018: Finding Your Voice and Embracing the Pivot with Jen Howat

What happens when life takes unexpected turns—and each pivot leads you closer to your true calling?

In this episode, Mandi sits down with leadership coach, strategist, and podcast host Jen Howat to talk about the power of embracing change, amplifying your voice, and building a business that doesn’t cost you too much.

Jen shares her incredible journey from former juvenile delinquent to juvenile probation officer, pastor, leadership coach, and now entrepreneur helping leaders grow their businesses while protecting their energy, creativity, and humanity. Through every chapter of her story, one thing remained constant: helping people integrate who they are with how they lead.

We dive into powerful conversations about leadership, boundaries, and the rhythms that allow us to sustain meaningful work without burning out.

Jen also shares practical wisdom for entrepreneurs and leaders who feel like they’ve lost their voice, reminding us that our stories, experiences, and perspectives are exactly what the world needs.

If you're a business owner, leader, or someone standing at the edge of your next chapter, this conversation will leave you feeling encouraged, grounded, and inspired to lead in a way that honors both your work and your life.

Connect with Jen:
Instagram: @jenhowat
Podcast: My Entrepreneurial Life
Website: builditbetterco.com

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Transcript

0:00

You are listening to The Mind Her podcast where mindset, leadership and personal growth come together to help you create a life and business you truly love.

Mandi Casey 0:08

Jen, we are so excited to have you here today. For those in the audience listening that don't know you, would you tell us a little bit more about yourself personally and professionally, and how you got to where you are?

Jen Howat 0:19

I'm. Honored to be here and be a part of this conversation. And, yeah. I'm originally from about 30 minutes southwest of Philadelphia, and so that's where I was born and raised. I worked for the Department of Juvenile Justice as a juvenile probation officer and. A degree in criminal justice.

Mandi Casey 0:37

I bet you have some stories there.

Jen Howat 0:39

For sure, for sure. But it was a good fit. because I actually spent probably about three years from the time I was 14 to 17, acting like a juvenile delinquent. And so, you know, these kids, they didn't scare me. It was really a great. Great job. My husband and I, we got married, we moved back up to the, Del Marva area and I ended up, actually getting a job as a youth director. I remember when they looked for somebody for the position, I thought to myself, well, I had a hundred delinquents on my caseload. So, you know, a job with, you know, 12 to 15 high schoolers and a dozen junior high. And I bet you, you know, probably none of them have a record. This is going to be great, this is gonna be fun. My husband and I decided that we were gonna do it together. And we had a nine month old at the time. And so we did it really as a, as a family. And that was a lot of fun. And in the course of that, it made. Our lives take a completely different direction because there was a time where there was a youth Sunday, so typically, you know, sometimes in churches when there's five Sundays in a in a month, they have the youth group lead that fifth Sunday. So it, we were supposed to do that. And the pastor who I got to know, she came and introduced herself, when we first started going to that church and we just, you know, had hit it off and she's become a great friend or mentor. But I asked her, I said, so who's supposed to give the message for this? And she was like, well, you can. And I thought. I don't know. I don't know if I should be standing up there in the pulpit. It feels like a sacred place that I do not belong.

Mandi Casey 2:33

Yeah.

Jen Howat 2:33

I'm like, what am I supposed to talk about? And she said, oh, talk about whatever scripture you want to. And at that point in my life, I had one. It was Hebrews 11, one Faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you do not see. And so I stood up and talked about it and sat back down and thought, okay, thank you that that's over and. As the service was ending, you know, we had a tradition where you stand at the back and you shake people's hand and then, they go out and have punch on the lawn. And people said to me, you've, you found your calling. This is what you're meant to be and do. And I thought, you are crazy. I think you have spiked the punch on the lawn and I cannot imagine this. But every time I gave a reason why, no, it's not me. I'm not, you know, good enough for this or meant for this. Every objection was met and I ended up going to seminary, and started when my son was 20 months old. We both started school the same week and took me five years, but I then went on to be a pastor in a solo church, um, where I was the head of staff. And did that for six years in Kennet Square, Pennsylvania. And then after leaving that position, I ended up being certified in life and Leadership Coaching and organizational Change through the navigators in Colorado Springs.

Mandi Casey 3:58

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 3:59

I was able to really work with organizations, you know, someone's personal health in their leadership, because that's first and foremost, you know, you, you lead who you are, you know, and so.

Mandi Casey 4:12

right.

Jen Howat 4:14

And then, um, after doing that for a few years, ended up here in central Oklahoma in a position. Um, of an associate pastor for discipleship. And through that time, I was really being formed in my leadership of really wanting to do some soul care, like caring for the person who's leading the organization first and foremost, because again, you cannot lead out of a dry well. You have to be filling up yourself and you don't wanna lose yourself along the way. None of us are called to a position that's going to actually make us become less human. We wanna be. Becoming, you know, who we're meant to be no matter what organization we're leading. And so that was really the heartbeat of what I was able to continue to do in the rest of my ministry. And then it took a hard turn and I ended up leaving the context of the local church still worked with pastors and leaders creating healthy rhythms and boundaries and COVID actually increased that business because.

Mandi Casey 5:19

yeah.

Jen Howat 5:20

All of a sudden they had permission to stop because you weren't allowed to go anywhere. And it was like, oh my gosh, let me attend to these things in my life. And that was really a rich period of time. And then when the world started to open back up. Unfortunately, a lot of people went back to their normal patterns and even pushed harder because a lot of churches lost about 30% of their congregations. And so that added pressure to them, and the business really came to a screeching halt after that. So I was. Not quite sure what does a former juvenile delinquent turn probation officer turn pastor do with her life?

Mandi Casey 6:07

Yeah. Yeah.

Jen Howat 6:08

And I ended up doing some like behind the scenes VA things for for businesses, but that really evolved into. Very much using a lot of my gifts in helping people lead and grow their organizations while maintaining the integrity of their sanity and the rhythms of life that they knew that they needed for themselves. And so that's really been what's brought me here today.

Mandi Casey 6:40

That's amazing. You are right. You had several pivots along your path. For the woman who is listening who might be on the brink of a pivot, what would you say to her?

Jen Howat 6:52

I would say first and foremost, don't panic.

Mandi Casey 6:56

Yeah.

Jen Howat 6:57

that most of our lives we're actually pivoting, but we don't realize it.

Mandi Casey 7:02

Mm.

Jen Howat 7:03

You know, you think about it, you, you go into different stages of life or you have a, something that comes up, you're always having to shift, and some of those pivots feel more heavy to try and figure out. But I would say no matter whether you're gonna make a small shift

Mandi Casey 7:22

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 7:23

this is a pivot that's taking you into a totally different direction, everything that you have learned. Every piece of your character that's been formed along the way will not be wasted. You will take that with you into whatever's next, and it will serve you in a way that you just can't even imagine at this point when you're in the midst of trying to figure out, you know, which direction am I going and how far off the beaten path am I now gonna travel?

Mandi Casey 7:56

Yeah. I love the, the breadcrumb analogy, and it's always in hindsight, right? You can look back and you can see how those breadcrumbs led you to where you are, but in the midst of the shift or the transformation, can feel. So far off path, and really you're starting to fall into alignment of where you're supposed to go.

Jen Howat 8:14

Yes, absolutely.

Mandi Casey 8:16

One of the things that you said was, when things began to shift, you had helped. People care for their soul, tend for their souls, right. And do business at the same time without losing that integrity. One of the things I think you do really well, Jen, is you help people amplify their messages. Um, and when I'm sitting here listening to your backstory, I'm like, oh, that makes perfect sense because you were standing on the stage amplifying a message to many. do you think that is? Um, with business leaders? About getting our message out to the right audience. And how do you think you do that so well?

Jen Howat 8:52

I think. Know at first we're really just throwing spaghetti at the wall, uh, behind a passion that we have, and as we become more strategic. We also get to the point where we recognize how human we are and how limited we are. We're limited in our time, our energy, our resources, just our capacity. And so one of the best ways to leverage our capacity and meet the demands you might have people that are saying, Hey, I want to work with you, but you're thinking to yourself, I don't even have time to go to the grocery store. I'm barely, you know, running around, picking up my kids and getting them to where they need to be on time. It's really a great opportunity to think where in your business can you start to serve more than one person at one time? And as you begin to shift those things, it doesn't mean that you would. Not do one-on-one work with people, if that's something that you're doing, but it just adds another layer to your business so that you're not so time constrained. It gives you that freedom because we are more than our business. Who you are is more than just who you are inside of your business. And so your business is part of who you are, but it's not all of who you are. And if you don't have time for space and margin to be able to do the things that matter most, even if it's pursuing a different business opportunity, but to do those other things too with the relationships that you want to be building and just the space that you want to have. We need that in our lives in order to continue to lead the people we care so deeply about. And what we tend to do is we think in the name of caring for people, we're gonna just keep on going. But it's so important to do that and that's actually gives you the ability to shift and then amplify your message from there. And I think what's just been, I think part of what I've realized about myself is I've always been an integrator. I've helped people integrate. Whether it's been something that's happened to you because you have, uh, received a, a sentence from a criminal court and you have to integrate that into your life, um, you know, new practices and behaviors, if you're integrating faith into your life, uh, rhythms into your life, that part of integration has really helped me be able to sit with leaders and listen to the vision of what they desire for their business and for their lives. And then to be able to think of a way not to make that woman feel like, now I have to work harder, but how can we work smarter so that you are amplifying your voice and you're reaching more people, but you're not trading a lot more time for that.

Mandi Casey 11:47

Mm-hmm. You are really good at that, and I think you've helped me personally see ways that I can work smarter, and still create and cultivate the life that I desire for myself. That balance that you're talking about. You've mentioned the word rhythms a couple of times, and, having those like healthy boundaries, I would love to know from you um, what does that look like? What do, how do you define rhythms and what does that look like for you personally? What are your rhythms?

Jen Howat 12:14

I, I really gravitated towards the word rhythms because I, I feel like balance is a fight that we'll never win. I mean, if, can you imagine like being on the seesaw or teeter-totter? What do, is that what you call it here in oak?

Mandi Casey 12:28

totters

Jen Howat 12:29

Okay. All right.

Mandi Casey 12:30

yeah,

Jen Howat 12:30

But being on that and having one foot on either side and just trying to always maintain, you know, the levelness there, it's impossible. And you're exerting so much time and energy,

Mandi Casey 12:40

Oh, it's exhausting.

Jen Howat 12:41

Exhausting. And the fact of the matter is, is that we are going to have times where. We're busy. Maybe we have a deadline. Maybe it's the season. Like I know a few friends right now, we're spring sports. It's like, all right, everybody hold on until the beginning of May. Um, because this is gonna be a wild ride. We have so much going on, and so it. I don't think there's anything wrong with the busyness and the seasons where there's a lot of activity. I think where we get into trouble is when we let one busy season bleed into the next busy season, which bleeds into the next busy season. So I believe it's really important to have a rhythm where you are recognizing. Okay. Spring's a really hard time. Uh, it, it's a busy time. Not necessarily a hard time, but it's, we're going to have a lot of activity and to pre-plan those spaces. Now, whether it's a day and each, and each person has to, define it for themselves. Some people need like a recovery week. Some people need a recovery hour, you know, and some people are fine. But whatever it is for you that fills your tank, put it on your calendar now.

Mandi Casey 13:51

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 13:52

that way you're not coming to the end thinking, oh no, I never, I never got a chance to disconnect. I never got a chance to refuel, and I'm now jumping into the next thing. Um, so put it in your calendar now and, and honor that appointment like you would with, you know, the client that you have always wanted to work with and has finally said yes to you. Like you would never miss that appointment, right? No,

Mandi Casey 14:17

no.

Jen Howat 14:18

no, you are showing up and you are going to be ready for whatever comes and to show up for yourself, um, in that way. So I think it's a, a balance of having some, you know, the rhythms, like where do I wanna take breaks, both in larger chunks of time, but then also smaller chunks of time. Um, for me personally, I have a hard stop when it's at five o'clock and granted, you know, it might be 5 0 7, but I do not work after. Five o'clock hour because that is time for me to connect with my husband, sit down and have a glass of wine, hear about the day, like just talk, you know, sit outside if the weather's nice. Um, that's really important to, to me and to us. And so that's a, a really good rhythm to have. I also do not make plans on a Saturday morning because we have a coffee date every Saturday and we have been doing that for, oh my gosh. 20 years maybe. I mean, it's been a long time, a long, long time.

Mandi Casey 15:20

Yeah.

Jen Howat 15:20

So there may be an exception where something comes up for one of us, but nine times outta 10, if there is something, we are really trying to guard that period of time to make sure that nothing interferes with, um, you know, the early Saturday morning. So those are some really good, um, ways that I do it. I also have learned not to give an answer right away. I find that I get in myself mostly in trouble when I say yes and then realize what have I done? Why did you say yes to that? Like, how are you gonna possibly do that? Whether it's I don't have the time, or that's really not my, my wheelhouse, or. Or, or port something that fits with what I'm doing right now. And so what I have learned is, unless for sure I'm super excited as somebody is explaining it and asking me, um, but most of the time I will hit the pause button and I will say, E whether it's in an email or in a conversation, you know, Mandy, thank you so much for that invitation. Lemme check on a few things and get back to you. And what that does is it allows me to take a step back. Because you know, as you know, every yes you say is a no to something else. And so I need to, not because this invitation would not be good or valuable, but I wanna make sure that it fits with what I've got going on now, and is it gonna compromise the commitments that I've made to myself, to my family, and to my business. And I have found that just that practice. Really allows me to get perspective and then I'm able to answer from a place where I have more information and I understand really what I'm saying yes to, and that has made a huge difference for me.

Mandi Casey 17:13

Yeah, that is excellent advice. I think so often we are quick to be yes people, and that's a general assumption, obviously. And then later that's part of the hustle and the pushing through and they're like, uh, I have to follow through with my commitment. And I tell clients all the time, like, okay to come back and be like, actually, I need to cancel.

Jen Howat 17:34

Absolutely. That's right.

Mandi Casey 17:37

Okay. So you also have a podcast. I wanna talk about this, my entrepreneurial life.

Jen Howat 17:41

Yes.

Mandi Casey 17:42

And I wanna know from you, as you shifted from being in, I wouldn't even say corporate world, what would you call, um, the juvenile like justice system? What? It's not really corporate. It,

Jen Howat 17:55

Oh, no. It's,

Mandi Casey 17:56

a whole world of its

Jen Howat 17:57

it's, it is a whole different beast.

Mandi Casey 18:00

Then you go into, the spiritual world, and now you're in this entrepreneurial world.

Jen Howat 18:04

Mm-hmm.

Mandi Casey 18:04

you've shifted, what have you noticed specifically about your leadership that has evolved?

Jen Howat 18:10

That's such a good question. I think what I've noticed is that I am more able to adapt and to live with tension.

Mandi Casey 18:22

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 18:23

I was before. And I've really learned the difference between there are problems to be solved and tensions to be managed. And for myself, I was turning everything into a problem to be solved because I did not like the feeling of the tension

Mandi Casey 18:38

Oh

Jen Howat 18:38

in reality, most of what we deal with, our tensions, where we have to hold both things, it's the both and,

Mandi Casey 18:47

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 18:47

so I think that that's been a big part of what's helped me. Build resiliency in leadership is realizing that there are far less problems to solve than I think there are, and there are just different tensions that I need to manage, you know, along the way and, and in terms of resiliency as well, I, I think I've realized that I am able to do hard things,

Mandi Casey 19:13

Mm-hmm.

Jen Howat 19:14

like really hard things and sit in. Hard places, whether it's with a family that's struggling, a lot of these kids who were on my caseload, they came from families that just were dealing with unimaginable. Um,

Mandi Casey 19:28

Hmm. Yeah.

Jen Howat 19:29

and problems, whether it's sitting by somebody's bedside who just found out they have a terminal illness or they're dying, um, or celebrating some amazing things that are happening in life and seeing people light up. I think what I've been able to do is see the, the beauty in all of those places. And be able to realize that a lot of my leadership is being present in that moment and allowing people to listening and then being a partner in walking forward in whatever's next. And I think that's what really builds some of the core values of my business now. You know, collaboration, partnership, creativity. Because those are just foundational to who we are as human beings and what we need. And so I've seen that that's what we need, whether we're juvenile delinquent or whether we're, you know, um, a family celebrating or a family that's dealing with tragedy or a business owner who's going, why am I not growing? I, I am totally confused about what's going on. We need to just be able to hold that space to sit. With someone. That's where I feel like I come in and hear them, and then help them see what's possible, even in a place that may seem really hard.

Mandi Casey 20:53

I will say you are excellent at that.

Jen Howat 20:55

Thank you.

Mandi Casey 20:56

and I have had a lot of conversations recently about AI

Jen Howat 20:59

Mm-hmm.

Mandi Casey 21:00

the use of technology in your business, and one of the things I'm hearing you say is how important that human element is. It doesn't matter. Age. There's always an element of needing to feel seen and heard, and AI technology does not give us that. Um, what is your advice to the person who is like trying to juggle, technology into their business and into their life maybe, and also like holding space for that, that human element.

Jen Howat 21:33

I would say one of the best places to start, I believe, of integrating AI is to think of those things that you do repetitively. Particularly in your business. So if you're somebody who is onboarding people all of the time, if you're somebody who has a podcast and you wanna send a series of emails out ahead of time or afterwards, you know, we have these things that we do all of the time and we're saying the same words. And so when you're finding yourself typing and you're like, I can't believe I'm saying this again, take note of that, because that's a great. Opportunity perhaps, of creating some systems where AI can help you automate that so you're not doing the same thing over and over again. That actually frees up a lot of space for you to have the human connection that not only I think is important for us as humanity, but also we're hearing, if you look at the statistics, we're hearing that despite people being on social media and having all these friends and they are feeling. Less heard, they're feeling more lonely, they're feeling disconnected more than ever, even though we're in this age of technology and all of these, these tools and the social network, so to speak. So I think first starting just with where are those processes and those things that you could help you do, uh, because there are things that you do all the time. I also, a challenge for me is I have found that when I use AI, particularly for writing, that it has really cost me in my overall creativity, a lot of what I've done. I mean, I have written so many things in the course of, you know, my 16 years in professional life, particularly through ministry and through this season. And I found that the more I. Abdicated that responsibility to check GPT. The less I was able to think of the very words and phrases that have helped me establish my voice. I was losing my voice and I was doing it at first in the name of getting things done. But AI also writes in terms of formulas, even when you give it certain, certain words, and I found that I just kept feeling like it was the same short sentences that sounded like everyone else. But more importantly, it was keeping me from my creativity. So I would say if you notice anything that you're doing with AI and it's you feel like it's hurting your creativity or it's maybe just not helping you don't feel like you have to keep doing it'cause everybody else is doing it. You are allowed to make the decision about where you want to integrate AI and where you prefer not to. But I do think that it's a great tool that creates the space for us to maintain the human connection, which is so important to us as humans. And it's also the very thing that the people that you serve are looking for.

Mandi Casey 24:48

Yeah. And I even think,, there's an element of the humanness within and our friends. Like you said, we have this connection to social networks and we think that these people are friends, but we actually haven't spoken words to them. Or seen them, you know, face to face and sat across the table from them in years and it's like there's beauty in that and then there's also like a little bit of sadness.

Jen Howat 25:09

I agree.

Mandi Casey 25:11

Um, okay. So I would love to know from you, when you think about the impact that your work will have on this generation and future generations, what do you hope to create?

Jen Howat 25:22

I hope to create a ripple effect by being able to amplify the voices of others. I get excited to think that I can help a business owner create. A strategy and a system that allows them to amplify their voice because they are all the experts in what they do. I have no idea how to be who they are, and they need the freedom to be able to do that themselves. And so if I am able to, for each client to know that. I am gonna help amplify their voice where they can impact more people. That is gonna have a ripple effect that starts to change the lives of so many people because these businesses are helping some other business owners. But just so many different things that people are dealing with in life. And so I am, I am grateful and hopeful that it will create a ripple effect. Just to be able to amplify them and to create the ability for them to continue to change the lives of other people.

Mandi Casey 26:30

I absolutely love that. You mentioned the word voices, and we've talked about it a little bit. What would you say to the leader who is listening who, isn't feeling seen or heard, or feels like they have lost their voice or is thinking to themselves like, nobody cares what I have to say? What would you say to that person?

Jen Howat 26:44

I would first and foremost say that I care. That there are a lot of people around you that, that do care. I understand the feeling. Um, one of my favorite sayings from Annie f Downs is my feelings get to,, ride, but they don't get to drive. So I absolutely, you know, acknowledge that feeling. I have that feeling too. But I also know one of the things that you have taught me is to take the feeling and to then ask yourself, are you telling yourself a story? Or is this really true? And a lot of times I think we might find that we're telling ourselves a story, but if you do still feel like, no, this is true. I don't have a community. To be looking for the one person, you know, who's somebody that you could start to develop a relationship with. Because when we're seen and we're heard, that usually comes after human connection, um, you know, over a period of time. And that's something that grows. And so it's a available, it's possible. And it's something that I wouldn't worry about getting. You know, I need to have this huge community with all of these people, but just be thinking about like, who's the one, who's the one person that I could start this and see who pops into your mind. See, as you go throughout the days and the weeks, if you run into someone, or if somebody just keeps coming to your mind and just start there. Um. But you, you do have, the world needs you and we want to see you and hear you because you, you're important and you have something special to bring.

Mandi Casey 28:26

Yeah. And I think you're so great Jen, at, uh, letting people know that.

Jen Howat 28:32

Thanks.

Mandi Casey 28:33

Okay, so before we wrap up, I always love to ask my guests, what's one piece of leadership advice that you receive, like the best piece of leadership advice you received that you still follow.

Jen Howat 28:46

I think the best piece of leadership advice actually comes from a quote that I heard. About 10 or 15 years ago that's attributed to Abraham Lincoln and that is that he said that all men are born originals, but sadly, most die copies. And I have learned, and I hope that the women that are listening will just know that you are an original and that. We don't have to worry about spending our time trying to be like other people, other people that are successful and copying what they do because the world doesn't need another. Mandy Casey or Jen Howett, or you know, the people you follow on Instagram and Amy Porterfield or Stu McLaren, or put in the person that you are following all the time. The world does not need another. Mandy and Jen, the world needs you to be you. You are uniquely and wonderfully made to be the person who you are. And so I would just say like be an original. That is actually the competitive edge that you're looking for. And the more we can just feel okay with that, I think that that will serve, um, you and your leadership. And I've learned that being an original. That's okay.

Mandi Casey 30:09

I absolutely love that advice. Be an original, um, because I think, yeah, we shy away from it and sometimes we, we think that that is a weakness rather than a strength.

Jen Howat 30:19

Absolutely.

Mandi Casey 30:20

Okay, Jen, where can people find you and follow you and interact with you? I wanna include all of your links in the show notes, but tell us where we can find you.

Jen Howat 30:28

Sure. Well, I think the easiest place right now to find me is on Instagram, Jen Howett. You can also come hang out and listen to the podcast at my entrepreneurial life. And then if you wanna learn more about the business, um, then you can go to build it better co.com and find out more that.

Mandi Casey 30:47

Awesome. I love that. Well, thank you for joining us for everyone listening, that's all we've got for today. I'm sending you so much love and gratitude. Thanks for listening.