Ep. 8 - Trading Up: Turning One Rental Into Three

Ready to trade hustle for durable wealth and real impact? We sit down with Wendy Papasan to unpack how values-driven investing, focused development, and smart systems can turn a handful of rentals into freedom, leadership, and legacy. Wendy shares how “impact” became the north star for multiple companies, why tracking time, dollars, and influence multiplies giving, and how staying curious outside your industry keeps you sharp when markets change.

We dig into a real Austin case study: converting a paid-off 1,100-square-foot rental into roughly 5,500 square feet across three units under new rules, moving projected rent from about $2,600 to around $18,000 per month. Wendy breaks down why local policy, vertical integration with a trusted handyman and remodeling arm, and investor education events help capture value fast and clean. We also talk discipline, living on one salary, reinvesting agent income, and planning for taxes, so you can hold gains instead of leaking them.

If you’re eyeing the next level, you’ll love the segment on buying businesses: using seller financing for the down payment to preserve liquidity, what clean P&Ls actually look like, and why vetted marketplaces with membership models give serious operators an edge. We connect the dots between development plays, high-end flips, industrial opportunities, and a re-review of the “bottom 25 percent” of your portfolio to redeploy equity into higher and better uses. The thread through it all is leadership, stepping up in your team and community, designing a brand that pops, and being camera-ready when opportunity calls.

Join us for a candid, practical conversation that blends story, numbers, and strategy. Subscribe to the Real Mike Duley Podcast, share this with someone building their portfolio, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.

Transcript

Meet Wendy Papazan

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Welcome to the Real Mike Dooley Podcast. I'm Mike Dooley, nationally recognized broker, bringing you real conversations, real strategies, and real insights into today's real estate market. Hey, thank you everyone for joining. We are at the Real Mike Dooley Podcast and hanging out. I'm so excited about our guest today. Coming all the way, I want to say from Australia, but I'll say Austin. How about that? You know, so I got a good buddy, he's from New Zealand, and I love his accent. But we'll we'll hang in the United States. We'll hang in Texas and Arkansas. We're bordering each other, which is cool. So we have the great Wendy Papazan. Do you want to go ahead? I know I got a cheat sheet of who you are, but do you want to tell our audience some of your great things when we look through your bio? It's multiple organizations, multiple companies, and multiple fun.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Yeah. Well, uh, first of all, I'm Mike Dooley's number one fan. So there's that. And uh I run the Papazant Properties Group here with Kether Williams in Austin, Texas, not Australia. And I have a couple other businesses. I run our development company or investment firm called Impact Capital. And we have a uh handyman remodeling company. And I also am a co-founder of Her Best Life, which helps women leaders.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

You know, people always ask me how do I come up with my names of my companies? So Impact, and what was it like, you know, this North Star, this dream? Did you have that thought process on some of the names?

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Well, Jay and I have done our core values exercise. And that is uh impact is where our core values uh overlap. So that's it's big for both of us. So that's why we picked it.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

So not like my first corporation. Actually, my dually group team is MCE Enterprises, Mike, Cody, Evelyn Enterprises. But I started it uh before Sinclair came along. So when she gets a little bit older, she's gonna be, what the heck? You left me out, you know. But I but to your point, obviously through a lot of great work.

SPEAKER_02 2:14

You can be doing that, right? It could be MCs, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Or or assigned, right? Or something like that.

SPEAKER_02 2:23

Yeah.

Core Values And Naming Companies

SPEAKER_00 2:24

But you and Jay have always, you know, and and Cody and I uh it it's it's cause, it's kind of funny. I'm sure you hear this a lot too. It caused some fights sometimes. Like when we first did Couples Goal Setting, and I think the document was kick-ass goal setting. And we first went through and had it. She's like, uh, I'll give you an example. I had to be a private pilot, is one of the things I really wanted to do. I had that on my list. And she goes, first of all, I love you. I'll let you drive the sprinter van and drive other things, but we're not gonna ride the plane with you. And I was like, oh, let me go ahead and cross that one off.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Um well, you know what? That was actually on my list that came up during the couple's goal setting retreat as well. And I guess I guess Jay wins an award because he ended up getting me flying license, flying flying lessons for Christmas one year. Yeah, I got up in there. My kids were little. I was like, no, this is not gonna work. But maybe now that they're a little bit older, I would be able to stomach it.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

Well, I had some sentimental stuff. My dad was a pilot. He he flew actually Chinooks in Vietnam. And he actually, my mom and him are high school sweethearts. So when they were in high school, which sounds crazy these days, he took my mom up in a Cessna, you know, and they did a day like two or three hours away. It's like kind of like the notebook movie, the perfect thing. So when we were doing goal setting, I said, hey, I want to buy a Florida beach house, which driving the van is about 12 hours. And I was like, honey, how great would it be to have the private plane? So and I know we're gonna talk about a lot of those things today. And I think, you know, and you and you're around a lot of people, I'm around a lot of people. And sometimes they quickly go to the private plane or to 12 years from now. And I would challenge them, anything they're listening to today, don't do that. The first part you have to do, and you're if you haven't done this yet, I'll give you your first your first thing. You actually need to get your medical card. That's your first thing to do in private lessons. Well, that only costs like 125 bucks. So you're chunking it down and you have steps along the way. It's true. Yeah, I do want to highlight for our listeners too, and I was overlooking this. You guys have helped over 2,300 uh real estate transactions.

SPEAKER_01 4:26

Yeah, we're actually about to hit 2,500. Yeah, you probably have a little bit of old information, but yeah. It was like last week.

SPEAKER_00 4:33

That's how many properties you're selling a week.

SPEAKER_01 4:35

Yeah, yeah, it's so crazy.

SPEAKER_00 4:38

And you're almost up to 900 million. Think about that. How many people you have affected uh in doing real estate, you know, from like you said, development to homes to all those things. It is amazing the impact you can make. Uh, I'm gonna actually see how many times I can say impact because I know that you're in your goals now. But I I know I actually listened last week, I went I went rucking and Jay's podcast is one of the ones that I listened to, and he talked about your giving strategy. So think about now, and he talked about I know you guys weren't tracking it. I think he said all the way from the beginning, but that if I read everything about you, I read that at least nine to ten times was about your giving strategy and giving back. And I know that's her best life and everything. What is the root of that for you?

Goal Setting As A Couple

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Um, I don't know. I I've always had a helping personality, and I do, I don't know, I think it's addictive, changing people's lives. There's a certain fun that I get from that. And I have been gifted like a strategic sense, you know, it's like that's my top strength. And so just being able to like get to the core of something. Um yeah, and then I just have always loved giving back. You know, Jay and I started tracking time we spent giving, and then we started tracking the money we raised, and then when we were able to, we started tracking the money we actually gave away. And I think we've helped since 2018, we've raised about four million dollars for local charities.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

That's amazing. And I know he added there too when he was talking about also the influence of giving. And I never thought about that. And I know many times you've been on my multiply KW carers thing and the stuff that you've done that. We don't think about that until you add that up. That events raise almost 1.5 million for KW carers. And people go to your point, they'll go, Oh, I didn't give 1.5 million, but you gave the influence of doing that. And sometimes that's a much bigger impact.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

Yeah, well, I think the world is starved for good leadership right now. And so many of us have the opportunity to be a leadership in our own world, whether it's on our team, on our block, in our communities, in our neighborhoods, in our towns. And I think, you know, sometimes we can't change the world, but we can change the world around us. And so you can do that by stepping up and being a leader. And I know that that's in your heart too. You and I are very much in alignment as far as that goes. And it's a real gift to be able to do that. And anyone can do it. A lot of times you just have to step up to the plate and raise your hand.

SPEAKER_00 7:17

And we know you've been podcasting for a long time. You guys, you had an award or a record most recently, right? How many downloads are we at now?

SPEAKER_01 7:24

We're at over a million.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

That is amazing. That is awesome. And you know, I think there will be some people that listen to this podcast and they go, okay, and I see this a lot, and you probably have this. When I would like to know what that trend was. Five, you know, five people listened to the first time. It was all your relatives, right? And then it then it what was the number where you were like, oh, we have something here? What was like kind of the the momentum? Like, how many episodes was that in?

SPEAKER_01 7:50

Well, we've been doing it for five and a half years now. So yeah, I mean, it definitely got momentum. I think the the gift that we got is at family reunion one year for Keller Williams. We got kind of put on stage because uh Simon Sinek was supposed to show up and speak and he got sick. And so we got his slot, and uh that helped us build momentum right from the beginning.

SPEAKER_00 8:25

You know, you know, we have a lot of mentors that say be ready with like your one thing. So what can you teach? What can you talk about? Are you ready to go? Because these opportunities might happen. And that would be a good lesson for anyone listening is what what is the thing you could teach on if you're like, hey, you got 30 minutes. All right, let's go. You're ready to go. And you guys went up there and that was life-changing.

SPEAKER_01 8:44

Yeah. I mean, the big deal was like, oh, what are we gonna wear? You know, we're gonna be on stage tomorrow.

SPEAKER_00 8:48

Well, I know I want to congratulate you too. What is this uh strategic too? Is the colors, your branding, and I think about everything that you do. One of the things was they were asking me questions about the real Mike Dooley, and they're like, What kind of colors do you like? Well, for me, Kella Williams is red. I love that. Uh the razorbacks are red. There's a lot, there's a lot of things that add emotions to me and everything that I'm doing. You know, this bright yellow, and I and it's it's funny, you know, whenever we do the growth call, they show four or five podcasts, and then they're saying, Okay, here's what's coming out next. Yours immediately, if you look at it, pops over the other ones because that bright yellow. I think it's not a color generally chosen.

Scale, Impact, And Giving Strategy

SPEAKER_01 9:28

Well, we didn't pick it, uh, it was KWRI, their talent team in marketing. I think it was Caitlin, actually, who's uh was working there. She's the same person that designed the one thing. So she's a super talented. She's not with KWRI anymore, but she picked that yellow. And I know she had done some research around it. And then when we uh created our company, Her Best Life, we did that on purpose to kind of align the two brands. So that was definitely on purpose.

SPEAKER_00 9:56

Yeah, if anybody listening to the show does not know what her best life is, will you go ahead and kind of give them a rundown, what it is, how to connect, where to connect?

SPEAKER_01 10:05

Yeah. Well, and before I do that, just as a like a side note about that color, when we were in Nashville, there is a historic hotel there that was the site of uh a very important part in the women's suffrage movement. So Tennessee was the last state to sort of ratify um women being able to vote. And the way they added up the votes was with yellow roses. And so we found that up after, in fact, and uh it was a nice kind of happy coincidence.

SPEAKER_00 10:44

Super cool. You know, your RAS was kicking in, right?

SPEAKER_01 10:46

So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I'm sorry, I forgot the question you asked me.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

I don't remember it, it was something brilliant. No, I just I wanted to ask Her Best Life for our audience just a little bit about it, where to find them, where to go if they're interested in learning more.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Yeah. So Her Best Life was founded about almost seven years ago. And it's a really special company because it's a company that was born of true love and friendship from me and six of my best friends. And we wanted to bring to others what we had, which was a powerful mastermind experience where we could all grow in our leadership, our health, our wealth, our business, and our thinking bigger. And so we formed Her Best Life. And you can go to herbestlife.com and find out about all the programs and everything that we do there.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

On all the social handles, same uh name too.

SPEAKER_01 11:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:43

You know, and and as people are listening and I'm thinking about it, you think about like a real Mike Dooley. It's funny. If you want today, if you want something to work, attempt to get all the, and there I'm sure there's uh a social platform that we haven't even thought about it. I actually just joined Substack. I don't know if you're on there or not. I joined that about two weeks ago. There's gonna be a social platform that we're not even thinking about. Do you guys have a strategy that you're like, okay, we need to make sure we hold that name on that new social platform or no strategy around this?

SPEAKER_01 12:12

We did. No, we're not that coordinated yet. Yeah. It's been kind of a little side hustle that's turned into a real business for us. And um, but I think we have all the we have all the big ones, you know.

SPEAKER_00 12:24

Well, you know, Gary says it's right.

SPEAKER_01 12:26

Not on Substack yet.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

Well, after this we will be, right? So Gary always says, right? He says, uh, it's progress, not perfection. And I think that's the thing that I want the listeners to learn too. If you think about it, you know, look at how great. And and and to your point, it was like, oh, how awesome. They're on stage. If they only knew Simon Sinek, and I think actually I I was there, I think they did say he got sick or did something, but still, if you would have thought about it, you're ready to go.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

COVID.

SPEAKER_00 12:53

COVID, I think so, yeah. Yeah. And uh, if people were like, oh, there's they were so buttoned up, they were so organized, it's because you were reading, you were learning, you're with your best friends, and I love that you're able to do that.

SPEAKER_01 13:04

Yeah, that's really cool.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

How are you keeping yourself sharp to be a really good, you know, podcast? I had a mentor say, know a little bit about a lot. And I think that's so true if you go deep in some of the things that you're doing.

SPEAKER_01 13:16

Yeah, I try to bring things from the outside in. Um, you know, Keller Williams has taught me so much. And you know, this at a certain amount of time, it kind of you're kind of full. You kind of got it all. Not that I've not that Gary or Keller Williams has taught me everything. I don't want to say that. That sounds egotistical, but you know, you kind of know a lot of the things. And so it's really getting out and going to other conferences. So I went to a longevity and wealth conference in Park City earlier this year, and I just met some really interesting people, deep dive with different people in a lot of different arenas talking about different things. So I'm just trying to do more of that, and it's easier for me because I'm an empty nester now.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

I I was I have a lot of questions around that, but longevity is funny. I never think about goal setting. I when I worked in corporate America, I never talked about I'm gonna live to 100 or I want to live to 90, I want to live to 95. I would love to know, and I'm sure audience would, about the conference. What what was a key takeaway you had or a couple key takeaways?

Leadership, Community, And Momentum

SPEAKER_01 14:25

Um, well, it was a longevity and wealth conference. And so on the wealth side, you know, this idea of taking your wealth and the assets that you've created and moving them around to help you live the rest of your life. Because I think we've primarily just collected assets, right? And so now we're at the point where we might take a rental property where we're we tore it down and we're building three properties on it instead. So kind of doing that kind of thing, or just saying like this rental property has we've gotten all the worth that we want out of it, and we want to do something, buy a you know, second home or something like that. You know what I mean? Like just that concept of kind of trading up almost.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

That's great. I was at a KW Wealth where they were talking about that. They said lay out your whole portfolio and kind of look at your bop bottom 25%. Is it earning you the tax depreciation that you want, the cash flow that you want? And you might flip that. So to your point, you might grab those that actually uh in KW Wealth, one of the people took it to an oil and gas fund. So they 1031 the real estate property to a uh oil and gas fund, which a lot of people are like, Oh, you can't do that. Well, some of the times it's knowledge or information. I that's what I have loved over my journey is like someone new is doing something. What you just said, a property, maybe that house was 800,000. You tore it down. Could you go? Maybe some of the money mechanics behind that. I'm pretty interested, I'm sure audience would be in that property that you did, the three units.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

Yeah. So in Austin, now you can put three properties on one piece of land. And we have a lot of homes in central Austin, and the land is worth way more than the houses on them. And so we bought this property as a flip in 2020, and it's been a good rental for us. It's paid off now. And Austin all of a sudden said you could build three units on there. So we're turning 1,100 square feet into about 5,500 square feet, and we'll go from about$2,600 a month in rent to about 18,000 at rent.

SPEAKER_00 16:48

That's awesome. Talk about a legacy.

SPEAKER_01 16:50

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We I mean, and we could move in there if we wanted to. You know, the the places will be really nice.

SPEAKER_00 16:57

I'm gonna back up a little bit. We started forward pacing, but for our audience, too, if you look at your first side hustle, you know, you well what tell us a little bit how you first started. I I know the story and I forget, I know you all too well, but I want to make sure our audience too kind of kind of goes back to a little bit of the beginning. Will you take them back to the beginning?

Branding Choices And Visual Signals

SPEAKER_01 17:15

Well, I got a lot of side hustles. Um, I don't even think you know this, but my first real estate side hustle was after I quit my job and I was staying home with my kids, is I worked for Outfront magazine. I was a writer. Yeah, yeah. So I wrote stories for Outfront and I did that. And then I also worked for a local realtor uh who was our realtor, Peter Dennison. And I would uh stuff envelopes for him. So I would do his mailings to his client. I would do his client mailings, so I'd stuff the envelopes, you know, while my kids were napping or whatever. And um, I've always had a side hustle. I was an editor for many years. Actually, that's how Jay got his job at Keller Williams because I was working full time and then I was coming home and editing books and Jay was free quote unquote freelancing. He did not have a job, and I would come home, and he did some free, he did some some freelancing gigs, but I got tired of like doing both. And so I came home one day and he was playing video games, and I was like, time for a real job. So that's when he got his job at KW.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

Fast forward, some of those video game people. I look at it, I read articles on them, and they're like, Oh, they flipped a video game for four billion dollars. It's pretty crazy.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

That was Jay. I would love to say that it was, but it wasn't.

SPEAKER_00 18:54

Well, like I had a side hustle. I had um I have multiple, like you two, you know, every every day on the way over here to the podcast, somebody was talking to me about another one. And I want I want to ask you, uh, so for me, for instance, I was like, oh, staging business. That's a no-brainer slam dunk. But where I was at the time, I had six storage units, all this furniture, sprinter van, who's gonna move the stuff. And I realized from my own PL, it was like$200 profit margin. I already had the listing anyway. It didn't make sense for my time. So I exited out of that business. And I had Gene Rivers say this to me one time. He said, Mike, you need to pick a number that business needs a net. So my number, for instance, is a quarter million dollars net profit. So if it will not net profit, it has to be a no because obviously there's going to be continue to be things that put in front of you. So do you have a process or a number for our audience to say, okay, here's what you should build? And I think it depends on where you are in your life and your business. 10 years ago it would have been different, but now it's like, okay, my time is the hardest thing to hold in control.

SPEAKER_01 19:58

Yeah. Well, you're definitely a serial entrepreneur. So I watch you from afar and I'm like, wow, he's got a lot of fingers and a lot of things. Um, for me, you know, the real estate team has always been the core. So that's the operations incubates out of that. And so anything that's ancillary kind of makes sense. And so that's when we started our handyman or remodeling company. And that company does not throw off a quarter million dollars in profit. Uh, and I don't really care because it surfaces it's uh services, our real estate team, and then we have 16 doors.

SPEAKER_00 20:39

Uh so sometimes it's sometimes it's fixing a pain that actually could be more than a quarter million dollars. It sounds like it's also business development. Uh, that was one thing in COVID that I I figured out a way to whenever a client came to me and said, Can you help me do my insurance? Can you help me do mortgages or refines? I was usually like, no, let me connect you with someone or whatever it is. And I said during COVID, I always want to figure out a way to say yes. That sounds like that's your yes bucket. So if somebody, it sounds like today, yeah, go ahead. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:08

Yeah, well, it's yeah, especially for the rentals, you know. I mean, we were paying out hand-y-hand full-time anyway, so we might as well pay a company that we know, love, and trust. And um, so it's been good for us. And it is profitable. It's not, it's just not that much.

SPEAKER_00 21:21

So well, and if a client now does not know about three units being able to be put on one property in Austin, now you actually have all the pieces and you can educate them and be an educator to provide that.

Her Best Life: Mission And Access

SPEAKER_01 21:34

We did a web uh not a webinar, but we did an in-person seminar about it recently and had a panel of experts. And I love to do that. Like my passion is always been investing. That's how I got started in real estate. I was a real estate investor for five years before I got my real estate license. And that's actually why I got my real estate license is to save money on investment properties. My goal, my first year was. To make$15,000 and that's it. So I could buy rental.

SPEAKER_00 22:05

It's funny how times have changed, you know, and now you're like, how do I make that either a week or a month? Uh your financial thermostat, I um uh a young guy that I know, he was our first intern nine years ago, almost 10 years ago. He's actually working at Kraft Foods uh now, and that's where I started kind of my first career. And it was funny, I made$29,000 was my my salary. And I was excited about it, you know, and you think about it too. And there's nothing nothing wrong with that, but as you know, cost of living and all those things, it's tough to say, okay, I want to stuff money away for the kids for college. What are those pieces? You have to have more income. And I know Jay wrote an article at one time, um, uh Hergenrother, I was on a call with Adam and Jay, and he was presenting to some people, and he talked about this happiness meter. People say sometimes you can't be happy with a certain amount of money, but he said there's a lot of research done around that. 75k, and I remember this loud and clear, and I always thought about our staff and our people. And he one of the things he said in there is you can put more things in your target basket, which I think resonates with people once you hear that. You can donate them more, you can do a little bit of things there, which are more important. You hit on something, you talked about being an investor for five years. Knowing what you know today, would you change anything in those first five years?

SPEAKER_01 23:19

I don't think so. I mean, I I became a land lady. Well, actually, the first real estate deal that we did as an investor was Jay was writing the millionaire real estate investor, and we'd never done any investing. So he thought, well, better know what I'm talking about here. And so it was me, Dave Jenks, Jay, and then their research assistant, Heather I Arusso. And all three of them were working full time at KWRI. And I was a stay-at-home mom at the time. And so we were all in it partners, you know, four four pieces of the pie. And I ended up doing a lot of the sweat equity because I wasn't working. And we really made some big mistakes with a foundation company and the plumbing got wrecked, and so all of our profit got eliminated, and we ended up getting$2,000 that we split four ways. And we were just thinking like$500. Like, I was I did all the plant. I planted the whole front yard, you know. And so, but it was a good learning lesson.

SPEAKER_00 24:23

Oh, well, you know, I love even Gary has his own vulnerability in that book. In the beginning of the book, you know, he talks about buying the condo and then losing out on the condo. Um, I've heard, you know, I go back to Gene Rivers sometimes because he resonates with me a lot. He talked about the red book is how you earn the money, the the blue book is how you actually develop the wealth and keep the wealth. And I know that's a lot of things that you've been focused on uh over the years for sure.

SPEAKER_01 24:48

It's true. I mean, we've had a really nice partnership because Jay's had really great steady W-2 income. And I am very grateful for that. And a lot of people who are investors, they haven't had that. And I've had the ability to kind of do the other stuff that's helped us build the wealth. And and some of that money he's made has gone towards that. And I've kind of done the work. And then when I got my real estate license, a lot of the money that I was making did go back into real estate. And we just kept our expenses low. You know, when we got when I got into real estate, we decided to continue to live off of one salary, which we'd been doing for five years. And it would have been a lot easier not to do that. And that was our choice. And and we felt really poor for many years.

SPEAKER_00 25:39

But that that's a life lesson right there. If people are listening, I think that's important. Sometimes when you get uh a uh you know, a flip, you make a lot of money, you do something, you're quick to either spend it. Or and a lot of people don't realize once you really one of the things that I didn't necessarily understand or pay attention, because no one teaches you this, when you start making uh considerable wealth or income is taxes. So if you're really not strategizing and really planning for those, uh you can really get hit with that. We see that a lot of agents are our rookie of the years and all those people, you know, they they've jumped up an income making three or four X uh what what they've made before in the past from a W-2 role or whatever that is, they're not ready for that. I did want to go into, yeah, if people are listening, what are some of the things that you're thinking about? Are you doing some creative things? Are you doing hard many hard money lending? Are you doing, you know, uh oil and gas? What what are the things are you are staying with Steady Eddie? Or what are you looking at?

SPEAKER_01 26:35

Yeah, so um we are we've done lots of different kind of fun things. Um the the development is is is really the thing that I'm focused on right now. And that includes this three plaques that we're building here in Austin. That's about you know$1.6 million deal. And then I have a development that I'm doing with a partner in California. We're doing a high-end flip there, so that's like a$1.5 million house that we're flipping. And we've invested in some businesses. So we have a good friend that's starting a platform for business brokerages, and we've invested in that. It's called Deal Ony. I'm on the board of advisors for that. Um, and of course, we've got a lot of real estate.

Staying Sharp Beyond Real Estate

SPEAKER_00 27:29

We're invested. Could you go a little deeper into that um business? I love it. I'm looking right now at a um dumpster business, and it's funny. And I know we've brought several speakers at CEO Summit and other places talking about buying businesses. And uh one of the ones that I'm looking at is an 88-unit roll-off dumpster business. And I'm like, this is this is a no-brainer. The the people that are in it now are looking to exit. And I every if people are not doing this today, please write this in your toolkit. One of the first questions I always ask is, would you own or finance the down payment? I asked that 100% of the time. Even if I had$100 million liquid, I would still ask that question because that way my liquid money, I can use it whatever the way I want. And about 99% of the time, they say yes. Usually they say no, because they're thinking that you're saying, can we own or finance the whole thing? And I'm saying, let me walk you through this. I want to owner finance the down payment. Usually it's gonna save them on taxes and it's gonna be a better strategy, and they'll have a second mortgage on there, so they still have ownership if something goes sideways. Once people explain that part to them, it's a win.

SPEAKER_01 28:39

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, our branch is owner financed, it's the best thing we've ever done. Yeah, so Dealonomy is for business owners, and it's the only online marketplace where qualified business owners can sell their company in a competitive environment with thousands of great buyers. So, usually what happens is if you are a business broker, the listing agent pays the business broker to sell and market their business. And they've this company has kind of flipped that in that buyers pay to be a part of this marketplace, part of Deal Onomy. And the it's a monthly membership. And then what Deal Anomy does is it vets the businesses because you know you're you've looked into buying businesses. I mean, most of the time you look at a business and it's full of businesses personal expenses, there's not a lot of profit, the owner operator is grinding away at 60 hours a week, and they're it's just not a great business. And so what they've done at Deal Only is they're vetting the businesses. They're they've got someone who's looking through the PLs and making sure that it's all you know a good qualified business.

Longevity, Wealth, And Portfolio Moves

SPEAKER_00 29:54

Well, well, just I I if you think about this, it's brilliant. Uh, congratulations. Because I've heard many mentors talk about this. The number one businesses in the world are membership. What I heard too, and I gravitated to you right away, and you probably have a your organization probably has a pro forma on that too. How many more members do we need? What's what's our waterfall? What does all those pieces look like? As you look at Netflix, Walmart, Amazon, all the biggest companies in the world are all membership based. So one of the things that I'm thinking about in my next 10-year strategy is how do I get more membership-based companies. So the roll-off dumpster, as an example, has a component of that because what builders are doing is, you know, if you if you were a large building organization, you might actually have your own roll-off dumpsters. But most of them, like, oh no, that's a line item I just want done. They're actually paying that monthly. So if you're doing a development, which I know you're going to do the three units, that might sit there for 12 months. Well, great. You're actually writing a check to me on a monthly basis, even though we don't think about that like a monthly membership company, but there's so many of those that are in a different peripheral from a line item because from a builder developer, that's a line item in their builder trend or whatever software they're using. It's smart. Well, I know I know I was saying I was getting excited. I was getting like geeked out a little bit too. So you're gonna be able to a buyer, if you will, and is it a website or is it an app?

SPEAKER_01 31:18

Yeah, it's a website. Yeah, you can go to it's it's D-E-A-L-O-N-M-Y deal on the me.

SPEAKER_00 31:26

Very cool. I like it.

SPEAKER_01 31:27

Yeah, too much.

SPEAKER_00 31:28

And in businesses, people, you know, just another life lesson. You you're hitting me with so many of them is your mounting your website. If someone's starting new or starting a business too, you need to think about your character length. Even though we still have this AI and chat functionality, sometimes if they're either driving, listening to radio, looking at billboards, all those things, they need to have that memorization. So I think that's really important in developing uh businesses. So that's that's smart.

SPEAKER_01 31:54

Well, I thank you. I had nothing to do with the name, but I appreciate that. I'm just on the board. I'm just an investor and I'm on the board. So um I'm and it's really been it's actually been a really great experience for me because you asked earlier like how you keep sharp. And I'm one of the few people on the board who's not a business broker. And so I bring a very different experience. And what's great is I will because I don't know, I'll ask a question out of a blue, and literally everyone will turn and look at me, and they'll be like, wow, that's so smart, because they're all in their business broker box, and I'm over here thinking like a different kind of business center.

SPEAKER_00 32:43

Uh why uh Mitch has said that from Keller Capital. I've heard him many times. He asks really good, and it's not that they're like he says, he in his words, not my words, he says, it's not that I'm seeing that I'm I'm dumb or uneducated. Obviously, we want to see a lot of businesses fail. So he goes a little bit deeper to ask, how do I make a dollar? How does the widget work? How does that some of that functionality? To your point, you we've seen a lot of people that we know and trust in other businesses where businesses fail. Um, you know, I've I've had a couple of them, different ones that you I wish I would have asked better questions in the beginning. How do we turn a profit? Uh, you know, when you're thinking about buying a business, what is your vision? And if they go, my vision for the next six months, to me, that's not a vision. I actually just launched from my Kelly Williams office, I did our 2030 vision. And I think there is a lot of operators in the brokerage space that aren't thinking about that. Well, you know what? Real estate's gonna be done a lot different in 2030 than it is today. How is AI being used? How is um one of the things we're talking about? I'm pretty proud of this, and I think you would like this a lot, is having everyone in our office have a hundred percent home ownership. Well, the next question is well, how are people gonna get down payments or how are they gonna have savings? We're actually creating a fund from some of those that are having blessing and doing well, and we'll be the hard money lender for the person. Some of them could be grants, some of them could be even that person making a return on their money to be able to pay that forward. And I was and I did not come up with that idea. I came up with the idea of the 100% ownership, but I love what you just said. Someone asked a really good question. Well, if somebody is maybe not making the salary they need to or having a hard time saving, how are we gonna help them have home ownership? And I just thought that was brilliant that someone said, Well, we're gonna lend it to them together, we're gonna be a tribe.

unknown 34:32

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

Super cool. Well, if you're thinking about the next as we, you know, we're gonna keep rolling for a little bit if that's fun. If you think about the next five to ten years, do you have some things out there that you're excited about?

Austin Three-Unit Development Math

SPEAKER_01 34:45

I think for me, it's really getting back into the real estate development. And that's how I started. And then when I started my real estate team, as you know, it's extremely distracting. Um it's been a wonderful distraction, a 16-year distraction. And so it's yeah, so it's for fun, it's fun getting back into all that and doing more of that and kind of upgrading. We want to buy a commercial property, we have one, but we want to buy another industrial property. And then, you know, our kids are empty nesters. So, you know, we are good. We don't have to make any more money, we're financially free. And so just deploying our money in ways that make an impact.

SPEAKER_00 35:33

The commercial real estate space, I feel like, is even the easiest to own or finance a down payment. Oh man, I, you know, I was able to buy my my building in Bentonville uh that way, which is really fun because it is a win-win-win. The people get that got their number, they got full price. Uh, and then I was able to get an opportunity, and then we renovated part of the building and then um actually take them out whenever we did that uh renovation, which is pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01 35:59

I had on here Well, and I just was gonna say we want to we have a a ranch that's 300 acres, and we want to sit sell that 1031 it and turn it into something closer and smaller so that we can do more retreat type things, you know. Jay and I would get a lot out of that.

SPEAKER_00 36:19

Very cool. Uh and I know you've experienced so you so I love you said this. Let's let's do it. But I was gonna say, too, when you think about real estate investing, and you kind of said this in the very beginning, want to make sure our audience hears it too. Just because too, you had a so ranch, for instance, you had a great use of it, you enjoyed it, you had it a certain time in your life. Now your life is shifting to a different spot. Now you're gonna be able to use that appreciation. Yeah, I think you said you owner how to owner finance there too. So it's a win-win-win where you got great use out of it. Now your life is changing, and you're gonna be able to 1031, that's something that's gonna be even a stronger use case for you. I think sometimes people think in real estate, I have to hold something forever. Now, I think there is times for that, but I think you always need to look at your piece of real estate. Am I it's not only are the numbers making sense, am I getting value out of it, right? From a font and a care.

SPEAKER_01 37:12

Yeah, no, I think that's so that's a that's exactly it. And I think for so long, it's just for us, it's been buy and hold. And in Austin, the rental properties don't cash flow that great. And so we've we have a lot of equity in our properties. And for us, it's not really about the cash flow. It's really about okay, what can we do to kind of deploy that uh you know, equity that we've been blessed to receive our last 20 years, and whether that's helping charities or buying a place where we could, you know, do retreats and and pour into people or just have fun with our family. Uh it's just a it's fun to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 37:52

Yeah. And if people are listening to, they might see uh you or me or other people today and they go, Oh, I want to have what they have. And I you just dropped something that I love over 20 years. So it does, it is. I always say this to people, it's a marathon, not a sprint.

SPEAKER_01 38:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:07

Now there's some, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

And we've both worked our butts off. Let's be real. We worked our butts off.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

This is a crane operator. Sometimes there is things that can be a sprint. You know, maybe okay, our goal for our organization is 33 under contracts this month. Well, that can be a little bit of a sprint, but you know, there's other things that are marathon that are helping us go where we wanted to go. I had a couple more questions. I think it's gonna actually, Valentine's Day will be 10 years.

unknown 38:34

Okay.

Early Side Hustles And First Deals

SPEAKER_00 38:34

So it's actually not that long. I, you know, I did I launched Yankee Candle at Walmart before I got into real estate. So I had an entrepreneur bug, but I think here, here's, and thank you to people like you and other people that are out there. I mean, I can name millions of them. Ben Candy, go through the list that they paved the way for me. So when I started uh Valentine's Day 2016, I was a really good listener, a really good learner. I went to 13 different events my first year. So Kristen Cole, you know, she had that expansion summit out in Arizona, I think that year. There was there was a million things that were happening, and all I did is just gobble up information. And I've always done that. So sometimes when people see me, they don't realize, and I want to challenge anyone to do this. I'm learning and listening and watching. Now I'm still failing like crazy, but I don't spend months and months on my failure. I go, okay, what would I do differently? How would I do it differently? Let me think about some things. And then it's usually 24 hours, okay, let's go do something different. And I'm always, and I think you said this too. We always need to be looking at businesses, investments. We need when someone says, Hey, I have an idea, I always want to say yes, I want to look at it, no matter what it is. One of the ones I'll plant a seed, and I don't know if you've ever looked at this, drop yards. Have you ever heard about a drop yard before? They're brilliant. So uh say you need two acres piece of property. All it is is gravel and a fence, and you can put anything in there. You could put boats, RV, tractor trailers, all that. You'll have some security around there. So there's no person manning it. So there's no W-2 salaries.

SPEAKER_01 40:11

Are you from Arkansas or something?

SPEAKER_00 40:12

I know. Obviously, we have one of the biggest uh trucking companies in the world here. But if you look at it, people have stuff, they just do, you know, exactly. So what it does to me, and here's why I like this as an asset class. Maybe your financial, maybe as far as a you only had a certain piece and you could acquire the dirt, maybe you owner finance the dirt, but then you paid for the fence and you had it ready. If it was a really good piece of property, and this is what I heard you say too, say so, fast forward 10 years, 20 years, um, I forgot where I heard this, but it grab any main street and go seven miles from Main Street. So that's gonna be your future Walmart, your future Target, your figure at Costco. So say I had this piece of property and it started as a drop yard. Well, I'm building my real estate investment portfolio as a mutual fund. So some things, and you talked about you're gonna have a$14,000 increase from going from one unit to three. Well, that was part of your mutual fund, but this would be a long-term strategy where by dirt, someone might go, oh, that's a future Walgreens. Well, maybe what if I actually uh had a triple net and I actually did a land lease? Now I own the Walgreens. Then I can 1031. So I'm thinking a little bit further and thinking about the game as a marathon, not a sprint.

SPEAKER_01 41:30

Well, I live in a city of two and a half million people. So seven miles from Main Street is pretty that's a pretty expensive drop yard.

SPEAKER_00 41:39

Well, we might have 17 or 70. You know what I know is there's certain cities like dripping springs, I know, and other ones that are like you're like, oh, that's far away. But someone in Austin, how do you close the gap, right? How do you pick up the pieces? Eventually, all that's gonna tie together.

SPEAKER_01 41:56

Of course. Yeah, no, of course. I hear you. Yeah, there's lots of land between Austin and San Antonio, and that's all gonna be at some point, that's gonna be like the D, that's like gonna be DC Baltimore. You know, that'll all be one kind of contiguous uh industry and subdivisions and all that kind of stuff. And so there's tons and tons of land there. So yeah, makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 42:21

That's we're kind of wrapping up. You sold me.

SPEAKER_01 42:23

Yeah, you sold me a drop down. I'm googling it. I'm googling it.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

You have a lot of things moving on, you know, a lot of businesses, a lot of things. What kind of systems or tools or people uh really help make you make that happen?

SPEAKER_01 42:37

Well, I have a lot of great people in my life for sure. Um, I have number one, I have a basically my VP of operations. She runs operations for our commercial real estate team, our residential real estate team, and our handyman and development company. So she kind of does all that. And then I have an executive assistant and she helps me with a lot of the other stuff. She handles all the rentals, she actually handles the development, both developments. Um and then just, you know, she's wrapping my Christmas presents. She's she's helping with that kind of stuff too. She's a she's incredible that way. She runs the gamut. And yeah, just getting really clear about what my lane is, what I'm good at, and then not feeling like I have to micromanage everything else in my world. You know, if it's if it's 85% done, I'm good with it. Yep, what are they saying?

SPEAKER_00 43:36

And buy back your time.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

Yeah, buy back your time.

SPEAKER_00 43:39

Yep, uh uh 80% done by someone else's 100% done.

Cash Flow, Taxes, And Discipline

SPEAKER_01 43:43

Yes, a hundred percent. So that's I'm good at buying back my time. I have worked a lot, I'm a hard worker, and I still am. And I wake up almost every day and I look at my calendar. And I think I love my life.

SPEAKER_00 44:02

If people wanted to learn more about you or follow you or send referrals your way or send uh three unit developments your way, how do they find out more about you or where to find you?

SPEAKER_01 44:13

Uh I'm on Instagram. So Wendy Papazan. Uh, or you can check out HerBest Life at herbestlife.com. Or you can shoot me an email. I'm very easy to find. I'm the only Wendy Papazan in the world.

SPEAKER_00 44:26

That's awesome. That's pretty cool. Maybe that should be a uh a future podcast name.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

Yeah, maybe.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

Is that your fun fact? Was it two truths and a lie?

SPEAKER_01 44:35

Yeah, it's true. Yeah, Papazan is a very unusual name. And uh there's as far as I know, there's only one Wendy Papazan.

SPEAKER_00 44:44

So I know you're about to go have fun with your husband and have is it day night? Is it staying in? What are we doing?

SPEAKER_01 44:49

Actually, tonight we're going to the Kate Keller Williams uh Christmas party is tonight. So we'll be down at the Austin Trail of Lights with our friends over at KWRI.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Very cool, very cool. Well, this is all brought to you by our friends at Mutual Omaha Mortgage. So we want to thank them for sponsoring us and hanging out. We truly appreciate you coming on, the real Mike Dooley. Thank you, thank you, Wendy. And I'm looking, hopefully it doesn't hopefully I'm able to see you sooner than this, but I know I'll see you February 20th uh in Atlanta. I'm excited about Atlanta. I know, I can't wait. Well, good. We'll give your husband a hug and a kiss and a high five, and thank you for everything you do for me and our company. Have a great weekend. Thanks for listening to the Real Mike Dooley podcast. Subscribe, share, stay real. I'm Mike Dooley. Until next time, I'm not sure.