The Feminisation of Christianity | Ep.7

Today we tackle how Christianity became feminised in language, music, and culture, and why that’s driving men away. We argue for devotion over sentiment, agape over romance, and a public, gritty faith with clear duties.

• gender gap in church attendance and why it persists
• men’s and women’s value sets and how Jesus is framed
• language as a potential cause for gender discrepancies
• love defined as willed, costly action for spiritual growth
• correcting misreadings of Song of Solomon and “turn the other cheek”
• public mission, duty, courage, and the arena mindset
• worship trends that romanticise Jesus and how to fix them
• stronger male role models and practical paths for men to serve
• why reaching men reshapes whole families and communities

Christ is King, Jesus loves you, and He's coming back soon.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Hitting Episode Seven And Pushback
• 2:04 Modesty Post Backlash And Online Sleaze
• 5:56 Arguing With The Internet And Bad Logic
• 13:28 The Gender Gap In Church
• 17:50 Value Sets: Is Jesus Painted Feminine
• 22:16 Language Matters: Intimacy Vs Devotion
• 29:10 Love In Greek: Agape Not Romance
• 36:44 Public Faith, Duty, And The Arena
• 44:24 Soft Preaching And Misread “Turn The Other Cheek”
• 50:56 Worship Music And Romanticising Jesus
• 57:06 Weak Role Models And Low-T Pastors
• 1:03:41 Awkward Church Practices For Men

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Welcome to episode seven of Ministry of Man. Guys, we're here. Episode seven. Come on now. I'm gonna start saying uh my name too, because I'm your host. I'm the host. And my name is Isaac Anthony Turner. And I'm I'm the host here at the Ministry of Man podcast. And let me tell you this. I heard that 99% of podcasts created don't make it past episode seven. And we're here at episode seven right here, right now. So, and then out of that 99%, sorry, out of the 1% that make it past episode 7, 99% of those don't make it past episode 21. So our goal is to be in the 0.1% of podcasts of all time by making it to 21 episodes. So that's our goal. And uh yeah, I'm keen to do it. But more updates because your boy is getting some controversy on some posts, which is good. It's good for the algorithm, it's good for the algo, it's good for the I don't know, the hours watched, if people are arguing, people are arguing in my comment section, and I'm just sitting back thinking that's that's hilarious. I'm like watching it. I'm like, okay, that's that's kind of good. Like, oh, they got a bit of uh witty repartee going on. But there are a couple of things that I need to get ahead of because I I gotta beat this early because there's some allegations getting out there, guys, and I gotta get in get in front of this. So because the post that blew up was about modesty, particularly women's modesty, the commenters are calling me gay. They're like, this guy doesn't want to see girls wearing less. He wants modesty, but he must be gay. So I've got to beat these allegations, guys. I've got to beat them because they're laughing at me. Now, do I have a few guys in my corner commenting on those posts, backing me and saying, no, this is a decent human being that just wants a decent society, that doesn't want children exposed to certain things when they go to the beach. Yes, I do have some people in my corner, but they're trying, they're trying to bring me down, guys. Um, but it ain't working, so we're just gonna keep on doing it. But it is kind of funny when you when you look at like when someone gets offended of something that is like they just want to try and hurt the person. So they didn't like my take, and they're like, I want to hurt this guy now, and so they're like, Oh, okay, you must like other men, and yeah, it's just funny because they're like you can just tell that it's a sore spot for them if you uh oh the the funniest one though was someone made that joke, but they had a pride flag in their bio, and so they're like they're by trying to offend me by calling me gay, they're they're admitting that it's like a negative thing that they're using it as an insult, but they've got the pride flag in the bio. So what does that tell you? I called them out on it too, and they got ratioed really hard, which I thought was funny. Everyone was like, Yeah, you got cooked. So that was a nice little um bit of fun, but I can tell you this as well the other side of this is a lot of the girls they don't realize the depravity of man. So you're not gonna win by being like, oh yeah, well, I'm gonna wear even less. Because for every one guy that's like, you know, modesty is a good thing, there's 10 other guys that want girls to be wearing nothing at all, ever, all the time. Like one girl was like, Oh yeah, nice video. I'm gonna go out and buy three bikinis now. And then another guy commented on it and was like, oh yeah, yeah, that sounds good to me. And then she then she got creeped out and was like, um, yeah, I'm definitely not doing it now.

unknown: 4:38

And then it was like, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 4:41

Another girl was like, and I kid you not, she goes, I wear bikinis because I like to show off my insane abs that I worked really hard for. And there was no less than like 40 guys commenting on it, being like, oh, show us a pick. I want to see those abs. Like, prove it, prove that you got there. Like, it was so creepy. Like, you're not gonna win by trying to be like, oh yeah, you want us to like you want us to be modest? Well, we're gonna wear even less now. Like, guys are sleezers. There's so many more sleezers than not. Like, there's no winning that game. You cannot win. Uh, at least not playing it that way, because you're just feeding into the copious amounts of I don't know, depraved men out there, or just lustful men, like they have no limits. So I thought that was kind of funny. It was like girls trying to flex on it and then just like inundated with sleaze bags. And what can you do? What can you do? The other thing uh I thought was really funny as well. Well, actually, no, the other thing that's been weighing on my mind is I'm discovering new depths and new levels of stupidity out there, and I'm I'm questioning whether I'm cut out for this gig because I'm posting this stuff. Normally, when you see a stupid thing on the internet, you can kind of just blow right past it. You're like, okay, someone you see, you see a video, you check the comments, someone says a stupid thing, you're like, uh, that's obviously it doesn't make sense, and then so you, but you're like, this is not none of my business. So I'm not gonna spend time arguing with strangers on the internet or even bothering to waste my time commenting. But because it's my page and it's like my opinions, it's directed to me specifically. This is my face, and so it's a lot harder to not call people out when they say stupid things. And also like the degree to how stupid it is, I almost feel an obligation to reply because if someone else reads it, their stupid comment, then they might think that that is a true thing because people don't, I don't know. I'm not reaching the best target audience, I can tell you that much. One of the biggest things is, and I saw someone else point this out, but I'm seeing it happen in real time now, is that you can really identify a stupid person or just an idiot when they can't separate the difference between groups and individuals. So the last episode I put out was all about groups. It was a gender thing. So women being more likely to do this, men being more likely to do this, or behave in a particular way. And there's studies that have proven this. So they're clinical trials that they have put out, that they've replicated, and this is just the information. So I'm just sharing the information on these studies. And the amount of people that will read it and just go, not true, I don't do that. Or nope, that's wrong. Me and my wife operate like this. And it's like, yeah, I'm sure you do. Like it, yeah, it's not a hundred like one of the things is like, oh yeah, men are more likely to wake up from sticks cracking outside, women more likely to wake up from their baby crying, and then someone's like, a guy's like, I wake up from both. Like, yeah, so that's not true. You're like, yeah, yeah, cool, man. Sure. Did you hear the part where I said more likely? Like, if someone is completely unable, it's like saying, you know, men on average are taller than women, and then someone going, I know a girl who's taller than me, and it's a guy, and you're like, dude, what are we doing here? Go away. Go away from me now. I'm not I'm not, I can't be around these people. And so I really have to be, I have to blow up quickly. Okay. I have to blow up quickly because when there's like, you know, thousands and thousands of comments on a video, then you you obviously you can't reply. But if I'm getting like 10 to 20 comments on a video, that's not that's not enough. It's too easy to see these stupid comments, they can't get lost in the crowd. Uh, so their stupidity sticks out, and it sticks out to me the most because I'm checking it because I get the notification of it. It tells me about it. It's very hard to ignore. The other thing that really frustrates me that's been happening as well, is when, and this is another, I suppose, metric of a stupid person, is when they can't separate the content of an example or an analogy and the structure of the analogy or the structure of what it is that you're trying to say. So I gave an example in one of the previous pods I did, one of the previous poddies. And what it said was you should do hard things, you should do difficult things on purpose so that when uh things happen to you, you're better equipped to deal with it because you've kind of trained almost. You've prepared in a particular way. And the example that I gave was a marathon example about the things that I did to prepare. I didn't just wake up on the day, whatever. And someone commented going, uh, marathons aren't a real life problem. Like none of that uh would help in real life, or blah, blah, blah. And it's like, yeah, it's called an analogy. It's not, it's, it's, it's meant to help reinforce a particular idea. So they get, they get wrapped up in the content of, oh, it's a marathon, but it's I'm just looking at it from the structure. Like the structure is the point, not the content. The structure is a thing and then preparing beforehand training so the thing isn't as hard when you get to the thing or when it comes. It's not everyone needs to do marathons now, and this is how you do it. Like, oh yeah, it's like, come on, man. How do people just not know this automatically? Like, I'm not I'm not smart enough for there to be this many people dumber than me. So it's really concerning, dude. This is why the podcast exists, though, because this is the Ministry of Man podcast, and I'm ministering to man right now. So maybe I am reaching the right target audience, but by gosh, I don't know how to reach them. How do I reach these kids? Yeah, anyway. Um, so that's I guess a little recap. I'm finding new levels of stupidity. And shout out to the people, like one thing that's like really funny is because I guess the first episode I did was on the the on stupidity, and it wasn't supposed to be a running theme for this podcast, I guess. It was just meant to be, I just wanted to talk about things that I find interesting and that are like somewhat informative or educational and interesting that might help some people. Uh but like people that keep keep sending me things like about stupidity now, which is really, which is really cool because uh I don't know, I think it's I think it's funny. And it's just such a fun kind of topic because at the end of the day, all these people like you want the best for them. Like you want everyone to do well, you want everyone to heal from pain, you want everyone to be successful in whatever ventures they're trying, you know, the people that are putting themselves out there. You want people to grow and learn and develop, like everyone, like we can all win here. And so ultimately that's that's what I want for everyone. Uh, and I suppose none of these people that I'm kind of mentioning are going to listen to my actual hour-long podcast because they didn't like my 30-second clip. Uh, so I can talk about it freely, but anyway, I hope they all succeed in life, and I hope they all find the Lord God, Jesus. That's what I hope for everyone. So, speaking of Jesus, today, this episode is one that has been on my mind and heart for a very long time, and it is about the feminization of Christianity. Because this is an important topic, and it actually frustrates me quite a lot. But I'm going to set the scene a bit. I'm gonna I'm going to explain why I feel like, first of all, Christianity has been feminized and what I mean by that, and then hopefully encourage people to maybe I don't know, act, talk, be different, or just be aware, maybe. I don't even know. But let's get into it. So one of the one of the most important things to recognize in Christianity at the moment is that there is a big gender gap. So there's roughly, depending on what country you're in, you're looking at around 60% female congregation, 40% male. And that's pretty much consistent in Christianity at all age groups. So whether it be youth, middle age, whether it be grandparents, more often than not, it is you're gonna see at a church there's gonna be more women than men. There's actually there's some churches around that are like 90% women. Uh they're not super common, but they are around. But you're never gonna see a church that's not like a weird cult that's 90% men. Um but to to I suppose to add on to that as well, that isn't the case for other major world religions. So it's not the case for Judaism, it's not the case for Buddhism, it's not the case for Hinduism, it's not the case for Islamism, if that's how you say it. It's not even the case for like Eastern Orthodox, which is like another Christ, uh, I suppose, schism of Christianity. It is the case for Catholicism and Protestantism. So I know for Catholics there was kind of a bit of a diverge, because it never used to be like this, by the way. It used to be very much 50-50. It kind of you can kind of trace a bit of a shift in Catholicism when they started to, I suppose, glorify Mary, the Virgin Mary, more because that wasn't like a big thing for a long time. And then at one point that just became a very key thing. So they they obviously shifted from I suppose a male deity or a male god, which is the only god, to a big emphasis on a female god. Oh, they don't call her a god, but a f they're worshiping a female. And they they won't say that they're worshiping it a female, but they venerate Mary, which is that's not the case in any other form of Christianity. So I have a few theories. First of all, as to why and how. First of all, I believe that there's okay, so first of all, I'm just going to do a little bit of a test. And you can you can play along with this test as well. So I'm just gonna read out two set like value sets, and I want you to think which one, and you can do this whether you're Christian or not Christian, anyone can do this. You just have to answer is it uh value set A or value set B that you think represents Jesus Christ? Okay. So set A of these values, I'm gonna read, is competence, power, efficiency, achievement, skills, proving oneself, results, accomplishment, objects, goal orientation, self-sufficiency, success, and competition. That is value set A. Now I'm gonna read value set B. Love, communication, beauty, relationships, support, helping, nurturing, feelings, sharing, relating, community, loving cooperation, and personal expression. Now, out of set A and set B, which do you think represents Jesus and represents the call for, say, a Christian to live in in terms of values? Now, I know already that you said set B because 95% of people that look at this and do this test answer B. Now, what you don't know is that these value sets are taken from the book. Men are from Mars, women are from Venus, and all it is is just a list of values that men hold as the highest values, and women hold as the highest values. So set A was obviously what men considered to be important values, and set B is what women consider to be important values. And so when you look at this from uh the perspective of, okay, what is Christianity teaching? What is Jesus like? And you come to a conclusion, well, 95% of people would say that it's more feminine, then why would you expect there to be many men going to church? Why would you expect men to really resonate with Jesus if all of the components of what they consider to be the values of Christ are feminine values? And also, yeah, women are probably going to want to go to church more than men if this is the kind of thing that's being promoted. But ultimately, if that's the case, because this is, it does seem to be a heavy lean on the feminine values. When I did the test, I definitely said set B. And it seems like Christianity is just telling men to be more like women as far as the values that they should hold. Where is the like the achievement side of things? Where is the uh accomplishments? Where is the success or the competition, the goal orientation? Like these things uh are important things for men to have. Don't get me wrong, first of all. Things like in set B, it said something like love. So that was the first one is love. I'll get into this a little bit later, but I'm not saying that these are necessarily bad things. What I'm saying is that there's a heavy lean towards one side of Christ and neglecting the other side. That is to men, the side that they would resonate with more if it was preached or if it was communicated effectively. It just hasn't been. It's starting to a little bit now sometimes, but it's not a great deal. So the first thing that I really want to talk about is language. Because this is the thing that I struggled with. So when I first became a Christian, and I mean I was raised as a Christian, but I mean when I actually gave my life to God. Because up until I was like 28, I was just sort of doing my own thing. Didn't I was actually I was a I was a pretty big heathen, one would say. I was definitely not following the Lord. So the one thing that really like was off-putting to me was the terminology that was being used. So I'm gonna break down a few things. When you go to church, you're going to hear things like this. Christianity isn't a religion, it's a relationship. And so what the what they mean when they say that is that religion says, here's a bunch of rules you have to follow. Relationship is this is a personal relationship with between you and God, right? So it's not just you just following a set of rules, and then if you do that, then you get to go to heaven. It's you're you're getting to know God and you're walking with God, not just obeying some random arbiter out in the middle of nowhere. So again, it's a it's it's sort of it's an okay description, but I will say this. It isn't the the nowhere in the Bible does it say you need to have a relationship with God. It doesn't use the word relationship, it alludes to that, it alludes to being close to God, as in it'll say things like abide in God and he will abide in you. It'll say, um, you're grafted into the the tree of life, or um, it'll say Jesus says to follow him. And so to follow, obviously, there must be some proximity. It says when you if you want to meet with God, he is in the quiet place. So you go into your room and you close the doors and you pray. So there's things that people wanting to put words and language to explain the operation of how you should speak to God. Like it'll say, our Father who art in heaven. The reason Jesus says father is that there is a close, it's signifying that there is a relationship there. The only issue is that I really have with it is it's they say the word intimacy. It's intimacy with God, it's intimacy with Jesus. Now, before I was a Christian and I walked into church and I heard people saying have an intimate relationship with God or with Jesus, that was weird to me. That was very weird. It was like the only time I'd ever heard the word intimacy was between a man and a woman. Or the only time I'd ever heard having a relationship was with a woman. And so I didn't like it, to be honest. I was like, this is this is weird language. Like, and so as I got to learn and got to understand, they're just using words to try to signal this is how you should behave, but they're neglecting the fact that for a man saying, I have an intimate relationship with Jesus is off-putting to especially to someone that's never that's never been around. I'm not saying that it's a bad thing in that that's not what how you should be behaving, but there are other words to get across the same point. So instead of saying I have a uh an intimate relationship with God, you can be like, I'm devoted to God. Like I'm um I have laid down my life for God. There is there's other different terminology you can use to get the same point across. So if we are wanting to get a particular message across, if if you're a new man and you're coming into church, then different language should be used. Because here's the other thing the word intimacy isn't in the Bible either. That's just that's a newer term that we've put in to try and again, I'm not saying that it's not how you should operate. So when someone says it, it's true that you should have uh, let's say, an intimate relationship with God in the sense that you should be close. It's it's if you are to know God, like the the whole point is to know God. And when you know God, you know his nature, you know how you're meant to show up in the world, and you're you're you can trust someone that you know more, right? The more you know someone, the more you trust them. And the whole thing about Christianity is to trust in the Lord, have faith in the Lord. So it's uh, these are all good sentiments and they're accurate to a degree, but I do not believe that it's the most effective way to communicate these ideas. There are other words you can use. English is a is a massive language, but we get so wrapped up in these particularly feminine types of scriptures. I remember sitting in a in a church service and the pastor was preaching out of Song of Solomon. And what Song of Solomon is, the book of the Bible, is it's just a like a very intimate, uh like love letter between a man and a woman that is basically saying how much they love one another. And it's really personal. So it's very, some would say, uh, I wouldn't say it's erotic, but it's like it's very much, you know, borderline. So the the pastor was preaching to like this as like an analogy for how much God loves you, and he's using particular words and language that a man is saying to a woman, and he's saying, This is how much God loves you. So I'm sitting there and being like, he loves, like that's I think you're actually misusing that. I think you're misusing those words, and to the point where there was a girl I was sitting next to who turned to me after and she goes, Hey, what's it like as a guy to listen to that? And I said, It's weird because it is weird, and it's not what it means either. By the way, that particular book, there's phrasing in the Bible talking about the bride of Christ. So that the the bride of Christ is the body of Christ. It's the it's the uh the Christians, so the the church, basically. The church is the bride of Christ, and the church is whoever is a believer, a Christian. And so it says Jesus loves the church in a way that the bridegroom loves the bride. It doesn't say that it is a personal that Jesus loves you in the way that as an individual, the way that a bride, a bridegroom loves the bride. It's it's distinctly different. And it's an important distinction because there are other words Jesus uses to explain people. He goes, No longer will I call you slaves, but I call you my friend. He he specifically creates this idea of God the Father. So he doesn't create the idea of an individual personal lover, which some Christians seem to be lost on that point. I am not the bride of Christ. We as a collective church are the bride of Christ. And so when you're preaching out a Song of Solomon, like a love letter, and you're saying we need to be looking at this is how much Jesus loves you personally. No, no, no, no, no. I'm sorry, my brother. You've got it twisted. And like I I was in a another church sermon, like in a service, where a guy was on stage, and I kid you not, he was saying things like, Jesus wants to give you a holy kiss on your mouth. Okay. I live in Australia, and we don't kiss other other men on the mouth here. I understand it's a thing that they do in other cultures. I think in South Africa, it's you know, a father might kiss his son on the mouth. In Hawaii, they do that. There's there's a cultural thing they do. But I'm in Australia, that's not our culture. This guy's from Australia, it's not our culture. Somewhere in the Bible, in or in 1 Thessalonians, it talks about greet each other with a holy kiss. The equivalent to that is just like a hug for us. Like the point of it is to greet with with love in a manner of love. It's not saying you have to give each other a holy smooch. Okay, like the oh, dude. I'm not giving my brothers a holy smooch, alright? Dude, if you took the Bible that literally. Like in the parts, there are some parts you need to take literally, but there are some parts when it's like there's this idea of the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. It's like, why is a particular like it's the whole reason why Jesus came is that we're no longer under the letter of the law, but there is a spirit of the law. This is why he Jesus would say something like, you know, they'd say, Oh, we should stone this person, and then he goes, Okay, well, he who is without sin cast the first stone. Like there's things like that where, you know, people were looking at they're looking at it all wrong, I suppose. And so, yeah, I couldn't believe it, man. Like this dude in a very intense moment is like Jesus wants to kiss you on the mouth. I don't I don't believe that. I don't think that's true. That that that's what uh Jesus was wanting to do at that moment. So, yeah, I don't know, man. You can get really carried away with things and oh yeah, it really grinds my gears. Um the other thing that I suppose we're at a real disadvantage with as a church and as a society that wants to pursue God and Christianity is our definition of love. So the greatest commandment, they ask Jesus, what's the greatest commandment? He says to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength. And the second greatest commandment, like the first, is to love your neighbor as yourself. Now, here's the thing. In English, we just have one word for love. Okay. So we use the word love for if you love your wife, if you love your, you know, or your spouse, if you love your children, you can use the word love to love a football team, to love your mates, to love a particular TV show, you can use it to love like so many different things. We've just got one universal word for love, but they obviously mean different things because the way that someone loves their wife is not the same way that they love their children, and that's not the same way that they love their favorite football team, or that they love a particular food. Like they're all different things that they that we love, but we're only using the one word. In Greek, they had well, I know of eight different words that they would use for love. I've heard someone say nine, I'm I'm only familiar with eight, but yeah, there could be more than eight. Uh, so the the different word, they would have a different word for these things. So Eros in Greek is the romantic love. Storgay, they would use for the family love, or sometimes a protective love that a parent might have for a child. They have Phileo, which is the brotherly love, or Philadelphia is the brotherly love. They have Ludas, which is like a playful flirtation kind of thing. It's a bit more lighthearted. They had um pragma, which is like a long-lasting love, like a like almost like you have a duty to towards something. So this is something you might see if someone works at a particular place for 10, 20 years or something, that they've almost got this love for the place because they've got this uh, I suppose, this long kind of bond, I suppose. We have um another one, filausha, I think it is, which is like a self-love. They have mania, which is the obsessive, sort of possessive love, which is probably not even considered love in our language, but um, but the one that Jesus uses the most is agape. Agape love is an unconditional divine love. So this is the it's a very specific kind of love. And if you don't make that distinction, then you're going you're going to hear other things. So when people are hearing the word love, you have to love Jesus. Oh, I'm so in love with you, Jesus. They're hearing this language, and that that's the type of thing that you can, if you're not careful, you'll get it twist off with the with the eros love, with the romantic love. And it's not what's being told here. So there's a real disadvantage when it comes to uh love because the way that love is described in the Bible that Jesus wants us to do or wants us to love, it isn't a feeling. It's not a feeling that you have. Well, he laid down his life for everyone as he was sacrificed on the cross on the last day before he went to the cross. He served his disciples. He washed the feet of all his disciples. So he put himself underneath. So it's like it's raising others up above you. You are more than me. That is how you love. That is a decision and a behavior that you do. It isn't a feeling because you do that whether you feel a particular way or not. In fact, it says to love your enemies. Jesus says, love your enemies. And so you probably aren't going to feel a particular kind way towards them, but it doesn't matter because if you're obedient to the Lord, then you would just do it anyway. So it is a behavior. This is uh, it's it's a very, very important thing to understand this particular type of love. Because this is how, especially for men, because this is how men operate. Men operate in the public sphere. So I'll get into that in a moment, but that is um, it if if you don't understand that, you'll miss it. You'll you'll completely miss what Christianity is and what it is, what it means to love someone and obey those commandments to love someone isn't to feel a particular way. It doesn't matter. Feel good or bad, whatever. It is to sacrifice, to give yourself up for them. The best definition that I've ever heard for love was written in a book called The Road Less Traveled by a man named M. Scott Peck. He's a psychiatrist, and he says this love is defined as the will to extend oneself for the purpose of nurturing one's own or another's spiritual growth. So let me break that down. It says, the will, so this is the will is more than desire. You can desire to do something, but the will to do it is the actual action of doing it. I can desire to go on a flight to Fiji tomorrow. But if I don't actually do it, it doesn't really matter. The will is the actual behavior. It is in action and it is it is the completion of that desire. It's desire's fulfillment. So the will to extend oneself. So that's another part, is that you're extending yourself. You and you are then making effort. To extend yourself is to come out of yourself and to make effort in a in the moment. So it's it's almost costing you something because there is effort involved. So the will to extend oneself for the purpose of nurturing either your own or another's spiritual growth. So the goal is that either yourself or someone else is growing spiritually. This is why giving someone a hard truth is considered love. If you see someone that is doing something that is negatively impacting their overall well-being, it is loving for you to have a difficult conversation that's going to be hard for you to do, but it's going to be ultimately good for the spiritual growth growth of the person that you're communicating it to. This is why disciplining your children is loving them. Because ultimately they're not going to be happy about it in the moment, but you have a duty of nurturing their spiritual growth for them to come up into maturity. So you're wanting the best for yourself and for others. It's also, by the way, when it says of nurturing oneself, your own spiritual growth, because there is a degree to which you can't neglect yourself as well. It's almost in the way that they would say you would put on your air mask first on the plane so that you would be able to help others. Otherwise, you know, you might help someone and not be able to help anyone else. So there's um, yeah, there's there's a bit there. But so far, that is probably the best definition for love that I've come across. And I do really like that. So I think making uh slight changes in language that is more inclusive for people, it still gets the same point across. All we're doing is just shifting a couple of words, which isn't hard to do because these words aren't even found in the Bible anyway. We're just where we've just put these words in the mix to try and communicate something. And I think that it's not the best way to communicate it, so we should put some other words in so that it would be the best way. So uh yeah, that is that is one thing. Just the language that we use, like the the kind of the language, like it's so annoying, man. People started saying, thinking that Abba Father, in the Bible says Abba Father, and people started thinking that that means daddy, that for somehow oh abba means daddy, like Jesus was saying daddy God, Abba Father is saying daddy God, and you've got people saying that now. That is not what Abba means. There is no, I cannot find a single reference or anything that would ever allude to the fact that Abba meant daddy as this like little child's way. Like the Bible will say things like uh to have childlike faith. It doesn't say to be childish. There's a big difference between having childlike faith, which means just like an unrestricted faith, it's a pure faith, and then just being childish and using childish language. Like the closest definition, well, this is Paul Washer says he's done a bit of work and trying to figure out what abba means because it's difficult to find a good definition. And the the best that he was able to find was that abba is used in, oh well, similar words are used in some African areas where they will have a particular word that means it's a it's a it's a love and a fear at the same time. So it's like this respect, but also knowing that there's love in that respect. So you would know that you're deeply loved, but you're you would also understand the power that's held with in the father as the the leader of the house, and to that there is there is due respect there, completely, like not at all, what daddy means. So oh man, it's it's so annoying. And what this what this does, so this kind of language, it shifts the idea of how a man needs to show up as a Christian and what his faith should look like. There's a quote from a guy who wrote uh he has a website called The Art of Manliness, and he speaks about this. He says, The idea of Jesus as committed companion and loving protector is more appealing to women, they say, while men are looking for a leader, a mighty conquering king to suffer rather than cuddle with. And that's exactly right. Like, I don't want a committed companion and to be in the loving arms of the father. Like, that doesn't appeal to me. They say things like, oh, you know, you you just need to run into the the open arms of your father and let him hug you. Like, I don't want to do that with my act actual father, like with my dad. I have a great relationship with my dad. I love my dad, but no, I don't want to be in his loving arms. Like, I'll give him a hug. But like the the imagery that Jesus gave when he said Abba Father, or when he said, our father who art in heaven. The the type of men of the day, I don't think had that type of relationship with their fathers. Like, I'm not 100% sure on this, but I don't think that was the imagery given and why Jesus said that. You're talking to people that were not like that. So I don't know where we've adopted this thing of being like I mean, like there's some verses in the Old Testament that do talk of, you know, God as your fortress, as your protector, but there's a big difference between that and then just like yeah, like having a cuddle with someone. And I can understand, like women, it probably is more appealing to women to have this like loving, protecting companion. But yeah, men do want a leader. Men do like men, if they don't have a leader, they'll pick one. Like there's got to be a leader. And so that there's been a shift, basically. There's been a shift, and there's been an increase in Jesus as the personal lover. And it's shifted from what was at one point a public affair to uh or a public pursuit to a private affair. And it kind of it needs to kind of be both because you obviously you gotta have a like a relationship with Jesus. You have to have that has to be there. So again, let me reiterate the terminology isn't wrong in meaning. It's just not it's just not always effective. The terminology is is in meaning is actually correct. I fully, fully believe that that's correct. That for for lack of better words, intimacy with God is important and having a relationship with God is what it is. That is what the Christian walk should be. But there I do believe there's other words that we could be using or other ways to phrase it that gets the same point across. So regarding the the I suppose the public or the outward-facing uh thing. So going back up to some of the the things that were mentioned in the men's value set, competence was one of them, proving oneself, results, accomplishments, goal orientation, self-sufficiency, success, competition, all these things, they're outward facing things. So we here will hear things like not to do things in your own strength. So, but this is regarding like this is regarding your salvation. Like you can't save yourself. We're given the gift of salvation. It's things like not relying on yourself to defeat things in the spirit. Like I Jesus has the power for that, but he gives you the power. So he gives you, he goes, I give unto you now the the authority to trample serpents and scorpions underfoot. He says uh things like, if you don't have a sword, go and sell your cloak and buy one. So there are certain things in the Bible that give authority, he's giving us the authority, and then we use that authority now. So he doesn't give us authority to be like, no, Jesus, but we just still want you to do it though. It's like, no, like you you've got a mission. Why do you think you're here as a Christian? Like you have you have a job to do, like there's something to do. And so men, men throughout all of history, I spoke last time about certain in the last episode I went through things like rites of passage, for example. So all cultures have always had certain times where they've had to either be to prove themselves or do something in the in the public sphere. And and we've kind of moved away from that. There's a there's an awesome quote by Theodore Roosevelt. It's it's quite popular, known as the man in the arena. So I'm gonna read this out. But listen to this. He says, it is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs, who comes short again and again because there is no effort without error and shortcoming, but who does actually strive to do the deeds, who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.

unknown: 48:08

Damn.

SPEAKER_00: 48:09

I mean, come on now. Come on now. Like if you're a guy and you're listening to that and that doesn't get you fired up, like check yourself. Come on now. Like get in the arena. Like so many people just throwing darts, throwing arrows, just trying to shut people down, but they don't know what it's like to be in the arena. They don't know what it's like to do something. Everyone's afraid to be criticized, everyone's afraid to do anything, man. Aristotle has a quote that says there's only one way to avoid criticism do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing. Yep. That's the only way you're gonna avoid criticism. And you know what? There's a lot of people that choose that option, and you know what else? I don't respect them. So, yeah, I mean, church it used to, it used to have certain aspects of it that really did appeal to man: duty, sacrifice, challenge, risk taking, fighting for a noble cause, chivalry, like these things that they do inspire men to pick up their cross and follow God. Jesus says, for those that want to come after me, those that want to be my disciple, you'll deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow me. That's a hard call. It's not easy. It's not with a fainter heart. He also says things like, You'll be like sheep among wolves. I'll send you out, you'll be like sheep among wolves. You're going out into dangerous territory. There's a fight to be had, a fight of light and darkless. And we don't wrestle with flesh and blood, but with powers of principalities or principalities and powers of this world. So the way that the world has been painted, it's been painted in a way that people think that Christianity is weak because they'll take things like turn the other cheek and they'll think, oh, okay, so as a Christian, you got you're you're just meant to be stepped on. Like if you if you're a Christian, that means that people gotta walk all over you because you can't do any, you have to just turn the other cheek. Not understanding that what that means in context is that's a sign of disrespect. It's just someone like a slap in the face is not someone giving you physical harm. It's not seen as a punch in the face. As a Christian, you can defend yourself if you're in immediate danger and harm. Like the Bible actually says uh there's a proverb that says, like a muddied spring is a righteous man that gives way to the wicked. So, what good is your good if you just allow wicked to do whatever it wants? There's a call to step up, there's a call to actually get into the middle of it and push back the works of darkness. Push back evil, fight back against these sort of things, not to be overrun by it. Like this idea of, yeah, if you're a Christian, you just have to like enable everyone to do whatever they want and you have to be kind. Like the thing, like the thing that people say is like, oh, you're meant to be nice. And like not like not understanding the true meaning of love, by the way. Because if we do take that definition of love, then when when harm is being done, you can lovingly step in and go, hey, that's wrong. And I'm not gonna allow you to do that. Like, I'm not gonna allow you to just get away with doing evil things, not while I'm around. Like step up to the plate. Come on. Mercy and grace is not a substitute for allowing evil to take over. Oh, you're meant to have mercy, you meant to have grace. Yeah, you are. You are meant to have those things. But that doesn't like in the right place. You're also not like Jesus says, I've given you power. He's like, I've not given you a spirit of fear, but of power, love, and a sound mind. What do we use the power for? If it's not to push back darkness, if it's not to cast out demons, if it's not to cast out the works of darkness, like what is this? Where is this power? So the the whole message of Christianity has been so twisted as far as what we're supposed to be doing. And the preaching has just gotten soft as well. Like the preaching's so cuddly, and oh, we don't want to offend anyone, and we want everyone to feel welcome, and like just preach the truth, brother. Preach the truth. Then you'll get men right up. Let me tell you that. Um, okay, next thing the music. Let me get started on the music. I'm gonna try and get through this. So there's a thing in church called worship music. The definition of worship is not music. Anytime worship is used in the Bible, I don't think it's ever referring to music. We've just put it in as worship music and worship songs as like a category of adoration to the Lord. So there has been a shift in the music as well because the music is very sentimental, the music is very soft, and the music is very loving. There's uh it's become very personal. There used to be hymns that were sung about God, and now they're sung more directly to God, which is fine. Make music however you want. Like, but worship in and of itself isn't just music, it is a way of living. So people get really upset when there's a particular song and they go, that's not worship. Like that's just asking God for things. Well, newsflash, asking God for things is worship too, by the way. Because if you if you're going to ask God, that means you obviously trust God and you're going to Him, which He asks you to do that. He says, Come to me for your needs. And so just because it's put into the form of a song, all of a sudden it's not worship. No, no, no, it's not adoration. What you're wanting is adoration. You're wanting songs that say, God, you're the best, God, we worship you, all glory and honor to you, which is awesome. They're amazing songs. Probably the best worship songs, in my opinion, are the ones that are adoration to the Lord. Um, but there is nothing wrong with saying, God, I need help in the form of a song, or God, uh, I don't know, uh asking God for things. Like, there's just anything about God, even just at a cafe with a mate, and you're just talking about God is worship to God. Like, all of that is worship, it's a state of living. So yeah, but the weird thing is, and South Park does a really good uh they actually nail it with this because they've obviously observed it too. In South Park, they make there's an episode where they make a Christian rock band, and at one point the music label they're under brings him in and goes, So it kind of sounds like you guys really love Jesus, and they're like, Yeah, yeah, we do, we do. And he's like, No, no, but it kind of sounds like you're like in love with Jesus, and like they're obviously put poking fun at like the fact that they're just romance songs, and instead of it being about a girl or like a romantic interest, it's about Jesus instead. Like they've romanticized Jesus. Oh, someone goes uh again at a church service, the story of Jesus is a romantic love story. No, it isn't, dude. It's not it's not romance. Stop conflating Eros romantic love with agape love. There isn't it's not romance. Like, just why don't you just say, guys, don't even be here for this. Go out and talk to the women for a moment. Like, just say that. Or just say, guys, you have to be girls now if you want to be Christian. Drives me up the wall, dude. Oos, oos, oos, oos. That's we need a bit of that. Um, and if if you're not watching, that was me um shadow boxing. So, um, okay. The other thing, this is another big thing as well, that there aren't very good strong male role models in the Christian church. There's a couple of them, but there aren't a lot. The culture paints Christians as just being these weak little nerds, and that's been the case since forever, but they're not that far off for a big part of it. And it's like if you want to bring in more masculine men, then you have to address the first things I was talking about. Because currently where it stands, we're struggling. They did a test, and I'm not even joking about this. I can I can show you the test, I can put it on the on in the links. They did a test on testosterone levels, and they tested actors, athletes, and pastors. The actors and the like the drama students, the actors in the arts and the athletes scored the same. The pastors were way lower. There's any, there's there's a potential, like this is a scary stat. Like you're giving the main, the top dogs, the guys in the, you know, men love hierarchy, but they want to follow a leader that they can trust, and that they're like, Yeah, this guy is someone that I can get behind. And if it's this weak, low T fella, a lot of guys are gonna be like, Well, I don't want to listen to this like Dweeb. No offense, by the way. Like, I'm just trying to give you imagery when I say that. Like, you can have low testosterone and be an absolute firebird in the spirit. I don't really care so much about it, but I think it's just the appeal to men. Like, you haven't really, there's the way that the church has been designed is there isn't a good structure that is appealing to men because we like to compete and we like to have some sort of thing to work towards. And the only positions in the modern day is just at the church building. The positions of uh, I suppose to have goals and to rise is either your part, you're a pastor, a youth pastor, or a worship leader. Like, first of all, if you're a worship leader in in music, you're probably a bit artsy, a bit create, you know, creative, which is nothing wrong with that. I play guitar, I love it. Um, a youth pastor, you know, obviously you have to be good with kids. And I don't know if a lot of macho men are good with children. I mean, some probably are, but let's just think about the the broader perspective here for a minute. Uh and then pastor. I mean, obviously they're going to be speaking a lot. And as I've said in previous episodes, guys aren't the best communicators, even though like 93% of pastors in the word are male. Uh, but that's obviously like it's a biblical thing to be have a male pastor, I suppose. So, but the role of the pastor is a very feminine role. Like the things that you have to be good at to be a pastor is like the nurturing side of things, is the compassion and the empathy and good things. They're all good things. But in the way that we've set up the world, or like I suppose the church, is that we've created a particular structure of church services where the pastors have to be men and they can't be women because of you know, there's like leadership things in the Bible and hierarchy things. And but like women would be better at the modern day pastor's role, though, like based on the things that they need to be doing. So I don't know what even there's too much to unpack here of the changes, but oh yeah, it's just another thing. And then there's certain instructions as well. I'll try and finish it off here because it's this has gone way longer than I thought. It all I always go way longer than I think, but the There's certain things and like instructions that are given in church as well. So, like, there'll be things where it's like, all right, let's all stand in a circle and hold hands. I don't want to do that, dude. I don't like I don't want to hold hands with another dude that I don't even know and I just met. Like, why do we have to hold hands? Like, it feels super like awkward and just don't want to do it. And I can only imagine, and I am a Christian, and I have been going to church for a long time. And I understand all the intimacy stuff, and I still don't want to do it myself. So imagine someone that's just rocked up and then you tell them to go like hold hands with a neighbor next to you. No, don't. And then like the whole being vulnerable thing, like some people okay, some people need to be vulnerable, right? Some people need to open up because there's a lot of healing and trauma and stuff. But some people don't. Some people are okay and they don't need to be vulnerable. And telling them to do that and to just cry all the time, be emotional, they're not gonna like it. Sometimes it's it's really helpful and good. Some people need to, I don't know, open up open wounds and whatever, but I don't know. And then you got these like yeah, dude, guys guys that try to be manly just cringe me out so much, bro. Like, I saw this like men's conference, and it's a huge big men's, thousands and thousands of guys all coming, and they're like, This is a men's conference, and they had like monster trucks there, like literal massive monster trucks driving up this big stage, and they had a guy who took his shirt off and he was like the shredded guy, and he did like a sword swallowing thing and then took a sword out, and they're like, Whoa, man, that's crazy! Like, dude, that is just the cringiest thing ever. It's like, yeah, men, which means cars in like danger. You just don't even like it's almost it's like it's like a girl organized the event that tried to think this is what guys like, except it was actually guys that organized it that just have no idea, like they're so out of touch with just a regular dude, like a regular man. Like if I go to a men's conference, I don't need you to like put on a little performative display of you know cliche masculine things, like dude, especially when it's a Christian, just talk about the Lord, bro. Just talk about God and tell me to do something difficult and hard. Don't show me flames. Oh, there was big fire show. Wow, there was loud motors. Uh anyway, dude, I think it's all a I think it's all a big ruse. I think it's a plan because if a child is the first person in their family to go to church, 9% of the time the rest of the family will follow. If it's the mother is the first person in the family to go to church, 17% of the time the rest of the family will follow. But if it's a man, if it's the the dad or the husband is the first person, 93% of the time the rest of the family will go to church. And uh, I think if you want to kill a movement, kill the men when it comes to Christianity. If you want to kill that, go after the leaders of the house because yeah, I think it's I think it's been feminized either intentionally or it's been sustained intentionally, but you're not gonna see you're not gonna see good fruit if if we we don't have any men going there. There's so much more to say on this. There's so much more to say on this. I think I actually wrote something else down of like oh yeah, that's right. The top three reasons that men don't go to church, number three was like asking for money, number two was it's for wimps, and number three, uh sorry, number one is too many hypocrites. So the men that do go, like I don't know. The thing is, Christianity is a hard walk, it is not easy, it's never promised that it's gonna be an easy way, it's promise it'll be a better way, it's a better way to live, but it's not an easy way to live, it's not easy at all. In fact, it like Jesus promises that you're gonna have persecution. He goes, They hated me, so they'll hate you too. So it's not gonna be an easy walk, but GK Chesterton says the Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting, it's been found difficult and left untried, which is very true. It's a hard walk to walk, but it's definitely the best way. So I'm gonna end it with this. Everything is garbage, everything's trash, everything I said, everything I know, nothing matters, okay? Doesn't matter. This matters. Christ is King, Jesus loves you, and he's coming back soon. And just do with that what you will. And I hope what you will do, besides giving your life to the Lord, is like, subscribe, and leave a comment. My brothers and my sisters. See you later.