The Uncanny Valley
Regular discussion of horror media. Movies, shows, books - we'll cover it all. Pack a bag, put on some shoes you don't mind getting messy, and join us in The Uncanny Valley.
The Uncanny Valley
UV32- In The Mouth Of Madness
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Join charlie and chris enthralled in Sutter Cane's newest masterpiece but as the pages keep turning and the scares keep building how far will will they survive before they fall into the mouth of madness?
Yes. As we walk through the uncanny valley of death, we shall fear no evil. For I am medieval The Uncanny Valley.
SPEAKER_05Today we're here talking about the mouth of madness. In the mouth of madness.
SPEAKER_03In the mouth of madness. You got you got your inner marker player out for the end.
SPEAKER_05Alright, we're here talking today about In the Mouth of Madness, directed by John Carpenter, starring Sam Neal. This is a great movie. This is a fantastic movie. What do you think about this? I've said it objectively, I'm saying, not my opinion. And then I'm asking for your opinion.
SPEAKER_03I gave it okay. I gave it a free star.
SPEAKER_05No.
SPEAKER_03Only because I could I still don't know if this is a good movie or a bad movie.
SPEAKER_05It's a great movie.
SPEAKER_03And I think over time I'm just coming to the conclusion. I don't think I like Sam Neil.
SPEAKER_05He's doing a bad accent in this movie. I don't know what he's trying to do in this movie, but they should have just let him be British.
SPEAKER_03For those that care, it's was 265 days.
SPEAKER_04Alright. That's less than I would have hoped for.
SPEAKER_03Nah.
SPEAKER_05The fans cheer it, he's his annual thing.
SPEAKER_03It is. Even what once it was just for like an an eye issue, he had like bad pink eye or something, so he took a selfie in the hospital.
SPEAKER_04What's he doing to give himself bad pink eye?
SPEAKER_03I don't know, maybe drowning himself in like the most blood that's ever been on a film set ever.
SPEAKER_04Uh well.
SPEAKER_03Okay, I'm pulling up in the mouth of madness because as I said, I have no notes.
SPEAKER_05My first note is is he doing a British accent?
SPEAKER_03No, Chris, that fucked me up so bad. Sam Neil, he is British, yes.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, he's uh he's Australian. He might be Australian.
SPEAKER_03He's from New Zealand. But okay, see, but that's what was weirding me out.
SPEAKER_05Oh, I'm gonna be hung for for saying he's Australian. Right, he's New Zealand.
SPEAKER_03See if see if you go to deliver a parcel number five on the lane and you accidentally drop off at number six, no one calls it's a fuss. We just pass it over. Holy shit, he's 78 years old. But no, Joe, that's what I came to when I was watching it. I was like, okay, I can't tell if he's supposed to be British or American. And then it hit me. Every single movie that Sam Neil's ever done, he always speaks slightly British, and it doesn't work for him or his face, or for the most part, any of the roles that he is in.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, they should just click Hunt for the Wilder people, he is amazing, and then he's just being himself.
SPEAKER_03See, that's not I'll give you a rundown on my Sam Neil movies. I know Bicentennial man, I know the movie that we just watched, I know Jurassic Park, and I know see this is this is the hot take. He's fucking ass in possession, he's dog shit in that movie. It's like a Tommy Wise old level acting job.
SPEAKER_05I haven't seen Possession, but I I had a bolt of lightning go through my brain and got really confused when I was trying to remember who he played in Obsession.
SPEAKER_00Well, he's Bear, did you not see it?
SPEAKER_05Oh fuck, it was Bear. Oh, you're so right.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, after he escaped the dinosaurs, him and uh he got a little bit too close to Laura Dern. Oh, that'd be such a good remake. And then oh Jeff Goldblum as just his dickhead douchebag mate.
SPEAKER_04Oh yeah. They shouldn't make that.
SPEAKER_03See, I feel like, but see, that's the I feel that's the level of acting that Samuel has. It would be shitty parody movies with his friends. I don't think Batman can act, and I'm tired, I'm tired of the gaslighting that comes around with people going, Oh, he's such a good actor. He's in some you know, he I don't know how he's like free-stood himself into becoming like a national treasure.
SPEAKER_05I like Samuel.
SPEAKER_03He's cast with people that are infinite, he's cast with Laura Dern and then fucking Isabella Jarry in possession.
SPEAKER_05Something might shed light on it though, where I mean, first he started in I think he did start in an Australian movie about uh a guy in Australia who helps get the Apollo 11 launch televised, something like that. But he also started his career as a director. John Carpenter actually talked about it in the commentary. He said that Sam Neil helped him with one shot, like get an overhead shot, because he started his career as a documentary director.
SPEAKER_03Are you thinking about the movie where a farm uses sheep to telegraph the Yes.
SPEAKER_05What the fuck is this movie? I haven't seen it, but I know that's the one.
SPEAKER_03And why does Is the movie poster for black sheep a parody of this movie? Hold on. I don't know. Sam Neil's not Black Sheep, is he? The zombie the zombie sheep movie. Have you ever seen Black Sheep?
SPEAKER_05I'm doing the most janky. I'm gonna have Mouth of Madness playing on my phone over the notes I have.
SPEAKER_03I don't even have it up. I'm bewildered. Chris, I'm gonna send these to you like that.
SPEAKER_05How do you like them, Apples?
SPEAKER_03And I need you to tell me if you believe in the world.
SPEAKER_05Do you wanna start with the framing sequence? I can't hear you at all, I'm realizing now.
SPEAKER_03I've not done anything.
SPEAKER_04There we go. Talk again.
SPEAKER_03I was yapping away and your fucking rude ass was going, hmm. Maybe we should talk about the framing of the movie. As I was as I was talking.
SPEAKER_05I couldn't hear you whatsoever.
SPEAKER_03What the fuck did you last hear? Can't remember at this point. Oh, it still has one month and we're back to fucking what even was that shitty predator movie with the autism?
SPEAKER_05Or back to the predator. Or back to training wheels.
SPEAKER_00No, we should never have took that holiday.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, we really shouldn't have. But we're here, man.
SPEAKER_03Braz, I was trying okay. As I was trying to say to you, you just ignored that I vanished off the face of the earth.
SPEAKER_05You're too busy talking about I was absorbed in my own thoughts.
SPEAKER_03I went, have you seen black sheep? And you went, mmm, and just started talking about something else.
SPEAKER_05That's the last the last thing I heard you say was, is the is the poster of something a parody of this movie? And I said, I have no clue what that is.
SPEAKER_03You'd never seen Black Sheep? Mm-mm. Oh Umbrella been putting out special editions for it. Even as a child, I thought it was trash, but so many people say that it's what is that? It is a movie where have you ever seen Doghouse?
SPEAKER_04What is Doghouse?
SPEAKER_03Okay, I'll give you a rundown. Both of these are like shitty gore zombie comedy movies from the 2000s. Doghouse Annie Dyer and Mickey from Doctor Who. And uh sexist zombie movie where laundry detergent is turning women into zombies. What? And it's a good it's a pretty good movie. It sounds fun. And then Black Sheep is is I think it's supposed to be like an environmentally conscious one. About because you would think if you're going mutant mutant zombie animals, you would go mad cow disease. But they went sheep, presumably for the pun. Chris, look at those fucking posters I think.
SPEAKER_05You've got some parody, isn't it? I'm looking at him. I'm looking at Dog House looks like you'd expect. It looks really stupid and bad, but like it would be fun to watch. I'm looking at black sheep now.
SPEAKER_04You're talking about the no, you're not talking about the Tommy. No, I'll look up the Tommy boy reunion movie.
SPEAKER_00It should come up.
SPEAKER_04Okay, it's not showing me a poster yet.
SPEAKER_03I sang you in Discord.
SPEAKER_05Yes. I'm not looking at I have my phone on fucking do not desert for the podcast. Yeah, it does look like a parody.
SPEAKER_03Oh, this entire thing's then from me going, oh, that's strange. That's a parody poster. And now here we are 10 minutes later, and you went, hmm.
SPEAKER_05Your message did not pop up on my Steam Deck for whatever reason.
SPEAKER_00Maybe I'm just not bad. Maybe I'm just weak.
SPEAKER_03I gotta be doing it, Chris. Fucking we'll just we'll talk about this movie, okay? You want to talk about the framing so bad, go for it.
SPEAKER_05The the framing device, yeah, of uh of the hospital. Which at some point I want to note. Very funny of John Carpenter to say later in the movie when it comes back. He says, and then we have a he loves when he does this, and then we have a movie that sort of finishes where it started, and then he he goes and it reminds me of Invasion of the Body Snatchers. You can't say that about your own movie.
SPEAKER_03Think he can. I feel like he's built up, he always has like an ign- I'm not meaning this in a derogatory way towards the man, but he carries a very ignorant aura about himself. I may I mean it maybe a bit more derogatory nowadays. I feel like back in the day he could have got away with it.
SPEAKER_09I see what you're saying.
SPEAKER_03This is a man who said he scores movies based on vibe.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, and let me tell you, once you're done with this thought, I'll give you another detail that might go towards what you're saying.
SPEAKER_03What do you mean when it's just he's got like a sort of speaking of you may have you skimmed past just a little bit, see the opening credits is the the Sutter Kane books are being printed and that little metal riff over it.
SPEAKER_05Oh, fantastic! Reminded me of uh To Live and Die in LA.
SPEAKER_03See, we were on different vibes. I was thinking when uh J. Jonah Jameson printed the lies about Spider-Man.
SPEAKER_04That was true. Yeah, like that, too. Nice.
SPEAKER_03And then we got that questionable scene with the Chinese woman screaming the Spider-Man song.
SPEAKER_05One of Yeah, whatever. One of the thoughts that John Carpenter shared, which I think you'll appreciate knowing, is he said one of his favorite things. He talked about the end of the movie in the uh in the asylum where he's doing the lightning cues, you know, and the actors can't be talking while they're doing that because the machine makes a lot of noise. So he said one of his uh like so you have to wait until the actors stop talking, and then you can hit the cue, and that's one of my favorite things to have a button on the set. So, like his favorite thing is when the actors stop talking, basically.
SPEAKER_03When the vibe to me, what comes more across is my favorite thing is having a button that I know will make everyone shit themselves simultaneously the second I press it.
SPEAKER_05That also, I think he he seems like he probably played a lot of bad pranks on people.
SPEAKER_03Like, okay, hypothetically, you could conjure a small lightning blast in your flat. You're using it every opportunity you get to horrify someone.
SPEAKER_05That's what that's something else he said. Is he had someone in like a black outfit run past the camera as a jump scare while he did a lightning flash. And he said it's a cheap scare, but or it's a cheap trick, but I love cheap tricks, is what he said. No, at least he's honest about it, you know.
SPEAKER_03He hasn't asked if it's it's like I feel like a lot of his movies are I don't even think it's just the soundtrack alone that he makes off vibe. I really think a lot of his movies he goes in and just vibes shit out for better and for worse.
SPEAKER_05There's one scene that I'll get to that they had to improvise to keep the budget down, which I think was good. Like it came out really well.
SPEAKER_03Chris, you're more knowledgeable in this movie about me. See the screenplay of this, is it a book?
SPEAKER_05Because if a book is a film, it's written by someone very specific who wrote this screenplay and shopped it around for a while. From what I remember, it wasn't a John Carpenter thing, it was uh a screenplay that someone had written with Lovecraftian Lovecraftian vibes, and John Carpenter latched onto it and sort of rewrote it for himself a little bit. I don't think he did a lot of alterations to it beforehand, but I'm not I don't remember that specifically. I've avoided listening to other podcasts or anything on this before we talk about it.
SPEAKER_03Okay, well, I will say I I don't know if you did know this or not, but whilst I was looking up stuff for this movie, I did find on Amazon this movie was novelized as uh the Sutter Kane book like last year. You can buy it on Amazon, and I was like, that's such a Chris item. Why did why isn't Chris told me about this?
SPEAKER_05I want that.
SPEAKER_03It's extremely cool. I don't even like the movie that much, and I want it.
SPEAKER_04I want that. That's cool as fuck. Alright.
SPEAKER_03The movie does have a maybe a birthday gift for myself. If we're going if we're just talking about the asylum right now, I will say. It doesn't feel like John Carpenter directing. It looks very like the the establishing shots at the beginning, very jallow, very colourful, very well boxed in on the frame. I don't know where he pulled that one out of. That's not his usual bag. And then this when the asylum, it feels more like who's who's the curtain-made reanimator and from beyond.
SPEAKER_05I do not remember of him.
SPEAKER_03That guy. The guy, the little nerdy guy. Stork Gordon.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_03I wish I knew what you said there. I'm just gonna keep talking.
SPEAKER_04But it feels more like a Stuart Gordon was the name of the guy.
SPEAKER_03Uh Stuart Gordon, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's such a fucking nerdy name. Yeah, what kind of is he sounds like the alter ego of a superhero. Like you get like the superhero at night and Stuart Gordon by day. Okay, I actually do have the asylum. The asylum is the one thing that I managed to get down before the mic started stressing me out.
SPEAKER_04Please do say.
SPEAKER_03Okay, Chris, when he's getting pulled in, he goes, I'm not insane, I'm not insane. One of the staff go to Sam Neil would make a reference to oh yeah, that's what an insane person would say. I hate that fucking argument. What do you mean? So am I supposed to say I am insane in the insane asylum? Do you know who say that? Insane people. It's such a paradox, but it pisses me off when someone brings up that argument. What the fuck else am I supposed to say? That's like if someone went to court and you said not guilty, and they went, Well, that's what the guilty person would say.
SPEAKER_04Well, that's it's called defense doesn't it doesn't work, does it?
SPEAKER_03You can't so am I supposed to go into court and go, Oh, I'm guilty, and like, see, he's a good heart, he wouldn't have done it. But okay, so we're at we're at the same asylum. What's Sam Neil's name, or am I just gonna keep calling him Sam Neil?
SPEAKER_05Uh I'll look it up right now. Sorry, I was doing a little aside on my phone looking for the the DP who John Carpenter did the uh commentary with that I listened to. A very little bit of I just wasn't they talked a lot about the framing. I I like the color choice stuff, but the framing and the cameras, I'm not, I can't, it doesn't stick in my head. Uh but apparently he just worked with John Carpenter a lot. He didn't do a lot of other stuff. I thought maybe he was the difference in this movie. I'm gonna look through the the crew to see if anyone else had input on the cinematography.
SPEAKER_03Uh Sam Neil's character Italian cinema.
SPEAKER_04Sorry?
SPEAKER_03Because it feels very Italian.
SPEAKER_04I see that, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Can you have you seen Italian home?
SPEAKER_05I have a little bit. There's a a friend I used to have who showed me two or three that I didn't quite pay attention to. Oh for fuck's sake, Chris. John Trent is why we didn't remember his name.
SPEAKER_03I'm just gonna keep calling him Sam Neil. Yeah, that's fair. When he gets to the asylum, he's having these these little spooky visions and he's seeing weird shit going on, and it's it's it's left to us to determine whether or not we think he's insane or if there's um supernatural things happening in this horror movie.
SPEAKER_09I wonder which one sometimes it's not, honestly.
SPEAKER_03But the one one of these visions is a man that shows up behind him, and I've wrote down what he says, because I was like, oh Joe, that's very, very, very fun. Or this full circle narrative, as he says, This isn't the end, you haven't read it yet. So if we go off the narrative that this movie is the book, he's saying you can't be at the end of this film, you haven't seen the beginning yet before we circle back to the original events of the movie.
SPEAKER_04Oh, that's cool. I never thought about it.
SPEAKER_03I think that's a nice little writing. See, Joe's gonna fuck me up about this movie, Chris. You haven't played Alan Wake 2.
SPEAKER_05No, I haven't. I played can more control today with my roommate. We're working our way up to Alan Wake 2.
SPEAKER_00How look control's not that long, Chris?
SPEAKER_03I need to you can't give me the Alan Wake 2 movie, and you're like, oh yeah, but no spoilers, please.
SPEAKER_05The last time we played it was in like March. We're gonna finish it in the next week or two, probably.
SPEAKER_03Also, there's another media franchise that I know you like, and I know you haven't seen the bits that I'm talking about, so I also can't reference that either. It fucks me up because when I watch the movie, all I can think about is oh, this reminds me of this thing in Island Week 2, or oh, this reminds me in this thing in this thing that I cannot mention to you.
SPEAKER_05That sucks. It's it's a video game or a movie that you can't mention.
SPEAKER_03I'm not even gonna say what it is because I feel like if I give you through, you'll be like, oh, is is that is that is that important to that?
SPEAKER_04I won't question it then. Thank you. God damn it.
SPEAKER_03But what do you think Sam Neil's sick tattoos he's got rocking?
SPEAKER_04His what?
SPEAKER_03His sick Jesus tattoos he gets in his asylum.
SPEAKER_05Oh, okay. Interesting, interesting. You're not you're not referencing the silence in Doctor Who, are you?
SPEAKER_03I um see, I'm looking at his crosses right now on screen. Why that's is that not uh is that not a Nazi symbol that man has on his his his forehead? Um is it you just hit me and I was like, huh? Wait, hold on.
SPEAKER_05Well there's one that's it's also a pe it was a peace symbol before before some maybe I'm pretty sure the Nazis didn't go about writing I'm bad on things.
SPEAKER_09Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Have you not seen that classic, Are We the Baddies? No, I think we do get a nice little moment of um woke Sam Neil where he's getting investigated for his insanity. And he says, Every paranoid schizophrenic has a them and a V. So it's good to know that in Pride Month Sam Neal was putting it down in 1995.
SPEAKER_04That's uh thank you. Yeah, great.
SPEAKER_03The the authenticity the the maybe controversial nature that every paranoid schizophrenic has a non binary friend. We'll leave it up to it at the times.
SPEAKER_04We'll leave it up to it, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Uh imagine that was the diagnosis. Imagine you had a non binary imaginary friend and that's what classified you as Schizophrenic.
SPEAKER_04That would be so fucked up. But honestly, not unrealistic.
SPEAKER_00What do you mean not unrealistic?
SPEAKER_05That discrimination would happen like that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but I think at any point if you have an imaginary friend in adulthood, there's probably the point where we're questioning you.
SPEAKER_05No, but I'm saying I assumed what you were saying is that if you had a cis imaginary friend, they wouldn't walk you up. But if you if you had a non-binary imaginary friend, they would. Is that what you were not saying?
SPEAKER_03So you go into therapy and you start you're discussing this new um hallucination you've been happening, and you sit down and go, hmm. Where on the gender binary does this person sit? You've got their look the big notepad up. Interesting.
SPEAKER_09Yeah.
SPEAKER_05I'm looking at the work of uh the guy who wrote. I'm sorry, I'm distracted by the IMDB of the guy who wrote the movie, who is a producer with MGM, apparently. He's a chairman. And what he's written, he wrote between 1997 and 1996. He wrote the story for the Judge Dread movie with Stallone. He wrote this. He wrote Freddy's Dead, The Final Nightmare. He wrote two television shows. One of them was a Friday the 13th show. And he wrote one episode of Voyager.
SPEAKER_04Star Trek Voyager.
SPEAKER_00Hmm.
SPEAKER_04What a strange career.
SPEAKER_00Like we feel like, yeah, that makes sense.
SPEAKER_03Like it's such weird wildcards, but if you had him in a deck, it's like, yeah, that's a full house you've got going on.
SPEAKER_05Huh. He's an executive producer on Shogun, the new show. Yeah, he started executive producing with one movie before Freddy's dead, and then he sort of moved into it in 1991. Fascinating.
SPEAKER_03What a strange. Maybe we can follow Batman's career. I suppose that we do that when we did um Michael DeLuca. Well, we'll search him up. Well maybe he's maybe a gold mine.
SPEAKER_05Well, we gotta do all of those. I got a detour for a second. Have you seen any of the agency? I'm seeing an ad for it.
SPEAKER_01No, I have not seen any of your weird copaganda shows.
SPEAKER_05Shut the fuck up. Alright. I can enjoy what I want to enjoy, even if I acknowledge Justified is my favorite show. Is it forgiving of shitty people? Yes. Is it fun? Yes.
SPEAKER_03It's not about the shitty people, but it's always like a oh, do you know this show? And it's like some some show that had 12 seasons that was on ABC at 8 p.m. and it starred a B list actor from like the 90s as like I don't watch those crime seasons.
SPEAKER_05I don't watch those. No, I don't. Don't slander me like that.
SPEAKER_03It's got Henrik Smith. He was in this movie.
SPEAKER_05No, I'm out here watching Rubicon. I'm not watching CSI.
SPEAKER_03Rubicon's a fucking drink? What's Rubicon?
SPEAKER_05Rubicon is a one-season television show starring James Badgdale that aired on ABC, I think around 2010, about spies in an office in New York, but they're in an office, so a lot of the stuff is like paperwork, but there's a conspiracy, it's good.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but Rubicon is a tropical or orange flavored drink that you get in a little bottle.
SPEAKER_04It can be two things.
SPEAKER_03And it's also the name of a mockbuster alien movie. See if I see if you go up to anyone in the street right now and go, Do you know what Rubicon is? They're gonna go us back. It's a little juicy drink, isn't it?
SPEAKER_05They would all say, Oh, you mean that James Badgdale show?
SPEAKER_03No, they would all go, Oh, you mean Tropical Twist, my favorite flavor.
SPEAKER_05They would say, You mean that James Badgdale show?
SPEAKER_00No, they would not. It would be you being interviewed on the street. Oh, that's my favorite show. With your Rubicon in hand.
SPEAKER_05Uh yeah, I'm not here watching French. I'm not I'm not watching Law and Order.
SPEAKER_03You're talking about what the fuck's agency? Why did this come up?
SPEAKER_05I'm seeing an ad for it on IMTB.
SPEAKER_09I just wanted to know, man.
SPEAKER_05I probably do need some medication for my ADHD. I'm talking about it with my psychiatrist. I'll figure it out on my own time. Thank you very much.
SPEAKER_03Well, you next time you see them, tell them that you were an hour and a half into talking about a movie. You didn't get past the 10-minute mark, and you started talking about a police drama show because an advert ball popped up.
SPEAKER_05Well, alright, we'll move on a little bit. You want to fast forward to the axe? The agent with the axe?
SPEAKER_00There was no fast forward. It's like the opening scene.
SPEAKER_05I'm doing you a favor. You want to fast forward to the axe?
SPEAKER_03Sam Neil. We're gonna zoom, we are gonna fast forward. Sam Neil, okay, we get flashback to him. He's he's like some sort of Columbo business, and he he sniffs it when cunts are lying. And he goes to the city.
SPEAKER_05He's super British at the start here.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, he's super British, but he's also a little American, and we just don't question it because Sam Neil clearly doesn't know how to voice it.
SPEAKER_05When he's doing Columbo, it felt like he was doing British as a thing, like to trick them or to play a character, but then later in the movie it feels like you just can't control it.
SPEAKER_03I think it's he uses it to put emphasis on his words, but you can't use emphasis to switch an accent. It just sounds weird.
SPEAKER_04No, that's a fucked up thing to do.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so see, he he busts that guy, he comes up and he's like, Oh, you you burnt down your place for money, and also I may have fucked your wife, and also you're cheating on your wife, and she knows. Okay, and then he gets he's going for a little celebratory drink with this man who we don't know who he is. When we get the Spider-Man 2 cafe scene, but it's instead it's a homeless looking man with a big axe. Good scene.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, great scene. And he's he would be dead here if he wasn't having lunch with a guy who has a gun. Not making a point. Or I mean, what I'm saying is the agent was trying to kill him.
SPEAKER_03The agent was okay, we'll we'll the age he the man with the acts as agent agent is sort of Kane's agent, but we'll we'll get it. We'll come back to that in a second. We'll get to it later. What I'm saying though is at this moment, surely he's not in any danger because at this point he's already part of the book's narrative, and we get later on that the narrative will sometimes have exciting moments to progress the plot because the audience demand it's a very funny games going on.
SPEAKER_05You're exactly right. So yeah, it's also a little cabin in the woods.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so Sam Neil's character isn't actually in danger at this point. He needs it so he can have a reason to be introduced to who Soder Kane is and starting.
SPEAKER_05It's an inciting incident in the movie and in the narrative of the movie.
SPEAKER_03It is. Sam Neil, he takes this pretty fine. He he goes on a walk and like this is New York, isn't it? Because that looks like a New York ass alleyway if I've ever seen one.
SPEAKER_05There's no alleyways in New York.
SPEAKER_03What do you mean there's no alleyways in New York?
SPEAKER_05That's a not a real thing. There's like one alleyway in New York that they film all of those scenes and everything from.
SPEAKER_03What do you mean? I have seen Spider-Man save a rape victim in one.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, all of those are filmed in like one fucking alleyway. I think Cortland Alley or something downtown in the financial district. There's no alleyways in New York, buddy. They put the garbage on the street.
SPEAKER_03Then where does Spider-Man change his clothes, Chris?
SPEAKER_05He changes Spider-Man goes to that one alleyway to Cortland Alley. Let me make sure I'm saying the right name.
SPEAKER_03He needs to change before he can get there.
SPEAKER_05That's where he needs. Yeah, that's the one. That's the one I'm thinking of. That's the one he goes to every single time. Look it up, you'll recognize it.
SPEAKER_03But it can't be because the kiss alleyway is a little straight shot. And then the one where the woman is being raped, and that that weirdly dark scene from the first Spider-Man movie is like a big one. It was a set.
SPEAKER_04It's a set on a soundstage.
SPEAKER_03Why would you build a cube of full blocks for this one scene that will probably get cut thanks to the sensor board?
SPEAKER_04Oh my god. I don't know, man. Ask someone else that.
SPEAKER_05It is supposed to be New York City, though. You're right.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so I was right. It was a it does feel like it besides the alleyway.
SPEAKER_05I just wanted to make the point about there aren't alleyways in New York City.
SPEAKER_03It feels like New York, but there's no alleyways. He's in an alleyway, so how does it feel like New York, right?
SPEAKER_05The alleyway doesn't feel like New York. Because there's no alleyways in New York.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so he's walking down the one alleyway in the entirety of New York City.
SPEAKER_05Yep. He's walking down not Courtland Alley. They found a different one.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we found other one that's around the corner that Chris refuses to acknowledge.
SPEAKER_05They found one in a different in like Vancouver, wherever they filmed this, you know.
SPEAKER_00Okay, but he's going down this.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, he is. He's going down an alley. I'm being really pedantic. It was filmed in Toronto.
SPEAKER_03Mouth of Madness posters look awesome. I found a site online that may or may not be a scam that we do the big movie posters as a replica, and I really want it.
SPEAKER_04Oh, I want that. That sounds cool.
SPEAKER_03He's horribly d he like a dickhead ripped one of the posters for some reason. Just an asshole move at someone's marking, they paid for that. And we see your standard New York police brutality who then invites Sam Neil into also being brutalized in a very strange scene.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_00It's more of a question.
SPEAKER_03You want somebody who wants to be hurt rather than a threat. But so so Sam, he's getting he's getting a call from Surakane's agents, and they're like, Our guy's fucked off. And he's like, What do you mean? And he's like, Can't fucking find him. So he goes, Yeah, no, this sounds like a scam. And they're like, dumb cunt, why would we skip we're telling you he's missing before this becomes an issue? And he's like, No, I guarantee this is a scam. And for some reason he's got a really big hard on about hating horror books that he has not read yet. And okay, see, this is where we get to uh Sarah Kane's character. This is it's Stephen King. Yeah, like there's no yeah, oh yeah. I get my say he's outsold, but this is Stephen King.
SPEAKER_05They even chose a state adjacent to Maine.
SPEAKER_03But even the font on the books is like, yeah, that's Stephen King's like Yeah, Sodra Kane, Stephen King.
SPEAKER_05It's the same guy. Except it's weird that he's British. Why is everyone British in this?
SPEAKER_03Um uh Lovecraft loves the old English.
SPEAKER_04I guess, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so we get see this is what I was when I was watching this movie, we keep trying to hit it with this. Oh uh people are acting strange and we're blaming uh the the media for it and saying it's affecting them in these sort of ways and it's causing a big uproar and scandal. Do you think this is the rage book by Richard Bacham?
SPEAKER_00That we're this is like pulling from Bachman?
SPEAKER_09Bacham? Bachman. Bachman.
SPEAKER_00Do you think this is supposed to be a play on this the whole school shootings thing?
SPEAKER_05Maybe. I don't know much about that one.
SPEAKER_03The whole thing where Stephen King refuses to reprint it because uh school shooters always need to try and blame a piece of media and then go Oh, but I like that media, and so I'm still blaming it for you shooting a fucking child.
SPEAKER_05No, I haven't heard of it.
SPEAKER_03I guess I understand that the the logical thinking of a school shooter is probably a little skewed as if. Why would you go see this thing that I really really really like? I'm going to make it implicit in my shooting of a child in the face.
SPEAKER_00Uh, because it's that is really gonna boost its numbers.
SPEAKER_05Because that's your moment of I don't want to talk about, but never mind. I don't want to talk about it. Kinda, yeah. So you would mention things that you like. It's like being it's like your Oscar speech in a really demented way.
SPEAKER_00I'd like to thank my mom, my dad.
SPEAKER_05I mean, kinda, that's why psychologists forever have recommended not publicizing news of it very far, and if you do, not to publicize news of the perpetrator of the situation, because it encourages other people to do the same so that they get attention.
SPEAKER_03But I still don't get because like see you hypothetically, I went on like a murder spree tomorrow. My first thing isn't gonna be going, oh yeah, shout out One Piece because I know Oda's just gonna get fucked in the ass from people from it.
SPEAKER_05Well you would go, you know, you're in a sane state of mental health.
SPEAKER_09No.
SPEAKER_00No.
SPEAKER_04Alright. Fair.
SPEAKER_03And argue with the camera says I would just say AI told me to do it. Because whether or not that was true or not, it would cause a big shitstorm. But use that moment logic.
SPEAKER_00Don't blame the things you like. It's not helping anyone.
SPEAKER_03People were blaming the book on their school shooting, so Stephen King's pulled it because he's like, Well, people keep using it as uh as is like their thing that they choose for it. Which I mean, it's because you probably it's because you wrote a book about a school shooter. So of course people gravitate towards it. I don't understand your logic working.
SPEAKER_00But that's where I thought the whole the whole movie was trying to go at.
SPEAKER_09Um I don't know.
SPEAKER_05I I don't think the way that I agree with you about John Carpenter is I don't think his movies have points like that. I think he has an idea he finds scary, and then he services that idea in a fun way. I think he makes haunted houses almost. Does that make sense? Like it's a lot of vibes, there's an idea behind it that's carrying you through the whole thing, but it's not built out in concept so much.
SPEAKER_03I don't know. The thing is very much that don't leave men alone, they'll probably end up killing each other.
SPEAKER_05Well, the thing is very much Yeah, you're not wrong, but it's also made in sort of an era of like Cold War paranoia. You know, he's the things that are deeper that he's including in his movies are relevant to the era. They're things that are being processed by everybody. It's not He's not setting out to make a point the way modern horror movies typically are. I don't think that detracts from the movies necessarily. I think they're still great. I think this achieves honestly, what I'm describing right now helps this movie achieve sort of a detached nature, which also helps the fear of another world leaking in. You know, it does because it's not attached to this is gonna sound very insulting, but because it's not attached to emotional arcs or human emotion in the way that a typical horror movie we're used to now is, it gives it more of a an otherworldly text feeling. It feels like something you weren't supposed to witness. You know, like they they tell you that he's an invented character, and you go, Oh, that makes sense, because he hasn't changed at all through this whole movie. And then you feel like the subject of the movie.
SPEAKER_03No, I I can agree with you on that, but you said he will take from things that people in the moment were experiencing. And would you not say that in the 90s blaming media for like mass violence is it wasn't like a prevalent topic?
SPEAKER_04True. You know what?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, no, you're very right.
SPEAKER_03Um I had a million and one thoughts to go over, but then Craig gave me an alert and it it made me shit myself momentarily, but I think we're all okay.
SPEAKER_05What alert did Craig give you?
SPEAKER_03He gave me a now recording alert on my phone, and I was like, You you're you're gonna I'm gonna kill myself. And he was just telling me an hour later that I was doing that. Yeah, so again, he gets the job and he's like, Okay, I'm gonna read all these all these little spooky books, so everyone's like, Oh, it's the most the most effective horror you've ever read. That was the nineties, so we were past like horror movies, so I don't know how books were having that much of an effect on people. I don't understand if this is like the 1940s and they're like, This man's writing some scary shit. There was a ghost on page 20. Like, I feel like at this point, maybe media moved on a little bit from the spooky book. But they're they're all they're they're going not through the spooky book, he's reading it, and even some nerd comes up to him and starts being weird because he's in a bookshop. He takes he takes the book home, which seems to be his big new one. And he starts having his weird out-of-body experience, like a middle-aged woman reading Fifty Shades of Grey for the first time. He's having cold sweats and his arms shit. Passing out, he's waking back up, he's reading it again, and he's passing out again. He saw the ghost on page twenty and he couldn't handle it. And then we get flashbacks to the the police scene that he's picking up the poster again because he's still a dickhead and doesn't doesn't appreciate the money put into the marketing department. But now the the the police he's he's like a he's like a fisheryman. He's like a little he's like a little zombie.
SPEAKER_04He is like a fishy man.
SPEAKER_03And then he's also sitting next to him reading his book.
SPEAKER_04It's it's good.
SPEAKER_03I love the surreal imagery in this. Like it's good, but I feel like Sam Neil's overreacting to the scary book a little bit. Like see if you get to page B and you're you're having cold sweats and you're starting to go dizzy. Maybe don't read the book.
SPEAKER_05True. I mean, I guess I guess the counter to that is that he's just written to do that. But that's a little boring.
SPEAKER_00Chris he passed out then woke up and started reading it again.
SPEAKER_04He's addicted to it. I don't know what to tell you.
SPEAKER_00I'm fucking dying, but there's a cliffhanger and I can't let it go. I don't know what the ghost is in the page 22.
SPEAKER_03So he he wakes up from his his his stuff and he's like, I have all the books, even though I bought one book, but he has all the books. And he goes, Wow, I I can see there's like a there's like a you win a mystery prize if you rip the pages of all his books into random shapes and place them in a map shape that does not look like a map at all. Like I I think he's like, Oh, you can follow the lines, and there's a did you see the map? Because on both times I didn't see the I have no idea what he was talking about.
SPEAKER_05Well, the map is that once you cut all the pages out or the covers out in the right order and stitch them together, it looks like New Hampshire. The state. So I'm not surprised you didn't notice that.
SPEAKER_00Oh.
SPEAKER_03Because to me that was just a blob.
SPEAKER_05No, it it they formed together to look like New Hampshire, and then the lines all lead to a central point in the state that they go find.
SPEAKER_03See, that's where that's the British in me. I had no idea what the fuck it. Like if you gave me if it made like a vaguely penis shape and then went, oh, it's Florida. I'd go, I know that one. That's like as far as you get from me.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, and I might still think it's Italy instead.
SPEAKER_03Homer Simpson. No, because Homer Simpson calls Florida America's wang. And it's the only it's the only reason I know it.
SPEAKER_04That's funny. I like that.
SPEAKER_03So you so he goes back to this guy who's like, I phoned you to help me find a man, and then you you just very rudely accused me of creating this weird scenario to find this writer and this book to publish. And then he's like, Okay, this strange man, I don't know. If you don't believe me, why don't you take my attractive secretary and drive her out into the middle of the countryside? And she has no say in this. No. Okay, we could argue.
SPEAKER_05Apologies, I just had a massive sneezing fit. Um yeah, she seems very snarky and upset about the whole thing. As you would muted myself, thankfully. Yeah, as I would be.
SPEAKER_03I'm not a young woman, and if my boss went either way for two weeks, you're gonna go with this strange man that I don't know into the countryside. I would have an issue with that.
SPEAKER_05I'd be incensed about it.
SPEAKER_03Especially if it's because he brought in ripped front covers of a book that he glued to look like New Hampshire went into the street.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, we should have this guy admit it at the start of the movie, honestly.
SPEAKER_03Now this you can argue, okay, that from a later kiss scene in this movie that it is not that questionable because Cutter Sutter Kane would write a female for our male protagonist, so he not only has a knowledgeable person with him that he can have that dialogue with, but also there is a love interest that doesn't see that's the thing though, because if it's if this is all a book, if he's all living a book, you'd think that the love interest would either a go somewhere or b like but like it doesn't follow because like he it's set up as if maybe we would be maybe this would be your your typical novels love interest, the attractive woman that's with our male character. But at one point she turns and goes, Well, we have to kiss now, the book says it, but there wasn't set up for it.
SPEAKER_05Not at all. It feels all in a weird way, it feels fifth-dimensional of like the screenplay is demanding that the characters kiss for the audience who can visually view the movie. So the book in the script is demanding that the characters kiss.
SPEAKER_03But see, this is where we fucked up, Vol, because if this was a Stephen King book, all the characters would be talking about her jahoobis and her ginormous flopping breasts every five seconds.
SPEAKER_05You think like a modern Stephen King would be talking about sloppy nattties?
SPEAKER_03Oh, 100%. Do you think Stephen King's changed? He's still just that weird old man that writes random horror books. He's a weird horny guy from a son's so much worse. He's just a whole family of perverts writing horror stories.
SPEAKER_04Fascinating.
SPEAKER_03So everyone's jacking off, or everyone's fucking everyone. So why why this isn't scary? I'm sitting on the bus feeling like a pervert with my headphones in. Steven Stephen King.
SPEAKER_05I like listening to like a gory horror audiobook while I'm just in public. I think it's funny.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but it's so much worse when it's a sex scene in a book.
SPEAKER_04Fair, I haven't done that.
SPEAKER_03Because like if you if you're going for an adult-rated book or gonna get in detail, and you can't not write about sex in detail that isn't incredibly awkward when there's a stranger sitting next to you on the bus scrolling Twitter. So this poor guy's just trying to look at what's whistle Everly, and you've got some old woman narrating his hard wrecked cock in your ear. So that's unacceptable when you're having it in public.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's pretty funny.
SPEAKER_03Well, it's even worse if you're in the house and you've got the audio book playing. It's like you need to hope no one comes in because you know that's like a 15-minute narration going on. If they come in to say something, leave, then come back, they're still gonna be hearing about it. It's gonna make you look like the wrong. I feel puritanical for saying this, but please, no more.
SPEAKER_04Maybe you are puritanical for saying that.
SPEAKER_03What about I like my gore and my sex separate? I suppose in movies, so I'm a habit crit, aren't I? I don't mind it in movies. No, I just think it's in movies is a more control. Because like, okay, an audiobook, I get no one can hear it, but that's still a public thing that many people. I'm not like I'm not whopping out the DVD player on the bus, am I? And sitting through May Chan's daily life with the chainsaw fasting.
SPEAKER_05Like, it's not for me, but if you I I just feel like some people's experiences might mirror that. It might be something that they relate to more. I don't know. You know, it's it's not something I'm that I want in my movies, but something like what I've heard from a friend about the trans experience, for example, feels like there is more of a cross-section to be found if it's done tastefully between those two things. I can't think of anything off the top of my head.
SPEAKER_03No, there I mean for I was gonna say different strokes for different folks. I don't mean it's a pun. But it seems like every movie that tackles those subjects for like a party, but it's like, yeah, this was done correct, and then there's a party that's like, no, this was done horribly. Especially that um, I'm not seeing it, but promising young women. That seems like a direct 50-50 split on people going this is great, and people going this is horrible and should not exist.
SPEAKER_04But yeah, which is odd. I then liked a lot of it, but I didn't like the end.
SPEAKER_00But then some people still writ it.
SPEAKER_03Well, I suppose um does it. Oh yeah, that's true. Titan does it pretty well. From what we like titane a lot.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03I've never been uh uh possibly trans French woman with a plate in her head.
SPEAKER_05No, I can't say I had either.
SPEAKER_03I guarantee that small subset of the audience that was that probably fucked with that movie heavy.
SPEAKER_04Probably.
SPEAKER_03Especially if you have a incestuous kind of thing going on with a fireman. Yeah, movie.
SPEAKER_04Especially that they would might feel freaked out about it by then, actually.
SPEAKER_03I suppose that's true. Like, how did he capture my sexy dancing on a on a on a fire pole? How do you know? But uh so we so the best part of the movie for me is see the stretch.
SPEAKER_05How'd she know?
SPEAKER_03Well woman directly it feels like it's like a it's like almost like a buddy cop type vibe of Sam. And can you please pull up the the second I don't want to say the secondary protagonist, but this secretary that's with him, pull up her name because I feel bad. Not saying on the case.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, she feels like a secondary protagonist, and then I do feel like the movie does her dirty a little bit. She just turns into Linda, Linda Styles.
SPEAKER_03Linda, okay. Well, the their dynamic in the car. I love that the horror stuff that goes on, especially see when she's asleep and he honks that fucking horn in her face and goes, Oh, you're awake to her to then assault him with a bag of lays and him going, hey, never throw chips at the driver.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I do like that. It's good though.
SPEAKER_03So he he goes for his his little nap. He's he's been tired from driving. See the see the spooky shit. This spooky shit is like cream of the crop. See this whole scene. Phenomenal. The the taillights with the dark glow of someone behind the car. Whoa. I love it. I love an like endless driving scene. It does something to me, Chris.
SPEAKER_05Oh, yeah, you must have loved that in uh what what was the the movie we watch the found footage movie with the Incantation? Yeah, Incantation. I was thinking about Incantation while I watched this scene. I love this though. The kid getting older too is really creepy.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, she okay, so she hits that person with the bike and it's like we're like a we're like a child, old person. Very unsettling.
SPEAKER_04It is.
SPEAKER_03And it's like in the movie, Stan Neal cycles away down that street. I don't know if it's supposed to be like a weird like reflection of him being trapped or maybe being like birthed from from the area that the narratives come from. So it's like a child, old man maybe version of Sahara, it's it's it's freaky. Reminds me of you know the mutants from Wrong Turn?
SPEAKER_04Yes. Yeah, exactly. There's something weird about them.
SPEAKER_03Then uh Linda hits um the the speedometer on the DeLorean and they seemingly travel through space and time to a little rickety bridge into I don't know what this town's called, but the spooky town from the books that had the ghost on page 20. No, no, no, no, no. She hits that person with the car, okay? And Sam Neil wakes up. She goes out and talks to them, and then they disappear and appear behind her and cycle away. So Sam Neil woke up knowing that she'd hit someone with a car, it got away, and he goes, Oh, I guess we were alright then, then goes back to sleep and she continues driving.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. That sounds about right for the character we're presented with.
SPEAKER_00But he's just such a fucking little freak, man, and just not not at all in shock.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Oh, the battery's low.
SPEAKER_03Oh, this might be too much. Yeah, to report batteries for them together. Got like an hour to go, so we might actually just speed this up because we've already been here like an hour.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah. Let's just okay. I feel like we can crunch down the rest. There's a lot of vibe talk we could do. There's a lot of things we could talk about, but we could just if there's anything you want to get to before the church, obviously we'll talk about, but I feel like that's where we should just fast forward to a little bit.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, they go we go through the town and Linda's like, I've seen I've these are all from the books, and he's like, Shut up, I don't believe you. And he's like, Well, look, this is the thing from the book, it should be right here, and he's like, Yeah, granted. That was correct.
SPEAKER_05Really funny scene because he's so cocky about it. It's a really good scene.
SPEAKER_01So then we go to a church. I don't know why we go to the church. We go to the church.
SPEAKER_05Oh no, no, and then sorry, I thought you were leading up to yeah, and then she opens the other window and says, It's here, idiot, and then the the look on his face is really good. Sorry, go ahead. I know we're trying to pass forward, but I forgot about that scene.
SPEAKER_03So we're doing we're doing a little we're doing a little run around town, okay, and we we're going to the the church that has a little a little blonde boy that is young, Sutter Kane. Linda's like, uh, him, but he's like a little he's a little blonde boy, and then he becomes like a big adult boy, and the town want to kill him because he's HP Lovecraft.
SPEAKER_09He's like stolen all their children.
SPEAKER_03Kind of, but he created the children from writing the books, so I don't know where that dynamic's about.
SPEAKER_05I know it's a little but that's hypothetically why they're mad. He's written them to be mad because he's written that he stole their children.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so they all come up and weird power fantasy, man. Yeah, it's weird because it means like in their series of books, there was like nine books that in this town, and then I mean like if Stephen King at the end of the Dark Tower had Stephen King was writing books that was creating the Dark Tower, and all the It's not even Dark Tower, because Dark Tower is a multiverse story, it's way more like Castle Rock.
SPEAKER_05The one that we're gonna be we can do a little teaser, we're gonna be doing Stephen King's, we're gonna be talking about some Castle Rock stories in August. It's horrible. Um, but yeah, it's like at the end of Castle Rock if he just said, and what's so funny is I was there the whole time.
SPEAKER_00I was the bat that bit Coo on the nose.
SPEAKER_03And also I was best buddies with what was the vampire's name from Salem's Lot down the street. And also I drove the truck that killed the child in Pet Cemetery.
SPEAKER_05Right. It's a little bit of like the Blofeld reveals in the new James Bond, too.
SPEAKER_03I see. I don't know anything about James Bond. You'll keep me lost on that.
SPEAKER_05Well, in the newest series of James Bond movies, that's sort of the series of reveals they did was I was this guy and that guy, and I did this and that, and everything that made you who you are. Yeah, I'm keeping my eye on the It's just it's not dramatically compelling, like you're saying. But I guess in this case, the elder gods are making him do it.
SPEAKER_03So the elder gods are making it a a bit on this man. But that that questionable part aside. Okay, so the townsfolk want to kill him, but he hit he has little double dogs, he's got Dobermans. Doesn't seem like a safe set. Well, seem like Dobermans.
SPEAKER_05No, they yeah, they seem aggressive, they don't seem like they're just happy like other dogs. But are they supposed to represent Cerberus? Because he sends them three at a time. Until the very end.
SPEAKER_03It was the Hell House.
SPEAKER_05Okay, cool. Yeah, that makes sense.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so so Sun Neo, he's back, he he leaves, he goes back to the house, and he's like, I'm fucking, I've had enough of this shit. He he still thinks it's a prank for some reason. Very elaborate prank for this one man.
SPEAKER_05Lyndon's the the to his credit, it was a prank to start with to his credit, you know, like it the whole thing was a ruse to begin with, it just didn't wind up being one.
SPEAKER_03So but okay, so Linda's out on her own for some reason. She's exploring the town and she finds children and they look deformed. Are they supposed to be fishy people?
SPEAKER_00Like like Dagon.
SPEAKER_05Or they just yeah, I think a little bit. I think they're supposed to be sort of like melting out of reality a little bit.
SPEAKER_03Because even that that main guy is like they took our kids, the the man who shows up with the shotgun to the church, he like as the movie gets on, gets like progressively more bulbous. I like him.
SPEAKER_04That actor's good.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, all his like practical effects are awesome.
SPEAKER_04But uh that guy might be my favourite actor in the movie, honestly.
SPEAKER_03Nah, I like Sutter Kane, he's got like the perfect amount of camp for it.
SPEAKER_04He does, yeah, you're not wrong.
SPEAKER_03No, Linda's back. She goes back to the church, and uh Sutter Kane he's fine with that, he seems to just let her in. Awesome set for the church, very like weird. It looks like again, if we're going fishy, it looks like it's been like water rotted over time. It looks fucking damp and fisty.
SPEAKER_09I imagine the air quality of the city.
SPEAKER_04John Carpenter.
SPEAKER_05John Carpenter says of the scene it's like a an odd sex scene, or an odd love scene is what he calls it. Because he says that Sutter Kane shoves her face down into the book, is how he describes it.
SPEAKER_03I just think he's a bit of a gunner man. Like, I don't know.
SPEAKER_05I do too. I do too. I'm not disagreeing with you at all. I thought I caught the imagery and I didn't quite wanna. I don't know. It's maybe a little too much.
SPEAKER_03John Carpenter's the fucking directing with one hand knows what's going on behind the scenes in his film.
SPEAKER_05That's yeah, I don't know. Prince of Darkness felt a lot more level.
SPEAKER_03Okay, John. Uh I the see the I like I could I could maybe get like Sutter Kane as like the dad of the town, because he created them, and then the kids say you're you're our mummy to the to Linda.
SPEAKER_09They do, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Maybe that's he he invites her in, he's like, Look at my big bulbous store. Look how it wins.
SPEAKER_05I'm always saying the women also.
SPEAKER_03Come see my my rotted bulbous store.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I'm always saying that there's the rats and stuff.
SPEAKER_03That throws me off so bad because like he gives asexual, like he gives like he doesn't seem human, he seems like he would not be interested in an elderly. He does graph and says, Come. So maybe maybe he was on, but I still feel like that's unnecessary. I do like he calls his book the new Bible, which is a bit disrespectful to lots of Christians watching.
SPEAKER_05But he's like, Oh, more people reading either will read the Bible, which I don't think is true. He's he's only counting translations, he's not counting how many people read the translation.
SPEAKER_03So do you but like I feel like okay, his little manuscript that he's writing, he's writing it with a typewriter, Island Wake style. Um I feel like it would have been cooler if it was a pink and pen. I feel like it just fits the line more. Oh, he's a little goofy, it's perfectly typed out um in the mouth of madness. But I feel like Sarkin looks too old for his fit. What's with this like Steve Jobs turtleneck? He's got like a like a what's his name? The guy from Night Rider.
SPEAKER_05Nightrider. Oh.
SPEAKER_03David Hasselhop.
SPEAKER_05David Hasselhop?
SPEAKER_03No, no, no. If a David Hassel mop is not not the look, he also.
SPEAKER_05I think it works because he looks like he's trying to pretend to be a human almost.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, because he's he's got little bulbous people in the back of his head, which is fun.
SPEAKER_05Little bulbous people on the back of his head. Yeah, he's got a little like he does have a coato. That's just a an odd way to put it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I like the the the adjective bulbous is very it's a very appealing one to me. I quite like it.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it's a good word. It's very gross. I don't like it, but I like it because I don't like it.
SPEAKER_03How do you think the transformation of that starts when you start to know about do you think like once you've read a few pages of a Necronomicon, like that's inevitable? Like you've been infected and it's coming? Or do you think you have to keep thinking about it quite a lot and then your head starts to over time?
SPEAKER_05I think it's inevitable. Unless like you get hit by a truck the next day, I think you'll come back around to it. Like the seed has been planted. Maybe it needs to be watered more, but you'll see or hear something that makes you think about it, and then you'll think about it more. So I think once you I think it's a it's a root it's a Rubicon. You know, once it's crossed, you can't go back.
SPEAKER_03Once you open it, the fizzes out, you can't stop it. It will it will go flat eventually.
SPEAKER_04Right, after one season.
SPEAKER_03But uh so she's she's looking at our book, and we cut back to Sam, and he's in he's in the hotel with the the woman that, according to the novel, chopped her husband up into little pieces. Why she is now the thing from the thing. No idea. She she's It's cool though.
SPEAKER_05I love the practical effects.
SPEAKER_03It is awesome, but she's like a little wormy person that's chopping at her own pits. And also she doesn't go for Sam Neil. She's just kind of doing that in the back.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, she has a chance and she just throws him through a door.
SPEAKER_03Which makes more sense once you know he's a written character. But she's not like avoiding her own wiggly bits. I feel like that must hurt.
SPEAKER_05I don't know. Maybe they don't feel pain. Maybe they don't have nerves.
SPEAKER_03I feel like you've got to surely you have nerves in your wiggly bits. If you grow a wiggly bit, it's gonna hurt if you touch it.
SPEAKER_05Look, man, my wiggly bits have nerves, but I'm a human. I can't talk about the wiggly bits of an alien or in or an intimate interdimensional creature.
SPEAKER_03I feel like I feel like your wiggly bit get in touch is a universal issue.
SPEAKER_00I don't know how you can only apply that to humans.
SPEAKER_03Saying that's it I think my wiggly bit get in touch is No, because if an alien saw us, okay, we'd see our arms and they go, The arms make sense. And then we have little round bits at the end of it, and then little five wiggly bits. But we we grasp all our of these aliens' wiggly bits.
SPEAKER_05You're talking about fingers? You're talking about fingers and finger adjacent things? Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Copy. I thought you were just talking about generally wiggly arms and wiggly bits on creatures. It's talking about dicks.
SPEAKER_03Well yeah, the humans they they they grasp their wiggly their wiggly bicks, their wiggly bits together and give them a shake as well. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_05The prime wiggly bit has to be saved by the the subservient wiggly bits.
SPEAKER_03They have wiggly bits at the ends of their arms and they harden them and then interlock them with each other and give them a shake as a greeting. If we wrote that about an alien, I'd be like, what the fuck? You better keep your wiggly bits to yourself, mate.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it's yeah, true. I love the shot of the the wiggly creature in the greenhouse.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, where Linda previously says, Oh, there's there's a big there's a big thing that should be there. And he's like, Yeah. Shut up, I read the books. Even though he clearly hasn't read the books. He goes out to town and now everyone's bulbus, everyone's uh and they're they're slurping and they're fighting. This is the genuine bad time in the town. Very Simpson Street House of Horror hat and run bad vibes. So Sam Neil rather than attempt to leave this town runs to the pub. A very fair reaction if I do say so myself. So he goes to the pub and the pub has bulbous man and he's like, This place is sh I just want my way. And all these fucking fish hunts are everywhere and I'm sick of it. They're all gonna die anyway. Rather than logical thinking, Sam Neil goes, What so you uh you're an actor or a writer? So he sat there with a shotgun in his mouth.
SPEAKER_00His face is melling, what do you mean, Sam?
SPEAKER_05Yeah. This is grim. This guy goes, You're all alone, and then shoots himself in the head.
SPEAKER_03I wasn't expecting but like obviously this man's done the thing. The rest of his film doesn't go as hard as that that one blast.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's a good scene. There's not a lot of gore in the movie so much.
SPEAKER_03So Sam after seeing the man um game end in Minecraft, he goes, Okay, maybe, maybe time to leave. He goes and he finds Linda and he's like, We're getting the fuck out. Getting the whip. And she swallows his carcass.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, funny.
SPEAKER_03Understandably, he beats her up. Yeah, at that point, I don't fucking know you. Get out. I'm leaving myself. At this point, you're not my issue. You're harbouring my escape. I probably just slapped the mic really bad there, apologies for that.
SPEAKER_05I heard it a little bit.
SPEAKER_03It's warm in here, the sweat is like dripping it down down my top. Damn. So they're on the plan to leave, and she's shutters made me horny, Sam. We have to fuck right now.
SPEAKER_04Um she's going nuts.
SPEAKER_03She's she's going ham. Sam's having none of it. He's a very respectful man, no matter the scenario. She seems out of it, he's not having it. He's ready to leave. Um just wish he turns into like a little crab ball. Or am I mistaken?
SPEAKER_05A crab ball? Yeah, yeah. You know what? She does turn into a crab ball.
SPEAKER_03See, it's weird because in this movie, I hear a lot of people go, Oh, it's great for um like love crafting horror elements. But no one talks about the practical like body horror in this. Like I'm looking at it right now, she's pulling an exorcist, she's she's flexible, she's like, I don't even know how we did it, because it's like her head, and then it flips to like a model. But both of them look as unnatural as each other. There is a moment where she's crawling and it is clearly just someone else with a Halloween mask on, which is a little funny.
SPEAKER_05Right, with a mask of her face, sort of like sleep away camp, a little bit.
SPEAKER_03Or the Poughkeepsie tapes.
SPEAKER_04I have not seen that. Maybe I should watch that.
SPEAKER_03He gives her a ring around, he gets into the car. Like very much.
SPEAKER_05I do just want to echo while you're saying that. The practical effects in this are incredible. They're really, really. Certain it's not.
SPEAKER_03That's crazy. I wonder if it's the same guy from uh from beyond. Because it's got a similar, like uh creepy, chunky look to everything.
SPEAKER_08Interesting.
SPEAKER_03But okay, so so Sam he gives her a little ring of rosy and he daps in the car. But the car flashes you back, you're fucked, you're stuck in the town. Very like Silent Hill vibes. Actually, incredibly Silent Hill vibes. I wonder if this was inspired. With the like the the weird like cult church building in the town.
SPEAKER_05John Carpenter plays a lot of video games now. I don't know if he used to, but it would make sense.
SPEAKER_03I've got to imagine back in the day, because even David Lynch knew about Silent Hill.
SPEAKER_05Oh, it was handled by shit. The visual effects were um created by Industrial Light and Magic and also handled by a group that included Robert Kurtzman and Greg Nikotero. Greg Nikotero, known for the Walking Dead show, who that show is bad, but the one thing that's always been really good in it is the makeup and zombie effects.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, because like even if like if someone's watching this, if you Google like the waterlogged zombies from The Walking Dead and how like their swollen like uh pussy flesh drips off of them as they walk about. Good shit.
SPEAKER_05Oh, we gotta look at that. Yeah, it's consistently so good. Anyway, yeah, go ahead.
SPEAKER_03Sam, he's doing the Ring of Ring Rosie, keeps leaving town, keeps popping back, keeps leaving town, keeps popping back. At one point tries to fucking spear them with his car and goes through them. So that was a fail. Um fucks his head pretty bad. He does. I'm I'm I'm narrating this as I go along because I don't have notes. He wakes up in the confessional booth with Sutter Kane and he's like confess to me your sins and they start yapping about this cunt's book because he's got a fucking ego. It's a great death because he's like Yeah, is it an is it a confessional booth with just like the ceiling removed that they filmed in?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it it must be, and it the way it's shot is like he's been arrested and he's in a cell. Like it's a confessional booth presented as a prison cell.
SPEAKER_03Oh yeah, oh, because it's supposed to reference the aside. That's cute. I like that.
SPEAKER_05I do too. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03God, the amount Sam Neil smokes in this fucking movie as my.
SPEAKER_05He smokes so much. I love how the old lady. Oh, yeah, that sucks. I love how the old lady is like, You gotta stop doing that. And he goes, I don't know, man. Something just makes me want to do that.
SPEAKER_03And it's not small cigarettes either. The man smoking super kings, they're like double-sized cigarettes.
SPEAKER_05They really are, and he'll put them out right away, so he must have a lot.
SPEAKER_03I mean, you say that I don't even buy cigaremon. I have like 50 cigarettes in this house in random locations. I think smokers just it's like have you ever seen 1408 in John Cusack? Even though he doesn't smoke, he's like, Yeah, I'll keep one on me just in case.
SPEAKER_04That's a good movie.
SPEAKER_03Uh fucking so he's he's in the booth with Sarkane, and Sarkane thinks he's dropping fire in that fucking booth. He's pulling a heretic and he's yapping about how of religion's designed to just control you through discipline, and uh it's been translated, the pages don't even reference what they're supposed to be anymore.
SPEAKER_05My book's just all he has the knowledge. Well, at least he has the knowledge of like an another world, you know.
SPEAKER_03He has the knowledge of some gods, so why would that imply that God does not exist?
SPEAKER_04Oh, I guess you're right. Oh shit.
SPEAKER_05Oh, you know what? Hmm. Is it more than that?
SPEAKER_03I don't remember. But see if I found out some gods existed, I would be more likely to believe in the Christian god. Why? We keep we keep we're having this little back and forth, and sort of like you have to read the book. And it's like, oh, you wrote the fu read, just write him into reading the book earlier if you're that fucking determined, mate. You're you're controlling the narrative. I think he is fine. I think that's why he's just he's an asshole talking to an asshole. He's like he's been he's been forced into the R slash atheism subreddit in reality. That's why the fucking the guards of hell were defending this little booth. And it's like he's not even like Sam new fire into it. He's just fucking listening, he's just gonna yaps. He just yaps and yaps and yaps about how fucking popular his little books are.
SPEAKER_04His little books.
SPEAKER_03I guess little books. And then there's a flash of lightning, and Sam is sitting on his lap, which is also a bit sus.
SPEAKER_06Kinda.
SPEAKER_03So he teleports to Sutter's Sutter's little book lab and he's like, I've finished my book with my pristine typewriter and desk in there's a Lovecraft Temple.
SPEAKER_05And this is when Sutter starts going off about you know, you never had a life, you were a creation of mine. There's a father and son dialogue, I guess, that we have.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, this is when it's kind of revealed that Samuel's character is kind of part of this new narrative. And the like the way the narrative is supposed to continue is that Samuel gets the book that he is in and he's supposed to deliver it to the real world to get uh published uh to spread uh um publicity for circane uh, I assume basically uh yeah. Yeah, it's like the the thing where um uh like people will leave one person alive so they can tell the tale. In this one, yeah. He's like you boring Columban that deals with false insurance claims. I have deemed you the ultimate protagonist for my best-selling novel. Now go spread the word. And this is this is when his bulbous store opens, is it not?
SPEAKER_05Yes. So this is when he starts ripping the paper.
SPEAKER_03Is it okay? Well, walk me through it, because you've seen this movie a lot more than I have.
SPEAKER_05Well, the image that's in my head, I I'm in a jumble because I've been bouncing back and forth through the movie, listening to the commentary, trying to focus on it and not doing a good job. But what I've been really focused on is the special effect of um well first Sutter Kane is saying, I can't hold them back. You know, you have to go through this, you have to go through this tunnel, and he it's super cool the uh the design they choose for it. He shows him like a sci-fi spaceship looking tunnel, almost.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, isn't that a like um HR Geiger?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it almost implies like they're in a spaceship right now, potentially, which is cool. Uh I wanted to mention the effect for that spaceship they talk about being it's like a 10-foot hallway and then like another 10 feet or whatever that get narrower and narrower. So when you shoot it, it looks like a 50-foot hallway.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's a fucking classic running down the hallway to the door, but the door's actually tiny, so you can't get through it.
SPEAKER_05Exactly, which is why Sam Neil gets tackled halfway down the hallway.
SPEAKER_03But yeah, so despite the the guy, he's writing this book, but he's like, I cannot stop the monsters coming because I wrote that they come at this part of the book. God, I think he's a proof of it, also, effectively.
SPEAKER_05I don't think he's writing his own story. I think he's writing what they want him to write. That's what he said. He didn't realize that he was writing someone else's story for the longest time. But he said that he realized recently it was someone else's.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so that clears it up a little bit more for me. But this is It's a double.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Okay, you you know, you know some of the special effects behind the scenes. See when Kane stands in front of the the altus door that's like pulsating, and he rips himself as a sheet of paper into a hole in the door. Who the fuck did they do that?
SPEAKER_05So honestly, I don't know how they did it. They didn't talk about it. I think they like sort of a movie magic, like we don't want to tell our secrets a little bit. Um, but that is what I wanted to talk about. That's this it's so fucking cool.
SPEAKER_01They used foil for the paper that happened in the end.
SPEAKER_03I know it's we can be excited, we can overlook, we don't have to make gaps.
SPEAKER_05Uh no, true, true, true. Yeah, uh that's what I was excited to get to. They used foil for the paper, especially for when he's peering through that big hole in the wall. It's uh tin foil that's been painted to look like paper. And what's so cool to me is that's the effect I was talking about earlier. There was something else in the script, and John Carpenter said, We need to cut five million dollars out of this script. Let's you and me, he's talking about the the guy who's on the commentary. I'm pretty sure uh the like visual director, let's come up with a fix for this.
SPEAKER_03Originally in the script, the whole town was supposed to get sucked into the book and disappear, and they couldn't that what the poster is that it's the big beams coming out of the book.
SPEAKER_05Oh, yeah, you're right. That is what that is. Interesting. Huh.
SPEAKER_02Also, uh little little side thing about the him ripping paper, the door hole on the other side has the pages of the book, which would imply that like the whole town is like a weird paper illusion that he's in because he's in the book.
SPEAKER_03He's like ripping him out of the book.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it's such a creepy effect.
SPEAKER_03Because people go to this is like the best example of Lovecrafting Horror. Kind of the point of Lovecrafting Horror is you're not really supposed to see the gods. The gods don't look like they look cool, but it's yeah, I don't think it lives up to what my man sort of was talking about. They look like the Gorgonites from Small Soldiers.
SPEAKER_01No, they do look a little bit. Don't get me wrong, I love them.
SPEAKER_03I love small soldiers. But it is the Gorgonites.
SPEAKER_05I think the best way to imagine it.
SPEAKER_01You could put them with Gorgonites, you couldn't kill them out.
SPEAKER_05I can't say nothing about Gorgonites. I haven't seen small soldiers. The best way to imagine it is that these are like ants from another universe, honestly. Cause no, these aren't Eldritch beings. Something that was really funny to me is they have um, I think it's called Robot Monster. There's a movie from the 50s that Sam Neil sees in a motel room later, and John Carpenter says it's one of his guilty pleasures to this day. And what's so funny to me, I do like the special effects in this movie a lot. I think a lot of the practical effects are great. But some of them like that, like the way wiggly arm monsters, while they look really good, still compared to effects from now, they look like the effects in Robot Monster compared to in this movie.
SPEAKER_02Next month is July.
SPEAKER_03We have to set we'll set up a scenario, okay, where you have to we can count small soldiers because it is like dolls coming. It's kind of like a child child's play. It's like an evil doll movie, more 12-rated, but it is fucking awesome.
SPEAKER_05You would are we gonna do evil doll month for July? That could be fun.
SPEAKER_02You cut off a little bit what are we doing for July?
SPEAKER_05Do you want to do evil doll month for July? Yeah, that could be fun. Puppet Mastery, Chucky, small soldiers, presumably dolls, Chucky, Puppet Mastery, dolls, dolls. Sure. I haven't seen dolls. That's the Robin Williams. Oh, that's toys. What's dolls?
SPEAKER_03Dolls is like it's is it's not a great movie, but it has good vibes. It's one of those people stay in a haunted house and little little creatures are running about.
SPEAKER_05Oh, that sounds pretty good.
SPEAKER_03Just from the effects and the stupidness of it.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, that sounds that sounds good. That sounds like um like wax work or something.
SPEAKER_03I suppose you could count house of wax if you're going dolls. Uh little lapel, I'm just talking to his mic. But uh, so Sam he gets he gets popped out a little bit and he wakes up. It's like Ebony's or Scrooge. You find it when he's like You head from the town of Hobbs End. I don't know why I put like I went super Scottish for it. I feel like it was more like a it gives like a uh Tulkin vibe when I say it like that. I think it's the Hobbits.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it does he gets a bite and he's like, Alright, I'm leaving. But the book of In the Mooth of Madness keeps appearing at him. He assaults a teenager in a motel for delivering his letters.
SPEAKER_05He also, I want to say, doesn't tell that kid not to go down that road. He sees that kid don't going down that road. Oh, that's true. No, you're right, because that one kid was probably written. I don't know. I still wish he had told that kid not to potentially go down that road.
SPEAKER_02No, but I think in the mouth of madness is the book, but I think when the paper tears, that's Sam leaving the book into the real world, but with the knowledge of the book.
SPEAKER_01So now he can't get rid of Arcane in his head. Also, the lighting's very different, the world's very blue.
SPEAKER_05There wasn't an actual boy stuck in the outskirts of the town, that was a written aspect of the book.
SPEAKER_04Is what you're saying.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I think just the town does it. That's just like a kid going to a different town.
SPEAKER_05But the there's the time loop kid when they're driving into the town that they see before they arrive and as they're leaving. I feel like it's possible for someone to get stuck on the outskirts. Maybe. Maybe.
SPEAKER_02Possibly. Possibly. We'll leave that. Maybe, maybe John says something.
SPEAKER_05Maybe. I didn't listen to enough. Again, so much of it was like John Carpenter would say, you know, oh, this is a lovely 20 millimeter lens here. And then for the first time in 20 minutes, the director or the visual effects got not visual effects. He's like a visual artist slash director of photography. He would chime in and say, like, uh, mm-hmm, screen screen wide angle. Lovely. You know, it's just really nerdy shit that I was not on the level for.
SPEAKER_02So our boy's um he's he's going back home. He can't escape this book. He even goes back to his his New York alleyway that you say doesn't exist. With the little binfiers that you always see. Oh, I think Chucky's New York. There you go. Toronto. Yeah, but it's a New York staple, you can't avoid it. He sees the poster for the new, the new movie, The Hobbs End Horror. Which a little kid must have been like, what the fuck the second you saw that poster? Like this weird, this weird businessman in a field asked me if I knew about Hobbs End. And then a horror movie comes out about a few minutes. Yeah, but I don't think the newspapers were spreading that fast back then. No.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, he's he's going back. You're gonna need to run me through because there's like 10 minutes left, and my battery's on 17%. Let's give me a little rundown.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So sees this kid, pops an axe in his head. Exactly like the uh the agent earlier in the movie. He has him if he's read the books and he says it'll be no surprise what happens next. And then they smash cut to him back in the hospital. He's got all these crosses and everything on him. Uh they did John Carpenter did mention that because he was asked directly by the guy he was talking to, and he said it was just like you know, to ward off evil, basically. Uh which is what you expect. But it's funny to have it described in such a plain way. You know, there's nothing deeper to it. Uh he's talking to John Glover from Gremlins 2, slash Lionel Luther from Smallville. Go ahead, what is that?
SPEAKER_03Serious funny. I didn't think of it as a warding off evil thing. I thought of it as a if I like that's like a stereotypical thing to be drawing on myself, so if I do that, they might keep me in here.
SPEAKER_05Interesting. No, that's what John Carpenter said was um the idea was that maybe everything will avoid him if he does this.
SPEAKER_02So like he he gets back to town and he he's he's meeting with the person. Not yet. Oh, yes.
SPEAKER_05Alright, you're doing a hypothetical. Sorry, go ahead.
SPEAKER_02No, no, I'm just so he we we can skip past it.
SPEAKER_05I just want to say John John Glover is uh at the hospital. He he walks off, he gets captured. Then we have Sam Neil walking out, and this is the sort of effecty, moody atmosphere I wanted to talk about. Just with the the lightning and uh you know, this is a very mood piece section. And then yeah, he starts exploring the world, it's like a Twilight Zone episode. Uh he is walking where's my microphone? There we go. Walking through all these empty set pieces and gets to a movie theater. Was there anything you wanted to mention before the movie theater?
SPEAKER_02No, I just like the very liminal vibe. There's another Love Caftian movie from like the 80s or 90s, like a low budget one, but people keep saying to watch it, it's got like an empty town liminal vibe to it, and I have to figure out what that is so we can we can talk about it or something. You're not talking about Dagon there empty no, not Dagon, it's something it's something to do with the moon. And we'll we'll interesting. I'll find it, I'll find it at some point.
SPEAKER_05Please do.
SPEAKER_02But yeah, I love the butt, but it leaves you to wonder like what the fuck like did the knowledge of the book become so prevalent that like people vanish?
SPEAKER_03Or is because the book's been completed and Sam is maybe not real? Is he like in his own pocket now?
SPEAKER_05It's a great question because the implication on the radio broadcast is that everyone just started murdering each other, basically. Uh yeah, I don't know, because there's no bodies. The the true answer is there's no budget to show bodies everywhere. But I like that it leaves you in this more liminal space.
SPEAKER_03Or boy, boy Sam, he's he's fiending for some canoe in the apocalypse.
SPEAKER_02So he hits some.
SPEAKER_05He got the popcorn working, so that's all you need.
SPEAKER_03He decides he's gonna watch the because I feel like popcorn would take a while to watch, he just the kernels. I feel like that's hard to get you, maybe get some mole, but I don't think it would do too too much damage.
SPEAKER_05True. You think you could just eat stale popcorn right off there?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I think you could eat stale popcorn for like I don't think there's much nutrition in it, but if you're just watching movies, you don't really need to make it.
SPEAKER_05Put a bunch of butter on it. Yeah, that's fine.
SPEAKER_01Fun movies. What movies would you try to find?
SPEAKER_05If the world ended right now, what what movies would you try to find that you could watch over and over? Well that would be in theaters.
SPEAKER_02I would well, I know there's a house like five 600 meters away from me that has solar panels.
SPEAKER_03So I would be commandeering that so I have electricity for my Blu-ray players and TV. I would be hitting Blu-ray shops. But if I wanted the cinema, I would be scooping around just in every every c I've got like a circle of cinemas where I know I could hit and I would just take one good film roll of every movie because I'll get bored at some point.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's true.
SPEAKER_02And just stash them and like the Omniplex near me is being built will be will be recliner seats. Oh, but there won't be any power.
SPEAKER_05I guess I would have to find my way to the like the National Archives. They've got to have some good movies over there in Washington, DC.
SPEAKER_02See the thing is at some point though you'll come across like a house of someone that was like uh you ever seen Digital Hoarders where we just we store as much digital information as possible in case it goes missing at some point so we can just upload.
SPEAKER_05That's crazy. No, I haven't seen that.
SPEAKER_03There's people with like full hard drive rooms in their house of just everything anywhere online. It does help occasionally, so fair fucks to them.
SPEAKER_02But yeah, Sammy gets to the cinema and he realizes that um the the joke is on him. I feel like the ending is a bit like yeah, okay. Like he see he sees his life in the movie and he's like, haha, isn't this funny?
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it seems like he's but it's it's also a classic gif at this point. Him laughing in the theatre with the popcorn.
SPEAKER_03But like he doesn't add much because okay, he was a book and now he's a movie character.
SPEAKER_02Like he's still a fictional character from media.
SPEAKER_05But he's he's a fictional character that because he is perceived brings about the end of the world is the idea. So the fact that you are seeing him means that something is seeping into your world effectively.
SPEAKER_02Okay, but how much of a movie do you think is what happened?
SPEAKER_03Okay, so when the book ends where the book ends, but then the movie adaptation is like a meta adaptation of someone trying to make the book, and that's the movie that we just watched, and then that's the character. Because like how many layers deep is this man? Or has he just lost his mind at this point?
SPEAKER_04I think he's just lost his mind at this point.
SPEAKER_03Well he it's funny, I'm looking at the credits here. There's a head carpenter, a carpenter, and an assistant carpenter, and none of them are John Carpenter.
SPEAKER_05That is funny. Or one or Cody Carpenter, one of his family members.
SPEAKER_02Someone called Jazz. What a sick first name.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02See, the more we talk about it, the more I'm like, Joe, this is maybe more than a than a freestar. Maybe I did it dirty. I still don't like Sam Neil though. I think it's the one thing that holds me back.
SPEAKER_04Really?
SPEAKER_03I've I didn't have beef with him before possession. It's his performance in possession that has pissed me off to such a degree, I don't think I can like him in anything else.
SPEAKER_05That's so interesting to me. Why yeah, like what's so bad about it?
SPEAKER_03I don't know, it just feels like it doesn't match the tone of the film. It's got the same issue I had with Moriarty and Q, but too, it's fucking extreme.
SPEAKER_02Like the movie tries to do see how when you play Japanese video games and then they'll have like a weird quirky scene, and then everything else is serious.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, I do.
SPEAKER_03It's like the movie has those weird quirky scenes, but it is only Sam Neil's character doing weird out-of-pocket shit that doesn't add to the fucking narrative. And then it's supposed to be like it's a director writing about the horror of divorce and like miscarriage.
SPEAKER_02But the entire movie, I'm like, yeah, Isabella Janny's character is a fucking nut job, but I still feel more sorry for her having to put up with your fucking annoying ass through the entire movie.
SPEAKER_03No wonder she wants to divorce from you, you cut infuriates me. But you go you go include I feel bad because I don't have beef with him as a person, but I just cannot stand that fucking performance.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I I like him maybe more as a comedy rack comedy actor, someone who's adding something like that. Like in this movie, he is he has an incredulity to him, he's not playing it straight. Or he's playing it straight, but you know, he he's sarcastic about everything. Um but I I see what you mean. I like him in things, but I also see that he's more of a personality than someone who can act a bunch of different types. Anyway, we got him in this movie theater, he's cackling. Movie ends. He's having a good time.
SPEAKER_03Happy ending.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it's good, I suppose.
SPEAKER_03Happy ending? He's having a good time. He gets a happy ending in the cinema.
SPEAKER_05Yes. You'd hope so.
SPEAKER_03So yeah.
SPEAKER_05Uh so what are we thinking? Well, I guess we'll close out with if you have any thoughts on this movie, you want to share anything, you can email us at uncannyvalleypodcast at gmail.com. If you want to follow us on Instagram, we're at the uncannyvalleypod on Instagram. So we're thinking small soldiers for next week.
SPEAKER_01Oh, you have to go you I guarantee you will love small soldiers.
SPEAKER_02I might watch small soldiers the second we're finished with this.
SPEAKER_06Oh, okay, okay. Shit, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_03Banger movie. Banger movie. It's like it's really pushing horror, but there is it's it's evil dolls attacking people. It's it's the same sort of vibe.
SPEAKER_05Okay. Yeah, that sounds fun.
SPEAKER_03And I think there's one I think of as a child that scared the shit out of me.
SPEAKER_05Really? You think it'll still scare the shit out of me?
SPEAKER_02No, I think it's probably goofy as hell, but we'll we'll get to it. Ron Perlman's one of the soldiers.
SPEAKER_05That's my phone. My bad. Ron Perlman is one of the soldiers? Yeah, he's a Tommy Lee Jones also.
SPEAKER_03Oh is it Tommy Lee? Oh, is it Tommy Lee Jones and Ron Perlman? Hold on. Before we go, we need to get this sorted.
SPEAKER_05Shit, yeah. Please.
SPEAKER_03Where is it? Where is it? Where is it? Where is it? Is this is this where we're cutting off?
SPEAKER_05Do you want to say I mean say say who's in it, but no, I'm I'm pretty good on it.
SPEAKER_03Why are boxes moving so slow?
SPEAKER_05I don't have much else to say about this movie. I love the practical effects. I love a lot of the uh the directing and just framing of things. It's time it's just Tom Ely Jones. Phil Hartman's in it, David Cross is in it, Dennis Leary's in it. But it's just Tommy.
SPEAKER_03I was wrong on Ron Perelman. It's just the villain looks an awful lot like Ron Perelman. Ignore me. That'll be fun. Oh shit, David Cross is in it. Directed by Joe Dante, the guy that made Gremlins and the Howling.
SPEAKER_05Oh, that'll be fun. Okay.
SPEAKER_03This gives me some good shit.
SPEAKER_05Another little guys movie from Joe Dante.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_05Alright, Charlie's gotta go watch Small Soldiers.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Bye-bye.