S3 Ep1 An Australian in Dubai- Meet AHMED KHAN

Meet Ahmed Khan, an Australian agent in Dubai, who tells us what it's really like there- from the good, to the bad and the ugly gold rush of UAE real estate.  We find out why he went there and if it's changed him, what he warrns prospective clients and also why it's appealing for Australian investors right now

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:05

Welcome to Meet the Agent Coast Series 3. I'm Wendy Clare from Jusion Period and International LuxListings.com. I'm so excited that today we are going to Dubai. We're taking you straight to Dubai to meet an Australian in Dubai, Ahmed Khan, who's going to tell us everything that we need to know about this mysterious country that's just taking the whole attention of the real estate world. So welcome, Ahmed. So glad you could join us.

SPEAKER_00 0:44

Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be here. And the opportunity, I'm really excited about it.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

So Yeah, so tell us what is it like today in Dubai? What's the weather? What's the feeling? Danny, one of our guests and also our followers and the audience had the best question ever. She just said, I'm so excited to know what's it like. And that's just a perfect way to begin.

SPEAKER_00 1:09

Okay, let's kick it off with Danny's question. So I mean, look, it's it's opposite season, so we're just about to start summer over here. It does get warm. We're in in the Middle East. This the temperatures will reach kind of 40 plus in the bigger summer, but yeah, yeah. But I would say like it's not, it's very different to the Australian summer.

SPEAKER_02 1:34

What is that like in Fahrenheit? Do you know? Do you know what that is for our internationals? Oh, okay. I'll add that in. That's okay, go on.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

So the the Aussie summer, which I was used to, was it was like I would say more harsh. It would burn your skin, like even someone with a slightly darker complexion, I would still get burnt. And over here, it's very different. Like you will get a tan, you won't necessarily get burnt, but it's just constantly warm, even in the evenings and stuff. So you don't get that relief of an evening time. But there's still so much to do in summer over here. There's still a lot of people that will visit here in summer, especially from Europe, surprisingly. Europe obviously gets busy during the summer. A lot of tourists head there, and a lot of the Europeans that want to get away from those kind of high traffic intakes, they'll end up here and relax and live that divine lifestyle.

SPEAKER_02 2:33

So is everyone rushing into the big inside malls? I remember being in Egypt, and it was a bit of that feeling of people darting outside for a while to get to and from some gorgeous mosque.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Is that is that what it's like?

SPEAKER_00 2:51

Yeah, you'll you'll get an element of that for sure. So the the fantastic part of this part of the world is it everything's open almost 24-7. So the malls will be open, let's say like nine or ten o'clock, a mall might open, and you'll obviously have air conditioning and everything inside. So people will be there during the day, but you don't have to rush from work to get to a mall because in Australia we're used to things closing at five o'clock and there's not much time to do anything of an evening. But over here, the malls are open till you know 10, 11, 12 o'clock. Uh, if you want to go to the movies at 2 a.m., there's still cinema showing sessions at those those times as well. So it gives people the opportunity to still uh invest into the economy and keep the economy going because you've got night golf and you've got paddle sessions inside. And I mean, I play football quite a bit. I'm I'm an avid football soccer fan, so I'm still playing soccer in the summers, but it's in an indoor pitch, like the whole full-size pitch is indoors, so uh you've still got plenty to do in summer over here.

SPEAKER_02 3:58

So you're playing football uh at what time? At two in the morning? No, surely not.

SPEAKER_00 4:04

Yeah, so like the latest session we'll probably do is around 11 p.m.

SPEAKER_02 4:08

Really?

SPEAKER_00 4:09

And we finish, yeah, we finish around 12:30, like after midnight. And yeah, there's still there's still things to do.

SPEAKER_02 4:16

That's incredible. So that is a little bit more like the European culture where everything starts late and ends late. Obviously, I'm meant to be in Europe because I'm I'm a late night owl, as we were chatting about. It's about 11 at night, and I'm just you know, this is perfect time for me. My caffeine is kicking into the right limit. So you're you're from Dubai originally, or your family? Tell us a little bit about your yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

So heritage, my my parents are both from Pakistan. Dad's been uh he migrated to Sydney about 55 years ago, about 56 years ago. So myself, my brothers, my sister, we're all born and raised in Sydney, been there our whole lives. I was fortunate enough to play a football for Pakistan's national team for a number of years. So I was traveling quite a bit playing football. And the back end of my last kind of international tournament, I ended up in Dubai. I met my wife here. She's also Pakistani, but born and raised here in the UAE. And yeah, we've been married just over 10 years. So I was a very frequent visitor to Dubai and meeting obviously her parents and spending time with them on during Christmas and New Year's and things like that. So yeah, like I was I was fortunate enough to be exposed to this market for the last 10 years, and wow, uh, it was definitely something that was intriguing me and kept me coming back.

SPEAKER_02 5:47

How beautiful. So for our international listeners, Christmas is what we call end of year long summer break. Doesn't necessarily mean the religion. We're not very religious, really, on the whole in Australia as a culture. So, yeah, what's that been like now being in a very religiously dominated place? Great, because you know there's more values or a little bit stifling.

SPEAKER_00 6:14

Yeah, I I would say I think the the misconception as well is that it is stifling, or there's restrictions, and like in my opinion, and I say this to a lot of my friends and people that I meet, like if they've never been, definitely come and visit because it's an eye-opener. I find the UAE to be the perfect blend of East and West. There's more expats living in Dubai than there are than than the actual locals. So you'll you'll you'll see a lot of foreigners, whether they're from Europe or Russia, Asia, the Americas, like there's every nationality is here. Dubai is definitely the most liberal state out of the UAE, which is what attracts so many of like the foreigners over here as well. So Christmas is still a big thing. My daughter's at school here, so they still celebrate Christmas at school, uh, because there's obviously people of other religious backgrounds, uh, but then you also get you know your religious holidays, for example, being in an Islamic country, you've got Eid, which follows Ramadan, and then you've obviously got the the end of Hajj as well, which is another kind of public holiday for everyone as well here.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

Right, interesting. Yeah, I I was looking at your socials, and you had a social where you were saying, you know, and we'll get we'll get to this topic about the market, but you were saying, you know, I'm I'm so used to seeing real estate agents that just disappear and then they end up in Bali somewhere. And when I first heard that, I thought they're being disappeared in Dubai. And I jolted because of course we don't really know much about the Middle East. And you know, actually I've been to Dubai in a stopover, but that was five hours. But it made me realize that in that time I tried to see a bit of the city. I went on one of the the the buses, the the buses and the rail lines, and there was a a different carriage for women, and it struck me as oh, okay, but then I realized this is interesting. I actually feel safe, and I wish that maybe in Sydney there were different carriages for women. So it challenged my preconception of the place, and in the middle of this carriage was one, I guess, stubborn man sitting in the carriage for women, with all the women, you know, respectfully trying to avoid eye contact and keeping distance, which was like a almost a Seinfeld episode for me. But it made me realize that we we sometimes jump to conclusions about a place very quickly without really understanding it. So I guess when you were making that clip, being a man in Dubai, there's probably a little bit more freedom. And I remember seeing Marty Fox, who's a big name in Australia, and has now started his business in Dubai, saying, you know, everyone is so free there. And I thought, well, yeah, but you're a man, Marty, you know. That's probably the way you're going to see it. But it's it's a different culture. So tell me a little bit more about those culture shocks and the misconceptions and what you were trying to get at then when you were talking about real estate agents disappearing and ending up in barley.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Yeah, yeah. I need to I need to reword some of my clips. I need to reword that clip now. So, in terms of the video, it was more kind of directed at look. I mean, the the market is there's a lot of real estate agents in this market from all over the globe. Now, a lot of them don't have kind of a genuine interest in property or real estate, they've just jumped into it because they've heard people can make a lot of money. Now, when the when when this Iran situation kind of started, because in in Dubai, I would say probably about 85% of agencies here work on a commission only basis. So there's no salary attached to what you're doing, it's purely off your activity, your closures, and your deals that get settled is when you get paid your commission. So there's a lot of people that have never done real estate back home in their native country, and then when the Iran situation happened, a lot of them disappeared. So I like just because it sorry disappeared in terms of like they either went back home to their native country or they heard that Bali, for example, is also attracting a lot of investment. So they they pivoted and moved into another market trying to now sell like property in Bali, for example. So that was a very kind of interesting kind of experience to kind of see here firsthand because I mean my pipeline's quite good. Like I've got a lot of investors that are working with me and clients that are buying for the first time. And then out of nowhere, I started getting more and more inquiry because you you asked a simple question, who have you worked with before? And they were like, Oh, I was working with this agent, and now that agent's not here. I'm like, Oh, so where are they? And he's like, Oh, well, he messaged me asking me about Bali or trying to sell me something in Portugal, and it was it's so it's it was very interesting to see that. I wouldn't be surprised if those agents eventually do come back once there's obviously a lot more clarification on what's happening with Iran. But um, that was what I was leading to.

SPEAKER_02 11:57

Yeah, so I'm hearing there's a bit of a kind of gold rush feel of people wanting to come and strike it big on beginner's luck, in a sense. The the kind of fly-by-night agents, and so it's become a crowded market because there's so much talk about it, but not everyone is going to have the experience and the diligence and the reputation that you need. A little bit like kind of the cd end of Hollywood or something, it sounds like yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, yeah, definitely good to know. Okay, that makes sense now.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

Yeah, so I think that's also like it it comes down to I think the for the agencies where they're where where individuals are working, like that plays a big part in how successful you're gonna be. Because again, if there's no salary attached to you being in the office, you're I guess another, as as we would say in Australia, another bum in a seat, just occupying a space, making the calls, trying to get listings, trying to sell. And if you don't perform after three, four months, you're probably gonna leave anyway because you need you need an income to survive here. So and in terms of like culture shock and those adjustments and things, uh I look a lot of it, and and I would love for kind of it to be true, a true sentiment across the globe. I think a lot of it just comes down to respect. Like if you're if you're open to operating and behaving in a way that respects the place that you're living and and and where you are, then then that will help you kind of get by. In in terms of I guess I mean going to the beaches here in Dubai, you'll you'll have obviously plenty of foreigners that are here, they can go to the beaches. They don't like, for example, I'll talk specifically for the ladies, like they can go to a beach and wear a swimsuit and stuff, and it's not like prohibited for them or anything like that. Oh, okay. Um, so it's and I mean, even from a a working point of view, obviously being summers, like women aren't expected, uh, especially if they're not of a specific faith, that they have to be fully covered. And that I think that even goes for women in general. I mean, if they're the the the Muslim women that are here, if they don't feel that they want to wear a particular outfit, they don't have to, it's not forced upon them. The only time you'd see a foreigner man or woman having to wear a specific outfit is when they walk into a mosque, for example, just out of respect to wear it at those times.

SPEAKER_02 14:35

And it would be inappropriate in Australia, in a church, in the same way, to be dressed in a bikini, for example, you wouldn't do it. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 14:44

Yeah. I've I've had a lot of friends from Australia that have asked, like, oh, if I visit Dubai, like, can my wife wear this and wear that? And yes, absolutely. Like, as long as she's not like walking out inappropriately, like in a bikini, and she's you know, outside of a hotel or outside the apartment, for example, like in the middle of a street, you wouldn't really expect people to do that in any city, really. You dress appropriately for like the street. I mean, girls will wear skirts, girls will wear corporate attire that's suitable for the weather as well.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

Right. Okay, that sounds good. That sounds better than I was thinking. And yeah, it's a little bit of understanding both sides, isn't it? I mean, I remember being in Egypt, and of course, being a tourist, I went to buy a belly dancing costume as everyone does, and the man in the shop went, You realize this is for dancing, right? And I was like, Yes, yes, I've I've realized that is it's kind of misconceptions both ways. Yeah, I'm not wearing that to the office, right?

SPEAKER_00 15:47

Yeah, I think for me, like the frequency of my travels as well, like back to Australia, like since I've been here, the one thing I've really got accustomed to here in Dubai is you don't see people yelling or carrying on in the streets, for example. So over here it's it's seemed to be offensive if you walk out in the streets and you start hurling abuse at someone, uh, for example. Like that's because the way I see it is like people here feel like you're you're offending someone if you're yelling or hurling abuse or anything like that. So over here, like you'll walk in the streets, or even if you're out, you you head to the bars or a pub, or you're at you're you're out at one of the nightclubs and stuff, and then afterwards, you won't really see people carrying on in the streets, even if they've drank a little bit too much. It's more it's more they'll you'll see them calmly leave and they'll get into their taxis or whatever and head home. And yeah, like you won't really see people fighting in the streets or you know, right, uh people doing anything stupid. But yeah, which I'm getting very used to that.

SPEAKER_02 17:00

That sounds like a good thing. It's definitely a good thing. A little bit more civil and controlled.

SPEAKER_00 17:07

Correct, yeah, correct.

SPEAKER_02 17:08

Excellent. Excellent. And what are the cultural differences when you're working as an agent? I mean, when it comes to the real estate market, is there anything that comes to mind there?

SPEAKER_00 17:23

Yeah, so you just I mean, English is still the predominantly what everyone speaks here in terms of doing business, even the local Arabs, they'll they'll speak English, some of them a little bit less, and it's a bit broken, things like that, but you can get by here, just speaking English. In terms of like culturally and religiously, like Friday in in Islam is like the equivalent of church Sunday, for example. So Fridays here, there's like prayer time at around 1 a.m. what 1 p.m. So you'll get a little bit of a quiet period. Some offices won't open until after prayer time, for example, the banks, whereas others might finish up after prayer time. So it's only really a half day. Uh in real estate, when it comes to uh working in this market, again, like it's just uh understanding who you're speaking to, uh you know, uh is it the right time to call them and things like that?

SPEAKER_03 18:22

Right, interesting.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

So it's yeah, it's not uncommon for you to be speaking to someone at 9, 10 p.m. talking about properties and and listing a property or selling a property because people are uh happy to do business at any time of the day here.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

Right, yeah, that's a big difference. Very interesting. So did you feel it's probably a little bit easier for you to have slipped into the culture, but your role now is very much kind of guiding people to help them transition into that culture and obviously into a you know very exciting investment market. I'm presuming that you're really dealing with clients that are wanting to invest in Dubai rather than move there, then yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 19:14

Yeah, correct. Correct.

SPEAKER_02 19:16

And it's quite it's quite pertinent, actually, that we're speaking tonight because it's budget night in Australia and everyone has been on tender hooks about the housing market and about interest rates and about the taxation, capital gains, negative gearing, all of these things that are, to be honest, beyond my understanding is the interior design. But it it really made me think, ah, I get it. If you are feeling a little bit trapped in your options in the Australian market, what you are offering is an ability for people to look at another market entirely.

SPEAKER_03 19:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:59

Where it seems there's there's a lot of you know growth potential. Is that right? You want to tell me a little bit about that?

SPEAKER_00 20:06

Yeah, for sure. So, in to your first question, like did I slip in and did I just feel very comfortable? I think for me, the biggest thing was I didn't want to, I didn't want to move here with the mindset that it's gonna be easy. So I didn't take anything for granted. I just knew that if I'm here, I'm gonna be in be completely invested and do the work that I would be doing whether I was in Sydney, right? Like you've still got to do the calls, you've still still got to meet people and stay true to yourself, I think, as well in in how you want to operate. I think that's the best way to get a good feel for how you're going to perform in a market.

SPEAKER_03 20:45

Right.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

I knew nothing was really going to be handed to me here. It was essentially moving from a market where I had a really strong network base and leaving that behind and coming to Dubai and starting from absolute zero. I felt like I was at my first day of kindergarten and I had to make new friends and all that kind of stuff. But for me, the exciting thing was like understanding how does it work, what is the advantage that people can take it like to take take advantage of. And then I was fortunate enough to, I guess within six months of being here in the market, I got poached by a business that wanted an Australian that was traveling to Australia and becoming that bridge for investors. It's I'm sure for some of your lists like across the globe, there's more and more Dubai property roadshows happening on a weekend, and different agencies are hosting them on a weekend in the different city around the world. So I now do that for the Australian market where where I am here in Dubai. So I fly back into Australia twice a month. I'll do an event over a weekend, but then I'm regularly back, whether it's Perth or Sydney, Melbourne. Brisbane Gold Coast, it doesn't really matter. I missed Adelaide, but Adelaide as well. But yeah, the the idea of me being here is to assist Australians to understand the market first, understand like or eliminate the hype from the reality, and then kind of go go with a calculated decision. Because I still have, you know, my family still in Sydney, like my parents, my brothers. I moved obviously to buy with my wife and daughter, but my my immediate family is there and I still visit them frequently. I've still got invested, sorry, I've I've still got investments in in Australia as well. So this is never a kind of a get rich quick scheme. It's still people's biggest assets that they're investing into. So I still bring that kind of, I guess, an Aussie mentality to how we're investing, but how can we implement it here, take ownership of it, understand the strategy, and then execute it with a level of comfort that people are are willing to kind of move ahead with?

SPEAKER_02 23:08

Wow, interesting. Yeah, it's true because you know, as you said, nothing ever gets handed to you if it's going to be substantial and important, you know, short-term gains and never as as good as the long-term ones. So that seems a very grounded and responsible approach. Do you have clients though really wanting that unicorns get rich quick investment? And you're trying to say to them, you know, slow down.

SPEAKER_00 23:39

There's so those clients, I won't, I I most likely won't meet them on these events in Australia. They'll most likely be here. And I've I've had a few clients that have, you know, if if we're talking Australian dollars, they've probably bought worth 10, 15 million Aussie dollars worth of property in one transaction. And it's just been an immediate, you know, yep, that looks like a great investment. I just want to buy that. And and it for them, it's more of a like a purchase and forget kind of option. They'll they'll buy it, let it sit there, they'll whether it's a ready property, they'll get some rental income and they're happy to just leave it there. Right. Um but there's yeah, there's a lot of that here as well. I mean, if you look at the investors coming from Russia into this market, you know, there's there's some huge transactions from Europe at the moment as well that do you know come across into this market. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:43

So can I can I ask, being you know, a blunt Australian type, what are the figures that we're talking here? I mean, I think we we had a kind of pre-meet chat where you were sort of saying something to me like no, there's no tax even in Dubai, which was just shattering my brain. I mean, what are the what are the figures, what are the growth rates for all of the excited accountants out there, which I'm not one? What are the kind of numbers being slung around?

SPEAKER_00 25:15

So again, like the if I split Dubai into certain segments, like water pro waterfront properties always going to outperform an inland property. So, waterfront properties, I mean, let's take the iconic Palm Jumara, right? The the palm that was built initially when properties were being sold there, they were selling for about three, 3.5 million dirhams. Uh, and people thought, you know, it's probably gonna sink in 10 years and it won't be there anymore. But there was people that invested, obviously, the palm is still there. It's one of the most iconic locations in Dubai, and it definitely attracts the ultra-wealthy. Properties there, the the cheapest property you're gonna find there right now is about 50 million dirhams. And that's in a span of 10 years, the property's jumped from 3.5 million to 50. Now that's extraordinary growth.

SPEAKER_02 26:08

Right. Thank you so much for joining us. And you've got properties. It's been just as fantastic as I expected. And thank you. I'm going to go to the entry point supported by my design and banking company to join us next week for another episode.

SPEAKER_00 26:31

Actually, it's almost like you've got that pin that I've got a property in the palm, and and it becomes like a staple that in their in their investment portfolio. So if we look at other locations, you're looking anywhere from I guess 20 to 50 percent capital appreciation in in value. If we look at kind of Dubai as a whole, some areas might perform a little bit slower, but uh, if you look at a five or six-year period, what is to come in those areas, you'll you'll you'll probably pick up a lot more growth in in that period uh after six years.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

Wow, interesting.

SPEAKER_00 27:13

Yeah. In terms of like settlements and deals happening, uh you're you know, I think there was last week. If I look at the numbers for last week, I was looking at them earlier. Last week the off-plan market did about 826 million in the sales, which is a week's activity uh again in the start of a month. So there's there's definitely a lot of transactions still happening, uh, and that's still I guess not the peak of what the market operates. So they end up in billions and like 4.2 billion, I think, was what had transacted just in or in May, in April. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:59

Incredible. Incredible. Well, it's it's hard to know where you're beginning at with those numbers. It's certainly not what the housing market in Sydney is looking like, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_00 28:13

Yeah, and I look, I I if I think it would be I in terms of like numbers, the numbers sound huge. The numbers like, and in terms of even rental returns, like on average, a rental return in Sydney, for example, is about three to three point five percent. In Dubai, on average as a whole market, you're looking at about six and a half, seven percent. So it's still you know, uh there's still some really strong rental returns. In in line with what you're asking about tax, I don't want to give um any advice. Uh I'm not a an accountant, but yeah, like the way Dubai operates, there's there's no income tax on your salaries, there's no you know, tax on your rental income that you're receiving for an investment property. And if you're to sell a property with and you're making whatever profit you do, there's no capital gains tax either on that. So whatever profit you make goes to you as a property owner. And that attracts investors, it keeps their economy growing, it keeps it moving forward. It's a big reason why you've got a huge spread of the type of investor as well. You've got the ultra-wealthy, you've got people that are, you know, seasoned investors that know exactly what type of investment they like. And you've even got your entry-level investor now as well, that you know, is looking to explore into an international market.

SPEAKER_02 29:42

So you were you were telling me as well, and we use this quote on the Insta carousel, because I thought it very intriguing that you always say first though to clients that you ask, are you stable first in your investments in the Australian market before you invest in Dubai?

SPEAKER_00 30:04

In terms of what we've discussed before, let me explain kind of why that's kind of my ethos of how I operate. So I spent 16 years working in finance before I moved into real estate. So working with the big banks, and I was always exposed to property. Like my my family had my dad had done a lot of investments in Australia before, and from a young age I was exposed to that. Now, from my banking experience, I got a real kind of insight into how difficult it was for Australians to purchase property. Um, I people would be saving up for a lifetime, and that's the the Australian dream, and I'm sure it's the dream for a lot of people across the globe, is to get into the market, own an asset, and then kind of as my time in finance progressed, like it was just just seemed like it was something that's being further and more difficult and for for the average Australian. Now that's why when I meet with Australians and I and I see them, I mean, I think it's important. I think you've got to be honest with yourself. And you've if I can help someone to enter the property market, I would love nothing more to the to be able to do that for them. But if again, like we spoke about it briefly, like I'm helping more, I'm not I'm not necessarily encouraging every Australian to move to the UAE. This is about an investment opportunity for them to take advantage of. And that's why I always come back to that core value and core question. Like, are they established? Are they have they entered the market in Australia and settled themselves there before they kind of jump into an international market, whether it's here, whether it's you know another market? But I mean, I I would hate nothing more for someone to lose money in a foreign market that they've saved for such a long time. Because it's a slippery slope of that get rich quick kind of idea that we spoke about briefly before. This is again people's biggest assets. Uh where it is a foreign market, there's there's things to take advantage of in the UAE or how they operate and how safe it is in terms of particular types of investments. But I just feel like it's the right thing to do by people to make them like have a strong base in Australia and something they can always fall back on.

SPEAKER_02 32:39

Take care of your fundamental needs first before you take anything that's different or foreign or risky is is sensible, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 32:49

Correct.

SPEAKER_02 32:50

Makes sense. Do you think that the Dubai market is a little bit more risky than say the Australian market?

SPEAKER_00 33:00

So I I it's probably hard for me to say I I personally, because I'm I'm in the market, I don't see it to be as risky. There's smart investments to do, but then there's they are there are definitely more risky investments to kind of toy with as well. It I'll give you a quick snapshot of how this market works because it's it's different to the Australian market, and I can't speak for any of the other international markets, I'm not exposed to them. But when we're buying property in Australia and it's an off-plane, we're buying directly from a developer, we pay 10% down to hold a unit, and then we're waiting for that developer to complete a project, whether they hand it over on time, or they delay it, or they go bankrupt and liquidate, and we don't see them, and we lose money. There's there's all those kind of elements that kind of come into play. Now, in Dubai, they've experienced a global financial crisis like everyone else did. And from that experience, there was a lot of investment lost. People did lose their money, there wasn't a proper structure in place then. So the government here evolved how investors operate and it protects the investor a little bit more. So let's say I'm a developer and I, you know, I show that this is a project I'm gonna build, I take that to the Dubai Land Department. It's a government organization, it's like your governing council, like you would deal with your local councils in in Australia. So the governing council is Dubai Land Department. As a developer, I take my plans there, I get those plans approved, and then me as a developer, I would have to show that I'm financially liquid to complete that project without relying on any sales from the market.

SPEAKER_03 34:55

Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:56

Right? So once I've approved, once that's been kind of green tipped and I've I've passed that, the Dubai Land Department here in Dubai sets up an escrow account, so trust accounts, for that particular project. Now I can go to market and sell my units or villas or whatever I'm selling, but all investors that are buying into it pay into escrow, not to me as a developer. And the developers only getting access to funds once they complete the project. Right? So for me as a developer, the motivation becomes I need to start and complete the project in line with all the checks and balances required by the by land department in order to get access to funds and get paid. So again, like at any stage, like there's no motivation over here for a developer to go, okay, well, I've got the money, I'm disappearing because all money sits in escrow for them, so they can't even touch it. That's why the the developments here they start and finish on time in most cases, because that's the way the system's been set up. So I would say, yeah, like it's a safer market if you're looking to invest and buy an investment property, and it depends on your strategy. Do you want to do you want to sell it uh on completion and pocket some profit and reinvest for whatever it is? Or you could even hold it and have an Airbnb or a long-term rental option as well, or potentially holiday home. So, yeah, like there's I feel like it's a safe investment as long as you're buying in the right area with the right developer who has a proof of concept and has delivered in this market before. There's over 22,500 developers in Dubai. So you've got to pick the right one, right?

SPEAKER_02 36:48

So there's some opportunities there that are perhaps going to be safer than what we know back in Australia, but you've got to be selective and look for those safer opportunities. That makes sense. That's a sensible approach. That's great. I love that.

unknown 37:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:07

Sounds good. So tell us what else we we need to know about.

SPEAKER_00 37:14

In terms of I, you know, we we spoke briefly on in terms of like how does Dubai compare to Sydney, to London, to New York, and and all those kind of markets as well. So I think for like that's a very common question I get. Obviously, tax is one component why people do like the Dubai market. When we look at London and New York, they obviously are like your your capital preservation type markets. You you hold into a stable market and and your asset will relatively stay, you know, strong in terms of returns. More and more, I guess what I'm seeing from the Australian market is that the affordability is getting a lot harder for people.

SPEAKER_03 38:00

So hard here, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:02

Yeah, and the the barrier to entry in terms of price point is just getting higher. I mean, born and raised in Sydney, we always saw Sydney or Melbourne as those kind of big, iconic, more expensive kind of cities. And you know, this year I've been to Perth five times this year, and more and more people from Perth are telling me how expensive property is there. And that's why. Because I would always ask, like, what's the motivation for your investment in in Dubai? And they're like, Well, we're being outpriced by everyone from the East Coast buying in Perth, and we just can't afford it here anymore. So there's also those transitions that take place. So it's definitely been, you know, the attract main attraction for Dubai has been that it's it's still a growth market. It's 50 years old. They've got a 2040 plan for Dubai, which is, you know, it has a couple of huge milestones within it, which will change the landscape of Dubai completely. The population of Dubai in December last year was 4 million, and their goal by 2040 is to hit 8 million. They've also got the world's largest airport that they're building, which will be close to 400 terminals. They've got the flying taxis that should be starting this year sometime, and they want Dubai to be 400% greener in terms of the city, not just, I guess, green energy. It's more, they want more greenery around. So a lot of the new developments, you know, have an element of greenery within them. Whether it's a villa community, you'll see maybe 60% of the land is what will be constructed on. The rest of it has to have greenery and trees and parkland and all those kind of things as well. So no more concrete jungle. There'll definitely be greenery around.

SPEAKER_02 40:02

Yeah, that's fantastic. Because yeah, it is a quite overwhelming city. I mean, when you first go there, it's just striking and it is very luxurious, and the standards of luxury and wealth do seem to be on another level. But now you mention it, yeah. The greenery and these elements of nature are so important too. So that's very interesting. All right, we can tick that question. I'll pretend I'm asking you to cut it in. So, how is it different there in Dubai from say other markets? What else do we have to cover there, Ahmed? We covered Danny.

SPEAKER_00 40:40

You touched on you touched on luxury.

SPEAKER_02 40:44

Oh, yeah. So let me ask you, is there a different feeling or idea of what luxury is in the UAE or specifically Dubai?

SPEAKER_00 40:54

Yeah, I think the definition of luxury changes every month over here. So there's there's always something new. Yeah, it's it's so interesting.

SPEAKER_01 41:04

Are we talking like Japanese toilets that do your coffee?

SPEAKER_00 41:09

I mean, I'm sure I wouldn't be surprised if that's happening somewhere. There's there's elements of obviously the the fashion side and the the cars and everything like that. But I just like even if we look at your basic investment kind of here in Dubai, if it's a studio or a one bed, the new developments here just offer you so much more than what you would get from an apartment building in Australia at the moment. The and this all ties into that 2040 plan that they want these buildings to have greenery or they they want them to offer more than just you know the concrete slab that they're built on. So, I mean, the the new developments here. I mean, for me, this is still luxury because I I need to resonate with the Australian client that's looking at the investment, because here you'll you won't just have an apartment building with a pool and a gym, it'll also have a salon, it'll have a daycare center, it'll have a cinema room, it'll have you know your your your sauna, and and the list goes on like there's there's a new development that just wants to be.

SPEAKER_02 42:21

Why do you need a sauna if it's 40 degrees?

SPEAKER_00 42:25

Yeah, so some people just want that after a training session or something, but there's but that's true.

SPEAKER_02 42:32

Luxury is always a question of why do you need it? I mean, how many perfumes do you need? It's not about need, right? When it's luxury.

SPEAKER_00 42:39

Yeah, but yes, you're I mean, because like going to get gym membership, for example, might be expensive. And if you want to do yoga classes, it's expensive. So now all these facilities are available within the apartment, and even if the strata fees correct. Yeah, I would say Dubai is built on convenience, like it's on another level.

SPEAKER_02 43:01

Interesting, yeah. Wow. So, yeah, I mean the idea of having a pool is it it's so mandatory for really any any luxury market around the world now, isn't it? It's like having a bathroom. You have to have a pool, it's a given you have to have air conditioning in a car, in a house. So yeah, but wellness is definitely on the rise around the world. And I'm I'm hearing from what you're talking about that clearly it's on the agenda there in Dubai.

SPEAKER_00 43:29

Definitely. Yeah. There's, I mean, you you've got so many expats here. You know, there's a lot of people from England that are here, and they just love the outdoors. And you've got your run clubs, and you've got your, you know, golf is a huge sport here.

SPEAKER_02 43:44

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 43:45

Paddle. Uh, have you heard of paddle as well?

SPEAKER_02 43:48

Paddle? It sounds like paddle boarding to me.

SPEAKER_00 43:51

Okay. So paddle is like a it's a it's a mix between tennis and tennis and like. Like uh squash almost.

SPEAKER_01 44:01

Really? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 44:03

Yeah. So it's smaller p smaller courts and very European sport that's caught on like hot fire, like or hotcakes, yeah. So it's there's a lot of people into that. And yeah, the outdoor activities people are really getting to their cycling and and just that's all available to people frequently now.

SPEAKER_02 44:23

So I I'm hearing and imagining you've got really any sport you could want, except maybe skiing. Or do they have fake snow there even in the the mountains?

SPEAKER_00 44:35

Yeah, you'll be surprised. So they've got a they've got a ski slope inside one of the malls, yeah. So in the Mall of Emirates, you've got a ski slope there, so it's it's an indoor ski slope. So they do have snow.

SPEAKER_02 44:48

Fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 44:49

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:50

So that is really remarkable. I mean, why are you coming back to Australia providing me again?

SPEAKER_00 44:59

So again, like I I still see Australia to be home.

SPEAKER_03 45:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

I'm here, like obviously, like I think there there is definitely a lot of opportunity. It's it's allowed me to kind of get out of my comfort zone, but I I'm thoroughly enjoying it. I I think in terms of if I can be the bridge to help Australian investors get ahead and growth and make some real wealth, I'm I'm all for it. I don't really have plans to immediately return to Australia permanently. Like, I want to kind of see how this market evolves as well. And yeah, like I I I think there's a lot of opportunity here to to enjoy, and I I love seeing the the city like reshaping itself.

SPEAKER_02 45:48

Yeah, that sounds really exciting. And if it's working and you're enjoying it and you're not only surviving but but flourishing, why not? That's fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 46:00

So has it changed you, do you think, as a person in any way?

SPEAKER_00 46:08

I think it's very easy for people to get lost here in the city. I I do know a few people that ventured to Australia from Australia to to buy and it wasn't their fit. And I mean you could you can spend your life savings here within a couple of days very easily. But I look I'm I'm a pretty grounded individual. I I like to kind of live the simple life on I yes, there's a lot of conveniences and luxuries to enjoy here. You know, I'm my my main priority is to take care of my family and make sure that they're all happy and and we're investing and we're growing our our our own kind of family and things like that here. So I don't think I've changed. I think I'm at a point in my life where I I am who I am and I enjoy what I do and yeah, like that's just kind of how I approach life, really.

SPEAKER_02 47:05

Yeah, that's good. I mean, I think that's fantastic because it's a wonderful thing about Australians that we're known to be, and I think genuinely are, quite down-to-earth, quite grounded people, and you're able to offer that plus a little bit of that, you know, glitz and glamour and and go beyond the the struggle that we've always sort of seemed to identify with and and and reach to a different reality. That's that's fantastic. So I realized I have I have to ask you too our interesting, fun question, not to be taken too seriously, but it's enlightening usually. What kind of music, or preferably a music star or song, most fits a med Khan? Most resembles you, your vibe, your approach, your energy, who you present to your question.

SPEAKER_00 48:09

So I grew up in '83, maybe, right? So 1983 is when I was born, and I growing up in that kind of time, a lot of the people around me were you know, MJ was a big thing for a lot of people. So I think it's hard to not say, you know, when I think of music, like such an icon, you know, and it doesn't matter where you go in the world, if that beat starts, everyone knows oh, that's MJ.

SPEAKER_02 48:43

Like, uh, so I think like for me, there's a defining sound of your correct your youth, really, your era, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:52

Yeah, so for me, I like I think there's two parts of this question. If you don't mind me kind of giving you both parts, I I was a big MJ fan, so I mean, if if you were to say, hey, like put on a song, like I would say Billy Jean. Oh, I love that kind of be so fitting.

SPEAKER_02 49:11

That's my favorite MJ trap you just mentioned. Okay, go on.

SPEAKER_00 49:16

It's so iconic. Yeah, it's so iconic, and and I think for me, like I always you know enjoyed the dance floor a little bit, so that was just um for me, like MJ was a big part of kind of me growing up.

SPEAKER_02 49:32

I'm gonna make when I tell you I actually was about two meters from him.

SPEAKER_03 49:37

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02 49:39

I got to dance in front of him literally at a at a gala event at a film festival. One of my films. It was a it was a really bitchy moment.

SPEAKER_00 49:49

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:50

Sorry, go on.

SPEAKER_00 49:51

That's like I think for especially when you meet those celebrities, it is just such a a surreal moment to kind of do it.

SPEAKER_02 50:00

He had one glove on and all. I mean stunning anyway, go on. And what what's the other song or track?

SPEAKER_00 50:08

So yeah, I think so. For me, it was always what was my motivator in terms of getting me in the zone, and I'll I'll bring it back to like football, so soccer for me um whenever I had my headphones in before a big game and before like just kind of getting me into that zone. Is it's a song by Fort Minor. It's called Remember the Name, uh, and that was all kind of I think the lyrics kind of you know they resonated a quite a bit and it just kind of got me focused. So that kind of plays wrench free in my head quite a bit. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:45

Excellent. So it's like a a a match or a kind of um ethos for you. That's how you I like that. Well, absolutely. I mean, whenever one thing a wheel, one song, so that that's perfect. And yeah, I I get the sense that that hasn't changed. I mean, you're still both of those things, so yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 51:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 51:13

Well, it's been so good that before we wrap up. I always like to ask, is there anything else you want to tell us or add or that uh you not forgotten to venture into because sometimes um it's those little things that people feel a niggling that they really want to say to the world that are the most interesting or intriguing.

SPEAKER_00 51:39

I look the the only thing I'll say is uh you know don't be afraid of having a conversation. Um like always be ready to learn something new. I mean, if we knew everything, we would be the one that would be teaching people as well. But like you've got to like one thing that's kind of brought me to a very quick realization here in Dubai is that you never know who you're standing next to. Um, you know, they could be a you know, a first-time investor or a a multi-billionaire, uh, and one interaction can change your life. Uh so this power and a genuine conversation. Uh and again, like if anyone uh from from your listener group ever wanted to reach out and have a chat and ask any questions, I'm more than happy to have that conversation. Uh and yeah. Wonderful, it's been an absolute pleasure to have a chat.

SPEAKER_02 52:36

It's just meant to be. It's so thrilling and and wonderful and enlightening to have you uh explained by and have you launch our new series. So thank you so much. And thank you everyone for listening in. I'm Wendy Clare. Join us next week for another episode of Wind Podcast.