UV24 - ONIBABA (1964)

Join charlie and chris on a journey to 14th century japan but as grizzly gilfs and horny hatchi's hiding in the tall grass, will they reach a happy ending or will they become trapped by a curse of corruption?

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Yes. As I walk through the uncanny valley of death, you shall fear no evil. For I am that evil. Erica, you never got Grizzly Tales for Gruesome Kids, did you?

SPEAKER_09 0:23

No, I don't know what that is. That sounds fake. That sounds made.

SPEAKER_02 0:27

Well, Grizzly Tales for Gruesome Kids was you get this insanely sick like opening stop motion claymation intro of a little kid walking through. See when I was like trying to plan out like the uncanny valley stuff, this was very much what the inspiration for it was. Because it's just he's walking down this like weird abandoned town, and the cinema is still open. And like this disembodied hand gives him a ticket to go in to see a film, and then it cuts to like this weird gangly, like rotten old man who introduces and he plays like old tapes he has. It's like an anthology kid show, and it's all um like strange tales about like kids misbehaving and horrific shit happening to them. Like I'm sure um I've I've talked about it in the Discord before. Did you not see I was there was one about a girl that abused her plushes? So the plush comes to life in the middle of the night, Chucky style, and um disembowels her, stuffs her, and then leaves her in a charity shop for purchase.

SPEAKER_07 1:40

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 1:44

There was one where uh I forget why, I think they were just making fun of the butcher. The butcher uh kills the little girl and sells her sausage meat.

SPEAKER_07 1:57

You would not buy it. That's just goosebumps Sweeney Todd.

SPEAKER_02 2:05

Yeah, it's very goosebumps, but it's like how mortifying can we make this ending for young children?

SPEAKER_09 2:11

Have you ever seen scary stories to tell in the dark?

SPEAKER_11 2:15

The movie?

SPEAKER_09 2:16

Mm-mm. I'm pretty sure it's a TV show. I haven't seen it either, but as far as I'm aware, that's there's goosebumps and then that as well. Which I think is Canadian.

SPEAKER_02 2:28

I don't know if there was a TV show. There was a book series and then there was a movie. The movie has cool visuals, but it's pretty bad.

SPEAKER_09 2:35

Oh, there there was like one recently, right?

SPEAKER_02 2:39

Yeah, it was clearly like we went, oh shit, the goosebumps movie, but it was very bad. Made money.

SPEAKER_09 2:46

We should just do that. That movie was better than Yeah, produced by Del Toro. That was better than the Goosebumps movie. It wasn't good, but there was one or two good kills in there.

SPEAKER_02 3:00

Yeah, but my ex I I've got like a like maybe 60 different goosebumps books I could just go, oh the bum it's it's it's the thing. I know that thing. I like that thing. Did you see the Justin Long um adult Goosebumps?

SPEAKER_09 3:18

Are you afraid of the dark? That's the other show I was trying to think of.

SPEAKER_02 3:22

Ah, see, I never I hear that fucked up some kids though.

SPEAKER_09 3:26

Yeah, I heard that people really like that one.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

I assume you watched Goosebumps. A little bit.

SPEAKER_09 3:33

I read more Goosebumps than I watched.

SPEAKER_02 3:35

I read so much more Goosebumps than I watched, but I had the occasional videotape. Holy shit, those factors went so hard.

SPEAKER_09 3:44

My memory from when I was a kid is so spotty. I think because of how many drugs my parents had me on, but I'm not entirely sure.

SPEAKER_02 3:58

See a lot of mine is as well, but I can I have some vivid memories of goosebumps. Like I remember I can remember my primary school's library layout and where I found my first goosebum books, and it was Invasion of the Body Snatchers part two from series 2000. I've got it like it's bund as a core memory of me going, this little alien cover looks sick as hell. I'm gonna give this a beat, even it was part two, and then it just like spin on into obsession. That's cool. I was one of the kids that uh A Haunted Mask, the the the like actual episode traumatizing, absolutely horrifying.

SPEAKER_09 4:40

Don't remember. I remember the piano one mostly. The piano? Yeah, there was a player piano story.

SPEAKER_02 4:51

Oh, oh, oh, oh, was not okay. Uh so they hire a piano teacher, and he's like this weird guy, you can have it's like Colonel Sanders, and then there's like a ghost child that keeps playing the piano, not something like that.

SPEAKER_09 5:07

I remember the book more but I believe it's mostly about like the piano starts playing on its own, but it's not a player piano. Oh fuck, it was again you could be right, and I could just not remember anything because I really don't remember much about media I loved when I was a kid.

SPEAKER_02 5:33

See, I have I have little splotches, like I remember the twist of Shocker Street? Maybe was it Shocker Street? But I remember the Shocker Street.

SPEAKER_09 5:46

That sounds like somewhere a kid should not go.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

No, they definitely should not. But it was the big it's the big preying mantis or like a big grasshopper. We did it in the movie, and I remember, oh I remember that part. I also had to do a a school, like we got me, I did a book report on um oh it was it was there was one about a voodoo head or some shit. And I remember in school they made us do a book report, and then I I fucking I finessed that shit so bad they made me read it in front of the entire school.

SPEAKER_05 6:21

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_09 6:22

Love that. Now I must have been like you know, Shocker Street is making me think of them. Which I haven't seen, but I think we should watch. Yeah, it's a movie from the 50s. Them with an exclamation mark about a giant ant.

SPEAKER_02 6:42

A giant hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. Maybe I have seen this. I also have very spotty memories of going to a pound shop as a kid and finding a giant ant horror movie, and then going, This fucks? And I can't remember. Is it was it them? Did I see them?

SPEAKER_09 7:03

I would like to watch this either way, but that rules if you've seen this already and like it.

SPEAKER_02 7:08

Is it they or them?

SPEAKER_09 7:10

Them exclamation mark.

SPEAKER_02 7:14

Oh, these ants look so sick. What the fuck? It was definitely not this.

SPEAKER_09 7:19

Okay, this movie looks rad though, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:23

What the fu the only thing I can really remember from the one I watched was even as a child, I remember going, This is far too long. This needs cut down, and then there was one scene where it was the ants were watching like the survivors, and it was from their point of view, so it was like 80 different cameras all like hexagoned into each other. You can tell I was gonna be a film, bro, as a young kid. Yeah, yeah. Giant and horror movies. Maybe I'll find it. Maybe I'll find it.

SPEAKER_09 8:00

That would be cool. We should think try to think about movies we barely remember watching at some point.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

Well, it's not them.

SPEAKER_09 8:11

Yeah, it wasn't the first one that comes up. Empire of the Ants, I'm seeing.

SPEAKER_02 8:18

That's what I'm looking at. I'm like, maybe it's that.

SPEAKER_09 8:21

What is this?

SPEAKER_02 8:22

Oh ouch, a four-point for you and IMDB.

SPEAKER_09 8:26

And then Legion of Fire, Killer Ants, is the other one that Google recommends, which has a 2.9.

SPEAKER_02 8:34

Oh, it was Empire of Ants.

SPEAKER_09 8:36

Oh, hell yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 8:39

It's such an obscure HG Wells story. What Empire?

SPEAKER_09 8:46

That probably doesn't mean much, yeah. That probably doesn't mean much. It's just about ants. You know, what could he have put into it? Robert Hempzig is in it. Ants Ants.

SPEAKER_02 8:56

There could easily be like a fun little twist at the end.

SPEAKER_09 9:02

The ants were people, and the people were ants the whole time.

SPEAKER_02 9:07

There's one called It Happened at Lakewood Manor. It's a TV movie, and it just seems to be about a really fucked ant infestation. Oh. That sounds horrible.

SPEAKER_05 9:20

That sounds kind of fun. Oh, I'm looking at this. This looks bad. This looks outright bad.

SPEAKER_02 9:28

But it's like either you're a normal person and it's not going to do anything, or you show it to someone with like really bad psychosis symptoms and you send them spiraling.

SPEAKER_00 9:43

Oh.

SPEAKER_09 9:46

Are you okay? Dick Van Dyke's son is in It Happened at Lakewood Manor.

SPEAKER_02 9:54

Is that a sign of quality?

SPEAKER_09 9:57

No. I don't know if it's a sign of anything. Stacy Keach Sr. Brian Denehy. Ooh. He is my last name. It's gotta be good.

SPEAKER_02 10:11

So we have not famous people, but we've got tangentially related to famous people.

SPEAKER_09 10:17

I know Brian Denehy is very well regarded. I like Brian Denehy. I've only seen him in FX. But he's good.

SPEAKER_02 10:26

Is this are we talking Empire of the Ants or are we talking the Lakewood Manor movie?

SPEAKER_09 10:30

Lakewood Manor.

SPEAKER_02 10:32

I was gonna say if it's Empire of the Ants, I remember as a kid being like that that guy with a beard, he fucks. I fuck the ant.

SPEAKER_09 10:38

Empire of the Ants looks pretty good, actually.

SPEAKER_10 10:41

It's got such a bad score, but the ants look cool.

SPEAKER_09 10:43

Yeah, yeah, it looks fun. Should we do an ant month? It seems like there's enough movies. Um We should have done Antro this month.

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Oh no, there's gotta be there's gotta be another. Surely, what's what's the different words? They're arthropods, aren't they?

SPEAKER_06 11:01

Oh, that's that's true interesting.

SPEAKER_02 11:04

October pod? That's that's horrible. That'll get scrapped. Um another term for ant. Help me here, Google.

SPEAKER_04 11:14

Yeah, Google, help us out, come on.

SPEAKER_02 11:17

We form a C die Formics?

SPEAKER_09 11:22

That sounds like a genuine. I don't think this is a good idea. I don't think anyone's gonna understand what we're saying.

SPEAKER_02 11:29

Doesn't formicide sound like something like a a 14-year-old would call you after talking about loot cracking.

SPEAKER_09 11:38

Yeah, if you have glasses and formicide.

SPEAKER_02 11:42

Oh you formicide?

SPEAKER_09 11:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:47

I think ants are kind of cute.

SPEAKER_09 11:50

I like ants. I have no problem with ants.

SPEAKER_02 11:54

Is he one of the only bugs that I feel like if you look up close up, you're like, oh, you're kind of a kitty.

SPEAKER_07 12:00

Yeah, look at them, their little eyes. They're doing alright, they're doing their thing.

SPEAKER_02 12:06

Okay, hypothetical apocalypse situation. Some bugs are giant. What is the worst bug that could possibly be giant?

SPEAKER_09 12:17

Amazing question. My instinct is cockroach or mosquito.

SPEAKER_02 12:23

Oh fuck, a cockroach, you could kill the fucker.

SPEAKER_09 12:26

Yeah, that thing would be invincible. And then a mosquito would just like eat you, basically. It would just fly down and eat you.

SPEAKER_02 12:35

It's got a big tube. It's like a straw. It's a human straw. It's a human straw.

SPEAKER_09 12:42

Horrify. You've envisioned a horrifying scenario. I don't like this. I want it on the record.

SPEAKER_02 12:49

Do you but surely we wouldn't eat you if we would just like suck all of you? So we would just leave a like a little dry pinable to him.

SPEAKER_07 12:58

How I wish how I wish in my life for someone who will suck all of me.

SPEAKER_02 13:12

Surely you could launch like a bunch of them into like a big flamethrower.

SPEAKER_09 13:18

Hmm. Yeah, flamethrower could solve a lot. What wouldn't be solved by like a flamethrower?

SPEAKER_02 13:28

Because like I was thinking, for me, the worst insect on planet Earth is like a millipede. Vilson would be so juicy to kill.

SPEAKER_09 13:37

Oh, that'd be so scary. I feel like ladybugs would be scary. Have you ever played Grounded?

SPEAKER_02 13:44

I haven't. I feel I I I mean, I feel like it's not a game you can kind of play single player, and my schedule doesn't really work for online like teamwork games.

SPEAKER_09 13:55

Yeah, fair. It's not as fun single player, and it takes a while to beat, so it's way better when you have someone to chat with.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

No, ladybug's cute. Look at this little guy. We've got a little mosquito.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

I love ladybugs, but they feel I feel like they'd be creepy big. Like mosquitoes, what freaks me out about them being big is that they're hairy.

SPEAKER_09 14:22

Isn't that gross?

SPEAKER_10 14:25

I feel like Giant hairy mosquito.

SPEAKER_09 14:28

They used to be gigantic, also, so we would just have prehistoric mosquitoes, basically.

SPEAKER_02 14:34

I sent you a close-up ladybug. Look how cute that is. That is not scary.

SPEAKER_08 14:39

Alright. Alright, I'm looking.

SPEAKER_02 14:42

No, I feel like a bug, the less scary a bug is. No, the the more terrifying. No, that's so cute. What do you mean?

SPEAKER_05 14:51

I don't like it. It looks like it's thinking about how to absorb me.

SPEAKER_03 14:55

No, it's got like a little mustache, it's like snapping the floor. It's giving it a good snap. It's like a it's like a good dog. What about um a gigantic tardigrade?

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:15

Oh no, I love them. I've got to build a bear of them.

SPEAKER_09 15:18

I love them too, but they like what if there were millions of them? Because there probably are so many. What if they all got too big and then they're invincible, right? Like you wouldn't what would what what do you do? I'm pretty sure.

SPEAKER_05 15:35

Put them in crops and put them in the ocean?

SPEAKER_02 15:37

If you're going an exact number of them, I'm pretty sure there is like uh easily trillions, Chris. I don't think planet Earth is surviving. Oh, we'd be so fucked. Oh, population density, given their ubiquity, is estimated they exist in massive numbers, likely quintillions or higher, tens to the plus.

SPEAKER_07 16:03

Whatever that's so what do you do if target grade dick?

SPEAKER_03 16:09

Um I feel like they'd be cuddly though.

SPEAKER_07 16:14

You think they'd be chill? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:17

Yeah, okay, there's some spindly ones that make me uncomfortable, but see the see your typical one? He looks cute.

SPEAKER_09 16:24

Oh yeah, little they're little cuddly guys. They look like a stuffed animal.

SPEAKER_02 16:29

I don't like the butthole mouth. The butthole mouth is unsettling.

SPEAKER_09 16:35

No, nobody likes a butthole mouth when you first show it to them.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

See, I'm looking at photos now and I can't tell if I'm looking at its mouth or its arsenal.

SPEAKER_09 16:46

Well, you know, for some of us.

SPEAKER_02 16:52

Maybe every time scientists have tried to photograph them, they've just given it a quick flash.

SPEAKER_09 16:58

You think they're flashing scientists.

SPEAKER_02 17:01

Oh what? Yeah, wait, what? Here's one without without the little button. And he's cute. Why is every fucking the poor tartugrades must be like here's those rude humans coming to invade our privacy.

SPEAKER_07 17:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 17:18

Oh, yeah. I love that guy.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Yeah, he looks friendly. I don't know about quintillions of him.

SPEAKER_09 17:28

That's what I mean. That would be so scary. Welcome to Uncanny Valley. We're talking about Onibaba this week from 1964. Directed by Kaneto Shindo.

SPEAKER_02 17:44

This is this is gonna be our first time thoughts. This is this has never been discussed at any point before.

SPEAKER_09 17:51

No. We've not talked about this, we've not tried to talk about this, we wouldn't have tried to record this before now.

SPEAKER_02 17:57

Uh yeah, but okay. Onebaba. I think this is this is awesome. This is like see how occasionally you fall out of film and you go like I just can't be fucked for a little bit, and then you watch a film that makes you want to go back and start watching more movies. Onebaba has been that for me. Due to this, I've started trying to watch Akira Killisell movies. I've watched The Woman in the Dunes. Widan is definitely gonna this is an awesome film. Atmospheric, like really immersive, impressive. I can see why this is a Willem Defoe favourite.

SPEAKER_07 18:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

Chris, your thoughts.

SPEAKER_09 18:39

It's good. There were moments where I fell out of it. I didn't love the entire thing, but overall I really like it. I think it captures a pretty unique tone. There's a few details of the production, just broad details, that that I'll bring up. Uh one of which is that they just built huts in the middle of nowhere to film this. And the crew was living for I think a couple of weeks. Just in the middle of nowhere. Focusing on this, doing kind of nothing else but working on this or letting off steam. And it like shows very much in the production. It feels very isolated, and it feels there's just an energy to the area they're in. Which obviously develops further as that energy gets hornier, I guess. I don't know if there's any other way to put it. I love. Are we trying to go too chronologically, or do you mind if I comment on something later in the movie?

SPEAKER_03 20:00

No, you can you can you can bounce about, I don't mind.

SPEAKER_09 20:04

I love the moment where. Yeah, there a sequence of moments. The first moment being when uh I was hoping there would be names to call these women. No, they're just the the mother and the wife. Uh the mother character is telling the wife, you know, don't go sleep with that guy. Uh with Hachi. Don't Hachi is just looking to sleep with somebody. Uh also another sidetrack. So funny when she says, he just wants a woman, and then you cut to him, his face in the in the reeds in the hot sun, and he just goes, I want a woman. Amazing.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

Um, but later on.

SPEAKER_09 20:54

One more time.

SPEAKER_02 20:56

So don't we all is a relatable kinetic?

SPEAKER_09 20:59

Yeah. Yeah, um, but later on, there's the moment where she sees them having sex and has sort of a breakdown, and like holds the tree, embraces a tree. And it goes from you understand how her motives were you cared for my son, you shouldn't sleep with this person that he trusted. You know, there's a lot of emotions in that, but what she's left with once all once all that is stripped away is just that she's lonely and she's jealous that somebody else has a connection that they've found.

SPEAKER_02 21:42

Yeah, it's that's really interesting. No, it is really interesting because the female characters they don't have names, but they're so much more fleshed out. Because again, if you go for the the mother, again, like you she doesn't like have. Hatchy and she doesn't like the wife going with Hachi, but it's there's many multiple layers as to why she doesn't like this for selfish reasons and also for like actual smart reasonable mature decision making.

SPEAKER_09 22:19

But if the wife yeah, she also has pragmatic reasons not related to her probably dead son. And she's just saying, uh, you know, I need her to help me do my work, basically.

SPEAKER_02 22:36

I feel like we'll go back to it being rather horny because it is a horny movie.

SPEAKER_09 22:42

But what I I Which also makes a lot of sense why Willem Defoe likes it.

SPEAKER_02 22:47

Oh Willem Dee, he loves a horny movie.

SPEAKER_09 22:50

Doesn't he? It also makes a lot of sense that he wanted to star in this, and I assume he wanted to star in it after remaking it.

SPEAKER_02 22:59

Yeah, but surely like he says there's no way he could have spun it without ruining the source material. But I feel like Onibaba is so like it has to be set in Japan. You can't not make this set in Japan. So I was just gonna say But this is like it's 14th century funny Japan with just Willem Defoe shows up horny as hell.

SPEAKER_05 23:27

Oh my god, God help us all.

SPEAKER_02 23:31

It would be a town menace.

SPEAKER_09 23:34

It would be like Genghis Khan. Everyone now would have Willem Defoe in their DNA.

SPEAKER_02 23:39

I don't, but the thing is it wouldn't work. I feel like Willem Defoe's hatchet would have too much charisma. I feel like he would pull both of them.

SPEAKER_09 23:46

I agree, I completely agree. When she was when she's coming up, when the the mother is coming on to him, he'd be like, alright, why not?

SPEAKER_02 23:55

He would get he would get the mother, the daughter-in-law, the random samurai he finds in the hut, and the human samurai that's what he would do.

SPEAKER_09 24:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:08

Oh see, I would love that as a film, like 14th century Japan.

SPEAKER_09 24:12

Well, he should try to make something else that's similar. Like I would love to see what he would interpret. Because you can't well, but you you couldn't make him a soldier. That would suck. Right? It's like a modern day soldier. There isn't an like you you already said, but there isn't any interpretation that really works of this specific material. But you could there's something you could do.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

Well, I mean there's I feel like there's enough civil wars going about on planet Earth that you could. I mean, really, civil war is kind of like the setting that this takes place in. So you could easily do a list. I feel like at that point it's like I just made Onibaba, but like during the American Civil War.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

Yeah, which I feel like you would American Civil War is too I feel like too horrible and too race-coded.

SPEAKER_09 25:13

There's just too much going on historically with it to set something irrelevant in it. And if you don't do that, you're gonna then be setting it in like a hypothetical, you're gonna be doing an Alex Garland type Civil War, which I think maybe is too much for the movie. It would be it would kind of overstuff the movie a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

No, but that's the thing, I feel like Willem Defoe, I trust him enough, but I feel like if he took something like the American Civil War, he would put a good because this man, he does he's he's the most Did you ever hear the story about I think it was during the filming of Platoon, he was in Vietnam during like big protests to get the Americans out and he joined the like the giant riot crowd.

SPEAKER_04 26:03

No, that rules.

SPEAKER_02 26:05

He said like they had guns and knives and they were outside his hotel, and he was like, you know, yeah, fuck let's get this American let's get these Americans out. But I wonder if it's because he's got like such an obscure face shape. But like if you looked at him, you wouldn't be like, that's an American man.

SPEAKER_07 26:27

No, you really you would go, what is that?

SPEAKER_02 26:32

Someone's goblin grandad.

SPEAKER_07 26:36

Yeah, even when he was like 30.

SPEAKER_02 26:40

Yeah, he's the thing is Willem Dafoe's always looked 50, and it seems like he will always look 50.

SPEAKER_04 26:47

It's an interesting curse that turns into a blessing.

SPEAKER_02 26:52

But he what he ha is he he had a weird metamorphosis because he went from a hot 50-year-old to uh wait, he's hot 50-year-old. Like he never lost it. But it there's just there's there's something that's changed within him.

SPEAKER_07 27:09

I see that, yeah.

SPEAKER_09 27:12

But yeah, as as I think in the first stage his personality wasn't as relevant, like he was just hot, but now if he weren't Willem Defoe, it would it would come or go pretty easily, depending on how much of a dickhead he was.

SPEAKER_02 27:33

Yeah, I could say like he's got like a sort of like Jim Balushi thing going on. Whereas like the the the charisma is off the charts. Like he just exudes or like oh my god, see that fit check video he did.

SPEAKER_05 27:50

Yes, yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking of.

SPEAKER_02 27:53

And he's clearly just a confused old man, but he still has so much energy about him. We could all hope he's just be looking to follow. He's just a cool man.

SPEAKER_09 28:07

Oh, but as I don't know if I would recognise him in the street, as crazy as that is to say.

SPEAKER_02 28:13

No, did you never hear the subway video of him?

SPEAKER_05 28:17

No.

SPEAKER_02 28:18

Well, uh, he was telling a story about how he used to just he he pulled like a Keanu Reeves thing where he didn't bother with like private transportation, he would just use public transport because he thought he didn't have a recognizable face until one day on a train he overheard someone say, That must be him, no one looks like that motherfucker.

SPEAKER_07 28:42

That's pretty funny.

SPEAKER_02 28:45

But yeah, it's it's a running theme with I don't know if maybe it's just because the the horror films that have lasted from 60s Japan have been more transgressive cinema, so it's become like these films are almost legendary, but a lot of these 60s horror Japanese movies are all so horny. But I feel like they're a perfect example of see how you keep getting the debate online nowadays where it's like, oh Gen Z want less sex in their movies, and it's like no, have you seen the art house scene?

SPEAKER_07 29:26

It's all just sex, it's all that euphoria is very popular.

SPEAKER_02 29:35

Yeah, okay, I was going to use that as an example of of my next point. I feel like a lot of the hornyness and sex scenes in these movies, there's there's harpice to them and there's artistic intent within them. It's not just and now let's have them fuck for a bit. Like the euphoria is. The difference between the sex scene and well the multiple sex scenes in Onibaba and Sydney Sweeney pretending to be a dog in this new season of Euphoria. I feel like there's a big Have you seen those fucking photos?

SPEAKER_04 30:13

No, I haven't.

SPEAKER_02 30:15

Oh good god, have you not seen the photo of her um spread leg dressed as a baby with a dummy in her mouth?

SPEAKER_07 30:23

No.

SPEAKER_02 30:25

Horrifying imagery, genuinely one of the most disturbing things I've seen as of recently.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

Great, great.

SPEAKER_02 30:33

Oh I was gonna say I'll send it to you just to ruin your day, but I don't want that on my phone. I don't even want the metadata of that being on my phone.

SPEAKER_01 30:41

Yeah, start looking for it. Google it.

SPEAKER_02 30:44

Okay, yeah, I'll send you all of the clips for you to be disgusted at later on.

SPEAKER_09 30:49

Oh great. Have you ever seen a Jane Campion movie?

SPEAKER_02 30:56

Give me hit me with a list, I'll tell you.

SPEAKER_09 30:59

The piano is the most famous one with Harvey Kaitel. Uh Power of the Dog is one of the more recent ones with Benedict Cumberbatch.

SPEAKER_10 31:12

Oh, weirdly, I don't think I have been. None of those are ringing bells.

SPEAKER_09 31:16

What's in the cut with uh Mark Ruffalo is really good. They are so sexually charged. Pretty much all of her movies, most of them, but they are I'm trying to find the right way to describe it. It's like they are charged with the emotions of sex. It they're not charged with, you know, these are directed by a woman and they're focusing on emotions instead of physical presence. They're very focused on people existing in a space with each other. But it's it's not about showing you anything. It's beyond how these people are feeling and what they're expressing with each other, effectively. I don't know if that makes sense. But they're very hot, the scenes in her movies also, but they're very cinematic and plot relevant and good. I love all of her movies.

SPEAKER_02 32:24

I take it this is a European filmmaker.

SPEAKER_09 32:27

No, uh Australian, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Oh, god damn. Coming straight from the sensor boards.

SPEAKER_09 32:33

Yeah.

unknown 32:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:35

Must be a witch hunter out in the streets. Holy shit.

SPEAKER_09 32:42

Oh, what was um, hold on. One of her really good ones. Bright Star I did not like. Holy smoke! Is um Harvey Kaitel plays this guy who's like a not a PI, but like a fixer who has been hired by Kate Winslet's parents because Kate Winslet has been sort of inducted into a cult. So Harvey Kaitel has been hired to kidnap her and bring her to an isolated house, and the whole movie is them in this isolated house and playing mind games with each other. It's very, very good.

SPEAKER_02 33:21

What is it just like uh a dialogue-driven movie?

SPEAKER_09 33:25

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 33:27

Sounds horror-ish. Is it horror enough that we're not? No, no, no.

SPEAKER_09 33:32

No, it's not not horror at all. They're like romance comedy, drama, that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

A romance comedy about two people uh manipulating each other.

SPEAKER_08 33:48

Yeah, well, it's very sexual. You know, that's a big part of it.

SPEAKER_09 33:56

I just um I'm being a little bit vague in certain places just because uh I want you to watch it. I think it's a good movie.

SPEAKER_02 34:05

Okay, so we should probably start Onibaba.

SPEAKER_08 34:09

Yeah, we'll talk more about Onibaba.

SPEAKER_02 34:11

We get we start off in a field of tall grass. We have our two stereotypical samurai heroes, but out pops from the bush. The one thing I was like, I have no idea what's happening the second we watched this because it was it's like a blink and you miss it scene. The mother and daughter have been murdering samurai to steal their loot Assassin's Creed style and sell it to the nearest vendor down the road. I didn't look up if this was an actual thing, but I've got to imagine this must have been a thing that went on during the time with men leaving the home to fight at war. Also, I love the war setting, the fact that when Hatchie comes back, they talk about how no one even knows why we're fighting anymore. At first they thought we were fighting for the emperor, but now there's two emperors, and then each army keeps kidnapping people, but the people then keep fighting for each other's armies, so now when they fight, we don't even know who they're killing.

SPEAKER_08 35:17

Yeah, that was grim.

SPEAKER_02 35:20

And it's it's but it's interesting though, because you think in the 14th century, like you can't no one snapchatting each other. Like, how the fuck are you supposed to know if that man in his samurai outfit is a friendly man in his samurai outfit?

SPEAKER_07 35:35

No way.

SPEAKER_02 35:38

Also, can we can we acknowledge for the fact these motherfuckers are wearing huge samurai fits? Ain't stopping shit. Everyone's just getting stabbed through their armor.

SPEAKER_09 35:48

Oh yeah, it's so funny how I I do love you touched a little bit on how they They start with the imagery of what feels like a protagonist for a different movie that you'd be following. And they let you follow him for a split second before they absolutely ice him and his buddy that he's trying to save. Uh and they do get stabbed, like, under their arms, I believe. So it's kind of the the weak spot, I guess. You know, they're they don't realize they're about to be stabbed. But yeah, at the same time, it's just the one that takes them down.

SPEAKER_02 36:32

It's such a bad place to get stabbed for, like right in the armpit. Such like soft, stringy flesh.

SPEAKER_08 36:39

Yeah, exactly. You're fucked. That would that's gotta hurt too, even if it kills you quickly.

SPEAKER_02 36:47

You ain't getting the national health service kicking about right now, and you know. I to be honest, I don't think these characters know where the fuck they are for most of the meeting.

SPEAKER_07 36:56

No, I doubt it.

SPEAKER_02 36:58

But yeah, so okay, we we reached a little bit. I love this little vendor shop.

SPEAKER_09 37:03

It feels like this is based on a Shin Buddhist parable. Sorry, I don't mean to interrupt. Uh but uh in which a mother, disgusted by her daughter's affair with a priest, used a mask to pose as a demon and frighten the girl into believing she was cursed. She was punished by the mask sticking to her face, and when she begged to be allowed to remove it, the mask took the flesh of her face with it. So it's based on uh a parable, but not the not what you were talking about, which is interesting, you know, the element of being at war. It's based on something more about uh I guess the horror elements of it.

SPEAKER_02 37:45

Oh yeah, no, I've got that that somewhere in my notes. Uh it's strange because when you look up, no what nowhere really mentions that this is like uh an adaptation of anything.

SPEAKER_09 37:57

Yeah, it's interesting. Cause it is. Oh, it's inspired by, I guess. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 38:06

It's inspired by, it's a one-for-one of the plot. Hold on, my only Baba that I had in the background who's just decided it's no longer having it, it's just turned itself off.

SPEAKER_08 38:15

Great.

SPEAKER_02 38:17

Hachi showed up and it went, no, none of it.

SPEAKER_09 38:22

Oh, I hated Hachi when he showed up. Or like by the end of his first scene. How did you feel? I'll talk more about how I felt about Hachi through the movie.

SPEAKER_02 38:32

Okay, well, the the little vendor shop I'll just say is cool. I don't I don't know how this man is getting the food to trade for these He says he's selling it to the soldiers. But it seems like surely if hypothetically this war started with 20,000 samurai, surely half of them are dead by now. Surely like armor isn't too hard to come across by this point.

SPEAKER_08 38:58

Yeah, that's a fair point.

SPEAKER_02 39:00

Which I suppose would make sense why we're getting paid so little, but I do like just a little side note that when Hatchie goes to sell later on, it seems like he gets more for what he's selling than the women do, because he knows these women are reliant on him. Which is just uh but anyway, we're back in the hut. I do see the thing is Hatchie, he's like an asshole. But he has so much charisma. I love Hatchie. Like to uh uh but I feel like all all these characters morally are a bit dubious. They are murdering people regardless of what side of the war they're on, for food.

SPEAKER_09 39:46

Yeah, we're past anybody here being redeemable. I think that it took me a moment to accept that about our protagonists, which is why I really felt negatively towards Hachi to start with. But as the movie went on, I really just came to a place of uh I can't these two fuck. Like what's well they have to die alone now just because you are going to.

SPEAKER_02 40:17

But yeah, when Hachi shows up, okay, he he reveals the story of how the mother's son and the wife's husband, both of them seem to have been at war together. Then they got kidnapped by the opposing army, they fought for the opposing army, they lost, they then ran away, they then got kidnapped by farmers, and then seemingly the husband son was beaten to death as Hachi made an escape and managed to return home. Do you believe Hachi?

SPEAKER_09 41:03

Uh I mostly believe him. I don't believe that Hachi knows he's dead, but I do believe that Hachi thinks he's dead within good reason. Like he didn't see him die, but he thinks by now he would be dead, or he did run away while he was getting hurt. You know, like I I don't think he's assuming anything in bad faith, but I do also think he's intentionally stretching the truth.

SPEAKER_02 41:35

See, okay, we'll we'll circle back to my thoughts because I've I have I have a little fearing from something later on. But see, the way Hatchie's demeanour is, I feel like he wouldn't care to let them know whether or not he died or not. Like, I feel like Hatchie wouldn't feel like he needs to lie. Because like he'll he'll do asshole things and he'll just go, Yeah, I was an act. So I don't see why, even if hypothetically he abandoned him, I feel like Hatchie as a character would just say to him, well, to them, Oh yeah, I think he died, but I worked in short, I had to just make a getaway. Like, I don't see what Hatchie gains from lying about the death. Okay.

SPEAKER_09 42:20

Other than I think the thing to address is neither of us think he killed or made his friend die so he could do all of this, right?

SPEAKER_02 42:33

I feel like trying to get a girlfriend, there's much easier routes than co-opting your friend into a war, fighting these wars for multiple years, and then abandoning him with some farmers to go then by to his life.

SPEAKER_09 42:50

I agree, but people have crazy theories. Uh I just want to get that out of the way. I'm sure some people would assume that. I wouldn't blame them necessarily. I feel like the movie deliberately makes it ambiguous enough so you can assume that among other things. Uh I think there's a line that the wife has, which is something like Why would Hachi tell us he's dead if he wasn't dead? Which to me implies Hachi probably doesn't know. But I also don't I just don't get the impression from Hachi that he's he's like a he's like a little bit of a dickweed sometimes, but he he's not a bad person, I don't think.

SPEAKER_08 43:40

Yeah, he doesn't seem like he would be able to hurt somebody like that.

SPEAKER_02 43:45

Yeah, because even jumping forward a little bit, when he's arguing with the mother about him sleeping with his friend's wife, he even lets her know he's like, Well, I don't have any intentions of marrying. And I'm happy to let her know that. This is just we're just having sex. And it's like I feel like if this was like some long con to try and get his wife, surely you you wouldn't be open about the the hedonistic aspect of it. You would be like, oh no, we're definitely getting married.

SPEAKER_07 44:20

True. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:23

But yeah. See, okay, this is when we start to get Hatchie's um advancements to his friend's wife. I feel like there's there's I I run across an issue with 60s Japanese movies with men and women, where I can't tell if the predatory aspects of the character are simply just it's 60s Japan and it's a man being it.

SPEAKER_09 44:54

What do you mean? Or what elements are you talking about? I I do kind of know what you mean.

SPEAKER_02 45:00

Like like how like he's playfully pushy, but he's really pushy about it, but I feel like 60s Japan, a lot of us wouldn't be seen as nearly as bad as it would feeling it through a ball-on lens.

SPEAKER_09 45:20

Yeah, I see that. Uh and that's also that's most of why I don't like Hachi in the places where I don't like him. Uh and where that levels out for me is just understanding that nobody in this movie is a good person, really. Uh they're all murderers and thieves. And I think it's when the wife has her monologue about the first time I killed somebody. That's when it really sinks in for me. Like, it's not nobody deserves treatment of any kind for being any sort of person. That's not what I'm saying. But you know, in the the moral scale of the movie, it it winds up feeling more level.

SPEAKER_02 46:14

See, from but my thing is Hatchie, he's like, okay, he's pushy, but he's never rapy. And I feel like that's like an important distinction.

SPEAKER_09 46:22

It is never definitely that's why it doesn't feel gross at any point, even if it feels uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02 46:32

See, it's it's strange it took you to the monologue, because for me, the first like when it really sunk in that oh these are these are bad people is when I get it's when we first get Hachi being pushy towards uh we'll just say the wife. And it's when they're by the lake and she's washing clothes and they look over and they see the two soldiers fighting, both of them seemingly wound each other in the war. And then when one of the soldiers swims over, he goes, Oh, I'll get this guy, and you two go kill the other one, despite this soldier seemingly asking for help from them.

SPEAKER_05 47:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 47:15

Cause like it shows they don't care about it's important to It doesn't matter if they're cruel people that they're killing.

SPEAKER_02 47:23

Yeah, because like even during this time, it's her son and her husband that's also at war. He's the same as these men that they're tracking down and murdering. It's not like they're attacking specifically the enemy soldiers. They're just killing any man that will come across.

SPEAKER_09 47:42

And they've deliberately made the point to us that it doesn't matter what side they're on. They don't know or care really.

SPEAKER_02 47:52

I feel it adds to it, I feel like this must have been a fairly normal thing. That Hatchie just is like, oh yeah, can you go murder that guy real quick so I can steal his stuff?

SPEAKER_06 48:05

Yeah, it's creepy.

SPEAKER_02 48:14

I love your door run.

SPEAKER_07 48:16

Yeah, it's horrible. I know it's so loud.

SPEAKER_02 48:21

Why is it like that? I don't know. The inspector gadget ass war buzzer. You could sample it and make it into a song.

SPEAKER_09 48:37

You could. You could also that could be a good uh that's my dog now shaking. It would be a good like sting for a horror movie. Now my dog's trying to get out because he knows there's food somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 48:54

I know. Oh okay, Chris. Next scene where with Hatchie, and this is what I I mean. I don't know if you're watching along with me. Hatchie is selling two suits of armor back to this this shopkeeper.

SPEAKER_09 49:09

No, they're all eating that mine.

SPEAKER_02 49:11

Three bags of foods when they get I'm pretty sure it was just one.

SPEAKER_09 49:19

Oh, okay, that's wicked, honestly.

SPEAKER_02 49:24

And this motherfucker still he still swaps it for a bottle of sake. You're sake, man, Chris.

SPEAKER_09 49:32

I do like sake. I've never had hot sake.

SPEAKER_02 49:36

I've never had hot sake. I love I love a plum sake.

SPEAKER_06 49:40

Plum sake sounds interesting.

SPEAKER_02 49:43

It's hard to come across oh, see you see if you find sake out in the wild. I assume being in New York you must have like some East Asian supermarkets near you.

SPEAKER_09 49:52

We do. I only really have sake when I'm doing karaoke.

SPEAKER_11 49:57

Oh, you you're you're like full LARPing and East Asian?

SPEAKER_09 50:02

Yeah. No, it's just how it's just how our karaoke is a lot of the time. It's very Asian karaoke places.

SPEAKER_02 50:13

Do you do the do you get the little sake cups out and have the youngest person pour for the other one first?

SPEAKER_09 50:19

No, I don't know what that is. I don't know what you're saying to me.

SPEAKER_02 50:23

It's it's it's like the traditional way, you get your two sake glasses and then you get your bottle, and then you have to pour for each other, but the youngest pours first for the other one.

SPEAKER_09 50:34

So if you're in a karaoke room with about seven people, you just go in a circle.

SPEAKER_02 50:41

I would assume so. I don't know. I've never See for me, sake is just always on a date night. I never have a third person there.

SPEAKER_06 50:49

Hmm, okay. Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 50:51

Occasionally I've had the staff pour it for me. Like they'll come over and top it up as I'm sipping, but I'm like Do you ask to see their driver's license? What?

SPEAKER_09 51:03

Make sure that they're younger than you.

SPEAKER_02 51:07

Oh no, no, no, no. When when when I'm hitting up Ooh Mammy, these one in our like in our 50s, right?

SPEAKER_09 51:14

Damn. Alright, so you gotta pour it for them first, right?

SPEAKER_02 51:18

Yeah, I'm gonna get them pissed on shift every single time.

SPEAKER_09 51:23

Do you say ooh mommy?

SPEAKER_02 51:27

No, I do not. I feel like asking to get in trouble with the wife across the table.

SPEAKER_05 51:34

Try that, try that next time.

SPEAKER_02 51:37

I hope so. The way when I'm hitting up umami, the the women there are grasped on English is will say tenuous. So I feel like they wouldn't even get the pun.

SPEAKER_09 51:49

So you'll you'll you'll get in so much trouble, and also nothing will happen. Like no one will even know that you said anything besides your wife.

SPEAKER_02 51:59

I'm not I'll not only get the awkwardness of making flirtatious remarks with this randomly jumping in front of my body. But it's like a uh a synergy with none of the staff will know what the fuck I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_09 52:19

That's really good. That's really funny.

SPEAKER_02 52:22

Oh, but going back to my point, see your your um like East Asian supermarkets, they're not allowed to sell drink, you have to go to liquor stores and that, don't you? Or do some of them carry liquor licenses?

SPEAKER_06 52:37

That's a great question.

SPEAKER_09 52:39

I'm thinking about you are right, New York City, you don't have liquor licenses in supermarkets and corner shops for the most part. There can be some exceptions, but oh wait, is wine not an exception? Wine is the exception. I'm trying to think of if there's any others.

SPEAKER_02 53:05

Oh well, if if it might just be wine and you come across them, I implore you, look for plum sake. But the plum, there should be plums in the wine. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 53:20

Sounds good.

SPEAKER_02 53:21

It's so good. It tastes just like plummet.

SPEAKER_06 53:23

I didn't know sake is a wine.

SPEAKER_02 53:26

Yeah, it's it's like a rice wine. I'll be honest.

SPEAKER_09 53:30

Cool, okay. No, no, no, I just drank it.

SPEAKER_02 53:34

Well, you never question what you're drinking.

SPEAKER_09 53:36

No, I just said that one.

SPEAKER_02 53:39

Anyway, or and you can sometimes get, I don't know if it'll be I feel like import it would make it rather expensive for you, but over here in a lot of the Asian supermarkets you can get it's like a little glass bottle, and it's about like your average beer can amount of and it's different fruit flavoured sackies, and they're like 20%, and they taste like juice, and they're about £3, £4 each.

SPEAKER_05 54:07

Alright.

SPEAKER_02 54:08

So you could get fucked off your ass really, really, really fast if you needed to.

SPEAKER_09 54:14

Fuck it. Oh, yeah, I'll pay $80 to get those imported. Oh.

SPEAKER_02 54:20

Asians go crazy. See when you find like Asian canned cocktails, like in like little fib supermarkets. They're all so strong. And half of them have got caffeine in them.

SPEAKER_05 54:32

Hell yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 54:35

But anyway, sounds like a good night. Uh I got distracted. Where am I at? Keep me, keep me in focus here.

SPEAKER_09 54:43

We're talking about Hachi and the women just killed the men in the river, and they're just dumping their bodies in the hole. They sold the the stuff. Hachi gets extra food. So we're sort of just where they start having their little love connection.

SPEAKER_02 55:00

Yeah, but having a little spot.

SPEAKER_09 55:03

It was very funny to me that this is a it's a horny, very hedonist thing that they're doing. But whenever they hold each other or touch each other, it's I would describe it as a warm embrace. It feels like they've known each other for 20 years and they're not engaging like carnal lust. It feels like they are reuniting somberly.

SPEAKER_02 55:38

You could well, I mean, the world we're in sucks. You need like something. We don't really have anything other than the sun, tall grass, and murder. It's the only thing that's been keeping them going. And like the odd bit of rice that we can get from the trader.

SPEAKER_09 55:58

I I think it's fine what they're doing. I just it doesn't it doesn't feel like it's the thing they need. The way that the actors are playing it. It feels like something they're enjoying. But I don't get I don't get as much desire out of it as I feel like I'd like to.

SPEAKER_02 56:21

I also that's interesting for me. I feel like it is a need for them. I feel like it's like their their escapism. Just strange. I feel like this movie's weirdly pro-sex for like a black and white 60s movie.

SPEAKER_07 56:33

Yeah, it's cool.

SPEAKER_02 56:35

It's very just accepting of like yeah, we're both grown adults, and the the the mother is clearly in the wrong for not just letting them get on with our get on with our duties.

SPEAKER_01 56:48

Well better put, I agree that it's something they need.

SPEAKER_09 56:52

I don't feel like it's communicated from their emotions or their passion, like how how what's the word I'm looking for? Just like what it feels like for them to achieve the thing that they've needed and haven't been able to have. It never feels explosive. One little note of like explosive is the wrong way to put it. I don't need it to be you know uh over the top or over-dramatic. Just I don't know, something feels missing.

SPEAKER_02 57:35

See, it was one little thing I'd like to point out. During this first we'll say argument that the the mother, the wife, and Hatchie have after him selling it. We get a a little shot of the mother spying on the wife with a samurai sword by putting like the tall grass aside, very, very, very similar to how the the mother will get spied on later by the mysterious samurai.

SPEAKER_05 58:04

Yeah, that was interesting to me.

SPEAKER_02 58:07

What what did you feel about um Hatchy's blue balls causing him to launch into a fit?

SPEAKER_09 58:19

Well, this is after the mom has started doing the fake demon stuff.

SPEAKER_02 58:26

No, this is after the first argument, Hatchie he he runs, he well, I would say he frolicked over tall grass, then proceeds to lie on his back and have a baby piss fit about the fact that he is not allowed to have sex with this woman.

SPEAKER_09 58:46

I don't remember it too distinctly. Uh I'm pretty sure that's part of what knocked his character points for me and made me feel like he was just a little turdbag.

SPEAKER_02 58:57

Chris, but his balls are blue. He's been carrying his massive sack all the way from the farmlands behind him. You don't know the weight my man Hatchy's had to carry.

SPEAKER_09 59:15

I'm probably familiar. I think he'll be fine. I think he would have been fine.

SPEAKER_02 59:22

Yeah, this is when we this is when the canoodling starts. This is when it gets scandalous. I feel like see, this is the one thing I'll say. I feel like the jump between the wife not reciprocating into her um almost animalistic, like soaring through the grass to get to Hatchie's house.

SPEAKER_01 59:50

Repeat what you said at the start.

SPEAKER_02 59:52

Like you it cuts from Hatchie being told no, and then he has his little his little brass run away, and then during the night it goes straight to the wife. It's such a strange way. I've never seen anyone flirt this way. She sneaks out in the middle of the night, full force sprints to Hatchie's home, then lifts up a boulder and punts in the poor cunt's front door with it to wake him up. Yeah, I don't get this. This is strange foreplay. I've never had someone like tear in my windows.

SPEAKER_09 1:00:41

Against like throat stuff, but it's without express consent, it's a little weird. You can't just go die, you can't just go grabbing people by the throat.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:55

You can, but I mean it seems like he played his cards well in the moment.

SPEAKER_09 1:01:00

Yeah, it seems like it worked out for him. It does.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:04

Like I I g maybe I don't know, like, why did you throw a rock in this parallel? If you were sleeping like the other way about, you might have just dreamed the whole party.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:20

Yeah. I was just gonna add as a little like addendum. This this old woman, this old hag, as the translation puts across. This is a very attractive 39-year-old woman. She just has grey hair. We've just gave her grey hair and a white streak.

SPEAKER_09 1:01:40

Yeah, they've given her rogue hair.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:43

We've gave her rogue hair and some goth makeup. And we're like, look at this old decrepit woman.

SPEAKER_09 1:01:51

No, she's hot also.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:53

She's a hot granny. I don't doubt she even is a granny by this point. It's also the director's wife. They got married 14 years after this movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:02:02

Oh nice.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:04

So clearly the director also thought so.

SPEAKER_09 1:02:09

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:11

But uh yeah, well, where was it?

SPEAKER_09 1:02:13

Oh, my favorite uh my favorite meeting of them just happened where she sprints in and just says, Hachi, hurry, and takes all her clothes off.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:23

I I mean it's productive.

SPEAKER_09 1:02:26

It is. And then by the time Right, right, right, they are so this was the best one for me also because I did get like how you get the impression of how intense it is because the the mother is following right behind her, but by the time the mother gets to the house, they've already finished. And they're it seems you know, it feels like they're recharging and kind of waiting to go again.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:57

Again, my boy Hatchet, he's been carrying these blue balls for miles. He can't blame them for being a little quick.

SPEAKER_07 1:03:04

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:07

But yeah, it's so funny the way they just launch at each other because this seems like it's quite a fair distance. And keep in mind these people are starving.

SPEAKER_06 1:03:18

Yeah, it's crazy how she sprints. She says later it's because she is scared when she's in the woods. Or in the remote.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:28

Scared of the grass at night. How do this motherfucker sleep? Have you ever been in like woodlands at night? It's just black.

SPEAKER_09 1:03:39

I yeah, I'm vaguely familiar. I'm not entirely familiar because I live in a city.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:46

Yeah, uh one day I'll send you a I'll I'll go out into the woodlands and I'll take a video of me with the flashlight and you'll see just how you you wouldn't she would go face. I suppose there's no trees. Her only real issue is the giant ominous pit in the middle of the the grassroots.

SPEAKER_09 1:04:06

Oh, that sounds good.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:09

But uh yeah. Chris, what why what do you think of this strange deep pit that they've they they've found?

SPEAKER_05 1:04:17

Very cool. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:20

I like the imagery of it. It's it's weird because it's like it's clearly unnatural. I like it, it's almost like it gives the full story. What both the tall grass and the weird pit give it it's almost like a kind of I suppose as you said it's based on uh based on a what was it based on?

SPEAKER_09 1:04:40

Uh a hold on, let me let me get a Shin Buddhist parable of Yome Odoshi no man. Bride scarring. Or Nikuzuki Nomen, a mask with flesh attached.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:58

I I love your enthusiasm at trying to get these pronunciation right. No, we do sometimes get the odd Japanese. Maybe you this will be our first comment, and it will just be someone very angry that you mispronounced something.

SPEAKER_09 1:05:14

Yeah. They'll say I'm never listening again.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:18

You ruined my injured. You're gonna start a smear campaign against this.

unknown 1:05:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:28

But it oh Chris, Chris, Chris, the lighting in this movie. Okay, this is it's something I don't really pick up on until the um until weirdly this sex scene that we've like if if you're following along with just passed. The fact that all the lighting in the huts is just from the moon like beaming through the grass and like reflecting and it's got such a nice contrast to everything.

SPEAKER_09 1:05:55

It's gorgeous. This is a really nice looking movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:59

Here's Is there's a visual motif that I want to get your opinions on. Do you feel like the occasionally we'll get like these close-in shots of the the tall grass swaying back and forth? Do you think it's supposed to be symbolic of um like katana blades?

SPEAKER_09 1:06:19

Hmm, yes. I didn't that didn't occur to me, but I see that.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:25

So the the environment is invocative of the violence surrounding them.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:35

Hmm. Hmm.

SPEAKER_09 1:06:40

I'm watching sorry, I'm watching Hachi right now. I'm at the scene where uh where he's laying in in the grass and the mom comes up and starts kicking him and he's like, it's a nice day, leave me alone.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:52

I see I love that for him. It's really good. Because I feel like Hachi probably would have slept with the mother. But he's he's he's how do you think he's been going three nights in a row?

SPEAKER_07 1:07:08

Yeah, very true. This is the wrong time. It's also just like Oh now.

SPEAKER_09 1:07:20

Now you want a piece of Hatchie, huh?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:23

So now you've seen how good Hatchie gets it. Everyone wanted a piece of Hatchie.

SPEAKER_09 1:07:29

And he's already got his steady piece right now. He's not looking.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:43

Oh I suppose X-daughter and Lord, but he's like, that's practically your daughter.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:48

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:56

She looks so cool with that white stripe in her hair.

SPEAKER_09 1:07:59

She does. She does turn into the antagonist at some point. It's interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:06

She is, but again, I feel like it's not really like I don't feel like there is an antagonist really. I feel like it's more of a like I said, it's like a folk tale, it's almost like a 1960s Goosebumps episode. Again, but I feel like this must have inspired the Haunted Mask. You're familiar with the Haunted Mask story, yeah?

SPEAKER_05 1:08:26

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:28

It's it's it's so strange. It's like possibly the most fair. I'll give you the quick rundown of the Goosebumps Papa Meat or Meat Canyon, he owns the mask from the episode of this.

SPEAKER_09 1:08:40

Oh, that's cool. Oh, Goosebumps. You know, I feel like I did read this, but I do not remember anything about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:49

Well, I'll give you the the quick rundown. Uh our protagonist, Beth, she gets bullied in school, so she she forms this like self-hatred complex, and she she promises that she's gonna have the scariest Halloween costume for Halloween night. So she goes through this, it's like a strange liminal Halloween shop that just seems to have appeared in town that no one knows about. And she goes in this little creepy shop owner, and she's like, Can you give me a good Halloween costume? Here's the money I have, what have you got? And he starts giving her all this random like you know, trick shop, run-of-the-mill Halloween stuff, and she's like, This is some fucking nonsense. I asked for scary, give me scary. So he takes her back to this thing doesn't work. He's got like a workshop going on in the back.

SPEAKER_09 1:09:46

Oh, Santa. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:49

He has like a like a table of weird deformed masks, and he's like these these masks have an evil energy. I think it's implied that these are like people's faces that have twisted and deformed due to something over time. So Beth feels the mask and runs out with it, and then for Halloween, she's wearing this like little green goblin mask thing. But throughout the night it gets tighter and tighter onto her skin and then starts to fuse with her flesh. And then it's like this whole it's like a big story about how you have to love yourself, and in the end, she because she carries a spike with a depiction of her head on it, like a decapitated version of herself, and like the the ends like this whole self-accepting story where she she loves her former self and then the mask comes off, and then you get your typical goosebumps thing where she comes home and her brother has the mask on and can't get it off. It fucked me up as a child to think you'll see if I put on this scary mask where if it like fuses with my neck flesh and I can't get it off.

SPEAKER_07 1:11:09

Yeah, that's terrifying.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:11

Because it's not just oh you've got to put a claustrophobic like a big old latex Halloween mask is Yeah, I don't like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:23

Stinky hate this.

SPEAKER_09 1:11:26

No, that's true. Imagine being in one of those mascot costumes all day.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:32

It depends on the mascot costume. I have seen a lot of a like American baseball mascot costumes and I fucking adore them.

SPEAKER_09 1:11:41

No, just like a Winnie the Pooh.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:46

I wouldn't mind being a Winnie the Pooh. Do you ever get it?

SPEAKER_09 1:11:51

Winnie the final you don't like. Chip and or Dale.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:56

I don't mind Chip and Or Dale. Fuck. Chip and Ordale hit me the same wave, like hi, my name's Ang Andor Dingus.

unknown 1:12:06

What?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:07

Chip Andor Dale. You you never seen the video of the kid with all the it's got like a huge bowl of tang fastics, and he's like, Hi, my name's Andor Dingus. No. It's like this poor kid, he clearly just fucked up his name for the video and it became like a huge bean.

SPEAKER_09 1:12:25

Great. Is that what Andrew is based on?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:29

Uh presumably so. I take it his name on in the series is Dingus.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:34

Yeah, yeah, it is. That's okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:39

But yeah, Times Square, I assume you get like a bunch of like people in shitty homemade mascot costumes.

SPEAKER_09 1:12:47

Uh mostly store-bought superhero costumes and or Disney princesses. Or like Mario, I like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:58

I would much rather have like some drunk guy in a shitty Mario costume come up and go like, it's a me, Mario, than like some twat who set up uh an amplifier and his electric guitar is trying to bust some on.

SPEAKER_09 1:13:14

Well, they're usually uh hustling you to take pictures and pay them. And if you take if you take a picture and don't pay them, they'll beat you up sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:24

Fucking getting jumped by fucking chip and dale.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:30

Uh but yeah, but I feel like to be fair, if you take a photo of them, you should pay them. Because you're getting something in the tongue.

SPEAKER_09 1:13:40

Yeah, I'm not I don't really have any comments on what they're doing. I think it's you know, like if you take them out of there, it's just less lively. I don't know. Some of them are dickheads, though, is what I'm saying. Some of them have like really hurt some tourists, which is shitty. And the problem with what they're doing is that you can't tell who anyone is because they all are all wearing masks.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:06

Yeah, but it's probably if someone jumps your ass, it's probably the Mickey Mouse hauling it down the street. I guess not easy costume to get out of. There's no gonna like have a lineup of people in this like.

SPEAKER_09 1:14:19

Can you imagine a lineup of like Mickey Mouse, Spider-Man, Indiana Jones?

SPEAKER_02 1:14:29

Like we're trying to identify them, and it's like I just I I can't I don't know.

SPEAKER_09 1:14:34

I don't remember. One is Optimus Prime.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:40

One's just a guy who just doesn't know how he's there. Oh yeah, fucking I I wish we got good Glasgow used to get them, but we ended up it used to be a guy that would sometimes be a Yalcha or a xenomorph, and it was really cool to him. That rules and then he vanished, and then it got replaced with the most rapey Mickey Mouse you'll ever see in your life. And I think he got ran out just because even if he wasn't trying to approach children for dubious moves, the costume definitely looked like he was trying to approach children for dubious moves. Like this this Mickey looked like he was on smack, like he was he was so bad. Oh I feel like work out a Jason costume, you should get some traction on Times Square. A Jason costume, yeah, from Jason Takes My Hand.

SPEAKER_09 1:15:42

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was just making sure I heard you right. Like that's a good idea. I feel like a lot of people wouldn't get the reference. I don't think a lot of people know about that movie, to be honest.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:57

Yeah, but I feel like the people that do get the reference would definitely pay money to get a photo with you at Times Square.

SPEAKER_07 1:16:04

Yeah, true.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:04

I feel like that's the problem you're narrowing your audience.

SPEAKER_07 1:16:07

But I feel like that would be cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:13

And then I feel like if I'm gonna get arrested, that's one of the cooler cautions to get arrested. But if I'm uh if I end up in a street fight with fucking SpongeBob and a Power Ranger, I want to be the Jason Borsies. And I've got my weapon as well.

SPEAKER_07 1:16:32

Yeah, I got my weapon too, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:37

Well SpongeBob is jellyfishing, eh?

SPEAKER_07 1:16:40

Yeah. How'd you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:43

Oh. The fuck it the dog dies. We have a doggy down. Is this our first dog death?

SPEAKER_09 1:16:51

How did the dog die again? I don't remember. I was so disturbed by the dog dying that I just sort of went into a fugue state.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:01

If I beat the fucker to death with a wash basket.

SPEAKER_09 1:17:05

Who beat it to death again?

SPEAKER_02 1:17:08

Um I think both the wife and a daughter.

SPEAKER_09 1:17:10

Oh my lord. I didn't hate them as much as I should have.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:16

The dog meat looks nice though. I have to say, see it glistening, even in the black and white, they're like the moon hitting off the crispy skin, or oh, that's right.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:26

It's that's what they have to eat.

SPEAKER_09 1:17:29

Yeah, they cut away from it very quickly. You sort of hear the dog whimpering and then they just cut to them cooking it, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:17:37

Yeah, again, I feel like this has to be quite extreme for a 60s Japanese movie.

SPEAKER_09 1:17:42

True. Uh yeah, I guess I was more sad in the moment about the dog dying just because I knew that they were hungry and had to eat. But uh I don't know. It's still upsetting.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:58

Again, I feel is this our first doggy death out of out of end. It might be.

SPEAKER_09 1:18:03

Yeah, we had a whole movie about a dog not dying, basically.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:09

We uh have to we'll keep track. We'll add one to the doggy death counter.

SPEAKER_07 1:18:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:16

I would have thought it would have been like an old slow burn movie. But yeah, Chris, what are we up? I feel like you're slightly ahead than me, so you can keep keep us on track more.

SPEAKER_09 1:18:27

Okay. Uh I guess I I must be watching them eat the dog right now. Because I'm watching them have a little meal. I think we've had she's she's already kicked him while he's down in the ground. They've sort of had their back and forth. You know, that's the scene where she propositions him and he says, I don't want to do that. I think we're about to start scaring. Yeah. I think we're about to start scaring the wife. I think this is now the scene I'm watching, is gonna be the one where I'll let you know in a second. Um But we we start this sequence in the latter half of the movie the mother at night starts picking up uh some swords or things that they're going to sell. She says, as part of her plot, she says, I'm gonna start bringing less when I go, because I think he'll give me slightly more if he doesn't know we have as much right now. Uh but it's sort of just a ruse for her. It's honestly smart, and they should have been doing that anyway, because he's been underpaying them, but it's a way for her to uh sort of sneak out and start wearing this mask every night.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:52

Well, to get onto the mask, we first have to talk about the samurai. Oh, yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:58

Hold on.

SPEAKER_09 1:20:01

I've missed a whole section of the movie. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:04

Let's give it a lot.

SPEAKER_09 1:20:06

It's very slow, to be fair. So um that hasn't been introduced even where I'm watching, and we're we're in this sort of back and forth between Hachi and the wife for I would say 40 to 50 minutes. It is something you're sitting with for a long, long time, and they're building a lot of good atmosphere. So this is the wife runs out and then the samurai comes in to the home, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:20:40

I've got to say, earlier we we missed it. I think everyone coins Texas Chainsaw Mascot is creating the gratuitous like ass shot with the the camera angled upwards to the ass walking. It's in this movie. I don't know if Tony Hooper, uh Toby Hooper saw this and went, I'm stealing that bad boy. But the the very famous gratuitous ass shot is in this movie. I would just like to bring attention to that.

SPEAKER_09 1:21:12

It is really appreciated that it was look, I love every ass. It wasn't like the nicest ass, you know. It wasn't a camera, it wasn't a fast and the furious ass shot, but I liked that. And I liked that it was still effective and I don't know. It was just refreshing, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:39

A refreshing natural ass.

SPEAKER_09 1:21:42

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:43

So one takeaway from Oni Baba. That's what Willem Defoe says to all his friends when he recommends it. I've got to say, I feel like see my man Hatchie. He's punching a little. The wife is gorgeous.

SPEAKER_07 1:21:58

She is, yeah.

SPEAKER_09 1:22:00

Although I did think she was a like 13-year-old boy when I first saw her in the bushes at the start of the movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:14

You thought she was a 13-year-old boy, holy shit, Chris.

SPEAKER_09 1:22:18

Yeah, with the haircut.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:20

You must have to be careful in dating apps. Good god. I'm pretty sure this is a 20-year-old woman.

SPEAKER_09 1:22:30

Well, I'm just a small hair. Turning 30 this year, and I don't date 20-year-olds anyway, so I'm fine.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:40

I wonder what age Hatchie was during this. I feel like he looks like he's in his 30s.

SPEAKER_09 1:22:44

He does, yeah. He looks probably about my age, maybe 32.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:50

I feel like a 10-year age gap, as long as people are adults back in 14th century Japan, is probably the best you're getting. I don't think I can I can push on too hard on that. No, I'm I think uh 13-year-old boy gratuitous asha aside, we should probably talk about samurai.

SPEAKER_07 1:23:13

Alright, if you insist.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:16

And and how fit the message is.

SPEAKER_09 1:23:18

Yeah, samurai comes into the the mother's home while the two are having sex. Uh sucks. Sucks for her. I mean, she was being shitty, but it sucks that these two are fucking and she has to deal with this creepy samurai with a busted face.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:36

Uh did you do any research into the into the samurai's mask?

SPEAKER_07 1:23:42

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:43

Well, this is a henya mask, which is typically for um like stage shows and presentations. It is not designed as like an intimidation tool as you would typically get for a samurai mask. This is supposed to represent uh female rage or uh feminine jealousy, like almost a metamorphosis over time. So it's interesting that this this male samurai shows up wearing this exact mask. It's almost like do you know what we jumped past it? There's something I've got to take in my notes. But I feel like despite nothing supernatural happening towards the beginning, there is an air of it because when Hatchie first shows up, doesn't he talk about like the night sky, like the the like almost like time wasn't working properly out in the war, like he said it was night for longer than it should have been, and then there's this ominous deep pit. Like there's all there's an air of supernatural throughout the movie, I would say.

SPEAKER_09 1:24:51

I could say that. I didn't clock the line that Hachi has.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:56

It's not uh I'm quoting for Baton, but he definitely makes note of like something in the sky isn't working the way it should have. Like he has like these these stories of weird spooky shenanigans going on that he's came across.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:12

Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:13

Uh yeah, it's we it feels like the samurai is almost like a like it doesn't feel like a real event, it's it's almost supernatural, despite it does feel samurai showing up.

SPEAKER_07 1:25:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:26

Yeah. I mean, like, oh I'm lost. Can you can you help me? But it's a plausible thing, but he's it's almost like a I don't want to say a force of nature, because I feel like that's wrong.

SPEAKER_09 1:25:36

I'm surprised he didn't move at the bottom of the pit when she went down.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:42

It was a big ass pit.

SPEAKER_10 1:25:44

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_09 1:25:45

Yeah, well, I yeah, but the the air is supernatural. I did expect him to even not even fully be alive, you know, even reach out and grab her and then get kicked once and be dead or something.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:00

So what do what's your take on I would like to just uh a wee quick aside, um the mother and the samurai both walking through the grass and her bamboo staff is like moving in tandem with the samurai's bigger I forget what these big ass pulse are called. But they like mirror each other as they walk. Probably not it's not a halberd, there's like a specific term for a Japanese one, but scary ass weapon.

SPEAKER_07 1:26:33

Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:36

Uh so what's what's your take on the samurai's tale of um he hides his face because of like his immense beauty that no one's supposed to look upon it?

SPEAKER_09 1:26:49

I think it's a rad story. I think it it's pretty tight. It's uh W Riz for a guy with a fucked face.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:01

So you think he's just bullshitting? Yeah. I am the most handsome man on earth. But I'm too handsome, you cannot look at me.

SPEAKER_07 1:27:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 1:27:14

But I I I If a guy in the club was saying that and he had like some sort of face covering, so I had the most beautiful nose, you can't even see it.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:30

You just have to take my word on it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 1:27:35

See yes, see, this is I'm gonna go into people say you're conceited, I don't want to talk to you. And he goes, That's fine. I still have my beautiful nose. I still have my sexy nose.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:47

Yeah. And they look at my ass as I walk away. It's like a little point.

SPEAKER_09 1:27:54

I love how they don't try to. It's sort of a fairy tale even element of it, is they don't try to make it too tactical how they trick people into the hole in the course of the movie. When she the mother, you know, is uh being led by this samurai through the woods. He's asking her to lead her out of here, or telling her. Uh she intentionally leads him to the hole. She just jumps over it. And it's in sort of a clearing, and it you're right, it's nighttime and it's pitch black, so maybe he couldn't have seen it.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:35

But it's a fucking mask on, Chris.

SPEAKER_09 1:28:38

He did have a fucking mask on.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:40

I think if it's poor man's full division, he ain't seen shit right now.

SPEAKER_09 1:28:44

But it it still does feel like a sort of a fairy tale element, the way that they depict her leaping over it.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:53

Yeah, like almost like it's like one of those tricking the devil like type situations.

SPEAKER_09 1:29:01

I love her see this putting the peg into the ground.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:06

I have see this is where I started to fairy craft, and this is where most of my notes come from. Because I found it suspicious how much the talk of purgatory is throughout this film. So I started to go, okay, where can I piece this together? And I feel like I don't know, I've not seen too many people talk about it. This is this is just my personal take. I feel like Hatchie, the mother and the daughter are in a well, I'll get I'll get to what the actual term for it's called because I did do some research and I feel like there might be some connected tissue, but I do feel like they are in their own purgatory. One of my points was the what I mentioned earlier, the like deep surrounding uh long grass that I again I said I feel like might resemble katanas, but again that's this is just this is just my own interpretation. I always have to say this during theories because I feel like I'm talking a lot of shit. But um I just find it interesting that all these people seem to have like they they're surrounded by violence, they're in this deep, dark field. Are also I also thought maybe like field of reads, like I get that's an African sort of afterlife. Oh yeah. But um I I was looking into it and apparently there is a sort of Japanese purgatory uh fucking hell purgatory called Yomi no Kuni, which isn't it's not for like sinners, so to speak, it's not like your typical um sort of Christian purgatory, it's uh it's almost like a between state, between the afterlife in earth, and it's it's depicted as a dark like shadowy version of just typical earth, it's usually called the spirits are like awaiting funeral ceremonies to help them pass over to the other side. But um apparently during this sort of um purgatory Yomo no kuni, it's like it is not uncommon to be visited by Oni as a sort of trial, which I was like, oh, that's that's interesting. Um one of the believed entrances to uh Yominokune was a a ja hole in the ground that is typically blocked by a boulder. So I was like, oh, that's interesting. And then I was like, I forget what it was, but isn't there a like mention of it? They're not 100% sure of where they are at times. And the fact, see, my big one with this is Hatchy. He was in a scenario where he got kidnapped and his friend got kidnapped, and one of them was beat to death, but he miraculously found his way back to the home with the mother and daughter, and he he makes a knock, he's like, Oh, you guys are still alive. I thought you would have starved to death by now. And they seem to be in this endless field of just like war and violence.

SPEAKER_09 1:32:36

I don't know if I'm cooking or if I'm just like if I've lived in like a clinic like No, it all makes sense. I could see that this is just uh I don't know. I you know it's hard to fully link because why wouldn't their son why wouldn't her son or her husband wind up here unless he was a bad person and went to hell. But it beyond that, to be honest, it all makes sense to me. I was just listening to you for a minute.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:14

Yeah, I I've got like other little notes, like the um like I found it interesting when she goes down the hole with the samurai, there is three different skeletons down there, and I was like, oh, that's that's interesting. There's also three crows that you keep seeing throughout the film, and I'm like, ha.

SPEAKER_07 1:33:32

That's interesting. That's cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:35

There's just like little things that I'm like, I feel like this could also just be me talking a lot of nonsense. I feel like I don't know if the director's still alive. I feel like I could meet the director, give him all these points, and he could go, the fuck are you talking about?

SPEAKER_09 1:33:51

This was not but um But yeah, the three skeletons, they threw bodies in there so recently that shouldn't be you know, unless it's supposed to be what you're talking about, you know, like potentially a reference to their corpses. You know, that hole should have other dead people in it that aren't fully decayed, or they've only killed one person other than the two that they killed with Hachi.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:23

And it was just uh I was also thinking, like, the the lost samurai. He like he shows up and he's like, I don't know where I am, can you try to help me find my way out of here? I don't know, maybe that was like that could be seen as like because it's it's an onimask. That's a purgatory, yeah. But she um she fails by murdering the poor fucker and ripping his face flesh off.

SPEAKER_09 1:34:49

And it takes her a lot of effort to rip the mask off.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:54

See the thing is it's like it's portrayed as like he said he was a handsome man, but look at his disgusting face. It just looks like like he's he's got too much moisture on his mask.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:05

He looks way better than she looks later in the movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:09

Yeah, he definitely does.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:12

But uh Oh, she leaves in the daytime the first time.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:18

Yeah, but is it not she makes note that oh it's gonna take a long time for me to get there and back, so it will be nighttime by the time I arrive.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:28

Yes, she does.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:31

It's kind of hard to tell when things are nighttime or daytime in a black and white movie.

SPEAKER_09 1:35:39

It is especially if the shot doesn't include the skyline.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:45

Oh, if I got to add, uh Yomo uh Yomi no Kuni is also typically surrounded by um like a river of water, which their like their grass field also is. I've got lots and lots and lots of little notes here. I feel like the rest of them that I'm looking at and like this sounds like insanity. Like I definitely watch this too late in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_07 1:36:12

It seems to make sense though, is the thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:16

But uh yeah, so where are we at? We're at this is this is the do we call her the onibaba now? The the demon old hack starts making her a plot to What is her end goal? Just to scare her?

SPEAKER_09 1:36:33

Just to make her not have sex with Hachi anymore. Because there's a moment where uh well it's sort of when her plot winds up failing later in the reads, where they wind up it's very funny. She unintentionally literally guides them back to each other. Like physically, and then they just start having sex.

SPEAKER_07 1:36:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:00

Yeah, but it's like I feel like the the end thing that would come of this is at one point she would just leave during the day and be like, yo, I'm staying at Hatchie's house because a weird demon keeps trying to grab me and Yeah, that's the thing.

SPEAKER_09 1:37:18

You know, it's not really and you I can tell when that happens in the rain, her face you know, it's clear that like that's the thing she was trying to prevent. It's it doesn't make sense because well this is a grown-ass woman.

SPEAKER_07 1:37:39

I guess first and foremost.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:44

Oh, I'm watching the I fucking love uh her in her full demon garb. What a sack outfit.

SPEAKER_08 1:37:50

Yeah, it looks great.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:52

I wonder if this was deemed scary back on release. Like if people were like changing their pearls at seeing the old lady in the the henya mask jump scaring through the grass.

SPEAKER_07 1:38:06

Maybe I could say that.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:09

It's different, I feel like see when we like when I said okay, uh, Oni Baba, did you think this was like uh a a demon movie? Because at first I thought this was a demon movie from all the posters. I feel like the marketing led me astray on this.

SPEAKER_09 1:38:27

I no, I didn't really look into anything. I didn't read anything too much.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:34

Not even the posters.

SPEAKER_09 1:38:40

I don't think I took I I'm not sure what I took from the posters. I would I was just avoiding getting an impression of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:50

Oh actually I loved having a press. But I I I went into us going, okay, there's probably gonna be some spooky shenanigans. So you could imagine my my confusion when an hour into it we've just had horny hatchie, um a horny granny, and um a horny widow all just trying to fuck each other with no with no spooky stuff happening. But I feel like see it's strange now that we're at the end of the movie, we have the plan, but like it does it is just kind of the plan scene happens three times on Off, isn't it?

SPEAKER_07 1:39:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:30

The rain looks awesome. I love the rain.

SPEAKER_09 1:39:36

The rain looks amazing, and it must have been hard to film it. I was trying to look up what they used for rain, but I imagine they just waited for rain. Right?

SPEAKER_02 1:39:49

I mean it had to look how much rain's fallen down in that store. Yeah, exactly. I wonder if it was just like a lucky coincidence.

SPEAKER_09 1:39:58

But um yeah, the plan I imagine they waited for the rain and then filmed that day whenever it rained, and then filmed the rest of the movie around it.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:13

I mean, I feel like you know more of the filming than me. I tried to look at some filming stuff and I couldn't find too much of anything.

SPEAKER_09 1:40:21

Yeah, I'll look back. I honestly have mostly just been looking at the Wikipedia entries of the production.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:30

But yeah, so the plan goes to shit, it doesn't work. I feel like this the scene where the mother confesses to the daughter because she can't get the mask off is easily the best scene of the movie. It's such like it feels weirdly like an A24. We've had the long slow burn, and now in the last ten minutes everything's going to go to shit.

SPEAKER_09 1:41:00

Yeah, when she's crouched in the corner, starting with that.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:05

She's scarier crouched in the corner, it's horrible. I do agree.

SPEAKER_07 1:41:13

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:15

But instead it's just some guilt trying to kill Madden.

SPEAKER_07 1:41:20

Oh no, get away.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:29

I feel like the daughter maybe had a bit of an extreme reaction with the hammer. Because she watched the fucking.

SPEAKER_09 1:41:36

Oh, she's a real fucking asshole about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:40

Well, to be fair, the mother's a real fucking asshole about them fucking.

SPEAKER_09 1:41:46

I agree, but that does not let you nearly beat someone to death, I don't think.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:56

I don't know what sensitivities were like back then. I don't feel like you make a judgment on that.

SPEAKER_07 1:42:02

I don't know. I don't know, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:05

Yeah, you've not seen um eyes without a face, have you?

SPEAKER_07 1:42:10

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:11

I feel the the face, um I want to say the face removal scene. It practically is a face removal scene. Um this is very, very, very um similar to what you get in the the eyes without I'm I'm saying it like like it's technically a spoiler, but it's also what the movie poster teases. So there's no way we could talk about eyes without a face without you going or waiting for a a skinned face reveal. Like it's the entire the entire premise of the movie teases it. Okay it's it's how what do you think of the the makeup for the degloved face?

SPEAKER_07 1:42:56

Oh don't say that it's great.

SPEAKER_09 1:43:02

It looks really good, it looks really horrible.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:06

Hold on, I'm looking it up. I'm sure there's a term for that like just fully face removal. Also, to go another route, uh face-off with Nick Cage and John Traveler, do you think this in any way inspired that movie?

SPEAKER_07 1:43:28

Uh sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:32

I can feel you getting tired on me, Chris.

SPEAKER_07 1:43:35

I am getting a little sleepy.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:39

What time are you rocking at, Chris? I'm looking at 10 to 4 in the morning.

SPEAKER_07 1:43:44

Yeah, no, I'm at 10.48 p.m.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:48

Not dharma planning, I'm talking about like some fucked up shit here. But oh wait, no, okay. Last time I started trying to look at like some messed up scenarios on Google Images as we talked about things, I ended up with horrific imagery jump scaring me. I'm sure there's a term for. But uh yeah, we get our little catch-up to face skillf chasing the daughter through the Horrible. I like that her reaction when she rips off her mother-in-law's face is to go, uh fuck this shit, I'm out of here. Lodge.

SPEAKER_07 1:44:32

Yeah. She just paces out completely. What do you think of Hatchie dying?

SPEAKER_02 1:44:41

Oh yeah, I completely forgot Hatchie dies. See, I find that weird, I don't know what I think about that. Just like the I suppose it's karmic. Like the same action that he's been doing to other people like comes back to him where it's just a random death by a random soldier looting his house.

SPEAKER_05 1:45:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:02

Uh I don't know, it feels it feels anticlimactic, but I feel like it's supposed to feel anticlimactic, so I don't know, I'm a little torn in that one.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:14

I am also.

SPEAKER_09 1:45:15

I was sad that he died, but I also liked that they had the balls to kill him.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:22

My boy Horny Hatchie, rest in peace.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:26

Yeah. He tried.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:29

Well he tried, well, he succeeded.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:33

He he succeeded several times.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:36

The movie's based on him succeeding a little too well. But yeah, we get the NJ scene. They leave it ambiguous. Do you think that the mother fell into the her little her little death pit?

SPEAKER_07 1:45:57

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:02

Like freeze frame towards the end.

SPEAKER_09 1:46:04

Yeah, it's an interesting way to leave it. I don't think she did. Because she's so used to jumping over that. It's gotta be muscle memory. I don't think she I don't know, you know, I don't imagine she'd live too long after.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:26

Yeah, again, go on as I mentioned earlier, I don't think there's a health service.

unknown 1:46:31

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:32

I feel like and I well, I mean, if my my reading of it's correct and down purgatory anyway. I feel like she has to go in the pit. I feel like the pit is like Jigoku. Is that how you pronounce it?

SPEAKER_07 1:46:49

It is the doorway.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:51

Yeah, like that's like the downwards. Like that's the the You know what I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_07 1:46:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:02

I feel like In a general sense Did the daughter murder a bunch of men? Yes. Did she have premarital sex? Quite a lot, yes. Did she beat a dog to death with a basin?

SPEAKER_06 1:47:21

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:22

Maybe also, yes. But I feel like for some reason my brain is like she's still better than the rest of the characters, I don't know why. I feel like she's more worthy of redemption than probably just because she still seems like like a poor soul. She seems like she does these things because she's forced in a situation where she has to do them. And for me, I feel like the mother is more just indifferent to the fact that she does these things.

SPEAKER_09 1:47:52

I agree. I feel like the wife is still in this area, one, because the mother convinced her to stay, but two because she was hoping she could see her husband again, and she wanted him to be able to find her.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:08

And also we can't really put the dog on him.

SPEAKER_09 1:48:10

We did have to be Yeah, that's the thing. They were starving.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:16

But yeah, I suppose any any wrap-up thoughts on Onibaba.

SPEAKER_09 1:48:22

No, uh I liked it more than I thought I would, but I didn't really have an expectation for how much I would like it. I didn't think I would dislike it.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:34

See, I I was I thought I was gonna go either way. I thought I was gonna be like, I'm a fake film, bro. I have to I have to unsubscribe from the BFII like player. I can't I can no longer continue my letterbox account. I thought I was either gonna go in and go, this is pretentious shit, or I was gonna be like, this is phenomenal. And I do think it's phenomenal. I actually think this is a fucking a great I don't even know if you could consider it horrible.

SPEAKER_09 1:49:05

It's like I didn't want to throw that back at you, but yeah, it is one of those dramas that we've covered a couple of that has sort of horror-ish elements.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:21

I would definitely well, it's definitely more horror than Take Shelter Crush, don't you try and throw it back on me if I ain't happening on that.

unknown 1:49:29

No.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:29

A woman gets her face removed, she dresses up as a demon.

SPEAKER_09 1:49:35

Yeah, that guy's imagining natural disasters. That's horrifying.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:41

Yeah, he's imagining it.

SPEAKER_04 1:49:44

And then they happen.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:47

Or maybe they don't. They don't rank in that episode. I still think about that ending, by the way, it still angers me that I'm like, regardless of each way it goes, it doesn't matter. I still think about how angry that ends. If I'm looking up at this guy randomly, I'll be like, that fucking movie and his fucking rock solid chin. That's where it got.

SPEAKER_05 1:50:13

You get mad at it? That's so funny.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:17

Do you know what fucks me up see when I see oil? I remember we're talking about how the sky looks like oil. When I see oil, I think of that and I go, I'm so fucking angry with it.

SPEAKER_09 1:50:27

It's a good movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:30

It's a it's a fine movie.

SPEAKER_08 1:50:33

Pretty good.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:35

No, it's like it's so we've got to get back into this. The problem is with Take Shelter is everything is good on a technical level. It just it gets too repetitive by the end, and then again the ending is it's a non-ending. It doesn't matter either way. Either it was the apocalypse and they were all going to die anyway. It doesn't matter, his little fucking shelter's not gonna do shit, or he's imagining shit again, and then his whole therapy journey was just pointless, and I just wasted an hour of watching the film. And he even if it was the apocalypse, he mistimed it, so he would have came out of his little fucking shelter and went, oh, it's fine, I reckon, and then just fucking died again. Which was so bad. Can be like, oh, it was right, it was the apocalypse, it was just like two years later after therapy. No, you didn't guess shit then. You're just a schizophrenic, then the apocalypse happened to happen.

SPEAKER_09 1:51:43

It's just a dad doing his best. It's an American dad doing his best.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:55

None of us.

SPEAKER_09 1:51:56

Go listen to Take Shelter.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:59

I took my Japanese gulfs over my American dads anyway.

SPEAKER_09 1:52:04

I can't argue with that. If you want to argue with that, you can email us at theuncannyvalleypod at gmail.com. Or you can follow us at the uncannyvalleypod at on Instagram. No, it's theuncannyvalleypodcast at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:24

I don't think anyone would have to do that. We had to change it at some point. Did we have to change it at some point?

SPEAKER_07 1:52:30

Yeah, we did.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:31

I think Chris, I think it would benefit you see if you just did like a little see if you just recorded that and then just made it a little sound bite to send me and I could just slap this in at the end of episodes.

SPEAKER_07 1:52:41

Yeah, that would be way easier, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02 1:52:44

It really works. Ah, but yeah, I saw oh, we've got to do all uh who would you recommend us to? I don't know, fucking anyone. I think this is sick. I think if you like horror, it's quintessential like old Japanese horror.

SPEAKER_09 1:52:58

Especially if you want to tell this to people at work.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:02

Oh, you go see, so you must have liked it to some extent.

SPEAKER_09 1:53:06

Yeah, yeah, I do.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:09

Do you want to watch a movie of random Japanese people being horny and some craft?

SPEAKER_07 1:53:14

Yeah, horny people uh in the war.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:18

Um I can't I feel like I can't I keep going back to The Witch. I feel like if you like Robert Edgar's movie. Like this is this feels very Robert Edgar. Yeah, it really does.

SPEAKER_09 1:53:30

Just very sunk into the atmosphere of the time.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:36

Robert Edgers' entire thing's historical accuracy, and I don't know how accurate this would be. I don't think anyone's ever really Well, to be fair, I don't think you could 100% accurately depict 14th century Japan. Because I feel like that's you wouldn't get the minute like details as perfect as like Robert Eckers going, we can't have that many candles, that family couldn't afford that many candles from the witch.

SPEAKER_09 1:54:08

But yeah, Robert Well, you know, what is there to be historically inaccurate about, you know? Maybe architecture, that's all I could think of.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:19

Yeah, like house, um I don't know the exact fashion, what type of stuff they would have. Um would it ever actually be able to survive in this situation? Again, if it is purgatory, and my theory was right, I suppose none of this matters fucking anyway.

SPEAKER_07 1:54:36

Yeah, true.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:39

Oh, I'm watching a scene where she gets her fucking face smashed in, what a good scene. Anyway, I suppose this is is are we just gonna do her end ramble where I just cut at some random point?

SPEAKER_07 1:54:50

Yeah, yeah, that sounds good to me.