The "Special" Effects of Horror Movies

Joining me today is SFX artist, actor, and filmmaker, Joe Castro. Joe and I are gonna have another enthralling chat about horror movies, why we love them, and how they have changed over the past 40 years. Prepare to hear about Joe's latest projects, his past works, and why he and both live and breathe horror. Chatterbox is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, and YouTube at @Chatterbox-94. Don't forget to check me out on IG @atkmedia_ #horror #podcasts #sfx #theundead #chatterbox

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Acclaimed master of horror and filmmaker John Carpenter once said, horror is a reaction. It's not a genre. I would have to say that is 100% accurate. Today we're going to be circling back to horror. As many of you know, it's probably my favorite genre of films out there. But it is also an art in ways that people don't understand. In art in how it is created, how it affects us, how we look at the world, and how even movies have proven that truth is way stranger than fiction. So sit back, relax, put on your headphones or your airpods, whatever you use to listen. And hey, let's get started. Hey folks, how did you get here? Welcome to another chat of the channel. Joining with me is a master called filmmaker, special effects artist, and a fanatic fanatic myself. Joe Catch, Joe, pretty chat.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

Hey everybody, how's it going?

SPEAKER_02 1:10

So Joe, Joe, let's talk about how your speciality and stuff like that. People when they see horror movies, they just they don't really understand the work it takes into creating the undead.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

That's why you can watch like really old movies from like the 60s and 70s and still be like thoroughly entertained by the you know overabundance of creativity and the obnoxiousness of the special effects in the story, you know. It's like it's all for all forgivable as long as it's entertaining, you know. And I I think that mainstream and then the people that don't like horror are kind of like, you know, they just don't get it. They don't get it. It's just not in there. It's it's it is it's of no use to them to be able to escape and just to be entertained for 90 minutes with something that's just imaginate imaginative, you know, escaping to another world. They just don't get it. You know, I remember um being uh at uh a family function, uh, and uh I met like a whole bunch of like uh cousins on my husband's side of the family and uh that I had never met before. And she was like bragging about me and going, oh yeah, we just came from this uh convention where Joe did like a like a special effects demo and he made this guy up into this zombie covered in maggots. And he said, um I pulled out the picture to show them, and they looked at it, they're like, you know, I they didn't have to say anything, but I could just see like the look on their faces, like, well, what like like how do you pay your rent with that? What what do you do with that? Like what what how what's that worth? What what what does that mean? You know, they just didn't get it, you know. And uh uh and that's okay, you know, that's okay. They don't have to. We live in a really big universe where you know there's like all kinds of exceptions and all kinds of different flavors, and um, yeah, so yeah, yeah. Hope that explained the question.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

I I'm sure I'm sure people uh I I was intending to take a talk more. I was just like, which is why I had my wife who loves more.

SPEAKER_00 3:55

So I'm a woman. Yeah, I I I've even had I know exactly what you're talking about. I have um uh uh long before I met my husband, I went on our first date with somebody, and uh I brought him back over to the house and uh we ate dinner and then I put on City of the Living Dead, the Fulci film Gates of Hell, and uh we watched it. And uh at the end of the film, they were like, great choice, you know, great. And we had a friendship where we were friends for a while, but and that one didn't work out. But you know, if you can put on City of the Living Dead, and then they they're like right on, then you're you're probably gonna have you know some fun, you know, probably gonna get along. How about you talk about some of the Roger that you had worked on the stuff for working with the nod? Sure. Yeah. I mean there's a couple of things I'm super excited about. Uh next month, uh July the 19th or the 14th. Uh no, I'm sorry, July the 10th. Uh a movie called Sunset Strip Killers is coming out, and uh it's directed by Chad Farron. He's a true crime master. I mean he just knows exactly how to make these like true crime masterpieces. And he he he makes films and he uses true crime killers, serial killers, and he frames the movie as if it were like an actual slasher film. So it's everything we love about slasher movies, but with true crime stories. And um he uh he made a movie called Sunset Strip Killers about the and it's an actual uh this couple that went on a killing spree. They picked up they would pick up people and they would murder them here in Hollywood on some of the Sunset Strip, mostly prostitutes and girls that you know had no connection with anybody else. But uh I get I played Ron Jeremy in the movie and uh super excited about that coming out. It's my first nude scene on camera, and I'm I'm real, I'm real, I'm real excited about that. And uh uh and then uh I just finished shooting another film in um but that film has a lot of gore in it too. The Sunset Strip Killer's got decapitations and people getting shot right in the face with a 22 rifle. I mean, just you know, just really graphic stuff. Uh and then we have um a movie called uh Are you familiar- Do you remember uh Richard Ramirez, the Night Stalker in the early thing? So uh Chad Farron has directed this like quintessential piece. It's called The Devil's Disciple, the Night Stalker, because it was uh commonly known that Richard Ramirez worshiped the devil. And uh uh so I got to I get to play Richard Ramirez's father in the film, but I also created all the special effects of the movie. So we have all kinds of, you know, I can't really go into too much detail about the deaths, but Richard Ramirez was a very disturbed man. Yeah, he did all kinds of things. He not only did he, you know, shoot people right in the face, he stabbed them, he pulled out their eyeballs, he strangled them, he electrocuted them, uh raped them. I mean, just you just name it. And uh this is all uh all in the film. So if you like true crime and you like uh it I kind of it kind of reminds me of like a like a first-person video game slasher movie with Richard Ramirez. That's how I describe it. That's exactly so. If you kind of like that, you're gonna love this new movie. It's called The Devil's Disciple. It's a it's a the Night Stalker. How did it feel having the serial killer killer? You know, I was I was so honored. I was so honored that the Chad asked me to do that, to be uh to play that role. I I don't have a lot of lines in it, but I do have some stuff that you know definitely, you know, I sprinkled throughout the film that I'm very proud of uh show up on camera. And uh yeah, working with like a director like Chad Farron is he's just a master at what he does. Like uh and he works for the same core group of people I've probably done, I think I've done 11, maybe 12 movies with him now. And he just has everything, he's like a well, was it like a well-run chip, or you know, it's just he knows exactly how to use everyone's strong points. And uh he's a master at the shooting practical effects and uh lighting and working with the actors and casting, and he writes everything, he writes almost every script he can he produces. Um I'm not sure if he wrote the Richard Romero story himself, but he definitely puts his own finishing touches on on set with everything. And uh so I'm super excited about that. But the big film that I'm really excited about, uh which is being pre uh in pre-pro uh post-production right now, it's called um The Morning Architect. And it's morning spelled M-O-U-R-I-N-G. We're like, oh, the morning. He's like crying, the morning, mourning the death of his wife. Anyways, uh, and I played the morning architect in the film. It's uh a big special effects masterpiece. It's directed by Joe Allo and produced by Dave and Dexler in Florida, and it stars Debbie Rashawn, Brink Stevens, Alyssa Dowling, and uh Missy, where were uh oh uh uh Deborah Lamb, uh uh four uh major screen queens. Also uh Rhonda Shear from Up All Nights in it. Uh and um it's uh it's just uh it's uh it's it's everything we love about about 70s and 80s uh horror films. It's got a big creepy on it house, it's got the dead, it's got butchering, it's got on-screen kills, it has a fantasy element, plenty of blood special effects, and it's got a great new original story. And I I get to play the killer. So do you think it would make Jane Captain proud? Proud. I think yeah, it's definitely a very entertaining film. I uh and uh I think that uh you know if you love horror, it's something you would absolutely watch. You know, there's a lot of stuff that comes out this coming that that comes out lately that seems like it's um uh it's just a uh uh like a like a word I want to use. I guess it's a cheap Xerox, a bad Xerox of things that have been done before. This is not that film. This is definitely uh a brand new take on a haunted house story and story of the living dead and uh ghosts, and um uh it's kind of like a dark, twisted kind of love story and in its own right. So yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:05

Yeah, every time every time I've seen I've seen a few of the horror horse in the past. And I do feel like recycling stuff from the past.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

Trying to take on it, but uh succeeding when I mean, you know, the stuff that was done in the past is you know, you always go back to the original source material if you want to do something really good and maybe put your own spin on it. Um but when I was growing up, I mean, I'm I'm gonna I'm 56 this year. How old are you? I'm gonna be 32 next month. Okay, you're 13 next month. So when I was growing up in like the 70s and 80s, it was really um special when a movie came out because of two things. One, uh there was no there was no upfront press about it, nothing was released on social media. So when something came out, it was like fresh, it was always super fresh. And two, every film tried to be truly original. It was something you you know, that was like a thing that directors and producers and studios uh uh shot for. That's what we're trying to do. Can we produce something that's never been done before? You know, like one of a kind. You have to come here and see it, you know. And um, and uh I I'm always trying to go back to that. That's that's what I've that's what I'm always trying to get back to because there's something magical about going to have a movie experience and seeing a film unlike anything you've ever seen before, you know. And uh, you know, sometimes it's very hard to get an audience to like something truly original, you know. Uh, but uh things come around, eventually it all comes or comes around, and uh you know, there's always like, oh, that's you know, you're way ahead, either you're way ahead of your time, or you know, people don't like it now, but then it becomes populated, you know, many, many, many years later. And uh so but yeah, I think being truly original is uh super important. And I feel like because I'm a strong writer, as well as like an actor filmmaker.

SPEAKER_02 12:10

And horror is the one that you struggle with. I I can't get it right because the first I ever wrote was the dark horror comedy. Which is great, great. But if you really really want to establish yourself yourself as a horror filmmaker, as a filmmaker, you have to go to go to dark to dark levels.

SPEAKER_00 12:34

Yeah, I think uh you're right about that. People these days are have a very limited uh attention span, and it's important that uh you know if you're going to ask for their time to watch what you're doing, that you actually entertain them uh and uh don't waste their time because you know it's easy with a click of a button or swipe or whatever, you move on to something new. Uh so uh yeah, going to dark places, uh yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 13:08

And and you really gotta be willing to like tap into a different mind of yours.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

You can be the most insane and and clear conscious person on our willing to think like a psycho psychopath.

SPEAKER_00 13:23

Now in the in the morning architect, we have a lot I had a lot of people come in on set that I asked them to get naked because they had never been on naked on camera before, and uh they were gonna be you know the undead, you know. And I, you know, it's one thing to put like you know makeup on someone's face and on someone's hands and run around with dirty clothes. It's another thing to have a completely nude piece of art that's rotting on camera, you know. Like when in the seen The Shining, the original Shiny, the Shining? Of course. I mean, original shiny. So when the old woman gets up out of the bathtub and starts coming, you know, that whole that whole scene, you know, yeah, there you go. You know, if she would have been wearing a bathrobe, it wouldn't be the same. No, it wouldn't. So these are the things we're talking about. Like you got to go to the nth level for that. I think because of so many movie stars over the years have done nudity and sex tapes and you know, OnlyFans and all this stuff, uh it's not really a shocker anymore. You know, when I tell people I did my first nude scene, it's like, okay, you know, I didn't know I would do it at 56, but you know, it's I'm probably more proud now than I would have been years ago. So uh it's all good. It's all good.

SPEAKER_02 14:42

It takes a man to do full frontal man.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Uh yeah, well, uh uh let's see. This one didn't have full frontal yet. Um saving that one for something else. I've yeah, you know, it's hidden. Uh I did do full backmuddy in the morning architect, and but then Sons of Killers uh did my first. It was kind of a it was it's in it. Well, you'll y'all I'll let the audience uh wait and see that.

unknown 15:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

I'm sure it's gonna be very, very revealing. Uh it'll be fun. It's a fun, it's fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:14

When you are doing like these special special effects, creating the undead and your zombies, your zombies, your demons, and what do you what do you what do you look for?

SPEAKER_00 15:27

Where's the drawing? Yeah, yeah. I I I I've said this before. You know, I mean, uh see, I grew up on a goat ranch in Holodas, Texas, uh back in the 70s. I was born in 1970, and um uh there was a we had a slaughterhouse on the goat ranch, and I saw you know roadkill almost every day, being out in the middle of nowhere, and you know, just it was I saw death everywhere. It was just it was a very uh traumatizing childhood and grew up in a very very harsh, brutal reality. Some people would say no, others would say yes. Um, but uh uh you know yeah, it was pretty gross. And so I know that when I'm doing something, if I don't make myself ill, then it's not it's not right. Or, you know, if I I when I'm looking for reference, I I go to something, someplace that makes me feel ill, you know, and uh that's mother nature. All that sucked is mother nature's nature. So it was nature, and uh so I use mother nature as my reference uh always. That's where I go to. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:39

Yeah, yeah, because I because like like like we were talking about earlier. I like to talk on on uh horror pass, real horror torture method that were used in medieval times. Even throughout the drug century. If the audience finds out that that real thing, that's gonna be more.

SPEAKER_01 17:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:04

Yeah. Sure, yeah. And there's plenty of reference material online now for stuff, you know. But I think I think uh I think uh one one of my one of my greatest mentors, his name is Rob Berman, his father was Tom Berman, he did all these great movies from the 70s and 80s, uh uh Cat People, The Beast Within, he did work on Ghostbusters and John Carpenter's remake of the thing, and uh the this movie called Prophecy about this big mutant bear was one of the big hits he worked on. Anyways, he said if you can't master fantasy, oh no, if you can't master reality, you'll never master fantasy. And uh that made a lot of sense, you know, and um and so that's why when I'm making anything that's of horror or terror, you have to you have to you have to it has to be based in reality. If not, people won't understand what you're doing. It's if it's too abstract, it won't people understand what you're trying to do.

SPEAKER_02 17:59

One of my favorite forms of psychological gets you all dressed up.

SPEAKER_00 18:15

What's your opinion about psychological horror? Yeah, that's yeah, I mean ultimately that's really the only thing in horror that scares me the most is when it's going with my mind and my emotions. I am very empathic, and so I'm very deeply sensitive to like, you know, animals being killed on on screen or hurt or you know, uh other empaths being taken advantage of and hurt and this sort of thing. And you know, I think rectors that work in cinema that tap into that sort of stuff, uh, you know, they understand what they what they're doing, you know. And they understand uh how to reach uh those uh levels of fear in their audience, you know. Uh and uh ultimately that's that's good horror, you know. That's that's that's uh horror isn't just blood. In fact, uh blood is not horror at all. It's it's always the the moments before the blood. A lot of people don't realize that. Like a lot of a lot of filmmakers these days don't realize that. They think because the move the movie is really gory, somehow it's a horror film. No, that's it's not true at all. Horror comes from the anticipation of being hurt or harmed or tricked or fooled or you know, misled or abused or whatever it is. And um uh that was a bit that was that was that was a big deal in the 70s and 80s when they were making more films. And today it's not as as relevant, except for the real good ones. Uh I like that movie Um Talk to Me. I thought they did a really good job of that. My wife. Yeah, it's a great film. Yeah. Did you see Obsession? I haven't seen Obsession yet. Haven't seen it yet. Uh uh we'll see it, but um I'm looking forward to it. I heard this very good. Yeah, Backrooms is also very kind of like a dark film, but it's very more surreal. Uh which I'm probably gonna really like backrooms because I like that kind of surreal fantasy kind of stuff too. I like horror films, but I'm not really I you know, I'm I I I like to I just like to be entertained. You know, don't bore me to death, don't don't make me watch paint dry, you know, and which is what most these you know they call they call them slow burns, but that's not what it is. It's just there's no substance, and so you're waiting for to get to the stuff that you bought your ticket for, and uh it's that everything else is just fluff and filler to get there. Um, but uh, I just want to be entertained. It doesn't matter if it's horrifying or it's fantasy or what it is, just keep the story moving and entertain me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Yeah, what was it? Marlon Marlon Wayne said this about this about the new scary movie. He said, We don't make movies for critics. We make movies, make movies, entertain, entertained, have a good time and laugh.

SPEAKER_00 21:04

Yes.

unknown 21:04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:06

It's entertainment, that's what they are. Movies are neither good or bad, though. I believe they either entertain the person who's watching them or they don't. And um, if you can make a movie that uh uh holds the uh the attention of the viewer, then uh you know that and that person is you, then you've done your job because we're not mind readers and we're not telepathic. We we don't know what everybody wants at any given moment. And you know, it's uh that's just the way the world works. You know, art is subjective, and that's what films are. They're art.

SPEAKER_02 21:38

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 21:40

What was it?

SPEAKER_02 21:41

Um you were uh at Jimmy Kimmel Campbell. Please interlock.

SPEAKER_00 21:48

Oh well uh we went on Jimmy Kimmel. What my husband is in the uh the he's uh he's an Emmy Award winning editor, same as Stephen Escobar, and uh he uh is on the uh the voting board of uh uh the voting for the Emmy. So he's a he's an Emmy he's gonna vote. And Jimmy Kimmel was having an Emmy nomination party where, you know, he invited uh the uh you know he has those a big party and invites uh people to attend and and you know show them uh you know have a real good time and you know say please uh please uh vote for me you know and uh so we got to go to the Emmy party and um it was great it was fantastic to be able to be surrounded by industry professionals and be there to support Jimmy and all that he's done and uh yeah it's a guy I get to go into the studio and and just really be personal with uh one-on-one with uh people right there in the industry you know it's they're they're they're human too and you know and uh it's a definitely a a a really a once in a lifetime experience to go and and be able to celebrate with someone that you respect and be a part of the entire uh what do you call it the entire experience of of living a life uh in in Hollywood and and being a part of the uh industry yeah yeah yeah of course of course it's a magic magical industry but also a dark dark industry but but I I I don't really know what I'm talking about the Hollywood because I was stuff out of your very young age. Okay. Yeah yeah yeah I yeah I kind of feel like there's something uh morbid about any industry uh uh there's always some sort of yin and yang right there's always you have to have one can't have one without the other blessing and a curse. Yeah well you know I can only imagine what kind of like horrific things they do like in the medical industry. You keep making money and you know oh what they do in the political world to keep making money. You know it's just like yeah I hear you you know I saw I saw murder in front yeah I'm yeah in the medical industry yeah yeah yeah I can I I completely understand yeah she was she was sentenced dead when they brought her to her and like I'm like she ain't gonna make it make it yeah I can I can absolutely without a shadow of doubt say that there's a lot of malpractice and accidental deaths and actual deaths and all that stuff so yeah most definitely what is what is it I I've been trying to look at that I started writing horror one thing then that I was I thought I thought horror movie movie is what about a horror spell yeah yeah I know they they that's a thing they people like to collect Christmas horror movies yeah yeah yeah but I mean like I mean the not ridiculous because if you look at a lot of the Christmas Christmas movies they make just more and more ridiculous every year. Right right yeah Christmas shark or Santa Shark or Santa Claus and Werewolf or yeah yeah I get it. You know I mean like I said it's all kinds of flavors for different people you know yeah I mean when I was first working in Hollywood back in the early 90s I I worked on a movie called Evil Tunes with Red Ellen Ray about killer cartoons basically or about a cartoon a kind of an animated character that comes to life out of a book and many years later my husband and I made a movie called Terror Tunes which is about uh killer cartoons made by the devil and uh you know it's a very uh obnoxious uh idea but uh I think uh with the charm of it is it's done in a very classic kind of horror film kind of way and and uh the every time I watched it I realized the cast they did they took it seriously when they made it it wasn't that they didn't think of it as being funny at all when people died in the film at the hands of these cartoon characters they showed uh actual pain and terror when they were dying which is why I think it makes a good horror film. Now whether or not the movie's funny that's on the way the audience perceives it I don't think that when you're making a horror film you shouldn't set out to make a horror comedy like the comedy just comes from the writing not don't be silly about it you know I mean you you you like the original creep show is probably considered a horror comedy but there's still a lot of scary stuff in that film. Yeah and it's because everybody played it very seriously you know and uh the comedic humor unfold unfolds naturally on its own that's right yeah like Adrian Barbeau uh and uh the story of uh the uh the crate you know the the the woman that was Billy play Billy uh the the bitch the the the wife you know she was like the comic relief in the in the film in that portion of the film and she did a great job she wasn't trying to be funny she was just a bitch and and uh that's where all the comedy came from she was great fantastic I look at Shelley DeValy DeVal as well as being relief relief the shine is shining okay all right yeah well it just seems to be um the way she the way she does she got those great expressions yeah she's got some classic one of a kind expressions yeah well that movie broke her broke her uh do you ever see um the Witches of Eastwickes of Eastwick haven't seen it heard of it heard of it Michelle Pfeiffer Cher and um uh Michelle Pfeiffer Scher and Susan Saran and played these three witches and uh Shelly Duvall plays the wife of a man that runs the local newspaper and uh she uh you if you you have to see it I'm just gonna say you have to go after we're done if you have some time this weekend you should watch it the Witches of East Wick. Yeah she uh yeah yeah they put a spell on her in the film and she um she does this one scene that's just out of this world so anyhow yeah she's classic oh she God was yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean she didn't exactly easy death person because she became a train wreck train wreck and oh oh sad that little yeah so so what wisdom would you get would give people who want who want to break into the industry industry and just focus on horror alone alone yeah well you know I mean I probably would say that your your one of your big greatest assets in the working in the film industry is going to be your your circle of friends you know um you know the people that are at the top uh really were surrounded by you know people that uh you know push them in the right direction pointing them in the right directions and having a good solid group of friends really really makes a big difference you know um and people forget about that they think that maybe it's just all talent or all writing or all you know whatever but uh I mean that's why so many bad movies are made because the people that are making them have good friends they're friends in high places you know uh so networking is a very very big tool very big tool so it's real I would say it's probably at least 50% of your job networking. Yeah at least 50% I I've come to come to discover that on my own and if you're not a social being uh then you need to have someone on your team that that who is you know as far as working in the industry and if not you'll you'll you'll stay stuck you know I don't care how much talent you have. And then of course once you get your foot in the door then you must deliver. You cannot continue to climb high if you have nothing to once you get there you to you know uh uh to remain remain teachable because people come in at you know like your age and they think they they're the best of the best and then um they don't uh they they don't remain teachable and they go nowhere. I mean um I'm not sure you know like you have a lot of these directors that start off at number one nowadays where do you go when you're at number one yeah it's gonna be hard it's gonna be it's it's more it's a more of a difficult it's a more of a difficult career when you start off at the top. I mean look at Linda Blair. I mean countless people when you start off at the top you gotta be real careful. So um you know the everything seems if people look like they got it easier or that things are easy for them just remember there's always the exception you don't know what's going on behind closed doors uh you don't really know how much money they made from it or who made the money from the success or you know I mean look at the people that made the Blair Witch they had they start off at number one and I don't think the director made a movie after that I'm not I don't think he did. No I think that's the grudge yeah and uh I well I know that the director of photography the man the man who was responsible for the success of the film he died in 2005 he was going to shoot my fourth feature film and um I met with him and he said I'm going to Florida to shoot a crown in the Florida Keys and he was um tied to the side of a helicopter getting a shot and the helicopter crashed in six feet of water and ground him I thought we do the then more and more I thought helicopters this was 2004 this is 2004 so the thing from like from like yeah the the the this in in in 2004 the director of photography of the Blair Witch drowned to death while being tied to the side of a helicopter in the Florida Keys shooting yeah so yeah that movie was cursed that movie's that movie's cursed the cast everyone was the manly way yeah he died yeah because he was gonna shoot my family when he came back for the keys and um I remember reaching out to try to find him and I or I think so I might on the news the guy died yeah he died anyhow um so you never know you know everybody's got their own their own thing going on and their own struggles and you know yeah yeah I hope that's pretty good advice remain teachable be social learn some skills you gotta deliver yeah the best advice I think people in this is what I taught myself because I started out as an actor but but how do I you don't become overnight overnight doesn't work that way that way not anymore no not you did back in the day but not anymore yeah there was a formula you know now here you have to become a jack of all trades in order to go play all plays in this business. You can't be on scale so that's why I I became walking talking to all you know that I'm always um um in the belief that there's always the exception and that you know it's a big universe we live in and and what what works well for one may not work well for somebody else and just try to keep an open mind like I said remain teachable and you know just kind of find your own way you know but uh to keep moving forward for sure.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

Yeah yeah and the project I'm on right now one thing I may I made clear to the director is I'm here not just to work because I want to want to make a movie.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

I'm here to learn to learn and and I feel like that's the attitude you you have to have player being yeah all that good stuff yeah it's all true it may sound cliche but it's all true.

SPEAKER_00 34:00

Yeah I I I believe very very heavily that it is true so so uh told me that you that you're pushing trying to spoil it spoil it oh yeah well uh actually I can't I can't right now uh but uh we have a new project coming up uh in uh in the fall the winter of this year it's not really a new project it's called the the Summer of Massacre uh my husband and I made a movie back in uh 2012 titled The Summer of Massacre and still till this day has the Guinness Book of world record for the highest body count in a slasher movie. It's 155 on-screen depths and um we're going to beat our record this coming fall winter and uh we're gonna set a new world record with the movie as well. 255 right right yeah well I'm I there's no exact number I'm that I'm divulging at this time uh but uh uh definitely going to set a new record with new heights and um do some new things that have never been done before. Oh that's gonna be amazing yeah yes yes that's definitely oh just I was wanted to say you know and you know if if people want to find out where my other stuff is they can always go to um www.terror tunes.tv that's uh uh where we have all all my films uncut and uncensored and rated well the films that my husband and I have produced and directed are there uh the entire Terror Tunes franchise is there uh I we had a movie come out in uh 2005 by Lionsgate it's called uh the Jackhammer Massacre it's you'll get the uncut uncensored version there uh at the on the website and um all the rest of our films uh uh if you're interested in like obscure stuff uh that's uncut and uncensored it's all there at the website and t-shirts and other merchandise as well uh and uh we we will definitely be making we have uh four films right now in the Tarotunes franchise and uh we're getting ready to make part five as well that'll that'll probably happen uh within the next year hopefully uh uh if everything goes as planned but things are really uh the schedule is really tight right now I'm very you know grateful that I have so many movies on my plate but uh there's still a lot of uh uh of uh bucket list stuff I want to I want to get done before you know before we move on yeah yeah I I can I can imagine that that's gotta feel make you feel so down because you're doing a lot of you're getting it all done but overwhelming at the same time absolutely in fact right before I jumped on this phone call I got I just answered an email I guess they're making uh the Night Stalker part two and asked me if I was available so you know muck on wood that uh I just scared my dog uh that uh that uh that that that that my schedule is is clear to be able to do that because I I'm super proud of the first film and I'm looking forward to being a part of the second one. Nice yeah so it's gonna be uh the first film takes place before the Night Stalker was arrested and uh all the way up to the time where he's arrested. Actually most people don't realize it but the night stalker was caught here in Los Angeles by a group of plaincloth citizens. They were just regular citizens they had in this neighborhood chased him down the streets and and held him on the ground until the police came and arrested him uh because he was he was spotted you know there was a picture of him on the on the uh in the newspaper everybody knew who they were looking for um and um and so this this the sequel is going to take place after he's arrested it's all kinds of strange shit happened even after he was arrested is it true you can stay in the exact hotel hotel you know that's a question I cannot answer. It's I'm pretty sure you can I'm pretty sure you can uh uh but uh yeah no uh I mean there's plenty of information out there there's he's got video interviews on YouTube he's got his father's got interviews uh there's just so much information about him and he had a sick sick joy yeah yeah like he just relished everything everything he did yeah he was a well-known drug addict a speed freak and uh uh uh uh what you call a satist and uh this you know Satan worshiper and um you know everything he learned he learned from his uncle his uncle fought in Vietnam and uh his uncle uh tortured uh young women and children in Vietnam and so he taught his his he his uncle taught him how to rape and kill murder people. Yeah Jesus yeah that's that's what you teach him child child yeah yeah he's I mean he like uh uh it's uh you know he brought his uncle bob I think he brought like Polaroids uh pictures of his vic of his victims and showed him to him and you know this sort of thing I I think he uh his uncle murdered a uh a a woman in front of him at one point and they got away with it and uh it was yeah and so you know this is this sort of thing. Yeah very very dark uh but all true you know once again uh the truth is stranger than fiction uh most definite yeah yeah yeah and that's that's that's kind what I what I love is that is that when you this is why I find that folk is the most there's a movie right now that I worked on that's on Tubi that uh if you like true crime it's called Ed Kemper are you familiar with Ed Kemper? Yes yes I am I am uh it's another true crime story that's directed by Chad Farron uh I played the devil in the film uh it's commonly known that uh when Ed Kemper was young his mother would lock him in the uh boiling room in the basement and he would speak with the devil through the furnace and so uh there's a scene in the film where uh as a child the devil's telling him to you know do these horrible things and uh as I was reading the script breaking it down to do the effects I I sent an email to the director I said you gotta let me play the devil and he said sure you get you got it so did you go to the or yeah it's it's like a classic kind of you know if the devil was like a rapist you know uh like a murdering rapist kind of look just very very simple very simple look but the whole demeanor of it is very uh you get you have to see it you gotta see it but it should watch but the the movie Ed Kemper is a true crime story on too big right now very graphic um once again it follows the uh the actual life of Ed Kemper is kind of told from his point of view which is great you know um and um very uh accurate and it's a period piece film very beautifully done shot and uh well acted and the story is is solid it's a solid good a really good film yeah so huge one than that I'm sure I'm sure my listeners are interested in every every horror has some more movie that pushes them to the point where they can where they can't watch there's always what is what is yours. Yeah um I can't watch bugs and mice get hurt or abused for entertainment in horror films anymore. Like back in the 70s and eighties they could kill a bug on camera or they would have a mouse and it would be covered in blood or something or crawling or put worms on like a cadaver that was like covered in slime and fake blood. And you know worms have very sensitive skin. If if you would put it on like something that was salty it would be burning them. And or you know a mouse being covered in syrup and discarded like a you know like a paper napkin afterwards is inhumane and just the idea of that knowing that that's possibly what happened or killing a bug or cricket or you know or something like that on camera. There's a movie called The Nest we bought these killer roaches and there's a scene in the movie where they dump out all these roaches all over a counter in a cafe and they just start killing them. I can't I can't watch that stuff. I just I I I don't consider it entertaining to watch another to watch a a living thing get killed on camera. So in like a like a slaughterhouse kind of that's one thing for eat to kill an animal and eating it for substance sustenance but it's another thing to like you know like most people don't realize that when you see like a a real animal brain in a movie like from the 70s and 80s the animal is probably murdered that very day because brains don't stay all like beautiful and voluptuous so it would still it just came from the animal you know for the scene and uh I can't watch movies like that. I immediately shut it up then shut it off then I don't want to watch it. The one wonder movie I can't watch is Mitsuma. Oh yeah that's a pretty pretty graphic film.

SPEAKER_02 43:51

Yes I might well well so I'm a I'm a cult summer so watching the movie

SPEAKER_00 44:01

I see. Yeah, I can see where that would be very traumatizing. Yes. There's a lot of like misleading, lying, manipulation, uh uh uh uh uh unwanted touching, uh uh you know, rape, uh uh uh uh assault and uh uh mutilation, uh uh uh uh being deceived into it and being tricked into yeah, all that stuff is there. That that's it's it's the psychoological abuse. Well it's it's the relationship that empaths have with narcissists, narcissistic behavior, you know, and you know, if you have empathy, if you know what it would like to feel empathy for harm or for harm being done by someone or for the harm that you cause someone, then you know you are an empath, and then there's the opposite side of the coin, which is unfortunately a lot of people in this world today, uh they're narcissists and they have no empathy for the harm that they cause people, or even to see someone get harmed, they don't have any connection to it whatsoever, or have any empathy for someone who's been hurt in any way. And um uh the you know, that's the in a horror film that's that's if you can tap into that, then I think we discussed that earlier, you know, then you're you're you you can traumatize your audience, yeah. Yes, yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:24

Well, I was I was on the I I was on the cult that podcast and I actually actually hold the how how I can front former cult leader. Hold them and no, I'm there.

SPEAKER_00 45:39

No, but yeah, no, there's most callous attitude I I've ever heard in my life. And you know, and most people don't realize that you can find yourself being surrounded by lots of narcissists and and you say, well, how can that be? Well, because if you're an empath, they naturally gravitate towards you. You are actually sought out by them. They intentionally come to you because they need the level of empathy that you have as a supply, because they have none for themselves. And um they get a rush out of it, like a drug, they get a joy out of it. Um and uh I find myself all the time being surrounded by narcissists, uh narcissists. I'm I'm very kind online, I have a very you know, and and you know, I'm a magnet for narcissists, and that's okay. Uh, but uh once you arm yourself with the knowledge to identify who these people are and how they operate, you can easily uh keep them from your life, you know, uh keep them at bay and keep them safe distance so they can't harm you. It's you using that uh that toolbox uh how to combat the there's a lot of information on on Instagram about it. If you do a search, uh you'll start showing up in your feed and you will absolutely become a master at spying it. And it's and it's very helpful. I thought to be very helpful.

SPEAKER_02 47:06

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:06

Because I'm also a very empathetic person. I can tell.

SPEAKER_02 47:10

And whenever I'm on that, that I like whatever I refer to as the guy who's neutral and just and just is friend-friendly.

SPEAKER_00 47:22

That's exactly what a narcissist wants. You see, you're a narcissist magnet. That's exactly what they want. They want you to be completely neutral to their narcissistic behavior. Yeah. You know, and and and and um, I mean, I mean, they like a reaction from you, but the fact that you won't combat their crappy behavior is more important. You allow them to continue to do it. Then how the fact that you hang around. Yeah, yeah, that's a narcissist. Yeah, that a narcissist. I don't. You just ultimatums. I give them ultimatums. Oh, yeah. Now I just recently did that, I put myself in a position where I told the uh the executive producer, I I will continue to work with you, but as long as I have no contact with this person. I don't I don't need to have any con we will have to figure out a way to do this where I don't have to be in a position where I give this person in my and my empathy or my supply of attention because that's exactly what they want, you know. I mean, and most people don't realize that narcissists aren't really um they're not they don't live in a community uh uh way of life. They're not trying to communicate with you, they're trying to control you, they're trying to um uh cause confusion in your life. This is how they they feel. They have no they they have no empathy, so they have no way of feeling for any anybody else. And um so their whole uh mode of operation is to uh uh get you to respond to them, re remain remain in control of how you respond. Even if it's a even if it's an outburst or an insult, they that's what they're that's what their goal is. They're trying to get you to to to show emotion. And um even if it's hurtful, they that's all they want. Yeah. So I I I don't I I I won't allow them. I I will I will cut them out like a bad habit. And I'll put myself in a position where they they professionally they don't have to communicate with me. Yeah.

unknown 49:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:21

And of course I've kind of gotten to a place in my career where I have the capability to do that. You know, you may be working uh maybe lower on the total pole in some cases and some jobs and whatnot where you have to deal with them. But uh I just straight up say no, I'm sorry, I won't I won't put makeup on that person, they're a narcissist. I won't, I won't work with that person there, they're they're they're they're unstable. And I professionally I I'm not interested in being in a position where they could do something where production might actually be responsible for their behavior, you know. Yeah, same thing, same thing.

SPEAKER_01 49:54

Oh my god, they have to make hair.

SPEAKER_02 49:56

Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, they just gotta show the other.

unknown 50:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:01

Oh what what? Oh, what bitches?

unknown 50:04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:05

Like like you're making them in something beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 50:10

Something that's not beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 50:12

They have to accept it.

SPEAKER_00 50:15

Well, you know, uh, like I said, a narcissist is not about communication, it's about control. So it doesn't matter what the truth is, they'll just straight up lie about whatever it is.

SPEAKER_02 50:24

Because when I'm sitting in the chair for make a makeup, I actually try to turn breaks. I mean, it's not a control.

SPEAKER_01 50:32

Right.

SPEAKER_02 50:32

But I like to see you being like, okay, okay, what are you gonna turn into today?

SPEAKER_00 50:37

Today, right off yeah, you're the you're the the the perfect uh canvas is exactly what we want. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:44

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:45

And I can I can I also make sure that everything isn't just comfortable for myself, but it's comfortable for mega megabar.

SPEAKER_00 50:56

That's very kind of you, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's very kind of you. Yeah, I mean, we even when I'm working on people, I don't even want to especially working close to their face, I don't even sometimes I I'll hold my breath if I'm working really close to them. They don't realize I'm actually holding my breath. Really? Because I don't want to breathe on them. Yeah. On sympathic behavior, you know, we don't we're we're we're we're always thinking of others. Always, always, always and narcissists need that, they need that supply. So if you find yourself believing that you're surrounded by narcissists and you might think you're crazy, but because of it. But the truth is that you are being surrounded by them because they have sought you out. And it seems impossible, but that's just the nature of a narcissistic relationship with an empath. They look for you, they look for your energy, they look to see you're happy, you're easily uh forgiving, you are kind, you are uh very, very free with your attention and time so they can waste it, uh this sort of thing. They're they're constantly they constantly they need it because they have none of their own. Yeah. But uh that's a whole other horror story altogether. We should make a movie about okay, yeah. Yeah, we could do it. Yeah, we should know we'll just call it ego. Yeah, ego. That's ego is two different things. I learned something about ego yesterday. Ego is um um the ego is not isn't it's not inherently good or bad, but it can be abused. And um the the trick is to find uh to be right size with your ego. That's the and that's the true nature of being happy. If you can be happy with your true size of your ego, right, the the actual one, the reality, then you're gonna be okay. But if you always feel the need to be take more than than what it's really worth, then you're always gonna be in a struggle. Yeah, uncomfortable. Or always putting yourself down. The best or the worst, nowhere in the middle, uh, which is a very false way to live.

SPEAKER_01 53:07

So I I have a question.

SPEAKER_00 53:11

Okay, yeah. Bring it in. 44 years.

SPEAKER_02 53:20

Um how would you say that has completely all? Yeah. Like I was watching uh an interview with John Mike Madamo. And he talked to when they made spawn.

SPEAKER_01 53:34

Uh-huh. And how tough uh was putting makeup and how how funky he said he's saying. Oh yeah. And then we're gonna dunge.

SPEAKER_00 53:46

Yeah, I bet. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I um, you know, over the years, well, you know, they I mean I just like you know, starting with like in the 50s and 60s and 70s, like using real animal parts and stuff like that to do blood and gore with, and then you know, having to glue things on people's faces. They used to use spirit gum and all kinds of different glues. And, you know, I mean, I remember uh the uh having to put uh liquid latex, which is basically an ammonia-based rubber directly on people's skin. And they still do that sometimes these days. Uh well, not really, but you know, your skin is actually porous if you breathe through your skin. So if you're putting ammonia on your skin, you're absorbing ammonia into your bloodstream to some extent. So, you know, this kind of stuff, and you know, I've been involved into, you know, we have these these uh you know prosthetic glues that were invented by the medical industry that were safer uh to put on, but then you have to use a harsh chemical to take it off. That's the downside of it. So uh you know, and some of these things they come out and they've only been out for a year or two. We don't know what the long-term effects of them are. And um, there's always something new, you know. They say that silicone is a very safe uh chemical. I don't they've been we've been using it for about 20 years now. We'll see what happens in 20 years from now if it's really safe. But everybody uses it for everything. I use it for everything. And I try not to use any glue at all when I do uh work because I have to use it, even though the glue might be safe for the human skin, to take it off is another chemical to take off with. And putting two chemicals together, you know, may not be the it's just not the best thing.

SPEAKER_01 55:36

So try to use chemists.

SPEAKER_00 55:38

Yeah, you try not to use glue at all whenever I go on prosthetics. It's difficult though. Sometimes you just gotta do it, especially if there's dialogue and whatnot. And the evolution's been from you know, practical and you know, adding a little bit digital effects, and now we have AI, which I love to work with. Uh, we've been doing some amazing things with AI. And uh, but the best part of it is using them all, using all the tools together, you know, and um uh it's gonna continue to evolve, you know. It's gonna continue to be people will become even more masterful at maybe one or the other, or or Jack of Wall trades, like I say earlier of all three, which is what I kind of consider myself as kind of more of an illusionist. That's people say I do makeup, but I really don't do makeup. I do special effects and sometimes I use makeup products to do that. You know, if you want to see my entire portfolio, you can go to my website, uh joecastrofx.com, and uh have my entire my entire career is there. It's uh it's uh if you have some some time and uh you want to go and just check out a whole bunch of uh you know horror art, yeah, that's it's there on my website. And uh yeah, but uh I'm looking forward to the um I'm looking forward to uh seeing where this uh where this uh industry grows and goes and how the world of special effects uh continues to refine itself and redefine itself and reinvent itself. I know there's a lot of years because uh this new generation which I can try to I feel like they're not they're not gonna like a level of nobility and respect. I hope so. I hope that people remember why we where we started and who started it all and where we came from. And but uh they say that once you die 30 days after you're dead, most people won't even remember your name. Uh it's just the way it is. Uh I don't even know who wrote The Wizard of Oz or directed it, you know, but he was a creep. He was a creep. He was a creep? Yeah, yeah. I don't know. He would touch press. Oh, did he? I didn't know anything about that. But you know, like like that guy you hear so many horror stories about.

SPEAKER_01 58:00

Oh wow. It was gruesome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 58:02

Like when you talk about special effect, yeah. The lion awesome 90 of real lion lion.

SPEAKER_00 58:12

Yeah, yeah, you don't do that today. That's uh disgusting. I remember the guy that first did the the put on the the the tin man makeup, the guy that did it, he died from the makeup. I know I don't know I know he had a beer religion. Maybe he had a severe religion. Margaret Harvard was no, it was a different person. The first person to put it wore. Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah. Margaret Hartmann, she got she got burned. Like three from the from the yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And they forced working. Of course, yeah, absolutely. And they fed Julia Garden speed to to keep up with the shooting schedule. That's how she became a drug addict, addicted to narcotics. And she was uh groped by the munchkin. I bet yeah, those were just some. I'll be honest with you, I've had several experiences with um how do you say little people? Did they call them little people? Uh how do you say it? Less version. Yeah, I I actually have been groped on a movie set really in the past ten years by a little person.

SPEAKER_01 59:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:19

Uh and then I recently found out that person died. Uh I didn't speak up at the time, but I was absol absolutely sexually assaulted by this this little guy.

SPEAKER_01 59:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:28

His name was Sammy the Dwarf, and he um he uh uh he groped Ryon Set. And um uh you know, I didn't say anything to the producers, but you know, yeah I absolutely believe that they did that to Julie Carnot. They have this uh this um uh idea that they have this free pass to not be treated like regular human beings because they're little people, but uh yeah, anyways. So but uh listen, uh uh I really enjoyed talking with you today. And uh we got into some dark subjects and I hope it was entertaining. And uh yeah, you know, hey, if you want to make a movie about uh the the evils of narcissism, you let me know and you can write it. And as long as you write write me in as a lead, I'll I'll definitely come on board. So I I'll I'll I'll try and find something.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:19

A good break time plot plot. Sure, sure. Good break time plot, right? And hey, folks, tell you if you want to support the podcast, uh have a channel. You can follow Instagram, Grandia or check the chat out on YouTube at chatabox dashboard. Don't forget to like it, like subscribe, leave your thoughts in the comment section below below and you can do Instagram and you can tune in. I'm on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, anywhere you can podcast.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:58

Alex, thank you so much for having me on the show today. It was a pleasure talking with you. I look forward to the possibilities of maybe working with you on a movie set one day soon. Yes, all right. And everybody have a little loop. I will, absolutely. Okay, and everybody have a beautiful rest of your weekend, uh happy uh Father's Day tomorrow for all the fathers out there. Uh, I didn't even get a chance to say my father was my number one supporter. So, anyways, everybody uh have a beautiful rest of your day. Thanks, Alex. Until next time, folks, folks.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:26

Stay highlight.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:28

Ow, ow.