Homemaking: Delight in Your Duty

 In this episode, Heather is joined by Becki McNeely from Fruitful and Fearless to explore what it means to truly delight in the daily work of homemaking. They talk about rejecting the victim mindset, finding joy in necessary tasks, pursuing skill and excellence, and viewing homemaking as both art and calling. If you’re longing for renewed purpose, creativity, and faithfulness in your home, this conversation will encourage and equip you. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Babies need not to be taught a trade, but to be introduced to a world. To put the matter shortly, woman is generally shut up in a house with a human being at the time when he asks all the questions that there are, and some that there aren't. It would be odd if she retained any of the narrowness of a specialist. Now, if anyone says that this duty of general enlightenment, even when freed from modern rules and ours, and exercised more spontaneously by a more protected person, is in itself too exacting and oppressive. I can understand the view. I can only answer that our race has thought it worthwhile to cast this burden on women in order to keep common sense in the world. But when people begin to talk about this domestic duty as not merely difficult, but trivial and dreary, I simply give up the question. For I cannot, with the utmost energy of imagination, conceive what they mean. When domesticity, for instance, is called drudgery, all the difficulty arises from a double meaning in the word. If drudgery only means dreadfully hard work, I admit the woman drudges in the home, as a man might drudge at the Cathedral of Aeneas, or drudge behind a gun at your Falgar. But if it means that the hard work is more heavy because it is trifling, colorless, and of small import to the soul, then as I say I give it up. I do not know what the words mean. To be Queen Elizabeth within a definite area, deciding sales, banquets, labors, and holidays, to be whitely within a certain area, providing toys, boots, sheets, cakes, and books, to be Aristotle within a certain area, teaching morals, manners, theology, and hygiene? I can understand how this might exhaust the mind, but I cannot imagine how it could narrow it. How can it be a large career to tell other people's children about the rule of three, and a small career to tell one's own children about the universe? How can it be broad to be the same thing to everyone, and narrow to be everything to someone? No, a woman's function is laborious, but because it is gigantic, not because it is minute. I will pity Mrs. Jones for the hugeness of her task, but I will never pity her for its smallness. Excerpt from G.K. Chesterton. Hello, and welcome back to the Keeping the Citadel podcast. My name is Heather Faria and I am your host. On today's episode, we will be diving into the topic of viewing homemaking as a duty and art form, and how we as women can delight in our duty instead of viewing it as drudgery. If you are new here, in this first season of the Keeping the Citadel podcast, we've been discussing what it means for us as women to faithfully man our posts. This theme ties directly in with our first issue of our magazine, which is also titled Man Your Post. So if you haven't yet gone back and listened to the first episodes in this season or read that issue of the magazine, I highly encourage you to go back and check those out. In this episode, we will be focusing on the area of homemaking and how this idea of manning our posts applies there. We live in a culture where women are constantly being bombarded with navigating the tension between the modern impulse to outsource, automate, or escape the home versus the biblical call to steward it with excellence. In this episode, we will explore how to, as Missy Winkler often says, learn to love what must be done, as well as shed a victim mentality and grow in skill, purpose, and joy in our homemaking. With that said, it is now my privilege to introduce a very special guest, Becky McNeely. Becky has been married for nine years and is a mother to three sweet children. Formerly a fourth grade teacher, she is now a full-time homemaker and homeschool teacher. She enjoys sipping iced coffee, gardening, and reading a good book. She is passionate about encouraging women and teaching them and how to keep their homes well for the glory of God. She is the author and creator of the Keeping Home Planner, as well as one of the hosts of the Fruitful and Fearless podcast. And just a side note, Becky also wrote an article for our first edition of the Keeping the Citadel magazine on how essential planning is to our homemaking. So if you haven't yet read her article, be sure to go and check that out as well. Becky, it is so amazing to have you on today. Thank you so much for joining us. Um it's such a privilege to have you on because I've been listening to you on your podcast, Fruitful and Fearless, with Jordan Sparks, for probably about two years now. So it's just, I feel so excited to have you on and like I already know you. And so thank you for joining me today.

SPEAKER_02 5:22

Of course, of course. Thank you for asking me and having me on here. And I feel likewise like I know you a little bit. I feel like we're already friends, which we are. But we have actually met in person. Um, but getting to know you uh via the the beautiful side of Instagram, getting to know you there and and chat with you there has really been a joy and an honor. And so I am really excited to get to talk to you too. We haven't actually gotten to chat in in person before.

SPEAKER_00 5:50

So I'm I know this is so fun. And one of the things that's been so great about starting Keeping the Citadel is just the joy of getting to meet and interact with all these amazing godly women. And so um yeah, I'm just I'm so grateful for this opportunity. Yeah, same. I'm excited. So as we begin, I was hoping, can you share a bit about your homemaking journey? Have you always loved homemaking or was it something that you grew into?

SPEAKER_02 6:21

Um, a little bit of both. I I've always wanted to be a mom. From an early age, people would ask what I wanted to be when I grew up, and I was like, I want to be a mom, just what I want to be. I want to be a wife and a mom. And um, there were a couple other pipe dreams thrown in there, but for the most part, it was just wife and a mom. And so I always enjoyed um things similar in that nature. I I, you know, love playing baby dolls and things like that. And um, that was always a hope of mine. But I did not become a believer, even though I grew up in a Christian home. I did not become a believer until I I was um out of college, actually. Wow. And I kind of got caught up in that mindset of work is everything, you know, and that mindset of if you if you're gonna do anything of any importance in life, it needs to be with a degree under your belt and letters behind your name. And it's going to be all of the accolades that mean anything are gonna be coming from a boss and your teaching reviews and you know, all of these things. And I didn't realize until after I became a Christian how much of my worth and my value, even just as a human being, I was placing on my achievements and my accomplishments. And um so I always wanted to be a wife and a mom, and I always wanted to have a home. And I think I've always had a lean towards more feminine things for sure. But when I actually became a wife and a mom, I didn't know what I was doing. And there was this, this part of me that's like, okay, how do I do this well? And part of the struggle with that too was I was working full-time outside the home. And I went into teaching thinking, oh, this is the perfect, this is the perfect job for having a family. Because you get the summers off, you get holidays off, you know, you work eight to three, which I'm sure any teacher that's listening is or anyone who's been in that field is just laughing because that's yeah, yeah. Right. Like I I realized pretty quickly, oh wow, this is not conducive to a family at all. But I was already in it and I did enjoy teaching. I loved it. I I taught special education and my students were precious. I adored them, but it was not something that I could, I could not do both. You know, I um I there for a little bit, I Brandon and I had gotten married, and I think it was it was two years before I had Jack. And it was okay. I could sustain that. I I could keep up an 800 square foot apartment and the laundry of two people and still work outside the home. But once we had Jack, there was just something that, and even even up to having him, I had the plan of I'm gonna go back to work and this is still gonna be fine. But it was so, it was so crazy to me. The realization as soon as I held that little baby for the first time, it was I never want to leave this human. Yeah, yeah. I never want to hand him over to anybody else. And my husband was still in school at the time. I'm I'm a few years older than him, actually. And so he was still finishing his degree. So there were two years there where I desperately wanted to be home and I couldn't be. I think the Lord, while those two years while he was finishing his degree were absolutely grueling, I think the Lord really used that for my good in the long run because I know what's on the other side of the tracks now. And there is no longer any ounce of a desire in my heart to go back to that. Because I know what that burnout feels like. I know what that feels like to see your child crying as you're leaving for 10 hours because you have a meeting before school, you have meetings after school, you have an evaluation the next day, and you have copies to make and you, you know, and I remember standing there doing all those things as a teacher going, this doesn't matter. And it it did, it did matter to those students. But to me, it was not what was most important. What was most important was my family and my home. And I was staying up until, you know, midnight, one o'clock, trying to get laundry caught up, make sure everybody had food and all of the food was just quick fixes because that's what I had time for. If I wanted to have any amount of time with my family in the evening. And so I think in that time where I was unable to be the home be a good homemaker, really. I think God grew my desire and my love for homemaking. And as odd as that sounds, it was like I would look at, and you have to be careful because you don't want to get caught in that comparison trap. But I would go to other people's homes who were stay-at-home moms. It was like, wow, they have such peace. There's such a atmospheric can be, yeah. Yeah, there's there, there was such an atmosphere of peace there, even if things were loud, right? Yes, yeah. Doesn't mean not loud, but they were not burning the candle at both ends, sleeping four or five hours a night. You know, yeah. Well, sometimes if they have a little one, you know. But but for the most part, there was just such a marked difference. And God really grew my love for homemaking. And I thought, okay, Lord, and I prayed, okay, Lord, when you when you give me the opportunity to be home, please let me do this with every ounce of my being. Let me never forget what this feeling feels like so that I am always just in complete gratitude and awe of the way that you brought me home, you know? And we actually went through a time where my husband, I resigned from teaching and we kind of jumped off a cliff with it because he didn't actually have a job lined up. He had opportunities, but we were so convicted that I needed to be a full-time homemaker that he's like, we're gonna rely on savings, it's gonna be okay, God's gonna provide. And he did provide in crazy ways, but I ended up being about six months before he actually had a job. Wow. And but even in that, there was still just this, I want to be home. I love homemaking that much, and I value it that much, and my husband values it that much that we're like, no, this is God's gonna provide. And he gave him some odd jobs and he was part-time ministry then. So it's not like we didn't have any income, but it was worth that incredibly trying time because that's how much God had just grown my love for homemaking, you know?

SPEAKER_00 13:03

Yeah. I I love that. But thank you for sharing that. I I think it's so awesome how God used that time to really give you that appreciation for it. Because I think when, for example, with with me, I well, I had a similar thing where I was working up until I had my first baby. And I knew I always wanted to be home once I had kids. But once I did have my firstborn son, I was able to stay home after that and have been home ever since. And I was I'm extremely grateful. I was so grateful for years that I was able to do that. But I think in a way, um, because it wasn't a situation like yours, it was easy to take that for granted a lot of times, the blessing that it was just getting to stay home. And I think in a situation where you are waiting for something to happen and praying and longing, that when the Lord finally does give you that gift, it just makes you appreciate it all the more. Yeah, for sure. For sure.

SPEAKER_02 14:06

And that's not to say that I have days where I think, man, it it would be nice to be able to check a list and have it stay that way. Yeah. Yeah. There are times where I do have to fight that mindset, but being able to pull back to that gratitude of, no, Lord, this is a gift and thank you so much. I don't ever want to fall into that.

SPEAKER_00 14:26

Yeah. Were were there things that you did during that season of your life where you were taking steps to educate yourself in what a godly homemaker was or how uh you could still be pursuing homemaking and you know, just doing that while you were still working? Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 14:48

Um, a lot of it was actually just on I I had a 30-minute commute each way. And so on the way to and from work, I would listen to podcast after podcast after podcast of homemaking. And even though I grew up in a Christian home, my mom was a stay-at-home mom. For for a good part of my childhood, she didn't love it. And so, and it was obvious to all of us that she didn't love it. And um I wanted, I wanted to do it in a way where I loved it and my kids loved it, and my husband loved it, you know. So it was tricky and I felt a little bit like a lost lamb trying to figure out like, okay, how do I do this well? So without having a mentor to kind of come alongside me, so I just started seeking them out. And one of them was my friend Jordan. I got, we were really new to that church. We we started going to our church when I was, I think I was one or two weeks away from having my son. And so we were really new to that church, but all of the ladies there just they they had a love for homemaking. And so I just started, I started paying attention when we went to their homes for a small group, or they would invite us over for dinner, and I would just pay attention to what they were doing that was really beautiful. And watching the way they interacted with their families, watching the hospitality that they that they showed to people, and just the simple things too, like having having a hot tea bar just always ready in the wintertime. You know, something so simple of just keeping tea on hand because your kids like it, you know, all these little things. And my decoration style was uh an aisle at Hobby Lobby, you know? You get everything that matches and you put it on a wall. And but that's not what I was seeing in these other homes that really felt cozy and homey. And so I started paying attention to what they were doing and how were they putting pieces together. And there were a couple of people I started following on Instagram actually to see how they would thrift items and put them together. I'm a really big thrifter. I love thrifting. And so I I knew that our home wasn't gonna look cookie cutter, it was gonna have to be something that I literally created out of pieces that I found and and and also for budget-wise at that point too, you know. Yeah, yeah. And so I just started looking or I started listening to podcasts, looking to the people around me that were doing beautiful things. I started asking for questions. When I didn't know how to do something, I asked. And sometimes I think we're we're afraid to we're afraid to ask, we're afraid to admit what we don't know, but you miss out on so much wisdom when you don't just humble yourself and say, Hey, I have no idea how to decorate. Can you come over and show me what you you would do with my things?

SPEAKER_00 17:34

Yeah, exactly. Because so many of us didn't grow up in homes where we were given that inheritance from our mothers. And, you know, a lot of us come into homemaking not having those skills. And it I think our pride wants us to focus on that feeling of intimidation, but really like we just can benefit so much when we ask those questions and thank the Lord for podcasts too that can really be those mentors in our lives. I know when I was first starting out on my homemaking journey, I just soaked up all the podcasts as well. They were, I mean, they the some of the people that I listen to have been some of the biggest mentors in my life of what it looked like to be a godly wife and mother and how to cultivate a life-giving home. And it's just um it's amazing the wealth of knowledge and mentorship that we can get through just from online women.

SPEAKER_02 18:36

Oh another thing, too, is seeking out books of women who have gone before and who are talented and gifted in homemaking. And one that popped into my mind as you were talking, Heather, is The Life Giving Home by Sally Clarkson.

SPEAKER_00 18:51

Yeah, yeah. That was that's one of the most impactful books I've ever read. And yeah, Sally Clarkson was she was actually the one I was referring to, is I used to just devour her episodes and books. And she really, really shaped my idea of the beauty and joy of creating a life-giving home. And I I recommend that book all the time for new wives and homemakers because it's um I I think it really gets to the heart of what this episode is about, too, is delighting in our homes. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 19:29

And you can tell throughout that book the things that the the traditions that they set up and even the little things that she did in her home, you can tell that she didn't do it out of spite. She didn't do it out of frustration, she didn't do it, you know. It was just, I love my family so much and I want everything in our home to give them life. You know, and I love how she went through month by month of in August, here's how, here's some fun practical. I'm all about practicality. Yes. And so I love, I like, I like hearing the the theory behind it and the theology behind it. I love that part too, but I hit a point where I'm like, give me practical steps. I want to know what I can do practically to put to put boots to the ground to that theology and that perspective, you know? And I think one thing that is an absolute treasure from her wisdom is knowing that her children are now adults and seeing the relationships that they still have. They're writing books together. What a dream as a mom, you know, what a dream. And what a testimony it is to the fact that those things really were done out of love. It wasn't done for show. It wasn't done so that she could write a book. It was just done because she loved her family and she wanted to be a homemaker that honored the Lord. And I love, I love that. And I love that testimony that she has of of adult children, you know?

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Yeah, yes. And one of the reasons I often hear them say that uh when people ask them, why do you still believe, why do you still love the Lord uh as adults? And they often point to the aroma that their mother cultivated in their home, that it was in the tangible things that they did, the meals that they shared together, the conversations that they had around the table, and those daily rhythms of their life where they got to taste and see the Lord's goodness and experience him. Uh, I think that is so essential for what we are doing in our homes that this is something we're we're creating an atmosphere and an aroma that speaks of the goodness and love of Christ. And it's not just it's it we're not just giving our kids doctrine and instruction. All of those things are vital. They are so important, but we're also showing them how to taste and see that the Lord is good.

unknown 21:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:00

There, when we were talking about this concept of delighting in our duties at home, I thought, you know, in order to delight in your duty at home, you have to first delight in the Lord. If your delight is in, if you're trying to find delight in wiping down countertops and scrubbing toilets and cooking meals, that the your delight is going to come up lacking if your delight is not first and foremost placed in the Lord. And one of the verses that came to mind was Psalm 37, 3 through 5, trust in the Lord and do good, dwell in the land and b befriend faithfulness. Delight yourself in the Lord and He will give you the desires of your heart. Commit your way to the Lord, trust in him, and he will act. And when we are delighting in him first, he molds and changes those desires. We're no longer pursuing worldly or fleshly desires or, you know, accolades or those things, but we see the value of the things that we're doing. Those things are kingdom work, which is exactly what we're doing in our home, you know. Um, and he changes, he changes our desires. We're again, we're not not pursuing things of the world, but we're pursuing him. And when we pursue him first and delight in him first, and he's our anchor and he's our hope, we're not hoping that our floors stay clean. We're hoping that the Lord is going to be faithful, you know, which we know is a rock that we can stand on. When that's where our hope is placed and that's where delight is, then nothing else can shake that. That's not to say that we're not gonna have hard days by any stretch.

SPEAKER_00 23:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:39

But if we are delighting first in him, then he will help us learn to delight in the work that we're doing and the work that he has provided for us. I think sometimes it's easy to think of the work that's in front of us as, and I don't want to jump ahead, but the work that's in front of us as a drudgery. And oh my goodness, this child made this mess for the hundredth time, or oh, I have to do this again. And it's really easy to get caught in that mindset because so much of our tasks as a homemaker are repetitive. We do the same things day in, day out, because that's just the it's just the nature of it, right? But it's easy to get stuck in that that mentality and that victim mindset, like you had you had said before, of just, oh, this is terrible, poor me. But if we see the actual value of what we're doing, of we're delighting in the Lord and He ordained all of those things for us, then we can truly find joy in the things that we're doing in our homes.

SPEAKER_00 24:49

Yeah, that is so good. That verse that you mentioned from Psalm 37 is actually my life verse. It is Was it really? It is. That is probably one of my number one. I mean, it's so hard to choose your favorite verse. I always actually kind of hate it when people ask you that question because it's like, um, how much time do you have? Right. But that one is deeply meaningful for me. And um, I don't remember which version it is, but there's a version of it where it says, Dwell in the land and cultivate faithfulness. And that that's my favorite version because I I think especially when you are struggling with that sense of discontentment in your circumstances and just some mundane repetition of it all, the the the idea of dwelling, which means really to abide in the presence of God and to dwell in his presence. And then our responsibility is just to cultivate faithfulness. It's just something that is deeply encouraging to me when I am struggling with that sense of discontentment or frustration or discouragement in my own homemaking.

SPEAKER_01 25:59

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 26:00

Yeah, I think there's two mindsets that we can choose, right? We can grumble about it or we can praise the Lord for it. And there's not really an in-between. You're you're either doing one or the other, you know? And um, I love that. I like the cultivate faithfulness because it is something that you it is something you have to do over and over, right? If if you're cultivating a garden, you're tending to the plants. It's not like you weed the garden once and it's done. You're cultivating it. You're gonna be adding things to it, you're gonna be taking away the things that aren't good. You're gonna be, you know, caring for it, nurturing it. And cultivating faithfulness is a daily decision of I'm going to choose to do this with joy today.

SPEAKER_00 26:44

Yes. Yeah, and thanks and Thanksgiving too. And thanksgiving. Yeah, thanks for having me. That was something that I I had thought about a lot it when I was preparing for this episode is how essential it is for us to give thanks, like you were saying too, with recognizing the privilege of being able to be a full-time homemaker. Is that this is a gift. This is a gift that we have the opportunity to do this, that we get to be the homemakers, the the dominion takers in our homes, the ones who are shaping our kids' hearts and uh really helping to create that sense of awe and wonder over who God is and creating those memories and all of those things, that that it is a gift and a privilege. And we often forget that when we are doing those mundane chores. So I really think that that having that attitude of Thanksgiving is so essential when it comes to this idea of delighting in our duties for sure.

SPEAKER_02 27:46

And and if you think about it just from a practical standpoint too, you know, which is going to make your day more enjoyable? Thanking the Lord for the children, thanking the Lord for the food that you have to prepare or that you get to prepare, you know, or grumbling about it. Um we have a child at at this current point in development who is really struggling with this. And one thing that we've had this kiddo do is every time a complaint is uttered, we immediately say, okay, tell me three things you're thankful for about whatever they're complaining about. And then when there are subsequent complaints about having to give thankfulness, like, oh, there's another one, you know. And so there was there was one point last week where she oh I shouldn't have said which one, but one of our children had to say, had to say six things they were thankful for about a pair of PJs. And I thought, you know what, it was funny because towards the end, they're going, I don't even know. I was like, Do you like this color? Yes, okay, thank the Lord that it's that color. You know, there are always things that you can be thankful for, but that's if you're gonna be cultivating a thankful heart and cultivating faithfulness, there's gonna be other things that have to be weeded out. And that victim mindset is the first to go. That's the first, that's the first weed to pull because it is not poor you. It is these are blessings the Lord has given you. Um and I think sometimes too, guarding, guarding your heart and your mind against some of the things that we see online. It's really easy to see things and get trapped in some of the some of the mindsets that are shared online of, oh, whoe is me, I have to change the stiper, or woe is me, I have to take out the trash, or I have to, you know, just this um very self-centered attitude when really our work is is there to glorify the Lord, not glorify ourselves and make us comfortable. Our our work is to be a gift and an offering and something that we offer back to him as a thank you for the breath in our lungs, not something that we should bemoan and make a big fat fit about, you know?

SPEAKER_00 30:03

Yeah, yeah, exactly. I I think this victim mindset is something that is so prevalent in our culture. And I really believe what I see is that women are being trained to view themselves as victims really from the time they're children. And especially when it comes to housework and just keeping a home and being a mother and all these things that are part of our duties as women. Uh all of a sudden women feel like they're martyrs because they have to put food on the table. Why do you think that this is so common right now in our culture?

SPEAKER_02 30:44

Well, I mean, we look at, is it First Timothy or Second Timothy, the one that it's it's leaving my mind right now? But it says, in in the last days, people will be lovers of self. And I that's what we see. And obviously, you know, the last days, I'm I'm not saying, you know, Jesus is coming back tomorrow, although that would be great. But we are in those last days and have been for have been for a while, but you know, we're going to see that people are going to be lovers of self. And what does a love of yourself produce? Well, it produces a higher, a higher version of yourself, a higher view of yourself of I am the most important. Things are here to serve me. I should be comfortable. I should be, you know, going on five Hawaiian vacations a year, or I should, you know, we it it kind of bolsters that that pride and and feeds that pride monster in us. Um and so I I think it's prevalent in our culture just because sin is rampant. You know, we live in a fallen, broken world where people are going to be lovers of self, but then you add in that component of just mass communication, you know, you can tell 5,000 people at one time that you are really unhappy with your situation. And I don't think that's something that we've been able to do in the past. You know, in in past years, you might be able to tell the people in your home and the people you call on the phone, hey, I'm really unhappy with this. But when you have that kind of attitude blasted out in a megaphone kind of vacuum for millions, you know, and and then it just kind of catches on, right? There's kind of that crowd mentality of just, oh yeah, my day has been hard too. I should complain about that. Yeah, it's contagious. It's contagious. And but the positive side of that is so is gratitude. You know, when when you think, when you say, I am thankful for this, I'm thankful that I get to be a mom, you're pushing back that darkness. You're manning your post, you're guarding your heart. You're saying, no, this is a blessing. Being a homemaker is a blessing, and you're pushing that back. And I think that's a great thing. So I'm I'm not knocking on social media. I think there are good uh there's a bad side and a good side to it, but I think we see it so much now because we hear so much and we are exposed to so much all the time that it's just it feels a lot louder because you can hear way more people saying it.

SPEAKER_00 33:22

Yes. Yeah. I I think I think even off social media, offline, that we can hear this same prevalent attitude amongst our friends and family. And we want to have that strokes of praise from people that that um, you know, where they're coddling us for our bad attitudes and giving us the poor me treatment. And that kind of reinforces our sense of victimhood. And what what I think that really does is it gives, it takes away the responsibility of having to do the hard thing. And what I see a lot in our culture right now is that any doing anything that is hard is scorned. And we are encouraged to take the easy path. And we are really taught to expect things to be easy and comfortable, and that as soon as something does get hard and requires effort or um we're experiencing discomfort in something, that we automatically are taught to assume that that is the problem and that we need to find the escape so that we can stop experiencing this hardship. But what that's doing, I think especially in homemaking, is it's teaching women to outsource their responsibilities. And as soon as they are experiencing the hardships of homemaking and the effort and time that it puts into growing in these areas, they want to run away from it and they want to complain about it. Do you do you see that?

SPEAKER_02 35:03

Oh, a hundred percent. I think we are very much a culture of comfort where we want to be comfortable. And that's not where growth happens. That's not where strength comes from. You know, even from even from an exercise standpoint, in order to get stronger, you have to lift weights. And then it once your muscles kind of acclimate to that level of weight, what do you have to do to get stronger? You add more weight, you know? And I was telling my son this today in in school. We're talking about Proverbs and we were talking about how the Lord is a shield and a refuge. And he goes, and he my son just turned seven and he goes, so that means that nothing bad can ever happen to us, right? And I oh honey, unfortunately, James actually promises us the opposite. He actually says that in this life we're going to have trials and tribulations, but that steadfastness or those trials are going to produce steadfastness. And God promises that there's going to be fruit that comes from the trials we go through. He promises us that we're not going to be alone. He promises us that ultimately one day he's going to make all things right. But it doesn't mean that we're never going to be uncomfortable. And then we went in and talked about the book of Job, and he goes, Oh my goodness. You know, he's going to- Yes, yeah. And he goes, and at the I told him, I was like, this is what happened. And God took this away and he took this away and he took this away. And my son, even at seven, he anytime somebody asks him, How many kids do you want to have when you grow up? He goes, I want 10. I want 10 babies. And it's so sweet. He loves babies, it's so precious. But I think that really kind of hit home with him. He's like, God gave him 10 kids and then took them away. And I was like, Yeah, he did, buddy. And yeah, as we're talking about this, we got to the end. And I said, What do you think Job said at the end? What like after all of this happened? Do you think Job said, I don't want anything to do with you? Or do you think he said, Bless you, Lord? And he goes, I don't think you want anything to do with them. And I said, No, actually, it's the opposite. By God's grace, Job responded with, Blessed be the name of the Lord, even though all of this has happened. But I think in our culture, we just we don't have that mindset on trials and pain and suffering. We don't see the value that it produces, especially for non-believers. You know, if if people are not a believer, they like this is heaven for them. This is as close to heaven as they're gonna get. They're seeking ultimate comfort from a world that's never going to give that. And so there's just this, you know, you have this higher ver higher level and perspective of self fed by I want to be comforted and and be comfortable, that just kind of breeds this really ugly monster. And then we as we as Christians can fall prey to that mindset too of, yeah, we do deserve to be comfortable. But if we look at it from a reality standpoint, we don't deserve the breath in our lungs.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 38:10

You know, even the very breath in our lungs is a gift and a blessing from the Lord. So if our day doesn't happen to go exactly the way we planned, you know, I think we're okay. You know. Um, but sometimes it's just so easy to fall down that slippery slope of, oh, things are hard. It's gonna be, it's everything's awful, you know, and become like these giant eeors just walking around of everything's terrible. Um, but I again I think that's being blinded by our pride, blinded by our sense of comfort and that that longing for it, but also just not having that attitude and that heart of gratefulness for the things that we do have. So you may not have a giant home. If you're a stay-at-home mom, you may not have a big home. You may have dreams of a big home, but that may not be your reality. And that's okay. That's not that's you can be thankful for the little home that you do have. Be thankful for the blankets you do have, be thankful for the floors that God gives you and the roof over your head and the lights that work. You know, there are so many things that we can be thankful for, just like there are so many things we can grumble about. But you you have to pick your side, you know?

SPEAKER_00 39:25

Yeah, yeah. And I think uh Thanksgiving is a muscle and like like you were saying with exercising that we need to be exercising the muscle of Thanksgiving, because if it doesn't, the the spirit of complaining is what's going to dominate in our hearts and our minds. And I I think that we just need to get more in that mindset of of exercising those muscles, you know, that it it's not going to just happen. This this sense of delight, this sense of joy in our homes. We're not going to just wake up one day and be like, I'm so excited to do the dishes and fold another basket of laundry. We we, you know, we have to put on that Thanksgiving and we have to put on that joy. Otherwise, that spirit of complaining is what is going to be what defaults in us.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

Absolutely. In in Nancy Wilson's book, Learning Contentment, that book has been a pivotal book for me. It's so, so good. I love that book, and I I read it every January as just a kind of a mindset reset of just, I'm going to be thankful for all of these things and I am going to choose to be content because it is so easy to fall into discontentment without even realizing it sometimes. Even if you're you're just sighing and fussing about something that's small, you don't think that's a big deal, but it does become a big deal. And I've been caught by this several times because now that we have this child in our home who we are actively saying, Oh, you complained. Tell us three things you're thankful for. You know, they caught me doing it the other day. Oh yeah. My uh my stove and my oven broke right before we had family coming into town, and all I could cook with was an Instapot. And I was like, we're gonna have family in town. They're gonna be graciously redoing our floors for us as a gift. It was amazing. And I thought, and all I have to offer them is Instapot meals. And um Hey, you can make some great meals with the Instapot. You can. Unfortunately, some of the groceries I had bought were planned for like sausage and eggs for breakfast cooked separately in the same Instapot. You know, so there there was, there was definitely a um, there was definitely some grumbling happening in our kitchen that day. And my son goes, Oh, mommy, say three things you're thankful for. I'm like, oh gosh, you're right. You're right. I do have to say three things I'm thankful for. Thank you, Lord, we have family coming to visit. Thank you, Lord, that they're giving us new flooring. Thank you, Lord, that we have food to cook, even if it's not the most convenient method, you know. But in her book, Learning Contentment, she talks so much about just that attitude and that that mindset of being content. And I didn't realize how many different avenues that applies to in our lives until I read that book. So if you haven't read that book, I highly recommend it. But one of the doctors, her chapter on dumpster diving, was so helpful for me because I I do lean towards anxiety very quickly. And it's something I have to really safeguard against. And in there, she was talking about how in the verse that says, set your mind on things above, set is an action word where you literally pick up your mind and you set it somewhere else. Just like you would pick up a teacup and set it on a shelf or pick up something and set it over here. You're picking up your mind from where it shouldn't be and placing it where it should. And I think that is so key in changing that victim mindset and getting us out of that as homemakers of I am going to literally pick my mind up from my whiny, complaining, fussy little attitude I have. And I'm gonna set it on the things that are good. I'm gonna set my sights on something bigger than the mess, bigger than the dishes, bigger than the laundry, bigger than reorganizing something. You know, if that to me, that's to me that's therapeutic. I know to other people organizing is stress-inducing. But if so, if it's stress-inducing for you, set take your mind out of that grumbling attitude and set it on, thank you, Lord, that I have things to organize, you know. That has been so helpful.

SPEAKER_00 43:39

Yeah, I I love that. I love that picture. And I I completely echo your recommendation. Every woman should listen or read that book. You can listen to it on Canons Pl Canon Plus, um, but you can also read it. And it is just, it is such a treasure and so helpful when it comes to this attitude of cultivating Thanksgiving and Fighting against discontentment. But what we're talking to really, I think, gives such a good picture of how that act of setting your mind is an act of obedience. And how when it comes to discontentment, that is something that we need to actively repent of, that that is a sin. And we can't be passive about it. It's not just going to go away with our circumstances, or um, it's not something that will ebb and flow from day to day. That is something that we actively need to be repenting of. And that looks like what you were just talking about, setting our minds on what is true and what is good and practicing giving thanks, which is an action that that's that's an action of obedience that we have to do. And the more that we do that over and over again, that's going to build that muscle in our minds and our hearts. And I mean, I love the example that you gave with your son, how you're training him in that. And now he gets to hold you accountable. And both of you guys are getting to build that muscle together. And what that does is that's going to change the atmosphere in your home. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

We, we um every now and then, my my husband, very, very graciously, it's God's God's providence for sure. Every now and then when he sees something become um a thorn in the flesh and just this this issue that's just over and over, he makes these sweeping declarations that are so helpful for me. I don't know what it is about my type A mindset, but if I have a rule, I'm gonna follow it. You know, if I think, uh, it's not that big of a deal, I fudge it a lot more. But if he comes in and says, okay, no more complaining. There will be no more complaining in this house. It is against the rules. I'm like, oh, great. Thank you. I have a rule, you know. Um, and that was one of the ones he did lately. He's like, okay, we're done, we're all done complaining. It's all done. We're not gonna do this. And not to say that we don't, but having that set as this is not, we're not gonna allow this to take root in our home. And when we see those ugly little sprouts come up, we're gonna pluck them out as fast as we can. Yes. By God's grace. This is not just us saying, Oh, look, we're, you know, defeating sin in our lives. This is all through prayer, covered in prayer, saying, Lord, please help us. And um, he is faithful to convict, sometimes through the mouth of babes, of, you know, no, we're not gonna do this. Mommy, you're complaining. Say three things you're thankful for. But though, and even that too is something to rejoice in. The fact that I have children who call me out and say, Mommy, you can't do that. You know, I'm thankful for that because, Lord willing, these are my brothers and sisters in Christ. And I'm gonna walk beside them, not just as their mom, but as their sister in Christ. And I want them to call me out respectfully, right? There is still that honoring your parents that is absolutely essential in our home. But I still want them to be able to spur me on in my faith just as I spur them on. We need to be an iron sharpens iron kind of family. And in our households, the people that see our struggles the most are the people that live with us. And in my house growing up, there was this phrase that was shared a lot of, you know, family's furniture, meaning, you know, you can act however you want at home because family's not going anywhere. But something that I I and just for the record, I strongly disagree with that statement. But families should get our best. Families should not be getting the silent treatment because we're grouchy, or they should not be, they should not have to put up with our constant grumbling and bad attitudes and fussiness. They should, they're as as homemakers, our family is our they're our first guests in our home.

SPEAKER_00 47:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:57

They are the people that deserve our best, not our messy leftovers. They deserve, not not to say that you can't wear sweatpants, you know, but but they deserve the best attitudes. They deserve the best hospitality, the best, um, the best care, the best attention. We should not be giving our attention and time to things outside of our home more than we're giving to things inside of our home. And I think that that's really incredible that our kids get to have that opportunity to grow up in homes that are just covered in that attitude of of love and we're in it together. And, you know, my mom loves being a homemaker and my dad loves providing. And, you know, I think that's a blessing, even though there are hardships in it. I think that's a huge blessing for them. And what a gift that they get to walk into adulthood by God's grace with those perspectives.

SPEAKER_00 48:53

Yeah, yeah. And when they see us taking joy in that and delighting in it, then they're going to want to continue that legacy themselves with their own families, which I think is just the the most one of the most motivating things about why I do what I do every single day. That I I am through my children continuing this legacy for their children, for their families. And and that is also a very sobering thought when you think about it. You know, what are they going to see and learn from me about what it means to be a homemaker, to be a parent, you know, to um be in the home and and you know, how what are they gonna take from that? Yeah, for sure. So I wanna um we we've been talking a lot about Thanksgiving and and cultivating joy, but I want to also talk about this from another angle. I don't know if you can relate to this. I I feel like you might be able to relate from some of the things you said, but I uh have always been a perfectionist.

SPEAKER_02 49:59

And so can you relate to that? Oh, 100%. I I would like to say I'm a recovering perfectionist, but my husband might say otherwise. Right.

SPEAKER_00 50:09

Yeah, yeah. It's there, there's still those strong undercurrents there. So with when it when it's come to homemaking, one of the things that I used to struggle with a lot when kind of in my early, even middle years of homemaking and just being a wife and a mother, was that if I couldn't do it perfectly, it it was it was hard to have motivation to do it at all. And not only that, but I was caught between this sense of how I wanted to do it a certain way, like I have this desire built in me for excellence. But at the same time, I didn't want to be legalistic. And I was afraid that for a long time because I just had a, I had a wrong concept of what it meant to glorify the Lord through obedience. And I think I had been really taught by a lot of things that if I practice good works, if I practice pursuing these things in excellence, that I am, I am being legalistic about these things, or I'm trying to earn God's favor, or I am bringing glory to myself and not to him, and I'm making it about me and how good I am about this. And it was uh several years back, I was listening to this talk from Rach Rachel Jankovic. And it was called Turning a Prophet on Fruitfulness. And that talk was absolutely life-changing for me because she she talks about the parable of the talents and how the master of the field gave his workers each these different talents, and he told them he was going on a trip. And then they, you know, the first, the first worker, he goes back and he turns a profit on it, he brings back I think it was five more. And then the second guy, he brings back ten more, he doubles what his master gave him through the work that he did. But then the third man, he takes the the talents, the money that his master had given him, and he buries it in the ground because he says that he knows that his master is a hard master. And what sh what Rachel talked about in this talk is how he was hating God by doing that. He was hating his master and and because he didn't believe that what he had for him was good, that it wasn't enough, and rather taking what he had and turning it into something more, glorifying it for being a blessing for others or to magnify it for the Lord's service, he just chose to bury it in the ground and not do anything with it. And I was so convicted when I heard that because I realized like that was what I had been doing so much in my own homemaking that I was picking and choosing the things that I was going to be good at because either I couldn't be as good as that person at them, or um I didn't want to be seen as being legalistic. And I realized that it wasn't the pursuing excellence that equated to legalism. It was this the seeking to bring glory to myself. And when I when I was able to wrap my head around how obedience is what brings joy, and how obedience is in in doing these things in the work that God has given me, and pursuing excellence, pursuing faithfulness, um, seeking seeking to be excellent at what tasks the Lord has given me so that I can bring him more glory, so that I can turn a profit on what he has given me. I may not be the best in this area as somebody else, but I can still learn how to be good at it. That that is actually how I am bringing glory to God. That I wasn't bringing him any glory by wasting the time and talents that he had given me and taking the easy route or the more efficient route. And so what that did for me is that really just lit a fire of renewed passion for the act of homemaking, all those practical tasks that we have, such as cooking and budgeting and decorating and meal planning and all these things that really become routine, especially after you've been doing it a while. And I realized that that this was the path that the Lord had given me to bring him glory through, and that he had given me this home, that he had given me the skills that I had, and how was I going to grow in them? And how was I going to turn a profit on that for him? Well, how how was I going to return what he had given me back to him and magnify it? So, with that said, I want to talk about what it looks like to pursue skill building within homemaking and just the value of it and viewing viewing homemaking as an art form. I think our culture tends to portray homemaking really as this thing that we can outsource because there's so many things that are set up to make it efficient. And so we as women have really lost not just the skills that are required to do it well, but the art of it, the beauty of it. So, with you, with that said, what does it mean to you to treat the home as a place of creativity and craftsmanship and intentional beauty? Well, I'm so glad.

SPEAKER_02 56:11

I'm so glad you brought that up because that's been a trap that I have fallen into and I didn't even realize it was a trap for a while. You know, I thought, well, I'm just not gifted in that, therefore I won't try. But, or it was for me, I like to have a plan. And if I didn't have, you know, a three-step plan of how I was going to get from point A to point B on that task or that skill or whatever it may be, I just I would shut down and just not do it. And I would close it off. And like you said, that's burying a talent. And you have to be okay with being bad at things for a bit.

SPEAKER_00 56:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:49

You just have to be okay with it. And if you are a type A person or just have that perfectionism battle that you have to fight too, you know, it you have to be learn to be okay with not being, not being perfect at it. And know that in time, that skill set can grow. I have a friend who didn't start watercolor painting until she was in her 30s. And now she's this incredible watercolor artist, and it's a huge blessing to their family. And that has been such an encouraging journey for me to watch and to hear about because she had to be really okay with being bad for a while. You know, the first time she picked up a paintbrush, I'm sure it was not a canvas-worthy art to be displayed in somebody's home. You know, but it was something that she continued to hone and practice. And I think all aspects of homemaking can be the same thing. It's easy for you to say, well, I'm not good at cooking, therefore I'm just gonna do microwave dinners, or I'm just gonna do quick and easy, which sometimes you need to do a quick and easy meal. But you can also learn to grow in your skill sets as a cook. You can get a good cookbook, get the right tools that you need for your kitchen and be okay with burning some dinners and know that eventually you'll be able to put on a feast. I remember the first time I ever put on a Christmas meal, which granted, this was not the opportune time to do so. I had just had a baby three weeks before, and I thought, sure, I can cook Christmas dinner. And it also happened to be our first child, which, as you know, there's a huge learning curve when you go from two children to one child, you know, you're going, oh my goodness, I didn't think about all of these things that I was gonna have to think about, you know. And three weeks postpartum, I'm I'm cooking um a Christmas feast for my in-laws. And I thought, this is really foolish. I shouldn't have done this. And there were a lot of things I did wrong, and they were very gracious and very sweet and very kind, and um ate some questionable food. But now I enjoy, and if I would have stopped at that point and said, I didn't do it well, I'm just not gonna do it, I wouldn't know how to put on a meal like that now. And now we host other people for Easter every year, people who don't have family that they can go home to and things like that. And so had I just shut down the first time it didn't work out, what a blessing my home would have missed out on, what a blessing I would have missed out on, and the fellowship I would have missed out on, you know, from getting to be a part of something like that. And so I do understand though that that trap of feeling like, am I being legalistic about this? And some of that again comes down to your mindset and your attitude behind it. Are you doing it so that everybody can see what a good cook you are? Or are you doing it because you love the people coming to your home and you really want them to have great mashed potatoes? You know, those are two very different perspectives. So if you're stuck in that mindset, just take a step back and ask the Lord. He is so kind and gracious to call us out when we're wrong because he loves us and because he loves us, he disciplines us and he shows us the way that we should go, right? So we know that if we go to the Father and say, Hey, I, Lord, I need you to check my heart here. Am I doing this out of selfish ambition or vain conceit? Am I doing this from a heart of pride and selfishness, or am I doing this from a heart of hospitality and I want things to be really good for people? Um, and he'll show you. And sometimes it can be a little bit of both. It can change from day to day too. But ask the Lord to convict you, be humble when he does, repent of that. If there is sin in there, be quick to repent and say, Lord, please help me do this with the right attitude. Um, but when it comes to just pursuing things in general as far as as far as skill sets, um yeah, learning to be okay with stuff that's not perfect is huge. And don't have such a narrow-minded view of what homemaking is. Because sometimes you can say, well, you know, homemaking means I have to sew all of my children's clothes by hand. And you might try thousands of times and still not be good at sewing your children's clothes. And that's okay, but there might be another avenue that God has really gifted you in that you haven't even explored yet. And that's one thing that I absolutely adore about homemaking is, ladies, the world is our oyster. There are so many things that we can do in homemaking to the glory of God. There are so many things you can sew, you can do other kinds of craft things with your home or with your hands to make your home beautiful. You can learn how to decorate in a style that you like and your husband likes. You can, which I side note, I think is very important that we as well. Very important decorating for what we think is pretty, but we're asking our husbands, hey, you live here. You are you are in charge of all of this. You are the leader here. Do you like this?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:02

Um, because there are some guys who genuinely would not care to sleep with flowers on the on the comforter. They don't care. My husband is not one of those guys. And he's like, he would be like, no, why did you bring home something floral? I'm not a girl. Um so there's, you know, take his, take his um his perspective and and his interest in into into it too. But what a gift it is that we get to craft a home that's just ours. It's not gonna look like anybody else's, but it you're gonna be getting to use and learn skill sets to bless your home in ways that nobody else can. You're not replaceable in your home.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:41

And it's uh I think our our problem is not that we don't have enough to do and enough to be creative in. We our problem is that we have too narrow of a mindset of it. And I think also a lot of times what happens is that we adopt this mentality that we can pick and choose what we want to invest in. Where, you know, oh, I'm not good at cooking, and so I'm just going to focus on this area over here. And so, but you notice our husbands don't say, Well, you know, I'm not good at getting up for work on time, and so I'm just not gonna do that. That's just not my thing. And, you know, they they know what their duties are and they have to do them and they have to get good at them. And but for some reason, I think as women, we have this idea that we can just pick and choose when it comes to our duties in the home. That I mean, yes, I think there's certain things like you were saying with sewing that, you know, that it's those kinds of things are not gonna be for everyone. And those are areas that we can use to pursue creativity if the Lord has gifted us in those ways. But I think with other tasks, especially related to, you know, um cooking, cleaning, running the budget, things like that, those are things that we need to not have that pick and choose mindset about. We need to learn. If we're not good at them, maybe we weren't taught how to be good at those things. But we need to learn to get good at them. We need to, like you were saying, be bad at it for a little while and just keep practicing. And over time, um, we will grow in those skills. We actually can become very good and talented and gifted at these things. I I know for me, when when my mindset shifted to realizing that this isn't optional, this this isn't about me and if I'm good at it or not, this is my duty. And God commands me to obey him, and I just need to do it. And it it really made me realize this is something I need to grow in. And it it actually became more of a joy because I had the the knowledge of knowing that I'm glorifying the Lord and doing this, and I'm growing in a skill here, and this is exciting, and we actually get more pleasure, I think, when we're learning, when we're putting more effort into something.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:11

I I experienced this a lot when I was really diving into learning how to make bread and learning the skill of that and and just how fun it was. You know, it yes, it takes more effort than buying the the packaged bread at the store, but there is a joy in the process of making something and learning how to do it well and getting to experience all of the steps that go along with it. And I think I think that that when we engage in that type of of work, that we are actually imitating God as creator and shaper and sustainer. And as women especially, I think that we have a unique ability and and role. That God has given us to image him in that way as creators and shapers. And I think that that homemaking gives us such an opportunity to pursue art in that those elements of homemaking. And how we can actually, instead of just seeing our tasks as these mundane duties, how uh, you know, we can we can turn cooking into an art form and it becomes a delight. And, you know, that's something that I think really can change the way that that we approach those everyday tasks.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:38

A hundred percent. I think too, like you said, and it it's funny, we were gonna say very similar things. So I'm so you worded everything so well. I'm so glad you said that. But I think one thing that we have to come to accept as homemakers, if if if you are just really struggling with wanting to do things excellently, realizing it is our job. And that, like you said, it's not optional. Just like our husband can't it, we would not, we would not be thrilled if our husbands went to work and did like a quarter of the job they were supposed to do. Yes. Now, you know, the ramifications may not be as immediate for us, right? We wouldn't necessarily get fired. You know, we can't be fired as homemakers. But whereas our husbands, if they go to work and they do a quarter of a job or they just kind of halfway put a little bit of effort in, yeah, they could lose their jobs. That's a real thing. But we as homemakers miss out and do end up losing in the long run if we don't pursue excellence. If we're not pursuing ways to cultivate beauty in our home, our children do lose out on that. There is a loss that happens there. It may not be as concrete as a job loss, but there is loss that's happening there. And seeing our job, seeing our role as homemakers as an actual job is so helpful in kind of kicking us out of that mindset of seeing, I'm gonna get up in the morning, I'm gonna get dressed, I'm not just gonna lay around all day, I'm gonna have a rhythm, I'm gonna have a routine, there's gonna be structure in our home, there's going to be um, there's gonna be, like I said, rhythms that we follow. You know, it's not just, ah, we're gonna shoot from the hip and kind of see what happens. You know, if you're aiming for the goal of creating and cultivating a beautiful home to the glory of God, raising, raising disciples to go out as arrows into the world, that's not a small calling and it shouldn't be taken lightly or come at from a haphazard, I don't know if I feel like cooking today kind of attitude. That should be attacked with vigor. We should be getting up ready for battle, ready, getting our pants on, getting our hair out of the way. Like we should be getting up and putting our hand to the plow daily with joy, delighting in the Lord first, but putting our hand to the plow and doing it with excellence. Finding, finding the best way to make bread for your family. Finding the best chocolate chip cookie recipe that your grandchildren are gonna be like, I can't wait for grandma to make these cookies, you know. Finding, finding the best way to clean your clothes. If you're going to be doing these tasks anyway, do them with excellence to the glory of God and for the good of your people, because you're going to be doing laundry thousands of times. Get good at it. You know, findings do work for you, find, find ways to clean stuff so that when you look at a room, you go, wow, that room is sparkly. That room is clean. I did a good job. And that's not just a at a girl or pat on the back, but a, I did this to the best of my ability to the glory of God and the good of my family. And there there is a sense of joy that comes from that. And if you are having, if you're struggling with delighting in your duties, pursue excellence in them and be able to look back and say, thank you, Lord, that you allowed me to do that job well. Um because there is a joy that comes from that, you know?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:18

Yeah, yeah. This is this is our vocation and we should treat it as such. We we need to take pride in it. I if if we were to have any other type of job, you know, if we were a lawyer or um, you know, a real estate agent or something, we wouldn't show up for work and just do a halfway job and be lazy about it and sit there and complain the whole time or try and just find the easiest, most efficient way of getting through it. I mean, if we were to do that, we probably wouldn't be valued by our employer. And we we we certainly wouldn't be excelling in that position or bringing glory to God, first and foremost. And so why why should we see our vocation in the home as any different? This is something that the more that we pursue excellence for the glory of God, the more joy that we will that we will receive. Yeah. So we're we're getting close to our time here, um, which it's I I can't believe it's already this been an hour because I just feel like we could talk for so long about this. This has been so good. Um But I wanted to say, what what would you say are the most essential skills that homemakers should pursue mastery in?

SPEAKER_02 1:11:41

I would say, I would say the skills that are most vital to everyday life. I feel like that would be the foundation to start in. And then if you want, if you want and have the the time and ability, like absolutely expand past that. But think about what it takes. And and I wrote about this in that, in that article as well. But anytime when you're trying to evaluate, you know, what you need to do next, keep your circle small. Look at your home, look at the people in it. And how do you care well for them, like your children, your husband, the people under your roof, start there. So think about what are the things that people need every day? They need nourishing food, they need a sanitary place to live. It doesn't have to be, you know, pristine, but it does need to be clean and it does need to, people need to be able to find their things when they need to find them. They need to be able to take a bath in a clean bathtub. Um, they need to have clean clothes on their bodies. So I would say start with those basic skill sets of cooking, cleaning, organizing, laundry, those would be the first four that I would start with. And then you can add out, like kind of branch out from there. But start with those basics because if you're over here, you know, pursuing how to be really great at landscaping, but your family doesn't have a good meal on the table at dinner time, we've got a priority switch that needs to happen. You know? And that's great. If you're great at landscaping, fantastic. And I want you to come to my house because I am not a visionary in that regard at all. But you need to start with the things that are most important and vital to the people and the care of the people that are in your home, which would be like those basic life-functioning things, and then add on from there. And if once you've once you've got kind of gotten a good footing on that, then start looking at other things that would be fun and can add life and um beauty and uh creativity and fun to your home.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:47

Yeah, I I wholeheartedly agree with that. I know that there's so many things about homemaking that we can pursue that are super fun. For example, I really enjoy decorating and just creating that atmosphere in the home through candles and colors and all these things, textures, things that make the home look pretty. But, you know, cleaning obviously isn't going to be as fun as that. And so it's we we have all these things that we can do as homemaking homemakers, but if we're not doing the essentials that require the general functioning of our people and their well-being, then we're not actually really doing our job. So I I completely agree. That is where we need to be starting.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:37

And I think when you do those things too, you know, talking about delighting in our delighting in our work in the home, when you get those basic things down, and I say basic, I know that those are skills to learn. I I burned chicken the first week I was on my own at 18. So I I definitely had to learn how to cook. And um it's definitely I ended up in the hospital for making a raw chicken.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:03

So no. Learning, learning how to cook chicken is definitely an essential skill.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:10

Yes. Yes. And chicken still, you know, I'm Brandon and I will have been married 10 years in February, but um, chicken is still tricky for me sometimes. And it's still nerve, it shouldn't be. It should not be, but it still is nerve-wracking to me sometimes. But when you do all those base, when you kind of get a good footing on those things, you're really setting your home up for success. It becomes more delightful in your home when your home is running smoothly.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:41

When you're when things are chaotic and everywhere, you can still rejoice, right? You can still rejoice when there's a mess. You can still rejoice when, you know, your floors are being ripped up, and you can still rejoice when your stove breaks. And you can, you know, there's you can still rejoice in all of those circumstances. However, when things are running smoothly and you feel competent in cleaning laundry and cleaning a a room and keeping things organized, it really does bring delight and joy to your day of feeling that feeling of we're prepared, everything is settled, that feeling of of peace. I don't have to scramble and figure out what's for dinner. And yes. Yeah, when you hold a plan for dinner and you know at two o'clock, oh yeah, I can go ahead and start piecing these things together, rather than 6 30, everyone screaming because they are past the hangry stage and into just absolute despair because they are withering away, you know, and going, what's for dinner? Like, I don't even know what's in my cupboard. Um, those are two very different feelings as a homemaker. And if you're operating in the latter all the time, you're going to feel like it's really hard to delight in what you're doing. But if you're coming at it from a place of, I have a plan, things are prepared, I can shift from that plan if need be, you know, because it's going to change. We can't map out our days perfectly because the Lord knows our days. We don't. But when you have those things kind of set in place, it lays that groundwork for you to be able to delight much more easily in your home.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:11

Yes. I love that. That's so good. Okay. So, Becky, uh, as we prepare to close, could you leave our listeners with a challenge or encouragement about delighting in her homemaking duties? What would it what would you say?

SPEAKER_02 1:17:29

I would share the verse from Ephesians 2, 9 through 10. For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God, not by works so that no one can boast, for we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do. So looking at homemaking from that perspective, God has literally ordained every scrub of the toilet, every meal made, every conversation around your table, every spill that happens on your floor, every cup of coffee or cup of tea that's served, he's ordained all of those as good works. He saved you by grace through faith, and it's not from ourselves. Our salvation is a gift. Like we said earlier, the breath in our lungs is a gift. And he, when he saved us, already had all of these good works planned out and prepared for us. These were ordained by God to sanctify us, to grow us, to challenge us, to pull us closer to him, to help us find refuge in him in the days that are really hard. But all of these gifts or all of these tasks that we do in our home as homemakers are ordained by him and should be approached with thankfulness. There's a quote from Elizabeth Elliot that I keep in our room because it's just, I want to read it every single morning. It says, This job has been given to me to do. Therefore, it is a gift, therefore it is a privilege, therefore it is an offering I may make to God, therefore it is to be done gladly if it is done for him. Here, not somewhere else, may I learn God's way. In this job, not in some other, God looks for faithfulness.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:16

That's one of my favorite quotes. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:20

I love that one because it's so good. It's a good, it's a good grounding reminder of this job is a gift. It's not a burden. It's not something that needs to be bemoaned or whined about. This job is a gift, and because it's a gift, it's a privilege. And because it's a privilege, it's an offering we make to the Lord. And we want to offer the Lord our best. We want to offer him excellence. We want to offer him, even though our righteousness is as filthy rags, we still want to offer him the best that we can because we love him so much, not because we're trying to um meet a standard that he has set, or because we're trying to earn our salvation, or we're trying, you know, we're doing these things and we're offering every, every skill, every everything that we're doing in our homes as an offering to him. So we do it with excellence and we do it with love and we do it with care and we do it with intentionality and with craft and with design and with purpose because we're presenting it as an offering to the Lord. And at the end of the day, let us not grow weary in doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we don't lose heart. So don't lose heart, don't grow weary in doing good, clean the floors again after people walk over them, be cheerful about it, clean the clothes again, be cheerful about it, do all of these things to the glory of God, rejoice in the work that God has set before you, and again, do it all as an offering to Him.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:54

Amen. That's so good. Isn't that just so comforting to think about? Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I I would add to when you were talking about the things that the Lord ordains, is he also ordains every interruption, he ordains every mess, he ordains every inconvenience that we come across through our homemaking. And he does it for our good. All of these things, all of these grueling tasks, the grind and grit that we have to put our hands to, all of it is for our good to shape us to be more like him. And so when we are experiencing hardship and and difficult tasks, when we're experiencing even failure within our homemaking, we can rejoice because we know that that it's not going to waste, that God is going to use that to make us to be a better reflection of him and to be more fruitful in the work that we're doing. And um that the more we lean into him and the more we press into the hard work that he has given us, we can only we can only grow and things can only get better from there. And so I I would just say, you know, when those interruptions and frustrations and messes come that seem like they are getting in the way of your job of homemaking, just to embrace it because that is part of the beauty of it all and what God is doing through the work that you're doing in your home. So absolutely. All right. Well, that's just about all we have time for today. Ladies, if this episode encouraged you, would you please take just a minute to subscribe and leave a review? We want to get this message out to women and more importantly, to the women who need it most, that biblical womanhood still matters. It's going to take an army of women to do this. So we need you to help us bear the flame. So if this conversation blessed you, would you please take a moment to subscribe, rate the show, and leave a review? It just takes a few seconds, but it makes all the difference to us, and we are so grateful for your support. Also, don't forget to join the Keeping the Citadel magazine community to go even deeper into each theme we explore here on the podcast. Subscribe, share, and help us build a culture of faith one home at a time. Becky, thank you again so much for coming on today and having this conversation with me. I am so blessed. This, even just listening to you, so many of the things that you were saying, it's just such an encouragement to be reminded of these truths. And I'm just so grateful for you and your friendship. So thank you. Of course. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:46

I'm I'm thankful for you and thankful that we've gotten to gotten to meet and know each other, even though we're miles and miles apart.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:54

Yes, I know. I know. Hopefully someday it can be in person. That would just be such a blessing. I know. That would be wonderful. I would love that. Yeah. Can you tell people where to find you before we leave? Sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:06

So I co-host on the Fruitful and Fearless podcast. You can find that on Spotify or Podcast app. And then I also have an Instagram where I share all things about keeping home. And it is called Keeping Home.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:21

Awesome. And your planner is coming out very soon, or it's already released, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:26

It has released. We are doing pre-orders right now to put in our first big bulk order. So if you want to be guaranteed to get one before Christmas, now is the time. So I am very excited. It is a labor of love, but it is it is a joy to get to do that every year. The first year I released it, I thought, well, I don't I wanted this. So I thought, well, I'll make it and I'll put it out there in case other women want it. And it's been a joy to get to see how God has used that and grown that to bless other homes and help other women remain faithful in their callings through manning their post well and organizing their days to the glory of God.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:04

Mm-hmm. I am very excited about this too. I highly recommend you all go and get this planner right now because I've been using this two years and this is an essential tool in my homemaking. So I am very excited that you have another one releasing. Yes, I'm I'm excited to get it into the hands of everybody. Awesome. Cool. Well, thank you again so much, and um hope to talk to you soon. Yes, thank you for having me. With that said, here is my charge to you. Proverbs 3127 says, She looks well to the ways of her household and does not eat the bread of idleness. Ask yourself today, are you the kind of woman who looks well to the ways of her household? The calling for you is simple. It's to take up your cross and die. Not once, not for a season, every single day. You have been called to follow the king, and you must do this in your home, in the place the Lord has ordained for you to manage with the people He has entrusted to you. He made you to be a life giver, a soul nurturer, and a homemaker. He made you to be the glory of the glory. So be a glory in your home today. It isn't easy to lay down one's life. It isn't always glamorous or fun. The road you find yourself on may be paved with suffering, pain, and heartache. The messes in your home will be great, the interruptions plenty, and the work will often be overwhelming. But it is not the easy path that leads to victory. It is the one that leads to him. You might feel weak, ill-equipped, or unworthy, but we don't answer this call because we are worthy. We answer it because he is. Stand firm, man your post, and do not forsake your duties. Embrace the work your King has given you to do. Challenge yourself to grow in your skills and pursue excellence. Resist discontentment, victimhood, and laziness with every fiber of your being. Embrace the joy of the mundane, delight in the duties set before you, and always endeavor to be exercising your muscle of thanksgiving. And when the weight of your duty is more than you can bear, when you think you can't go on anymore, remember He is holding you fast and He won't let you go. So have courage, dear heart. You were given a high and holy task. Until next time, embrace your high calling, live a better story, and keep the flame of your citadel burning brightly.