Body Dysmorphia, Plastic Surgery & The Search for Self-worth with Kimber James

Today, I sit down with Kimber James for a deeply honest conversation about body dysmorphia, plastic surgery, identity, self-image, and the lifelong search to feel comfortable in your own skin. From growing up feeling disconnected from her body and being relentlessly bullied as a child, to navigating transition, fame, beauty standards, and the pressures of the adult industry, Kimber opens up about the emotional complexity behind transformation, self-expression, and the need to feel accepted.

Kimber reflects on childhood bullying, gender identity, eating disorders, dysmorphia, and the pressure to conform to impossible standards of beauty. Together, we unpack the emotional reality behind cosmetic surgery, the shame society places on women and trans women for altering their appearance, and the painful truth that changing the outside does not always heal what is happening internally. What looks glamorous or empowering from the outside can often come from a much deeper place of insecurity, survival, loneliness, or the need for control.

As the conversation unfolds, Kimber speaks candidly about transitioning in the adult industry, living through botched surgeries and medical complications, appearing on *Botched*, addiction to change, social media pressures, relationships, and the exhausting cycle of constantly trying to “fix” yourself. We also explore self-worth, aging, healing, internal validation, and the difficult process of learning how to sit with yourself in a world that profits from making people feel inadequate.

In this episode, you’ll learn:
How Body Dysmorphia Begins in Childhood
How Bullying and Shame Impact Identity and Self-Worth
How Beauty Standards Shape the Way We See Ourselves
How Plastic Surgery Can Become an Emotional Coping Mechanism
How Transitioning in the Adult Industry Creates Unique Pressures
How Social Media Intensifies Comparison and Dissatisfaction
How Cosmetic Surgery Can Shift From Enhancement to Obsession
How Health Complications Change Your Relationship With Your Body
How Trauma, Relationships, and Insecurity Affect Self-Image
How Self-Acceptance Is a Lifelong Process, Not a Destination

If there’s one thing to take away from this episode, it’s this: changing your appearance may temporarily change how you feel, but it will never fully heal the parts of yourself that feel unloved, unseen, or unworthy. Real healing begins internally.

Sending you all so much love,
Ava Devine

What We Discuss:
00:00 Intro
00:42 The Disconnect Between Body and Identity
01:35 Feeling Different Since Childhood
03:22 Bullying, Shame, and Growing Up Androgynous
05:14 Transitioning and Hyper-Feminine Beauty Standards
06:41 Dolly Parton, Beauty Ideals, and Wanting Transformation
07:40 “I’ve Always Hated How I Look”
08:37 Botched Surgeries and Health Complications
09:25 Misconceptions About Transitioning and Attention
10:57 Beauty Standards, Judgment, and Public Cruelty
11:41 Living in a Constant State of Dysmorphia
12:37 Depression, Surgery, and the Need for Control
13:19 Chasing Trends and Social Media Validation
14:07 Plastic Surgery, Obsession, and Self-Control
15:05 Eating Disorders and Childhood Trauma
16:37 Generational Beauty Standards and Learned Dysmorphia
17:27 Why Society Judges Women No Matter What
18:17 Feeling Like a Target for Looking “Overdone”
19:00 The Difference Between Enhancement and Fixing Yourself
20:39 Behind the Scenes of *Botched*
22:16 Multiple Surgeries, Complications, and Recovery
24:32 Vaginoplasty, Reconstruction, and Medical Advances
25:28 Does Reality TV Help or Exploit People?
26:58 Representing the Trans Community Publicly
27:49 Wanting Surgery to Create Acceptance and Love
29:19 Why Plastic Surgery Became Part of Identity
30:03 Can Cosmetic Surgery Ever Be Healthy?
31:42 Why Nobody Truly Feels Completely Comfortable
32:31 When External Changes Don’t Heal Internal Pain
34:01 Beauty Trends and the Pressure to Keep Up
35:47 Social Media and the Loss of Individuality
36:42 Why Self-Acceptance Is Still Difficult
37:31 Addiction, Obsession, and the Desire for Change
38:24 Learning to Slow Down and Reevaluate Priorities
39:20 How to Know If You Truly Want to Change Yourself
40:13 What It Means to Feel “Enough”
41:59 Relationships, Insecurity, and Emotional Unavailability
43:53 Why Healing Has to Start From Within
44:50 My Final Takeaway

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

We're often told that if we change our bodies, we'll finally feel comfortable in ourselves. Body dysmorphia, self-image, and the deep disconnect many people feel in their own bodies.

SPEAKER_02 0:12

You are told to act or dress a certain way, and that was not the way in which I felt. Oh, they bullied me from day one. They would write fab on my locker. So I had to graduate early and get out of there.

SPEAKER_03 0:26

The pressure women faced to conform to beauty standards and the shame often attached to plastic surgery.

SPEAKER_02 0:33

The boobs got bigger, the lips got bigger, you know, and then you but you always have those lips for better before. I've always hated how I look, I've never been at peace with it. Really? Because I see you as absolutely beautiful. I've not accepted anything.

SPEAKER_03 0:49

That's okay. And I don't know if I ever will. Botch surgeries or complications. Health is so much more important to me than a zero waistline. We question whether fixing the outside ever truly heals the inside and what it actually means to build self-acceptance in a world that constantly tells us we are not enough. Okay, my darling Kimber. I have many questions for you. Since you are my best friend, I'm learning so much about you, and I feel you have a really impactful story. Yes. So I want to know when did you first start feeling disconnected from your body or your identity? Probably my entire life. Tell me about that.

SPEAKER_02 1:33

You know, I'm like when when I I guess when I started going to preschool, even because you are told to act or dress a certain way, and that was not the way in which I felt. Yes. I was told what toys I could play with and what toys I couldn't play with. So the disconnect was there from the very beginning.

SPEAKER_03 1:57

Really? And was that with your family or within the school system? Both. Okay. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 2:03

But I was, I will say, I was lucky right around the time. So I went to a private Episcopalian school, and there was this one teacher there that kind of recognized it, and she would let me like do dress up with like tutus and stuff, and she had a conversation with my mom. My mom was fine with it. So I mean, thank God I had like someone to help me out a little bit. And your parents were supportive? They were, but I mean it took a while, but I have a medical diagnosis. I think if if I had said I feel a certain way, I one, I don't think I had the vocabulary for that. Um they wouldn't have been so easygoing about it. But because they have a chromosomical disorder that they've known about since I was a baby, I that kind of helped make legitimize an issue.

SPEAKER_03 2:55

And what is that disorder called? Kleinfelter syndrome. Syndrome. Okay. Kleinfelter syndrome. Okay, thank you. Um, what was there, was there a moment where you realized something doesn't feel right?

SPEAKER_02 3:10

Um I just I just I never felt in tune to what people were telling me I needed to be. And it wasn't anything specific other than I just I it was almost like I re I just rejected totally what they were telling me. So I just I I don't really know. It's just that whatever they were saying didn't feel like my natural being.

SPEAKER_03 3:38

That's important. How did the world around you respond to who you were at that time? Were the kids bullying you?

SPEAKER_02 3:46

Oh, they bullied me from day one. Yeah, I I I don't know, I I mean, even in elementary school, they would be like, because I was like very flamboyant. It was always really small. So kids would even ask me, Are you a boy or a girl? So you were very androgynous as a youngster, yeah. Okay, did they pick on you? Oh, totally, really, and then it just got worse as I got older. I remember in high school, um, they they would write fag on my locker. Or like I'd walk in the hallway and they'd be like, Oh, it smells like fag over here. Yeah, it was awful. God. They used to write stuff on my car. Wow. How old were you? 16. Wow. That's awful. So I had to graduate early and get out of there.

SPEAKER_03 4:35

Really? I graduated a year early. Really? But you're also very smart. You're beautiful and smart. Brands and beauty. You're my best thing, but you are. Okay. Okay. But you really are. Birds of a feather, flat together. Okay. So now let's talk about the transition and the identity. What did your journey of transitioning teach you about belonging? And did you ever think that wouldn't come?

SPEAKER_02 5:03

Um you know, I think that my experience would probably be different because of the adult industry. Like you're trying to fit not a not just like a feminized mold, but now you're trying to fit like this hyper feminized mold of like an of a performer. So I think as time went on and the boobs got bigger, the hair got lighter, the bit the lips got bigger, you know, you are a little bit more accepted, but um, but you know, and then you but you always have those people be like, you were better before. So it's like, you know, you're pleasing some people, you're not pleasing another, but you have to just be like, I like my inner tube lips.

SPEAKER_03 5:50

Yes. And then just deal with that. Okay, good. So how did that what did that teach you about transitioning?

SPEAKER_02 5:55

That, you know, I needed to, regardless of what anyone else thought, I needed to like what I was doing to myself. And eventually that came. Well, n you know, not I mean, because I would constantly go in for more and stuff, but so like it made me feel fine. Like, I don't care what you're saying about what I look like, I'm gonna do what I want to do. And if that's doing it over and over and over and over and over again, I'm gonna do it over and over and over again.

SPEAKER_03 6:21

Yeah, because now you're feeling like in acceptance and more comfortable in your own skin, even if it's you know, fixing the outsides, right? But you're like, oh, I like this look and I want more of it, and this is what I've longed for, right? Right as a child.

SPEAKER_02 6:34

I mean, I mean, even as a kid, because since I grew up in Florida, you know, I loved the light blonde hair, the really fake saline boobs. I mean, I loved all that, and so I've I always that's what I wanted to look like and Dolly.

SPEAKER_03 6:48

I was gonna say, who was our role model of Dolly Park? Dolly, yeah, exactly. Okay, what was was there a difference between how you thought and how you would feel and how you actually felt hmm, I mean, I would constantly be doing something to myself, but it never I've never been settled about anything.

SPEAKER_02 7:15

So, you know, I hate how I look. I've always hate I've always hated how I look. I've never been at peace with it. Um so you know, I think things little by little I was able to accept and get uh like about myself a little bit more, but still overall, I just see like a big project.

SPEAKER_03 7:40

Really? Because I see you as absolutely beautiful, but tell me what how do you see yourself now? I'm a lot more comfortable. I mean, there are little things that I'm like, uh uh uh, but honestly, in the overall grand scheme of things, I'm healthy, and as you and I both know it, we spoke about all my plastic surgeries that I've ever encountered, I've always had complications. And there's nothing worse as thinking I'm gonna have a successful surgery and things go awry and go sour, and I'm left with you know, botch surgeries or complications that take forever to heal or heal and yeah, and I gotta get them removed, or or some, you know, something goes wrong, and then I'm out for like months trying to heal, and I'm and it's still infected and it's leaking, and you know, so it's like right now I'm you know, I always want to improve, of course, right? But I'm I'm okay right now because I'm healthy, and health is so much more important to me than a zero waste size.

SPEAKER_02 8:50

Yeah, and I and through medical problems I have had, I did, you know, I have realized like health is like a real powerful thing to have, and you really do take it for granted. For sure. Like even being able to get out of the bed correctly, like it's stupid stuff like that.

SPEAKER_03 9:06

Yeah, and you and I were sick a couple weeks ago. We had like a stomach flu, right? And that was tough. We both get sick at the same time. We're from the same womb. Our ribs, exactly, exactly, exactly. We have the calic on the same side though. Okay. Um, now what do people misunderstand about the transitioning process?

SPEAKER_02 9:29

I think for me, people always thought I I liked or wanted attention because like because of being over-exaggerated with the boobs or the lips or whatever it was, like that was their natural thing. They're like, oh, you want to be stared at and looked at. And it for me it's the complete opposite. Yeah. Because you're pretty shy.

SPEAKER_03 9:49

Yeah, I'm very shy, I'm very introverted. So, so you think that people did not understand, like, this is who you truly are at heart, right? And they're like, Oh, you want attention, you want the overly whatever.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

And maybe for someone else that does do those things to themselves, yeah, maybe like that is what they want. They do want the attention. I I did not.

SPEAKER_03 10:11

Yeah, you know, I honestly could agree with you too, because even when I was younger, I loved overly done stuff, you know. And um, when I was in the 90s and early 2000s, a lot of people would ask me if I was trans, and I thought that was such a compliment because back then everything was overly, you know, overly exaggerated. And honestly, that's what I like. It's not for so much attention, it's an aesthetic, exactly, because people are very rude, you know, and they'll point and they'll laugh and they'll make me uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02 10:43

I don't I don't want to just girl at the mall this week.

SPEAKER_03 10:46

So yeah, and but I we realize jealousy will get you nowhere, and that's really sad that you have to be that rude and distasteful and disgusting. Yeah, I've never understood and make me feel uncomfortable because you feel uncomfortable at yourself, but neither you or I wouldn't do that to someone. Never, but we were raised differently. My my dad would like backslap me if like backhand me if I point at someone, goes, ew, look at that. Look how ugly she looks, or look at how big her boobs is. My dad would be like, shut up.

SPEAKER_02 11:15

My family would have been mortified.

SPEAKER_03 11:16

Yes, exactly. That because we have manners, it's considerate in manners, but okay, so now let's go on to the body dysmorphia. Okay, I want to hear about the trans experience and the internal dialogue. How would you describe the way you saw yourself during that time when you were transitioning?

SPEAKER_02 11:35

Tell me about that. I feel like I'm in a constant state of transition, so I wouldn't say like there's a beginning and an end. Um you know, it it just goes back to like that thing of you know, I see something in a mirror that maybe other people don't see. So I'm in a constant need of fixing, changing, and then that also changes to like with age or like what's popular right now. So, like, you know, the just in, you know, the real big lips or whatever it was was like so popular in like 2007 or something, and now it's like a little bit more subdued, yeah. The better, like the glowy skin is more popular, so it's like you're fixated on that. So it just my dysmorphia just changes depending on what's going on in my life and the world. Sure. And then if I'm real depressed, it really heightens. My mom would always tell me, like, if she didn't hear from me for a while or she knew I was really depressed, she knew surgery was coming. Really?

SPEAKER_03 12:42

Mm-hmm. She always knew. So do you feel that like your dysmorphia can is more of like the sign of the times, like to um match what's the new trends?

SPEAKER_02 12:54

Um, I don't know if I mean that's definitely how it's worked. Like what I fixate on changes, but I don't know if that changes like the overall dysmorphia. It's just that's a constant.

SPEAKER_03 13:05

Sure. Me too for me too, it it accentuates my dysmorphia because now I'm like, oh wow, what's the most popular? Oh, all the girls with the big biggest, largest butts are getting all the likes. Uh they're the ones making the most money. Now they're getting it removed. Exactly. Right? So now I'm on that. Exactly. Now I want it removed. Yep, exactly. So it's like that kind of determines, you know, how much I'm obsessed over something. I guess that's and there always will be something because there's always something new. Exactly, exactly. So the rib removal.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

Oh, and I'm booked. Uh oh.

SPEAKER_03 13:42

Yeah, nobody. I'm booked in June. Oh good, okay. All right, what kind of thoughts were running through your mind and your body about your body?

SPEAKER_02 13:52

Just overall dissatisfaction. Like, I I just never like how I look. I mean, I'm always finding something. Like I said, now there's like this the whole rib thing like I have going on where I feel like I'm more boxy. I don't know what's happening. It's, you know, I think we're both of us are in a certain situation too, where like not only are we looking at ourselves in a mirror and like you know, pulling ourselves apart, but we also see images of ourselves constantly. So then you're picking apart that, and you you always look different in a photo versus what you do in real life. It seems like that. Yeah. So that makes it worse.

SPEAKER_03 14:32

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, we got video evidence and footage going up. I didn't realize I had that love handle hanging out or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Okay. Um, what did it feel like something you could control or something that controlled you?

SPEAKER_02 14:52

Um I guess it's probably something that can control me. But maybe it was the fixation was to control it.

SPEAKER_03 15:03

I like that. I totally get it. So it's like we're trying to control something that is truly controlling us, right? So now there's that battle. And that's a whole disorder thing, too.

SPEAKER_02 15:13

It's like an eating disorder. That's your sense of control.

SPEAKER_03 15:16

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 15:17

When you stop eating, or you know, you're controlling what's coming in and now, and all that.

SPEAKER_03 15:20

Yeah. Do you feel like your dysmorphia happened as a child to you?

SPEAKER_02 15:24

I've always had it because I had an eating disorder when I was a kid, too. So I wasn't, yeah, I was in a hospital.

SPEAKER_03 15:30

Really? For anorexia or blaming? Anorexia. Oh, yeah. Wow. Yeah, I feel like my childhood formed my dysmorphia in a sense, because like I was, you know, I experienced racism at a as a very young age, just being Chinese and Italian. So I was constantly thinking, I'm wrong, I'm the oddity, I need to fix myself to be more uh Caucasian looking or blonde hair, blue eyes. Yeah, exactly. So I was constantly chasing that look, and I feel like it spiraled out of control because then I went from that to now I want bigger, you know, I want to look like Dolly Parton now, or whatever movie star was popular at the time, you know.

SPEAKER_02 16:12

I think too with my child, so my my mother and my grandmother were hyper-fixated on their looks and their weight. And so for my mom, it happened through my grandmother, where like she picked her up, it wasn't it wasn't at her kids, it was at herself. She was she was on diapills when she was pregnant, like she was amphetamine then. So, you know, and then that obsession with weight and the way that she looked, it bled in onto my mother, and then my mother bled it onto me. And this is something even my mother will acknowledge at this point. So always I knew what from very young age I knew what surgery was, I knew like what weight issues were, you know, it was constantly talked about in my house.

SPEAKER_03 16:58

Me too. So I always knew about the good stuff, exactly, right? So it's like kind of like learned behavior, right? Yeah. Okay, let's talk about plastic surgery and shame. Yes, we like that. All right, why do you think women and men are judged no matter what they choose, whether they get surgery or not?

SPEAKER_02 17:19

It's a way to put knock you down and make the other person feel better about themselves.

SPEAKER_03 17:24

For sure, for sure. And I feel like there's a lot of jealousy too, that people like they go, or sometimes even within myself, I'll speak for myself. Sometimes I'll see someone with like really over overly done lips, and I'll go, oh god, that's way too much. And then I'm thinking, since when? Since when is that way too much? I go, that's probably way too much because I don't have the balls to do it or the money to afford that, you know.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

I had a doctor tell me one time, he was like, when someone doesn't do anything to themselves cosmetically, that's for poor people. Like poor, no, he said poor, ugly people.

SPEAKER_03 18:03

Yes, yeah, that's a good way to look at it. I don't know, but but but it's funny because the people that are usually the ones not doing anything are the ones that criticize. Yeah. Or they'll go, oh look, I'm natural. I'm not I'm like, ugh, sorry for you. Like that's embarrassing. If that works for you, then that works for you, but this works for me. Exactly. But they'll go, oh look, look, I'm all natural. I'm like, yikes, I can tell. Like that's not a good thing. If I would shut up, I don't know. That but that's my the way I see it. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

And I don't know what it is too. I feel like when you are a little bit more exaggerated, people almost like make you a target. Yeah, like you're like it's okay for you to take all their shit.

SPEAKER_03 18:49

Exactly. That's a really good point. You're their punching bag because they're so insecure. Sad. But that is a really good point, yeah. Okay, do you think wanting to change your appearance comes from insecurity? For sure. Yeah, for sure. All right, where do you think the line is between wanting to enhance yourself and trying to fix yourself?

SPEAKER_02 19:14

Um I mean, trying to fix yourself like with a legitimate issue, like if you're like capsulated, or I mean, then you gotta fix it. Sure. So an enhance I think that enhance is like small things. Like people that maybe get surgery or whatever it is, but they look very natural to where like you never know. But um I I when you're going to an extreme, I think then that's a different subject. Trying to fix yourself, right? But when you and usually like when you're in that kind of zone, you've had a lot of surgery, then more complications occur, then there are legitimate issues you need to fix. Like I said, now I'm encapsulated. Yeah. So like every boob job I've ever had, I've had to have one right after to fix something. Exactly. I have an eight-nosed job.

SPEAKER_03 20:04

Do you think I will really wanted that? Exactly, exactly. And a lot of it people don't understand is reconstruction. You know, sometimes if I have crooked breasts, people are like, why don't you fix that? Why don't I? Because uh it's right. But you've tried. Yeah, exactly. You think I'm just like walking around going, This is the this is what I really want. I paid a million dollars for that.

SPEAKER_02 20:25

Do you really think I want so much cartilage from both ears that can't take anymore and I can take my rib to put in my hand? My nose is, you know, my nose is from all different parts of my body at this time.

SPEAKER_03 20:34

Nobody understands there, right, the depths of it. Okay, so now since we're gonna talk about more plastic surgery, how about what was your experience being on botched and how did it actually feel behind the scenes?

SPEAKER_02 20:49

Um, I mean, I I kind of wish I had I hadn't done the show, really. Really, why? Um, overall, I mean, like I miss how I looked before. Like I don't like I've had a reduction and I wish I hadn't done that. I think overall my my nose was at a point like I shouldn't have messed with it, and then it just got worse. Um the labioplasty was fine, but um, but you know, I was I was treated well through the show. I still talked to Dr. DeBro. I mean, I just saw him, and um, but it I mean, it was also the first season, so it was like they're working out kinks with how the show is gonna even work. They don't even know what it's gonna be called. So it was kind of chaotic. They definitely, you know, consume your life for several months. They want every ounce of your life for them to be able to film or control, even though it's one episode. So, I mean, like I think I know, I think I was cast in the summer. I had surgery in December, and I don't think we were done filming until in like February or something. It was like a long process.

SPEAKER_03 22:01

And how did you like uh his work?

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Um, you know, like I'm not happy with it. I think they definitely tried. I'm like when so like with the breast, I had mesh put in too. So the mesh came undone. So like he had to operate on me again to like slow it back down, and then Nassif um kept not basically did four nose jobs on me in a matter of months. Like I went into his office one day and they were trying to take packing out of my nose and I couldn't find the packing. What does that mean? They couldn't find like the packing that goes up in your nose to hold your septum, they couldn't find it. And so they literally put me under that day. I think I'm getting a checkup, they put me under that day to do exploratory surgery so it didn't go into my brain or something. And they still never found it. Wow. I'm like, did it fall out of my nose when I slept or what?

SPEAKER_03 23:02

But do you think they are reconstruction doctors, reconstructive doctors, or do you think they're just plastic surgeons? So there there is a difference.

SPEAKER_02 23:10

I I I think Dr. DeBro is more reconstructive. Um Nassif, I think he's just, you know, he's a plastic surgeon. And also, too, it was like a weird time because Dr. Nassif was going through like in the beginning stages of a really messy divorce. So he you could tell like that was taking a toll on him. I mean, I met his kids one time, like it's because he was like one, like he was temperamental. So um I was always still very close to DeBro. So one time I called him and I cried because of how I was treated in the office. Wow. And he called Dr. Nassip and he was like, you need to be nicer to her. And he did make an effort that same day. Like he came over to my room and he and he brought all of his kids over, and was he try you could tell he was trying to be sweet. So I mean I have to give him credit for all of that.

SPEAKER_03 24:06

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 24:08

So then uh Dr. Alter, I just saw him at the airport. Oh really? The one that did my labia plastic. Oh yeah? Yeah, we were we ran into each other at LAX.

SPEAKER_03 24:16

Are you still cool with them?

SPEAKER_02 24:18

I mean, I don't have like a relationship with them, but yeah, it was fine. I'm like, hi.

SPEAKER_03 24:23

Oh my god. Now tell me, are you tell everybody are you happy with your uh vaginal plasty?

SPEAKER_02 24:30

Um, I'm fine with the external. There's like newer surgeries that can like make things better internally, and I want to do that.

SPEAKER_03 24:38

Yeah, okay, what would they do internally?

SPEAKER_02 24:41

So they would take from because mine was a penile inversion, so they cut and fillet the penis and put like put it inside of you, but now they can take uh lining from the muscle of your stomach to make it like more secure, and then it also helps to self-lubricate. And you you don't have to dilate as much, and so I would like to do that. Yeah. From what I saw, it's gorgeous.

SPEAKER_03 25:11

Yes, okay. Um it should be. There's like three surgeries on that thing. Well, as we know, there's always complications, and sometimes we've had surgeries done, I have had done many times, and it still doesn't work out, but but yeah, yours is Chef's kiss or Ava's kiss. Okay. Um, do you think that show helps people or exploit them?

SPEAKER_02 25:37

I can't say because I've never watched the show. Yeah. I watched mine when it first came out, and then that was that. I've never seen it since.

SPEAKER_03 25:44

Yeah, I've watched the show. I I feel um it's somewhat of an exploitation, but at the same time, it's for entertainment purposes, you know, it's like a show you gotta watch, you know.

SPEAKER_02 25:54

Well, and I was aware of that. So I mean, I definitely played things up for the camera and said crazy stuff. I mean, but I'm a performer. So like I was cool with all that, and then what I if if they wanted me to do something and I wasn't, I was very honest and saying, I'm not gonna do that. Good. So I don't know, it was fine for me, but and I don't and I don't think I came out wacky. I think I turned up they overall they made me look relatively normal.

SPEAKER_03 26:22

Yeah, well, you are relatively normal, right? Relatively, yeah, you are though. So it's like, you know, and I think that's great that you could represent the trans community with a level head.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

And that was one of the good things about that show. I did get a lot of feedback saying like I did portray that a trans person in a different light than what had been seen before, because it's usually a little bit more of like an eccentric character. I think people back then at that point would get confused with like a cross dresser and yeah, or even a drag queen, yeah, right performing, right?

SPEAKER_03 26:55

Okay, how did the in sp experience impact how you saw yourself?

SPEAKER_02 27:01

I don't I don't think it impacted me in any way, bad or good. I think it just it's a con it's it was just like anything else. I had surgery and I still wanted more after the fact.

SPEAKER_03 27:13

Yeah, did it help your uh standing in like the social media community or or the relevance of of giving you a household name?

SPEAKER_02 27:24

That was my plan, I thought, especially with getting a reduction, like I I could it would maybe open more doors for me. I did the same thing, yeah. We're delusional, yeah. And then and then I also thought maybe it would be more easy to get like meet someone and get married, so I'm not because I'm not so like like a character, but um, it didn't do any of that, and it was kind of a weird time for me too, because then I was having all these medical problems, so I couldn't work anyway, and it and that held me back. So it was just it's hard to it was just a weird time for me.

SPEAKER_03 27:58

Yeah, yeah. So it was it was somewhat beneficial, you'd say, because it kind of gave you more did a lot of people see you on the show?

SPEAKER_02 28:07

Did a lot Yeah, I mean initially, yeah. I mean it so my parents had moved to uh Georgia briefly, like out right outside Atlanta, and I went to visit them, and this was like right after the show came out, and I was going to a grocery store in Alpharetta, Georgia, and peop women were coming up to me saying that they had seen the show. What so it did give you some publicity? Some, I mean for a while, but but it uh but I wasn't because I was sick, so I wasn't doing anything, I didn't use it to its advantage, which is which sucks.

SPEAKER_03 28:39

Yeah, that's okay because everything's recycled. Yeah, they use that show a lot. Yeah, that's good. Okay, so what was your point of going on the show?

SPEAKER_02 28:50

Um, kind of just that. Like I I had said, you know, I wanted to meet someone and I wanted to have kids, and I kind of wanted to downplay my look to be a little bit to fit in a little bit more, and um, and it just didn't really that's not really how it went.

SPEAKER_03 29:09

Yeah. But but your point was like, so you can have surgery and have it documented and like kind of tone down your look a little bit. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 29:17

And I I mean, even since I was a kid, like I always wanted to be in plastic surgery show.

SPEAKER_04 29:22

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:22

When the clips were coming out of like me on the surgery table and it's taking the implants out, I loved it. Good. My dad, who's like a big prude, and you know, because I look at that stuff and I'm not like I don't think it I think it's normal. I don't think it's any right. That's our normal. We were like in an Olive Garden or something, and I'm like, Look!

SPEAKER_03 29:41

He's like, I don't look at it, yeah, right? He's like, I'm gonna vomit. I can't watch that. Yeah. Okay, so now we're gonna talk about fixing versus enhancing. Okay, okay. Okay. Do you think it's possible to make changes to your appearance in a healthy way? Sure.

SPEAKER_02 29:59

Um, I mean, in a little ways, like if if you're obese and you need to lose weight, if you're too thin and need to gain some weight, or you get healthy and you pack on muscle. Um, or like maybe you maybe you did lose like a ton of weight, now you need to get skin removed. So then that helps. And if you have a deviated septum, then that happens your nose. Yeah. If you have um if you have breast cancer and you need to get reconstruction.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Yeah. But how about making changes like to modify your look or to like uh change your look, like bigger implants, or do you think that's uh do you think that's possible to do it in a healthy way?

SPEAKER_02 30:43

It's kind of like, well, what's healthy? You know, like what's healthy for me may be different for you. It's you know, people need to do what feels good for them and what they're comfortable with. It's it so my extreme may be someone else's like norm or vice versa.

SPEAKER_03 31:00

So it's more personal. Yeah, great, great answer. Okay, what do you think someone needs to feel internally before making those decisions?

SPEAKER_02 31:10

I mean, it would always be nice if you have a good um, if you have a really good like self-acceptance about yourself and a really good or a really good sense of self. Um, but I I kind of think like when people are having surgery, it's like no matter what, you're not you're not there.

SPEAKER_03 31:29

Yeah, yeah. So yeah, but that is true. So you so you feel like you have to be okay with yourself first instead of trying to like, oh, this is gonna make me better. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 31:40

But I think that that's that's a real big hypothetical. I don't think it I I I really don't think people, anyone is really comfortable with themselves, to be honest.

SPEAKER_03 31:50

That gets surgery or just anything in general.

SPEAKER_02 31:53

People in general, and if they say they are, I really feel like they're masking something.

SPEAKER_03 31:57

Yeah, you think?

SPEAKER_02 31:58

Yeah, I mean who's who is comfortable with themselves completely?

SPEAKER_03 32:02

I mean, I am not, but I would say I'm more comfortable than I've ever been, even if I'm 52, it's been but maybe that's because you're 52. Exactly, but I have I had to work on myself, and I had to have so many complications that I've had my breast implants stripped from my body. So I had no choice. That's terrific. Yeah. I don't know what I would have done with that. Oof. I had no choice to be like, okay, obviously, this isn't gonna fix it.

SPEAKER_02 32:27

I feel your pain, like I couldn't imagine.

SPEAKER_03 32:29

Oh yeah, it was the toughest, one of the toughest experiences I've ever had. Okay, what happens when you try to fix something externally that's actually internal? Give me an example. So basically, like what I did, I thought if I had the biggest implants in the world, it's gonna fix me. I'm gonna make more money, I'm gonna be successful, I'm gonna be happy in my own skin. And then it backfired because then I had infection after infection. I had to remove my implants for a couple years.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

I I mean, I guess I would just say I could compare that to my first nose job, just because you know, I really went in wanting something like I didn't I wanted something specific, and then he's messed me up completely. Yes. And it's never been right ever since. So, but anything else, I just feel like I I think I've always known like this was not gonna be it. Like I never like went in to get breast implants and think, okay, well, I like this and I'm gonna stick with it. I've never been like that with anything.

SPEAKER_03 33:32

Okay, good. So so you're in acceptance that whatever your surgery you're getting is not gonna fix you. You're always gonna have to continuously do more.

SPEAKER_02 33:39

I like surgery. Yeah, I like the process of change, I like experiment, I like to do new things. I mean, even if it's little stuff like changing my hair, I like to change my look. I like it. You're just a little bit. It's like my version of art.

SPEAKER_03 33:53

Yeah, I like that. Great self-expression. I like that. I love it. Okay, great answer. Okay, um, external influences, society beauty, and beauty standards. Let's hear. What messages do you think were given, especially as women, about how we're supposed to look?

SPEAKER_02 34:12

Whatever's hot at the time. Like, you know, we were talking about like the huge Brazilian butt lifts, yeah, and now everyone's like down playing it. You know, huge boobs were popular. Now it's they call them like the ballerina implants. Really? Yeah, because they're small and natural looking. Um, so it's just things change with the times, and trends. Uh yeah. I mean, look at Kylie Jenner. People just ridiculed her to death, and now she's kind of like in a middle zone, and people still criticize her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:47

So, you know, gotta do what you want to do. True. Okay, how do you not what's popular? Like, oh yeah, that's the toughest, but doesn't make sense. I mean, yeah, I mean, I don't know. I I always like to like like a certain look and just go with it.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

That's where I'm at.

SPEAKER_03 35:02

Like, I that may be popular, but exactly. So I like a big butt, regardless. Okay, how much do you think social media culture or upbringing plays into body dysmorphia as well as a big thing?

SPEAKER_02 35:13

Plays a lot, most definitely, especially if you're younger and you're seeing all these images, and you know, it is kind of people are starting to all kind of look the same. There's a lot less individuality. Like a friend of mine who's who's trans, she's in the business, she she had a gap in her teeth, and it's like she's beautiful, she had a gap in her teeth, and she had a like a hump in her nose. But it gave her, she still was beautiful, but it gave her so much character. And anytime she would say she wanted to fix whatever, I'd be like, no, don't do it. It makes you different from everybody else because you're still beautiful, and she did change it eventually. But now she doesn't like it. She, I mean, she likes it, but she looks like you know, everyone else. There's nothing that stands out.

SPEAKER_03 36:02

Yeah. Yeah. It's hard. But you know, as long as it's not fine. But if she's fine with it, then that's what matters.

SPEAKER_02 36:10

Like anyone can say the same thing to me, and I'm like, Me too, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 36:15

Okay. Um, self-acceptance and healing. What does self-acceptance look like for you now?

unknown 36:22

I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 36:24

Because I have I have not accepted anything. Okay. That's okay. And I don't know if I ever will. That's okay, right? It's a process, right? Yeah. As long as you're happy. I'm I mean, I'm fine. Okay, good. All right. Okay. What was the moment when your relationship with yourself with yourself started to shift?

SPEAKER_02 36:46

Did you ever have in a like positive way? I don't think it's shh. I I think I'm a little less intense about like the need to get something done. I mean, I still want to, but I'm not as like gung-ho. Like I'm I'm I'm yeah, you know, I can wait a little bit, but so it's still the desire is still there to change, but I'm not as proactive.

SPEAKER_03 37:11

Or obsessed?

SPEAKER_02 37:12

Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 37:13

Alright, that's good. Because obsession is.

SPEAKER_02 37:15

And that probably that is an age thing, I guess. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:17

You just set up. But it's also like time, too. It's like experiences. Cause I can get obsessed over anything.

SPEAKER_02 37:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:26

Even at my age. But you know, it's like, I don't know. I just the desire is still there, but the urge and the need kinda and maybe too, that's the part of just like addictive personalities, too.

SPEAKER_02 37:39

Yeah. That desire that stays there.

SPEAKER_03 37:42

Yeah. And also sometimes like I'm like, I I rather I my priorities are different today. I don't know. I rather spent like 40, 50k on something a little bit more like an investment, you know? I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 37:57

Yeah, I'd agree with that. Right. Because now I'm like, I want to invest more rather than like go shopping.

SPEAKER_03 38:04

Exactly, exactly. Okay. What helped you reconnect with yourself in a healthier way, if at all?

SPEAKER_02 38:11

I don't think I have. I think my state of being is a constant thing, like I said, but at the same time, I think I've calmed down with the need. But is it still there? Yes, but I'm not as aggressive about it.

SPEAKER_03 38:25

Yeah, so that's a healthier way, right? I think so. Yeah. Okay, so here's some fan questions. We want to hear Kimber James bad advice. Okay, how do you know if you want to change something about yourself or if you've just been taught to hate it?

SPEAKER_02 38:44

Um, maybe taught to hate it. It's like if you if you are fine with how you are, but you have outside influences, whether that's family, um, a significant other, a business person telling you, no, you need to change this. But and then on the other end, it's you wanting to do that rather than someone else telling you.

SPEAKER_03 39:09

Yes. Okay, I like that, right? Because it's like something that you have to internalize and be okay with versus somebody badgering you.

SPEAKER_02 39:18

Well, I mean, like you and I have been in an atmosphere where we know girls that have been told, you know what, you do need a nose shot, and you're not gonna work unless you get bigger, but you know, and maybe they didn't think about that at all.

SPEAKER_03 39:31

Yeah, true, right? We you and I would be like, oh, yeah, I'm like, doctor, yeah, book me in. Exactly. You don't gotta twist my what else do I need though? Okay. Um, what does feeling like enough mean to you?

SPEAKER_02 39:49

I don't think it's for me, that has nothing to do with my appearance. It's more like feeling loved. Um, like what about me is unlovable versus how what do I need to do to be enough to be loved? It's so it doesn't really have to do, it's it's much more internal. Yeah, good. And how do you work on that? I don't know, I'm still in that phase. I was having that conversation earlier today because like I said, like we we talked about the other day, it's like these two people I dated that I guess I was not enough for where they cheated on me or whatever it was, and then 10 years on now they're like, oh well, you know, I made a mistake. Yeah. So what what's like what about me isn't enough that you couldn't realize that then.

SPEAKER_03 40:45

Yeah. But I mean, honestly, I think you dodged bullets because like I I always feel like nothing happened, nothing happens on accident. And it's like looking back, would you really? I think you'd be doing the cheating, and then they'd be going, what, you know? But I mean, I'm just saying it's like, you know, I don't know, I think it took you to a wonderful path, right? And like a hard one for sure. Yeah, but now that you look at these people, you're like, uh, never.

SPEAKER_02 41:21

One in particular. Yeah. But you know, it's still though, um, you know, like I've been through different relationships, like with uh with with one I was engaged to, like, I was still not enough for you to be okay with everything about myself for us to have a life together. So it's it's not even just like those two, it's everyone. It's that's been my history.

SPEAKER_03 41:46

But do you think it it is you or do you think it's their problem? Because if they can't if they're not comfortable in their own skin, nothing will make them happy.

SPEAKER_02 41:57

Yeah, but there's I I have to be inadequate in some way. I'm not perfect, so like or what is it about me that like I kind of still go for these people that um can't see the best of me.

SPEAKER_03 42:16

Like, you know, so yeah. Well, for me, I I've learned that um I'm comfortable with those people, and you know, like sometimes I'm like trying to date like these convicts. I'm like, what? Because back in the day when I was younger, I some I still like go back, regress into the 18-year-old, 18-year-old little tweaker, you know, escort. Like that so the convicts and everything is what I was comfortable with, you know, and sometimes I still regress and go, oh, I'm that little 18-year-old tweaker, you know, and I'm like, no, I'm not. Like so, maybe it's just like I'm used to the kind of like the abuse, yeah, or or like the the avoidant type or like the distant person, you know. I have and that's what's comfortable to us.

SPEAKER_02 43:04

I have said that the commonality with everyone I've been with is that they are they are unavailable in some way, whether they are with someone else, or whether like the it they're not emotionally available or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_03 43:24

So maybe it's the inadequacy of our old beliefs, right? Yeah, maybe maybe it's not so much they don't think that we're enough, it's maybe I don't think I'm enough, so that's why I'll settle for the convicts and the other lower end people.

SPEAKER_02 43:38

And I and I've tried settling too, and that that doesn't work either.

SPEAKER_03 43:41

Of course, it'll always backfire.

SPEAKER_02 43:43

So exactly.

SPEAKER_03 43:45

Well, I don't know, we're here today, right? We are, we are, right? And we're besties and we hold hands and watch Netflix and cry and laugh and eat. Right? So sometimes maybe support isn't.

SPEAKER_02 44:03

It definitely isn't right now. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 44:06

Yes, my girl. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you for having me. You make me so happy. Okay, so that wraps up another episode of A Divine's bad advice. So here's my bad advice for all of you watching and listening. Fixing the outsides will not truly heal the inside. It can help accentuate aesthetically, but it won't cure your inner turmoil. And sometimes our own inadequacy comes from within. Right? And once I once again, we gotta heal from the inside. So over and out, thank you you guys for tuning in. See you later. We're often told that certain women aren't relationship material. How long have you been in the business for?

SPEAKER_00 44:54

On and off for 17 years. Throughout those 17 years, I've taken some breaks. And I say to people, I take breaks either if my mom needs me or if I fall in love.

SPEAKER_03 45:02

Whether it's because of their age, their profession, or how they express their sexuality.

SPEAKER_01 45:08

So I went viral as the pastor-turned, I don't know if I can say this, pastor-turned stripper publicly on their platform. They're anti-adult entertainment, they're pro-Jesus. So they're spouting one thing, but then privately, secretly messaging me for access. And I'm like, this ain't cool.

SPEAKER_03 45:23

We talk about the stigma around dating adult entertainers, the double standards placed on mature women, and how desire is often accepted privately, but judged publicly.

SPEAKER_01 45:36

It became a requirement if I'm ever going to be with someone, they have to not tolerate my business, they have to celebrate my business.

SPEAKER_00 45:42

Guys get so excited, like, oh, I'm dating this woman and look what she does, and it's so, so cool. This is true. And then for me, they catch feelings quickly. And when they do, then everything turns around. Like everything is different. They don't want me, they're like um almost hinting at me to demand who I am and change my job.

SPEAKER_03 45:58

The conversation dives into age gap relationships, unpacking the difference between genuine connection and power imbalance. So get cozy if you're watching from home and turn up the volume if you're listening. This is Ava Devine's bad advice.