[00:00:00] Nate Flake: All right, ladies, this episode is for you, especially if you are 40 plus. Today I am super excited to be chatting with you, Lea. Thank you for coming on. It's been a minute. I've been trying to get you on. We both have, busy schedules, so welcome to the UGC 101 Podcast. Excited to learn about you. can you introduce yourself, and let's kinda dive into it?
[00:00:19] Leah Hamill: Sure, yeah. Thanks so much for having me. I am excited to be on here. I have been listening to your podcast for a while now, so I'm a podcast girl. So when I decided I wanted to [00:00:30] start UGC, I was like, "Let me find a podcast," and obviously you were the one that came up. So, yeah, excited to be here. I'm Leah.
[00:00:37] Leah Hamill: I am 45 years old, and I can give you kind of a little background of how I ended up here. I've been in the social media world for quite some time now. So back in, I wanna say it was about 2014 or so, I owned a medical spa. So we did laser hair removal [00:01:00] and Botox and all that, and I had opened it up with a business partner, and she was a nurse practitioner, so she did, like, the back of the house stuff, and I did the front of the house stuff.
[00:01:10] Leah Hamill: So I did all the admin, sales, marketing, and I did that for a few years and I realized that med spa, that, like, office life wasn't for me.
[00:01:22] Nate Flake: I left the med spa and I started a social media agency where I worked with like local clients, helping kind of small [00:01:30] businesses do content, and I did that for a long time. in 2018, I met my now husband and we decided to renovate an RV and travel and, and go see the, see the country in it.
[00:01:49] Leah Hamill: And
[00:01:49] Nate Flake: Wow
[00:01:51] Leah Hamill: yeah, we ended up buying a 1989, it was a Holiday Rambler, like motor home, and it was very '80s, [00:02:00] so it was like baby blue carpet. It was pink and blue, like flowered couch. And so we were gonna gut the whole thing, and our, obviously our friends and family were like, "This is bananas." And so I was like, "Let me document this.
[00:02:15] Leah Hamill: Let me start an Instagram so they can kinda keep up with us and see what we're doing with this RV." 'Cause really up until then I had only done social media for people and, you know, I had like a little personal Instagram account, but that was it. So I started this RV [00:02:30] account. Yeah, yeah. I started this RV account and documented the renovation and people went wild for it.
[00:02:38] Leah Hamill: And we ended up gaining, you know, a following and having brands, you know, reach out to kind of collab with us and basically doing influencer brand deals. And so my husband and I, we lived in the RV and traveled and stuff for about four years. We ended up, renovating a second... Yeah, it was wild. we [00:03:00] traveled and then we also had like a home base here in, in Florida.
[00:03:04] Leah Hamill: His family owns a blueberry farm, so we would like stay here and then go out and travel. And so during those four years we did, we renovated another fifth wheel. My husband did like a sprinter van renovation that we documented. We built a tiny camper and we went cross country out to California and back in it with our chihuahuas.
[00:03:24] Leah Hamill: And so it was like a, it was a fun time. But I will say the [00:03:30] influencer hustle really burned me out. Like I, the showing up every day, the having to like post, post to my account, that, that just like, it gets, it got old for me anyways. so I kind of completely burnt out and gave up, gave up that account.
[00:03:50] Leah Hamill: We sold the RV. I didn't delete it, but I just kind of ghosted it. I stopped posting. we sold the RV. We wanted to get out of the RV and get into a house, [00:04:00] so we ended up, moving to his family's blueberry farm. And once we moved, I just like, I didn't have it in me anymore to do that account. Like I could've easily probably transitioned, but I didn't.
[00:04:12] Leah Hamill: So I ghosted it. I kinda ghosted social social media for a couple years and worked on the farm, helping them with, like, weddings and events. And then in 2025, I was like, "I miss Instagram. I wanna get back." And I knew I [00:04:30] probably couldn't revive that, RV account, and I didn't really want to. It just felt like that chapter was done.
[00:04:36] Nate Flake: Yeah, you're done doing RVs
[00:04:38] Leah Hamill: mm-hmm, and so, I started a new account, and I was kinda playing around with some different stuff. like, I wanted to get away from working with the farm, and the weddings, and events, so I was like, "I wanna go back to social media, but I don't wanna be an influencer. I don't wanna manage people's social media anymore."
[00:04:54] Leah Hamill: I was done with that. So, I started playing around with, like, video editing. I did the [00:05:00] Amazon reviews path. I, started offering, like, content shoots locally, 'cause I enjoy content creation. I just didn't like the managing of it. And then I begrudgingly tried UGC, and I was so convinced that, it was gonna be just like influencing, and I was gonna hate it.
[00:05:21] Leah Hamill: Like, I was, like, 99% sure that that was one path that wasn't going to work for
[00:05:26] Leah Hamill: me. And so, in the summer of [00:05:30] '25, I started documenting this, on my Instagram, talking about the different... You know, I'm trying these four different paths to, to turn, you know, content creation into my full-time job again. And the first month, I made $1,200 with UGC, and I was like, "Huh, okay.
[00:05:48] Leah Hamill: That was fun."
[00:05:49] Nate Flake: for first month.
[00:05:51] Leah Hamill: It was, and it was only on the apps too, because I-- when I was going to start, I was, like, looking around at stuff, and I was like, "I don't [00:06:00] wanna make a portfolio, a rate card, invoices, contracts. I don't even know if I wanna do this. I'm pretty sure I don't wanna do UGC. I don't wanna spend all this time doing all this."
[00:06:08] Leah Hamill: So I said, "Screw it, and I'm just gonna get on the apps and try it that way." And it worked for me, right?
[00:06:15] Nate Flake: That's how I
[00:06:16] Leah Hamill: I made 1,200. Yeah, I didn't wanna mess with all that other stuff, so I made that $1,200. I was like, "Cool. That was fun. Let me see if I can do better next month." Next month, I made 3,000, over $3,000, and I was like, [00:06:30] "Okay, I'm all in on this," 'cause I was having a blast.
[00:06:33] Leah Hamill: you know, I didn't think I was going to be, but I loved UGC 'cause I didn't have to post on my account. I didn't have to worry about my engagement and my followers,
[00:06:41] Nate Flake: it's so different. It's so different than influencing. Like, it's so-- Like the, the type of content you're posting is so different, right? 'Cause influencing relies solely on, like, your personality and like, so, you, you know, you have to show up and put on the face every day, and if you don't, then it's like, "Oh, what's wrong with Leah?"
[00:06:58] Nate Flake: You know? And so it's nice [00:07:00] because you don't run it on your account, and it's like you don't... I don't know. I feel like it's such a... I mean, I live in Utah, right? Tons of influencers here, and it just, it's just like, it feels like it's draining a little bit.
[00:07:11] Leah Hamill: It is, and I think there's always a constant struggle of like, you... I think people are like, "I only post what's authentic," influencers, but you don't. I mean, money plays a big part in it, right? Like, y- I can, I can be persuaded to, to post something on my account because I... It, it's a lot of money. Like, that's the truth of
[00:07:28] Nate Flake: You can be persuaded to be [00:07:30] obsessed with something as they all
[00:07:31] Leah Hamill: yeah. Yeah. So it just, like, it always kind of felt like, you know, ugh, I don't really wanna post about this random... Like, I remember I had, like, a tuna fish, UGC deal, and I was like, "My followers know I don't cook, and this is so inauthentic," but like, "Oh, they're paying me so much," so I don't know, you know?
[00:07:51] Leah Hamill: So, it's like a weird struggle. But yeah, I, I, I fell in love with UGC, and I went all in on it. I [00:08:00] started to, make my way off the apps or a- I would say not off the apps, but I started to add in those other strategies like pitching and building my personal brand. And by month six, I hit $10,000, my first $10,000 month, and I hadn't...
[00:08:15] Leah Hamill: Yeah, I had never done that before with any other form of social media, so I was like, "This is great."
[00:08:22] Leah Hamill: So, that, that, yeah, and then people started obviously wanting to know what I was doing and how I was doing it, so that [00:08:30] snowballs into, like, trying to help everyone in the DMs. And,
[00:08:32] Nate Flake: yeah.
[00:08:33] Leah Hamill: and then realizing you can't do that.
[00:08:36] Leah Hamill: And then I took some calls, and then I was like, okay, you know, I, I put out my, my course to try to help more people 'cause it was just, it was overwhelming, so. but yeah, that, that's where I am now.
[00:08:46] Nate Flake: the people that, like, knew you from the RV account, did anybody ever transition into you, like, finding your UGC stuff?
[00:08:57] Leah Hamill: Yeah, so many because I think [00:09:00] like it's such a gr- it would be such an amazing thing to do while you're living and traveling in an RV, right? I mean, other than the product delivery, but there's ways around that. I always thought back like, "Wow, I wish I would've known about UGC while I was RVing," because this would've been ideal,
[00:09:17] Nate Flake: Way easier, yeah
[00:09:18] Leah Hamill: Mm-hmm. Yeah. So yeah, I have a lot of old, old friends from the RV days that have made their way over to, to my new account and have started UGC.
[00:09:28] Nate Flake: um, I don't know if you follow Maddy [00:09:30] Outdoors. She, she kind of start line on her whole story was a few years ago doing the same thing, like doing UGC in an RV around the, around the country and stuff. just 'cause, yeah, so, and, and you-- I mean, it's a lot of logistics of like, I wanna be in this town, so I gotta have it dropped at this FedEx office and that kind of stuff.
[00:09:45] Nate Flake: But I feel like, especially now 'cause I feel like RVing, like during COVID obviously it went bon-bonkers and then I feel like it's starting to see another like little resurgence re-recently. in fact, I had a brand right before I hopped on here, I had a brand ask me, their, company I [00:10:00] did a, like a garden hose company.
[00:10:02] Nate Flake: Like a
[00:10:02] Leah Hamill: Okay.
[00:10:03] Nate Flake: these like crazy colors, like bright purple garden hoses. They asked me like, "Hey, do you know anyone that has an RV? Like we need an RV
[00:10:09] Leah Hamill: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:10] Nate Flake: concept like ASAP." And I'm like, " Yeah, like I actually do know a guy." So, but yeah, that's wild. That's, that's cool. So when you first like, obviously you had s- you had the content experience, so was getting on-- 'Cause I feel like the biggest thing for a lot of people, and you probably can agree, the hardest thing for a lot of people when they first start out with UGC is just showing, like getting on camera, [00:10:30] getting in front of the camera, not feeling stupid.
[00:10:32] Nate Flake: How did you, you already had that experience from when you had that other account for sure, but how did you get over that, you know? Like how did you get over that, awkwardness?
[00:10:42] Leah Hamill: Yeah. I will say that when I started the influencer account, Instagram was photos. It was a photo only. So we weren't, we weren't into video yet. I
[00:10:53] Nate Flake: So you were just getting paid to do pictures and captions? Holy crap. That's
[00:10:57] Leah Hamill: And I w- you know, it, a lot of it was, like, [00:11:00] about the interior of my RV. We, you know, did these beautiful interiors, so it was, like, still shots of, you know, the interiors or, like, me in it, you know?
[00:11:09] Leah Hamill: So while I had that account is when Reels rolled out, the video aspect rolled out, so I had to, like, learn. And that, I feel like at that point, people were just, like, dancing. Like, it was just a
[00:11:19] Nate Flake: Yeah, nobody wanted... I remember like when that happened, everyone's like, "Keep TikTok on TikTok," you know? And everyone was like, everyone was super, super slow to like start doing video on [00:11:30] Instagram. yeah, I didn't ever use Reels for a long freaking time because I was the same way. I'm like, "No, I'll just, the still pictures stay there."
[00:11:37] Leah Hamill: Yeah, so I had, I had that content creation experience, but it really wasn't like... I didn't do a lot of talking to camera then, and, when I was doing content creation for other businesses, I wasn't really talking to camera. So it was a little bit of a adjustment for sure, and I think that for me [00:12:00] it's just, the teleprompter helps me a lot.
[00:12:02] Leah Hamill: I'm a big fan of teleprompters. it takes that mental load, like I don't have to worry about the lines. I can just worry about how natural I'm acting on camera. I think it's just repetition. Like everyone feels uncomfortable at first on camera and watching themselves back. But, I try not, I try to detach from the outcome too, like just, I, you can't obsess over it.
[00:12:28] Leah Hamill: You've gotta get to like good enough [00:12:30] and then call it a day. I think that hang- hangs people up is when they're like, it has to be perfection, and I'm just not that kind of person. Like I'm very type B. And so I'll sh- I'll do three takes and that's it. That's what we're working with and let's, and unless it's totally horrible, but like three takes of a line, three shots and then that's it.
[00:12:52] Leah Hamill: I'll choose from those in, in my editing and I just, I accept that. So that's kinda how I get over the cycle of like [00:13:00] continuing
[00:13:00] Leah Hamill: on.
[00:13:00] Nate Flake: that's how you do a lot of volume too, right? You can't, you can't be obsessed with perfection and, like, be able to do three or four projects in a day or else you'd be screwed. You wouldn't be able to do it
[00:13:12] Leah Hamill: Right, right. And I think a lot of people get stuck in the beginning on that, like perfecting one, like taking like five days to shoot one UGC video. I'm like, "No, you've got to like wrap this up, a few hours, a few takes, and go from there."
[00:13:25] Nate Flake: what are your best, what are your best advi- pieces of advice for using a teleprompter? You're really good at it. Like [00:13:30] how, like I, I can't tell that you're using a teleprompter in your videos. what are your best tips for that?
[00:13:35] Leah Hamill: Thank you. Yeah. I really like this app called Teleprompter. It's called teleprompter.com, I think. And I like it because it allows for that, like, cinematic look, so it kind of still lets you blur the background. but, but tips for using it, I keep the words at the top of the screen. I think that's something that like, you know, I-- that trips a [00:14:00] lot of people up 'cause you can tell they're reading from the bottom of the screen.
[00:14:02] Leah Hamill: So
[00:14:03] Leah Hamill: keeping what you're reading at the
[00:14:04] Nate Flake: Yeah,
[00:14:05] Leah Hamill: tippity top of the screen. Yep, I try to read ahead a little bit so that I can like look off of camera or like do something that isn't reading, right? To make it look more natural. And yeah, I think practice with it, right? and if you get, you know, where you're... It's scrolling up too fast, like chill out, stop, pause, bring it back [00:14:30] down, do it again.
[00:14:31] Leah Hamill: You don't have to like rush to keep up with it. So I think, I think the whole l- looking off camera and like l- using your hands and things like that make it feel really natural
[00:14:39] Nate Flake: Yeah, yeah. No, I agree. I like that. I like those tips. a lot of people are either-- And I think a lot of people get too hung up on the back camera versus front camera. Like I had, I was on TikTok Live yesterday. I haven't been live in forever, and people are like, "No, you gotta use the back camera.
[00:14:53] Nate Flake: Brands can tell." I'm like, "Dude, I have used the front camera for 99% of my videos."
[00:14:58] Leah Hamill: that drives me [00:15:00] nuts, Nate. I like... That is like one of those like hills I will die on situations. Like, use the front camera. Like wipe your lens, get in good natural light, and your front camera is gonna do beautiful. Like if you're in a dark closet, nothing's gonna, you know, make your content look good.
[00:15:17] Leah Hamill: But if you get in front of natural light and, and use your front camera, it's gonna be
[00:15:22] Nate Flake: Yeah, there's no need to buy those, like, monitors that stick on the back of your phone that are like 150 bucks or whatever, so you can see it and use it. I, [00:15:30] I, I also think that if you're using a teleprompter, there's no way you can do that. Like, you can't throw a teleprompter on the monitor either, right?
[00:15:38] Nate Flake: And, and I mean, unless you're into, like, memorizing the lines, which is, like, cool, do that. But I feel like, again, it's, it all kinda comes back to that, like, pursuit of perfection for a lot of people thinking that, you know, they're not realizing-- They're not, they're forgetting what UGC started as, which is, like, just janky videos on Amazon reviews, you know. and now it's kinda spiraled. How did... So how, you were just researching UGC though? I wanna go back to that. When [00:16:00] you first started, were you just, like, on it like everyone else on TikTok looking at, like, how to make money online and then this just came up?
[00:16:07] Leah Hamill: Yeah, I had heard about it along... Do you know Abigail Pugh, the digital product gal? so she does, like, digital products now, but she had originally started with UGC, so I knew of it from her. and then I was started, yeah, TikTok, Instagram, looking at it, and all I could find was, like, I didn't even know if I could do it, [00:16:30] because all I saw was, like, 20-year-olds in Bali or something doing UGC at that time.
[00:16:37] Leah Hamill: And I was like, "This is like, I... Do they want this old 45-year-old lady here?" But, that, and that was all the advice, too, with, like, the pitching and the portfolios and da da da da. So, yeah, that's how I kind of stumbled into it. I was like, "All right. Well, let me give it a whirl and see if they're interested in a 40-year-old woman," and they were,
[00:16:56] Nate Flake: which apps were-- You said like right away you were on apps. Which apps did [00:17:00] you start with? Were you, like was it Fiverr, Upwork? Like what, did you just like grab a sampling of a bunch of them or which ones did, which ones started to hit for you right away?
[00:17:09] Leah Hamill: Yeah. So I looked, to see what other creators were doing and what other apps they were on, and I just kind of signed up for several of them and started applying to see kind of what would work for me. the one that ended up popping off was Influe. I got a ton of work on Influe. I got work on InnSense, [00:17:30] and there's another one, Twirl, which is a UK-based...
[00:17:36] Leah Hamill: I think it's an, it's an app/agency. and I got several, jobs on there. So those three were kind of my... And once it hit for me, like I just-- It seems like they're all algorithm-based, right? So as soon as you get those reviews in on those apps, it starts pushing you out to more brands, so it kind of just snowballed from there.
[00:17:55] Nate Flake: Yeah, that's what I try to tell people too, and you probably tell your students this, but like, [00:18:00] I, I don't think that-- I feel like platforms get a bad rep of like, yeah, but they get a percentage of your money and you're only as good as opportunities that they put out there.
[00:18:09] Nate Flake: You gotta go, like, do your own fishing type thing. But like, there's so many freaking apps out there that it-- I, I don't know, I get really frustrated with students that, that I talk to that are like, "There's just nothing out there. I'm not getting anything." I'm like, "Dude, there are, like, 50 apps, and then within those 50 app..."
[00:18:24] Nate Flake: Probably more actually now, right? Like, every day, like, I have a meeting today with someone who's like, "I have a new app I want you to look at," [00:18:30] you know? And it's like, there's all these apps, and all of these apps are doing everything they can to get brands on for you, right? And so, like, you're not gonna be able to fail if you at least get on, like, 10 app.
[00:18:43] Nate Flake: Let's say 10. And you're like, "That's a lot to manage." It's like, well, is it, dude? Like, how many social media platforms do you have? And you somehow manage those, right? Like, I don't know, I get frustrated. Like, people... It's just, like, all a priority thing. It's a time thing, right? Like, h- how can I keep track of 10 apps?
[00:18:58] Nate Flake: I'm like, well, you keep track of [00:19:00] your 10 favorite sports h- things happening this weekend. You know, I'm not a sports guy. Like, your f- 10 favorite basketball teams or whatever. Like, you're on-- Like, people have time, you know? And it's like, dude, it's not hard to get on and apply. It, it's moving your thumb a couple times to then get paid hundreds of dollars.
[00:19:14] Nate Flake: Like, we live in a crazy freaking time. Like, what are we talking about, you know?
[00:19:19] Leah Hamill: Yeah. That's what I would do in the beginning. I just signed up for the apps, and in the morning I'd get up and I'd just spend an hour going through all the apps, applying to [00:19:30] every single brief that I could that matched, you know, me. And I mean, if you wanna make it work, you'll, you'll, you'll find the time, right?
[00:19:38] Leah Hamill: yeah, and as far as the amount of apps, like I get people asking me all the time, like, "What's the best app? What's the best app?" And I've, I've seen my students... It depends, right? You f- it seems like you find an app and it, you'll, it works for you, and then that's your app. Like, I don't think there's one for,
[00:19:56] Nate Flake: That's like way better
[00:19:57] Leah Hamill: magical app.
[00:19:58] Leah Hamill: Yeah. Yeah, and you're [00:20:00] right about like in my club I have, a list of, I think it's over like 60 different apps now. So you can go in there and apply, and people are like, "I've tried to apply and I don't, I haven't gotten anything." And I'm like, "Well, then go on to the next app." Keep
[00:20:13] Leah Hamill: going.
[00:20:13] Leah Hamill: Keep going. Y-
[00:20:14] Nate Flake: like, and it's hard to sell them that too. Like, like, like Incense, for example, is a great example. if you start getting-- I literally just updated my portfolio on Incense 'cause it had been over a year since I'd put a new video on there. Like, it gives you the thing, it's like, "You haven't updated this."
[00:20:27] Nate Flake: I'm like, "Oh, shoot." So I updated all my videos. But like [00:20:30] Incense, for example, if your content-- Like I haven't gotten a deal on Incense in probably three months because I had old videos on there, right? And I ha- and I wasn't necessarily like actively super applying. I, I do a lot more through Influency and Fiverr.
[00:20:43] Nate Flake: And so, but like Incense, if you're not getting anything, it's because people are seeing you and then your content's not great. Like the videos in your portfolio aren't great. And when you very first start, yeah, you may get, like you said, you did $1,200 your first month. You may get a couple hits there, you know, but like [00:21:00] your first videos that you had on Incense to attract the brands were probably not like stellar.
[00:21:05] Nate Flake: They're your first, it's your first attempts, right? And so people don't realize like, dude, the difference between you starting UGC today and then a month from now, your content is going to be exponentially better. You need to always be updating your content. If you're not getting anything on these apps, it's not necessarily like, "Oh, these apps suck, they're broken."
[00:21:25] Nate Flake: It's like, "Hey dude, you just gotta go put better videos up," and that's okay. We all start like [00:21:30] trash. We don't know what we're doing. And then you gotta just-- Like it's just like leave, like check the ego at the door and then like figure out why they're not working, right? I, I, I'm like a firm believer that every single app could work for every single person.
[00:21:41] Nate Flake: Like, yeah, you're not gonna make 10 grand a month off one app, but you could do 10 grand a month off 15 apps easy. You know, I've, I've, I've-- When I was in my, like prime of just doing UGC before I started coaching, I was easily clearing 10K on Fiverr alone, right? And it's like if you lean in, you can really, really like make a lot of money [00:22:00] on these apps.
[00:22:01] Leah Hamill: Yeah, you absolutely can. And I know like, yeah, and people get hung up on the, you know, I don't know, the perpetual usage rights and things like that on there, but I'm like, you're in, in the beginning, like you... Apps are a great way because you get paid to learn essentially. Like yeah, it may only be $100 a video or $200 a video, but there's no other job that you're gonna like a lot...
[00:22:24] Leah Hamill: You know, well, there
[00:22:25] Nate Flake: Paid training, yeah. Like
[00:22:26] Leah Hamill: yeah, you
[00:22:27] Nate Flake: training and like
[00:22:28] Leah Hamill: immediately
[00:22:29] Leah Hamill: paid. [00:22:30] Right. Right. Yeah. So yeah, it's low right now. I think as UGC gets more popular and people see everyone on social media talking about it, they're like, " I don't wanna take any free or gifted." I'm like, "Sometimes you do in the
[00:22:41] Leah Hamill: beginning just to,
[00:22:43] Leah Hamill: just to get it rolling, guys, especially on the apps, right?"
[00:22:46] Leah Hamill: Like, get that first review in so it bumps you up. Like, you gotta make, you gotta make some sacrifices. I, I did tons, like that $1,200 a month was like working with like 30 brands or
[00:22:58] Nate Flake: yeah. Like, probably [00:23:00] like $50
[00:23:00] Nate Flake: jobs, right?
[00:23:01] Leah Hamill: Yeah. Yeah. And then I inched it up, you know, a little bit. I was like, "Okay, I can go to 100, 150, 200."
[00:23:07] Leah Hamill: And then, you know, but I definitely got to a point where I had so many jobs and I was like, "Okay, now I need to raise my rates
[00:23:13] Leah Hamill: because
[00:23:14] Nate Flake: yeah.
[00:23:14] Nate Flake: When you get
[00:23:15] Leah Hamill: busy and..." Mm-hmm. Exactly. So
[00:23:18] Nate Flake: Yeah, I think there's this like, I mean, it's, it's, it's obvious where it's coming from. It's 'cause there's this-- because of social media and like how popular UGC... Well, not even how popular UGC is. Even when I [00:23:30] started, probably when you started searching UGC, you see all these like experts or whatever, like, "You need to do this, you need this."
[00:23:35] Nate Flake: Like, you know, like, "This is how I became a top earner in thr- two months." You're like, "What do you mean top earner? According to who? What are you talking about, dude?" Like, you know, and so you see these people that are like, "I charge $500 a video." And then all the reels that I've been seeing lately that I wanna call out, but I don't want people to see that I'm just like a cyberbully of like people that are like, "I, you know, I started UGC this month.
[00:23:56] Nate Flake: I pitched 300 brands, 17 said yes. I made eight [00:24:00] grand in 20 minutes." I'm like, "What are they talking about, dude?" Like they've never done UGC, you know, and then everyone's like, you know, "Comment the word waitlist if you wanna join my course." And I'm like, "Dude, you just said you started UGC this month. What are you talking about?"
[00:24:11] Nate Flake: So I think people get like this like false sense of like almost like entitlement in the space, because it's... And it's like not like, oh, you gotta do your... Like of course there's gonna be brands that are gonna pay you really well, even if you're a beginner. If your content holds up to it, then that's all that matters.
[00:24:27] Nate Flake: But like, don't put, don't put your nose up at like [00:24:30] gifted collabs if it's a cool product or if you just need the experience or like I was doing 50, $60 jobs for a long time, right? Because like you're still getting your experience and you wanna get a, a brief from an actual real company, right?
[00:24:44] Nate Flake: Like not something you just like had ChatGPT throw together. So like it's okay to learn what that relationship looks like between you and a client and the whole flow of it and the whole process. And I think people are just getting too like snooty by like-- 'cause they're just on social seeing people like claim their, [00:25:00] you know, "I made this much this month and I'm..."
[00:25:01] Nate Flake: And so I think they're just like, "Oh, I gotta make that." I'm like, "Dude, yeah, but these people have been doing it for years." Like it's not
[00:25:06] Nate Flake: like they just started.
[00:25:08] Leah Hamill: Yeah, when people are like, "How do you get, you know, how is your pipeline so full? How are you hitting these months?" I'm like, "Because I started with $50, $100 jobs and put my time in," right? Like, I didn't, like, I'm very open about that. I didn't just catapult to $10,000
[00:25:25] Leah Hamill: months. Like, there was a lot of work and pivoting and trying and iterating [00:25:30] on what was working and what wasn't, so...
[00:25:32] Nate Flake: And those brands come back to you too. That's the other thing that is not talked about enough. It's like everyone always talks about retainers because that's like the golden standard of like, "Gotta get retainers, gotta get retainers." But what they don't talk about is like, if you don't do good work for a brand, like they're not gonna come back to you, and then you're screwed.
[00:25:49] Nate Flake: Like, if you're going one-offs all the time, that's tough
[00:25:52] Leah Hamill: Yes. Yeah. No, I would say more than usually 75%, probably 60 to 75% of my [00:26:00] work now every month is from repeat clients. And I don't even have like a set retainer with any of them. Like I've never pursued that. they just keep coming back to me, right?
[00:26:09] Nate Flake: Yeah, I agree. I wanna pivot a little bit and talk about the, the, what we were talking about right before we hit record of, like, the people that you teach, like the age demographics, like 40, 40-plus women, right? I know we got one, we got one, one dude student, shout out to him. But like, mostly I wanna talk about how the [00:26:30] conversations that you have when, A, students come in and they've been burned by something on social media, maybe it's been like digital products, maybe it's been network marketing, maybe it's been Amazon affiliate or whatever, right?
[00:26:41] Nate Flake: And I know some people crush in all those categories, so I'm not knocking any of those. But like, what is the common, I guess, misconception about UGC from them? What's like, what's like the... You probably have to, you probably have to do some, like, clarification with people right off the bat that come in with, like, these misconceptions or these ideas [00:27:00] of, like, what they think UGC is.
[00:27:02] Nate Flake: what are some of those?
[00:27:03] Leah Hamill: Yeah. So I would say still battling like the you have to post on your account thing. I think probably because they come from a world of like, a lot of them come from a world of network marketing or affiliate, where it all depends on how much you're sharing, and some reason people still think that UGC...
[00:27:21] Leah Hamill: Well, I think it's because they see me posting about UGC and they think they have to do that too, but they don't. I was like, "You don't even-- You don't ever have to [00:27:30] use that personal brand strategy if you don't want." I actually talk about you sometimes when I'm like, "I know a guy that was making, you know, $10,000 a month, months on, you know, Fiverr."
[00:27:41] Leah Hamill: You know? You don't need
[00:27:42] Nate Flake: Yeah, I didn't even have social media for a year
[00:27:45] Leah Hamill: Right. I know lots of people like that, that never use that avenue, right? There's like several ways to do and to be successful with UGC. So I still-- That's still a big misconception. I still think the aesthetic content people get really hung up [00:28:00] on, you know, perfume bottles dripping in water and submerging their skincare and, you know, all that like super aesthetic stuff.
[00:28:10] Leah Hamill: And I see the p- you know, their sample content and I'm like, "This is, this is good, but, but I need you to talk to the camera.
[00:28:18] Nate Flake: Yeah,
[00:28:18] Nate Flake: I
[00:28:18] Leah Hamill: need
[00:28:19] Leah Hamill: to see your face." Yeah. And that's where I got tripped up in the beginning. My first sample videos were-- I look at them now, I have to go and like do that, like rewatch them and, and show them [00:28:30] because they're so bad, and it was the exact cliché of like this...
[00:28:34] Leah Hamill: I did, skincare and jewelry, and I was like trying to do all these aesthetic, you know, sprays and stuff, and sunlight and, they're so bad. But yeah, you don't need that. The brands want to see you talking to camera. So, that's always usually the biggest hurdle is the talking to camera, right?
[00:28:51] Nate Flake: Yeah, I get a lot of questions, about like faceless versus face, like,
[00:28:56] Leah Hamill: Yes
[00:28:57] Nate Flake: I guess just face UGC, I guess. or s- facing the [00:29:00] camera UGC. But I, I think a lot of people don't realize like that's... There's two things. Number one is that's what makes UGC UGC, is like someone speaking to camera, like that organic like relatability, authenticity, or whatever you wanna call it.
[00:29:15] Nate Flake: Like, th- people buy products because they sees themselves in the creator talking about a problem or a pain point, right? Like, "Oh, cool, that guy's bald. I'm also bald," and I hate that about, you know, my head shaver or whatever. But if like they didn't see me [00:29:30] on camera and the whole thing was just hands-free, faceless, it would be a lot less, it wouldn't convert as well.
[00:29:35] Nate Flake: And I think the second thing that people are kind of failing to realize a lot lately is like AI is, is a thing we're having to deal with, right? And like luckily there's been legislation, and I don't know if you, you saw that thing in New York last year, last month in June, where like now at least one of the states is like fining people for using AI avatars of people's face.
[00:29:55] Nate Flake: But what they don't get fined for is faceless content, and [00:30:00] anybody can remake a perfume bottle video with hands and spray and dripping water without anybody. And then the voiceover, obviously ElevenLabs can do it today, right? And so like it is so, so, so easy for brands to buy AI content for faceless UGC, then why would they ever hire a creator?
[00:30:21] Nate Flake: So like all of a sudden your addressable market goes down to nothing if you're a creator. So if you're not willing to put your freaking mug on camera, it's bad. It's real bad, [00:30:30] right? And that's like the whole thing. That's like what you're selling, and it sounds weird, like you're selling yourself, but like you speaking to camera is what's most important, right?
[00:30:37] Nate Flake: And if anyone, if, unless you're living under a rock, you've obviously seen, you ob- you've obviously seen the whole like yap challenge thing going viral and everybody like, "Oh, this is yapping. It's like this new thing." And it's like, it's just speaking to camera. It's not anything new, but like genius how it's b- been positioned and monetized.
[00:30:52] Nate Flake: But, but that's definitely the gap in the market that has been, like people just are not comfortable speaking to camera, [00:31:00] which is like, I don't give a crap, right? And you don't give a crap, which is why we did so well from the very, very beginning. But there's a lot of creators that don't have the comfort of like speaking to camera, which is like a skill that you need to develop, which is why the yap challenge is crushing right now.
[00:31:12] Nate Flake: Because brands are like, "Sweet, I love it. We can get people that are sp- know how to speak to camera. They don't feel awkward. They don't feel weird," you know. And so, yeah, I, I, I'm not a big fan. I mean, it's very, very rare that a brand sends me something where I don't have to do at least one portion of the video where I'm speaking directly to camera.
[00:31:29] Leah Hamill: [00:31:30] Same. Yeah. I mean, I'm at the point now where I tell my students, especially for, like, women my age, like, our age is our niche, right? Like, that's the whole reason. Like, they, they-- the brand wants to see another, you know, see you on camera talking to, you know, their demographic who looks, you know, that's the whole point of this.
[00:31:50] Leah Hamill: So I'm like: I don't care about your B-rolls. I mean, maybe have one B-roll, you know, voiceover, video in your portfolio, but you need to have, you know, the [00:32:00] talking to camera, because that's, that's your bread and butter with this. Yeah. I have people that still ask me about faceless, and I'm like:
[00:32:07] Nate Flake: Yeah,
[00:32:07] Nate Flake: faceless is
[00:32:08] Leah Hamill: be a hard road, yeah, but... And I'm, I'm not your gal 'cause I-- that's not, you know, I'm, talking to camera is definitely, I think, a must-have skill with UGC.
[00:32:19] Nate Flake: Yeah. Are you seeing s- on that same kind of, topic, in the last, like, couple months, have you seen any different type of trends with brands coming to you and asking you for different [00:32:30] briefs? Have you seen anything that's, like, popping up more than anything? Is it just the super messy, sloppy content, or what kind of stuff has been working?
[00:32:36] Nate Flake: I know street interviews for me, I've been getting a ton of those, which is tough. Like, obviously that's, like, another, that's another level
[00:32:43] Leah Hamill: That, good for you. I'm sc- yeah, I don't do street interviews or like... I actually, yeah, I don't do street interviews and I don't do skits. I, I just never have. I don't know, it's just not my
[00:32:55] Leah Hamill: thing, but
[00:32:56] Leah Hamill: I...
[00:32:56] Nate Flake: on InfluEE this morning, actually. I have to
[00:32:58] Leah Hamill: Did you? Yeah. Well, I had [00:33:00] a brand send me, they were like: " Hey, we've got four concepts. Choose which one you want."
[00:33:04] Leah Hamill: And I challenged myself to take the skit one, so I, now I'm gonna have a, have a skit in there. But, yeah, I would say as far as like trends, I think it's getting simpler and messier, and I'm just getting big script reads. They want me in my bathroom, looking like I'm just holding the camera, like very, very n- you know, no mic, just talking to, talking to the [00:33:30] camera.
[00:33:30] Leah Hamill: So I would say it's m- it's moving even farther away from the, like, aesthetic B-roll stuff and more to, like, I'm just getting some s- ones that are just straight script reads. So
[00:33:41] Nate Flake: Yeah, that's
[00:33:42] Leah Hamill: I think that talking to camera's more important than ever, and I think you're right with the AI and stuff. It's like, this is the skill, like, if you wanna be successful with UGC, it's definitely the being able to talk to camera
[00:33:54] Nate Flake: Yeah. Yeah, no, I agree. I think it's hard for people that, that's, I mean, e-easily the hardest skill [00:34:00] that's, that's with my students at least, to get them comfortable speaking on camera. And then also, like, the, the tonality of, like, what they're saying, right? Of like, once you nail... It's a lot of different things, right?
[00:34:11] Nate Flake: Once you nail the eye contact, that's one thing. Once you nail the reading ahead, looking off camera, whatever, making sure you have the eye contact. But then what's oth- what, what's also hard is, like, if you watch that back, which is why I always recommend watching it back after,
[00:34:25] Nate Flake: like, if you're, if you're, like, breaking up a sentence of like-- And you can tell you're [00:34:30] breaking it up by, like, how you're seeing it on the teleprompter.
[00:34:33] Nate Flake: Like, you need to redo that because you wouldn't say, if I was talking to you right now, I'd be like, "Yeah, you should click the link below today," right? Like, I wouldn't have that weird, like, pause between, or like, just, like, intonation and things like that as, as you get better learning how to, like, use your hands, like you said.
[00:34:49] Nate Flake: And then, and then also, like, there's a lot of creators that are doing a lot. It's, like, al-almost too much energy where it's too salesy. I'm like, "Do you need to, like, bring it, reel it back a little bit so it sounds, like, a [00:35:00] little bit more natural?" like how you would tell somebody about a product, you know.
[00:35:04] Nate Flake: I think that's another hard, hard part for people.
[00:35:07] Leah Hamill: Yeah, and I like to even throw in some, some likes, some ums, some filler words. I find that that can help to make it feel a little bit more natural. but yeah, the-- I've seen that where it's over the top, or sometimes they have that, like, influencer voice where it's like, "I'm... This is the da, da, da, da." And I'm like, "That's not your real voice.
[00:35:27] Leah Hamill: I've talked to you. You gotta, like, try
[00:35:29] Leah Hamill: to [00:35:30] channel your..." Yeah, channel your actual voice as if you're talking to your, your partner or your friend.
[00:35:36] Nate Flake: Yeah, that's tough. I was gonna ask you an- another thing is, or about your, students and community as well is do you, like you were just so going back to the street interview thing, one thing that I, that I think a lot of creators when it comes to street interviews specifically, right? 'Cause I don't know if maybe it's just me, I'm getting a ton of them lately.
[00:35:54] Nate Flake: if you are in a community like yours, one thing that I've been recommending is like [00:36:00] finding a couple people in your city and like, 'cause you guys, every street, and, not every, I did a couple in New York that weren't just actual random people that were not pumped with me talking to them. But like 90% of the street interviews you're watching and, and literally was in New York and saw this happen, where there's a group of about 10 people and then they just essentially staged a bunch of fake street interviews with each other, right?
[00:36:22] Nate Flake: So like if you have to do a street interview and you're super, super anxious about like stopping randoms on the street, like find other [00:36:30] creators then let them be the
[00:36:31] Nate Flake: randoms, right? And then like whenever it comes to the, your turn or their turn to like need somebody, then you can pay it forward and like help each other out.
[00:36:38] Nate Flake: But I think just s- straight up saying n- like I've had a lot of people that are like, "Oh no, I won't do those." I'm like, "Dude, just grab a couple people you already know," and like you're leaving a lot... Like you can charge a lot for those street interviews, like a lot more than your regular rates for sure. So
[00:36:52] Leah Hamill: I didn't...
[00:36:53] Leah Hamill: Yeah
[00:36:54] Nate Flake: to encourage people to do is like, just get people you know in your town.
[00:36:56] Nate Flake: A, it's cool. Like we do a Utah meetup once a month with like [00:37:00] people in the academy and out of the academy, just anyone that's a creator. In fact, a couple random like travel people that don't even do UGC, they just do mo- well, I guess technically it is UGC, but they're more influencer type people. but yeah, it's fun to just like, you connect with other creators, but then if you ever need a favor or need somebody in a video with you, you can always like have a, have a list of people in your town you can hit up.
[00:37:20] Leah Hamill: Yeah, that's an amazing idea. Wait, I have a question about the skits then. So I always thought it was someone that was in on it. Like I, I didn't know they actually grabbed [00:37:30] random people off the street. Like what's the protocol?
[00:37:33] Nate Flake: The skits? So
[00:37:35] Nate Flake: yeah, like for the street interviews you mean?
[00:37:38] Leah Hamill: Yeah.
[00:37:38] Nate Flake: Yo, yeah, so like,
[00:37:40] Leah Hamill: street interview, sorry, not
[00:37:41] Nate Flake: oh, so yeah, these street interviews and like skits with a random person
[00:37:43] Nate Flake: is crazy.
[00:37:44] Leah Hamill: Street interview. Yeah, grabbing people off the street.
[00:37:47] Nate Flake: That's next level. No, yeah. I did, I've done a couple. I've done one for like Masa Chips, here in, in, and had to go basically to like, they're like, "Go to a park or a mall," and I did grab random people for like the entire [00:38:00] thing, and it took
[00:38:01] Leah Hamill: this is like
[00:38:01] Leah Hamill: my worst nightmare.
[00:38:03] Nate Flake: Oh, it took me a long time. Like I, I had a couple people that were like actually pretty rude about it too, and I'm like, "What is going on?" And like I w- the only, and it w- I thought it was gonna be easy 'cause I, I had all these extra bags of chips that are like $15 a bag and I'm like, "Hey, I will give you this free bag of chips if you stop for 40 seconds and let me talk to you," you know?
[00:38:19] Nate Flake: but yeah. I think most, I mean, maybe there are people that do actual randoms. I thought it was just randoms and then as, as soon as I like went to some events and stuff, I realized, I'm [00:38:30] like, "Oh, these are all staged." Like I am the doofus that was like ask- actually getting authentic reactions from people,
[00:38:36] Leah Hamill: Yeah, that would've been me. I would've been out there stopping randoms. I didn't, or
[00:38:40] Nate Flake: mean, you definitely get way more... You, I mean, you can tell. The next time you watch a street interview, like, you can tell that they're like, you know, "Hey, what, you know, what's the most important thing in your diet?" "Well, I think fiber is." "Well, guess what? We have these fiber..." You know, like, happen to say the perfect thing, you know? Like, yeah. And so, I think you definitely get... It's way more work [00:39:00] getting randoms because you have to get more of a sample size. Like, you have to get more people to get the answers you want, but it makes for some good outtakes and stuff sometimes. And the brand was pumped about it. They were, like, stoked that I actually f- they, that I didn't, like, arrange friends and stuff, which was cool.
[00:39:14] Leah Hamill: Okay. Well, I'm gonna finish up this skit one that I did, and then I'm gonna try a street interview.
[00:39:20] Nate Flake: yeah. Straight to the reason why. Skit,
[00:39:22] Leah Hamill: Challenge accepted. Yeah.
[00:39:24] Nate Flake: outfit and like go into way, way crazy personality mode, so it's kinda fun. okay, la- I, I [00:39:30] appreciate your time, Lee. I wanna, wanna wrap with one last question. If you, basically could give a- any new creator any advice, what would you tell them?
[00:39:40] Nate Flake: Someone that's starting out today, like 2026, little bit different than when we started out, right? The market's a little bit different, a little bit harder to navigate, I would say now than it was a year or two years ago, for sure, three years ago. anyways, what would be your biggest p- piece of advice for somebody brand new?
[00:39:56] Leah Hamill: My biggest piece of advice [00:40:00] would be, I think this is gonna sound kind of cheesy, but I feel like if you decide that you wanna do UGC, you just have to keep trying and pivoting until you find something that works for you. So my recommendation would be to start, still start on the apps and apply to everything.
[00:40:20] Leah Hamill: And in your downtime, keep making content, keep getting better at content, keep saving ads that you see as you're scrolling on Instagram, and [00:40:30] study and just keep going because, I fully believe that, like, anyone can do UGC. I think it's a skill that can be learned. you just have to keep doing it, and sometimes it takes longer than, you know, for other people.
[00:40:44] Leah Hamill: But, if you keep doing it, it's going to work for you. So keep going is my is my piece of advice.
[00:40:51] Nate Flake: 100% agree. I, I, I haven't met a s- like I, I, you know, again, we both work with students and stuff. I haven't, haven't met anybody that has [00:41:00] actually like put in the work and like continued and like hasn't gotten a job and started to get momentum, right? Like it doesn't happen where you just like get rejected forever.
[00:41:10] Nate Flake: Like it just doesn't happen. There comes a point where your content gets better, you get seen, you get the right introductions. Again, you meet the right people and maybe they know somebody that needs a job, right? Or, or, and, and you're that person. But it's the people that like give up and like, "Ah, UGC doesn't work.
[00:41:24] Nate Flake: I tried it for three weeks." You're like, "Okay." Like that's fine, I guess. Like if you don't wanna do it, you know, [00:41:30] it's not
[00:41:30] Nate Flake: for
[00:41:30] Leah Hamill: Yeah, No, I think it's, it's totally doable. You just gotta keep, keep going until it, until it works for you. And you be resourceful, right? I think that's like a great quality is like finding different ways, different avenues, like trying different things until you kind of fall into the thing that works for you,
[00:41:47] Nate Flake: Yeah. I wanna talk about your community for a second. With your students, so your, you were telling me your students are mostly 40-plus females that had been in some type of marketing or social media, or, like, maybe they wanna try content or maybe they hate their [00:42:00] job. What's the hardest thing for them starting out?
[00:42:02] Leah Hamill: I mean, I think it's always getting that first job, right? Like, you need that first win under your belt. It seems like once you can get that first paid job that like, then it's like you get a little dopamine hit. Yeah, that, that it's possible. So it's like hanging on until you get that first job, and it can get discouraging to see someone that gets it in like, you know, their first week or, you know, but it may take you a couple months.
[00:42:29] Leah Hamill: Like, it, [00:42:30] it just, it depends. I think that it's a mindset really, I think is the biggest thing I see people struggle with, is just like staying, staying the path, staying positive that it can be done. because once you start to get those little wins, which is why I like the apps again too, 'cause you can get like a bunch of multiple little wins, and it's like a little dopamine hit each time, and it keeps you motivated to keep going.
[00:42:54] Leah Hamill: But, yeah, I think it's a, I think it's a lot of mindset that people struggle with, right? They're just like, [00:43:00] "Oh, tried it. Can't do it. Doesn't work. I applied to 10 brands and that's it, I'm giving up." So
[00:43:06] Nate Flake: Yeah, and I think, well, I think that's the like, you know, shameless plug or what I heard to the communities, but like I think that's why communities like ours are so important too, is 'cause it's like you have these, you know, hype people built in to the-- that are like always pushing you and like, you know, people that are like, "Oh, I was gonna give up," and then you basically forced me to keep going and then now I got one and I'm so glad and now I'm three months in, I'm doing [00:43:30] $3,000 a month.
[00:43:30] Nate Flake: You know, like that's the kind of stuff that, that's where community is really big, I feel like, and, and basically having the framework for somebody-- from somebody who's already been in your shoes, right? And made all the stupid mistakes, so then you don't have to waste months doing the same crap and you can just kind of get the, like the cheat codes to learning and to the apps and things like that.
[00:43:50] Nate Flake: So, yeah, I think, I feel like that's, that's what you're paying for, right?
[00:43:54] Leah Hamill: For sure. And I think, I mean, I've seen it with like, it's nice to see other people at the same level [00:44:00] as you too, you know, instead of just seeing all of us, you know, creators that have been doing it for, you know, a while and saying, "Oh, you know, I made this much, I made this much." But you get into like a community and you're surrounded by people that are, you know, closer to your beginning level, like a lot of the women are beginners, and so they're seeing, okay, look, you know, Suzy, you know, got her first deal and it was $150, and we're all so excited for her.
[00:44:23] Leah Hamill: Like, it just ma- it just makes it more realistic, too. It's like nice to connect with, with people that are on the same level with [00:44:30] you or where you're at now.
[00:44:32] Nate Flake: So if you're, I mean, you obviously probably have people that are under 40, but most majority of yours are like 40 plus or in your same demographic, right? So if you're a 40 plus and you wanna join, Leah's community, I'm going to throw it in the show notes, you guys, the link, and you can, you can join there.
[00:44:47] Nate Flake: I know I've seen a bunch of your guys' community posts and stuff. You guys seems like a cool crew for sure.
[00:44:52] Leah Hamill: It,
[00:44:52] Leah Hamill: it's fun.
[00:44:54] Nate Flake: yeah. So I'll plu- I'll plug that in the community, the show notes if you guys want to learn from Leah. any [00:45:00] last, any last words of wisdom, Leah? Appreciate you hopping on with me today.
[00:45:03] Leah Hamill: Gosh, no, this was really fun. I really love talking UGC with someone. It was great. No, thanks for having me. appreciate it
[00:45:11] Nate Flake: Yeah, yeah, for sure. We'll see you at the next event hopefully. I think Dallas o- Dallas in April, so
[00:45:17] Leah Hamill: Ah, so excited. No, I'm really excited. The first one was chef's kiss, and I was so impressed by it and, definitely excited for Dallas
[00:45:24] Nate Flake: Oh, appreciate it. Awesome. And then you guys, as always, if you have creator friends and are looking [00:45:30] for, some free education, send them this podcast, a comment, a like, subscribe, do all the things, press all, press all the buttons. Super appreciate you guys. Thanks a lot, Leah. We'll talk to you soon.
[00:45:40] Leah Hamill: Okay, bye
[00:45:42] Nate Flake: Bye. All right. That's it. If you got something out of this, hit subscribe. Catch another episode or share it with a creator friend who needs to hear it
[00:45:49] Nate Flake: Thanks for hanging out. I'll catch you next week. Keep creating.