Atsuko Okatsuka

Internationally touring comedy superstar Atsuko Okatsuka is here! Ilana and the master storyteller talk about rockin’ a bowl cut and not dressing for the male gaze, “the worse the healthcare the louder they laugh,” working with and loving your partner, growing up undocumented in the U.S., and building a culture rooted in spreading love and joy.

Host: Ilana Glazer
Guest: Atsuko Okatsuka
Producers: David Rooklin, Annika Carlson, Madeline Kim, Kelsie Kiley, Glennis Meagher
Video Producers: Lexa Krebs, Louise Nessralla
Audio Producers: Nicole Maupin, Rachel Suffian
Lighting Director: Kevin Deming
Editor: Tovah Leibowitz
Graphics: Raymo Ventura
Outro Music: Don Hur

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Transcript

Speaker: 0:00

My guest today is the hilarious, totally unique master storyteller Atsuko Okatsuka. She's an internationally touring artist and a fellow hilarious comedian. You can watch her latest special father and see her newest hour on the Big Bowl tour. She's bringing her one of a kind comedy and joyful party energy to stages us all over the country and the world. And today she is gracing us with her presence on our podcast. Please welcome the amazing, phenomenal Atsuko Okatsuka. Yay. Yay. Thank you. Thank you, Ilana. That was very, very nice to hear. I'm. Such a fan of yours and I'm so excited to maybe be becoming friends, although I don't mean to pigeonhole you, but man, you're just so, so true to who you are and it's really inspiring. And it's so funny because it's just funny you're your set up and punchline is often you being you, and it's delicious and it's so, it's like never try hard. You're never try hard. Oh my God. Oh, there's try hard. I'm sure there's a try hard version in the past, but it just seems right now where you're at, you're aligned and coming to us as you knowing you. Yeah. I mean, that's how I felt. I mean, I'm a huge fan too. Been watching you since I was a little girl. Girls, no, and then you go, oh my God, the person I'm watching is so them so authentically comfortable. You know what I mean? And then I want to be like that. So sometimes I feel like you're like, oh, maybe people aren't ready for the real me. I'm afraid of the real me. What is that too dorky or whatnot? Too weird. Making up words. That. Aren't actual English words like I do, I make sounds instead of speaking actual words sometimes, because my vocab is like, I think I only have 300 words or something. What do you mean? I don't use big words. There's always, I make things up. I go on the light, off the light, things like that. Yeah. When I want something like the bins in the airplane above us, I go, oh, can you put this? I tell my husband, can you put my backpack upstairs? Things. Like that, but you know what I mean? I totally know what you mean. I call Google Docs upstairs, downstairs, Google Docs upstairs. If I'm in a Google Doc with someone and I'm sharing it in writing, I'm like, can we go upstairs? Oh, to scroll up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Upstairs. I'm so about that. You do too. Oh my God. 300 words is so funny. I thought, you know how you can sort of get a sort of neurodivergence test or see how your brain organizes your thoughts? I. Thought you really meant you have 300 words. Oh, I mean, possibly. I don't even know where to take a test like that. It. Takes me a long time to go. I'm going to try to do something that's like self-awareness or self-care. I think taking tests is self-care to help you diagnose and stuff like that took me forever to admit I want a therapist, things like that. And so it's cool. Finally, I feel like I can be me, but it's because enough people, whether it's my husband being like, no, I think you do you, I'll pick up more shifts waiting tables so you can do more comedy. Things like that. Or my fans being like, no, I see you and it's okay that you are a weirdo. And it just took a village that way for me to finally be like, fine, I will rock a bowl cut. And. It's like, gorgeous. You are gorgeous off. Go gorgeous. Not everyone likes it. Okay. Let them not like it. I don't know. Just the way I opened for you at the Beacon recently when you were here in New York. What a dream. What a treat. You sold out two nights at the Beacon Theater. Hello. And yeah, you just were looking so fly and I was taking you in in your Rachel Antonoff, and I was like, okay, just looking gorgeous head to toe. The look is also another thing where I think for me, a lot of life, it had to be trying out things I'm not, or not for me. When people go like, oh, how do you, I find me. How do I find out what my calling is? It's like the key to life is knowing who you're not is what I say. Because that's how I was able to eventually arrive at, yeah, I'm going to rock this bull cut that I had when I was three years old, but made me feel like a freak when I was a kid. And that maybe isn't typically seen as beautiful for whoever decides what beautiful is, long, long hair. Whoever decides what femme and masc is, it's just learning about Barbara Streisand calls it the androgyny of the soul. Oh, yeah. And it's just these beauty standards that are so oppressive and then become so ugly. What we're seeing right now, these beauty standards in our government. The. Twisted, chopped and screwed version of what it means to be masculine is such a joke. And. Then it's like, you're telling me I'm not feminine enough? You look crazy. It's true. And you were saying before about to your audience, is it okay that I'm this weird? And then it actually turns out they need you to be as exactly weird as you are. And I'm just having this vision almost of you carving this space in the air into the universe. There was no Atsuko as we know her before you did that. So you have to, it's almost like digging a tunnel or something, like truly breaking new ground to be who you are and then make it okay for people to be not even at your show. People show up wearing bowl cuts to honor you and it's a wig, but to whatever their version of a bowl cut is. Right? Yes. Yeah. Because eventually, I mean, a few people came up that didn't have bowl cuts at all. That was hysterical. I wonder, is that what you meant by whatever their version of a bowl cut is? That man that came up that just was bald. Yeah, that was so funny. There was that gorgeous guy, but he was not understanding. He had his own slick look. Oh, yes. And then the older white guy who was just not getting what was going on, but you were like, I know. He was like, yeah, you know me. And we knew each other. Yes. But. From 20 years ago, he. Had just decided, Hey, this is a good way to say hi is, how else am I going to say hi to her. Publicly in front of a sold at Beacon Theater. And it wasn't the prompt, which is, Hey, if you have a bull cut a wig of my bull. Cut on. Come on up two people and then the rest not. And also the women who had the bull cuts were gorgeous. There was a cute shorter woman, and then this gorgeous, taller woman, and I was just so thrilled to see them. That one of them was also named sco, which is something that I've also found is I've had other SCOs also come up to me and say, Hey, because of you, people are able to say my name finally too. Pronounce it. So I think it's that, like you said, oh, chisel at a cave. Yeah. A poet. Laa Glaze. A true poet. So chisel at the cave. And then what it was was also once in a while I would go, is anybody out there? Listen in. I'm like, okay, no one's there yet, but I'll keep chiseling and I'll go, hello. And then finally, some people at the end were like, we're actually here. I hear you. Keep chiseling. I think that's kind of what happened. And there's specifically someone. Going. And you're like, no. And they're like. No, me too. And. Now people can say my. Name. Totally. Yeah. And then we found each other. You recently posted this very interesting and cool post about the way you dress not being for the male gaze, and how this relates to, I guess, the mask femme thing and your support of the trans community and the queer community. Right. Tell me more about it. Yeah, so it comes from, right, like you were saying. I mean, it is these guys. Sometimes I still get a trolling comment online and it is these guys that, well, they won't show their pictures. I don't know what they look like, but I'm guessing. Not good that. It's like, it's. Not good. I don't care what you look like, but they hate my hair. They hate that. It's not long. You know what I mean? They're like Girls, long hair, boy, short hair, what do you mean? And don't you get near my butt. That's kind of the subtext is like, don't you get near my butt. This is upsetting me. Why am I mad? And then the sub subtext is, please get near my butt. Please. Penetrate my butt. I know. It's so confusing. I'm the keeper of this information, Ilana. You know what I'm saying? People who are like, oh, you are here. Why so short? Why do I like it? I'm like, I don't know, please. I'm just. Right. And they're. Like, I'd never have dinner. Fuck you. Subtext. I desperately want to fuck you. It's a horrible feeling to hold someone else's dark, naughty, knotted up energy. Yes, yes. And I'm kind of like, well, I don't want that kind of person attracted to me. Correct. Actually, its unsafe. I'm so glad you don't want to hook up with me. That would be bad. I think that would be bad. Literally dangerous. Yeah, scary. And also want, for me, I would want to do some soul searching or I would want to change my look because of it. I'd be like, oh, wait, no, you're the kind of person. That. Trolls people and ESPs hate and says transphobic things. Oh, that's who I'm attracting that I don't want to No thank you do that. These people are going to be mad and not into it for their own reasons. But like I said before, I arrived back at this bull cut, and I love wearing bright colors and things like that. I used to think, oh, should I be more, should I wear more black and be more chic or something? That's very chic, and I think that's very pretty too. But. What I always wanted was to be more expressive in a colorful way. It is just what I'm drawn to. And so yeah, people are always going to be mad, but not to scare people. People aren't always going to be mad, but there will be people who don't understand. But that's not who you should dress for. KA, the male gaze, just because the people who don't understand tend to and. A few men who feel entitled to scream it. But it's not all men. I honestly like men get a bad rap because of those few guys. Yeah, no, totally. It's a bummer. It's a bummer. And honestly, I think it's probably 10 people with truly, truly. And then so many bots. It's. Not even real people. So you are on tour right now, the Big Bowl tour. So you're starting to go around the country and we are under an authoritarian sie. Yeah, totally. Good time to start a friendship. So that's why when you were like, Ooh, new friendship for me, I was like, yeah, actually, it's kind of exciting to me. Yeah. And you. Need a common enemy. Yeah. That makes bonds. That's right. It's true. Faster and stronger. It certainly worked for them. So how is it feeling? I feel so privileged when I get to go around the country and look at all these beautiful, smiling, laughing faces and get that truly, it's a feeling. It's an energy and then a physical feeling from sharing space that we all want the same things. We all want to be safe. We all, I think most people don't want authoritarian to live but then when you go back to your home, the way that information is being aimed at us, almost like a weapon is so divisive. And yeah. I'm just wondering as you're beginning embarking on this next tour, how it's feeling out there. I feel still lucky. Even being in the states, I was just talking to someone who was like, okay, so what country are you going to move to when it really happens? I was like, oh, I'm not going to go anywhere because I feel so, I am luckier than a lot of people. I was undocumented, but I get to be used to be undocumented because I have a citizenship. I'm luckier than a lot of people, and I get to talk about it and maybe not feel scared. I don't know. Not too much, but you know what I mean. I get to do standup comedy. I get to tour nationally, but also internationally with it and say what I want and have found a community and fans that way. I am luckier than most, so I feel like I should stay. I need to stay. I get to stay. In. America, get. To stay. Same, same. And spread love and funny's that way. Totally. For the people who need it, who can't leave. Totally. And just like you vote for people who can't vote as well. I've had family in Indonesia and Japan and Taiwan, and I've performed in a lot of countries where there are scripts. You have to submit your script ahead of time. There's some censorship rules. And so I've seen seen people really thrive even in situations where there are rules or they have a king or something. So I feel actually pretty hopeful that we get to do podcasts. You know what I mean? I really believe in the people here that, yeah, we can still thrive. So one thing that I'm picturing or that's coming up for me is you really can't squash the human spirit. Yeah. They try and they try, but bitch, you won't because humanity is too magical and beautiful. And. Your idea of how to organize it better for you is it's not going to fly in the end. It's very scary right now. People are being truly and deeply violated violently. But in the bigger picture, it's like you're not going to do it. You're not going to really end up enslaving all of humanity in the way that you want. You can't have that control. There's just too much magic in. Humanity. Yes. That's what it is. For real. There will always be, people will always be making jokes. People are making jokes as they're detained. You know what I mean? People will always act out of love. So much love and that you can't really, truly can't crush and kill. There was a docuseries by Larry Charles called The Dangerous World of Comedy, where he followed standup comedians in different countries where it's even illegal to do it, for example. Damn. But they're doing it and audiences are coming out even hush hush. It's like in speakeasy, but they're laughing their asses off. I ranked the countries that I've performed in from shyest to liveliest, and I did 28 countries. And of course, it's kind of a bummer in that the lively they are. It's because the worst, the healthcare, the louder they laugh. Right. So America's like number three, number three, number three. Wow. Which is not good. No. But great audience. Yeah. You. Know what I mean? Hey. To work out the material. But. Third out of 20 countries. Yeah. Because. Our healthcare is that piss poor our access to healthcare. And I mean. Belgium was the shyest, but do you want that this audience, my opener, Dylan Adler, he does a back flip right in his set. He did a back flip in Belgium to silence. Oh my God. I mean, I might take worse healthcare. Yeah. Their hearts are healthy. They've. Got access to therapy. They have two years off when they have a kid. They're not laughing. What do we have to laugh about? To be honest? Why are they coming? I don't know exactly. I'm like, you need this too. You. Need laughter. I don't think so. And. So you work with your husband on the road, which is so nice, in such a sort of vulnerable situation that is being a touring standup comedian. It's so cool that you, well, I want to say two things that you work with your husband and also that you talk about loving him. Stand up traditionally as my wife, take my wife, for example. Not really take her or my husband's so annoying, he's da dah, dah, dah. And. It's really just delicious. I do love talking about the things I love. That's what it makes me giggle and laugh. And I'm like, oh man. Oh the person. I love this. But also, maybe I get to be that way because people are so put together around me as well. What do you mean? I'm very lucky. I always try to remember that. And so I don't take anyone for granted. I don't want to. Yes. I mean, I feel the same way. Ryan's on top of it so that I could be like, oh man, what do you mean? I haven't been doing the laundry these past seven years. That was so funny that that. Who's been doing it? And he is like, me, me. So funny picturing you that your bit and father picturing you just going to the laundry room to tell a story, but never doing the laundry is so funny, is so delightful. Right. But I get to be that lovable silly girl. She didn't know she hadn't been helping out in the house because he's on top of it. And that is kind of, but I try to give him props for it because I know that it was a devastating moment. It was like, it's funny now, but it wasn't fun. When we both had that discovery. In. That laundry room, I was like, how do you turn this on? I knew how to turn it on. I said, but which setting is good for a load like this? And which thing would I press for that. For a load like this? I don't know. I have my preferences. What's yours typically? That's. So funny. And without missing, because he loves me, he started explaining. He's like, yeah, I think I would maybe do cold. And he goes, wait, have you not been done the laundry? Whoops. And I was like, and I genuinely was shocked too, because I also couldn't, I was like, it was a moment for me too. I was like, oh. My God. So funny. Yes. I guess I've never done it. But do. You fold? Huh? Do. You fold? What's LO? Oh, like folding. Folding the clothes, socks. Did you think I was doing something sexual? Fold. Fold. I fold. Yes. Text, hold them, fold them. Sometimes you got to hold 'em, man. You got to fold 'em. What? I was like, whoa. Okay. I was even trying. But the laundry for real. Yeah. No, I've matched socks and folded underwear. That's nice. I've taken things out of the dryer with him, and then he'll be like, oh, put it in the basket. And so I do that. And then. You're like basket. Right? Just really putting the pieces together. Yeah. So I was saying, we were talking about the assault on immigrants in our country, and meanwhile, immigrants are who founded this country and what we are proud of. But I was saying, reflecting as a white person in 2016, I really learned some things that I didn't know before and I didn't really even understand what an undocumented immigrant meant or was. And. You were like, well, me neither. Right, right. Yeah. And you were considered that. Well, to be honest, as a kid, I didn't know I would be considered undocumented or that I was illegal because this is props to society, communities, friends, neighbors. They, I think did as much as possible to make sure you just felt welcomed in general. At least where I ended up, which was West la again, pretty lucky. It was a very diverse neighborhood that I ended up in. And so there was just no question you could, as an undocumented person, you could go to school, you could go to elementary school, middle school, high school, I think around university that you do need a social security number. But. For the most part, you could use the public library. I was taking the bus, so I felt like, oh yeah, why would I be here illegally? Right. I don't even know what that meant. And also you were illuminating me that undocumented was actually a response to the wording illegals. Right? Yeah. It. Was a claiming of the status in a way that wasn't weaponizing your fucking existence. Right? Yeah, totally. Because I used to, once I found out I was undocumented, but I didn't have that word yet in my vocab, so I was calling myself illegal when I found out because that's the only word I had to describe what I was doing. And. So it was negative to be like, oh yeah, we messed up. We shouldn't be here. So let's not make a big deal illegal. But also alien too, because when I got, oh my God, because when I got a green card, you got an alien ID number. When I say I really actually connect with Stitch. Yes. Yeah. Because he's literally an alien from outer space and what I mean, and then finds a home with unlikely folks who are also broken in their family. So, so it wasn't until later that I learned words and defining something and the connotation of. Them. Really changes. Maybe your self-confidence and how you carry yourself. Yeah. It was the word undocumented or using the word immigrant instead of alien to. Alien is so crazy. Right. It's like, you mean from outer space that is so othering, it's putting you off the planet. I mean, it's just cruel. And for this to be sort of federal government language to organize groups of people into, it's just sadistic so unnecessarily. It should be boring and banal, not branded as villains, enemies. You know what I mean? Yeah. I think that's why when I've noticed, when my grandma talks about white people, she says, Americans. And I always have to encourage her to be like, oh no, we're Americans too. And she's like, oh yeah, right. She'll be like, your new friends, are they American? Or I am like, oh, white. And she's like, yes, yes. Are they white? Because they have names like Ashley Mark that you were talking about. Oh, Clayton, are they American? I was like, oh, they're white. Yes. But yes. And also American, but we're also American too. Even. With names like oco. And you have to retrain yourself to think a different way. And so when I'm abroad, and for some reason I don't understand this, I don't know if maybe I'm wrong, but when I'm in Asia, the white people there who moved there are called expats. But I'm like, oh. But they moved there from Ohio or wherever, Canada to look for a better life and settled. And now they live there. They they're immigrants too. Precisely. And then a lot of them were like, no, no, no. I'm an expat. I'm. Like, but you live here now and you work here now too, right? This is your new home. You're an immigrant. I think immigrant has still a more negative connotation than expat. Expat sounds more, I don't know, cool or something. Well. I guess centers America as the center of the world. So your exterior of the center of the world that we all know is the center of the world. Oh, interesting. Pat, it's making me think about how you're saying your community welcomed you in such a way that you didn't know the titles that were being thrust upon you, such as undocumented or legals. And honestly, this is what it feels like to watch you on stage and to watch you on screen. It feels like you are welcoming us into your spirit that is transcendent of titles or labels or identity qualifiers. I don't know. It's just very, for me right now, very clearly connected to your experience of feeling welcomed and being so. Welcoming. It took work. And then sometimes, I guess educating myself helped. Right? When you were talking about being a comedian, spreading love, no matter what government you're under, no matter where you are in the world, It was like a vision was coming up for me about the way I think of democracy. Democracy is not some fixed switch you can turn on or off. It is an organism filled by people, us that must be kept alive by us or not. And you were illustrating that for me about the culture. The culture can spread love and joy and welcomeness and inclusion if it does. If there are comedians like you going out and doing that, that's what keeps it alive. Thank you so much, so grateful to have this opportunity to talk to you like this. Oh. My God, thank you for having me. You're so. Brilliant. Friendships in scary, weird times. Yeah, it's really cool. It's kind of the way to get through. Yeah. Thank you so much. It's closed. You know how it was open. We're closing. I want to thank Atsuko Okatsuka for joining us. You can follow her on Instagram @atsukocomedy. This episode took a lot of people to make. I want to thank the producers here at It's Open, David Rooklin, Annika Carlson, Madeline Kim, Kelsie, Kiley, and Glennis Meaghar. Thanks to the crew who made the audio visual so beautiful, Kevin Deming, Rachel Suffian, and Louise Nessralla. Our graphics are made by the very talented Raymo Ventura. Our music is made by one of my favorite up and coming bands, Don Hur. And this episode was edited by the totally talented Tovah Liebowitz. This is a Starrpix production. And don't forget to like and subscribe to this show wherever you watch and listen to podcasts and follow us on at its open pod on socials.