll help you do that. Um, and so I, you know, there's a lot of different sales out there, but I would rather be sitting in an office talking on the phone, just chit-chatting with people about something I'm knowledgeable about, than to be out in the hot sun trying to or the freezing cold rain trying to walk and show somebody a Kia Spectra or a house that I've got to put muck boots on to walk to get to the front door and then go in there with these people I don't even know and show them around. I mean, it's not a bad gig, if you ask me. Right. It can be very rewarding.
SPEAKER_03It's just that quantity. I think that's the tough, like really tough for him, right? It's because it takes so many deals to actually make some money in this game. Right.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it does. But it's the topic of water. Yeah. And and that's again with the cyclical. You know, I mean, in a couple years, California or other states that are having a hard time right now could be on a totally different trajectory. And it's the skills that you built in that time of, you know, kind of things being down. If you can't, you know, you really have to sell on value during those down times, um, because that's all you have, right? And so then when they turn it green again, then you're ready to rock and roll.
SPEAKER_03Right. You just got to be consistent, and then the swings don't move as much, right? They don't hurt your own. I mean, I remember we used to, if we had a $20,000 day, it's like, holy shit, ah, you know, I'd jump off the roof. And then, and then if we had a zero, it's like, oh, it's the end of the world, right? And it's like, I don't even I I obviously look at the numbers, but not like I used to, and and I don't have the emotional response that I used to, because as long as they're doing the activity, in fact, I'm more concerned with did they all do 10 quotes, right? Did they all quote 10 households today? No. How come how come she only did four?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Right? Like what's going on there? You know, so because I know that if she only quotes four, she's either closing a bunch of stuff and neglecting the the activity that needs to be done or just not doing anything. And either way, it's not going to be good, right? And that they can control their cycle too. Yeah. I think early on in an LSP's career, it's really important to help them understand like you can't, like you closed three things today, great. You still need the activity, or in three weeks you're screwed.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you're only as good as that last sale because I mean it it is the business of sales. It's just like, you know, how we, you know, a month ends and then it the ticker turns back to zero. The year ends, and we're like, what what did last year do? Like, okay, we're past it. We gotta, we gotta win again. And so I have a friend who, you know, I think a lot of agents count activity for their team. They look at, you know, what did you sell? What did you quote? Who'd you call? What was your talk time? And things like that. And I have a friend who doesn't even look at the sales, you know, he looks at the quotes and the talk time because that is ultimately the factor that's gonna determine your success. If you come in at 8:30 or 9 o'clock and you closed, you know, a three-car home policy, that's great. But but then what? You know, okay, we gotta make, you know, it's it's just that mind frame.
SPEAKER_03And all you did then was finish the three weeks ago.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, or three, right, exactly. You're you you followed up on your pipeline, great job. But now let's let's refill that person that just fell out of the pipeline.
SPEAKER_03You need a new one in there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that's that was even like Odin and and Ruddy did it, it took a while to understand that. And you know, we have so many agents that we've talked to and helped, and and uh, you know, it's like, oh, you know, it's always this like aha, all of a sudden. It's like, yeah, the sales don't matter. You know, they they matter, of course, but they don't matter in the sense that you need to focus on them, you need to focus on what they're doing. Because if they're not doing, the sales ain't ever gonna happen, you know.
SPEAKER_00Right. And you guys have, you know, several arms within your business, and so you're able to help them keep keep their pipeline going, right? With the leads and the telemarketing and stuff like that. And so, um, and and that's what we're you know, that's what we're that's what we're getting to is, you know, we've we don't really, I mean, my my salespeople still call, but for the most part, I want them quoting. Like you've got this skill set and this license. And I think, you know, y'all have said it before, I've heard y'all say it before. Don't put your best, most skilled people on the phone calling a hundred and two hundred calls a day. Get let them quote. Give somebody else the phone to call. And so um, it's awesome that you have solutions for what you what you're preaching to.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, I mean, it the whole our our whole business started because I mean we were doing it, we were talking about it. People started coming to going, hey, how do you do it? And we're like, Oh, I guess we have a business. Yeah. And then COVID happened, and it actually helped because people were home. Yeah, they were home. Like it was the unlucky consequence of of COVID was our the contact rate went through the roof. And people were so bored, they were they were they're like, sure, I don't have anything else to do. Yeah, you know, I've already grown everything I can grow in my house. You know, what but all the weird wacky crap that people were doing during COVID, you know, all of a sudden they're like, okay, I'll get a quote.
SPEAKER_00Or they're so lonely that they were like, Yeah, I'll talk to you.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00No, I get it. And that's I mean, that's been awesome. And that's what, you know, it's what we want, right? So I'm sure I'm I'm hoping that, you know, I don't know what you know y'all's ratios are and how it how it works to who how many calls to quotes and things like that. But um, you know, the main thing is is you know, providing a solution for agents and salespeople to take that off their plate. It makes it less grindy for the the sales team, and you're just providing people, hey, here's somebody to quote, here's the next person to quote, and um and and that helps, I think, with staff retention, I would think, and hope.
SPEAKER_03Oh, it's huge. Yeah, I mean, I don't know if you heard this, I I've said it a bunch of times, but the quick story, and I'll just touch on it, is I've had somebody, my my top producer who could not get there on time, and it's like it's one of those things. I'm terrible at getting on time, you know, it just it's part of the ADHD, but um, but for that job, and because there's a team, you gotta be on time. Yeah, you know, it's just like it it affects everybody. There's a meeting, you know, and then you come in late, it just like you don't get to do whatever you want. And she was given an ultimatum, and she said, Oh, that's it, I'm leaving then. And she left, and I said to my ops manager, I just said, she'll be back. Because in Tucson, there wasn't any, there's nobody else that that is doing the way that we do. Yeah, you know, that gives the leads, has they have they don't have to prospect, right? All they have to do is follow up on their quotes. Yeah. And um, you know, she came back.
SPEAKER_00Oh, you called it, yeah. At this point, you know, yeah. Yeah, I mean what's out there.
SPEAKER_03And she told everyone how terrible it is out there, which is great. Employee retention because the cost of that psychologically, and when you get in that trap, you know, we touched on it earlier, but it's like going, oh, you know, I have the person that I need to get rid of, but I can't get rid of them because I don't have anybody lined up. And uh, if I get rid of them, then I'm gonna hire somebody that is just like them because I'm in a rush, and you know, that whole thing. Can't have that cycle.
SPEAKER_00I know. And I had a sit like I had a few people leave a few months ago, and um, you know, the insurance that what's out there now is very is very different now. They they can't they can go find something else, and uh and and there may be a bigger base pay and less leads, or there may be um, you know, maybe a bigger uh base pay out here or or something. I don't pay a huge base pay. Mine is very heavily commissioned, and um, but I'm trying to give them literally everything else in terms of everything for you to quote all day long. And um, anyway, I redid everything. I sat, I mean, I had a real um moment where I sat down and I kind of had that moment like you had, Craig, where you were thinking, okay, go find something. Okay, if you think the grass is greener, go find it.
SPEAKER_03Have fun.
SPEAKER_00I had to ask myself, is the grass greener? I don't know. And so I I really took a moment, I redid my comp plan. I got several agents' comp plans, top agents in the country, and I redid my comp plan to make sure that mine was competitive with whatever else they might be able to find. I uh I redid my whole benefits package to where now I offer a professional development stop and I offer a work-life balance, a volunteer, uh networking, uh, you know, health insurance, life engineering, dental, you know, just whatever you could possibly want from a job, retirement, you know, the paid time off. Um, and I upped my marketing and I said to myself, I'm gonna make sure that I feel confident as I'm interviewing to replace these positions, that I have one of the best offerings now that they'll find anywhere. And um, and I think that's important for agents to to be able to look at their whole package and feel good about what they're offering, to where you can have that attitude like you had, Craig, to where if someone does leave and they feel like they can find it better somewhere else, good luck, you know, because you've you've got it set up to where you you're you're trying to offer them a silver platter.
SPEAKER_02I love that you called it an offering too, because it really is like they're they're investing with you. Um they're deciding on whether they're gonna spend time with you for the next couple years or maybe even longer. So it's like what are you offering them? Like what is like you're selling them basically, right? And it's just crazy to me how many people don't put much time into that thought. Like, what is the benefit? What is the offer that you're offering the you know, somebody new to to join you? I don't think it costs to look at it like that.
SPEAKER_03I mean, it's the biggest cost and the biggest impact on your revenue is your team. If you don't if your constant turnover and all that lost revenue that that would have happened if the team was solid, I mean it's it's staggering, right? Like it's it's it's just it's a killer.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, when you sit down and you look at it and you look at it all and um and and it makes me feel good to know that I'm taking care of people as well, because these folks have families and children and spouses, and I want to offer something that um that they can feel because you know, you can interview a hundred people and they're all on a job search for a different reason. So it could be pay, it could be culture, it could, I mean, it could be there's no, I hear this a lot, there's no growth opportunities where I'm at. You know, I've kind of reached the end of where I can get to, or you know, my coworkers or my management is just kind of toxic or things. So everybody's looking for something really different. And so by offering something that, you know, you feel like you can check mark this box, this box, this box, it's really invaluable. Whatever it costs you to be able to offer and get uh solid A-players, you know, good quality candidates, what they bring, what the quality candidates bring to the table will offset whatever you spend trying to make it uh appealing to them.
SPEAKER_03And and also I think not looking for that unicorn, right? Like I was so in the past, I was so focused on finding the best producer possible. But you can take somebody who's average, like that is willing to put in the reps and give them all the tools like you suggested, right? Like if you give them everything, somebody who's eh can really do well. Yeah, right. If they have the right environment, they have the right tools, they could I mean, because it isn't, I mean, it's not rocket science, right? It's it's talking to people. If you can talk to people and you can do it every day consistently, you're gonna make money. I mean, I'm sure you have it too. Like we all have people making six figures. I mean, ten years ago, thinking that I would pay somebody six figures to work for me seemed impossible. Wild. That was like, no way, right? No, yeah, right, no way. You know, and and now it's like, yeah, I mean, hell yeah, because if if they're making a hundred or they're making more, whatever, then they're they're creating a lot of revenue.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, they're helping, yeah, exactly. Right, exactly. And thankfully, we're in an industry with recurring revenue. So even if we do maybe lose a little money on the front end, if we do, um, we're we're gonna be okay. You know what I mean? And um, we just wanna make sure that because at this point, and this wasn't even a thought 10 years ago either, was I can have like any of us could have somebody leave and go find, I mean, go just go to the job board and they can work anywhere in the U.S. Whereas you know, 10, 15 years ago it was like, oh, the agents in my town aren't gonna be able to do what we do. You know what I mean? Yeah. But now it's like, no, all they have to do is hit up the job boards and work anywhere. Yeah. And and it might it, I mean, it it who knows, like we were talking about before, the grass isn't always greener. There's always gonna be something, you know, but you do have to you're competing with the whole country now, not just your your town.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. I mean, George, how many people does George have that aren't in Ohio? Like multiple people, right? I think.
SPEAKER_02I think so, yeah. I mean, uh, he's a hundred percent remote, right?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean he has 20 or some of the producers now. It's crazy. But yeah, our our the first person that we you know, the first person we met and became a client that's still with us. I mean, he has 20 20 producers, 30 callers, like it's insane. I mean, you're young, he's younger. I've like, I don't want to I don't want to deal with that anymore.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you know, it it's a full-time job.
SPEAKER_03Just yeah, I like six. Six producers is great. You know, that's that's good. You can write 200, everything's fine.
SPEAKER_00You can manage, yeah, you can manage that. Once you get above that, then you kind of need an additional. Yeah, you have to start expanding, which I'm kind of I mean, in order to keep up, I mean, and especially, you know, with with some carriers, they're offering more on the front end so that it is more enticing to go about it that way. Um, whereas, you know, the old comp plans didn't really incentivize you to go have 30 salespeople. Um but now in most states, carriers are kind of switching over to that model where they're paying more on the front end because they want to incentivize um they want to incentivize the agents to have a big sales team.
SPEAKER_03And it works. I mean, the numbers pencil, you know, it's just whether or not it's just a job.
SPEAKER_00It's a job. I mean, managing people is something, and that's another thing too that I didn't realize when I first opened my agency, is just because you're a a a good salesperson does not equal great business owner or great manager or great leader. You know, those were skill sets I didn't have.
SPEAKER_03It's almost the uh right until you learn it.
SPEAKER_00You have to learn it, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Oh man, it's psychology.
SPEAKER_00It is, it's all psychology. And you know, I don't, I mean, I'm sure you've had these people, you may be you may have been this person. I know I was. When I was selling, I didn't want to have water cooler talk. I did not want to catch up, you know, in the afternoons on, you know, how did you know your daughter's birthday party go last Saturday? Like I was there to work to take take home my money bag and go, you know? And so when you switch it to, okay, now you've actually got to ask people how their day was, and when they come to you with their problem, you gotta like figure it out. You could instead of telling them, oh, I don't know, go do the you know. Um, and sometimes the best salespeople are like that. That's why they say the best salespeople don't equal the best managers. That's why you don't always promote your your top salesperson either, because the people skills may not be there. I'm sure y'all ran into that before.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, you know, one of my one of my uh really close friends said said to me or asked me, who's your number one employee? Or I'm sorry, your number one customer. And the answer that I've already now just given is is your employee, right? And it was like, whoa, wait a minute, you know, and I thought I'm really good at talking to people, you know, on the phone that that were, you know, trying to do business, but then I don't want to talk to these guys. But when I thought of it as, oh, they they literally are my number one customer. If I make them happy and make them good and they buy in, then it's leverage, right? So I started thinking of it like that. If they if they didn't work for me, but they're a customer, how do I approach them differently? You treat them, yeah. I and then you totally treat them totally differently, and uh, you know, then you just learn it. I mean it's it's it's it's pretty cool, right? Because you you just have to I mean you gotta get them, you gotta get them pumped. Leading like Darth Vader doesn't work anymore, right?
SPEAKER_00And that's what the the whole um idea of lead or maybe management years and years ago, that's the only managers I ever had was people who just kind of you know were like mad if you didn't do this or if you caught, you know, I mean it just all kind of things. I never really had a great manager, and I think that's what uh really uh motivated me to become a leader that people could trust and talk to, is because I had such bad management uh when I was an employee. Um, but also this idea of servant leadership, you know, they don't work for me. I work for them. I truly do. That is, you know, I'm not going over quotes anymore, but it's my job to now cater and make sure, you know, our our team is happy. And um, and that's the best leaders, right? Is the ones who truly have that heartfelt, um, genuine care and authenticity for their team members, and they're not. I remember when I worked for um the agent that I was working for before opening our agent, I just felt like I was just a number. I felt like I had a dollar sign written on my forehead. It did not matter what was going on. I mean, she could not have cared less about what me as a person, right? She didn't even know me as a person. She never cared, you know, she just wasn't that type of leader. And so I aspire to be somebody that um that looks at at my team. I don't even like to say employee, my employees. I don't even like that. They're my team, they're my co-workers. You know what I mean? They're family. You you probably feel like that with yours, and you've probably learned Usually Yeah, most of them, right? And I'm sure they feel the same about you.
SPEAKER_02What would you say, like, especially especially now? I mean, I everybody it's funny because every time we ask this question over the years, it's like there's all this stuff looming in the future. And then it's all kind of the same anyways, but like looking into the future, what what are you excited about and what do you have on your radar?
SPEAKER_00So um I'm a little behind on this and come like compared to most, but I am not super threatened by AI. I'm I as the more I learn about it, I think it's gonna make us be able to be very efficient. Um I think the relationship component is gonna be in the um insurance. I think insurance shoppers are gonna prefer a real human to talk to. Um I mean just as a side story, there's been I I've been trying to get um, there's a particular process that I am trying to get some information on uh implementing, in which case I've got to get some uh information from several vendors in order to do that. And I'm reaching out to these vendors as a potential paying customer, and I cannot get answers. They don't answer the phone, they do not return calls, they do not return emails, they do not answer a chat box. I mean, and it's very frustrating and makes me really, really um value the businesses that I frequent who care you know who I'm having human interactions with. And so although I do not see anything on the very near future of AI replacing anything, I I think it will help make things a lot more efficient, and I am excited to see that. Um and one thing too that I am just now I and again I'm very behind, but I have um just started in The remote world this year. And so I've got some staff working remotely. And I do think to myself, like, because I I own my office building, or I have a mortgage on it. And so I think all often, like, okay, for what I'm paying for this this mortgage, you know, what else could this pay for to make our team better? And so maybe money is going to be better spent um in different places rather than brick and mortar and rather than being in person and rather than, you know, I I don't know. I'm like I said, I'm still kind of behind. I know these are things that y'all have been doing for a while now, but um I'm just I I don't know. I I'm curious to kind of see where those things take me. Me, me personally.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I love that. Craig and I have talked a lot about AI and stuff. AI is going definitely going to replace some stuff, j not necessarily people, but activities, right?
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um but I also think that uh because there's like the AI world and now there's humans. So humans just need to be better at being human.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You know, like like if like even with my team, I tell them like the best use of your time is actually talking to somebody. Yeah. Like you know, if you're behind the computer just typing in stuff, like what makes you different we can automate that at some point, right? Like five years from now, that's not going to be a skill. But like five years from now, actually talking to you is going to be awesome. So it's like just get better at that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Like talk to people more. That's it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I think um, I mean, I don't I don't really know, but I have heard the speculation that as as AI gets more advanced and as we're using AI more, and I you know, this you you'll talk to these people and you call them and they they're kind of untrustworthy now. I think that might amplify because you could have these voices say anything, and they're not gonna know. Am I giving my credit card to the right?
SPEAKER_03You know what I so it could be your dad on the phone and it sounds exactly like him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, saying the same, yeah, crazy. Right. So it it could be a theory that human um interaction and being able to prove that you're a real person becomes maybe even more um prevalent. Right now it's just kind of the elderly generation that's kind of untrusting and wants to know who you know, who are you? How'd you get my you know, those are the things we hear right now. But um who is this? Right, exactly. Um, so I don't know. It'll it'll be interesting to see. I think we need to be kind of ready and prepared for anything. I mean, because I mean, just the pace in which things have changed since COVID is almost seems to amplify. I was listening to something the other day that was just saying how fast things changed, you know, just looking over the different decades in the 19, you know, in the 1900s. And then when COVID hit, it was like decades of of fast forward all within a year, two years, three years. And so um, I think there's pros and cons to it all, but it's how we use it. We got to make sure we're adapt with those skills to be able to um have the knowledge of how to use AI and use it to our advantage.
SPEAKER_02Love it. Well, Kathy, you've been awesome, and thank you for going the distance with us today. Distance over an hour. I really, really appreciate this. Any final thoughts before we get back to work?
SPEAKER_00Um well, for me, it's almost time to go home. I'm on the East Coast, so that's right. Yeah, it's 4:30 here. Um, so no, I just I appreciate you guys having me. Y'all are always fun and entertaining. And uh again, I appreciate what you do for the insurance community with just putting this information out there so that other people in the industry can learn and share and um just collaborate together. It's been fun, it's been a great time talking to y'all.
SPEAKER_01Awesome, great talking to you.
SPEAKER_03Thank you.
SPEAKER_00Thanks so much, thank you, Kathy.
SPEAKER_03It's been awesome.
SPEAKER_00Thank you. Y'all have a good one.