From Gang Life to Reinvention with Joseph Martinez

Today on Ava Devine's Bad Advice, I sit down with Joseph Martinez to explore a powerful truth: you are not destined to become the environment you were raised in.

In our conversation, Joseph opens up about growing up surrounded by gangs, violence, and survival-driven thinking, and how that world quietly shaped his identity before he realized it. From having a father serving a life sentence to inheriting “street beef” instead of opportunity, his story reveals what it really means to be raised in a system where certain paths feel inevitable.

But this episode isn’t just about where he came from; it’s about what it takes to break away. Joseph shares the internal conflict of wanting that lifestyle, the influence of the people he looked up to, and the moments that slowly planted a different vision for his life. From a cousin who challenged his mindset, to becoming a young father, to confronting his own behaviors later in life, this conversation unpacks how change actually happens. Not overnight. Not perfectly. But through awareness, willingness, and the decision to want something more.

In this episode, you'll learn:
How Your Environment Shapes You And How to Break Free From It
Why Leaving a Negative Lifestyle Is Harder Than It Looks
How Small Moments Can Change the Direction of Your Life
How to Turn Survival Instincts Into Strength in the Real World
How to Control Your Emotions Instead of Letting Them Control You
How to Redefine Masculinity in a Healthy Way
How to Build a New Identity Without Losing Yourself
How to Let Go of the Need for Approval From the Wrong People
How to Channel “Hustle Mentality” Into Something Positive
How to Move From Just Surviving to Actually Thriving

If there’s one thing I want you to hold onto, it’s this: where you start does not have to be where you stay. Change doesn’t come from pretending your past didn’t happen, it comes from learning how to use it differently.

I hope you love watching this episode as much as I did filming it.
Ava Devine

What We Discuss:
00:00 Intro
00:48 Growing Up in a Gang Environment
02:23 How Environment Shapes Identity
04:54 Life With a Father in Prison
07:28 Shame, Identity, and Childhood Experiences
10:02 Faith, God, and Finding Meaning
12:13 Wanting the Lifestyle vs Questioning It
14:01 The Moment That Changed Everything
17:47 Why It’s So Hard to Leave That Life
22:06 The Reality of Gang Culture and Family Ties
25:04 Feeling Trapped and Fear of Judgment
28:04 The Turning Point: Wanting Something More
31:52 Redefining Masculinity
34:31 Learning to Trust and Communicate
36:17 Unlearning Old Behaviors
40:05 Letting Go of “Tough Guy” Mentality
41:32 From Hustling to Honest Living
45:42 What Reinvention Really Looks Like
48:31 Fatherhood, Pain, and Growth
53:25 Breaking Generational Patterns
54:25 How to Rebuild Your Identity
56:47 Advice for Anyone Feeling Stuck
58:21 Letting Go of Limiting Beliefs
01:01:43 The Truth About That Lifestyle
01:04:51 Feeling Like It’s Too Late to Change
01:06:40 The Dark Side of the “Glamour.”
01:07:27 Can Anyone Truly Change?

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Instagram: @mr.send.da.wire

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

We're often told that where you come from defines who you become, that your environment, your upbringing, and your circumstances shape your future in ways you cannot escape. In this conversation, I sit down with Joseph, who grew up in a gang environment to talk about what the world really looks like beyond the surface. We unpack the realities of growing up in that environment. But most importantly, we talk about what it takes to walk away.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

My father went to prison when I was about two, two and a half years old, and he got a life sentence for a double murder. That was the norm for me. The environment I came in from was uh a lot of gangs, a lot of hustling type-minded people. We didn't inherit a set of books, encyclopedias. We inherited street beef. You ain't nobody special. You think you're better than us? I wasted a lot of time and energy and emotions on a lot of things that were necessary.

SPEAKER_00 0:58

Okay, Joseph. How are y'all?

SPEAKER_02 1:01

I'm doing great. How are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:02

Very well. Thank you for being part of my show.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Oh wow. Well, actually, thank you for having me. Um, I'm a huge fan of yours, and I the little bit I've been able to talk to you, I find that we have a lot in common. And um I heard you talking on the intro, but all I heard was the word reInvent. And the reason I only I think the only reason I heard that is because you're way more beautiful in person.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Congratulations on all your success and the award that you should have had a long time ago, in my my eyes, in my opinion. So, yeah, again, thank you for allowing me to be around somebody that's really big-hearted, beautiful, successful, and um it's an honor. And again, with the reinvention, um, I like where you're at now in life. Yeah, yes. I as stunning as you are, stunning as you've been to everybody, this is the most attractive I've ever seen of you. So I'm excited to watch you reinvent yourself. Um, as myself, I uh feel like I've come a long way in reinventing myself. So thank you again.

SPEAKER_00 2:10

No, thank you. Well, I'm a big fan of yours from what what we've discussed about your lifestyle in the past, present, and future. So that's why I wanted to have you on my show because I really feel that reinvention is very important, self-improvement in all areas of our lives, right?

unknown 2:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:27

Okay, so um, I'm gonna talk about this. I want to hear about what did the environment looked like growing up and how early did you become aware of the worlds you were in. So tell us about that backstory, please.

SPEAKER_02 2:41

Um, you know, I guess the environment I came in from was uh a lot of gangs, a lot of hustling type-minded people. Um and I'm I'm a big person on uh you're a product of your environment. Um with that being said, I feel like people, you know, if your family, you know, went to college and was successful, there's a great chance you're gonna follow in their footsteps. If you grow up around, you know, negative-minded people, um that's kind of the flow that you'll go with as well. Because you just think that's the way life is supposed to be. Nobody's taught you different.

SPEAKER_00 3:20

Sure, because it's like learned behavior.

SPEAKER_02 3:23

Absolutely. Like this is this is how it's supposed to be. You know, if you didn't know nothing about except having a mom and dad and a white picket fence and getting tucked in every night and a book read to you, it's it's just it's just two different lives, two different worlds. So the environment I grew up in was like again, you know, not to here to glorify anything. I'm more of uh I feel blessed to be here. Um, I didn't even realize, I knew I had a story just because some things I'll get into, but recently I've met some people and they really touched my heart. And I shared my story with them, and they didn't judge me. Um they believed in me, and they really, they really felt what I I had, the story that I do have, I overcome so much. Statistics, you know, like everybody's supposed to be set up to do things based on statistics. So I knew I had a story, and I'm I'm grateful again, you know, to be here with you and share, you know, hopefully somebody can take a little bit from my story that's struggling, uh, maybe think the world's against them, um, maybe doesn't have anybody to lean on, any guidance or support, and can realize at an early age that you can't overcome a lot.

SPEAKER_00 4:38

I like that. Okay. So, what did normal look like for you as a kid? Tell us about that.

SPEAKER_02 4:45

So, I I you know, I guess I can start in the beginning, and I've I've shared this a little bit with people in my life. Um, not a lot, but my father went to prison when I was about two, two and a half years old, and he got a life sentence for uh a double murder. So my life as a child was basically in a visiting room, you know, traveling, uh it'd be a whole day of traveling to go see my father because it seemed like they put him in the farthest spot possible. So, you know, we'd spend all day traveling, we'd leave at night, we'd come home at night, and you know, growing up, that's that was the norm for me. And um, I didn't know anything different than you know, a visiting room and you know, seeing my father. I can still remember going to this, we used to call it the castle. Oh, your dad lives in a castle, grandpa lives in a castle. And it was um it was just a different experience, you know. But you know, you you grow up and you go into this one room, and uh boom, these cages open. Boom, they put you in another room, the cage is open. And it's just like you don't even realize it as a kid, but it's just something that you go through, you know. But that was the norm, you know, growing up, you know, with your father there, and then uh my mother was 18 when she had me. You know, my mom's beautiful. Well, she's still beautiful, but you know, she was young when she had me. So it was like uh my grand, my grandparents raised me, my grandmother and my grandfather. Uh and you know, my mom would go out, do her thing. She's 18 years old, you know, my father's in prison. So I was raised in that environment, also, you know, going from one home to another, and then pretty much staying with my grandparents. And my grandparents were great, you know, they were loving people, but they weren't uh they weren't really teachers, they didn't really, you know, go play, go in the other room, you know, or my uncles, everybody, Mexican families, we all like live together, and you know, my uncle's like, go play in the street, you know, like just being mean and just kind of a negative vibe, and you know, just go play, and uh, you know, we're not reading you books, we're not getting any of that. So that was kind of the start of it was you know, knowing my father was in prison. And you know, you know, when you're in school, you're ashamed of those things. Like, you know, other guys are, you know, their dad's uh a scientist or their dad's the the coach, you know, or this. And you know, I can remember telling kids on uh Father's Day you come to school and there's a Father's Day. Um, I would tell kids that my dad was in the army because I you know I was the only one with no father there. So it was like it was kind of embarrassing as a kid. Um, but yeah, I mean that's that was the start of you know when I started to realize my life was probably different than most. And um, yeah, that's how it all began, was just realizing that you know you got two parents, and and then and I watched your show, I've watched some of your episodes, and uh it seems like you have God in your heart. And um that's that's touched me, you know, it's made me look at you in a different light. Um, and it's it's uh it's precious because I know it's took it's helped you get really far in life and be a stronger person and um overcome a lot. And I've watched your last episode and I seen the lady and she spoke about it as well. And I'm not here to, you know, I don't go door to door selling Bibles. You know what I mean? Yeah, but I grew up with God in my heart, and um, you know, I'm was born and raised Catholic. My culture is always a very spiritual culture. Um, but it's a it's it's always really hard too because you're also raised in a negative environment, and sometimes you only pray when you think it's beneficial. And I feel like um as long as you always have God in your heart and know, um, and that's whatever somebody's God is. I don't knock anybody's religion or who they believe in or what they how they get their power, but there is a I believe there is a power for everybody. So um yeah, I just always had God in my heart and uh you know just knew that I think I knew as a young age that things would get better eventually.

SPEAKER_00 9:22

Yeah. Yeah, I was raised Catholic too, and but I was raised with a punishing God. Today I'm just very spiritual, I'm not really religious, but for me, God stands for gift of desperation because I'm always desperate, and I know money, property, and prestige won't save me or myself, you know. Right. So yeah, so I look at look at you know higher power that I choose that I choose to call God, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:47

Yeah, no, I can relate. I mean, you know, I I feel like you know, I don't want to say I don't want to sit here and feel like this episode about I can relate to everything you've been through in life. Yeah, but I feel like I have a lot of similarities.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Most we have a lot of commonalities.

SPEAKER_02 10:03

A lot of, yeah. So it's like, yeah, I I don't think I necessarily I feel like even though you've may have questioned God in the past, like everything he has done is for a reason. Exactly. You know, like I don't know why he put me through the things he did, but it led me right here with the opportunity to sit here and talk to you.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

Yes, you're walking testimony today.

SPEAKER_02 10:25

Yeah. And I also think that he blessed me with the father that he blessed me with so that I wouldn't go on that same path, you know. Um I think it was every Sunday I would get, I don't know, maybe a 15-minute call, 30-minute call from my father. That was the only time I'd get to talk to him. And it got to a point where it was like I dread, it was dreadful. Like I just dread he's gonna call because he's not asking me anything really. He's always schooling me. He's always telling me, don't do this, don't do that, don't go around those people. Those people did this, they do that. Because when you're in prison, you hear everything. I don't know why. But they had Wi-Fi in the 70s and were able to communicate with people, and I don't know how, or they found things out, but he was always drilling me. And again, going back to God, I think he he gave me that father to make sure I didn't go in the same path. And I also want to think that common sense was kind of beat into my head, and that's what separates a lot of people, I feel, in life is common sense, not a uh, not a degree from Harvard, not anything like that. It's it's common sense can take you a really far away. And you gotta know right from wrong, which again is common sense. And I don't know if I was originally blessed with that, but my father put that into me, and that's one thing that you know I'm you know grateful for.

SPEAKER_00 11:51

Yeah, for sure. I always say I graduated from the school of hard knocks. Like, I can't learn that what I learned in school or in a book or in a textbook, it's like it had to be life lessons, you know. Right. Yeah. Okay, so um I want to talk about the internal conflict. Was there a part of you that knew early on that you didn't want that life? Tell me about that.

SPEAKER_02 12:15

No, there wasn't a there was never a time that I I thought that I didn't want this life. Actually, I embraced it. I really wanted to be part of it, and it excited me. And again, that's a product of your environment. You know, everybody I looked up to was uh had flashy things. Um, you know, they were tough guys, they were, you know, these these people that I just I I wanted to be like. And my father always was a presence too because being doing so much time in prison, he seemed to have developed uh a status where people loved him and respected him and maybe even feared him. And to me, at a young age, that like excited me. Like I wanted to there was a time I wanted to be like my father. And um, so it took me a long time, a long time uh to realize I always thought I wanted to be part of that life. And I just recently shared something with somebody that's very special to me, and I and I told her, I said that there's one thing that sticks out in my head, and it's this older cousin I have. And he's always had the beautiful car, you know, gold necklace, watch, just really a cool, clean guy. And I can remember him giving us a ride in his, you know, like low rider, and we're really young. Yeah, and again, you know, telling you that I thought the environment that I come from, my father, I was just gonna follow in that pattern. I thought for certain it was just a matter of a time. But the thing was is I was gonna probably outdo my father. I was gonna go out harder, I was gonna shine more, and this is all super negative. And hearing myself talk about it out loud, it sounds really dumb. But that's the mindset I had because I didn't know anything different. So we're going, my cousin's driving us somewhere, getting ready to get out, and he says, Hey man, be safe out there. And I don't really remember exactly what I said, but this is my comment was for what? Just a matter of time. And he grabbed me by my wrist, and nobody's ever I don't want to say nobody's ever cared because I grew up around people that cared about me and loved me, but nobody ever really forced something onto me. And he grabbed me by my wrist and he looked at me and he said, Don't ever talk like that. You know, and it just stuck in my head. And uh, you know, even to this day, I had dinner with him a few years back, and he's living a different life now, he's successful, and he he's around a bunch of people that we didn't grow up around, and we're all having dinner, right? And it's me and him, and we kind of stick out like sore thumbs because we're with people that we typically wouldn't be with, but we're blessed to be with these people at the same day, and I'm not judging them, you know. Um they know him, but they only know a certain part of him. So I stop our dinner and I acknowledged what he did and how he changed my life, and I think I actually punched him in the gut because he was speechless, and you know, um yeah, what a blessing to be able to share that with him, you know, 30 some years later or whatever it may be. So um, you know, back to your question, I always thought that's what I wanted, and uh that was a turning point in my life where a little more common sense was you know shoved down my throat.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

I like that. And how old were you when he when he did that?

SPEAKER_02 16:07

I don't even know if I was a teenager yet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you know, I was when I was young, I was I was always the young guy. Now I'm the always the old guy. I don't know how that happened, but I used to always be the the young guy in the in the crew, the clique, whatever you want to call it. And uh, you know, you always had to have like an image when you're the young guy, you know, you you want to hang out with these guys, and uh yeah, so I wasn't a teenager yet, and that's when I I, you know, and I still I love that dude to the day, you know. That's great.

SPEAKER_00 16:40

Yeah, so he touched you because like you looked up to him and then he grabbed you and it said you don't have to live like that.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

He basically checked me in a cool way. Yeah, you know, he didn't punk me, but he checked me. And uh even if he did punk me, I accept it because it was it was it was uh something that stuck with me until this day, and I'm I'm glad I'm able to share that. And I hope somebody would do the same to somebody that you know they see, whether they love them or not, they're just going down the wrong path. Like you know.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

So he had like faith in you and he saw that, and then he was like, since you never had like parental guidance and supervision, right? He was somebody that was like maybe a father figure or someone you looked up to that was he was able to like say, Hey, don't go down that path.

SPEAKER_02 17:23

Yeah, exactly. It was uh somebody I looked up to. For sure. Somebody that had value. Yeah, what he said had value to me.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

For sure. Well, there there is a saying, it's attraction rather than promotion. I'm gonna be attracted to somebody and listen to them more than them forcing it down my throat.

SPEAKER_02 17:38

Right, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:39

Right. So you were attracted to him and you were like, I want what you have. Yeah. And you're telling me no, so I'm gonna believe you and follow your follow your lead, right?

SPEAKER_02 17:46

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 17:48

Okay, so what what do you why do you think you stayed as long as you did and in in that environment? And was it a sense of a community? Was it was or were you just scared to leave that lifestyle?

SPEAKER_02 18:01

So, you know, I can't talk for every uh, you know, every scenario with people out there that grow up in these environments. You know, I think it's uh you know, different parts of the country, different states, everything is is done differently. At the end of the day, we can all relate to each other, though. Just it's the same uh a little bit of a different recipe, but it always seems to cook up the same. And um, yeah, I mean, it's just the environment, again, I mean, I didn't think I would ever get away from it. And it's not like uh the environment I come from, it was more we have big families. So my family, my my core family, everybody was around my age, and my cousins and everybody, like, they all like the same thing. We all like the same thing. So, like, why would you leave? When we're you know, like this is your culture, this is what you're supposed to do. Um so, you know, like being in a gang environment, sometimes you're forced into it, you know, because again, every I feel like every state has a south side, every state has uh has an east side, or every town, I should say. So it depends on what side of town you are, who you're gonna get along with and who you might not get along with. Um and my family, my dad's family, grew up on the south side. So, you know, I didn't think anything different as a kid. We just all hung out and all that. And next thing you know, we're beefing with other sides of town. And again, I was I didn't even really know why, but again, it goes back to generations. This is something we inherited. We didn't inherit the old car, we didn't inherit a house, we didn't inherit a set of books, encyclopedias. We inherited street beef. So, you know, I just didn't know anything different. Now all of a sudden, these guys on the side of town don't like us. Well, and it always comes, seems to fall back on a girl, too, you know. I mean, yeah, you know, women always seem to know how to brew some things up, you know. Um, and you know, so you get one girl that's on one side of town and she messes around with the guy on the other side of the town. Next thing you know, two guys that should probably just talk it out and say, hey, are we really fighting over this girl? Instead, you got the whole crew gets involved and everybody's excited, and you know, um, yeah, that's just that was just the the norm. So it it was uh uh a bad environment, but again, it was just it was like normal. Again, I I I go back to my father. I can remember I had a a cousin, but his family, his core family was from the other side of town, you know, and I don't even know nothing about gangs, I don't know anything about hustling. I'm just pretty much an innocent. There was a time I was innocent. Yeah, it was a small window, yeah. And um, I can remember being at the house, it was like a Saturday morning or something, we wake up, and not knowing really me and this guy that I'm close to, we probably shouldn't even be getting along based on our family's histories. All of a sudden, I remember I can just remember this one guy comes in, and he's gotta be in his 30s, and I'm, you know, still maybe a teenager at this point, maybe not. And um he starts talking real loud and he starts mentioning this these words, and these words are affiliated with a gang. And I didn't realize at that time he was basically letting me know that I wasn't welcome there. He knew who my family was, and he wanted to basically mark his territory, which is kind of sad because I was just a kid, you know. But um, I guess that's when I started. To know the difference in what we're inherited in the route, what the future looked like at that time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

Wow. Okay. So let's talk about the culture of the gang environment. What do people misunderstand about how hard it is to leave that lifestyle? Since you said it's like, you know, you're kind of born into it. Are you able to like you know, is it is it like everyone's kind of inherited, like you were saying? You know, is is it like everyone's kind of stuck there because their side of the family's this, you know, lives in this neighborhood or whatever? Is it is it like that? Like you're kind of inherited into Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:38

Basically, like you said, it's uh it's not like uh, you know, joining the army and you know, deciding at the boot camp or during boot camp, you're like, yeah, this ain't for me. Yeah, you know, this is uh oh man, I you know, I can remember, you know, um the environment I grew up in, anything could happen. Like I think you and I had a conversation when you park somewhere, you always back in. I know you're doing back. To me, like that's amazing. Like, I like how not too many people think that way, you know, and it's kind of sad that we do think that way, but uh, you just never know when something's gonna you want to spend that split second trying to figure out how to back up when stuff's flying around and people are getting injured. Um so yeah, I mean it's it's it's hard when you're it's your family. And you know, nine times out of ten, most of these environments it is family, it's inherited, and you know, anything can go on. I can remember being at a grocery store. Normal human beings work the whole their day, they're with their families, their kids, they're buying groceries, probably struggling, however, to make ends meet. Then all of a sudden you got, you know, somebody that I'm with, all of a sudden they're just knocking somebody out in the line. And it's just like, whoa, what happened? Next thing you know, it's crazy, right? So, you know, those scenarios, you just uh again, it just makes it challenging. And it's usually your family. So, you know, my culture, family's a big thing. You know, uh, and it was like, oh, you're you you you're talking about my cousin? What's up, man? You're gonna fight, and then all of a sudden your other cousins get involved and sucker punching somebody, and part of it's fun to you at that time. Sure, right. You know, you're having fun, and then you think you're y'all, you know, you go home and tell the the the adults, yeah, well, I have my cousin's back, and you know, and they're like, you know, sometimes saying, Yeah, man, you know, like encouraging it. Yeah, yeah. So um, again, it's I can't speak for every uh gang environment or people's choices, but you know, mine is like there's more of a family, and uh, you know, that's you're supposed to. And I I think I had this story with somebody as well, like, you know, um, somebody comes to college, goes to college and comes home from the environment that I'm in, and everybody's like, oh, this is sissy, are you nerd? You know what I mean? Like, yeah, you know, you ain't nobody special. You think you're better than us, you know, and that's how they you got treated. Like this guy just went to school for however many years, just graduated, put it in the work, the studying. I mean, nobody would really acknowledge it. Then you got the big homie coming home from prison, you know, they got the band out there, the mariachis are playing, they got, you know, kegs, everybody's having a good time, trying to take pictures, giving them dabs, oh man, you know, like what where's the common sense? Sure, you know, like what environment am I, you know, like so you know, that's it's just it's a challenge for a lot of people to get away.

SPEAKER_00 25:39

Do you think that's because it's like that saying misery loves company, or do you think it's just that they're conditioned that way? I think they're conditioned.

SPEAKER_02 25:47

Yeah, I think they're conditioned. And uh, you know, again, I I grew up in the Detroit area, you know. Um, and I'd never once been to the West Coast in my life. Um, going back to, you know, talking about my youth, uh spring, summer's summer uh break would be over and everybody go back to school. Hey, where did you go? We went, me and my dad went fishing. Oh, my mom and dad took me to Disneyland. Oh, what'd you do? I just uh didn't have to go to school. Uh you know, you know, I didn't get those opportunities, you know. Um, so yeah, it was just uh growing up that way, it's just like you're like you said, conditioned, you know. It's just like you know, that's what you think. Or it's just it's just it's sad, but you know.

SPEAKER_00 26:38

Sure. I mean it's understandable because like we said, that that's what they're learned, right? Yeah, right. You're kind of conditioned to be like, that's the norm, right? I don't know any other way other than you know, adult stuff, adult work, right? That's what I'm conditioned for, you know. Right. So yeah, we're reinventing ourselves today, right?

SPEAKER_02 26:58

But yeah, just like you're saying, that's what you think you're conditioned for. Exactly. But well that's what you've been, the environment you've been in. Most definitely just like yourself, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Yeah, that's what that's what we're learned, we're taught, you know, or you know, whether my I was by choice or not, this is all I know.

SPEAKER_02 27:14

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 27:15

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Did you ever feel like you couldn't leave even if you wanted to? Like, would did you feel like you were gonna let down your family because this is inherited? Do you think they would turn your their back on you?

SPEAKER_02 27:28

Yeah, absolutely. I felt like that. I felt like I never had a choice, like they're gonna look down on me. You know, one sure one thing I a phrase I always heard, you think you're better than, you know, this or that. Like, why can't somebody be better than the next? You know, what's the problem with that? Exactly. So, yeah, I would think I I for a long time I thought, yeah, they're gonna they're gonna turn their backs on me or think I'm soft or whatever. But then you you you know, again, leaning on God and you you get that mindset. Like, who cares what they think? Who cares what anybody thinks? Because you do these things, you know, for other people. And at the end of the day, if if you're alone, who's gonna be there for you? You know? Um, the environment I came up in, I can remember everybody, all the houses had porches, you know, like out here, there's not a lot of porches.

SPEAKER_01 28:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:18

And um everybody would hang out on the porch, be drinking, partying. And I can remember one of my family members, an older family member, um, everybody's just in La La Land talking about whatever. And the older family member that's supposed to be like uh supposed to be giving us good advice, right? Says, where am I gonna go? What am I gonna do? And that stuck with me. Like, what do you mean? Like, there's so much in life, yeah. I I don't know because I've never experienced it, but I know there's so much more to life than just sitting on this porch and drinking beers and smoking weed and waiting for who's gonna drive by, you know. Um, so that was that clicked in my head. Then I started to get the mindset of I don't really care what these people think anymore. You know, just because you're blood with somebody, it it doesn't mean you're the same person. You know, it doesn't mean you come from the same cloth, even though you have the same blood. And again, I go back to God. Um, I was a teenage father, you know. I had a son, I should have had my own. My joke is I should have had my own teen mom show way back in the day. I missed that, you know, I missed that bag, but um I think God I had kids and I think it was God's way of t slowing me down. I I honestly do.

SPEAKER_00 29:41

For sure. Nothing happens by accident, right?

SPEAKER_02 29:44

Yeah, yeah. It uh it definitely slowed me down and made me realize what was important, and the important part was not watching them grow up the way I grew up. I didn't want to do that to them, you know. That would make me less of a man. That wouldn't make me well, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that I left them or put them in a situation that I grew up in because it was one of the worst feelings.

SPEAKER_00 30:09

Yeah, so so you're saying like before you were a teenager, your cousin, right, told you you don't have to live like that, and then you heard your the the other person say, What about me? Like, what's left for me, right? How old were you then where it clicked where you were like, I want I want something better?

SPEAKER_02 30:27

I think one of the the the click was the common sense where I was able to to dissect what was just said, which I don't think everybody else around me did. Sure. And I felt like it was negative. And again, I didn't even know the word negative back then or what it meant. Yeah, but I just felt like that was something that I don't feel like like you where where's your hope? Where's your your faith? Yeah, you know, like there is way more than you know to life, you know. I don't know, I didn't know exactly what it looked like, but I knew there was more.

SPEAKER_00 30:55

But how old were you when that happened?

SPEAKER_02 30:57

Uh that I was probably early teens. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:01

Okay, so the seed was planted by your cousin, right? And then like throughout throughout the years, you're like, uh, not cool, not cool. I don't want to.

SPEAKER_02 31:11

My father, that was the first seed, then my cousin, and then having that, I was able to to recognize what somebody said. And I mean, uh you're gonna hear me talk about teens because I I I moved so fast. My life is super fast, you know. Um, and so much happened in that in that time frame, yeah, as a a young innocent kid to a teenager.

SPEAKER_00 31:35

Yes, you know. So, yeah, that takes us to another topic. The masculinity and the gang culture. What did being a man mean in that environment?

SPEAKER_02 31:44

I mean, it meant everything. Like, you know, if somebody called you a b, that was those were terms, you have to fight them. You know, you just have to fight them. And, you know, it's uh it's you know, it's just it's silly thinking, you know, or there's girls around, and oh now you look like a chump, you know what I mean? So the masculinity was always there. And again, when you're in that environment, you know, you want to be the tough guy, you want to be the the alpha male, you want to be all that, right? Um, so yeah, that's that's another part. And it hey, let me tell you, I'd be honest with you, like I I knew a lot, I grew up with a lot of bad motherfuckers that are buried right now because they they were bad motherfuckers. And um there's always somebody out there better. And I know I mean half a dozen people just jumped right out of my head right now that I've totally forgot about in life. But they were the probably the toughest guys of where I come from, and uh they're no longer here. So, you know, what's that tell you?

SPEAKER_00 32:47

Yeah. What's the definition of being a man today?

SPEAKER_02 32:52

Oh wow, there's so many different for me. Health and wealth jumps out at me because that's something I pray about. You know, as long as I have my health, I should be able to get whatever. Um, and again, that's another blessing of coming up from the streets and learning how to survive. Um But yeah, being a man is taking care of your family. Um keeping whatever in your heart that is is true, you know, whether it's God or whatever religion you choose, um, you know, being successful for not only yourself, but you know, if you have family for them as well. And you know, not everybody is blessed to have a relationship with somebody. So if you can be in a relationship with somebody and be transparent, be um be honest, loyal, and just share that with somebody. I feel like that makes you a man and a better man as well.

SPEAKER_00 33:54

Sure. Okay. Um I want to hear about the psychological impact. How did that environment shape the way you think, react, or trust people today?

SPEAKER_02 34:07

You you're referring to the environment I grew up in. Yeah, I mean, I don't trust anybody, you know. Like to be honest with you, it's hard to trust anybody, you know. It's uh people let you down, you know. Sure. And uh I'm I'm big on communication, you know. If I communicate with you, and I'm not perfect. I don't get me wrong, I didn't come here to gloat or act like I'm perfect. I mean, I'm I'm pretty close, but but uh you know, but if you point something out to me, I don't I don't want to cut you off. Explain to me what you what your issue is with me. Let me reciprocate, let me acknowledge, let me correct it. You know, that's part of being a man. Sure. It's part of common sense. So, you know, I'm big on that now. That's something that I've I've that's a tool that I've learned, you know, and I I hope everybody can learn it faster than than I did because I wasted a lot of time and energy and emotions on a lot of things that were necessary.

SPEAKER_00 35:09

Yeah, okay. How about uh did you have to learn unlearn certain behaviors to function in a different world?

SPEAKER_02 35:18

Yeah, absolutely. Again, coming from a tough guy, you know, a tough guy um background or era where you you know you always gotta man up, but you who are you manning up for? If you can sleep at night, and that's all that really matters, and I'll give you a perfect example, like road rage, right? We see it all the time out here, it's super violent. And I was going somewhere, Sky cuts me off, and I'm like, I'm just I'm wigging out, I'm tripping, I'm like pull over, I'm on his ass, you know. The next thing you know, he starts going back at me, you know what I mean? And I'm like, okay, this is about to get real. And you know, he rolls down his window, and it just hit me. I was like, because I'm in my car because I'm on my way to go see my granddaughter be born. I'm on my way to the hospital to go see my first grandchild be born, and I'm over here acting the fool for what? Just because this dude cut me off and we both caught catch the same red light. So I rode down the window, he rolls down his window, and I was like, yo, what's up, motherfucking? Pull over, you know, let's let's go. And uh then I looked at him, and then he had his girl in the car, and she looks terrified. And I said, you know what? I said, I'll be honest with you, my fault. I'm sorry. Go ahead. Hope you guys have a safe day. Be blessed. So that to me was like, Yeah, you know, like I just I mean, for what, why do you want to carry those emotions and those anger? Like, what's it gonna what are you gonna accomplish? What are you gonna win? I might have gotten shot in the chest, I might have never even seen my grandchild be born. Um, so you know, it's just uh being able to slow down and again, maybe he punked me that day, you know, to be honest with you, but hey, I'm here, I'm with Ava Devine, I'm on the podcast, like life's great.

SPEAKER_00 37:31

I like it. So so basically you had a personality change, right? That's what it's called. How did you get to that point though? Because like, how do you unhinge old beliefs, old values, old reactions? How do you how do you do that?

SPEAKER_02 37:50

I mean, I almost feel like I don't know if you're referring to like my time as my transition from like a teenager to a uh teenage father, or because honestly, like we're always working on ourselves, even to this day, even to this day, like what I've experienced the last 10 years of my life has made me the best, in my opinion, the best person I could ever be. And what changed me was again, I'm gonna say that God did this for a reason. He put somebody in my life that pointed out things that I didn't I was unaware that I was doing. And the things I was doing embarrassed me, they don't make sense, and when I got called out, because nobody's ever called me out, I had to reflect on who I am, what I'm doing in life. Maybe I am wrong, you know. Um so I'm like again, I'm still you still work on becoming a better person, but again, I'll go back to the my time as a a juvenile as a youngin', um, it was my kids. That was the point where I was like, I gotta do what's right, you know, I gotta I gotta take care of these kids, you know? And um I didn't want them to go through what I went through, you know.

SPEAKER_00 39:14

Yeah. So that was your motivation. Yeah. Okay. Well, what has been the hardest part of adjusting to a different life now that you live a different life? Right? What is the hardest part about adjusting to that?

SPEAKER_02 39:31

You know, i it's just like that that road rage incident, you know? It was hard to accept. You know? Um I could go out on a date and I feel like I have to check my environment. I feel like I gotta man up if something's about to, like, it's it's you you never lose that, you know, but at the same time, you sometimes it's unnecessary. You don't really need that. Like enjoy the moment, enjoy, you know. Like, yeah, you might look like a fool out there dancing, but you're happy. The person that you're with is happy, you know. You might go to a uh a concert that you wouldn't ever think you'd be at in a million years. There's no reason to act like a tough guy there. You know, like enjoy the moment, enjoy who you're with, find something good out of it, and that's that's basically where I'm at now. That's the challenge, is trying to dissect that sometimes. You know, sometimes I'll see some gangsters walking up on me and I just don't pay it no mind anymore. I don't I don't give it the energy or the time, you know. I mean, probably because I'm too old now, too. But yeah, I know what they're about. I can just see it in their eyes. I can see it in their tattoos. I know what they're about, and I just now I just don't even pay attention, you know. I just I'm in my own world. It could be in the in the gym, you know, whatever it may be. I just I stay in my lane, stay in my and it's sometimes it's hard, it's challenging, you know. Yeah. But um, you know, I could sleep at night like a champ, so I'm not worried.

SPEAKER_00 41:06

See, I like that. So, because I have a question. Um, you know, like for I'll speak for myself, right? I only know how to hustle, right? So it's like, um, what does hustling entail? Well, in the past, it used to entail a lot of manipulation and lying, right? Right? Lying, cheating, and stealing, right? That's the life I used to live. How did you like, right? Because you said you were hustling too, right? As a youngster. Absolutely. How do you deal with that to in your business today? Like, how do you for me, it's like I choose not to lie, cheat, and steal anymore. Because for me, it brings me down a really dark path. And I don't like living like that. I don't like being paranoid, looking over the back of my shoulder. I don't like eyes behind my head. Like, how did you how do how do you take that mentality and bring it to business now?

SPEAKER_02 42:02

Well, let me acknowledge where you what you've overcome. So, congratulations on that. Because you're absolutely right. You don't want to look over, look around, like the stuff that you did, the reward was never big enough.

SPEAKER_00 42:15

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 42:16

So, but you don't see that when you're you know when you're caught, when you're lost in the sauce, when you're caught up in whatever you want to call it. Um so yeah, congratulations on that. Um, you know, again, I I go, I I again I didn't come here to preach no, but this is your experience. But you're a godly woman. I don't know if you're aware of that or not, but you're a godly woman and you bring that out in me. Like you really do. So thank you for that. Like you really do. Like, I don't go around every day speaking on God or talking about God. I pray, I do pray, but you know, since I've had a few conversations with you, it's it's it's really you really bring it out on me. And that could be why he he gave me the opportunity to, you know, be here and speak with you. But you know, I think everything I I come, I graduated from the same school as you, school of hard knocks. And everything that I was taught, put in a position, led me up to exactly where I'm at right now in life. And everything that I've learned, my craft, my gift to gab, my gift to be able to switch gears, a chameleon. I can turn into whoever's sitting right next to me. You know, whether you're a gangbanger, whether you went to Harvard, whether you're an actress, I can find some kind of common ground. And that's from being gift to gab, talking fast, and hustling, you just gotta put it in. You gotta take that tool that you learned, take that energy, and go hard in with whatever you're doing. You know, whether you're, you know, you're in sales, whether whatever your line of work is, you use that, and that's what God blessed me with, and that's where I'm at today. And what I've been doing for the last 10 plus years has given me the opportunity to meet some really great people, put me in some really good positions that I would probably never have, especially if I thought like the person on the porch, or if I thought like the person that got his wrist grabbed, I wouldn't have met the people I met. I would have never had the opportunity to meet you. So, you know, it's it's been another blessing.

SPEAKER_00 44:31

Yeah, for sure. It's like for me, it's like making a taking a chocolate double fattening cake and make it like a lighter side. Right. Without the manipulation, without the lying, without the cheating, without the stealing. And it's, you know, it may not be chalk full, and it may not turn out as quick, quickly as the fat calorie, you know, dense cake, but it's still great. Right. And I have longevity with the sugar-free or the layer, right? I gotta talk about food because I love chocolate and sugar.

SPEAKER_02 45:07

But yeah, but you know what I mean? No, absolutely. Totally relate. And hey, I got a sweet tooth too.

SPEAKER_00 45:13

So we're sugar-free chocolate cake in a little bit. Now we're gonna talk about the reinvention. This is the core theme of this episode. What does reinvention actually look like in real life? Not the version people post online.

SPEAKER_02 45:31

Hmm. Reinvention. What do you exactly mean by that?

SPEAKER_00 45:36

Well, what do I mean is that, like, what does the way you reinvented your life, you know, how does it look like? Because a lot of people post online, oh, I'm partying like rock stars at the at the club and and all this. How does reinvention look like in in real life to you without social media? Uh if you're not on social media, like what does your real life look like?

SPEAKER_02 45:58

Yeah, I would say currently the reinvention for me is um I am on social media, um, but you know, I feel like social media is for certain things. Sure. Um, you know, I don't go on there and you know drop verses from the Bible or, you know, or you know, say what people should do. And I don't, you know, get involved in politics online. I don't, you know, um, you know, I feel like it has a purpose for certain things. And the reinvention, what it looks like for me now, on everything I've experienced in life, I would go back to what I've experienced the last decade. And the reinvention for me is to be able to, I guess, love and respect yourself first. I reinvented myself by putting together a few tools to control emotion. And uh emotion is such a strong word, and I don't because it could be anger, it can be sadness, it can be so many other things, but just that one word, emotions, like if you can't control any of those, it's really hard for you to be successful in life. It's really hard for you to be healthy. So thank God that I was able to experience this reinvention, and you know, all I can hope for is to continue to have God in my heart, continue to reciprocate, continue to listen to people, whether it's a relationship, whether it's work, whatever it may be. Like you, you some people just hear you, they don't listen to you. You know what I mean? Like, so you just gotta be able to uh you gotta be able to control your emotions and you gotta have faith. And I feel like you've you've personally met the best version of me. Like you really have, um, and it's it's been part of this rein reinventing myself that I was unaware of. But I'm I'm happy where I'm at, I'm proud of where I'm at, and I feel like uh God has good plans, big plans for me, and he set me up for success. Not sure why he put me through the you know the bumpy road that I traveled, but you know, I'm here now and just gonna enjoy life and uh continue to do things that are gonna make me happy and be successful in whatever way that looks like.

SPEAKER_00 48:31

Sure. Okay, and also being a teen dad, how does your fatherhood look today?

SPEAKER_02 48:37

Wow, that's a really tough question. Not really tough. It it like it hurts me a little bit, you know? And I know, like, I mean, you know, I I feel it. Maybe I was supposed to come on here and be a tough guy and tell everybody, hey man, you can you don't have to be a tough guy, you can reinvent yourself like Ava and I. But um, you know, we still gotta have feelings, you still gotta be a person, right? And uh, yeah, I mean, today I'm I'm I'm blessed. My kids, they all love me. And uh, I wouldn't say they ever they didn't never love me, but I don't know, I don't think my mother was taught how to raise. Um I know my father never was, so I can't knock them not raising me properly or doing things that they could have done differently, but it it it it uh bled down to me on how I fathered as a I didn't have no book, I had no guidance, and all I knew was, I know a lot of people don't like this, but tough love. That's all I knew was tough love, and it's more like almost like you gotta punk somebody to get your point across, and that's no way to parent. Um so I I think my kids were like I I had zero tolerance for a lot of things, I was super strict, um, but you know, today's different, you know. They were teenagers when I went through a divorce, and they just like any other kid, we're normal, you know. It's just the story isn't, you know, it's mom loves me, she wants to do these things for me. On dad. Oh now mom's doing too much. Let's go back to dad. Not gonna shit on mom. I experienced that firsthand, it's real, but I get it. They're just kids, I don't knock it. Um it was uh it was a good experience for me to take that as a lesson as well, things I was doing wrong. But today, today, I I have my you know great relationship with my kids. Um, you know, my oldest son, you know, I don't we're only 15 years apart, you know, so it's like when people see us together, like there's no way that's your kid. Are you kidding me? I thought he was older than you. Um, I get that occasionally, and um he went through a lot, probably mentally and physically, from me. But again, I thought I was doing what was right, what was best for him. And he actually punched me in the gut or in the mouth one time and just came out of nowhere. He's kind of a quiet kid, and he came out of nowhere and he said, he thanked me, you know. He's like, I want to thank you for everything you've done for me. Um, you know, it got me to where I'm at today. I wouldn't be the person I am today, and you know, it was just the discipline that I, you know, put on him. I wanted him to be successful. I didn't, you know, nobody wants their kids to struggle in life, you know. So um, you know, thank goodness uh I have that relationship with him now. Um, you know, my other son, I was really hard on him as well. He's a multiple state champ in wrestling. Um he's really driven, he's a hard worker, he's um, you know, got promotion after promotion, had to relocate. He's doing really well. Um my daughter is um, you know, a great mother. She's doing something that you know she enjoys right now to have a career in. So I'm happy for her that she's able to do that. So yeah, right now I I I could still do more. I could still do more, but I feel great on the relationship I have with them. So I like that.

SPEAKER_00 52:27

But well, since I'm listening intently, Joseph, to your story, you know, it did sound like, you know, when you said when your dad would call you from prison and you were always like irritated and like not enthused about talking to him, right? Because he would always scold you and school you, right? Right. I think you passed that on to your kids too, right? Wow.

SPEAKER_02 52:50

Well, thank you for listening to me, Ava. Yes, it shows that you have passion for your podcast. You know, you really do. You could just be asking me some things just to ask me what people want to hear, but you're actually listening to me and you're you're relating to my story, and I think nobody's ever said that to me.

SPEAKER_00 53:09

But isn't it true, right? Yeah, yeah, because I learned a lot, good or bad, from my family. Yeah, you know, I I picked up a lot of their traits, and it's just normal because once again, we're as we discussed, it's learned behavior, right? Right? But today I could break the cycle with the negative stuff, yeah, right? Yeah, okay. So here's another question. This is a good one. All right. How do you rebuild your identity from the ground up? How do you take the gang environment, hustler, you know, uh prison enthusiast to who you are today?

SPEAKER_02 53:50

How what do you mean, how do you take it?

SPEAKER_00 53:52

How do you how do you change from that, you know, that, you know, uh being involved in the gang environment, hustling, watching people, you know, whoop each other's butts because they punked you or whatever, to a pro productive member of society who's calm, cool, and collective and wanting to go to prison. How do you change that? How do you rebuild that is the question?

SPEAKER_02 54:16

I mean, it's not easy. You know, I think you gotta uh you gotta definitely watch your environment, put yourself around people that you know that you maybe you look up to, maybe somebody that you uh you appreciate what they say, you know, they they hold some value. Um, but you also gotta want it. You know, you gotta want it. So that's again the common sense part. Now, I don't, you know, it's it's sad, but not everybody's blessed with that. For sure. You know, but yeah, I mean, to reinvent yourself, you you gotta uh you have to um definitely surround yourself around the right people. Again, I think if you have a uh a relationship with God, he's gonna help you as well. Um, but yeah, just definitely uh you you gotta want it, you know. You you gotta want more. Uh, you know, I I again I I I watch you, you know, there's things that you have because you wanted it, you know, you wanted it, you put in the work, you put in the time, and that's what it's all about, you know. Like you just you gotta want it. You gotta separate yourself from negativity, and you gotta whatever lane you're in and whatever you're trying to accomplish, you just gotta close mouths, don't get fed, right? So if you're just gonna sit around and think that you can't, you you gotta put in the effort.

SPEAKER_00 55:36

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 55:36

So like the willingness, the willingness, absolutely, yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 55:39

Because I always have willingness, right?

SPEAKER_02 55:41

And I don't know if you can that can be taught, you know.

SPEAKER_00 55:43

I don't know. I can't. It can't be purchased, it can't be faked. It's like within your heart, it's in your heart, either you're willing or you're not, right? Right. Right.

SPEAKER_02 55:53

And you know, with me, I think it was my kids that, you know. So that was your motivation? That was the motivation. Um, and then again, becoming a better man, you know, just you you put that recipe together and it's you're you're bound to be successful, you know.

SPEAKER_00 56:08

So it sounds like your cousin planted the seed at a young age and then you had the willingness to carry that out, right?

SPEAKER_02 56:14

Right? So all these people that I've crossed paths with, I only got like what was that three people that actually affected my thought process, actually encouraged me, inspired me, inspired me. I mean, that's not a lot.

SPEAKER_00 56:30

That's all it takes. That's all it takes, right? Because the willingness is there, right? Yeah, yeah. Um, what would you say to someone who feels stuck in that life? And and I'm not talking about the gangbart, I'm talking about in a life of negativity or a life that you know they feel that they deserve better. Okay, let's let's say what what would you say to someone who feels stuck in that life but doesn't see a way out?

SPEAKER_02 56:59

Oh, that's a good question, Ava. That's a really good one because you know, I uh I personally have had doors shut, you know, to me. Like there's people, you know, you you go to somebody for help. So not everybody's willing to help you. Um so you know, to uh to overcome things, it and you know you don't have any support or anything like that. I mean, it it's challenging, you know, it's challenging. But all you gotta do is you you really gotta want something. You just gotta put the time, the effort, whatever that looks like, and what you're trying to accomplish, um, you know, to move forward in life. I just uh it's it's just it's gotta be, it's it's the willing part again, right?

SPEAKER_00 57:42

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Okay, but what would you say to someone who feels stuck? Find the willingness.

SPEAKER_02 57:49

The old me would say, man up. Rub some dirt on it, you know what I'm saying? Quit crying like a man. You can, but you know, I uh now I would probably say, you know, find help, find direction, whatever that looks like, you know, uh reach out to people. There's resources now. Yes, you know, we have all kinds of tools within our phone, right? When we were growing up, you gotta go to the to the library. You gotta go to the yellow pages, you gotta go to the library and pull the thing out and find which book was gonna help you. You know, now it's instant. Yeah, so there's always a way.

SPEAKER_00 58:26

I like it. Okay. All right. Um, what was one belief you had back then that you now realize wasn't true?

SPEAKER_02 58:33

At that time, back then, I believed that this is it. This is all, this is all, this is it, this is what I'm my life's gonna be. This is the environment. This is again just a matter of time till whatever happens, happens. Um but I realized now that was totally wrong. Totally wrong. And super lucky in life now, super blessed. I surround myself. I don't have a I don't have a big circle. When I say circle, people some people feel like they have to have a lot of friends, a lot of people around them. I don't need that. I found peace in myself. I'm really content on being alone, which I've never thought I'd be able to say because I grew up a big family around a lot of people, but I enjoy that and it's peaceful to me. So now I only put myself around people that motivate me, that encourage me. Um, and that's what you have to do, you know.

SPEAKER_00 59:30

So you're more selective.

SPEAKER_02 59:31

Very selective. That's a great word. Yeah, right? You know the English language very well.

SPEAKER_00 59:37

Thank you. I like definitions, I like looking up things, but yeah. So basically, you know, I I feel like uh it's no more about survival, it's more about surviving striving and thriving, huh? Striving and thriving.

SPEAKER_02 59:52

Yeah, I like that. That's good. Yeah, it's uh definitely, and it's no more about survival. But you know, you still gotta survive, you know. That's why we're here today. We're we're working, right? We're trying to constantly grow ourselves and better ourselves today, you know? Yeah, um, so yeah, it's always still about survival and but in a better survival.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:12

Well, exactly, because there's a difference. Like, I don't want to just survive. That's like that's like me swimming and like flapping so I don't drown. I want to like thrive and strive. Like, that's the way I want to live. I want to like excel, not like barely get by, you know, like because I'm trying to keep my head above water, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:29

And and I and I think that's more rewarding, more exciting. For sure. It's more comforting. It's it's you get to a certain stage in your life, a certain age where that's that means so much more than again. I think I've heard you talk about other things in episodes about money and chasing this and that. Like you realize none of that really doesn't really matter, you know?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:52

Like, um it matters, but right, it's just more life.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:56

It's just like if for some odd reason you took me to Hawaii, right? I could uh open the window and be like, oh my god, this is the most beautiful. I'm in paradise. But does that really matter when you're around the right person? They're helping you strive, you know, it's it's just it's just different. That's a great scenery, but real life is having that exactly what you're what you're doing.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:23

You can you can take me to Hawaii. I'll come along. Okay, okay. Um, okay, so here's another question. Um, if a young man is listening to this and thinks that the that lifestyle is the only way, what would you want him to understand?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:41

Oh, that's it's tough to tell somebody that's young because a lot of young people enjoy that lifestyle. It's it's fun to them, you know, until they find out the hard way. Um, I I can just hope and you know, you know, when I was in my early 20s, um when I mentioned doors being shut, I personally wanted to go to juvenile prisons, youth facilities, and talk to these kids. Because half of those kids grew up like me. They grew up with their fathers in prison, and they wouldn't allow me. They it was like they didn't take me seriously. I and I didn't want no money, I was gonna do it for free, you know, because I felt like if I could help one kid feel better or think differently, then it would be rewarding to me. So sometimes even though you want to do something different, you don't always have the support. And I think for young kids now that enjoy being in that environment because it's it's when you're young, it's fun. You got you know, you got some money, you got some cool clothes, you got the girls that like you, um, because you got like this status, but when it's all said and done and you're gone and you're alone and nobody's around and the party's over and the music stops, that's when reality sets in. And um all I can say is enjoy what you're doing. I know life goes fast, but you know, I didn't think I would be here today um blessed to share my story. I didn't really know my story even mattered, but now I do know that it does because so many people can relate, and I just hope they can uh realize maybe sooner or faster, or if they don't accept what they're going through, know God has a plan for them, and if they really want that, if they really want a different lifestyle, it'll it'll come to them, they'll get it.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:45

Yeah, well, maybe you could plant the seed for that youngster and grab him by his collarances. You deserve better.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:51

I would love to do that. I would love to grab a kid by his neck and say, Man, yeah, but you're saying is silly, man. And but I I relate because I used to be that silly guy too. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:02

Well, we can look it up in the yellow page. Yellow pages. If there's any uh your fans are Googling yellow pages, what's exactly what yeah, we can look it up. Maybe you could you could do that as for volunteer work.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:15

I uh you know, and I would it would be it'd be rewarding to me because yeah, I mean it's fun, you know. Kind of a shame though, like you know, that somebody wouldn't allow somebody that's willing to help kids. I mean, like, who better to talk to teenage kids than me?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:28

Well, there there probably are some organizations we could look up and stuff. Oh, you'd help me with that? Of course. Because you're taking me to Hawaii on the plane.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:37

Is there a juvenile facility in Hawaii? Maybe we can write it off.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:40

That's likely. Okay. All right, so so now, Joseph, since you are on my podcast, we need to hear your bad advice. The fans are asking about Joseph's bad advice. Okay, here's question number one. Did you ever feel like you were too far in to change or that it was already too late for you? Absolutely. You did, absolutely. Yeah, tell us about that.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:05

I like I told you, I um that incident with my cousin checking me at that time in my life. I thought I was already super invested. You know, I thought I was too too far in. Um, you know, thank goodness that wasn't true. But yeah, I mean, absolutely. It's hard not to think that you know, it's just like people that are, you know, in cages at the moment. The time just stops. It's it's slow, you know, everything slows down. You're living that fast life, you're doing this, you're doing that. Now everything is slow.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:38

And um in cages, you mean jail? In jail, yeah, yeah. I'm sorry. That's okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:42

But yeah, they, you know, when you get that reality check, things start to slow down on you, you know. And uh, you know, yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:51

Okay. All right, here's another question. What's something about that lifestyle that people glamorize, but you know, is actually really dark? Or damage.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:02

I think uh the um they glamorize materialistic things. I mean I mean me hearing the the guy in all Gucci suit talking about materialistic things, but that's what's glamorized. And you're spending your a majority of your life trying to get these things, right? Um But at the end of the day, whatever you did or however you went about getting it that wasn't the right way is the the other side of it. You know, looking behind your shoulder, you touched on it. You know, you got that quick whatever you needed, but now you gotta worry about this, that sure, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:40

Or the lies I gotta keep up. What I tell this person, what I say, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:44

So sometimes the glitz and glamour isn't all what it's looks like. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's the the other side. And you and I both know a lot of people that have a lot, but they're empty or they're missing something, right? Sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:59

I Lord knows I tried.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:02

Okay. Uh, do you think anyone can change, or do you think people get stuck in that life for good? That's the last question. What do you think?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:11

I think it's a 50-50, really, you know. I think uh I think everybody can change, but I don't think everybody's capable of changing. Or they they have the willingness. The willingness, willingness, common sense, you know, uh, you know, whatever it may be. I mean, I grew up with a lot of people my age that let their kids down over and over, you know. Um so yeah, I think that's a 50-50. Uh again, I think if you just have God in your heart and you it might only take one person to change your life, you know. That's right. So you can have a small circle, but just make sure you get in with the right people.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:50

I like it.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:51

Well, thank you, Joseph, for being on my up on my podcast or being on this episode.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:56

Well, thank you, and and congrats on everything that you're working on. You look amazing. Thank you, Sony. I'm so excited to see your new reinvent of you. I think you're gonna crush it, and uh I'm excited for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:10

All right, thank you. Well, let me wrap this up. Okay, that wraps up another episode of Ave Divine's Bad Advice. So here's my bad advice for all. For all who's watching and listening, you are not a product of your environment. Reinvention is possible, and if there's a will, the willingness, there is a way. And also, victimization will keep me sick. I am responsible to heal from my past. Thank you for letting me share over and out. I sit down with Kita, a former 90s supermodel. We hear her experience in the industry, how it led her into addiction, partying, and eventually sex work.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:56

Thank you so much for having me. This is just a wonderful, wonderful topic. I think it's super important for many women and people to hear. It's always a personal journey.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:07

We talk about the loneliness behind the lifestyle, the myths about beauty, money, and validation, and how easy it is to lose yourself chasing an image that was never real to begin with.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:20

The loneliness that we feel, the more fame you have, the more isolated you feel and you become. I don't really want to go down that path of the Playboy path. There are so many people who have had success stories in all professions, and that's what I love, and that's why there's so much hope. If you're suffering right now, you don't have to suffer. There is a way out.