UV25 - PRINCE OF DARKNESS (1987)

Join Chris and Charlie in surviving a supernatural onslaught while unpacking religious themes and dodging dated jokes.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Yes. As I walk through the uncanny valley of death, we shall fear no evil. For I am not evil. Have you heard of a TV show from? It's like a horror TV show.

SPEAKER_07 0:22

From? Yeah. Yeah. I've heard it doesn't answer anything yet, at least.

SPEAKER_02 0:29

See, it's strange because I hadn't heard of it before until I started seeing it in a bunch of people's like top five on serialized. It's got eight out of ten on IMDB.

SPEAKER_07 0:40

It seems fun. I've watched some of the first episode and it's more gory than you'd expect.

SPEAKER_02 0:48

But it's like I feel like the posters are really letting it down because I've got all four of the posters up right now. It's just every single one of them.

SPEAKER_07 0:55

Staring, right?

SPEAKER_02 0:56

Yeah, it's just him looking a bit perturbed. Like I get no I have no idea. He is? Oh, you've not started Alan Wake 2 yet, have you not?

SPEAKER_07 1:09

No, my roommate and I are finishing control right now.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

There's a Castle Rock TV show?

SPEAKER_07 1:17

Yes, it's I've seen half of the first season. Bill Skarsgard's in it. A couple other people are in it. Chain Levy's in it. In the first season. And then it sort of shifts focus. Jane Levy plays Jane Torrance, Jack Torrance's daughter, in the first season. But then the second season shifts focus. All I know is that Lizzie Kaplan plays Kathy Bates' character from Misery.

SPEAKER_02 1:47

Oh, that's fun.

SPEAKER_07 1:48

Yeah. It seems fun. But I don't know if I want to watch that before we can at least sizzle that we're thinking of doing a Castle Rock mini-series. I don't think I'd want to add that in there.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

Is Bill Scorsgaard character supposed to be kind of pennywise adjacent to them?

SPEAKER_04 2:11

No.

SPEAKER_02 2:13

So why would you have him in it?

SPEAKER_07 2:15

He's just I I don't think so anyway. He's just like a he's a prison inmate at Shawshank.

SPEAKER_02 2:22

Oh that's so strange.

SPEAKER_07 2:26

Yeah, Shawshank and then Terry. The guy who plays Locke in Lost is the warden of Shawshank.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

See it pisses because this is trying to connect to Shawshank. Welcome to Derry tried to connect to Shawshank, and it's like out of everything in Stephen King's Mythos, why is the fairly normal prison the one place that everywhere wants to go?

SPEAKER_04 2:53

It's a good question.

SPEAKER_07 2:57

I don't know. It's isn't that sort of the thing with any universe, is that it just sort of has to be focused around certain things. You can't go to the city.

SPEAKER_02 3:07

Yeah, but like you think we go, okay, let's go to the the Overlook Hotel or let's go to to Derry for a bit, not go you want to go to the very normal prison where very normal things are happening.

SPEAKER_08 3:23

Yeah, well it's notable, it's very famous.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

Yeah, but it's famous for not being anything like the rest of it.

SPEAKER_04 3:34

Yeah, I'm not arguing, I'm not saying you're wrong. Tim Robbins is in it.

SPEAKER_02 3:44

Who's Tim Robbins again? That's not the friendship guy, is it?

SPEAKER_08 3:49

No, that is Tim Robinson. Tim Robbins is in um I'm blanking out now. Is he not in Shawshank Redemption?

SPEAKER_02 4:04

I I was uh see both Shawshank and Green Mile I saw as a child on TV. I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_07 4:10

Yeah, he's not in the Shawshank Redemption. He's in Mystic River. He's in Silo recently, which I really love.

SPEAKER_02 4:20

I assume Silo is like uh an American channel TV series that has got like three seasons.

SPEAKER_07 4:26

It's uh so far two seasons waiting in season three right now. It's a sci-fi TV show on Apple Plus where Rebecca Ferguson looks incredible playing an apocalypse mechanic in a like grain silo that functions as a fallout vault.

SPEAKER_02 4:47

Oh, is that is that the one where there's like oh there's more than one silo? And it's like, is that a twist, really? That was like your planned twist? Yes, the most the most obvious twist known to man.

SPEAKER_07 4:59

Yeah. There's more to it, but yes, and that's now what's interesting about it. Like the twists are fun, and it's why you'll keep watching, I guess. But Rebecca Ferguson's so good in it.

SPEAKER_06 5:10

Among other people.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

Yeah, I like who that's two things that she's in for um that are at Stephen King adjacent that we've been talking about, where she's the only good part of it.

SPEAKER_07 5:22

She's not the only good part of it. Uh Tim Robbins is really good.

SPEAKER_02 5:27

You keep saying that, but I don't know what that is, so I'm just imagining fucking Tim Robinson from Friendship who's stuck in like a fallout shelter.

SPEAKER_07 5:36

I kinda want that. He should be in Fallout, he should just be a crazy guy they come across.

SPEAKER_02 5:42

No, Tim Robinson would make a crazy good like cult leader in a show. Oh, yeah. Imagine him running like a gang in like a really like imagine Gotham. Like him running like a little biker gang in a Gotham show.

SPEAKER_06 5:56

That would be fantastic.

SPEAKER_07 5:58

He would have to like accidentally die when he gets confronted by Batman. And everyone acknowledges that Batman didn't kill him.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

You know what? See, serious role, Tim Robinson. I think he would kill the penguin. See if you made him fat with a little hunch and gave him like a little march.

SPEAKER_07 6:17

If he should kill the penguin, I think that would be a weird way to take that show.

SPEAKER_02 6:22

No, but then he takes the mantle of the penguin and he becomes Emperor Penguin.

SPEAKER_06 6:28

Oh. Honestly, he might be kind of good. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:33

I can't think of anyone. I feel like he would do Harvey Dent really good. I don't know why.

SPEAKER_08 6:38

Weirdly, not in a big role, but I could see that.

SPEAKER_02 6:44

Well, you could I think he would boot like he'd be on par with fucking Tommy Lee Jones and Batman Forever and Robin.

SPEAKER_04 6:54

Yeah. Hi, welcome. No, I don't like High. I don't like High. So mad.

SPEAKER_07 7:03

Welcome to The Uncanny Valley. Today we're talking about Prince of Darkness. I don't like that either. This sucks. Hold on, give me one second. I'm burning out. Welcome to The Uncanny Valley. Today we're talking about Prince of Darkness from 1987. I love this movie. This is one of my letterbox top four. This is easily probably my third favorite movie. My favorite John Carpenter movie. What do you think of this?

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Oh, that's so wild. I forgot this was in your top four. Because I saw you gave it five stars and I was like, shit, is this is this like a because I don't think this is a bad movie. I'm not gonna say this is a bad movie. I had a lot of fun with this. But I thought this might have been like one of your I I will die on this hill. Like five star reviews. Because I think it's good. I like the direction. I like uh I like the characters actions, I would say. It definitely has issues with the scripting. I feel like there's a lot of stuff in here that isn't explained very well, and a lot of pointless characters, but for the most part, I did have a good time with this one. I've yet to review it, it's gonna get it's gonna get a 7 out of 10. But I don't think I can go further than that.

SPEAKER_07 8:21

That's what I think it is. I think it's realistically a 3.5 on Letterboxd, but because I love it so much, I just give it a 5 because I really like watching it. The first time I watched it, I had such a unique sense of dread that I feel like is only matched by maybe Sorcerer.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

I'm not seeing Sorcerer. Do you know the one thing I will say I do think on a rewatch I would prefer this more. I went into it expecting it to be like weird trappy Lovecraft horror and not almost a zombie movie with like Hellraiser elements. It's very it's very slowburn. I wasn't expecting the tone of this at all.

SPEAKER_07 9:05

Yeah, I didn't want to tell you anything about it because it's best experienced not knowing what to expect, I'd say.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

Well, going into it, I did know that there was a big evil lava lamp.

SPEAKER_07 9:19

And uh Satan goo. You know there was Satan come in a jar.

SPEAKER_02 9:24

Yeah, I knew there was something to do with Satan. I didn't know that um Donald Pleasant was a priest. Honestly, I was a little disappointed with Donald Pleasant in this movie. I feel like he kinda hammed this one in.

SPEAKER_07 9:37

I think he's fun in this, but I think he's better in the first half.

SPEAKER_02 9:43

But yes, the thing about I don't think we gave I think there's too many characters for Donald Pleasant having like a lot to do, because aside from talking to um Brak? Is that how you pronounce the teacher's name? Byrak? Like he's he's basically just there for like philosophy and um almost said exhibition. He's not an exhibitionist. Um this is what you hear him say. What's that word, the X-word, that means you ex I'm trying to I'm trying to reverse engineer the sentence because I've now got exhibitionist and that's definitely not correct. Yeah, I feel like there's too many characters in the film because it feels like towards the second half, because we're trying to balance so many people. Him and Professor Bayrak, Bayrak? I'm not really sure how you pronounce it. We say his name a lot, but I still I still don't get it.

SPEAKER_06 10:39

Yeah, I don't remember, honestly.

SPEAKER_02 10:42

We start to become like an uh exposition like philosophy side plot rather than true, Chris. I thought like it's weird this movie, you start with protagonists, and then you get a full other group of people and they become the protagonist, and then in the last five minutes it like shimmies back over to people we were following at the beginning, and it threw me through a fucking loop. Because I was like, Where's Porn Stash? Where's Ginger? Where where are these characters that I was following?

SPEAKER_07 11:17

You didn't like that it switches around? I always like when a movie kind of switches the characters around.

SPEAKER_02 11:25

No, I liked it, but I just felt like like we got like the first opening, the half an act is like setting up like visa protagonists. And then it just goes.

SPEAKER_08 11:37

Well, certain situations they were there to set up.

SPEAKER_07 11:43

Like people being in danger. There were a lot of you know, three of the side characters, I believe, went into a room to sleep and got infected with goo in their throat. Uh, and then that sets up for when, you know, one of our characters goes into a room with a bunch of goo on the ceiling, but the goo is going into the Antichrist instead of trying to attack him.

SPEAKER_06 12:10

Uh there are a lot of things. Where we're following these other people so that they get killed off in a way to set up something that'll be suspenseful in a later scene.

SPEAKER_02 12:23

Yeah, no, okay, I understand that, but still it works with the antagonist as well, because it goes, okay, here's your Satan come. That's the main body. And you're like, okay, I have the Satan come in. And they're like, okay, the Satan cum squirted on these two women, and they're also the main bodies, and I go, Okay, I'm following you. And then it goes, okay, but then they're gonna squat on even more people, and then they're gonna be side bad guys, and then Alice Cooper is like a homeless Trent Reznor, and he's also one of the bad guys.

SPEAKER_05 12:55

Okay, I didn't mind that so much as a starting bit, but I agree that they didn't keep track of all of these pieces.

SPEAKER_02 13:04

It's just it's I get the whole point because I feel like it's supposed to be confusing, but at the same time, it's like okay, I've got protagonists, and then I've got the second protagonist who are becoming the first protagonist, and then I have the antagonist who's making some of the new protagonists the new antagonists, and they're adding other antagonists in, and I'm like it's just a cluster. Like, how are this many people all in this one building together? I think the appearance is supposed to be something you can't quite keep up with.

SPEAKER_07 13:36

You know, they're throwing a lot of philosophy at you, they're throwing all these things at you, people are getting stabbed, they're dying off relatively quickly once it starts happening.

SPEAKER_05 13:46

I I think the idea is that you're supposed to not be able to get comfortable, not really get enough time to try to understand what's happening.

SPEAKER_06 13:53

You're just reacting to it.

SPEAKER_02 13:58

I d I like that, but also at the same time, do you not think that Satan come takes too much of like a back step through the the the rest of the runtime?

SPEAKER_07 14:07

What's weird is maybe on a rewatch I can see that, but on a first watch, it made it so much scarier to me not interacting with it much and knowing that it was gonna come back into the story. Because I didn't really know what was gonna happen with that, and then they mentioned the Prince of Darkness in relation to the two. Which I guess I could have put that together, but you know, it just the the suspense was building for me in a very effective way the first time I watched this. And it it still does. I'm not really dissatisfied with the way that they use that.

SPEAKER_02 14:50

Yeah, Chris, I have a question for you. Is this set in New York? I get a really New York vibe.

SPEAKER_07 14:56

It seems like it's set in Detroit or something to me.

SPEAKER_02 15:01

Uh interesting. Okay, well, it's like my my confusion continued even when we started with the the the guy who works at the I think university and imagine because they all seem to be staying. I'll just call him Bayrak, because I feel like that's easier to say. He's like he's teaching this class, but he's teaching physics and philosophy. Oh, it's lost and some other shit of course. And my boy's just going on a fucking rant in class, like he's he's definitely an entertaining teacher, but I am not learning shit in this man's class whatsoever.

SPEAKER_07 15:38

You think he's too old, you think he's tenured and he should have been fired by now.

SPEAKER_02 15:43

No, I love an old rambly teacher. Okay, it seems they say like okay, that this is a physics class, and you're like, okay, I understand that this is a physics class, but apparently the last lesson was on Scrooge's cat, and I'm like, but that's a philosophy term, and then he's going insane talking about at the subatomic levels, nothing makes sense, and it's like, well, you're not helping your class here, are you?

SPEAKER_07 16:12

He's acting like he just got divorced.

SPEAKER_02 16:16

Like he's a man of science, but the priest, the first thing he's like, the second, one of the other priest eyes like, I need to get this insane physics teacher in to help me.

SPEAKER_07 16:26

By the way, played by Victor Wong, who is also uh with Dennis Dunn, both of them were in big trouble in Little China. I don't know if you've seen that.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

Also, I've I feel like I've got so many blind spots whenever we talk about movies. I feel like everything you've not seen, I've seen, and everything I've not seen, you've seen.

SPEAKER_07 16:47

It's good, it's a good combination then for this. Yeah, I've seen a lot more non-horror stuff, and you've seen a lot more horror stuff, I feel like. Because that's more of a comedy.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

I feel like you've seen No, you've seen a lot more like 80s horror, I would say. Outside of the slashers, I'm kind of like a big gap.

SPEAKER_00 17:04

That's true. Have you seen the stuff? The stuff?

SPEAKER_04 17:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:10

This sounds like a cleaning chemical. Have you seen Society?

SPEAKER_02 17:14

I have that's that's not the butthole one. That's the one where they like they become like a big human puddle blob. Yes.

SPEAKER_07 17:23

Okay, cool. What's the butthole one? I don't know what the butthole one is, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_02 17:31

It's like it's a body horror where a woman has a butthole for a mouth.

SPEAKER_00 17:35

Oh, I don't know about this one.

SPEAKER_02 17:38

No, no, no. Whoa, whoa, maybe circle back to this. Okay, so what did you think about? Um the priest sees his priest friend is dead, and he's like, okay, I need to go reveal my Nickelodeon slime collection that I've hidden in this church to this random doctor that doesn't seem to know me.

SPEAKER_08 17:59

It's very funny.

SPEAKER_07 18:01

It's one of it might be the only element of the movie I just don't question because it doesn't make sense when it comes up as why is he contacting this guy? He's going, I need help. We need help. The world needs help from you and your grad students. It's like Scooby-Doo, you know?

SPEAKER_02 18:23

It's like more expensive goo that I have hidden underground. It's like you're not gonna go to this Satan, are you? You're gonna go, alright, mate. Where'd you get this from? He has the book, and he's like, This book is 2,000 years old. No one has been able to decipher it. It's in Latin and Greek and has some numbers. And it's like, well, motherfucker, you've just deciphered it, haven't you? Like it's not that big of a mystery if you know exactly what everything in it is and you just haven't translated it yet.

SPEAKER_07 18:58

But it's so much work.

SPEAKER_02 19:01

And he's he goes, Well, people rubbed out some stuff, but it's sick because you can still read it. It's like so why are you adding in that detail? Like, how did these Greek philosophers not realize when they took like the eraser to this holy sacrament? It's like I thought you can still see it underneath.

SPEAKER_06 19:20

Yeah, you can still get it.

SPEAKER_02 19:22

It's just it's so stupid to me. It's like it's been impossible to translate. Can you ask your teenage students to come in and read it for me?

SPEAKER_08 19:31

There's something very well. Let's let's go through the plot.

SPEAKER_07 19:37

We meet our main couple of characters. Uh I don't remember offhand the name of Brian and Catherine. And they are introduced, sort of weaving in and out of their lives and this philosophy class that they're in. And he is lightly stalking her, I'd say. He's sort of waiting outside the school to see when she comes out at nighttime and gets annoyed by the city.

SPEAKER_02 20:06

Oh, he's crazy. He's so unsettling, he's so weird.

SPEAKER_06 20:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:13

And like, I feel like he looks about 12 years older than her. Like, this looks like a grown man.

SPEAKER_03 20:18

He's a real weird-looking guy.

SPEAKER_02 20:21

And he's like, his Riz is to go, I don't know you, but can you walk with me? And he immediately goes, I'm sexist, haha. And then gets mad when she's upset at this.

SPEAKER_07 20:33

When she's uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02 20:37

I don't I don't get the there's there's another instance of Riz in this movie that I look at and I'm like, this director has never not director, this writer, because it's not. Did um oh my god, I'm he did.

SPEAKER_07 20:52

He did, he wrote this.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

I'm sure someone else wrote this.

SPEAKER_07 20:56

It's a pseudonym. It's under Martin Quatermass, which is a reference to a movie called the Quatormasse Experiment. But it's a pseudonym for John Carpenter.

SPEAKER_02 21:06

Oh, see, that makes so much sense. I feel like John Carpenter has never pulled a day in his life.

SPEAKER_07 21:12

No, uh, it seems like he I don't know really, but I would uh guess he fell in love in like high school and then just married the person that he met in high school.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

Did he walk up to her and go, by the way, I'm sexist? Is this hot to you?

SPEAKER_07 21:30

That's the thing. I don't like there's some jokes in this also, like um Dennis Dunn's character saying to Susan uh saying you could pass for Asian. One Asian character to another Asian character, but written by a white guy. And it's that He gets annoyed when she doesn't react. I think it's the jokes are there for a plot function, but it doesn't, you know, they're there so that they hear him through the wall and then start talking to him, but it doesn't change the fact that they're really awful.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

Yeah, he's counting wall.

SPEAKER_07 22:17

That character has one other really bad joke, I don't remember.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

Yeah, don't worry, I've got I've got it noted down. But yeah, Walter in this. And it's strange because I feel like he's like the only, I'd say, like, aside from our schizophrenic priest and this nut job teacher that for some reason decided he's gonna kidnap his students over a weekend in a church to help him solve this issue. Out of all the students, Walter's like he's written a comedy book.

SPEAKER_01 22:52

You have a bunny escape?

SPEAKER_06 22:53

Yeah, a bunny escape, one second.

SPEAKER_07 23:14

Remarkably, I did not even have to get her. She just scrambled back into the living room on her own.

SPEAKER_02 23:23

Turns out you both gonna get cut, I'm gonna s uh uh like to put I am thinking of maybe getting a rabbit at some point, so you should.

SPEAKER_07 23:31

They're very, very sweet, and they don't make noise because they don't have vocal cords.

SPEAKER_02 23:36

Yeah, but he can stomp.

SPEAKER_07 23:39

Yeah, yeah, you're right.

SPEAKER_06 23:41

They do actually make noise when they thump. But it's cute.

SPEAKER_02 23:45

I think what I'll do is I'll wait until Field's got like a good eight months left in him. I'm gonna wait for him to kick the bucket, and then that entire side in my room will just put like a fence down, and that can be the little the little home area.

SPEAKER_04 23:57

Hell yeah. How's Theo going?

SPEAKER_02 24:01

Um doesn't get up to too much, he doesn't really have hobbies.

SPEAKER_08 24:10

I should get a hamster. It seems fun.

SPEAKER_02 24:12

He spilled his entire water bowl earlier, and then I had to fix that for him, and that's about as as exciting as they got.

SPEAKER_08 24:20

How much do you spend keeping your hamster?

SPEAKER_02 24:24

Oh fuck, he eating food is dirt cheap. I just like once every three months spend like 30, 40 pounds and buying a big bulk of it, and then it's Hell yeah, okay. It's the cage that's the issue. The cage, you need a big cage, or they end up depressed.

SPEAKER_07 24:42

But even you he has a big cage and he's still managing to walk his w knock his water over somehow.

SPEAKER_02 24:48

Yeah, no, because what he does is even if it's full, he'll put his hands on the side of the little tub and he'll bend it, like he'll push it down so it like bends up towards him so he can get a better grasp of it.

SPEAKER_05 25:00

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 25:01

And it's like, can you just dunk your head in it like a normal hamster?

SPEAKER_07 25:05

Buddy. Why are you gonna be so gluttonous?

SPEAKER_02 25:08

It's like I can't even give him a water feeder because rather than get him a tank like I did is I got a big giant storage tub and I sawed a cube off the top, and then I um attached chicken wire with sip ties so air can come through. So he just lives in a big storage tub.

SPEAKER_04 25:26

That's cute.

SPEAKER_02 25:29

That was a pain, yes. But it I got sidetracked, we'll talk about Walter, weren't we?

SPEAKER_07 25:35

Yeah, I like this actor. He's great in Big Triple in Little China. He is he plays opposite Kurt Russell, and the gag in that movie is basically that he is the protagonist of the movie, and Kurt Russell is the sidekick.

SPEAKER_02 25:54

Uh calling uh Guardians of the Galaxy too.

SPEAKER_04 25:57

Kinda, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:00

Yeah, as I was saying, I feel like Walter, like, he's written he's almost like a cartoon character compared to the rest of the students. Like I feel like he's supposed to be. But he's like he's so extreme comedic relief. But he's just he's just he's like his own character in this movie. Like he seems like he's been filmed from a different film. Yeah, he doesn't have a movie, and like he would be fine there.

SPEAKER_07 26:28

That's the thing, I feel like it's performed pretty well, it just doesn't, the character doesn't fit. I like him, I think he's really charming.

SPEAKER_02 26:37

See, I think okay, before all the the students get kidnapped and put into this fucking church over the weekend, which no one would agree to do. If your teacher says cancel your weekend plans, you're staying in a church with me. This is what we get the first instance of like the the upside down crescent moon above the sun. It's a cool shot.

SPEAKER_04 27:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:06

Because I assumed okay, it's going biblical, we're going to get the moon eclipsing the sun as like a big and then it just doesn't. It just doesn't at all.

SPEAKER_04 27:20

It's fair for you to assume that.

SPEAKER_02 27:25

Is the the weird crescent moon supposed to be what brings the homeless crowd to attack the church?

SPEAKER_07 27:33

I think they're there incidentally, they're just sort of worshiping, you know, his creation.

SPEAKER_02 27:41

Yeah, but why would they not the only thing I can think of is they say okay, when you're near it, you start to have dreams about it. And presumably a lot of these people would be hardcore drug addicts that are in a sedative state. So we'd probably be more inclined to be under the spell.

SPEAKER_04 28:01

I think they're just zombies already. But why? There's no the same cum didn't hit any of them.

SPEAKER_07 28:16

I feel like maybe there was there honestly might be sort of a Jedi mind trick almost sort of offensive implication that houseless people are sort of weak mentally enough that they can be overtaken without being directly infected.

SPEAKER_02 28:36

So why did you have to do that? But you're like, yeah, but what if he thought they were all dumbasses?

SPEAKER_07 28:46

The the the drug one doesn't quite make sense to me for why they would be fully controlled. You know, like if they if they were the only people in the world to be having the dream because they have these more intense dream states. And then they come to visit this place because they are all having the same dream. Consciously, and then they get infected. Then that makes sense the way you're describing it. But the way it happens, it feels like they are just sort of weak enough, or they have broken themselves down enough to be controlled inherently.

SPEAKER_02 29:22

Insane cameo from Alice Cooper, though.

SPEAKER_07 29:24

It is, it's great. It's like seeing uh well, you don't know who Jim Jarmish is, so you have not seen the dead don't die, but it's like seeing Iggy Pop as a zombie in that.

SPEAKER_02 29:34

That's such a strange because I feel like well Alice Cooper, he's the he was doing like little cameos and things, because I think he was in Tenacious D at one point in the 2000s, and then he's uh I haven't seen that. He's in Wayne's World.

SPEAKER_07 29:50

Does Tenacious D count as a horror movie?

SPEAKER_02 29:54

Um The Devil's in it, does that count?

SPEAKER_07 29:57

Yeah, that's what I was thinking of. So maybe we can make it count. We could do a music thing at some point.

SPEAKER_02 30:03

Um if you count Clockwork Orange as a horror movie, there is a cameo that connects the movies.

SPEAKER_03 30:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 30:16

Do you consider Clockwork Orange a horror movie?

SPEAKER_07 30:19

I haven't seen it.

SPEAKER_02 30:21

You've not seen a clock? What the fuck?

SPEAKER_07 30:23

No.

SPEAKER_02 30:24

That's just like a I feel like just everyone's seen the clock. That's just like one of those films. It's like saying you've never seen a Titanic.

SPEAKER_07 30:32

Uh I have seen the Titanic, but I w I saw it when I was a kid and I did not like the first half, so when I rewatched it, I would only watch it after the Titanic sank.

SPEAKER_02 30:44

I I didn't like the movie section, I just like watching the people die.

SPEAKER_07 30:48

I just like the action.

SPEAKER_02 30:52

There's more upbeat action movies than the end of fucking Titanic.

SPEAKER_07 30:57

Yeah, I'm a little of a grim fucking kid. What do you want? Or I was.

SPEAKER_02 31:02

Well, I don't have anywhere else to put this, but it's quite prominent in this. See that fucking blomp, blomp, blomp fucking bass soundtrack it plays throughout this entire movie. Dude.

SPEAKER_07 31:14

So, so good. I set up my sound system for the first time since moving into this place for it.

SPEAKER_02 31:21

I like I noticed it in one scene. I was like, that's sick. I wish I could hear that again. And then it played in the next scene, and I was like, oh fuck yeah. And I got jump scared by it in the third scene. I said it's incredible. And it's just it seems to be just the same bass look. It's so good though. Sounds so good.

SPEAKER_07 31:41

I don't know if John Carpenter, he scores his own movies too.

SPEAKER_02 31:45

Oh, does he?

SPEAKER_07 31:47

Yeah, he the way he's described doing it, which I fucking love, is just he's watching a cut of the movie in the editing room. He has an electric guitar in his hand, and I imagine he has a cigarette in his mouth, and he's just strumming along to the movie.

SPEAKER_02 32:04

But it's it's weird because both this and like something like Halloween are both super simple soundtracks. Like it was really not much like a kid could play the soundtracks if you give him like it's I love John Carpenter, and I'm gonna pick all of his movies through this, to be honest.

SPEAKER_07 32:23

I really he's my favorite horror director. And I don't say this lightly, I don't say this insultingly either. I feel like he's not accidentally great, because he has all these ideas that are amazing and he puts so much work into everything, but stuff like that is like yeah, it it's not enough of a score, technically, if you're really analyzing it, but somehow it really fucking clicks into place and works. Then he does get like any ill marcone for the thing to fill out the soundscape for something that needs a more grand score. Whereas something like this, you know, the steady, a bass line especially, is something that really builds a level of dread because it doesn't let you it doesn't let you rest, but it also doesn't give you something to get carried away with. It doesn't let you drift away from the situation you're in.

SPEAKER_02 33:27

Well you say that, but I was I was I was getting groovy with it.

SPEAKER_07 33:31

Well no. This is so good. Have you seen the Salt on Precinct 13?

SPEAKER_02 33:41

I haven't. See the thing is with John Compton, I like his movies, but we'll we'll go past it fast because I can't be used sitting on it because it seems like it's just a thing in his old age. But it just seems like he's become like a really bitter old man when it comes to movies, and it really puts me off liking his stuff. Like you never hear about him nowadays unless it's him complaining about.

SPEAKER_06 34:03

What stuff are you talking about?

SPEAKER_02 34:05

Did you not see him um bitching and whining about hating Coralite for Jay's movies and calling her like a terrible director and saying our movie's about something?

SPEAKER_06 34:15

That does suck. I haven't seen that.

SPEAKER_02 34:18

There was a lot of people in the comments going, oh yeah, you say that about a movie I liked as well. It just seems like that's all he does now. I was like, ah, it's kind of depressing.

SPEAKER_07 34:26

The last I checked in, he was just saying, Yeah, you could make a movie, you can make a sequel to a movie I like, just pay me a lot of money. I don't have anything against that.

SPEAKER_02 34:38

Oh, just you wait until we get Blumhouse rebooting the thing with a full trilogy.

SPEAKER_07 34:46

I wanna see a new the thing. I wanna see what they'll do. It's fine. There's already three.

SPEAKER_02 34:53

How three?

SPEAKER_07 34:55

There's the original from the 50s, there's the 80s, and then there's the remake.

SPEAKER_02 35:02

Yeah, but you can't well no, because the remake isn't a remake, it's just a prequel.

SPEAKER_07 35:07

But it's both. It's it's a spiritual sequel while also being a prequel.

SPEAKER_02 35:12

Yeah, but you can't count the original as part of that like storyline. Spiritual movie, I guess.

SPEAKER_07 35:18

But hypothetically the thing movie. It's based on the same thing.

SPEAKER_02 35:23

It's based on the same thing, but it's not part of that franchise. What I'm saying is, you know, hypothetically Blumhouse Scott Writes, they would do a let's follow McCready immediately after the events of the thing.

SPEAKER_07 35:35

Do you think they would do old man Kurt Russell? I would watch that.

SPEAKER_02 35:44

And then he would go to like some medical base. Josh Dilmell would be killing people. And you know that's what would happen, and it would be McCready is the new thing killing people in like random military bases.

SPEAKER_07 35:58

Yeah, I guess so. It's fine. I was thinking more of like another Halloween movie, made by someone you probably don't want, like a paramount Halloween movie.

SPEAKER_02 36:11

Uh I'm okay, but the Halloween franchise has been tarnished enough with bad movies. I don't think another bad movie's really gonna do too much.

SPEAKER_07 36:21

That's how I feel about the thing after the prequel, which I like for the most part, but it's also not a good movie.

SPEAKER_02 36:30

Yeah, but there's a difference between you've got The Thing, which is the classic, and then you have The Thing, which is a sequel, but it's still it's still half decent, and then you've got Halloween, which goes good, good, not related, but good, bad, bad, bad, um, kind of good, really bad, then kind of good again, then really bad, then kind of good again, and then okay, and then terrible. Like there's a bit there's a big there's a a different scope you're dealing with when it comes to Halloween.

SPEAKER_07 37:05

Yeah, true. We agree that 2018 is not great.

SPEAKER_02 37:10

I I quite like 2018.

SPEAKER_07 37:12

Oh, you do, okay. I'm I misread that. I don't I like Kills, but 2018 looks great, but I don't think the writing's very good.

SPEAKER_02 37:23

Also, you you don't think 2018's writing is very good, but you like evil dies tonight from kills?

SPEAKER_07 37:30

I don't think it's good, I think it's funny.

SPEAKER_02 37:34

Can we agree that kills is the best action out of any of the Halloween movies?

SPEAKER_07 37:40

I was laughing through most of Halloween kills.

SPEAKER_02 37:44

Not only that, because I think I've talked about it like three times before on this, but the kicking a kid's arm with a door car as he goes to shoot him and making him shoot himself is fantastic.

SPEAKER_07 37:54

Very fun. I mean that scene at the end is incredible. I might watch that after we record this.

SPEAKER_02 38:00

But also him murdering that poor old couple in their house with the entire chopping block of knives.

SPEAKER_04 38:10

Oh, I forgot about that. That's great.

SPEAKER_02 38:12

It's so funny at the same time. Because it's just so unnecessarily cruel. And it's like I get you're supposed to be evil, but evil should be indifferent, it shouldn't be like, okay, I'm going to stab you, and then I'm going to find your knife collection and then stab you with every single knife that you own.

SPEAKER_07 38:33

Yeah, it was going more into just ridiculous, which is why I liked it though. Because I felt like 2018 wasn't as grounded as it was purporting to be. How should like the podcasters?

SPEAKER_02 38:51

I don't even remember that being. I've seen that movie like three times as well.

SPEAKER_07 38:56

There's like a whole plot at the start following a couple podcasters looking for him that got killed in a gas station.

SPEAKER_02 39:03

Oh, you're so right, where she goes, Hey Michael, look at your mask.

SPEAKER_08 39:08

I hated those characters.

SPEAKER_02 39:11

Yeah, but did you did you not like that he then fucks them up immediately afterwards?

SPEAKER_07 39:16

I couldn't get over it. Maybe I'll watch it again and like it. I just didn't like a lot of the dialogue and a lot of the characters.

SPEAKER_02 39:25

Oh, that's fair. I think I I liked it mostly for Michael's. You've not seen the Rob Zombie version, have you?

SPEAKER_03 39:31

No.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

I think the Rob Zombie version, the first one, do you like Rob Zombie films generally?

SPEAKER_07 39:39

I have never seen a Rob Zombie film.

SPEAKER_02 39:42

That's you could do a full month of Rob Zombie movies. What the fuck?

SPEAKER_07 39:47

Which one is your favourite?

SPEAKER_02 39:50

Out of all of them, probably is Halloween, but obviously people love House of a Thousand Corpses. I've not seen either of the two sequels, The Free from Hell or The Devil's Rejects? Yeah, Devil's Rejects. I Lords of Salem, I think's okay. 31 I hear is fun. And then Green Inferno is just cannibal holocaust, but you know, we're not sexual assaulting actual teenagers.

SPEAKER_04 40:21

Isn't Green Inferno Eli Roth?

SPEAKER_02 40:24

Oh yeah, you're right. Oh no, never mind. I've not seen his The Monsters. I hear that's atrocious.

SPEAKER_07 40:33

What do you think of Sherry Moon Zombie in his movies? I don't know anything about her because I've never seen one of his movies.

SPEAKER_02 40:41

She's fun. I don't think she could act particularly well, but she's fun. Oh but Chris, see Halloween 2007, I think Rob Zombies one. You want to see a protagonist get fucked up in a movie? Holy shit, that girl's a mess by the time the credits roll.

SPEAKER_05 40:57

Okay, hell yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:00

It's like I think did I not talk about that in the disco review before? It pisses me off when I see like horror movie protagonists get beat the shit out of, shot, stabbed, and then come out with a car in her makeup looking thing. Her face is like a swollen blob by the end of 2007.

SPEAKER_07 41:20

Yeah, there's a lot of movies where they're like, what do you think about something like Ready or Not, where Samara Weaving's covered in blood, but she looks fantastic?

SPEAKER_02 41:33

Well, I mean, but that makes sense because she's done up for her wedding.

SPEAKER_08 41:37

That's true.

SPEAKER_02 41:38

And she does look ragged by the end of it, but she still has her makeup on. There's a reason for her to be done up in that situation.

SPEAKER_06 41:46

My guy's analyzing everything. I'm sorry for doubting you.

SPEAKER_02 41:51

If you want to see Samara Weaven looking good, it's the one thing I will give the end of Ready or to.

SPEAKER_04 41:57

Samara Weaven looks incredible by the end of Ready or Not to I can't tell you why you're gonna watch it anyway.

SPEAKER_02 42:09

It's not offensively bad, it's just like pointless. Like it's definitely if you wanted a movie. Do you ever have like movies that you're like I don't give a shit, but I kind of want to see it, so I'll put it on whilst I look at my phone?

SPEAKER_07 42:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:26

It's I'll put it on whilst I look at my phone movie.

SPEAKER_07 42:29

Most movies with Scott Atkins in them. Who I love watching fight, but in most movies, I don't really care too much about the emotional drama. Unless he's just playing a dude who's a soldier and he's just getting emotional about other dudes dying. He can do that okay.

SPEAKER_02 42:52

He's he's the big guy, Vic. You always see him with Sarah Michelle Gather in the marketing for Ready or Not 2. Yeah? Big guy, big big beefy man.

SPEAKER_07 43:05

He is he in Ready or Not 2? I I don't think so. But I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 43:10

Oh, I thought you were referencing. Never mind me. There's a big beefy guy, you leave the big beefy guy.

SPEAKER_07 43:15

Oh, is Kevin Durand in Ready or Not 2?

SPEAKER_02 43:19

It I think it might be him, actually, yes. Hold on, I'll pull up the letterbox or should you talk about um alien cum studies?

SPEAKER_07 43:28

Oh, it is him. Oh, okay. I like Kevin Durand a lot.

SPEAKER_02 43:33

He's I would say the best part of Ready or Not Too. He's really good.

SPEAKER_07 43:36

David Cronenberg is in it.

SPEAKER_02 43:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:41

What?

SPEAKER_02 43:44

He's there for a bit, it's not not important.

SPEAKER_07 43:47

Mr. Carbonell is in it too, that's cool.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

Chris, what on Alien cum?

SPEAKER_04 43:53

Darn it.

SPEAKER_02 43:55

Alien Devil cum.

SPEAKER_06 43:57

Work out that alien cum.

SPEAKER_02 44:01

So like okay, we're studying the company and then there's one of them that is like we're doing the like the book translation, even though it's Latin Greek and some s so you could probably figure it out just by having a look at it for long enough. Yeah. The pr the father even speaks Latin. We see that at times, but we'll ignore that. Okay.

SPEAKER_07 44:27

Yeah, no, they instead decide to outsource it.

SPEAKER_02 44:32

Lazy fuck is what it is.

SPEAKER_07 44:34

Yeah. Because they're not none of them are actively working too much. They just sort of set up equipment and then wander around and flirt with each other.

SPEAKER_02 44:43

I mean, as you do when you're trapped in a church with other other teenagers of uh teenagers, they're all like 30. But I think we're supposed to be teenagers, okay? It's the 80s.

SPEAKER_07 45:02

There's that one bald guy who looks 43.

SPEAKER_02 45:06

There is that one bald guy. But doesn't he like work with the churches? I don't think he's friends with these people.

SPEAKER_07 45:13

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 45:14

Because he's not in their classes, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_07 45:17

Oh no, I think Susan is whoever he was looking for. Because he keeps going around going, Where's Susan? They have a that's a good joke in the movie. People are going, Have you seen Susan? And everyone who gets asked goes, Who? And then they go, you know, blonde, glasses? Something like that. They everyone says it exactly the same way. It's definitely a joke, and I was laughing every time.

SPEAKER_02 45:48

See, I didn't even pick up on it because I was too busy trying to take notes as I was watching. See the amount of times I had to rewind in this film just to get what the because they're they're translating the the book that it seems Jesus' disciples obtained with the Alien Cub. But like I feel like I've jotted down all of the translations, and aside from like towards the end, it doesn't seem to have any relevance to the cumjar. Like it's just random satanic biblical stuff. Because they say okay, that Jesus was part of the good God, and then like anti-particles, or need to be an evil God, and Jesus was warning people. But the first translation says, I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you this thing that will be unleashed. Mystery, Babylon the Great, the mother of harlots, and the abomination of earth. Surely that sounds more like he sent that. Like Jesus caused this issue.

SPEAKER_07 46:59

I guess, yeah, there's an interpretation like that. But I d I like the I I take that just to be a misrepresentation of Jesus was sent by God. Maybe they meant sent, you know, God sent Jesus instead of Jesus sent something.

SPEAKER_02 47:22

Yeah, because there's a later translation about um the cum falling from a star, which makes me wonder how did they get it in the red cum jar? Who made the cum jar? Surely it wasn't the devil.

SPEAKER_04 47:40

I mean it was the church.

SPEAKER_02 47:42

It was but how did they get the cum in the jar?

SPEAKER_07 47:47

Through Greek with Greek jewelry. I imagine there was sort of an outbreak similar to this at some point.

SPEAKER_02 47:57

But I well I'd assume it's in like because they mentioned Jerusalem at some point, do they not? So I'd imagine it's like during that whole you know the Jesus story arc.

SPEAKER_03 48:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:10

It's like how's how's John, Mark, and Luke smelting glass to make a a vial with a lock and then scooping up the alien cun? I've got my hamster um assailing my arm as I'm speaking, and it's very ticklish, and it's really throwing the off.

SPEAKER_06 48:28

Hell yeah, good 'em, Theo. You got this.

SPEAKER_07 48:33

It just I don't know. You can imagine it was something someone had, or they went on a big quest. There maybe could be a fun prequel movie about that.

SPEAKER_02 48:45

So that's something I'd be accepting of a prequel movie, but I feel like it would just be because I mean we kind of know the ending to Jesus already, don't we? So I feel like it's it's a mute point.

SPEAKER_07 48:56

That would be such a fucking funny thing, though, to put a movie in theaters that is a retelling of the Jesus myth in the chronological reality of Prince of Darkness, so Jesus is an alien. You would make so many people angry.

SPEAKER_02 49:14

Yeah, I was I was strange. I've not heard of it in the first movie before, because I feel like like there's one thing saying you don't believe in God, but I feel like saying God and Jesus are human-like aliens that like anti-particles have a good like uh they have an equal evil alien to their good alien, and that um the the entire Catholic Church is allied by Jesus' disciples to better conceptualize good and evil to human beings. I feel like that's like we're on like another level of blasphemy, are we not at this point?

SPEAKER_06 49:56

I love it, such a cool idea.

SPEAKER_02 50:00

Like, never in a movie have I been like, I feel like that's a bit touchy when we're talking about the kids. I feel like you push it up. It's a wee bit too far gone.

SPEAKER_07 50:10

No, I it's so creepy to me, and it's so scary that like there's this thing that we could have been preparing for for 2,000 years, but we just couldn't get the message out. It honestly reminds me of global warming and the issues communicating that to a higher class of people and the importance and the uh urgency of it.

SPEAKER_02 50:34

I do like that um it seems like our the does the priest have a name? I just keep calling him the father in my notes. What one more time. The priest, does he have any name, or is he are we just gonna call him the father? Because I've just been calling him the father.

SPEAKER_07 50:51

Pretty sure he has a name. I'll just call him the father for now. I'm gonna look it up.

SPEAKER_02 50:55

I d I do love that his character is like we've held this secret even from the Pope, but I, random LA priests, know everything about this from the beginning of the beginning of recorded history.

SPEAKER_07 51:10

He is just priest.

SPEAKER_02 51:13

Yes, he's just a guy.

SPEAKER_07 51:15

Yeah. But I do agree that there's too many characters to define anyone. I don't fully notice it as a problem. I feel like it adds to the creepiness of what this movie is doing, and also giving this movie the most chance to feel like it's operating on a worldwide scale while still being budgetarily locked down to one building. You know, by having more characters in it who die while they're trying to go off and go home to sleep to leave other people to use the equipment. You know, it it makes the world feel a little more dynamic, even though it's in truth just adding in a couple of hollow characters to kill them off.

SPEAKER_02 52:07

Yeah, I feel like this is like people rip the piss out of Chainsaw Man and call it Themesaw Man because the the thematic themes of the newer chapters are more important than the narrative, but I feel like that's very similar to what's going on in this movie. I feel like the the overarching story, and because I feel like as much as I said, it's probably like the most blasphemous retelling of like Christianity I've ever heard. I feel like it's not anti-religious in any way. Like we don't take the piss out of the father, the father's mostly in the right.

SPEAKER_07 52:43

Yeah, I think it's just legitimizing it. It's legitimizing everything in a fantastical way, separate from reality, basically. Yeah, we haven't it's saying what if this were all true, but that being said, it meant something else.

SPEAKER_02 53:06

See, my takeaway from it was like we keep seeing the the Virgin Mary statue through the gates outside, and I took it as like he's saying that religion and science have both been held back by each other, like keeping them in separate worlds has caged them off when humanity would have been able to progress easier if there was like a coalescence of the two where people learn to work together. Because ultimately that's how we stop the devil in this. We use science and religion.

SPEAKER_04 53:40

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_02 53:45

Okay, one little note about the translation, you can tell at what point um John Carpenter gave up on trying to make it sound like biblical speak. Because the fourth translation goes, I saw a star fall from heaven onto the bottomless pit, and he was cast out as water from the flood. Sounds pretty good. Part five starts with the container was buried somewhere in the Middle East eeons ago by the father of Satan. It's like that doesn't you wouldn't read that in the Bible. That's like someone to do it.

SPEAKER_07 54:18

That's like a military briefing.

SPEAKER_02 54:22

I do love Christ comes to warn us he was of extraterrestrial ancestry. It's like that's he's warning you that he's an alien. That was his warning.

SPEAKER_04 54:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:34

He came to everyone, watch out, I'm an alien, guys.

SPEAKER_07 54:38

It's hard to warn someone about a thing that you have to inform them of before you warn them.

SPEAKER_02 54:44

It's also kinda hard to go to a planet and go, but aliens are coming to do bad. I'm also one. But I'm a good one, don't worry.

SPEAKER_07 54:54

Don't worry, don't worry. What did you think of the camcorder footage, the the dream footage overall? Like what did you know that was gonna happen?

SPEAKER_02 55:07

I like the vibe of it. I find it very funny that it's supposed to be a message from the distant future, but their future we keep going is from the 19 and then cutting it off because I'm like, well, buddy, you're already way off at this point.

SPEAKER_04 55:22

But yeah, it's cool.

SPEAKER_02 55:24

I love I do I love the way they explain time travel in this being in the future. We figured out how to move faster than light, but that would mean going backwards in time so we can send messages through these faster signals. That's awesome. That's like one of the coolest time travel things I've ever heard of. I fucking love that.

SPEAKER_07 55:48

It makes the universe feel huge in a scary way, because you don't really know what the future holds. But creating the science fiction thing, but also limiting it in a way where they say we we can only contact you through your subconscious brainwaves because you're not guarded like electropathically almost, is it's fascinating.

SPEAKER_02 56:14

Yeah, and it does like it does mysticism through like I I highly doubt this the scientific basis of this is very accurate.

SPEAKER_07 56:23

But it's science mysticism is a great way to put it, though.

SPEAKER_02 56:27

Yeah, because it's like everything in it, because we even say um the reason the disciples kept us hidden was for humans to be able to deal with this issue. We needed to have scientifically progressed to a point where we can understand the issue. So it's not saying that Jesus and Satan are magic or these big rods, it's just saying, oh, they're much farther advanced than us.

SPEAKER_07 56:53

Yeah, pretty much.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

It's kind of Prometheus almost in a way.

SPEAKER_07 56:58

It's very Prometheus. It is missing. If it's missing anything, it's missing a reason why everything is converging on Earth. You know, if they are just random aliens, why is anti-god coming for Earth as well? It why is this the only place that he can come through? I guess incidentally, because the um the goo fell there.

SPEAKER_02 57:26

Yeah, but also why do they only start to transform like under 2,000 years later? And how does that help anti-gods become like matter through like reflections? Like I don't there's like there's a little chunk of explaining, but I don't think it's is missing from uh well, this is love crafting you're not supposed to know. I think it's missing from we just weren't fucking told.

SPEAKER_07 57:57

I agree. I I feel like there is a level of um things that aren't thought out, but they're not thought out under the assumption that it will be creepy. And I think it does effectively make it creepy most of the time, but there are things that haven't been fully thought out properly. And that kind of also goes to the way that everyone's interacting with this. There's not a lot of concrete assumptions being made. People are reacting well to things in the moment, especially when they start kicking off. But like you said, they're not even really putting together that they can translate these things manually.

SPEAKER_02 58:44

Okay, well, we get we get a first instance after all this this cum investigation of Frank being the only sane person of the group because no, I'm just going to leave. Um doesn't end well for him. Quite a horrific scene. Um I was I wasn't expecting how brutally um Frank got fucked up.

SPEAKER_07 59:11

Is uh Frank the guy who gets scissors stabbed?

SPEAKER_02 59:14

Yeah, he gets bugged to bits and then he gets um stabbed like some.

SPEAKER_07 59:22

The idiot who gets bike stabbed.

SPEAKER_02 59:26

Oh yeah, but he he just kind of walked out. Like he he didn't have any he was just like okay, bye guys, and then died.

SPEAKER_07 59:32

Yeah, yeah, it's true. Yeah, Frank gets it really rough.

SPEAKER_02 59:38

Oh dude, I fucking love see that that pigeon on the little crucifix. I don't know what that means, but it looks really cool. It might be an awesome tattoo to have. Is that the scar? No, it's when our little our little nerd boy, the one you're talking about who gets bike stabbed, he walks out and he gets trapped by the homeless and he looks down and there's just a crucified pigeon.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:04

Oh I forgot about that. Yeah, yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:08

What did the little pigeon do? Like I don't nothing. Like I I get maybe a carrier pigeon, like it sends a message. But does it put up their little bird? It looks real as well. Like this is it's clearly not the highest budget movie. I'm going to assume that that's probably just a real taxidermied pigeon.

SPEAKER_07 1:00:30

Probably. One of my favorite trivia bits about a John Carpenter movie is that they had a a leaf budget for Halloween. So whenever they shot somewhere, they would pick up all the orange leaves that they used and put them back down wherever they were gonna shoot next.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:47

Guess what I was gonna say when you said leaf budget? I was like, surely you would just like go outside with a black bag.

SPEAKER_07 1:00:55

That's what I mean, is more just that they were keeping track of all their leaves.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:00

It's actually crazy when you hear well, aside from obviously the thing was like a lot, but most of John Carpenter's movies seem to be he's like, I've got two pens in my camera. If fuck it, I'll I'll figure it out somehow. That's why it's not.

SPEAKER_07 1:01:18

I don't want to say it's accidental because this guy is making fucking awesome movies almost out of nothing, relatively. But it's also He's just got so much magic in a lot of situations where he's I don't think he's especially you know in a movie like this, maybe he took a pseudonym because he agreed that the writing wasn't fully up to snuff. I feel like the dialogue is more the issue. I like some of the I like a lot of the exposition-y stuff and a lot of the philosophical stuff in it, but the interactions between characters don't hit as well. Uh but he's writing, he's directing, he's scoring, he's producing. You know, even though he's not doing all of that at the level of, let's say, uh, Kubrick. He's doing all of it in his own way that really leaves a lasting impact and makes for very unique movies that no one else could make. He's he's a really interesting artifact to me.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:37

Yeah, it's definitely a certain charm to it. I do think that maybe when writing, he had the idea for okay, I've got the scientists and I've got the priest, and the movie's going to be their discussions, and then he's like, but I do need people to kill, and then he's just kind of like hand-fisted a bunch of other characters in to fill out the plot. But again, I think that's what the like no one's gonna go, oh I I love Prince of Darkness. Remember that scene with Lisa typing on the typewriter and not looking at it. No one's gonna give a fuck. They're gonna be talking about the priest and the devil come.

SPEAKER_07 1:03:16

Well, I do love that scene though. Isn't she just typing he lives?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:21

I think it's just I live.

SPEAKER_07 1:03:23

I live, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:24

Well, I'm looking at right now, I live, you will not be saved by the Holy Ghost.

SPEAKER_07 1:03:28

You will not be saved, you will not be saved by the god Plutonium. That is my favorite line in the whole movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:35

Yeah, but that's cool, and in that in fact, you will not be saved in capitals, is it's it's a bit cringe.

SPEAKER_07 1:03:41

It's bad, yeah. Then the way they end it is like if it just weren't in all caps, it would be fine, honestly, it would be great. It's just trying to overstate itself.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:55

No, it's the in fact that's the worst part of it, because it's like it's Fedora wearing like Reddit in fact, like the devil's not gonna like pull an AI you thought it was this. Actually, it's this writing technique when he talks to you.

SPEAKER_07 1:04:15

Yeah. Honestly, it's and I hate to say it because I do love John Carpenter, but it's the symptom that I feel like occurs with every single writer-director, which is that they don't have someone. Or most of them, they don't have someone checking their writing. It's my biggest problem with Christopher Nolan, is I feel like if he just got one or two good script passes on a lot of his movies, they would be much more comprehensible.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:44

Yeah, but I feel like like if you take a script writer to say something like Interstellar, there's nothing you can really change without fucking that movie up.

SPEAKER_07 1:04:55

That's not a great example because it's based on a Jonathan Nolan script. So Christopher Nolan kind of was the script doctor for that one.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:06

Okay, well, take a Dark Knight. I don't like it as a Batman movie, but I feel like it's probably like a perfect blockbuster action movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:05:17

Yeah, you know, true. I won't argue on that. The the character dialogue is not super convincing. But it it doesn't have to be, especially the the love story dynamic, doesn't have to be super convincing just because they've known each other as since kids.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:37

Yeah, and it's supposed to be awkward between them. And like even Oppenheimer. I mean, that's mostly dialogue, and it's mostly really good. No, I love the Oppenheimer.

SPEAKER_07 1:05:48

No, I I wanted to leave. I did leave the theater, actually. I had to see it twice.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:54

Well, speaking of Oppenheimer, um, do you think plutonium is supposed to be a reference to Like nuclear energy, or do you think it's supposed to be a reference to the planet Pluto?

SPEAKER_04 1:06:07

Nuclear energy.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:10

Do you think maybe that's what Satan's making up?

SPEAKER_07 1:06:13

That line is so good to me because what it says is in my mind, like the heights of weapons you have been able to create will not be able to surpass what is coming for you. The you you can destroy yourselves trying to create the most powerful weapons and none of it will save you. Maybe. And that would tie into sort of the climate change. Like there's this. Yeah, the the Cold War and all the tensions around nuclear warfare that have lasted since then and will last forever now are based in this fear of why isn't our government doing more to quell this? You know, why is this the status quo now? Why is everybody comfortable with this? Why doesn't anybody see that something needs to be done?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:38

Okay, I'm looking at some of the other translations. One of them does read, You will not be deceived of his purpose, for one will be chosen. Chris, who do you think the chosen one is supposedly like is in this movie? Like I can't Well, I I don't have a We know who it winds up being. But do we?

SPEAKER_07 1:08:01

Yeah, is it Catherine, the one who gets sucked into the portal, and then we see her in the last vision. She's in the church.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

Yeah, but is but uh the priest is the one that smashed the mirror closing that gateway, so is he the chosen one?

SPEAKER_08 1:08:19

No, no, no, no, no. Because now she is the new vessel.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:24

I suppose. I don't know, I don't feel like feel like it.

SPEAKER_07 1:08:28

If that message is like from the devil, it wouldn't be the person who stops it temporarily won't pick the chosen one.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:40

Oh well you see that's interesting. You say if a message is from the devil, so maybe some of the messages are from the devil, like the plutonium one, and some are from Gingy over here, sending like the messages back from the future.

SPEAKER_07 1:08:58

Yeah, I get the impression that the um the computer stuff is just like it's being hacked, basically, a lot of the time.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:13

Is this where we see the return of Frank? Oh, we do see the return of Frank. What a fucking incredible scene.

SPEAKER_07 1:09:20

Oh my god, this is like the best scene in the movie, effect-wise, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:25

Oh, easily by a long shot. Like the movie has a lot of similarities to Hellraiser with even the makeup towards the end. I imagine it's probably the same makeup artist, because it looks borderline identical. But it is funny that this is the second 80s low-budget body horror movie where a dead man called Frank comes back and has an iconic line around death with his Pray for Death line.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:01

That's funny.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:03

Although Joe is weird, I feel like Jesus Wet works better in this movie than it would have because I feel she just walked him around. Pray for death works because Hellraiser keeps you alive in like endless torture. And this has more religious connections.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:21

Yeah, the the fear in this is more of like the world won't be around soon. Everything's going to end.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:29

I was fucked up. I just thought if you swat those lines, arguably it works better for each film.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:35

That is interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:38

There must be a fooling, because I feel like this movie even looks very similar to Hellraiser. Like it's shot in a very similar way.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:47

It does, yeah. Hellraiser was a couple years earlier, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:10:52

I think it was a couple.

SPEAKER_07 1:10:53

Same year.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:54

Oh, same year.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:56

That's fascinating.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:00

I wonder if they had like their Barbenheimer day, like it was like Double Frank with Frank fatalities.

SPEAKER_07 1:11:08

Frankly.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:12

Got the nice fork. Have you do you know anything behind the scenes about how they made the melted man of bugs?

SPEAKER_07 1:11:19

No, I wish I had taken time to watch some special features, but I don't really know any trivia about this. I'll look some up so we can talk about some because I'd love to reference a bit of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:36

I mean, this is I would say the part of the movie where shit really fucking hits a fan because immediately after we get colder given his beautiful amazing grace rendition. Um squeamish looking, you see like the skin of his neck fold in as it stabs, it's all my and it's like I don't think his singing was that bad. Did he really have to like push it to that extreme?

SPEAKER_07 1:12:07

Yeah, come on, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:09

He has some good long. Everyone's the harshest critic.

SPEAKER_07 1:12:16

Yeah, you still sound very nice.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:20

Um my note here, this is where we start to see like the nice.

SPEAKER_07 1:12:26

The first trivia I found is fantastic. You're gonna like this. I'm gonna like that Alice Cooper used was his own personal prop that he used in his stage shows to do that same impalement trick.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:39

Oh that's do you think they got Alice Cooper in and he went, wait, I can do something in this scene? Yeah, or do you think he did John Cosmetic saw Alice Cooper live and went, I need I need him to do that in a film for me. Oh shit.

SPEAKER_07 1:12:54

No, you know what? You're right, that's what happened. Because I think that's also what happened for They Live, is he went to WrestleMania because he just goes to WrestleMania and he saw Roddy Piper wrestling and said, I want that guy in my movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:09

He's like the Hideo Kojima of the 80s.

SPEAKER_08 1:13:12

Kinda, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:15

But fucking I haven't my notes here. Okay, so like the homeless people they've barricaded him in, okay, and this is when they start to notice, okay, we're stuck in the building. There's a huge there's like the world's biggest fire exit out the back of the building, but none of them try. It's like comically, it's almost twice the length of the building. It's an obnoxiously large fire exit, and not one of them goes towards it. Well, you know, it's how they get to the basketball court where Frank dies earlier in the movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:13:54

It's like a building across, and they just Yeah, I I can't say I ever paid too much attention to the geography of the movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:07

I feel like you can't.

SPEAKER_07 1:14:08

I feel like they don't give you they give you a sense of rooms that are important and where they are relative to each other, but they don't give you a sense of what's between them very well.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:20

Oh, good. We skip we were in the in the excitement of Frank, that's also where our boy who's who's the little comedic um sex pest halter. The devil cum has started running upwards into the ceiling, then pouring into it's it it's the pregnant woman's mouth, isn't it? Like and her eyes? Yes.

SPEAKER_07 1:14:49

Okay, so we do have to mention that she has been getting sick. She's not pregnant before anything. She's just I think she's friends with the girl who jumps into the mirror. They we see them chatting when they're going through the classes earlier in the movie. Uh but she she starts freaking out. She has this moment. I think this is Kelly. Uh Kelly has this moment where she says, I have this bruise that I got I bumped myself a couple days ago, and then another moment later in the movie where she says, I don't know, it's starting to hurt a lot more. And the camera looks at it, and I feel like this is a symptom of high definition, but it's just very clearly like a a weird satanic symbol that's etched into her skin at this point. And I burst out laughing because it's they just she just went, I don't know, I'm gonna go to bed. It just doesn't seem like anything too big.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:58

Can later we go, oh, it's it's it was like a pagan symbol she had got so where did she accidentally bump into a hot iron at like a pagan festival?

SPEAKER_07 1:16:08

Right, yeah, that's the thing, is I would immediately look in that at that and go, oh no, I'm being possessed by something because that doesn't look familiar. And I would remember if there was something hot enough to burn me that looked like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:24

It's just it's nonsense, because like we we don't even explain it later on, despite her being pregnant and bruised, is like a vital plot point that oh yeah, last week when I was at the satanic orgy, someone bashed my arm really hard, and now um I don't know, I'm feeling a bit funny, I need to go lie down.

SPEAKER_07 1:16:44

I think she didn't sustain an injury, I think she was just sort of marked already for the whole thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:53

See, my theory for it was that maybe she was like slightly pregnant, and with this thing being able to affect dreams, maybe it's like the fetus.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:05

That makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:06

Yeah, it's taking over her. I don't really but see the thing is the the devil cum I thought he was saying well, I suppose it goes into her mouth. So that was the devil cum, even though that's not how human biology works, at least to my knowledge. That no the woman isn't accessible.

SPEAKER_07 1:17:30

No, but no matter how deep it.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:33

But like she was already marked. Well, I mean, if you if you really pushed your way through, you could probably hit somewhere.

SPEAKER_07 1:17:41

No, it your com is gonna wind up in their stomach acid. You you would wind up in their throat and then it would just go into their stomach.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:50

You wouldn't get into the no, no yeah, but okay, but no cervix at the end of the stomach. No, no, no, no, no, no, Chris. It's it's it's a very watery semen, okay? And when your body drinks liquids, it absorbs the minerals. Now, who's to say that the devil's cum isn't like little little rock minerals, little brimstone?

SPEAKER_07 1:18:15

The devil's been drinking too much water.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:19

Yeah. And then you've been drinking a lot of pineapple juice, you've been preparing for brimstone.

SPEAKER_07 1:18:24

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:26

But yeah, who's to say that these little these little brimstone cum minerals didn't get absorbed into the body, then make its way to the womb?

SPEAKER_07 1:18:37

I don't think it has to abide by natural physics. I you didn't we didn't have to try to explain or something.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:44

Well, it wouldn't have to have a womb first. It would need to hit an egg, which would mean hypothetically, if she was at the wrong point.

SPEAKER_07 1:18:53

We can just say it metaphysically gets absorbed into her spirit.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:57

But it doesn't metaphysically, it like it pours vomit come from the ceiling.

SPEAKER_07 1:19:04

I know, but then it's in her body. I just view it as getting absorbed into her body, and then her body reacts to it, like DNA almost. Or hormones.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:17

But the same thing happens to like Calder, so why isn't he pregnant?

SPEAKER_07 1:19:25

Cause they don't want her to be pregnant. Cause he wasn't pregnant already, by your own theory.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:32

Well, I don't know. I don't know. I don't either. Okay. Devil comes in. We've got we've got Waler. He's trapped in the room with the two possessed barries cornered him, and we have the rest of them in the adjacent room.

SPEAKER_07 1:19:50

What was their plan on like when he's yelling jokes out because he's stuck?

SPEAKER_02 1:19:56

Yeah, but why okay, the the students, why do they like homeless fish with porn stash? Like, what was their plan there? Because he drops down where he's trapped and goes, Yep, everyone, I'm trapped, I'm coming back.

SPEAKER_07 1:20:12

Very funny. Yeah, he goes, get ready to pull me back up. He jumps out into the alleyway, he looks one way, lots of people. Looks the other way, lots of people. But people start coming towards him, he goes, pull me up, pull me up, pull me up. I think he was just trying to get a sense of where he could go. The other thing that's funny is it seemed like they could leap from that window over a fence into an alleyway that did not have people in it.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:42

Yeah, but it's also two stories. I like it. He just he superhero landed that shit. He did, and someone he does he do it later in the movie, he jumps right back out at like a and people die falling out of that window later on in the movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:20:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:58

It's like a serious drop. But uh so I poor poor Walters.

SPEAKER_07 1:21:04

He's got the portal steamers of steel.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:09

My boy Walter, he's like everyone else is just fine in the room, but he's got like a front row view to the weird baby demon that's slowly melting, you said her name's not Lisa, was it?

SPEAKER_08 1:21:24

Oh god, uh Kelly, I think.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:28

Um it's I like that his his plan to get out of the room as he tries to res the possessed baddies by being both racist and anti-Semitic in the one joke. And somehow that doesn't work.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:48

It's obvious obviously it doesn't work.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:52

Do you not think maybe the power of anti-Semitism and racism at once may have shocked them back to life?

SPEAKER_07 1:21:59

Yeah, no, he he also similarly gets frustrated when it doesn't work. He doesn't seem to understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:08

He's like, This works with every other woman. Why doesn't it work now?

SPEAKER_06 1:22:12

Why not?

SPEAKER_02 1:22:13

This is a a 100% success rate in the 80s.

SPEAKER_07 1:22:20

My uh my roommate related this movie to Sphere, which I think is a good relation.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:27

I have yet to say I've got sphere somewhere. I picked it up going, this is a Chris movie, he's going to want to talk about this shit. I've never seen it before in my life, but I could tell with like it's space, it's 2000, it looks a little cheap, and there was a lot of men on the front cover. I will say it's not space, it's underwater. Okay, well, it's spiritually a space movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:22:57

Yeah, no, I'm not trying to sizzling you, I'm not trying to argue with you.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:02

You're sizzling me? What do you plan for sphere? Are we gonna do or could you all right?

SPEAKER_07 1:23:07

We should do a Krichton thing at some point. I don't particularly love sphere. I think it's watchable and fun, but it's not one of my favorites.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:17

But I also hear the book is No, you're you're missing the point here. Tell me geometry theme. Okay, you can watch sphere, you have triangle, yeah, and you have cube.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:32

What else? What's another shape? Is there a rectangle horror?

SPEAKER_07 1:23:38

Interesting. Rhombus. There's gotta be a one parallelogram, the horror movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:48

Is there a horror? I could see that making that could be a thing. Parallelogram. That seems like a sci-fi horror.

SPEAKER_07 1:23:58

But the one with the pointing.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:00

Mobius strip? There could be a horror sci-fi called the Mobius strip.

SPEAKER_07 1:24:06

That's true.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:08

Well depends what we count as.

SPEAKER_07 1:24:09

So if we're only working in two and three dimensions, pi is technically like representative of a circle as a number, right? And there's a movie called Pi. Shape of water?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:32

You could also just do cube too.

SPEAKER_07 1:24:35

Yeah, that's true. Hypercube.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:38

Just another cube.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:40

It's about a different type of thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:43

By not making the third cube called cube cubed. Like it's right there.

SPEAKER_08 1:24:50

Why'd they have to do a prequel?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:53

But it's like it's but even then you could still just do cube cubed.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:59

You could.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:00

But then but what is what is the cube of cubes?

SPEAKER_04 1:25:04

Because you can't really cubed.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:06

You can't multiply cube on itself three times without knowing the variables of the cube.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:14

So it would be the ninth cube.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:18

Why are you assuming a cube is a three?

SPEAKER_07 1:25:21

27. It would be the 27th cube cubed, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:27

Cube cubed would be but why are we assuming that a cube is a three? Is it because there's three cube movies? So having cube cubed would imply cube 27?

SPEAKER_07 1:25:38

Yeah, I I guess I'm I'm wondering because I'm I'm using math logic. But surely then if cube is the meaning of the number of the movie that it is already, then cubing it would be multiplying it by the number that it already is, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:01

Yeah, but okay, but hyper but say you're starting with you're you've got the basis, but cube equals three, and then you're doing three cubed, but the problem is that would then mean cube 27. But once you move over to cube four before you can get to cube cubed, you've then upped the numbers of what x slash cube equals. Yeah, so then that's a higher number.

SPEAKER_07 1:26:26

Yeah. Oh, because we're not using cube as a generic function, we're using cube as a functionary of itself. As a variable function, as a separate variable, yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:39

Well, you got it sorted, you could never make cube cubed.

SPEAKER_07 1:26:44

No, it's unattainable.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:49

Anytime you tried to move closer to cube cubed, it would get bigger.

SPEAKER_07 1:26:53

It's like the end of pi.

SPEAKER_02 1:26:56

It's like one of those v source videos where he's like, he's like, but I feel like this would be a V Source video where he's like, if you tried to make cube cubed, you could never make cube cubed. Because even if you infinitely moved up, technically at one point, if it's infinite, you should be able to hit the number that cube cubed would be, but also cube cubed would move infinitely higher as you go along. So you then end up with a stranger's cat to circle it back to this film where it's both a thing that would need to happen and never happen if you made infinite cube films.

SPEAKER_07 1:27:31

It's always too late.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:34

It's always too late and too early.

SPEAKER_07 1:27:36

Yeah, at the same time. Oh my god. We're in a cube cubed super state. Why can't Walter understand Schrödinger's cat?

SPEAKER_02 1:27:47

Yeah, he's in like university for like theoretical physics and philosophy.

SPEAKER_07 1:27:53

Doesn't get it, he's trying to become a millionaire by forty.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:58

And like the big Bang theory explained it to children and they understand it.

SPEAKER_07 1:28:04

Exactly. It's not that hard to understand.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:07

And before you're situations.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:10

Oh go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:11

Yeah. It's not like. See, you ever seen the the paradox where it's if a barber cuts everyone's hair in town, who cuts the barber's hair? Because he's the barber. And if there's no other barber in town, how does he cut his hair if he doesn't cut his own hair? Which is a stupid paradox. Because you're like, well, the cunt would just cut his own hair. Like there's not you're not looping on that.

SPEAKER_07 1:28:36

You're not incapable of doing that. It's just hard.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:39

Do you have any other paradox that like upsets you on like a primal level?

SPEAKER_07 1:28:45

That upsets me? No, I I kind of have fun with paradoxes. I like the grandfather sock paradox.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:54

Yeah, but for me, say the grandfather paradox and the bootstrap paradox, both of them work on a basis that time would remain constant even if time travel existed. It wouldn't be able to have variables because you move you're a three-dimensional creature that cannot have access to the fourth-dimensional time plane, so you can't move around it, so you have to move forward in it. So even if you move back and forward, it would still be the same line. But that would imply that all time is happening all at once, and we're just on a part of it. But it would also mean that no matter what you did in time travel, you would always have already done it, and then in which case you don't have free will, you're just stuck in the timeline, which makes time travel pointless.

SPEAKER_07 1:29:40

It makes it boring, yeah. I agree. Except primer is the only thing that's really been able to do that. There's probably a couple other I could think of, but primer's the only one that's been able to make it really interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:29:54

I haven't seen time crimes yet. Although time crimes is supposed to fuck time travel really bad.

SPEAKER_07 1:29:59

Yeah. That's a good friend.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:05

But this is where time travel like this is fun, where it's like, oh, we just figured out how to send a signal faster than the speed of light, but because time moves at that speed it goes backwards. And it's like, oh yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:21

But then the question is, would are these people always destined to survive this movie then? If she survived long enough to get into the future to be able to send back this message to them? Do they ever have a chance of not worrying?

SPEAKER_07 1:30:37

Uh it seems like it, because it seems like the events of the movie change reality in that the as far as I'm aware, we don't know when the original message was sent from. We know that the last message with her as the entity or as the functionary or the representative of anti-god is in 1999. But we don't know, or at least where I rewound to, the one transmission I looked at, it doesn't tell you what year it's from, where we see the image of the anti-god to be sort of a cloaked, almost gargoyle-looking creature, you know, with the robes in the doorway.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:28

So you think in the because this is in the 80s, so 1999's not that far ahead. So do you think originally they lost, but they were able to use the advanced technology of the Jesus Devil race that took over to be able to send that message from 1999 back to be able to stop it ever happening?

SPEAKER_07 1:31:50

Yeah. Yeah, something like that. And then it you know, what's so creepy about the ending is that even through all of that, even it it sort of references the line of the god Plutonium. Like, all of your scientific advances can't save you from what's coming. I will still keep coming, and I'm coming for you. And you are fucked.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:21

This like this time travel bullshittery is like my my bread and butter.

SPEAKER_07 1:32:26

I love it, especially in this movie where it's not overstated, it's very plot relevant, but it's also sprinkled on like a little you know flavor on top.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:42

But like so technically you could put this as a time loop movie then, but it's just you're watching the version where we break the cycle.

SPEAKER_08 1:32:54

I guess so.

SPEAKER_07 1:32:55

Yeah, I I don't think it applies to like the bootstrap paradox or something though, because like you said, the cycle does get broken. So it's definitely a different kind of time travel where they are affecting the future. Because we can see visually, it's not even a supposition. We can see visually that they changed something from happening and now something different is going to happen.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:23

I wonder if they've just delayed it or if this is like they've sorted the issue. I'd imagine it's just a delay if it's hypothetically just I wouldn't even say it's like alien, I'd say it's like extra-dimensional.

SPEAKER_07 1:33:37

Yeah, I would too. I I think the terms are interchangeable in this movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:43

No, but I feel like the fact that he uses like a mirror is is like the devil uses the way to contact people is through a mirror, which is like the thing that causes light to reflect back, and we have that earlier on in the movie. But these are real things, by the way. I looked them up as an actual thing, an anti-particle. It's strange you don't hear too many people. I think that's what antimatter is made of.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:07

Is it the same as apparently in large amounts? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:11

Yeah, but it seems in like large amounts, if actual matter touches antimatter, it would just like burn into a ball of energy and explode. Which I mean isn't isn't good.

SPEAKER_07 1:34:23

Weird.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:24

It was like I think it was like one milligram of like pure antimatter is like the equivalent of 47 blocks of TNT. Holy shit. It's like we say if a human touches it, and in which case of like, well, if you could make a couple of grams in it, how many people would you need to sacrifice to power an entire town for a long time? And at which point is that worth it?

unknown 1:34:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:53

If you just put them in a room and go, I touch this by the way.

SPEAKER_06 1:34:56

If you do that with old people.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:00

Just like sending the old when when they're on their last legs.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:04

Yeah, not just any old people, like, you know, really, like Dr. Sleep old people, like the cat sitting on them.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:14

Yeah, I feel like the cat sitting on you is a lot nicer than Touch Vessen and Plode.

SPEAKER_07 1:35:20

Yeah, very true. Uh, I did want to mention before we get back to Walter in the little cupboard, this character, he's like Burke from Aliens, but totally useless. He's the the money guy they send along with him. I need a character like this in every horror movie where he's I was laughing when he was introduced to the team because they bring him in, he looks at whoever he's talking to, I think one of the random guys, and he goes, What's what's going on? What are we doing? He just doesn't know anything, nobody told him anything, he just showed up.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:00

Yeah, well, I think it depends, because you can use them as like a way to place expository dialogue, but then I think it's more fun to have someone that knows everything and no one else knows anything, and have them explain it to everyone else.

SPEAKER_07 1:36:19

True, yeah. I just think it's when I want to see it more than every movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:26

I like a dumbass, but I feel like in both of those scenarios you get the same outcome. But one of them goes, Okay, this character is insanely smart, and you should pay attention to them. And then the other one goes, This one's a fucking dumbass, and you just should ignore them throughout the rest of the movie.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:43

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:36:46

Okay, so we're at our boy, he's watching the demon pregnancy, and this is she's like a gender-bent Freddy Kruger. Well, at least he's looking rough as fuck. Very frank from Hellraiser as well, like incredibly frank from Hellraiser.

SPEAKER_07 1:37:02

It really is, yeah. It looks familiar.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:08

He starts to get attacked, which is when they burst through the wall, almost prison break style, to try and help them. And my god, see see this poor this poor woman. I get that she's a demon, but when she's trying to grab water through the wall and they just pummel her in the head with two bricks, ow! You just beat the living fucking shit out of her. It's not even to like a funny, it's just like a oh but then okay. This one, this this one demon woman, she's so hard to kill that they beat her with bricks for like two minutes, and then she's fine. They have to kick her out the window to kill her, and then the second one comes through and he fucking he like one tap backflips her out of the window.

SPEAKER_07 1:38:05

Like it's not even a oh yeah, they they go right out.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:11

And what did you think about is it Cole that the Asian teacher launches a super chopstick into his eye?

SPEAKER_07 1:38:21

I'm gonna be honest, I missed that on the rewatch.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:25

It's when he's fighting his way into the room, okay, and then the two guys are there with bats ready to beat the shit out of Cole, and one of them gets squirted on, and he's like, ah fuck, I'm turning able. The other one gets beat, and then it turns to the Asian teacher, and he like he he turns into a superhero for a moment and launches a chopstick into his eyeball. Huh. That's just a bit racist now, isn't it?

SPEAKER_07 1:38:53

Yeah, I guess so, when you think about it. Yeah, I I like it conceptually. Well, no, not conceptually, but I like the idea of giving that character like a fun action beat that's a little bit goofy but still helpful.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:09

But it's like he just whips out a single chopstick from no.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:13

Yeah, that's very racist.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:16

I like I I suppose it's the 80s, they were probably it was probably seen more as humorous back then and not just blatantly racist.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:26

Yeah, you have to assume, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:39:30

But you have to hope. I don't know what John Carpenter's like in that aspect.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:34

None of the makeup artists for this worked on Hellraiser as far as I can tell.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:40

That's fucking crazy.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:42

It's so similar.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:45

One of them worked for um worked on To Live and Die in LA two years earlier, one of my favorite movies.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:53

But look, it's not even it's not even the Lisa Frank that is identical. It's also take when Colt stabs himself in the neck with Batwin Paul. It's like the exact same shot as when it's not Frank, Frank's brother in Hellraiser when he's going up the stairs and the nail catches his hand. It's the same shot.

SPEAKER_07 1:40:19

Yeah. I didn't catch that.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:22

That's crazy to me, these aren't the same people at all.

SPEAKER_07 1:40:25

Yeah, I'm really digging into it. Cause I honestly would have not even I've been surprised, but it would have made sense to me that they just use the same stuff on both movies to make it easier.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:41

I was low-key expecting for you to say, oh, it's the same company, and they both had similar script helpers. Considering it's both religious body horror with a dead guy that comes back to life with a warning called Frank, and both of them end with a very kruger look-alike melted person that's trying to bring demons back from hell.

SPEAKER_07 1:41:05

Yeah, it's it's fascinating that they came out in the same year within a month of each other, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:17

Oh fuck, so it was like uh an immaculate first omen situation that we got last year.

SPEAKER_06 1:41:24

Oh yeah, yeah, I guess so. Yeah, it's just fascinating, honestly.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:32

But yeah, okay, so I don't I don't get how Lisa is bringing the devil through. I get that it's something to do with mirrors. I don't know why she's fingering her palate to bring the devil through.

SPEAKER_07 1:41:48

It's not big enough.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:50

It's not she can't.

SPEAKER_07 1:41:52

So I think she's she's sort of like, you know, she knows what's up, she knows you finger it, and you could get it there, but then she gets frustrated too quickly. She just decides to go find something better.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:04

So she thinks is this a window or is this a mirror? It's a mirror, I assume she's in front of, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:42:10

It's a mirror.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:12

It's a mirror, and she she's done with just two fingers, she she rams the full fist and and I love sometimes it's what they want. Sometimes that's what they want. But this Antichrist, okay, it's a little it's a little votted, like fleshy person. And then the devil's hand is the buffest, beefiest, brightest. I fucking love it.

SPEAKER_07 1:42:38

Oh my god, what a great idea to model just a hand for the devil.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:43

And the fact that that's the size of his arm, you know that motherfucker was massive.

SPEAKER_07 1:42:49

Oh my god, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:52

But the thing is, if he's just like a technologically involved human, could they also hypothetically just beat him with bricks when he walked through the door?

SPEAKER_07 1:43:02

That's true. If he's but if he's small enough to fit through that mirror.

SPEAKER_04 1:43:08

Okay, the house in on him.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:11

Or like there must be sharp objects in that building. There must have been some like I feel like visually he would have been very threatening, but canon-wise, he's probably kind of easy to beat because like Jesus was one of those people and they beat him by slapping him on a wooden board.

SPEAKER_07 1:43:32

Jesus was like the equivalent to the the lady pulling him through the mirror, though. This is anti-God, not anti-Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:45

I suppose but Jesus came from the heavens, basically. So I'd imagine he's one of these type of people.

SPEAKER_07 1:43:54

And that's confusing because Jesus is God in Christian theology.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:58

But I was gonna say that Jesus is God, and the Antichrist isn't Satan, but he's uh uh like an indication of the end times. He's not the beginning. See, I took it that he was, I took it as like they're sort of like we're just part of like this weird alien race.

SPEAKER_07 1:44:22

Interesting. Cause I have to assume that whatever God is is something bigger and scarier because it has to be equivalent to whatever Satan is.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:34

Okay, but say say a little and that's how Jesus was created. If there was a big spaceship that brought him here, and there was more of those people in it, would people 2000 years ago in the Middle East see that and be like, okay, that's that's the little guy, and there might be a big guy up in there. Especially if he's like, Oh, that's my dad up there. You're the little one.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:09

You're the little one.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:12

You're the kind that caused that flood a few hundred years ago.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:16

Let's beat him to death.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:17

That's why the Romans were so pissed. Come back. That's why God left Jesus to die for a few weeks and then came back. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:27

Yeah. It's like when you force your kid to smoke all the cigarettes in a pack.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:37

I've never had to do that, Chris.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:40

No, me neither, but I've heard about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:43

No, that's a thing. What's that from? You've like awakened a memory, you know, what's that from? That's from some movie.

SPEAKER_07 1:45:50

Yeah, it is. I don't remember what.

SPEAKER_02 1:45:54

But uh yeah, so Junge sees the shit going down and she's like, Okay, I'm not I'm not having any of this. She wrote.

SPEAKER_07 1:46:03

We're right at the end, right? We're at at the very end of everything. She doesn't just say I'm not having any of this. This is one of my favorite moments of self-sacrifice in a movie because she notices what's going on. She starts stopping uncontrollably, realizing the stakes of what's happening. And then my favorite part of this, something that I can't think of ever seeing in another movie, is she like looks around to see who else can sacrifice themselves. Not in a selfish way at all, just like not even processing it that way, just seeing what other pieces are on the game board, noticing that she's the only person who's indisposed, noticing that this is the only moment she can act. She returns to sobbing uncontrollably, and then she starts screaming and just channels all of that energy into rage and sprints full force towards the Antichrist and the mirror and launches her in like a linebacker. And then this final shot of her disappearing into the darkness on the other side of the mirror is so, so scary.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:32

But it does back up my fact that you probably could just beat the shit out of the devil since you rugby tackled him.

SPEAKER_07 1:47:41

Yeah, I I don't see it that way because it's I see it like the devil was still stuck in quicksand, in devil quicksand. Because it was just his like little pinky finger that was out pretty much.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:54

Yeah, but it's in like water, so is he in like his own reddit double cum ja?

SPEAKER_07 1:48:00

I think it I think that's just an incredible visual, which I love so much. But I think it was just a smart, cheap visual. Is hey, let's film a body of water. I don't think it's literally supposed to be interpreted as being the viscosity of water. You know, like the surface tension, it clearly is the way that it interacts with the surface. But I I think you're supposed to imagine it almost like molasses.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:34

Uh I I get you, I get you. But okay, the one thing I'll give this self-sacrifice thing that I do really like about it, it's her character isn't set up to be the self-sacrifice. Like you'll watch any other movie, and within the first 20 minutes you'll go, Okay, that character has an arc, and to complete that arc, they have to die saving other people. And you you know how it works, and it's just the movie building to it. But for her, it's just she's in the room, and she goes, Well, I either die now or we all die later, so fuck it, I have to do it.

SPEAKER_07 1:49:13

It's not like uh that's what it's such a such an incredible moment cinematically, is that it's unremarkable, basically. It's uh like the sacrifice of a hero in a moment isn't theatrical, it isn't you know, like the end of a Star Wars movie. It's just a a really horrible decision being made in a split second.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:40

It feels like have you ever seen like I I don't know how how rough growing up in New York was, but you ever seen like your friend getting his ass beat in a fight, and you've looked around and been like, ah fuck, I guess it's me, it's jumping in to help him.

SPEAKER_07 1:49:55

No, I've never been in a fight. Well, that's not true. I got into fights in middle school. But it also is true that I've never been in a real fight.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:04

Yeah, but even in middle school, you never seen like one of your friends getting their ass beat, and you're like, oh no, I have to I have to stop this altercation right now and it's only needs. I was in a lucky position that I could be with the weirdo kids, but I was also kind of cool with the the like the asshole bully kids. So if I saw one of the asshole bully kids smacking fuck out of the little nerdy one that had to be I was like, okay, I'm getting I'm jumping into this and I'm stopping this.

SPEAKER_07 1:50:33

Shit. No, I didn't figure out how to play both sides until I got into high school.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:40

Uh technically, well, usually it's crime. See if you just perform crime in front of the the bully kids, they're like, oh yeah, he's sound. You perform what? Just any form of crime. Anything.

unknown 1:50:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_07 1:50:55

I was wondering if you're saying grime or crime.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:58

Yeah, I need to wipe out some London rap music. Yeah, exactly. Well, they kind of come hand in hand, don't they?

SPEAKER_07 1:51:06

That's true.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:09

I've had it being bullied. I show up to school the next day in like a north-based body warmer. Like a cap.

SPEAKER_07 1:51:19

But yeah, I suppose that's I feel like that's half of those songs, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:51:26

Is this why I really don't like grime music? Because there's there's I hate people that go over there's no variety of rap, it's just women, drugs, and guns. No, that's what grime is. That is just what grime is.

SPEAKER_07 1:51:38

That's what the genre thing to reference. I don't really legitimi well, I mean, all music is legitimate, but I think it's bad.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:46

And then people go, Oh well, what about Dave or Lil Sims? And it's like, no, they're they're London rappers. They rap with an English accent, but they're not grimmed musicians.

SPEAKER_07 1:51:59

Yeah, you don't have to associate everything. Uh so we have Donald Pleasance throws an axe at the fucking mirror with one arm and breaks it. Incredible.

SPEAKER_04 1:52:12

Great, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:52:16

But um like with her through the portal, wouldn't that big tin have moved anyway and he could have just briskly walked over to it?

SPEAKER_07 1:52:26

Yeah, I think he's being overly dramatic.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:30

He's like, she had her hero moment. It's my turn now, even though no one can see this.

SPEAKER_07 1:52:36

Yeah, I think he knows there's no risk because if he misses it or if it just falls down, he can walk over and hit it manually. It's like when you just try to throw in a crumpled up napkin into the garbage, but you probably are gonna have to walk over and pick it up and put it in anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:53

Oh shit, the worst thing. See, when you're at work and you you've thrown something into the bin 500 times in front of people, perfectly fine, but every single time you throw it and you miss, you feel like the most embarrassing cunt on the game. That slow walk over to the bin, then having to bend over like a fucking dog taking a shit next to it to pick up that bit of paper.

SPEAKER_07 1:53:21

Especially with the sanitizer rags where I work. Because I'm 99% of the time can just toss them into the bucket from 10 feet away, but every so often they'll end on the floor, and then you have to go all the way into the back to clean them and then put them with the rest of the dirty ones.

SPEAKER_02 1:53:40

See, it fucks me up in work because it happens about three times a day if I'm doing the security tagging, because I work on the shoes, and how it works is I'll get them in, I'll separate them by gender, because for some reason we gender the shoes, even though they're the same size as each other. But I I separate them using totes, so I tend to just chuck them. But the problem is if the rubber hits the side of the tote, it's just gonna bounce back out. So I can throw it 19 out of 20 times, it's gonna go in the fucking thing, but that every 20th shoe just goes boing and flies across the room, and then you look like the twat that tried to show off by throwing the fucking shoe.

SPEAKER_06 1:54:23

Great.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:26

It's fucking it's so weird that as adults there's still like those little things that's it's so childish, but you're like, I fucking hate myself every time it happens.

SPEAKER_07 1:54:38

Yeah, yeah. I'm trying to think of any others that work, but I definitely have those. There's stuff I just like doing. I've recently gotten into flipping the shakers around like a bartender, flaring basically.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:50

Oh, I used to do that when I worked at my my dessert shop. I would do it with everything. See the cans of squirty cream? Great to do it because what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_07 1:54:58

I've been doing it with the whipped cream cans for three years. I love it so much.

SPEAKER_02 1:55:02

And it's good because it helps the cream.

SPEAKER_07 1:55:04

That's true. That's really true. Yeah, it rates.

SPEAKER_02 1:55:08

But see, I wouldn't try it with like a frappy. You'll be making a mess.

SPEAKER_08 1:55:12

Well, not with the frap cup.

SPEAKER_02 1:55:15

Have you ever G if you're doing delivery in New York? Do you do the thing where you like clean film the plastic cups really tight so liquid can't come out during the delivery?

SPEAKER_07 1:55:29

No, it's all very standardized for us, which makes it stressful for me thinking about how they get to the customer, but also like we can just not worry about it. We uh we have the standard size bags for how many items, and then we put the drink tray in. Put the drink sweeper little sticker on the top of the lids, give them straws, tape them up, send them out. That's it.

SPEAKER_02 1:55:56

Yeah. Over here if you're getting like a if it's a particularly pair, I think it's just because speed bumps are so fucked in Glasgow, they'll always cling film the shit out of the top of cups. Just to stop like I feel like you probably could flip those. Oh, I'm just I'm fucking getting flashbacks and then I used to be in my dessert place, and if I was like in a rush, I would just grab like the cups for like Sundays and milk and I could just flip them and let them land on the table as I was running around with different things. Oh, I used to be so sauced. What happened to me? I can't even saw a shoe in a tub.

SPEAKER_08 1:56:33

You gotta get it back, it's all practice.

SPEAKER_02 1:56:35

Like that, how am I supposed to flip shoes? They're all different weights.

SPEAKER_04 1:56:43

You just gotta get the skill issue.

SPEAKER_02 1:56:46

Yeah, but when I try and get better and I embarrass myself and then I go, I'm never doing this ever again.

SPEAKER_07 1:56:51

Yeah, that is that's the thing, is I'm having such a good time flipping the shakers and I'm getting better at it. I know something's gonna spill and I'm gonna be so sheepish about it and never do it again.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:02

Or you'll do it with the squirty cream and it will be like the pressurized can't get dented and it'll make a pshh when all the airs are.

SPEAKER_07 1:57:09

Oh my god, thank god nothing's broken. I have dropped three four four cans in my three years of the whipped cream while I'm flipping it, doing whatever else. I like flipping it sideways, like around my hand.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:25

You ever do you okay, this is a weird question, but you get like ice drinks in that, don't you?

SPEAKER_08 1:57:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:32

Do you ever have machines that require like the giant pressurized metal canisters? Like the big huge four foot ones?

SPEAKER_07 1:57:41

No, I don't know what that means.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:43

Imagine like a helium tank, but like four foot tall.

SPEAKER_07 1:57:48

That's scary. What is that for? I mean we have like a cold brew keg and that gets pressurized.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:56

It's we we'd use them for you get tangled ice blasts in America.

SPEAKER_07 1:58:00

I don't know what that is.

SPEAKER_02 1:58:02

It's like imagine a slushy but rather than crushed ice, it's like it's liquid with so much um air pushed into it, it makes it fluffy. So it's super super super light.

SPEAKER_07 1:58:15

No, that doesn't sound familiar.

SPEAKER_02 1:58:18

Oh, I had one of those forward work one day, because they're supposed to get chained up against the wall, and some stupid cunt hadn't chained it properly. So when I walk past my arse hit into it, and it fell and the top of it kicked off, and it was like the worst scream you've ever seen in their big thick metal cans. So you had trying to get everyone like get to fucking cover in case this thing fucking blows up. But the thing is, human beings are stupid, so they'll hear a giant metal can screaming of pressurized air, and they'll look around the corner at it. It's like one of the most stressful situations because it'll go off for like 10 minutes, and you just have to wait and cover hoping you don't blow up.

SPEAKER_07 1:59:00

That sounds about right, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:03

But anyway, that's that's Prince of Darkness.

SPEAKER_07 1:59:06

That's Prince of Darkness, you guys. Uh I love this movie. This is it just has such a good sense of dread building up through everything.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:19

Yeah, I had fun with it. Again, I feel I'd like it more in a rewatch once I I know the vibe of what I'm getting in.

SPEAKER_07 1:59:25

Yeah, you know, take a a year or two away from it. Get your sound system set up to fork cake and settle in with some like renewed expectations and let yourself forget a couple things. This is my favorite John Carpenter movie, even though it's maybe the one I watched the most recently for the first time, besides a couple of his bad ones. Which I think he maybe only has one bad, bad movie. Well, the it's a conversation we can get into. Since he does all horror movies, I'd like to discuss his career in general in the future.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:06

We need to go film, but we'd have to, like, that's like a good three months worth of just John Carpenter, is it not?

SPEAKER_07 2:00:12

Yeah, no, I I don't want to do it in a month or in a row. I don't think that is helpful, but it he'll be fun to talk about as we do his movies. I love almost all of his movies, so I'll have a good time just doing them and then bringing up where they are in his career. Just checking up on it.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:31

So what do we have? We have we have this Prince of Darkness, we have Halloween one and two, we have the thing, Halloween.

SPEAKER_07 2:00:40

Halloween two he is a script writer on, but he didn't direct.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:46

Yeah, but he was on set, was he not? So he's not gonna be a good one.

SPEAKER_07 2:00:48

Yeah, that's true. Okay, yeah, you're right. Um Prince of Darkness, the thing, Mouth of Madness.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:54

Mouth of Madness. Mouth of Madness also Lovecraft, that's more like HP Lovecraft sort of Lovecraft, and that's not as re-animator as this.

SPEAKER_07 2:01:09

That one I also grade five stars. I think the thing as well. I can't tell you if I think Prince of Darkness or Mouth of Madness is a better movie. I like Prince of Darkness more, but I think they're equivalent and potentially Mouth of Madness is the better movie.

SPEAKER_02 2:01:26

Mouth of Madness is um shit, they come from Jurassic Park and Possession. Island Grand?

SPEAKER_07 2:01:33

Sam Neil.

SPEAKER_02 2:01:37

But that's more like that's more of your elder god tentacle like love.

SPEAKER_07 2:01:42

This movie does not have a Sam Neil in it, unfortunately. It doesn't have like that one killer cast member.

SPEAKER_02 2:01:52

Give me the rundown of Mouth of Badness. What's like the synopsis of it?

SPEAKER_07 2:01:56

Okay, you haven't seen Mouth of Badness. Awesome. Um, I haven't. Ooh, that's so cool. Okay, so you're gonna like you're gonna you're gonna like the rundown of it. Uh Samuel plays, I believe, a private investigator hired to find a writer who has gone missing. The writer is named Sutter Kane, based on Stephen King, who has written this big fucking novel recently that everyone is going crazy over. And he is going to find this missing author. I don't want to say too much. Similarly to this, I feel like a lot of it is in how it plays out.

SPEAKER_02 2:02:39

Is it like Alan Wake, how he's basically Stephen King, and everyone's going crazy over the book that he wrote recently?

SPEAKER_04 2:02:48

A little bit.

SPEAKER_02 2:02:49

Interesting. Oh, that's interesting.

SPEAKER_04 2:02:52

I think you'll like it.

SPEAKER_02 2:02:54

I think you need to finish control so we can discuss Alan Wake too. Because if we're talking Lovecraft and we talk Twin Peaks, and I'm getting into Stephen King stuff, there's a lot of shit that I keep going to say, but you haven't played Alan Wake 2.

SPEAKER_07 2:03:11

Oh, yeah, true. Well, alright, yeah, I'll have to do that.

SPEAKER_02 2:03:16

It's so funny like get like going through Stephen King stuff, because almost everything I look at I'm like, that's Alan Wake. Oh wait, that's in control. Oh wait, that's this.

SPEAKER_07 2:03:26

Shit, okay, yeah. I'll make sure to finish it.

SPEAKER_02 2:03:30

Like, see, you you've got to the bit and oh, you must have been control where she keeps going to like the little motel and you need to keep fucking about with lights to like change.

SPEAKER_04 2:03:41

Very twin.

SPEAKER_02 2:03:42

But it feels very similar. It's very twin peaks, but it also feels similar to Dr. Sleep when he's being Dr. Sleep and he has these corridors of patients that he visits. I was like, oh, Slash has nothing in control.

SPEAKER_08 2:03:55

Huh.

SPEAKER_07 2:03:57

Uh just to run down Carpenter, The Fog, I think would be interesting to talk about. I think it it's my least favorite of his decent movies. Uh Christine, I think, is well directed, even if it's not a great movie. Um there's a TV movie I do want to talk about sometime called Someone's Watching Me. The pitch I would give you is what if John Carpenter directed Halloween, but it's set in a city instead of in the suburbs.

SPEAKER_02 2:04:30

Oh, so a slasher.

SPEAKER_07 2:04:33

It I wouldn't say it's a full-on slasher. It's more of a suspense movie. Because it is a TV movie, so it's even a smaller budget. But I love what it does with instead of the suburban suspense of you know, nobody trusts each other even though everyone acts like they trust each other, like something is wrong. There's this with the city aspect of it, there's this just like you get lost in the noise of everything. Like nobody's noticing what's happening with you just because there's so much happening. It's not the quiet unease anymore, which I find really interesting. And I I relate to, I think it's a good rendition of living in a city.

SPEAKER_02 2:05:18

Um, I wouldn't mind doing a carpenter theme month, because I'm again I'm missing lots of them.

SPEAKER_07 2:05:24

And I do want to do some They Live is so good.

SPEAKER_02 2:05:29

I see again, that's a film that I've seen, but I was so young that it's like just nothing is retained.

SPEAKER_07 2:05:34

Vampires is not really good, but there's great practical effects in it.

SPEAKER_02 2:05:44

I mean I can carry I can carry a film from it. Depends how good they are.

SPEAKER_07 2:05:48

There's some great vampire stuff in it. Ghosts of Mars is bad, but what wouldn't don't don't want to watch uh Ice Cube, uh Jason Statham and Natasha Henry Stridge fighting ghost aliens on zombies on Mars?

SPEAKER_02 2:06:11

Yeah, that sounds kind of sick.

SPEAKER_04 2:06:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 2:06:14

To like new metal music.

SPEAKER_02 2:06:17

I don't know if that hams it up too much though. I think it depends on the band.

SPEAKER_07 2:06:22

It definitely hams it. It's like not it's nobody. I think it definitely hams it out too much.

SPEAKER_08 2:06:27

Who else is in it?

SPEAKER_07 2:06:29

Um uh Jackie Brown, what's her name?

SPEAKER_02 2:06:34

Oh, I know, I know who you mean.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:36

Yeah, she's in it too.

SPEAKER_02 2:06:39

I mean, if I mean we could just go for like if you want to.

SPEAKER_07 2:06:46

Is the other one that I needed to mention. I think that's the last. That one's a remake.

SPEAKER_02 2:06:51

I mean, if you want to continue doing themes, obviously I want to do King, but I feel like director theming is good. Because not only is it comparable with the other things that we've done, but it's also like you can you can compare where they were as a filmmaker and let them stay prominent throughout their work.

SPEAKER_07 2:07:13

I like that aspect of the Veeamonths the most is that we it gives us a sort of baseline to compare everything and gives us an angle to compare at analytically. So we're not just kind of shooting in the dark with everything.

SPEAKER_02 2:07:33

Okay, then back to theme monks will go. Carpenter will be somewhere within a carpenter theme play. We don't need to make wordplay. Wordplay I think is causing us more issues and it's helping.

SPEAKER_07 2:07:43

You think it's hanging us up too much? We we can still throw it in where we like it, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:07:49

If we can find one and put it in, and if we can't, fuck it.

SPEAKER_07 2:07:53

Yeah, John Carpenter month at some point.

SPEAKER_02 2:07:56

John Month at the beginning of C. Um Carpenter, I like Oh fuck. Recommendations. Who would we recommend this film to? Who what films if people liked would they like this film? I would say Reanimator is definitely one.

SPEAKER_07 2:08:21

That's a good one. If they only like new horror movies, they're not gonna like this.

SPEAKER_02 2:08:33

Weirdly, I think if someone likes heretic, they'll fuck with it.

SPEAKER_07 2:08:37

It's got very similar like religious conversations. Religious fans. If you have a religious friend or someone who's has like really religious parents, they're probably gonna like this movie.

SPEAKER_02 2:08:50

Yeah, if you've got someone who's a Catholic in your life and you really want to offend them.

SPEAKER_07 2:08:54

Yeah. No, someone who's I don't want to say struggling with it. I I don't want you to capitalize on their strife, but somebody who maybe is a reformed Catholic or something like that. Because, you know, as as one myself, it does help the perspective of the movie.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:14

Because I'm trying to think, because you see people that like religious horror, but I love religious horror, but I feel like this takes the skin of a religious horror, but doesn't like it doesn't draw parallels properly to things in religious texts in the way that I see like even with fucking the new One Piece season where I'm like, oh, this is this is thematically a retelling of the book of Enoch, and I can draw comparisons. This isn't that, this is God is good, the devil is bad, and the church likes to lie.

SPEAKER_07 2:09:53

Honestly, it's only amplified by being someone who has forsaken faith, is the idea that it was a lie or a fabrication because nobody would believe the actual thing it was trying to tell you, and it has been trying to warn you of something. So as somebody who doesn't believe the tenets of Christianity or Catholicism on the basis that they are not realistic or believable enough for me, and I also don't want to believe that that's what forms our basis of reality. You know, like the idea that not digging deep enough into it doomed humanity is interesting to me. That's really scary. Uh that you like picked something for your own comfort and by deciding not to actually investigate it far enough and you know, dedicating yourself to the secret cult of humanity and trying to get a message out, you've contributed to dooming everybody.

SPEAKER_02 2:10:59

Well, there we go, Prince of Darkness. Um I love it. Next week? Oh, we've got we've got a long boy with fucking Brotherhood of the Wolf. I'm going Director's Cut.

SPEAKER_07 2:11:12

I'm fucking excited. I gotta go with Director's Cut also. Would this one have been a Girthy boy?

SPEAKER_02 2:11:19

Is that what this last one was? Oh this is uh this is a big Girthy boy, and it's Gans, and I'm praying it's good because if I if I don't like it, almost three hours of bad Gans is gonna be uh you could liken it to fucking hell. It's gonna be. No, I won't I'll give him a chance for I walked out of the new Silent Hill movie, and I don't usually walk out of movies.

SPEAKER_06 2:11:48

That's crazy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:11:50

Anything anything he makes I'll watch because I like him. I don't think he makes good movies, but I think he likes making movies. And I think he likes what he makes. And I think that's you can tell when you watch his stuff. Like there's heart in everything he does, but everything he does is still bad. And I find it very endearing. But it's not like But like there's there's some good stuff. It's not like you're watching a The Room where it's someone tried really hard and it's fucking abysmal dog shit. He cle like he can make a film, he can do it. He just can't make a good one. He needs a better crew, it seems like.

SPEAKER_07 2:12:33

He just doesn't get the right people working with him all the time. Like Silent Hill, he had a fantastic cinematographer, and that it shows that that helped him realize a bit more of it.

SPEAKER_02 2:12:46

Yeah, and then he had returned to Silent Hill, where he doesn't leave it at that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 2:12:57

Well find us at the Uncanny Valley Pod at Instagram. You can email us at the UncandyValleypodcast at gmail.com. Email in, let us know your thoughts, we'll read them out. Tell us what you think of Brotherhood or the Wolf. We can read it out next week. Suggest something. Suggest a whole themed month. If it's a good idea, we'll do it. If it's not a good idea, we'll make fun of you on here.

SPEAKER_02 2:13:22

Yay.

SPEAKER_07 2:13:24

Have a good night.