Queen Elizabeth and the Mad Messiah

In 1591, a former maltster with a history of drunkeness and brawling walked into Cheapside, in the heart of London, and declared himself the second coming. But William Hacket wasn't just any old madman— he became the spark that nearly set the Elizabethan establishment ablaze.

 Join us as we dismantle the bizarre rise and rapid fall of history’s most audacious "prophet." From rightious preaching to a public execution so bloody that it shocked the city, we’re exploring how one man’s delusion collided with the iron fist of the Virgin Queen.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:07

Honourable Mentions.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

Warning. This episode contains descriptions of torture, capital punishment, and Northampton.

SPEAKER_02 0:18

Hello, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Honourable Mentions. Well mentions. If you listen to our first episode and you're now tuning in for the second, you really ought to re-evaluate your life choices. We thank you very much. We do appreciate it. And here we are, back again to bring you another extraordinary life that history's kind of just forgotten about. So Honourable Mentions. Yes, yes, thank you, Neil. We had this last time. We have had, after our last uh episode, we've had sackfuls of post asking the same question from our listener. It's for you, Neil. So what they want to know, hello Neil, they've said in the beginning. Hello, Neil. And they ask, Hello, Neil. Have you ever bitten off another man's nose?

SPEAKER_03 1:05

No. Straightforward yes or no?

SPEAKER_02 1:07

Yes or no question.

SPEAKER_03 1:09

But no.

SPEAKER_02 1:09

Stop trying to sit on the fence. Yes or no.

SPEAKER_03 1:12

No, I had to think about whether I did or not, but no, I haven't.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

You haven't? Okay. Well, there is a reason for that question, because today's protagonist has done just that he wants bit off another man's nose. His name was William Hackett.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

That's perhaps where they made a job. So it's made a hack of that.

SPEAKER_02 1:28

What someone's nose. What you're saying, that's where that word comes from.

SPEAKER_03 1:31

Yeah, I would say so. Or it could be the clothing brand. You know, the ones that put people where like rugby shirts with the collars turned up and should have jumpers over their shoulders. Anyway, let's not go there.

SPEAKER_02 1:41

No, let's not go there. Other pretentious makes of tops are available.

SPEAKER_03 1:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:46

Have you ever heard of Oundel, please?

SPEAKER_03 1:49

Yes, I have. I believe it's it's either Northamptonshire, I think. And there's a school there, isn't there? Very famous school.

SPEAKER_02 1:55

Yeah, it's called Oundle School.

SPEAKER_03 1:57

Oh right. Well, that didn't take much imagination, did it?

SPEAKER_02 2:00

No, no, they are a poor knight with that one. Yes, Oundal School in Oundal. Do you ever play rugby in Oundel?

SPEAKER_03 2:08

Yes, I have, yes, several times, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 2:10

And you didn't bite anyone's nose off?

SPEAKER_03 2:12

No, I didn't bite anybody's nose off, but we did used to have some quite fierce games, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 2:16

This guy, William Hackett, lived in Oundal in the 1550s. Which is about ten to four. No. Ten to four, you'd have finished by then. Anyway, there he was in the fifteen fifties. We don't know a lot about him, but we know he received no formal schooling. So your little observation about Oundor school is is correct but inappropriate. We know he married a lady called Anna Morton, who was the widow of a comfortably well off farmer.

SPEAKER_03 2:47

Did he have some money?

SPEAKER_02 2:48

Well he did, but then he burnt through it. He burnt through it really quickly with he spent it all on women and drink, even though he was a married man. But with that money, he was able to establish himself as a molster. A monster. A molster, as in like Maltesers, Maltster. So how much do you know, Neil? Hello, Neil, how much do you know about the mid to late 16th century malting industry in Middle England? Please go.

SPEAKER_03 3:15

Well, as a matter of fact, Steve and I know quite a fair bit about it. I know how malt is made, for instance. Um I do believe once you've got you've either got grain or barley normally, but they they do a a process called steeping, which is also a post name for what you do to a tea bag, is where you soak it in water. So when you steep a cup of tea, you can also steep the grain so it's soaked in water, um, which then it goes into the process of germination where they allow it to sprout a little green spike or something out of it to start it growing. But then just before that, they dry it, I believe, in a kiln. So it's kilning dried, and that adds flavour to it and gives it a beautiful malt taste, malty sort of taste. And then I'm gonna put it out there, I think that malt is probably used in a lot of beer. How's that?

SPEAKER_02 4:03

William was raised a Catholic, but somehow along the line he converted to Protestantism and in true hackett fashion took it a stage further by becoming an all-in-puritan.

SPEAKER_03 4:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02 4:13

How come you know so much about malting?

SPEAKER_03 4:15

Yeah, no, I know a bit about everything, me, mate. Not much I don't know. Not much I don't know, really. There you go. I know why they have frosted windows and toilets in the airplanes. I know all sorts of things.

SPEAKER_02 4:28

Why do they have frosted windows and toilets on the airplanes?

SPEAKER_03 4:30

So you can't see out.

SPEAKER_02 4:31

But why don't they have frosted windows and all the other windows in the airplane?

SPEAKER_03 4:34

So because they want you to see out. You think about it, if you sat on the toilet, you're normally sat in the toilet and reading the paper, but you they want you in and out, so they don't want you to look out the window because you could be sat there for a long time.

unknown 4:45

See?

SPEAKER_02 4:46

What if you want to open the window? Anyway, moving on, because I can't believe you knew that. Ruined it everybody now with your molting knowledge.

SPEAKER_04 4:55

Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 4:55

Anyway, as a Puritan, I am Hackett did not approve of anyone wearing priestly vestments. As you wouldn't, Major. Priestly vestments, you wouldn't.

SPEAKER_03 5:05

Priestly vestments? No, you wouldn't, no.

SPEAKER_02 5:08

Such as a surplus. Do you approve of surpluses? I don't.

SPEAKER_03 5:12

Oh well, I mean, if there's a surplus of chocolate, then No, oh, go back to your moulding in your toilet windows.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

A loose white robe worn by Protestant preachers as a hangover from Catholic priests. That's what a surplus is. Is it? So on what on one occasion, Hackett drew the anger of his local church and local community by sitting on the parish priest's surplus and hiding it throughout the absolute service throughout the service. Probably because he's an absolute stinker.

SPEAKER_03 5:46

That is a bit rude.

SPEAKER_02 5:47

Absolute shaw.

SPEAKER_03 5:48

That's like bullying, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 5:50

It is like bullying. He sat on it, so the old priest I don't know what the priest wore. No, I don't think probably stood on his vest and pants. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:58

They're vests, yeah. They're vests in the 1550s, Stephen. I think it is more of a a pantaloon.

SPEAKER_02 6:03

But they would have had vests.

SPEAKER_03 6:05

I don't know. I don't think so, but I'll have a look. I'll look it up into my vast knowledge, I would have to go back into it and have a look.

SPEAKER_02 6:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 6:12

But you carry on the story while I investigate.

SPEAKER_02 6:15

Not only was William Ackett an absolute stinker and a rotter, but he believed that he was a better preacher than any church ordained priest. So he began to preach Puritism in his own time. Oh. He's one of them, isn't he?

SPEAKER_03 6:30

Yeah, he's one of them. I know but thinks he knows best.

SPEAKER_02 6:33

Yeah. And he was illiterate.

SPEAKER_03 6:35

Was he?

SPEAKER_02 6:37

No, but he was hugely charismatic, naturally funny, and had a prodigious memory, apparently. So he could remember and recite long sermons, often throwing in the odd comedy line here and there.

SPEAKER_03 6:49

So he was one of the original comedians then, off the cuff jobs.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

He was a real comedian.

SPEAKER_03 6:54

Yeah. He could have been on Whose Line Is It Anyway, that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_02 6:56

If he was doing these unscripted sermons that he was preaching and throwing in a bit of comedy, I'd like I'd like to think he had one of those yellow ostrich costumes with the reins and a little pair of fake legs on top. So it looked like he's riding the ostrich, but in fact he's not. I mean, that's as we all know that that's real comedy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 7:15

It is absolute comedy.

SPEAKER_02 7:16

That's absolute. You don't top that.

SPEAKER_03 7:18

No, I don't think it just makes you laugh thinking about it, doesn't it? I'd like to think that's what he was doing. Especially when he pretended that the ostrich was in control of everything and running around everywhere. That was a good thing.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

Exactly, and nicking people's hats and things like that.

SPEAKER_03 7:29

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So it's making me laugh now, just thinking about it.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Probably the priest surplus. You probably have the priest and he's running around with it going, whoa.

SPEAKER_03 7:37

He'd probably have to have had a career out of just doing that.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

He could have done, but he didn't. He went on. So from there, from his comedy routines and his preaching, another Owndel man. You've heard of Oundel, haven't you?

SPEAKER_03 7:48

Yeah, I have, yes. It's in uh Northamptonshire, I believe. I don't know what that is, actually, it's quite close.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

Well, Rutland, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 7:54

Is it?

SPEAKER_02 7:55

I think so.

SPEAKER_03 7:56

Not sure.

SPEAKER_02 7:57

Anyway, soon, right? He dis he acquired a disciple called Giles Wiggington.

SPEAKER_03 8:04

Giles Wigginton. I know someone called Wiggington.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

Was he called Giles?

SPEAKER_03 8:08

No, he wasn't, no. He's a pilot now.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

So that's a bit pointless then.

SPEAKER_03 8:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

Well, thanks for that. Thanks for that interlude. So yes, they became partners in the moulting trade.

SPEAKER_03 8:20

They could have been related.

SPEAKER_02 8:21

They weren't related.

SPEAKER_03 8:22

No, they were.

SPEAKER_02 8:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:28

I'm asking. See if it's his family tree. His family's from around this area, so I would assume it would have been quite close, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02 8:34

From the Oundle area.

SPEAKER_03 8:35

Anyway, I digress.

SPEAKER_02 8:37

Yes, you die crest. Is that what you're doing? What colour are you dying it?

SPEAKER_03 8:41

Uh purple.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Purple crest.

SPEAKER_03 8:43

Nice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:45

Charles Whittington wasn't an illiterate buffoon, even though he went into partnership with William Hackett. He was well educated at Oundor School, as you've previously mentioned.

SPEAKER_03 8:54

There you go, see.

SPEAKER_02 8:55

And um Trinity College, Cambridge. So not only was he well educated, but he was well connected as well.

SPEAKER_03 9:01

He was, wasn't he? I suppose he was there.

SPEAKER_02 9:03

So they were moulting together as their little partnership. One of them was the brains, obviously, and the other one was the brawn. But William became more convinced that his calling was to preach God's word. So he jacked in the moulting trade and he set off to travel around the north of England and the Midlands, where he preached, prophesied, and even performed exorcisms.

SPEAKER_03 9:23

No, he didn't.

SPEAKER_02 9:24

He did. And I bet he didn't have a like a VW camper van and a great dane to eat massive sandwiches.

SPEAKER_03 9:33

Yeah. I bet. Yeah, and his hair in braids and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 9:37

Yeah, but he didn't do anything like that.

SPEAKER_03 9:39

No. No. That sort of thing. Cuddled trees and things.

unknown 9:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:45

William about cuddling trees. Anyways, on his way round, right, old William, doing all this preaching, exercising, that sort of stuff, he had let's call it friendly relations, intercourse. I don't know, but I just did. But he had he had this sort of relationships with many, many women.

SPEAKER_03 10:05

Tupping.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Yes, he did tupping, whatever you want to call it, yes.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Yes. Uh burying his helmet wherever he wanted. But anyway, he later claimed that these had all been deliberately placed in his way to ensnare him by the devil. That's the sort of thing the devil would do.

SPEAKER_03 10:21

Let's face it, if you've got a fellow going around going around doing that, the devil's gonna think I'm gonna put all these ladies in front of him, so he's gotta have intercourse with him, he's got to tub them all.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

He's got to do the business, isn't he?

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:32

He's got to go through him, isn't he? I'm gonna put these women in his way, and the only way round them is to do the business. So yeah, so he's probably right in that he couldn't avoid it. They were all put there in front of him.

SPEAKER_03 10:43

Yeah, if the devil's done that, you have to do the devil's work sometimes, don't you?

SPEAKER_02 10:46

Yeah. Although it has to be said, he did seem pretty keen on getting himself ensnared by the devil. He wasn't really putting up a fight.

SPEAKER_03 10:53

But was he a married man, did you say?

SPEAKER_02 10:55

He was a married man, but he was estranged. Yeah, well, he used the borrowed money and then legged it.

SPEAKER_03 11:02

Still has lost my respect, I'm afraid, sorry.

SPEAKER_02 11:04

As a happily married man, he's lost he's lost all your respect.

SPEAKER_03 11:07

Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 11:08

Okay. So biting off someone to know is you were with that.

SPEAKER_03 11:11

But now he's depends on the situation of that, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_02 11:14

Well, he he was in a pub fight.

SPEAKER_03 11:16

Well, there were the pubs back then?

SPEAKER_02 11:17

Yes, of course there was pubs as well, taverns and things, yes.

SPEAKER_03 11:20

Oh, of course. Because there was forty t forty pounds, wasn't there? Oh, that's a different one. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

And our first episode, listener, go back and listen to what he's talking about, because God knows. Anyways, young uh William Hackett was chased out of many towns by angry men folk, and he ended up in York. You've been to York. He did. He must have been chased Farold. But we don't know where he was chased from, we just know he was chased from somewhere.

SPEAKER_03 11:48

So he's somewhere near York, hopefully, because it'd be odd if it was from Andor. Well, but yeah, if he's they really wouldn't have gone on, didn't they?

SPEAKER_02 11:55

If he was in Perrinport in Cornwall or somewhere. That was a that's a bit of a jog, isn't it? But anyway, he was chased out of town, ended up in York, and here he claimed to have been sent by God to prepare the way for the return of the Messiah. So he's taken on a bit of a turn now, isn't he? Not only has he renounced his Catholicism and become a Protestant and then become a Puritan, now he's claiming that he's paving the way for the second coming. Which is a bit ironic considering what he was up to in the first place. But if you want to keep me on the kinky theme, this time in York, he wasn't just chased out by the men folk, he was whipped out of the city. They whipped him. Whipped. I doubt it'd just casually strolled out with someone whipping at his back.

SPEAKER_03 12:40

Well, that's what it sounds like, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Then he went to Leicester. So he's on his way round, wasn't he? He's doing the.

SPEAKER_03 12:46

It was, yeah, it's a long way again, isn't it? There's no there was no other places between York and Leicester back then then, no?

SPEAKER_02 12:50

No, no, obviously.

SPEAKER_03 12:52

Obviously not.

SPEAKER_02 12:54

Yeah, I mean he wants to go to Sheffield anyway. So yeah, he he was straight down York to Leicester. Guess what happened to him in Leicester?

SPEAKER_03 13:02

Uh he had a curry?

SPEAKER_02 13:03

No.

SPEAKER_03 13:04

He watched some rugby?

SPEAKER_02 13:06

No.

SPEAKER_03 13:08

He invented crisps.

SPEAKER_02 13:10

Oh, that was close.

SPEAKER_03 13:12

Was it? Because it was, you know, because I was assuming because he'd done a lot of walking. That's what I put the thing together. Walker's crisps. Oh, there you go. Other crisps are available.

SPEAKER_02 13:20

A very English snack. But yes, Walker's Crisps. But no, no, he didn't do any of those things. What happened to him in Leicester was he was ensnared by the devil, preached that he was looking for the second coming of the Messiah, and was whipped out of town.

SPEAKER_03 13:34

Again. Again. You think he'd learn his lesson in York, wouldn't you?

SPEAKER_02 13:37

You thought he learned his lesson in York, so this time he said this isn't working for me.

SPEAKER_03 13:41

I'm gonna have to find something else to talk about.

SPEAKER_02 13:43

Well, this time he he did. He went back to Arundel. He went home and thought, well, this this ain't going too well then.

SPEAKER_03 13:49

Gathered himself.

SPEAKER_02 13:50

I've got a bit of a sore back. So I'm going to rather than winding it in, as you and I would do. I think I would most people probably would do as well. Most people would do this. Here, he expanded his repertoire by preaching against the Queen. What? I know not only did he say I am clearing the way for the second coming, but he started having a pop at Freddie Mercury. I mean, what is the fella doing?

SPEAKER_03 14:15

Saying, I mean, and that guy uh yeah, he had his issues, but that guy could sing and he could write music, couldn't he? So why would you have a go at them?

SPEAKER_02 14:22

Well, I'd say Bohemian Rhapsody is a seminal piece of uh 1970s rock music, if not possibly the greatest single ever released.

SPEAKER_03 14:29

Well, there you go.

SPEAKER_02 14:30

And he's having a pop.

SPEAKER_03 14:32

It's probably because of his yellow jacket, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 14:34

It could be the queen, it could be the queen, Queen Elizabeth I. It could be, actually. I just thought of that. Yeah. But either way, what you're doing. Either way, what you'd be laying at, son. So anyway, so Hackie and his ost his ostrich costume were thrown into jail in Northampton.

SPEAKER_03 14:59

Wow, yeah, I could think of worse places. Well, actually no, I can't.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

So while he was in Northampton jail, the story goes, some guards who were guarding him, because that's what That's what guards do. Yeah, it's in their job title, isn't it? It's in their job title. So these these guards said they saw a bright light coming from his cell as if he were being visited by an angel.

SPEAKER_03 15:28

He's probably reading when they were um putting lights out.

SPEAKER_02 15:31

Probably under the bed sheets or something. Yeah. It'll be a r copy of Razzle.

SPEAKER_03 15:36

Or it could have been because he's lights all their ladies, didn't he?

SPEAKER_02 15:40

Smash hits.

SPEAKER_03 15:41

So a bit of a jazz mag or do him a world of good, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02 15:44

Probably. It's either that or he was he's got a Smash Hits under there and he's writing loads of letters to the editor about it.

SPEAKER_03 15:50

Or looking, maybe and just reciting some of the lyrics because he's got a good memory.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

Yes, he did have a good memory.

unknown 15:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:55

Well well remembered yourself, uh.

SPEAKER_03 15:57

There you see. I could be related.

SPEAKER_02 16:00

It could be. On his release by Bond, not James Bond. No, can't they? By Bond, as in someone paid some money. We'd call it Bale. Right. America America still called him Bondsman, don't they, in Bond and things like that. Anyway, he was um yeah. So this is Easter 1591 now.

SPEAKER_03 16:16

It could have been this it could have been the the light reflecting off some of the silver wrapping of an Easter egg.

SPEAKER_02 16:21

So you're still going back to the light, are you?

SPEAKER_03 16:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:25

Could have been. Do they still have silver wrapping on Easter egg? I suppose they do, don't we? Yeah, I've had an Easter egg for a long time. Listen, if you feel like it's like a lot of it. Oh that must have been what it is, then. Well, Easter 1591.

SPEAKER_03 16:38

There you go.

SPEAKER_02 16:39

Um and he travelled to London at Wigginson's suggestion, staying in a lodging house outside of Smithfield in London.

SPEAKER_03 16:46

Oh, there's a big market there.

SPEAKER_02 16:47

Smithfield's market, is there, isn't it? Is that the one that's in Smithfield?

SPEAKER_03 16:51

Yes, it is, yeah.

unknown 16:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:52

Exact same one. My knowledge.

SPEAKER_03 16:55

Yes. Exact same one.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

Exact same one. So while he was here, Wigginson introduced him to a fella called Edmund Coppinger.

SPEAKER_03 17:03

Edmund Coppinger. Right. Edmund Coppinger. Alright, Eddie Boy.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

And Eddie Boy, he held a minor post in the royal household.

SPEAKER_03 17:11

What's that? Just like a small one.

SPEAKER_02 17:13

Yeah, I'd imagine it was on some sort of private gate or something, some sort of low wall or something like that. He was holding this post.

unknown 17:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:20

So they wouldn't have hammered him in in those days, didn't they? So they had people employed just to hold the posts up. Yeah, that's what he was doing. And Coppinger soon convinced himself and another friend called Henry Arthington, who was a Yorkshire gentleman.

SPEAKER_03 17:36

That sounds an orchestra name, isn't it? Arpington.

SPEAKER_02 17:38

Henry Arthington.

SPEAKER_03 17:40

Arthington. Yeah, it does sounding, didn't it?

SPEAKER_02 17:44

Hey, oh, it's Henry Arthington.

SPEAKER_03 17:46

Oh, I know Henry. Where's Eddie?

SPEAKER_02 17:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:49

That's him. Yeah. Dickit.

SPEAKER_02 17:51

They were convinced that Hackett had an extraordinary calling by powers beyond this earth.

SPEAKER_03 17:59

You mean like Simon Cowell?

SPEAKER_02 18:01

The baby Jesus.

SPEAKER_03 18:02

Was he around then?

SPEAKER_02 18:03

Who?

SPEAKER_03 18:04

The baby Jesus Jesus. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:07

He would have been.

SPEAKER_03 18:09

Well he wouldn't, because he was born f 1500 small years beforehand. So he wouldn't have been a baby, surely.

SPEAKER_02 18:15

Really? What's Christmas all about? Anyway. Did he?

SPEAKER_03 18:18

Anyway. Yeah, of course he did.

SPEAKER_02 18:19

Well he didn't, did he? Because Christmas is December the twenty-fifth, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 18:23

Yeah. About the birth of Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 18:25

Yeah. And then Easter.

SPEAKER_03 18:26

He's done baby Jesus at Easter, was he?

SPEAKER_02 18:29

Well, it was only about three, four months on.

SPEAKER_03 18:31

Yeah, toddler. The toddler Jesus. Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

Anyway, Wigginton introduced him to Edmund Coppinger, da da da duh am I in opposed, blah blah blah blah. You with that? Coppinger declared himself Hackett's prophet of mercy, and Arthington said he was his prophet of judgment.

SPEAKER_03 18:47

Right. There's only much profit and judgment.

SPEAKER_02 18:49

And that William Hackett himself was the second coming of Christ and Massayer. So he's he's he's he's really building up his game, isn't he? So he started off sitting on the priest's whatever it was, cistern, obviously. Make him do the old uh church service and custom pants.

SPEAKER_03 19:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:07

And now when he well, then he started getting whipped out of places for saying he was clearing the way for the second coming.

SPEAKER_03 19:12

I really like that. That's all he was.

SPEAKER_02 19:13

Well, I think he must have done because now he's saying he is the second coming.

SPEAKER_03 19:16

Yeah, exactly. I think I made him go be the second coming when he got whipped.

SPEAKER_02 19:20

No messing about, mate. I am the second coming.

SPEAKER_03 19:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:23

So anyway, Coppinger, on Thursday, the 18th of July 1591, about size. About 230, just after he'd had some tea. Coppinger wrote, printed, and distributed hundreds of leaflets throughout London promising that something tremendous was about to happen.

SPEAKER_03 19:40

Wow. By hundreds, do you mean like more than two hundred? I mean hundreds. Because they wouldn't have got around much because there's millions in London, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 19:48

By yeah, by hundreds, I mean hundreds. So, um hundreds. So more than one hundred.

SPEAKER_03 19:53

So I'd say it'd be one per household, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02 19:54

Well, there wasn't millions in London then. Oh there's a few hundred about six hundred thousand, something like that.

SPEAKER_03 20:01

Unless you stuck 'em up on a pinboard somewhere and it could have done, couldn't he?

SPEAKER_02 20:06

Or you know those big those big billboards they have on the side of the motorways.

SPEAKER_03 20:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

Something like that. Or you can put it on the side of a tractor or a van on the side of the M25.

SPEAKER_03 20:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:16

That's probably what it's like.

SPEAKER_03 20:17

Yeah, an old old lorry trailer or something.

SPEAKER_02 20:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:19

They get a lot more people up there, wouldn't he?

SPEAKER_02 20:22

That's that's what he did. We'll go with that.

unknown 20:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

So Hackett defaced the Queen's arms. What the Pope? Whether he g I don't know, whether he drew a tattoo on him or or I don't know what he did.

SPEAKER_03 20:35

Or is it his local?

SPEAKER_02 20:37

I don't know. He he p he defaced the Queen's arms and pierced the image of her with a bodkin.

SPEAKER_03 20:43

A what?

SPEAKER_02 20:44

A bodkin.

SPEAKER_03 20:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

Isn't that like a like a sharp penny thing for your hat or something?

SPEAKER_03 20:50

That's a bodpin. Bodkin's a moor, isn't it? Cormore.

SPEAKER_02 20:53

Bodmin?

SPEAKER_03 20:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

I don't think he'd managed to pierce uh image with bodmin more.

SPEAKER_03 20:59

Oh I don't know. I don't know what bodmin, I thought it was a bobby pin.

SPEAKER_02 21:02

It would have been a bodkin. These were both treasonable acts.

SPEAKER_03 21:07

Yes, it would be.

SPEAKER_02 21:08

There would be. And guess what the punishment was for treasonable acts?

SPEAKER_03 21:12

Oh. Um a trip back to Northampton and a tour around the city, town.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

No, not as bad as that.

SPEAKER_03 21:19

Hanging then.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

No, it was a horrible death.

SPEAKER_03 21:22

Like what? A fate worse than a fate worse than death. Come on to that.

SPEAKER_02 21:25

Perhaps stay tuned. Stay tuned. Anyway, we're now on to Friday, 19th of July, 1591. And here we find William Hackett in bed, whilst Coppinger and Arthington, dressed in all black, was standing on a cap proclaiming that he was the king and the messiah to a crowd gathered outside the mermaid tavern in Cheapside. I think the mermaid's tavern, I think, was frequented by William Shakespeare.

SPEAKER_03 21:56

Was it? He was in Stratford.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

And Marlowe and people upon Avon, though, wouldn't he? Not all the time.

SPEAKER_03 22:02

Well, that's what it says when you go to Stratford upon Avon.

SPEAKER_02 22:04

Yeah, he had a bus pass. He could get like National Express or something. So he was in London quite often.

SPEAKER_03 22:10

That's doing some writing. I suppose that's where his theatre was.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

That's where his theatre was, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_03 22:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

So, anyways, I'm only I'm only surmising. I think that's true. But anyway, we'll find that out. If anyone wants to find that out and wants to email us, you can let us know. And please email us on our email address, which is honourable mentionspod at gmail.com. So um anyone who wants to um let us know. Let us know and we'll just I don't want to.

SPEAKER_03 22:37

Yeah, please, because that's really exciting, Steve.

SPEAKER_02 22:39

Yeah, exactly. We'll probably just go.

unknown 22:41

Thanks.

SPEAKER_02 22:41

Anyway, what they were saying while they're on this cart in Cheapside was that Christ had returned to judge the earth and establish the gospel in Europe. They said he they were his prophets, sent by God as witnesses, and repentance would ensure mercy from heaven. Terrible judgment and eternal punishment was promised against those who would not believe and repent.

SPEAKER_03 23:01

Ooh. Like what?

SPEAKER_02 23:03

Terrible judgment. Probably did have to go to Northampton.

SPEAKER_03 23:05

That's a terrible judgment that just walked past him. You stink.

SPEAKER_02 23:08

That's a terrible judgment.

SPEAKER_03 23:10

It is terrible judgment.

SPEAKER_02 23:11

Yeah. Yeah. But you know, it's cold play.

SPEAKER_03 23:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:15

Something like that, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:16

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:17

So that really upset you.

SPEAKER_03 23:19

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Saying things like Bernie Clifton wasn't funny. Things like that. Ostrich.

SPEAKER_02 23:25

Yes. Yeah. Saying things like, No, well that's not a judgment though, is it? That's a statement, that's an opinion.

SPEAKER_03 23:31

I suppose.

SPEAKER_02 23:32

So if you went by someone and said, you know, that ostrich, mate, that's just not funny. Yeah. That's an opinion, but you'd still be I think that'd turn the crowd against you.

SPEAKER_04 23:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:42

Because most people would look at that and think, what's he talking about? That's not funny.

SPEAKER_04 23:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:46

So they were told that they would get a terrible judgment and eternal punishment. So probably probably have to go to Northampton for eternity listening to Coldplay.

SPEAKER_03 23:56

Or best you'd have to listen to Eternal on on loop, probably.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

So many people took their ways at face value and said, Oh, okay, that sounds interesting. Please tell me more. Um but many did not. And then a right old, because they're in London, didn't they, right?

SPEAKER_03 24:10

Yeah. So geezers, aren't they?

SPEAKER_02 24:12

Geysers are right, a right old Barney, bro.

SPEAKER_03 24:14

Yeah, all those hats on with a bit with sequins on.

SPEAKER_02 24:17

Purley Kings and Queens and all that.

SPEAKER_03 24:19

That's it, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 24:20

They all jump up and click on the reels and on the braces.

SPEAKER_02 24:23

Yeah, that's it. Yeah. And then they went marching out, they took him into the blind beggar and give him a right old doing.

SPEAKER_03 24:29

Yeah, do them over, yeah. Give him a s give him a slap. You get slapped.

SPEAKER_02 24:33

So whatever happened anyway, what happened, Coppinger and Artington had to take refuge in the mermaid tavern.

SPEAKER_03 24:38

Well, that's I think the worst places.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

And the Privy Council heard what was going on and had all three of them meet.

SPEAKER_03 24:45

Um is that people looking for the toilets?

SPEAKER_02 24:47

Yeah, well, no, I don't think they look after it, that's where they meet. The Privy Council meets in the in the public toilet.

SPEAKER_03 24:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 24:54

I think something like that.

SPEAKER_03 24:55

And they're called cottaging nowadays.

SPEAKER_02 24:56

The cottaging council could have. Yeah, it would have fit better actually.

SPEAKER_03 25:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:01

Should have gone for that.

SPEAKER_03 25:05

Well, is that the yeah, because he could have told us, couldn't he?

SPEAKER_02 25:07

Yeah. The Privy Council heard what was going on. They had all three of them nicked and imprisoned in Bridewell Palace. They're doing alright actually, aren't they?

SPEAKER_03 25:16

They're doing alright. They're doing alright.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Yeah. And then they get put in a palace. Put in a palace. Well, I don't know that. But that's a very good observation because as we know, in those days, you had to pay for your food and accommodation if you were thrown in jail. Yes. So that's a very good observation. Anyway, we're now on to Friday, the twenty-sixth of July 1591. And nearly his, isn't it? But on this occasion, William William Hackett, who we're talking about, that William. If it was another William, it'd be a bit pointless, but it's on the same word.

SPEAKER_03 25:51

Yeah, like Shatner or something.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

You've done what?

SPEAKER_03 25:53

Like William Shatner.

SPEAKER_02 25:54

Oh sorry, yes, I thought you needed to take a break.

SPEAKER_03 25:57

No.

SPEAKER_02 25:58

William appeared in court and pleaded guilty to a charge of declaring that Queen Elizabeth was not Queen of England. What? But he pled not guilty to a second charge that he had defaced the Queen's picture, although we know that he did stab it with a bodkin. So he was turning a bit of a fib there.

SPEAKER_03 26:17

He was, wasn't he? He was a bit of a fibber. But he was, wasn't he? Because he's told his Mrs. he's gone off someone and he was um taking his way through all those ladies.

SPEAKER_02 26:25

Well does that make him make him a bit of a fibber? Bit of a bit of a rogue rotter. Yes. But uh the his uh behaviour in this trial um excuse me, in this trial that we're talking about suggests that he was not of sound mind, and the court labelled him a witch, visionary, and an idiot. A raving lunatic.

SPEAKER_03 26:51

Vegetarian.

SPEAKER_02 26:52

No, a raving lunatic.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

Okay. A vegan.

SPEAKER_02 26:55

Same thing.

SPEAKER_03 26:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 26:57

So Sunday, the twenty-eighth of July, fifteen ninety-one, now.

SPEAKER_03 27:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

So this is getting close to your birthday, isn't it? It's very close, yeah. It's the twenty-ninth of July, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 27:07

Yes, thank you, Stephen.

SPEAKER_02 27:08

Just putting that out there for the listener.

SPEAKER_03 27:10

Yeah, if anyone wants to send me a card and on that day it'd be perfect. Snydts would be accepted.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

So you probably like this the gift that um William Hackett received on Sunday, the twenty-eighth of July.

SPEAKER_03 27:20

Yeah, what's it, please?

SPEAKER_02 27:21

Well, he was dragged naked, full body, along the ground behind a horse. Well, I'd imagine Game of Thrones probably nicked it off off this kind of thing, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:33

So naked though, please.

SPEAKER_02 27:34

Well, it would hurt more, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_03 27:36

I suppose if he was excited.

SPEAKER_02 27:37

Strips him of his dignity.

SPEAKER_03 27:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

If you're being face down, dragged along behind a horse, you're not going to get that excited. Well, it depends how kinky you are.

SPEAKER_03 27:46

So he'd like to get whipped, doesn't it? Yeah, perhaps being dragged through some horse poo might do just top it off for him.

SPEAKER_02 27:52

Well, that's true. He's dragged along the road, naked, face down through all shite. Then um yes. Anyway, that's not what happened because the horse was on its way to a gibbet in cheap side.

SPEAKER_03 28:01

That's what they'd get inside Turkeys. Gibblets. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 28:05

Or Istanbul. Did you say Turkeys or Turkey?

SPEAKER_03 28:08

Turkeys. Christmas. Turkeys. You get in gibblets, gibbbs.

SPEAKER_02 28:11

That is that is gibblets. Istanbul was inside Turkey, which is another thing. Or the other.

SPEAKER_03 28:17

So it's not Constantinople back then, Stephen.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

Istanbul, not it would have been Con well done.

SPEAKER_03 28:22

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 28:22

So anyway, there he was, right? He's being dragged full body, naked, across the round, on his way to this gibbet. The horse, of course, although it was on its way to its gibbet, the horse was innocent. I need to point that out now.

unknown 28:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:36

Just in his job. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:38

The horse was just taking him to the gibbet.

SPEAKER_03 28:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:40

And uh anyway, right, Neil, besides that, the famous Burley House horse trials didn't take place for another four hundred years because he was innocent in the horse trials.

unknown 28:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 28:59

Anyway, Hackett was a bit of a, as we as already seen, he's a bit of a nuts. So all the way there he raged and writhed and screamed blasphemies against God and the Queen. But he wasn't really gonna enjoy himself, was he? Well no, but at this point I think he'd realised that that his game was up, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_04 29:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:18

He he was he was for it at this stage. Once he was there, he was forced up onto the gantry, his skin torn, bleeding and bruised all over he was. He had a few broken bones, that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_03 29:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:30

I'd hate to think the state of his John Thomas.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

That would have been shreds, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 29:35

It would have been shreds. In shreds. But he took a dramatic look over the large crowd and it was.

SPEAKER_03 29:42

A bit like you see a lot of people on that start of like homing away or something when they do that bit when they look sideways on their look straight forward. Slow motion, that sort of thing. Is that a dramatic look?

SPEAKER_02 29:52

I w I've got it more sort of Clint Eastwood, that squinty look.

SPEAKER_03 29:56

Yeah. But slow motion, looking around.

SPEAKER_02 29:58

Kind of, could have been.

SPEAKER_03 30:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:02

These are his last recorded words. Wow.

SPEAKER_03 30:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

You know those really big reel to reel tapes?

SPEAKER_03 30:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:08

It would have had a horse on either side.

SPEAKER_04 30:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

On a treadmill.

SPEAKER_04 30:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:12

Horses would have round the tape round as it went round.

SPEAKER_04 30:15

Oh cool.

SPEAKER_02 30:16

And then they'd have had like a hamster actually writing what was said on the tape.

SPEAKER_03 30:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:20

That's the way it worked.

SPEAKER_03 30:21

Yeah. Very clever animals back then.

SPEAKER_02 30:23

They did. Yeah, they did. We've lost uh we've lost our own.

SPEAKER_03 30:28

Yeah, it's lost art.

SPEAKER_02 30:29

These were his last words, right?

SPEAKER_03 30:31

Yeah. Did they put that down?

SPEAKER_02 30:34

Um no, that's me doing my act to thee.

SPEAKER_03 30:36

Oh, some mmm in heaven, he said.

SPEAKER_02 30:40

Mighty Jehovah, send some miracle out of the cloud to convert these infidels and deliver me from these mine enemies. If not, I will fire the heavens and tear thee from thy throne with my own hands. Wow.

SPEAKER_03 30:54

Not his bare hands.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

His own hands.

SPEAKER_03 30:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:57

Probably right about some gloves on, but he didn't mention that whether he was wearing any appendages. So um yeah, so we take it it would have been his bare hands.

SPEAKER_03 31:05

Yeah. Fairy ones.

SPEAKER_02 31:06

Don't know what you meant by all that. He said it. He went and said it and it was out there. You couldn't get it back now.

SPEAKER_03 31:14

That's sadly. Once you said it, it's gone, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 31:16

It's gone, it's out there, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 31:17

Yeah, and especially with the horses have been recording it.

SPEAKER_02 31:20

And the and the hamster and his yeah. But if you can imagine then, right? 99.9% of the population were religious. Deeply, not just religious, but deeply religious as people. Imagine someone just standing there shouting that over the top of them. That'd be quite shocking.

SPEAKER_03 31:38

It would be quite shocking. It'd be like sort of stood in Old Trafford with a Liverpool shirt on in the centre of the pitch with the full crowd saying, Man, you're a shit, or poo. I might say oh no I say poo. That sort of thing, wouldn't it? A lot of people go, dare you! That sort of thing. That sort of reaction. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:54

Or if you can remember when Taylor Swift got a was it a Grammy award, and Kanye West ran on stage and took it off her and said that Beyonce should have got it.

SPEAKER_03 32:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:05

I'd imagine it was that level of shock and outrage.

SPEAKER_03 32:08

Yeah, absolutely. A bit like when Cadbridge stopped doing the coconut boost.

SPEAKER_02 32:11

They did what?

SPEAKER_03 32:12

They used to do a coconut boost as well, there's the biscuit ones.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

Did they?

SPEAKER_03 32:16

Yeah, they're the best ones ever, but they stopped doing them. So there was a massive outrage. Well, it was for me.

SPEAKER_02 32:21

Letters I wrote to them.

SPEAKER_03 32:23

Ridiculous. They still left it out. Well hopefully they'll listen to this podcast and think to themselves, well, actually, yeah, we'll bring them back.

SPEAKER_02 32:29

Anyway, we'll leave that there. God was upstairs when he and he's listening on all this and he's thinking, come on, man.

SPEAKER_03 32:35

Come on. Come on again.

SPEAKER_02 32:37

Come on, then.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Come on, come on.

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Because what happened then, right? A noose was slipped around the neck of William Hackett.

SPEAKER_04 32:44

Right.

SPEAKER_02 32:45

And he was resisting all the way he was, but the ladder was kicked from under him. And he was he was then writhing and fighting against the inevitable, and his eyes started bulging, and he turned blue and his tongue went limp.

SPEAKER_03 32:58

And then he bit his own nose off.

SPEAKER_02 33:00

No, he was cut down. And he fell all the way to the floor, smashed to the ground in a weakened bundle of ripped flesh.

SPEAKER_03 33:07

Well, who cut him down?

SPEAKER_02 33:09

The executioner arrays.

SPEAKER_03 33:10

Why?

SPEAKER_02 33:11

Because it wasn't good enough for him, was it? They weren't just they weren't just gonna hang him.

SPEAKER_03 33:16

They wanted him to suffer.

SPEAKER_02 33:18

Yeah, it wasn't good enough for him. They couldn't get to Northampton in time, so they had to think of something even worse.

SPEAKER_03 33:23

Perhaps they could sprinkle salt on him when he was on the floor rather than cut.

SPEAKER_02 33:26

They did worse than that. So while he lay prostate and gasping on the ground, no, the executioner came up to him and sliced off his genitals.

SPEAKER_03 33:39

There wasn't pretty much much left of them.

SPEAKER_02 33:40

Well, there are pretty, I'd imagine they're pretty well grated.

SPEAKER_03 33:43

I would have to say, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:44

Like you'd taken to him with that very sort of.

SPEAKER_03 33:46

I think his left his leftist test is on the street somewhere down the road.

SPEAKER_02 33:50

You'd probably find that's correct.

SPEAKER_03 33:51

Yeah. But you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 33:55

You know the cheese grater. Yeah. They've got that one side that's got the really fine little holes in it. It looked like that. But anyway, they were sliced off, mate. Held up in front of his eyes so he could see them, and then they were tossed into a fire.

SPEAKER_03 34:09

Nice.

SPEAKER_02 34:09

And then just in case that didn't get him, they sliced his stomach open, pulled out his entrails, and did the same with that. Tossed it into the fire. Wow. There's probably a bloke with an octolog stand saying, Come on.

SPEAKER_03 34:23

Yeah. I've got fifty I've got fifty sausages here. I've got my onions here and everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:33

Come on. Anyway.

SPEAKER_03 34:35

Play at the games and I would imagine there'd be quite a few people doing a bit of a von bomb.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

They'd used to it, I suppose. I don't know, but then they've gone along because you may have already worked out that what was happening to William Hackett here, he was drawn along behind a horse to the place of execution. Then he was hung.

SPEAKER_03 34:53

Right.

SPEAKER_02 34:53

Then he was drawn again, insides were drawn out of him. So what do you think happened next?

SPEAKER_03 34:58

Don't know, perhaps they filled him with water or something? Did they use him as a plant pot?

SPEAKER_02 35:03

No. They cut him into four equal pieces. In other words, quartered.

SPEAKER_03 35:08

Is that what that saying comes from?

SPEAKER_02 35:16

That's the sound of that landing in in in Deal's brain. Yes, hung drawn and quartered he was.

SPEAKER_03 35:23

But he wasn't though, would he? He was drawn, hung, drawn and quartered.

SPEAKER_02 35:27

Yeah, it's not as catchy, is it?

SPEAKER_03 35:28

Well no, but that's they're just sort of abbreviated probably because that's Well yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:33

We don't know for sure.

SPEAKER_03 35:34

They didn't follow the process, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_02 35:36

Well, we don't know for sure whether the drawn relates because not everyone would have had their insides pulled out from in the middle.

SPEAKER_03 35:42

Well unless that means someone stood there with a pen and pencil on the side of it.

SPEAKER_02 35:45

And drew him. Yeah. It could have been.

SPEAKER_03 35:48

Yeah. Didn't think about that, didn't you, did you? Perhaps they wanted to draw him in his his state when he's been hung. I think, well, quick, we'll get a quick sketch of him. That's probably that's perhaps all the people in the crowd were there all right easels and a pen and pencil and had to do the competition, probably.

SPEAKER_02 36:01

So there he was, right? There's God was sitting there with his feet on his desk lighting up a big cigar, and they cut old William Hackett into four pieces.

SPEAKER_04 36:10

Right.

SPEAKER_02 36:10

So his head was chopped off, so that didn't count. That was that was put on a spike somewhere in London, but then his torso was cut in half, one half goes to one end of London, one half goes to another end, same with his legs, etc. So these were kept on the public display for anyone who wanted to go along and have a look.

SPEAKER_03 36:29

Can have a look and then Yeah, but you want to go and see the top half or something, you wouldn't want to go and see a leg, would you?

SPEAKER_02 36:34

Whatever. The the thing is, it's the lesson, isn't it? It's the lesson.

SPEAKER_03 36:38

Yeah, I know, but if you're going to take the kids out for the day or something, you'd just think to yourself, well, we're going to have a look at his head, shall we? Because you wouldn't want to think, well, there's his nipple and left arm or there's his leg.

SPEAKER_02 36:48

You don't know. It depends what you're taking the kids out for. If you're taking the kids along and say, listen, children, you do This is the life lesson to you. Do not diss your monarch.

SPEAKER_03 36:56

Yeah. Don't put bobby pins in her arms.

SPEAKER_02 36:59

Don't come at her. Because if you do, if you come at her, this is where you're ending up.

SPEAKER_03 37:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:05

So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:05

No down at school.

SPEAKER_02 37:07

Yeah, or Freddie Mercury.

SPEAKER_03 37:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:09

So this is what happens. So old William Hackett, by this time. He was hacked up, I think, by this time. He he w he was dead.

SPEAKER_03 37:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:18

There's nothing to say that.

SPEAKER_03 37:20

No. I would imagine so, but then again, if he's possessed, you never know.

SPEAKER_02 37:25

You never know. But anyway, he died. There's no record to say whether he got up there and give God a good slap, like he said he would.

SPEAKER_03 37:31

Well, yeah, but you know, because I mean, in like in Indiana Jones, when that guy retrieves that heart from that bloke and he was still alive. You know, they've cooked his entrails and stuff like that, but he could still be alive.

SPEAKER_02 37:42

Either way, this was 1591, wasn't it? So I think he'd be pretty he'd be getting on a bit now. So, yeah, I'm gonna take it that he that he passed on.

SPEAKER_03 37:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 37:51

But either way, right it'd shaken the Protestant establishment so thoroughly it was nearly forty years before the Puritans were able to begin to show their faces again. And that all ended up. How did that all end?

SPEAKER_03 38:04

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

Oliver Cromwell.

SPEAKER_03 38:09

Wow. Was he the one to ask for more?

SPEAKER_02 38:13

No. No, you're thinking of Oliver Twist.

SPEAKER_03 38:18

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 38:19

Oliver Cromwell, um I suppose he did ask for more because he was.

SPEAKER_03 38:24

Did he have a cast didn't he have a castle in Croland? Oliver Cromwell, is that something to do with him in Crownland?

SPEAKER_02 38:30

He was in charge of the parliamentarian army, which were the roundheads, which would have laid siege to the not cavaliers. Cavaliers he was a lot more cautious.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

Right. Yeah, kept himself tidy and clean. Yeah, well leave it. He was a roundhead.

SPEAKER_02 38:45

Anyways, Ryan.

SPEAKER_03 38:48

Don't try and maybe jump.

SPEAKER_02 38:50

Anyway, right, Edmund Coppinger. Do you remember us talking about Eddie Boyd? He was the one who used to hold up posts in the uh royal household. He's not because he starved to death in jail.

SPEAKER_03 39:02

That's perhaps because he didn't eat when he was holding the post up.

SPEAKER_02 39:04

But Henry Arthington, our Yorkshire friend, he says that he'd been the victim of witchcraft and renounced Hackett and all his puritanical beliefs, but he did spend the rest of his natural life in prison. Which serves him right, I think.

SPEAKER_03 39:19

Yes. I do as well, because he jumped on the bandwagon, didn't he?

SPEAKER_02 39:23

He did jump on that bandwagon.

SPEAKER_03 39:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:25

Then he jumped off it again. But he wasn't allowed to jump off it too far. So that concludes our story of William Hackett, the Messiah, and his little treacherous interludes against good Queen Bess.

SPEAKER_03 39:38

Yeah. But why does he deserve an honourable mention, can I ask, please?

SPEAKER_02 39:42

Because of what he did. Because he was a naughty boy. Because he tried to claim that he was the second coming and he wanted to throw good Queen Elizabeth off the throne. And imagine if he did. Just imagine it if you can.

SPEAKER_03 39:57

Just imagine it. We'd have had to have a a day like we had for Guy Fawkes.

SPEAKER_02 40:00

We'd have had to have a William Hackett day, perhaps. That wouldn't have been a Guy Fawkes day. Because that wouldn't have happened, would it? No, it probably would have done. Might have done because he was a pro he was a Puritan.

SPEAKER_04 40:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:11

So yeah. And that was a Catholic trying to get rid of James I who succeeded Elizabeth the First.

SPEAKER_03 40:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 40:18

But we wouldn't have ended up with our current royal family.

SPEAKER_03 40:21

No.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

Then we can't be having that.

SPEAKER_03 40:23

No, that means.

SPEAKER_02 40:24

No, true. Or true Englishman could be seeing that. No. Well Peter this one out. And thank you for listening to us, dear listener. We will be back again at some other time with Honourable Mention. And um yes, thank you for joining us yet again.

SPEAKER_03 40:40

Thank you ever so much. Thank you. Thank you. I mean that thank you. Bye. Bye, thank you.

SPEAKER_02 40:45

You say bye now. You say bye.

SPEAKER_03 40:47

You hang up.

SPEAKER_02 40:47

No, you hang up.

SPEAKER_03 40:49

You hang up.

SPEAKER_02 40:50

Bye.

SPEAKER_03 40:50

Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

SPEAKER_01 40:53

Hello. My name is Peter. How are you? I'm here to say that everything you just heard about William Hackett was true, apart from me. I played the role of the hot dog salesman, and those losers just made me up. Now they expect me to read the following statement like I haven't just wasted my lunch. I mean those torches, am I right? They want me to thank you for listening to Honorable Mentions. Frankly, if you made it to the end of that episode without your head in a bucket for one stone cold dude, but those losers do appreciate it. They need all the attention they can get. Please remember to like, subscribe, share, and leave a five-star review if that's the only way they'll get it. And you can even follow them on social media and email at honorable mentionscod at gmail.com. I suggest asking for more hot dog salesmen in their stories. Honorable Mentions is researched by Stephen Webb and is an Uncover Brothers production. Like that means anything. And the theme is written and performed by Pepe and the bandits. No, I haven't either, but it says here that you can listen to them wherever you stream your music. Well, that's me. Please come back next week. I've heard they're going to be talking about a woman. That should be interesting. I don't know whether that breaks their restraining orders or not. We will see. And remember, more rules for hot dog salesmen. Roles. For hot dogs. Get it? Never mind.