Now Walk It Out

Faith is often defined as a noun, but what if it was meant to be lived as a verb? In this episode, Ariana + Kimberly dive into what living faith looks like — faith that is active, alive, and put into action. Inspired by Hebrews 11 and Genesis 22, they explore what it means to faith it out.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:05

Okay, so shall we start? Sure. We are recording. We're recording. Yeah, I don't know how much of that we're gonna use from that bantering. Probably not much. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 0:16

We said a lot of names. Yeah, we did. We gave out personal information.

SPEAKER_01 0:22

So I'm like, are we recording? Anyway, well, welcome to Through It. Welcome. It is post-Fourth of July weekend. I hope everyone made good decisions.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

I didn't see any stories about anything terrible.

SPEAKER_01 0:35

Yeah, well, I am still off of social and I have no idea what anyone else has done aside from us.

SPEAKER_02 0:43

I don't think I do either.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

But I hope everybody had a great 4th of July. Happy 250th birthday, America. And side note, the things I did see, and granted, most of these people aren't aren't people I know personally, but there was a lot of like negativity about like I'm not celebrating America, blah blah blah. And I just feel like look, I can't not say something like the irony of living here. Praise God that you were born here. Yeah that you were given this, like essentially like hand up before you were even born, regardless of where or how the circumstances of you being born here, but now you have the freedom and the right and the ability to say whatever you want about the country and live. And you're walking around saying, like, I'm not celebrating this country.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

That's so crazy.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Like blind privilege.

unknown 1:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Just completely, completely, yeah. That gets underneath my skin a little bit. Try living in a third world country.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

I know, I just couldn't stop thinking that of like the people, the Christians, and and and everybody else that gets persecuted in other nations.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

Like well, it's like the thing where when just as people, how we have a tendency to only recognize the not good things. Is the mic working?

SPEAKER_02 2:14

Yeah, no, everything's good.

SPEAKER_01 2:16

Um, so like this whoever this person was that was complaining. It's like you're only thinking about all the negative things. You're literally not thinking of any of the privileges and the rights that you have from living here.

SPEAKER_02 2:27

Yeah, again, it's like you're not doing what I want you to do, so it's wrong.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Right. That is wild. But on another note, I'm happy we had a quiet 4th of July weekend. Um my son broke a window with a soccer ball. I already forgot about that. Yeah, it has. I'm like, I'm you know what I'm I'm being prayerful over is just that these people that hosted this place that own it, that their insurance just covers it.

SPEAKER_02 2:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:58

And that maybe the deductible is just really low or something like that. And Kendrick felt so bad. Like, it's one of those things as a parent. I can't first of all, it sucks. He broke, he broke a window, a glass window that's not ours, and that's probably gonna cost a pretty penny if insurance doesn't go in our favor. But I'm like, what am I supposed to say to that? It's already done, and it was an accident, it wasn't intentional. He was literally just being a kid, yeah, kicking the ball around. Yeah, and he felt so bad, and I'm like, I can't like be careful. Yeah, that's pretty much the extent of it. And I had to be like, I'm not mad at you, just so you know, but this is why you have to pay attention to your surroundings, like that's glass, yeah. But part of that is just being six, yeah, exactly. So that's I'm like, I was super frustrated, but I couldn't be upset about it.

SPEAKER_02 3:54

Yeah, what do you do?

SPEAKER_01 3:55

I know what do you do?

SPEAKER_02 3:56

You can't there are things in life that are just accidents, that being one of them, especially when you're six years old. You get less of those the older you get. So take advantage of them when you're young.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Yeah, yeah, pay attention as a grown-up because we're not we're not kids, although we feel like giant kids sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 4:16

All right, it was really nice to just like we got out of town, we didn't go too far away, and we just chilled. We had a great dinner, we had delicious s'mores, yes, we played hilarious games. Yeah, I uh Frankie told me that night we got into bed. He's like, I love that twice tonight you laughed so hard you lost your breath. That's so cute. I have like a giggle problem. Like once I've got it, I can't not like everything is so funny, and I try not to just let it out. Yeah, but I it was so funny watching the boys we were playing, what was it, taboo or even heads up, watching them act out things.

SPEAKER_01 4:59

Yeah. I know I was talking to Jordan on the drive back and I was still laughing about poop factory.

unknown 5:06

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 5:08

And he was serious, it wasn't a joke. Yes, that's my husband for you. Yeah, I was. What was that? We were playing taboo. The word was cheesecake. I needed to get my husband to guess cheesecake, and I said factory, and Frankie said poop. Because all that's where all roads lead to for Frankie.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

That's so funny, and Kendrick. They're all just yeah, Ellen showed journey, yeah. Anyway, it was a great time. It was low-key. It was um kind of felt like we roughed it up a little bit, but it was worth it. Like I left feeling like that was a memory made, like a solid memory that was made, and that was worth it.

SPEAKER_02 5:56

So even after we, when Kendra got really tired and it was late, and we kind of wind down the games, wound down the games, and we were all just sitting there conversing. That was fun. And it wasn't even for that long, but just to just get like stay up late and talk, yes, about like I don't know, less surface things. I don't want to say deep because that sounds so everything and nothing, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Yeah, it was a good time, it was good. That's how you bond. I know. I don't remember the last time I stayed up that late. It's been a while, it was late. I was so tired, but I didn't want to go to sleep.

SPEAKER_02 6:37

Yeah, because you didn't want the night to end, yeah, yeah, it was fun.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

Um, well, today's topic. I think there's a multiple reason why I wanted to talk about this, but we're gonna talk about faith, maybe in a way that you guys have heard before, and maybe in a fresh way that you haven't thought about before, maybe a different angle on it. Um what did I say to you the other day? I was oh yeah, I said living faith. I forget what sparked that. What was the context that we were talking?

SPEAKER_02 7:12

Um, yesterday morning when we woke up, when you were we all woke up, but when you and Jordan woke up, you were um at the table reading your Bibles. And after an hour or so, I asked what you guys had been reading about. That's right.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

Yeah, so I was in, we were in both James and Hebrews. Um, but I had looked up one of the passages on, I want to say it was Bible Hub, but there was a phrase that stood out and it said living faith. And that kind of just it stuck, but funny, it lingered with you, and then I kind of forgot about it. Yeah, I've been thinking about it nonstop. And so I want to hear more of your afterthoughts. And honestly, you do that to me sometimes too, where you'll say something, and I don't think it's meant to be like a sticking point or something really heavy, but it just like it lingers and then it just kind of morphs into another thought and to another thing into another thing.

SPEAKER_02 8:14

If I if that isn't the Holy Spirit working through us as vessels, like where it probably doesn't mean, I mean, I know it's unintentional. Yeah, this topic means a lot to you also, but you had said something and then just carried about your day. And then I left and was like researching it, like I was looking into it even further because it just gave me an idea or it brought something to me, and then I was just being reminded of things.

SPEAKER_01 8:39

Yeah, when I think living faith, I think the first thing that came to mind is it's one thing to confess your faith just with what you say and declare it. It's another thing to walk it out. And so I think gosh, I'm even blanking on the example that I had read. Was it about Abraham and Isaac? Yes. Oh, yeah. And we're talking about like um when Abraham is at, he's getting ready to sacrifice his son. And we're talking about how a lot of times when you either see an illustration or when this Bible story is retold, people almost come from the perspective of like he must be so distraught, like this is his only son, that he has to sacrifice him. And from a place of like almost even imagining that like he would be crying or emotional. But I had like this moment of like, I don't know if that's accurate. I feel like he was so full of faith, and not faith in the sense of like uh just I don't know, believing, but faith in the sense of he is so certain, like beyond any shadow of doubt, in the goodness of God. Like that is the faith of Abraham. There was there's not one ounce of it. I mean, maybe this is again just my own um interpretation, but I feel like he was so certain of how good God is and how much God loves us that I don't think he was emotional in the way that people think that he was.

SPEAKER_02 10:23

Yeah, I agree. Yeah, it's I think it's um like faith is a verb. The same way we say that like love is a verb, like faith as a verb.

SPEAKER_01 10:34

I'm faithing.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

I'm faithing. Should I read it?

SPEAKER_01 10:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:39

So in it's Genesis chapter 22. Um, I'll start in verse one, and I'm gonna read it in the amplified because that's what's in front of me. Now, after these things, God tested the faith and commitment of Abraham and said to him, Abraham, and he answered, Here I am. God said, Take now your son, your only son of promise, whom you love, Isaac, and go to the region of Moriah and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I shall tell you. So Abraham got up early in the morning, saddled his donkey, and took two of his his young men with him and his son Isaac, and he split the wood for the burnt offering, and then he got up and went to the place of which God had told him. On the third day of travel, Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. Abraham said to his servants, Settle down and stay here with the donkey. The young man and I will go over there and worship God, and we will come back to you. I'm gonna stop there, I'll pause there for a second, and then we can get into it. But just so that was verse one through six. Five. One through five, one through six. I think five. And interesting here in my Bible, it references Hebrews 11, 17 through 19. And we didn't know that. But what sparked the conversation of this was Hebrews 11. Yeah, wasn't it? That's exactly it. Gosh, I know it's so cool. But so it this is so crazy to me, and I don't know if this is like, I don't know. It make it right now in this moment, it's feeling like I don't know, I'm feeling like the word is coming alive. It is coming alive, but I'm feeling like our heavenly father is saying, add a girls. Because we've connected things that we connected things through our own reading, discovery, and revelation from the Holy Spirit, right? And so I'm standing in the kitchen yesterday morning. Kim and I are talking about living faith. She's bringing up this story of Abraham and Isaac and what his faith was like and how we think about it. And in verse one, it says, God tested the faith and commitment of Abraham and said to him, Abraham, God calls to Abraham, Abraham, and he answered, Here I am. And when Kim was talking about this, this is what I thought of because I have um, don't let me monopolize this conversation. No, I'm so loving this right now. Okay, so I have this tattoo on my right hand, and it's the Hebrew word hanaini. And the word that Abraham uses in response to God calling out to him is hanaini. And the way that we translate that in English is here I am, which feels no different than like what in grade school when your teacher calls attendance and you say here or here, but present. Yeah, it in the way you the way we just the way we translate it does not do it at all justice. And there are a few, so Abraham answers with Hanaini, Moses answers with Hanaini, and Isaac answers, excuse me, Isaiah answers God with Hanaini. This here I am, which does not just mean I'm here. Um, I'm gonna read a little bit of what this says. So a stunning response, Hanaini is a pure, astonished, unguarded affirmation given before all the facts are known. Wow. So a response before you know what you're being called for. It is a spontaneous, unequivocal commitment promising, I am here, where and as you found me, fully attentive, focused, all in, and even more, I am here, all of me, with all that I am and all that I can be. Hanaini is a response of sacred and undiluted presence, a response in which the self sheds all reservations, which expands the boundaries of self, indicating a readiness to receive and respond to whatever experience is about to unfold.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Oh my goodness, can we just I'm like, that is so good. I know.

SPEAKER_02 15:17

I feel like I'm gonna cry.

SPEAKER_01 15:18

I'm getting full body chills right now. This like I might just be cold. I just gotta make it.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

I'm getting that is so good. Just this the res the response before you know what is being asked of you.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Yes, and to me, that gives faith, you know. I ironically, I didn't actually think about this. Kendrick just walked through the door. Sorry for the background noise, guys. I didn't even think about this until this very moment. So the the Greek lettering that I have on my hand, one of them is faithful. And it's not faithful in the sense that like me, that Kimberly has faith, but faithful in the sense of like um the type of faith that incites action. Because I have faith, I will walk in obedience. That's it. Because I have faith, I will move forward. Like faith is a verb, living faith, henini. That is so good. I did not make that connection with henani, and this is pistos in Greek. Yeah, that's crazy. Hold on, yes. It's recording, Kendrick. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

You look like you just did cardio, Kendrick.

SPEAKER_01 16:42

He is watch when he takes his helmet off. Take your helmet off.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

I love that muscle tank though, showing all your bison.

SPEAKER_01 16:48

How sweaty you are, dude. Um, okay, getting back on track here with Hanini, even just the total readiness to be completely available to your point of like before you even have the full picture. And I think that's where it points us back to faith. Because to move forward in uncertainty, but the thing that you have full certainty in is God's character, God's omnipotence, um, God's love that John 3 16, how much does he love us? You know, and to not get confused, I think sometimes we think that having faith is almost like moving forward blindly. Because that's also not what we're saying, right? Even if yes, you don't have the full picture, it's not a leap of faith and blindness.

SPEAKER_02 17:41

Will you elaborate on that for me a little bit?

SPEAKER_01 17:43

Yeah. So when it's when you're thinking about it like, okay, I'm gonna move forward blindly. The part that makes it not like you're um walking in blindness is the part that we hold on to is knowing God's character and his his attributes.

SPEAKER_02 18:02

So it's not blind because we have reverence, we have the fear of love with the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

Because our faith is not in our circumstance, it's in Jesus. So that's the unknowing part. You're the unknowing of what's to come is you're un you're you don't know in terms of the circumstance what's gonna happen, but we have knowing it of who God is and the God that we serve and who's actually in charge.

SPEAKER_02 18:28

And regardless of what the next outcome is, that it is good because we know that God is good.

SPEAKER_01 18:36

Period. There's no blindness there, yeah. And so to be reminded in Romans 10:17, it says, so faith comes from hearing and hearing through the word of Christ. So when you think about hearing through the word of Christ, like when we read the word, this living and active book, if you want to call it that. I don't even like saying it's that. But you are getting to know God, you're hearing God's word. Yeah, and that's why if faith comes from hearing, what are you hearing about? You're hearing about Him. And then faith is about Him, it's not about results, it's not about what's gonna happen next. Faith is about delighting in the King of Kings, the one that created you.

SPEAKER_02 19:21

Faith is not about results, yeah. It's not, and and life, and I mean, I think even being a Christian is not about what you can get from God.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

Yeah, say that again. And how how many times do we hear people losing faith and being discouraged because they're praying for something that um it's an unanswered prayer, but I don't even like seeing unanswered prayer, they're just unhappy about the answer that they were getting.

SPEAKER_02 19:58

Yeah, they didn't, they prayed for something. God didn't deliver it on a silver platter in the way that they had imagined it. And so they now come to the conclusion on their own. They they've come to they've decided, I guess, same thing, that God must either not love them or not be real because they didn't get what they wanted.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah, which is gosh, this is so good. And so then it takes us back to what is your faith in? Is your faith are you are you defining your faith in your circumstance? Like if things are good, then I'm full of faith. If things aren't good, then then you lose faith. No, faith is who is God? Who is God? So I'm I'm reminded of um in James 2 where it says that even demons believe. And so faith is not even just believing in the existence of God, but it's okay, knowing who our Lord and Savior is, and then because you know him, you have a fear of the Lord and you surrender to him. So it's believing in his existence. That is like the most basic when you think about faith and how to define it, is just believing in his existence. No, it's believing that he exists, knowing who he is, how holy he is, king of glory. And then because you recognize the glory that he is, you surrender and you yield to him.

SPEAKER_02 21:33

And how much he loves you and that part, creation, that part.

SPEAKER_01 21:38

And because that's part of getting to know God, as you get to know him, he is love, God is love.

SPEAKER_02 21:45

And the way that you define love and the way that you even experience love, show love, receive love doesn't mean that that is the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 21:59

Different.

SPEAKER_02 22:00

Yeah. You you um Josh Howerton always says if God is an ocean and and your mind is a soda can, there are some things that are just not gonna fit. And that is one of them. Like I think we can get so prideful, and we talk about pride on here a lot. I think it's probably because I something I struggle with. Same. But you can become so prideful that you believe that your understanding of something or the way that you've defined it or you've experienced it is the end all be all.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

Yeah. But that is pride, ignorance and pride.

SPEAKER_02 22:39

Yeah, God has made all the definitions. He made everything. So he's the only one that can define it.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Right.

SPEAKER_02 22:45

So even if you've experienced something that you don't feel like is love, how do you know that it's not?

SPEAKER_01 22:55

Right.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

I don't know. That's a pretty obtuse question.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

Yeah. But something to sit on. I think we talk about even definitions a lot on this podcast. And so like redefine it. Even in terms of how you relate love with God, if it is causing you, I don't know if this is the right way to take it, but if if any part of that is causing you to lose heart, to be discouraged, like you just gotta redefine it. You gotta fix, you gotta, you gotta refocus on how the lens in which you see God and what love is. Because all good things come from above, period. There's nothing good that exists that is outside of God, period.

SPEAKER_02 23:42

Um which then means that everything that God gives you is good.

SPEAKER_01 23:50

Yeah. So even going back to the story in Genesis with Abraham, the circumstance that literally everyone in the world that exists would look at it as not being good, for Abraham to take up his only son, whom he loves, as a sacrifice, it may be seen as not good. But if we again just hold on and anchor ourselves to the truth of how good God is, you got to see it through to the beginning. If God tells you to do something to do it, and you will see in the end, again, because everything that comes from God is good, what happens. And then we see here that of course God ends up providing a sacrifice. And it was a testing of Abraham that I can't imagine. Can you imagine? Can you imagine after this incident, Abraham, what kind of faith was forged out of this situation?

SPEAKER_02 24:44

No kidding. But I mean, it and it makes me question the same thing of like if his faith was, because there's nowhere here in the text that says he's distraught about anything, right? God gave him the order, and then in verse three, so Abraham, Abraham got up early in the morning, like didn't wait. No hesitation, just went. And we don't, I mean, we don't know, but it doesn't we don't see anywhere that it says he was distressed.

SPEAKER_01 25:11

Everything he does is just very matter of fact. Yeah. Got up early, got the supplies he needed, took his son with him. Yeah, period.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

We can imagine being that we were all we're all human and knowing Abraham's circumstances and that he had to wait as long as he did. He believed his wife to be barren. They were in their 80s when they conceived, I think. Something like that. Around there. So Bear. Oh, bear, you gotta sock. This dog is so cute with his vest on. He's like a in the military. I know tactical clearly on a mission to destroy. Um, yeah, keep going. Um I kind of lost my train of thought, but just in what I was getting at mostly is that like was the faith forged after or did he have it before?

SPEAKER_01 26:08

I think before and after.

SPEAKER_02 26:10

It there had to have been a changing.

SPEAKER_01 26:12

Yeah, I think before and after. I think it took him, it took his faith in order for him to act in obedience in the way like you need faith to be obedient to walk in God's calling, period, right? Um, and then I think faith is one of those things that because it's an intangible, but you can, I think, still measure it to some degree, but it's just like it can grow infinitely. And so I just think it can it continued to swell.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

Yeah, I think that's good that it's it can grow infinitely.

SPEAKER_01 26:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:47

So even if he had the faith before, it continued to swell after.

SPEAKER_01 26:51

Because you know it what it makes me think is because as we get to know God, our faith increases. Can you ever fully know God? No, so then can you can you ever have a full amount of faith?

SPEAKER_02 27:02

No, and no, like the same way we're never done, never done, and how great!

SPEAKER_01 27:06

Like he was full of faith then, and for God and his grace to just continue to cause that to expand more and more and more. God loves us so much.

SPEAKER_02 27:19

The faith that worked through Isaac, yeah, right, generationally, yeah, there's actually so much in the chapter, and I didn't do any homework, so I don't have like I can't cite anything, but the I think that we tend to regard Isaac as being a child or at least a teenager, and I'm not sure if this is from like paintings or what or such, but in the based on the the events, Bible scholars believe that Isaac actually was somewhere around in his 30s, so he would have been a full-grown man who could have very well overpowered his dad, who is in his, if he's in his 30s and he's well into his hundreds, Abraham is, and he just kind of you know went with it also. I'm sure he was terrified.

SPEAKER_01 28:20

Yeah. Who knows, right? Like all these things, too, even as we're talking about in the way that Abraham was uh seemingly quick to be obedient and to rise early the next morning, and how the Bible doesn't really go into detail with how he's feeling. Like you said, it doesn't say that he was distraught per se, and even like how Isaac was feeling. But what I like here is like there's room for us to um to kind of pull from this and maybe think that. But what I like here with why it doesn't point out any of their emotions is because it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_02 29:00

Yeah, because they weren't they weren't controlled by their emotions, it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_01 29:04

What they did was they were just anchored into whatever God commanded.

SPEAKER_02 29:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

And so let's just say they were emotional, let's just go down that road. In and maybe kind of relate it to us practically. If we're in a circumstance and we are distraught about something, but God is calling us to do X, Y, and Z, that is when your heart is deceitful. You're gonna push your emotions aside, not to say that you won't feel it and that you shouldn't. We're still human, we're living in the flesh. But what you do is you, I was gonna say suppress, don't suppress them. That's probably not healthy, but you push those aside and you anchor yourself to God's truth and his commandments, and you just move forward. And eventually how you feel will dissipate and God's truths will triumph and overcome, and that will change. Like your feelings change.

SPEAKER_02 29:55

It's not your strength that gets you through anything either. Yeah. Even in in the times where our faith is being forged or tested or swelling, it like you mentioned before, all good things come from above, they all come from God. So it's not, I mean, and maybe this is just an opinion here, and so I can st I can be corrected, but it would lead me to believe that it's not even you getting you through it. It's not me getting me through it. It's not, I've read enough of the Bible. Like we have those deposits that we put into our spirit, the deposits of the days when things are easy, so that when the trials come along, we can look back and think remember the faithfulness of God, remember how he always provides, remember how he is always faithful, how he is sovereign. And those are the deposits that we've put there.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

But if they come from God, it's not even us doing it. I know. It reminds me of the verse that says that God gives the increase. And then here's the thing that, like, kind of the the push and pull, it's God, even our faith is God. It's the Holy Spirit.

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:04

That surge of faith that we get is God even revealing himself to us. Because in the way that I'm thinking about today, that faith is really just in knowing God more and seeking his face, his face more. Um, like that's all the Holy Spirit and his mercy that he is he is showing us. But at the same time, you can't just like sit on your hands.

SPEAKER_02 31:25

Yeah, there's action.

SPEAKER_01 31:26

So this is the living faith that we were talking about earlier.

SPEAKER_02 31:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:30

It's it's the faith that you could um that is directly given to us through God's grace and mercy, but also you receive it in the going. And as you live it out and as you walk it out, as you get in the word, your faith increases even like, yes, the word is here, but you got to pick it up and open it up.

SPEAKER_02 31:49

Well, it's also in James where he says, um, faith without works is dead. Correct.

SPEAKER_01 31:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:55

And we know that God doesn't measure us on our our own merit, but our actions are a reflection of what's on the inside. And how you act, how you like what your hands pick up, the next step you take. Yes, is a reflection of what's on the inside. Yeah. Where your trust is, where your faith is. And that's the um No wonder people are so anxious because humans are so fallible. Yeah. They're so incorrect, they're so limited. Yeah. And if that's what you're you, if you put all of your faith and your trust in yourself or in another human, it is no wonder to me the epidemic or pandemic, what I can't remember which one's bigger than anxiety is in society right now.

SPEAKER_01 32:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:48

Duh. Yeah. I would be an anxious mess too. Yeah. I know. I mean, I'm not, I'm still human. I have anxieties.

SPEAKER_01 32:54

But this is what happens when you define things that are outside of yourself, when you define it with your circumstance and your emotions. You just can't. You have to remove this. Is why it says in Ephesians, we do not battle against flesh and blood. Like, this is why we have to remember, not even remember, but just like realize the very real spiritual forces that are at play. These emotions that you feel, learn how to discern, pray for that discernment to separate. Like, okay, I'm feeling this. This is not of God. Okay, what truth can I anchor myself to? And then and really try to practice that to anchor yourself to that.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

I'm gonna out my husband a little bit here. Sorry, Frankie. Um, last night we were driving home from church. I don't know how we got on this topic, but we were talking about the way um things that how kids are so like um what's the word I'm looking for? Like malleable almost. And how when kids are when you're a child and you're picked on or you're told something, you grow up and then believing those things, right? I um my husband talks about and he's pretty straightforward about it, but he was picked on a lot um by like older family members as he was growing up. And I don't I don't know. I I think that my my parents raised me in a different way, and I was one of the older kids, so I think that I did the the picking on, I guess. And like I don't I don't experience this much, but I think it's because it was I was the bully. So sorry to my younger brothers and sisters, but he was telling me and we joke about like the things he used to say, like they I know they used to pick on him because he was really chubby, and I didn't think he had anything that he cared about that he held on to about that. So like I have addressed him as a child being chubby because he was. But he said to me last night, you know, what really, really bothered me is you know, more so than like being called fat or whatever was that they all told me I was slow. And I don't think that we had ever talked about that. And I was like, that's so interesting. And I immediately think about like well, look at life now. That was obviously like the enemy in your head at a really, really young age, trying to lie to you through people, just this lie. And I guess there was a teacher that when he was young that had said the same thing to him that perpetuated this lie. So then he continued to tell himself this for a long time. And we conversation carried on. We didn't think any I we didn't spend much more time on it, and then we got home and I came up to him and I was like, Look, listen to me. And my husband's gonna be 45. Yeah, but I'm like, there nothing about the way God created you, did he ever tell you you were slow? You are so much slower than him. But did he, is there anywhere that you can point to how God created man and and say that about you? Like, did God say that about you? And he was like, No. And I'm like, what did God say about you? That's great, and I like made him repeat scripture to me, but I was like, I don't want you to identify with this anymore. I don't want you to agree with this anymore because there's nothing about you that is slow that's not how God made you.

SPEAKER_01 36:31

That's so great. That's so great. You're a great wife, that's so great. I also think, like, even aside from the story that you just shared, I actually think he's very intelligent.

SPEAKER_02 36:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:44

And I almost wonder, Frankie, I know you listened to this. I almost wonder if because of that narrative as a kid, that that is why he is so prone to like researching and looking into things, you know?

SPEAKER_02 36:57

Um, yeah, because what the devil meant for evil God is gonna use for good.

SPEAKER_01 37:04

Reminds me of last night uh Kendrick was I asked him to grab me this bottle of lotion, and he's a six-year-old boy, and so he threw it at me instead of handing it to me. And I wasn't paying attention, and so it almost hit me in my face. And hi bear. Bear agrees. And um me and Jordan were both like, don't do that, you know? And so he felt really bad about it. I'm like, I know you weren't, you know, you didn't mean you weren't trying to hurt mommy. He's in the background, I'd have to be slick with this. Um moved on. I didn't think much about it. And then later, I catch him like sitting in the bathroom in the dark by himself, and I was like, What? It was bedtime. I was like, what are you doing in here? Sitting in here in the dark by yourself, like on that stool. And he was like, I'm just thinking. Like, okay. Hold on, guys, pause. Can you please go upstairs? You need to get water. Okay, well, he's just gonna have to listen and we'll talk about it later if he doesn't like it. Um, I'm just thinking. I'm like, okay, well, think think out loud with me. That's good. Yeah, and he's like, I'm just thinking about what I did, and he told me what he did. And I'm like, you know, mommy's not mad at you. I know that you just you're learning, you know. And then I told him, I was like, never do this. If you ever feel bad about something, okay, go ahead. Yes, you can. I just threw one over the stairs. And I told him, if you ever feel bad about something, never go sit in a room by yourself in the dark and just think about the bad thing that you did. Never do that. You go to the person and you tell them, I feel bad about X, Y, and Z. But what you don't want to do is go sit by yourself in a room in isolation and just marinate on the bad thing that you did.

SPEAKER_02 39:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:05

Because those thoughts, you think those are coming from God? No. Yes, and so just like those little things, important, just even practically as a grown-up, yeah. You know, you need help. Okay, just a second. Thanks for that pause.

SPEAKER_02 39:20

Um but the point being that the the faith faithing, faith being a verb is at some point remembering those conversations. Uh-oh. That's fine. Those conversations that hopefully your parents had with you, or remembering who God is and combating those the thoughts or the feelings that are trying to control you with faith. Right. With I'm like it, the action is I'm taking that thought captive, I'm commanding it to be obedient to Christ, and then I'm rewriting that mental stronghold with the word of God, with scripture. That's faith, because then that's you walking out your faith. That's because you're like, I know what God is capable of, I know what he has done, I know what he is going to do is gonna be good, and I'm going to reiterate that to myself. That's I mean, we that is our free will, right? That is as much choice as us being able to do what we can on our own.

SPEAKER_01 40:27

Yeah, that was so beautifully said, with in the way that you just said, to take that thought captive and to command it to be obedient to Christ and then moving forward from there. That is that is so holy spirit and also so practical. But also, even to do that, to to declare a ungodly thought and to um speak truth and life over it. What do you need to do? You need to have God's word on your heart, you need to be in the word, and again, it goes back to written on your hearts and down to your heads and in between your eyes. Yes. Yep. Romans 10, 17, too. Again, I'm gonna read it again. So faith comes from hearing and hearing through the word of Christ. So, I mean, as we're talking, even before, as I was thinking about like what should we talk about today, I'm even the the definition of faith is really expanding for me because it's really to me now it's coming across as not just um having belief, but it is just knowing God more.

SPEAKER_02 41:41

The more you know God, the more faith you have.

SPEAKER_01 41:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:45

I'm gonna read the just some more from Genesis 22. Okay, I love it. Okay, so we left off in verse five. I'm gonna pick up in verse six. Then Abraham took the word, the wood for the burnt offering and laid it on the shoulders of Isaac, his son. And he took the fire, fire pot in his own hand and the sacrificial knife, and the two of them walked together. And Isaac said to Abraham, My father, and he said, Here I am, my son. Isaac said, Look the fire and the wood, but where is the lamb for the burnt offering? Abraham said, My son, God will provide for himself a lamb for the burnt offering. So the two walked on together. When they came to the place of which God had told him, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood and bound Isaac, his son, and placed him on the altar on top of the wood. Wow. What does that sound like to you?

SPEAKER_01 42:45

Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 42:46

That's the whole gospel.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:49

I mean, and that this is why I love the Bible so crazy. And Genesis and Exodus, just how everything is look, even in the way that Abraham responds, right? Like he says, Isaac asks him, like, we have the wood and the knife, but where's the lamb? And in he doesn't say, I don't know, I'm not sure, maybe it'll be there, or even actually being like, You're the lamb psyches. Yeah, but says, God will provide for himself. Yeah, it's a burnt offering to the to the Lord. Yes. So God was going to provide it for himself, yes, in the same way that God gave his only son because he loved us so much as the offering in our place.

SPEAKER_01 43:45

It's so crazy, too, that in verse 8, when it says Abraham said, God will provide for himself the land for a burnt offering, my son. Like Abraham is having this faith all the way through from beginning to. The middle to the end, that even in his unknowing of the circumstance, he's he holds firm onto his faith of knowing for a fact that God is my provider. He is Jehovah Jira. And so even in the middle of it and the uncertainty, he still says, God will provide. God will provide. You don't have to know the next step. You don't have to know how the circumstance will end. You just have to know that God is good, God will provide, and God loves you and hold on to that.

SPEAKER_02 44:36

And it's not gonna be easy all the time. And I think you touched on that already with like, we still live in the flesh. We're still gonna have the feelings, we're still gonna have the emotions. But how much does he delight in us being like, oh, this is this is sad, this is sad, but I know who you are.

SPEAKER_01 44:55

That's so great. That's it, it leads me to this point of so we we touched on this earlier. Faith is not just about results, it is the heart of God. It's not what we get from having faith. It's not about that. So let's not get it twisted, guys. Faith is not about, okay, I have faith, so I can get this because if I have faith, God will answer this prayer. It's not about the results, it is about delighting in the Lord. It is about, it is about who you have faith in. It is about who is worthy to be praised. That's what it's about. It's to seek God's face and not just his blessings. People think it's the other way. Let me have faith so I can receive. Let me have faith so I can get a blessing. No, to have faith so that you can press in, so that you can endure, so that you can be steadfast and see his faith and his face and seek his face. And from that, everything else will flow. From being connected to the vine, everything else will flow. That is what faith is really about. Because if as we are talking about, like you know, not to let your circumstances cause your faith to be moved, faith is so much beyond your senses. It's spiritual in nature, it's so beyond your senses. Um, I want to read this quote that I found on Blue Letter Bible. I thought it was just kind of a cool way to say it. Physical eyesight produces a conviction or evidence of visible things. Faith is the organ which enables people to see the invisible order. And so, what a cool way to put it. Like, faith is the organ, that is what pumps the blood into all of the things in what is unseen.

SPEAKER_02 46:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:55

That's really cool.

SPEAKER_02 46:56

Like we have faith in gravity, in wind, electricity.

SPEAKER_01 47:05

Yeah, you know that it's real.

SPEAKER_02 47:08

That we're talking into these microphones right now and that it's being recorded, and we'll be able to post it. And uh we can't see anything outside of the internet. Yeah, yeah. I'm thinking, I don't know why, but I have heard, I have heard or even maybe myself thought truthfully, that like why would God ask Abraham to do this? Like, why would he want to test him in a way of like, oh, I'm telling you to go kill your son and to sacrifice your son? And now I'm I'm thinking about it like looking over this chapter and like, man, why would you do that? That's so sad. Why would you do that to somebody? But that's it's literally what he did for us. Wow, he did it, he did it. Wow. So how who are we to question him about like why that's so sad that you would do that? God, why would you test somebody in that way when God literally did that himself? He went through it, he experienced it. I mean, twofold twice, like himself in flesh and himself as the father.

SPEAKER_01 48:17

Yeah, there's something about two, because he could have tested Abraham's faith in so many different ways, right? Um as a foreshadowing, a sh foreshadowing of like what's to come later with Jesus. But I think it is so interesting that he tests him in the context of taking it to death. Like from through the end, from the the from actually from beginning to end, through the birth of his son, all the way through even the death. Like, God is so beyond all of that life and death is crazy. So beyond. And like talk about like the type of testing. Like, can it be more extreme than to the point of death?

SPEAKER_02 49:11

No, and and it's what we talk about here often too, like the eternity mindset.

SPEAKER_01 49:15

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:17

I think really having an eternity mindset is living faith.

SPEAKER_01 49:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:24

Because if you if your your eyes are fixated on eternity and the things of on the things of above, then the way you walk out living is going to be different.

SPEAKER_01 49:41

This is so good. This was man, this really blessed me. I love when we have a topic to talk about and we just kind of take it and we run with it, and it really goes in a direction that we didn't see coming. I know. I I had I had no idea what we were gonna talk about when I showed up today. I know, but and I had no idea either. I literally, these notes that I put in here, I put that in here basically 10 minutes before you walked through the door. It's so clear changed last minute.

SPEAKER_02 50:09

That hello, that the Holy Spirit definitely guided this. Like God knew what we were gonna talk about.

SPEAKER_01 50:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:16

Because there the conversation that we have, the way it lingered in my mind, the way I continue to think about it, the way that the verses that you had or you or your husband had read yesterday reflect the literal tattoo on my hand. Yeah. And then even carrying it on to the tattoo on your hand. This might be not as interesting for people listening.

SPEAKER_01 50:41

I actually think it's so cool though, because I did not make that connection with um the Greek word pistos faithful. Did not make that connection even with Hanaini, obviously, you know.

SPEAKER_02 50:54

Um but the intentionality and the heart of it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:59

To even some I'm thinking about again the Greek word for faithful again, but even to be, are we trustworthy to God? Like, do we have that kind of a faith or that kind of a response to be totally available and to say, here I am, does can can God trust you to respond like that? Do you have that kind of faith where God could even have faith in you? You know, and so I think that's a great just um maybe lingering thought and question to ask yourselves as we wrap up this episode.

SPEAKER_02 51:47

Um that's why I love like the the tattoo aspect that we have, because now it's an it's an added layer of accountability, right? If we're gonna have this on our bodies for the world to see, we better be walking in a way that represents that correctly.

SPEAKER_01 52:06

Honestly, the number of times where my flesh wants to respond in a way, but I have to keep myself accountable because of who I know I represent. That keeps me in line, which is also why it's important to be public with your faith too.

SPEAKER_02 52:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:21

Cause I think it's just another even, I don't know if it's right to say, but like a safeguard.

SPEAKER_02 52:26

Because you know people there's even a way to take that and look at that as living faith. Yeah, yeah. Because you holding your accountable, you holding yourself accountable through who you represent because you know who he is and what it's what it's worth, what it's worth to you, what it means. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:47

I mean, it's something as simple as like so um renovation fitness. We are intentional with even like in consultations, we'll tell people like you're an extension of our brand, so please represent us while that's smart, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:04

But that's actually so good. Did you see I'm wearing vintage?

SPEAKER_01 53:07

I know I did, girl. I saw it right when you walked in. I love that's like one of our favorite, like out of all the shirts that we've made. I it's like one of my favorite ones that we've had.

SPEAKER_02 53:16

I haven't worn this shirt in so long, and I put it on a couple weeks ago, and I'm like, man, I love the way this fits, right? I've worn it like two or three times recently.

SPEAKER_01 53:24

That's so funny. I just like how it like exactly how it sits. I think because it's like thinner. Yeah, it's like yeah, that's from Body Shop days. Vintage renovation. Yeah. OG shirt right there.

SPEAKER_02 53:35

Um, any last thoughts, girl? This was, I feel like I'm gonna keep thinking about this for even more. There's so much here. And I I just go. I want my last thoughts are just like a call to action, right? For the the listeners, like go read Genesis chapter 22, even if you've read it a million times, like go reread it and um look at the cross references. You know, there's a lot of Hebrews 11, there's Matthew 10. Um, but and in the direct reflection of Jesus, even the way it says, like, we don't have the time to get into this, but what stops Abraham is the angel of the Lord. The angel of the Lord is what theologists, biblical scholars call a Christophany, which is Jesus showing up in the physical before he before the new born. Yeah. So there's just like a lot there that makes that so much the Bible is just so cool, you guys.

SPEAKER_01 54:42

Yeah, I second that. I'm gonna just double tap that. Go, go read Genesis 22. Honestly, go reread Genesis, yeah, and then reread Exodus, yeah, and then Hebrews 11. Yeah, yeah. You like it's it's my appreciation for even the New Testament is because of being in the Old Testament, and then in the way that you said that in the way that Jesus is re revealed, even in the old testament. I want to wrap up by reading Hebrews 11. Now, faith is this is verse one. Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. Verse 2, for by for by it the people of old received their commendation. By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible. I think that's a pretty well-known verse when it comes to faith. Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. That's correct.

SPEAKER_02 55:48

Amazing.

SPEAKER_01 55:49

Let's okay, one more, actually. Sorry. Verse six. And without faith, it is impossible to please him. For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.

SPEAKER_02 56:01

Yeah, it is impossible to please him without faith. Yeah, let us please, Lord. I'll pray this in a prayer, but let us not be those who say, I have faith, but any longer. Take the but.

SPEAKER_01 56:17

Yeah, no conditions.

SPEAKER_02 56:20

No conditions. Yeah, he loves us, no conditions.

SPEAKER_01 56:23

Right.

SPEAKER_02 56:24

The least we can do. Thank you so much for this. This was so fun. And I have been, I think now I want to go back and reread Genesis.

SPEAKER_01 56:34

I know, right? Okay, I'll close out in prayer. Thank you, Lord Jesus. We thank you. Thank you, Heavenly Father, for who you are. Lord, we just come before you with faith, knowing in who you are, that you are good, that you are full of mercy, that you are all-knowing, that even there is no prayer that is missed. We thank you for being in the details. We thank you that you are Jehovah Jirah, the one that provides. You are our God, our provider, and not just in circumstances and materials, Father God, but that you would even provide us with a steadfast spirit and the willing heart to continue to serve you and walk out our faith, that we would not seek you to receive a blessing, but that we would seek you because we love you, that we would seek you because we delight in you, Father God. I ask you, Holy Spirit, to just um continue to pour over Ari and I, over our husbands and our family, and especially over our listeners. I just ask you, Lord, that you would just continue to reveal yourself to us, uh, that we would be humbled, that we can come before the throne of glory, not on our own merit, but because we know what price you had to pay, so that we may come before you. We thank you, Jesus. We thank you, Jesus, for loving us. We thank you, Father God, for seeing us. And I just pray that you bless everyone listening right now. And all these things we pray in Jesus' name, amen.

SPEAKER_02 57:57

Amen.