The Art of Closing High-Stakes Real Estate Deals with Mark Jovanovic

Real estate is never just about properties. It's about people, trust, timing, and solving complex problems when the stakes are high. In this episode of Deal Flow Diaries, we sit down with Mark Jovanovic, co-founder of Paradigm Advisory, to explore how a terrible first experience buying an apartment in New York ultimately led him to build one of the country's top-performing real estate advisory businesses.

Mark shares his journey from arriving in Manhattan knowing only a handful of people to closing more than $2.5 billion in transactions and helping shape the technology infrastructure behind Compass during its earliest startup days. From leaving the security of an established brokerage to becoming one of Compass's founding agents, Mark offers an insider's perspective on what it takes to build, innovate, and thrive in an industry undergoing constant transformation.

This conversation goes beyond luxury real estate. It is a masterclass in entrepreneurship, relationship-building, and adapting to change. Mark reflects on the importance of playing the long game, embracing innovation before it becomes mainstream, and building teams rooted in trust, alignment, and shared purpose.

Join us as we talk about:

• Taking the leap from a successful career at Corcoran to helping build Compass as one of its earliest agents and product contributors
• Why technology and AI will continue transforming real estate, while human judgment and relationships remain irreplaceable
• The philosophy of treating every client relationship as a long-term investment rather than a transaction
• Building high-performing teams through trust, alignment, mentorship, and empowering others to lead
• Why authenticity, resilience, and a willingness to "go all in" are essential ingredients for innovation and long-term success

Whether you're an entrepreneur building something new, a real estate enthusiast curious about the future of the industry, or someone interested in how meaningful businesses are built, this episode offers valuable lessons on leadership, adaptability, and creating lasting impact.

Follow Mark Jovanovic & Paradigm Advisory:

Website

Instagram: @mark.jovanovic @paradigm_advisory

LinkedIn: Mark Jovanovic, Paradigm Advisory Team 

Questions and comments; reach out to us at inquiries@dealflowdiariespodcast.com

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If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe and leave a rating and review on Apple or Spotify or where ever you get your podcasts.

Recorded at The Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center.

Thank you for listening.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:04

DealFlow Diaries, where the dealmakers talk. A podcast that takes you inside the minds of the Titans shaping today's global economy. I'm Alexandra Fairweather.

SPEAKER_02 0:17

And I'm Elaine Chamberlain. Together, we sit down with visionary founders, fund managers, and deal makers across private equity, real estate, fashion, tech, and beyond.

SPEAKER_03 0:30

Each episode, we uncover the untold stories behind their biggest deals, hardest setbacks, and boldest bets. Lessons in strategy, risk, and ambition you won't find anywhere else.

SPEAKER_02 0:44

Smart, unscripted, unfiltered. This is DealFlow Diaries. Our guest today is Mark Ivanovich. Mark grew up in San Diego, moved to New York for his wife's job, knew four people in the city, and had a terrible experience buying his first apartment. So much that he decided he could do it better himself. That was around 2003. Two decades later, he has sold over $2.5 billion in real estate, was ranked number two in New York State by the Wall Street Journal, and is co-founder of Paradigm Advisory, one of the top real estate teams in the country. In 2014, he and his partner Scott Houstis made a bet that almost no one understood. They left an established position at Corcoran to become founding agents at a then startup called Urban Compass, when there were fewer than 50 people at the company and maybe five agents in New York. He helped build the tech stack that every Compass agent now runs their businesses on. Today, Paradigm Advisory has closed over $2.5 billion in transactions, including a $61 million sale at $220 Central Park South, one of the most prestigious addresses in the world. He joins us now to talk about how you build trust at the highest levels, what New York City real estate actually tells you about the economy, and why he thinks of every client as a project. Welcome, Mark. Thank you for being here today.

SPEAKER_00 2:11

Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02 2:12

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 2:13

Mark, tell us what it was like when you arrive in Manhattan without any foothold.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

You know, it's a fascinating place because the energy is just there. And um, so what happened was is my wife and I we closed on a small little alcove studio in the building we currently live in, because we've owned several apartments there, and we just like loved it. But it was so funny because we had so little money in our bank account that like we were walking around looking to go or go where to go for dinner and ended up at like walking by Gray's papaya, and it was like the recession special, and the snow was falling, and it was like January, and like it was like I think $1.65 for two hot dogs and a papaya. And we're like, this is what we're having for our closing dinner.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 2:57

And so from there, you know, it was just this nice moment. And then from there, it's just like, okay, let's just go, because the city's gonna leave you behind if you don't. So that's what we just did.

SPEAKER_03 3:07

And how did you know at that point you wanted to go into real estate?

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Well, I came and I I had a semi-consulting job, but she was traveling the world consulting, and so she would she'd be gone like for sometimes two weeks at a time. And so I didn't have anything else to do. So I'm like, I'll just jump into this real estate thing and got a job at a small little office at a company called City Habitats and worked there for a year and a half and just started running and figuring things out. And I met my business partner, Scott, and next thing you know, we're leaving to go to Corcoran, and then they gave us one seat there, and that was like 2005, and so we had a share at desk. And then when we left in 2014, we were on the president's council for three years in a row, and we were, you know, had the coroner office, like Bill Ackman was in our building, like, you know, George Soros, you'd run into the DPG people, and I don't know, Steve Roth. And so it was like the idea of okay, we've achieved this thus far. How do you keep going? Right. And so that's why the whole like urban compass thing became that, and met Robert and said, let's go help him build a company.

SPEAKER_02 4:13

So I want to go back to part of your story where that first apartment that was a terrible experience, correct?

SPEAKER_00 4:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:22

Can you tell us more about that and what you realized during that experience that has led you to where you are now?

SPEAKER_00 4:27

Yeah. So I grew up in San Diego. I went to school in Santa Barbara, and my wife went to Stanford. And so like we had a lot of friends that were in tech during that whole dot com boom. And you know, it was an interesting time to be there, but it was also like I came from a mass science computer background. So my school was like a magnet school, it was like gifted and talented for science and computers. And so, long story short, like we were programming on BASIC and COBOL, and I knew Excel and like all these things. And when you get to the city, like no one had data, everything was kind of sheltered. You just had all these old brokers who had no idea what was going on in the regular world, but just were telling you to do stuff. And everything was like on a typewriter, and we had to type everything out because nothing was digital. And when you try to give it to them in digital format, they're like, no, I don't want it via email. You need to like FedEx it to me. So it was just this backwards process. And I was like, So inefficient. Yeah, like I can do this better than them. And I knew Excel and I felt like it was that ripe moment when technology, that divide, like right now, we're having like the whole divide with like the AI stuff and the non-AI stuff. So are you AI native? Are you not? And so it's like, okay, well, I'm 50 now, so I gotta like catch up to and understand what that is because that next wave is happening just like it was happening then.

SPEAKER_03 5:38

Right.

SPEAKER_00 5:39

But a lot of people are gonna be left behind if they don't know.

SPEAKER_03 5:41

Aaron Powell Are you implementing AI now yourself? And what are you doing?

SPEAKER_00 5:45

Well, yes and no. My team does it more than I do because I know that like for me, my job is to be in front of the client, right? And to be able to speak about it and understand it. It was my wife's birthday a couple of days ago, and you know, we generated this whole card for her that we put on the TV and it's all the things that she loves to do, you know. So it's like you can just do that very easily. And so you can do that for all the real estate stuff. So for instance, we just listed something and it's vacant. And so I'm like, let's just try to virtually stage this thing with Grok, right? And so we did it and we did it for free when something would have cost like $250 before to have some graphic person do it in, I don't know, some other place and it'd take three days to get back, and it was done in like 10 minutes. And I had exactly what I wanted. And so it's like, yeah, for sure. And then, you know, I don't have any agents or bots or anything like that running around yet. But not yet. At some point. At some point it'll happen. At some point it'll happen.

SPEAKER_02 6:40

Alexandra and I love that topic of AI and how it can just help with efficiency, right? And that's kind of what you did too.

SPEAKER_03 6:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:50

So I would love to learn more about at what point did you realize you really had an idea? I mean, like, what was the tipping point where you were like that? I can do this better. I mean, obviously, like you just mentioned, but was there another moment that you really thought this is it?

SPEAKER_00 7:08

Yeah, like um, so way back in the day when we were at City, we would go on a pitch to get a listing. And the brokers would say, We'd love to hire you, but you're not at the right brand. You're smarter, you're more with it, you understand what this website is compared to putting stuff in the New York Times, which people still did back then. And so that's when we knew we had to go to a better brand, right? And that's why we made that pivot. And once we got there, they gave us one desk. And after six months, our managing director like realized, like, oh wow, these guys are hustling, they're crushing it, not just on the rental side, but also on the sales side, and they're just running circles around everybody else because they're just working harder than everybody else. And we'd like to leave the office at 10 o'clock at night when all the investment bankers were still there, you know. So we'd see them in the elevators and getting food and going back up. And but our floor was totally vacant. And so we just realized like this is here necessarily for the taking, but it's here to like we have a lane.

SPEAKER_03 8:07

Right. Is that how you would get your first clients? Would you hang out in the elevators? Like, well, how did you get those for the bad client though? But that was some of your your tips.

SPEAKER_00 8:16

So back in the day, like the whole rental business was very non-transparent. And so we got a lot of clients for people looking to how do you win to find an apartment? And then those people become buyers, and then eventually, and you just kind of take the long road. So sometimes you don't try to jam them in someplace. What you're trying to do is basically develop a relationship with them. And so we've had some people that we've that are now like major managing partners at law firms that are like six-time clients. You know, we helped them rent the apartment when they were like an associate, and we were somehow got put on their list at their Simpson Thacker or whatever. And, you know, it's like that's pretty cool, right? And so we were on the list of the perverted brokers. You meet them when they're an associate, you solve their problem, and then you sell them a place. And it just keeps going and going and going. And so then they buy a, you know, $15 million place because they have four kids and they work all the time. And I think that that's the key thing is thinking about it from a long-term perspective. And so we never like cut corners, we never like took the fast road, we kind of took the long road, but built like a solid foundation where now it's like the phone rings all the time.

SPEAKER_02 9:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:21

And because we've established that we can solve this problem for other people. And so I think the other part is that like back then it was about data and it was about like, hey, how do I win this situation? So the data was the big issue. But now that data's kind of been solved, right, and everybody has transparency to what the market is. Well, now it's like, okay, you still have that last mile, right? Like Jeff Bezos always talked about that last mile. Like, how do you solve that problem at the end? How do you get that deal done? And that's the problem with like, hey, you can get faster with all the stuff to get there. But that last bit, like that last bit that, oh, wait, they went and walked the place at the middle of the night, they hadn't walked their dog, and they talked to the doorman, and the doorman said, Yeah, stay away from that corner, right? Like, how do you sense that? And when you s hear that conversation, like that means they're not gonna buy it.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Yeah, the deal's done. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:12

And so if you're the selling agent, like you know that, but it's hard for an AI to do that because they're not there.

SPEAKER_03 10:19

Also, what about whisper listings? I mean, I feel like whisper listings are becoming a bigger thing, and that's sort of you don't have the data, and that's you know, so much that you were championing. So, how do you feel about that? And what are you seeing?

SPEAKER_00 10:30

Well, the the thing is, is like if a property is an A plus property, there's gonna be an A plus buyer. Like that person knows this is, they don't care, they want it. Like we're doing one right now. And it's something that's off market in the West Village with a huge terrace with another broker we know very, very well. And we're getting the deal done because like our buyer realized like, oh my, this is really good. And we're not BSing and the broker on the other end. I said, look, we're open kimono on this thing. I'm gonna tell you everything. Yeah, I'm gonna tell you as it happens. We're not playing games. We want this, let's just get this done. And there were a couple of wrinkles that just happened and we still made it through it, right? But the idea is this thing's not on the market. If it did hit the market, it would go crazy. But they're not listing it on the market because they know that there's a buyer out there if they hit the right sphere of brokers that are there. And that's how things get done.

SPEAKER_03 11:19

Right. And so that's like the opposite of the data. That's like where I feel like so many high transactions are happening, which reminds us of 220. Can you talk us about that deal?

SPEAKER_00 11:30

Oh, yeah. Well, that was interesting. Yeah. That building was fully vetted. You know, we took several people to go see the project, and one of the people that didn't see it, but that we wanted to bring had a bad reputation with someone else who was an investor on the project. So, like the developer said, no, we don't want that person in our building. You can't show it to them. We don't have anything to sell.

SPEAKER_03 11:56

That's tricky.

SPEAKER_00 11:57

So, how do you break that to your buyer, right? And it just is what it is, right? But the buyers that we represented, we do have a confidential agreement on it. But like, I can tell you that when we went to go see the project, we went toured every single project that was close by and even downtown that had anything close to the amenities, the services, all of that. And we did that before we went to 220 because we knew 220 was such a good experience. And it was just gonna blow everything out of the water. And so we saw all of that, and then we went there. And when you go there, it was um at our old building, which is 8887th Avenue when we were at Corcoran. They take you up to this floor and it's a private elevator, and you go in, and then it's this whole experience. And you have basically a built-out model of the apartment and the finishes and all that other stuff. But they walk you through everything and they make sure to stop at this one pedestal and show you the book. And they had a book made about the history of the making of the building. So this is back in like 2018, 2019, something, 2017, whatever it was. And so people didn't make books. Like now you could just make a book like and have it in 48 hours, right? You could just do that online, but you couldn't do that back then. And so these guys went and made a book. And the part I think that was the clincher was where they told us that Zach Posen was the designer for all of the uniforms for the guys that work at the building or the staff that works at the building. And so they showed us like pictures of Zach Posen and the developer and his staff and like the whole thing and trying on different outfits. And when they went through and said, not only does the doorman have a different outfit than the concierge that has a different person than the the elevator man that has a different fixture or a different outfit than the um guy that parks your car, right? They also said it changes every season. Right? Like no one went to that detail.

SPEAKER_02 13:54

Yeah, the details are insane. There's an emotion behind it.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

And so it's like that like totally sunk the buyer. And so afterwards we walked to the site, which is just around, and then I walked them to Bergdorf and we sat on a BG the sixth floor, and we sat there and we talked about it. And we opened the floor plan on the bar and everything, and we just sat there and talked and just had an experience. And my phone was off. You got to turn off your phone because that's the moment that this happens because they're asking you, so what do you think? And I'm like, I don't know if I've ever seen a building like that. And, you know, I'd been there before and they knew that, but the whole concept was is that when you see a building that's that high quality, like in money doesn't matter, then you know they want the best. And that's what ended up winning it, right? Was that moment of them agreeing and and it kind of was like a reality show, actually. Like they had a glass of champagne and I abstained, I had sparkling water.

SPEAKER_03 14:50

Did you have champagne later once it closed? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:53

Well, that was really funny because it was in the middle of COVID, right? So Brooklyn Diner wasn't open yet, right? And or Brooklyn Diner was open only, but in the patio, and that's like downstairs from the Grenado office. So we went to go pick up the closed power of attorney, and no one could go to the closings because it was like during that period. And then Scott and I just sat there and had at Brooklyn Diner, this old place where you know we had gone numerous times because it was our office had been upstairs for all those years while we were building the business. And it was like one of these moments where it's like, that's pretty cool. I remember that for the rest of my life. And you got her holding a big check and everything. But I think it was also too like we were very happy for the clients. And uh, we knew that they had made a good decision. So I know that they would be calling me all the time if they had bought in any one of the other buildings because all those other buildings are negative right now and down, you know, but that was just the best of the best. Like 432 isn't selling at the same number as they were, you know, and 111 is not selling at the same numbers, you know, and neither is Central Park Tower. Like you knew that was the best building. And so you just feel like confident about it. It's like, yeah, that was a good decision. Even though the other guys were paying like four or five percent. You know, we just we didn't care about that. Our biggest thing was like your client needs the right thing.

SPEAKER_02 15:59

I want to go back to the tech platform that you created. Can you tell us a little bit more about that and how it came to fruition?

SPEAKER_00 16:08

Yeah. So our deal with Robert and Ori, who were the founders of of Compass, was like, look, you know, we're gonna help you build a modern brokerage. Because Scott and I had always talked about it, and our clients had always said, why don't you guys just go do your own thing? And why are you giving your commission to Corcoran or all these other? We're like, no, no, it's good. We like it, it's a good situation. But it's just so hard to raise that much money, right? To go jump into a space and all of a sudden play. And Robert and Ori raised incredible amounts of money. Kudos to them for being able to jump into a space. But like when you kind of like think about that much money going in, you're like, okay, well, they're really gonna go build something. And Robert's one thing, because he's just nonstop. I've never seen someone get knocked down so many times and bounce back up. Like he's just and he's just got passion and he's going and he just doesn't stop.

SPEAKER_02 16:59

It's a great lesson.

SPEAKER_00 17:00

Yeah. Like he's he's really, really incredible. And then Orie, on the other hand, like like, you know, he sold to Google like the original, like, hey, you're searching New York and it autofills Yankees or Metropolitan Opera. Like that's his algorithm. Wow. And then he worked there for many years. And then his next exit was to Twitter, which he did the same thing. He had tech chops, and so he could raise money like crazy. And that was also a time when we were coming out of the Great Recession, and there's money everywhere, and you know, the app economy is starting and all this other stuff. And so their ability to go raise money, and plus with Robert's like Goldman Chops and just how he knows everybody in the city, um, they needed some people that were like technically like very proficient, but also too, understood what brokerage needed. We meanwhile left Corcoran after being in their president's council and all of that. Our whole thing was we just wanted to leave, leave calmly. And then once we announced that we had left and all our listings started populating, everybody started calling. Like, what did you guys do? How why did you come? And so then kind of opened the whole train for the rest of all the agents to come from all the other brokerages. It kind of gave it permission because we were like the youngest people of the top agents kind of in that group. Um, but then and it started this tsunami where people just kind of moving around and stuff. And so for us, like we we could have gone to Element or somewhere else, but we would have never done that. Our whole thing was to go build the company. And so that decision was all based on okay, well, we'll get some equity, whatever. But we really wanted to build on Gamon or Tech platform. And so we kind of saw it as a SaaS product because that's ultimately what it is, but it's a brokerage, but it has everything you can need to run your business through. So we started first from where Scott, my business partner, he handled more of the back end like operations. Scott developed like worked with all the product people in order to develop like the whole end back end check processing system and how to get agents paid right away and how to just increase like that flow. And so that now it's like pretty much seamless. Like it just it's very quick, it's fastest in the business, and you didn't have to go outside. So everything's built proprietarily. And what I did was I did more of the like, okay, I need to do an analysis tool, right? Like, how do I do this valuation? How do I pull up all these listings? How do I have them come in? How do I export out? How do I not? How do I manipulate data? How do I just like move things around? Because it wasn't very clear to this thing called collections, which is like, hey, I interact with, I'm more on the buy side and Scott is more on the list side. So I'm like, look, I need to interact with my buyers, I need to keep them posted with everything. So why not create this like folder thing where you can go back and forth and comment, right, with your client and the client and the wife and the mom and the, you know, like all these various different people who are part of the transaction who want to be part of it, right? Sometimes they even put their kids on it, right? Which is great. And then my team can see everything that's going on, like digitally, and then all the alerts come through. And then you know, like, hey, they want to see that or they don't. And so if I'm out and I'm busy or I'm doing a podcast like right now, David for my team is handling it and scheduling it so that, hey, they want to see it tonight, like five o'clock, great. So everything like as far as like efficiencies and things like that got improved. And so when you do raise so much money, you have the ability to actually go and hire these really top-notch people. And it's really, really funny because at the beginning stages, it's all about like the fun, the jack of all trades, the McKinsey consultants, you know, all these people who can build all this cool stuff. But the issue is like they're not specialists, right? So then you when you start growing, you're like, oh, okay, I need someone who knows how to build a CRM. Oh, I need someone who needs to build, you know, something that's B2B, right? Because like, okay, well, they're dealing with title now. So it's like business to business. How do you do that? Right. And so then they bring in those experts. But they're in the phase where it's not like the they're the operational people, they're the builders. So that phase was so messy and so much fun because it was like things would break, and you're like, well, how do we fix this? Right. And so Scott and I spent about 50% of our time on the company and then 50% of our time on our business, which in some respects suffered a little bit. But at the same time, we got to build a machine, right? Which was so much fun and something that we always wanted to do.

SPEAKER_01 21:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:07

And so we wouldn't have just left just to go and like make more money. We had to go actually go build this thing. So it was fun to interact with all the engineers and all these interesting people and people that build these like fast supercomputers and that are here and that are CTO, but they're not the right CTO to take it to the next phase. And when they leave, you're like, oh my God, what are we going to do? But then the next CTO that comes in is like, oh, that's for this phase of the company. And we needed to raise that round and to go. So you start learning about like, okay, well, how are rounds raised, like in the tech space? Like, okay, you're in with people from Discovery or all these like interesting like hedge funds or private equity firms or VC people, or it's the VC part of the large private equity firm because they realize they want to get in early to know all where all the messes is, so that later on, if they need to take over a company because that happens too, because 80% of the companies don't make it. And then maybe of that 80%, maybe like 10% are good. So it's like that you could actually turn around and make something.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

They have a deeper understanding of the operations.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

For us, like it was awesome. And at the same time, it was like our clients loved it because they're like, they were along for the ride.

SPEAKER_01 22:05

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:05

You know, we give them updates, and like it'd be fun. Like, dude, we're root rooting for you, we're cheering for me, this brokerage bump sucked. People don't like the process. But when there's something interesting and fun, you know, and there was a lot of overlap with like Robert and Ori, because a lot of our clients are just younger and they were like in tech or in finance, and they all know that those two guys. So it's like it was a really interesting time and period. But I think the best part was you're surrounded by so many smart people that know what to do, but don't understand real estate. And so then when it started to scale and go bigger and bigger across the country, then it was like even more problems to solve. So like it's like Robert would say, Hey, come with me to San Diego. We're gonna try to recruit a bunch of agents there. And I'm from San Diego, so it's like, all right, let's go. Or come with me to LA, we're opening the LA office. I'm like, great, let's do it. And I'd get on a plane, be there for a day with him, and then fly back. And then we go to Boston the next day. So it was like we had a lot of fun and it was a good time.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

There's a common theme that I think you have mentioned throughout this entire episode, and that's innovation. I would love to hear your thoughts and advice on anyone that's building something new, like you did, and how best to navigate that process.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

I think you just gotta go in all in. You just gotta go for it. I'll give you an example. It's non-tech related. It's probably the most anti-tech thing ever. So my wife and I like the Cafe Carlisle. We go like all the time because it's just it's just fun. It's like old New York. You turn off your phone, you have to tip a captain as well. Like just it's crazy. But the room is like so special, right? Last night, I don't even remember the name of the she's 27 years old. And when she was two years old, she was watching The Wizard of Oz. And as she was watching it, she watched it over and over again. And then she learned how to sing the songs. And by four, she was singing all the songs like perfectly and on pitch. And then then so she's 27, but we're in this place, and she's singing Cole Porter songs, and she's singing, you know, Rogers and Hammer State, all these like show tunes and all these old people are there, and they're just like loving it. You know, these like 70-year-olds, like hilarious. They're probably, you know, and my wife and I are just sitting there watching this whole thing because she's just sit telling jokes and saying, you know, about her friends who they don't realize, like that she didn't write that song, that actually whoever wrote it wrote it. And um, she leaned in, she talked about how she leaned into it. And when she moved to New York City, it hit her in the face and she had to like build again and like build herself up, but she knew she wanted it. And here she is, like 27, like something like that. Right. And so I think it's it's it's like that with everything. And you just gotta bounce back up. Like, and I think like when you're establishing like where you want to go, you should set up like who you are and is it that right place and time in your life? Like right now with three boys, I don't think I'd have the capacity to do what I did back then because they're all young and we could handle it, but now it's like bigger kids, they're leaving home soon. You know, you have to make that compromise, right? And so I think like you have to know is this this this moment in time and space that you need to go do you for this? And if you're aligned with that mission and you're willing to break through walls and you're all in, then go for it. Just like the singer last night. And every time I've seen people succeed, it's because they do that.

SPEAKER_03 25:13

Right. Is there a moment that you remember where you had to bounce back, like something you know that really knocked you over?

SPEAKER_00 25:20

You maybe you lost a client or I mean, yeah, it happens every day, but like I don't know, you just keep getting up.

SPEAKER_02 25:28

What about building that tech platform? Is there a moment that you were terrified and you said, I'm still just gonna go for it? I mean, I I would assume there were troubles and issues that you had to bounce back from with that, especially any kind of innovation. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:44

So, like, okay, so what happens? This is what happens, right? You have a battle for the product roadmap because there's only a certain amount of engineers and a certain amount of product people. And so some product people are like super wanna build collections, and some people want to build marketing center, right? And it was this big battle that divided the company, right? And it was like these engineers who are over here that are old school that have worked in LinkedIn and Amazon and whatever, they want to do the collections thing because they think it's a freaking good idea. But then the short-term need is like, hey, we're spending so much money on these stupid show sheets and all these things. Why not be able to just build this thing in-house, which makes it incredible, moves around the images? When theoretically you could just do that in like Google if you really wanted to, but they wanted to do that and it was an easier, shorter win. And the other one was longer. So it took like resources to go build that. And I was like, guys, we have to have the collections because for the buy side, it's way better. But from a business standpoint, like it was like, hey, listings actually bring more money, right? Because most likely that you're gonna sell them, right? So for the company, that was a business decision because they needed to show, hey, look, revenue is doubling, tripling, quadrupling every year. And we're doing this thing, which will focus on the listings, not the buy side, right? And the listings, one investor was told like that drives revenue, right? And it's directly correlated. So it was a very interesting, like, and I was like, no, but this is so much better. And you're taking resources, but you know, it got delayed two months. But when you're in tech startup world, like that two months is like an eternity.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

Everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:08

And you lose people along the way. So it was really interesting to like go to those going away parties and whatever. And it's like, hey, sorry, it didn't work. And then you realize, like, not everybody's there for the ride the whole way through, right? And sometimes they're not aligned. And it's this moment where you're like, oh, that that's how this works. Like, I'm in it till way beyond today, but not many people from the corporate side were because they're just in that period for that period of time. And some people are just there for the equity, and some people are just there for a resume builder or to work with Ori or whatever. That was a really interesting thing because it was like, wait, I felt like the ship was breaking apart, and like, you know, but but at the end of the day, like it wasn't like any legal challenges or anything like that. It was like, oh wow, we're not all aligned.

SPEAKER_02 27:53

But that's a learning curve, right? And in that innovative process. And to Alexandra's question, that's a great example of having to bounce back and realize that this is just part of the process and that's building and that's growing and that's innovation.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 28:08

Right?

SPEAKER_00 28:08

The funny thing is like you stay friends with everybody. Just because you're like, okay, day one, but like, oh, maybe that was the right thing to do. And you look back, you're like, okay, that was the right thing to do for that moment in time. And these people weren't aligned because they didn't realize like that was more important than this.

SPEAKER_03 28:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 28:21

So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:22

So you're not building a new tech stack this year, but what are you excited about for this year?

SPEAKER_00 28:27

Well, so like actually I'm I'm excited about a lot of things about our team, what we're doing. We have a really like fine-tuned machine at this moment. I don't even deal with things anymore, like on a lot of levels, just because I don't need to know about that anymore. And I've just done it before. And so I'm really excited about operationally, like what we can do and how we can function and how David's like the go-between between me and Scott, and then Nora runs our team. She runs operations. But David's kind of like a senior agent, and he kind of works between me and Scott. So he covers for Scott, he covers for me. And so in that, it frees me up to like go a little bit further out, like maybe do a podcast and chat with you guys today. Or like just take time to think because we're like the next phase of the company. So like I'm kind of being pulled in a little bit more again now on the on the tech stuff again, because the company isn't AI native. So it's like, okay, well, we got to build the whole new sex stack. So they've already started doing that. And now it's like, okay, well, we really need the agents involved. And Mark, how much can you come back? And it's a lot easier now because there's a whole history to it. And so doing that's gonna be fun. Um that's exciting.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

That is exciting.

SPEAKER_00 29:34

Yeah, so I'm excited about that, but mostly about the team and like watching people on our team grow. And like, you know, like Cameron from the team recently did like an $11 million deal, and it was like pretty awesome, you know, and it was nice to see that. And and you know, Jen on the team is doing great. And and so I feel like that whole thing is like helping mentor and helping people like so that I have a little more time to think and see, okay, we're we're going through this big change in the world. And how do you adapt to that? How's your business adapt to that? How do you stay ahead of everybody else? And so so yeah, it's a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_03 30:08

I think what you've created with your team and being able to not be in the weeds is every founder's dream, including mine.

SPEAKER_01 30:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:15

And I feel I'm I'm getting closer on that journey, but what advice? How how do you go about doing that and building that team that you can trust and can operate at such a high level?

SPEAKER_00 30:26

It's like ego, right? Like, oh, they can't do it as well as I can, right? But then again, like maybe they can't, or maybe they'll innovate it and make it better because you've just been doing things the same way, just because that's the way it's done. And maybe they figure out a better way. So you just have to trust that your team is good and empower them. And then just make sure that they're aligned. Like, are you all on the same mission? Right. And knowing when you're not aligned anymore, right? And setting those expectations. I think that's the biggest thing in life. It's the biggest thing in like marriages, the biggest thing in business partnership. It's like, all right, I'm good for it for another 10 years, but at some point, like I'm done. And Scott and I haven't had obviously that conversation. But the thing is, is like, where are you in your life? Having that honest conversation with everybody and saying, look, this is what I'm building. If you want to go, let's go. And I think also too making sure that they get rewarded for, you know, compensated for the things that they do.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

I want to go back to one thing that you had mentioned when you were building your clientele. And you had mentioned that you were in it for the long term. Yep. Right. And that was your vision. You were building it for the long term. I'd like to touch on what that entails and any advice you'd give to our listeners on trust, loyalty, networking, and building that network.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

Yep. I think like there was a gentleman when we were at City, his name was Greg Young, and he taught the class for like when you're starting out as an agent. And he had us read this book, and it was like, I can't remember the name of it, it was like he was a 10-minute salesman or something like that. And it's it was all about how everybody is a salesperson, right? And I was just like, and I had read Death of a Salesman when I was a kid, and my I had some like PTSD from my mom telling me that my uncle like was a great man, but he was always salesy and whatever, it's something, you know? And so I always, and I'd read Death of a Salesman, and I was like, oh man, I I I'm not really a salesperson. I'm more of an advisor. I'm more of a so I never thought of myself as that. Like, but then when you start reading it, you start thinking about like, okay, well, a priest of a congregation or a rabbi is a salesperson. He has to sell or she has to sell the sh the flock on, like, hey, this is the mission. The CEO is the salesperson, the president's a salesperson. Like, everybody's a salesperson because you're selling people on a mission that what you're doing is really what it is, right? But no one looks at it that way, right? And so you just have to go to like the people that you're helping, right? And it's not really a salesperson like you're trying to sell them something. It's like you're there to provide a service. And if that service works, great. If it doesn't, it doesn't. And you can't jam it through. And I think that's where a lot of people get in trouble is they try to jam stuff through. Right. So what you should do is have, and I was lucky to have, you know, a little bit of a cushion just because my wife was working and so forth, that I was able to take the long road. But I probably couldn't have lived with myself if I had taken the shortcut, right? Because I know that if I keep just kind of like giving and kind of there's another friend of ours, Adam, he always talks about like planting seeds everywhere. Right. And then just like whenever they water it and then whatever, just pop it just grows. Like, and then it's all it's all over the place. But but Greg also talked about Greg Young back in the day was like if you do this right, right, then the business will just flow. That's the goal. And I feel like that's the right thing when people are willing to give your name because you've helped them two or three times, give their like that's the best marketing, that's the best advertising, that's the best thing.

SPEAKER_02 33:46

It's genuine, it's authentic, thoughtful.

SPEAKER_00 33:48

Yeah. And so I think like that's the the whole concept. It's not just a craziness that we deal with. And I think it's also too, it's like, you know, if you're in this business, it's a people business, and you're dealing with people who don't do this all the time.

SPEAKER_03 34:02

Right. Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:02

So your job is to like make sure and make it easy for them, right? The friction that they have is the big friction points. Yeah. Like, can they overcome those versus the little things?

SPEAKER_03 34:12

I'm so glad you brought up this book because I was talking to someone earlier today that I think people really don't feel comfortable with being in this sales role.

SPEAKER_01 34:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:23

And they don't know how to market. And so I think everybody should read this book, including myself.

SPEAKER_00 34:29

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I'll send it to you.

SPEAKER_03 34:32

Yeah, please do. I I want to read this.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

It's a quick read, too. The book is just so simple. And it just kind of puts you in the right mindset. Like you look at somebody like Elon, right? Like that guy is so genuinely what he is, right? Because he's just that's what he is. And people believe and they get on that mission, and like, dude, they're putting rockets into space and building, you know, chips that we're putting in people's heads that are, you know, helping people that can't move. Like, like takes a lot to do that.

SPEAKER_02 34:59

Right. I was at a dinner last night and someone had said, the host actually, she said, you know, the more authentic I am, the more I have this following, and people want to hear what I have to say.

SPEAKER_01 35:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:14

Because there's no bullshit involved, right? It's it's exactly what it is. And the right people are coming to her and the wrong people are falling off. And I think that's beautiful. I think everyone should live that way. And I I think it kind of goes back to your point of it.

SPEAKER_00 35:31

Yeah, it's it's hard though, too, because it's like, you know, we're all at different points on Masla's hierarchy of needs and you know, who needs revenue, who needs money, who doesn't. Like, and I think like if we really are looking towards the next phase of it, it's like, how do you overlap with everybody? Right? My mother was born in a refugee camp after the Second World War, they're fleeing communism. So the first five years of life she spent in the camp. I keep thinking to myself, like, what was that like? Right. And like, how do they get food? And you know, they had got transferred all over Europe and whatever before they were able to come here. But the idea, like, she always told me like everybody would kind of help and pitch in. And it where they could help, they could not, and you know, like, and some people would get in trouble and they'd leave. But it's all these like overlapping, like this whole thing. And I think that that's the key. If you're your authentic self and you're on a mission somewhere, if people are along for two months or two days or two hours, whatever, they're there and they're it's a great time. And maybe they latch on later on. That's the part where we're we're not so worried about subsistence anymore, right? And it's more like you're in your head and just kind of going forward.

SPEAKER_02 36:32

I love that. As we wrap up this episode, I always want to ask, why do you love what you do?

SPEAKER_00 36:40

This city is is so incredible. I mean, it's just the layers of it and the history of it. And you know, if you believe in it, then it's great, right? Like if you believe in love what you do, then like real estate, I just love it. It's like in my bones, it's fun. You get to help people, you're not really hurting anybody. You're just trying to get stuff done for people in their lives, you're providing them shelter or get helping them leave a place to have some equity to go start the next chapter. So I think it's it's it's a fun thing. It's a fun, fun, fun way to live a life.

SPEAKER_02 37:15

That's a great answer. So, for anyone who wants to reach Mark or learn more about Paradigm Advisory, where should they go? And is there a type of client or situation where paradigm advisory is the right call that people might not immediately think of?

SPEAKER_00 37:30

The way I think about it is it's all about advisory services initially to figure out what people want. Right? That's the advising part. And then when it's time to broker it, okay, well, what's the playing field? What's the scenario? Let's go broker it, right? So that's the way we think about it. We don't think about it like, oh, the paycheck's out here. We think about, okay, how do we solve this? What do they want? And then how do we get there? But the brokering part's at the end. That foundational part is the advisory part. So that's what we do. Follow us on social at Paradigm Advisory, Real Estate, and I guess we have a website and all sorts of things. But we're at Compass and probably be here for a long time. Love it. And uh thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_03 38:06

And for everyone listening, every episode of Dealflow Diaries is on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Audible. Follow us on Instagram and YouTube at Dealflow Diaries.