Confidence Isn't What You Think It Is (with Kristen Arnett)

Season 2, Episode 12

Confidence is often misunderstood, and it might be the very thing holding you back.

In this final episode of the constraint series, I’m joined by my friend Kristen Arnett, confidence coach and founder of Meant to Be Me, who walks us through what confidence actually is (and what it isn’t).

If you’ve ever felt behind, overlooked, or lacking the confidence to go after your dreams, this episode will give you a new way to think about confidence—and a practical path forward.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Welcome back to your next chapter, the podcast for women who read, write, and live creatively. I'm your host, Rebecca Hasselak, and today is a very special episode for a few reasons. First of all, it's the last episode in season two, so thank you very much for listening and coming along for the ride. Second of all, we're closing out our constraint series. We've covered how time, money, and readiness can hold you back in your creative pursuits and what to do about that. And this episode is particularly special because our final constraint is confidence, and I cannot think of a better person to talk with about that. I have a guest in the house today, and it's my friend Kristen Arnett. And before I read her bio, I do just want to say that she also is a big reason that this podcast even came to be. I had been thinking about doing it for about a year, and she has a podcast going that's amazing that we will tell you about so you can go take a listen. But she really helped me with encouragement. She gave me some of the tools she used, frameworks, and just kind of made it feel more accessible to me. So without her, I wouldn't have this. So thank you, Kristen.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Oh, you're so welcome.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Yes, and so I will tell you a little about her and then we can dig into confidence and where it can hold you back with creativity. Kristen Arnett is a confidence coach, former teacher, and founder of Meant to Be Me. She helps moms raise confident tween and teen girls while strengthening connection at home. Passionate about helping girls believe in their inherent worth, Kristen has spent over a decade guiding girls toward confidence and resilience through her podcast, local workshops, and online course. Thank you so much for being here, Kristen. Thank you so much for having me. I'm really grateful that you're going to talk with us today. And I would love to just start with a little bit about your story. What led you to create Meant to Be Me in the first place and focus on confidence to begin with?

SPEAKER_00 2:06

Great question. So I back in the early days of parenting, which was maybe, I don't know, 10-ish years ago or so. I'm a big reader, I'm a big researcher. So I can remember as my kids were kind of starting to leave this childhood baby stage. I was just kind of researching like what are the most important things as a mom I can be focusing on? Because there's so many things, right? And it's so overwhelming. And I kept seeing in so many different places, like confidence, confidence, confidence. Like that is just this foundation that if you give them tools for that, it makes everything else in their life easier, right? Whether it's their extracurricular activities or their friends, how they do in school. I mean, so much of life is knowing that you're worthy and believing in yourself. And those are skills we really never stop practicing. So the sooner you can start giving them to your kids, the better. And so I kind of knew, okay, so that's like one of the main things I want to focus on. And I think it was meant to be for sure that I had a friend that reached out to me in 2019 and she said, Hey, I have this idea to start this these workshops basically for our girls that are around fourth through sixth grade. What if we started bringing local girls together and giving them some of these confidence tools and also mental health tools, just understanding that their thoughts create their feelings and that helps determine their future? And will you write the curriculum for it? She just asked me because she knew I used to be a teacher. And so I was like, oh yeah, I can kind of adapt some of these things into that age group. And so we for several years ran workshops. Over a thousand girls, you know, have been through them, and we were able to give that to our own girls during those ages, which was super helpful. And then the last couple of years, they have moved on. My business partners, I had two of them, have moved on to different ventures, and I decided to keep the business and to run it on my own. And so now I also do, you know, some work with moms in the podcast, like you mentioned, and still do the local workshops as well. But it's been really fun for me to just dive so deep into the confidence research as I wrote the curriculum to help so many other girls, and then also just to keep that in my own mind for my own life, for my girls, you know, for my kids at home. So it's been fun.

SPEAKER_01 4:16

Absolutely. And I will say that my daughter and I have both been participants in Meant to Be Me, and I just I can't say enough good things about it. I think it's incredible curriculum, and you have such a way of connecting with girls that age and understanding what's really going on there. So for this, most of our listeners are adults, of course, but I think um I was thinking about it, and even though a lot of what you teach is geared toward tweens and teens, I do feel like a lot of us as women, you know, hopefully we've grown and dealt with some of our insecurities and things from when we were younger, but I still think each of us carries something from that time period with us. And those are such pivotal years, and a lot of the time the things we're insecure about then do sort of follow us into adulthood if we don't become intentional about changing that and addressing it. So I think you will have a lot to say to us today. So I wanted to start. I remember you talking about the confidence spectrum, and actually, my daughter told me about it from your workshop, and so and she was really excited about it. So can you explain sort of what that is, what it means, and how it can apply to people, especially women who are maybe pursuing creative fields?

SPEAKER_00 5:20

Yes, I this is one of my favorite things that I learned that we teach. And just to back up for a second, though, on what you said about how you feel like this is still something that we need as adults. The life coach, actually, who taught me the confidence spectrum, her name is Jodi Moore. So I give her the credit for introducing it to me, but she is always actually talking about how self-love and confidence are things that we're always working on. And she just this week did a reel where she compared it to brushing your teeth. Like the for the whole rest of our life, we never are just like, oh, we're done brushing our teeth. We just have to keep doing it like every single morning. And she's like, that's literally how it is, even in our 30s, even in our 40s. We're women and we are still gonna sometimes have those thoughts creep into our mind that we're not enough, we're not, you know, good enough, and we have to use the tools that we have to keep working on that. So it really is a lifelong pursuit. And the confidence spectrum, actually, I mean, I probably heard it for the first time at 35, and I was like, are you serious? That's what confidence means. So we'll get into it here. Basically, just picture a horizontal line where at the far right end of the spectrum is pride. And when I say pride, not like being proud of yourself, but just maybe thinking that you're better than someone else, right? Maybe a little too much has gone to your head, and you're like, okay, because of how I look or what I do or all the compliments I get, I am a little bit better than other people. And then the other side, the far left side of the spectrum, being shame. This is where we beat ourselves up. This is where we say things like, What's wrong with me? Why can't I get it together like that other mom does, or like that other creative does? And we kind of spiral that way, make it really personal. So the question I love to ask is where do you think someone who is truly confident falls on this spectrum? And most of the time when I ask this in the workshops, the girls say, not all the way on the pride side, but maybe a little over on the pride side. You know, you want to really feel good about yourself, but you know, but not fully too much. And so the answer is that it's right in the middle. It's when you actually realize that nothing that you do, nothing with how you look, nothing about how much money you have, I mean, just anything that sometimes we rank ourselves, like sometimes better or worse than other people, determines our worth. We are inherently just worthy as humans. We all have equal worth no matter what. And so if we're right in the middle and if we're thinking about, you know, nothing I do makes me better or worse than anyone else, that's where we really lean into true confidence. And that's how we really see others, I feel, for their worth too, and don't judge others. And I always tell the girls though, too, it's pretty impossible to stay perfectly in the middle at all times. Like you'll catch yourself drifting back and forth. But once you can picture that confidence spectrum in your mind, it really just helps so much to be like, okay, I can feel myself going into shame, you know. So what thoughts do I need to bring me back towards confidence? Or if you're going on the other side, right? On the pride way, like, hey, how can I humble myself a little bit and get back to confidence? So that's kind of a visual of what it is.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

Right. I love that. And so I would have also answered the way the girls did. I would have thought a little right of center. And yeah. So that is interesting. And I'm curious if you are, I think it's a little easier to think of some thoughts, maybe if you're going more toward the shame side of things. But if you are a little more toward the pride side of things, how do you suggest kind of that self-talk to bring yourself back to the center? I guess on either side of the equation would be helpful. Do you have some examples?

SPEAKER_00 8:57

Yeah, and I mean, thinking of it from a perspective more of women and talking about creatives, you know, and business owners and stuff like that. I feel like a lot of times things that might drift us onto the pride spectrum sometimes can be like, oh, how many followers did we get or how many downloads did we get on this or people telling us how amazing we are, right? And then, you know, we can maybe be judgmental of someone who isn't as far on the journey or maybe isn't getting as many compliments. And I think just reminding ourselves of like, hey, I started somewhere too, and I'm just doing my best putting my work out there, but really it doesn't make me any better than, you know, women who aren't owning a business or women who aren't even working. I mean, we all are just so equal. I feel like just maybe moving it back a little bit towards that direction is helpful if if we do start going on that pride wise. And then really for me, I feel like one of the areas that I personally will spiral into shame about has to do with more of my at-home stuff, more of the, you know, why do I have such a hard time staying keeping my house organized? You know, my friends' houses are always so much cleaner. It's never been my strength. Really? Well, I mean, I do struggle with that too. Okay, glad I'm not alone. Because I feel like some of my friends are like type A, just like everything's always so organized. And I like sometimes will have those what's wrong with me. Like, why can't I get it together? And I'll just be like, you know what? I have my own strengths. This is not one of them, but it's something that I can learn and grow and keep trying on. And it doesn't, it just doesn't change my worth. Trying it back to like a worthiness standpoint helps me to love myself even though that's not my strength and get get back to confidence.

SPEAKER_01 10:36

And it sounds like too having a growth mindset is kind of what you're also talking about a little bit when you are on the same side rather than approaching it like beating yourself up about it, just realizing even if there is something I'm not happy about right now, I still have the power to make changes and make positive changes and sort of do that rather than just wallowing and oh, this will never be different.

SPEAKER_00 10:56

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 10:57

Yeah, and so I'm curious. One thing about kind of trying to hit that sweet spot in the middle is how do you recommend people show up when confidence isn't there and external factors have sort of reinforced that? So for instance, I think of the very visible arts for this, because of course, if I'm just sitting here writing by myself and no one's seeing what I'm writing, like it's I can just tell myself that you know, this is great and I can feel about it. But if I'm in a dance class or in orchestra or in, you know, whatever else where it's very visible, and maybe the teachers are complimenting certain people or certain women are getting opportunities and something I want to get opportunities in, and basically all the external forces are telling me a message that's sort of reinforcing I shouldn't be confident. How do you recommend someone deals with that and somehow finds that intrinsic worthiness despite what they're hearing from the outside?

SPEAKER_00 11:52

That's such a good question, and I think I think we have to acknowledge that anytime that that happens to us, we're gonna initially like feel a little bit sad about it and feel a little bit like like I'm working so hard on this too, and man, I've I it would feel so good. Like, right, we all love to be noticed, we all love to be praised, and so it just to acknowledge that hey, it's okay to feel a little bit sad about that, right? But if we spiral too much and feeling like, okay, well, I guess I should just quit, right? I guess this isn't just meant for me, then that's not where we want to be either. So you had asked a little bit before about the you are special book. So I kind of feel like this might be good to just tie in just a quick analogy about this because it really does relate. So when I teach confidence and self-worth to the girls in our workshops, I read a picture book and I tell them, You're never too old to read picture books. I know we think of like early elementary with this, but I read this book for the first time as an 18-year-old. My church leader read it to me, and I just was like, wow, that just really sticks with me. And even as an adult, the more I hear it, the more I apply it to my own life, and I can see where I need to remember this. So I'll tell you a little bit about the book. It is by Max Lucato, I think that's how you say his last name. And it is basically about this village of wooden people who go walking around giving each other stars and dots. So the really talented wooden people, they get stars every time they can do certain tricks, or if they look really beautiful, or whatever it is, it's like everyone walks around, and we can think of that in the question that you just asked as let's see external validation, you know, like, wow, you're such a good violinist or whatever it is. And it's like, ooh, that feels so nice. And of course we love to give compliments, but the opposite is, you know, sometimes we do give each other dots, right? Like sometimes we might have a friend or a coworker or someone who is kind of honest and blunt with us of like, yeah, that actually isn't very great. And that would be a gray dot, is what they would walk around and they would give each other in this town. Again, adults don't do it quite as much. Sometimes the the things that kids say to each other on the playground just breaks my heart. But dots are given out pretty freely sometimes as kids, and it hurts. And so this main character in the book, he tries so hard to get stars. He's trying his best, but all he gets is dots. And in fact, some people just walk up and give him dots just because that's all he has, he has no stars. And so it's this journey of him trying to discover I saw this girl and she has no stars or no or no dots. And so I want to be like her. How do I get to the point where what other people say about me and think about me doesn't matter? And he goes through this journey of believing in his inherent worth and that the stickers only stick if you let them. And so as he starts to believe that, his dots start to fall off one by one. And I love that so much because I think it reminds us that we're gonna get stars throughout life and we're gonna get dots, even as adults, and it's gonna feel good and it's also gonna hurt. But if we really, again, that's kind of tying us back to that confidence spectrum. I think of the stars as kind of pride if we let them stick to us, and I think of the dots as shame if we let them stick to us. And so being able to be like, thank you, you know, for the stars, but also I'm not gonna let that stick to me. And also the dots when you said almost feels like a dot if other people are getting the praise and notice and you're not, even if it's not a direct mean comment. It's like that kind of feels like a dot, right? So again, it's a journey, it's not gonna be overnight. But the more we can just realize, hey, do I love what I'm doing? You know, does it feel me? Is it something I am passionate about and I want to be doing? Then I have to take off the stickers and I have to just remind myself that I'm here, that growth mindset, I'm learning, I'm growing, and maybe someday I'll get noticed and praised. But also if not, I'm still living in alignment with what I value and what I feel like I should be doing right now. And that's really all that matters. So that was a very long answer. No, that was so many things.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

There's a lot to it. That is absolutely awesome. And it it reminded me of a few things too. I think with the with the stickers, I think I've always geared toward really like clinging to the stars, you know, in my own life and being like, oh, I want more of that and more of that. Um, and then that also can just create its own kind of spiral where if you don't keep getting them, then you kind of go more to the shame side. And it's just so yeah, I love that. If I do have a copy around here somewhere, but one of my favorites. But yeah, until I heard you explain that, I hadn't really realized how seeking out all the stars can also be just as detrimental in its own way, because then you're just tying your worth to that. And I tell my daughter, uh it's not my original thought, I heard this somewhere, probably a lot of somewhere, but that thoughts, her thoughts aren't facts, and same with other people's. So if we're taking what someone says that's maybe maybe negative about us, and we're just immediately assuming it's true, we need to filter that out, both our negative thoughts and other people's, and realize just because someone thinks something doesn't make it true, and then coming back to what we know about ourselves, and like you said, really zeroing in on do I love this? Why am I doing this in the first place? And that's where so much of the worth and the passion comes from. Yeah. So, yes, that is amazing. So, for for people who have been on the shame side of things for a while or want to start something new and are feeling pretty overwhelmed because their starting point is maybe chronologically closer to someone else's end point and they're sort of just overwhelmed by the idea of even beginning. What would you say? How can you get the courage to start and to try to have the confidence that you will grow, even if it might be a little difficult to begin with?

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Yeah, I feel like, especially at the beginning of any creative pursuit, you have to be so careful about comparison. Mel Robin's book, Little FM Theory, one of my favorite books, but she talks about comparison in there, about how it can either be a torture or a teacher. And I feel like when you're at the beginning of something, if you're comparing yourself, I do this even thinking, oh, this will help me. I want to learn from them. But it's like, oh no, if they're too far ahead for me, all I do is I get in my head and I just think, why even start? You know, people are out there like doing it so much better than me. So why even bother? And so, really, just getting into your own, like, hey, I'm just gonna start. I like how your last episode, you actually just talked about it doesn't have to be perfect. Let's just start and let's come up with one little goal. What are we gonna do next week or next month? What's our one goal? And then, like, once I get into something, once I'm kind of mid or towards the end of creating something, then I feel like comparing or seeing, oh, how did she run this workshop or how did she do her email? That's also an inspiration for me of like, okay, let me add up to what I already did. But if we're just trying to watch other people and be comparing so much at the beginning, it it almost feels impossible to get started. So I love just the small goals, get in our own zone, create what we can without making it perfect. And then sure, like look at others farther down the path for some inspiration. Then it's more instead of a torture, and then it becomes more of a teacher.

SPEAKER_01 18:49

Yes, I like that. And actually, let them is on my list of to be read. So I have heard good things and good. You're gonna love it. Good. And so then this brings up the topic of, and I've sort of subscribed to this through the years because when I was younger, I struggled a little bit with confidence, but a lot of the hobbies that I enjoyed and the the pursuits I enjoyed were actually very um performance-based. So it was sort of an interesting lane to find myself in. And I felt action brought about confidence in the whole fake it till you make it thing where I was just like, I'm going to act as if I'm confident. And that was a little bit of a charade, but I did feel like over time, maybe just forcing myself to adopt an air of confidence then helped me to try whatever I was trying, and then that helped me to grow, and then it did help me to eventually become confident. So, do you agree with that or is that a flawed approach in your opinion?

SPEAKER_00 19:40

No, I do agree with that. I mean, yes, there's something we can do before we even like get to that point of like kind of working on our thoughts, hyping ourselves up, but then after the action, for sure, like the confidence just grows. And it actually made me think of this is really perfect timing for me to be talking about this episode because it's been a minute since I've done something new and kind of scary. And on Tuesday, I did my first live Zoom workshop where I was teaching moms. That's something I haven't done before. And so as it was coming down to the right before, it's just so such a good reminder that I teach this stuff. I've been doing this for so long. And I also still have a human brain that has a fear of you know innate failure or what if people don't like this, or all the what-ifs like just come into our mind right before. And so I actually was using some inspiration from my daughter. She just did her first solo last Saturday, and she she struggles with anxiety, and so I just never know how it's gonna go for her. And so my anxiety as a mom backstage, this is her first time doing this. I'm like, is she going to freeze? Is she going to run? You just never really know for sure. But she did it, she did beautiful. I asked her afterwards, like, how was your anxiety, you know, going into it? Were you scared? And she's like, I was at first, but once I started, it was just fun. I had so much fun doing it. So literally just a few days later, I'm channeling her when this is feeling so scary and when I'm starting to doubt myself of like, can I do this? Do people even, you know, care and want this? It was just cute because I was channeling her, like, okay, this is gonna be fun. So even though I was very, very scared, I was like, the whole fake it till you make it, this is gonna be fun. And then sure enough, like once it started, once people started joining, I really did lean into that. This actually is fun. And now that it's over with, like you said, I'm that much more confident to do my next one. Sure, is fear gonna still come up, you know, a little bit, but hopefully it's a little bit less because I'm like, hey, I did this and and now I know how it's gonna go. So I totally agree with that.

SPEAKER_01 21:39

Well, I'm so proud of her, and I'm so proud of you also. That's so exciting. And that does remind me of something I read that um nerves and excitement can manifest the same physiologically in the body. So sometimes almost even just shifting your mindset, kind of like you said your daughter did, yeah from I'm so nervous to I'm excited and I'm Kind of channeling it into the fun part, it's like some of the same feelings, but it takes on a more positive spin. So I love that. Yeah, that totally makes sense. I love that. Well, this has been so amazing to hear from you and to get your insights. And so before you wrap, I would just say what is one final tip you would give someone who maybe has always struggled with confidence. You know, we talked about just taking the taking one little step. Is there anything else you would recommend if this is something that has always held someone back? Anything we haven't covered?

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Yes, a couple things. When you when we were just talking about confidence a second ago, I thought about how I wanted to remind people that so often we think that confidence means that, you know, we just totally believe in ourselves and we're just feeling so great about something. Some of my favorite definitions of confidence are being willing to be bad at something at first and being willing to feel in the emotion. So I'm like, okay, like that is actually confidence when we're super scared right before we do something, but we're still taking that action. That is confidence. We don't always have to be feeling like, I've got this and no fear. And so that's important for people to remember as they're moving forward with something of like, hey, this actually is practicing my confidence. I'm really scared and unsure, but I'm still taking these tiny steps towards whatever my dreams are, whatever my goals are. And then as far as like actionable tools that I thought would be helpful for people listening, I call it a confidence map. And I do it with the girls in our workshops, but I also have had moms say that they've done it for themselves and that it was such a game changer for them. So turn on some peaceful music, get out a journal page, and then go through these few things to kind of like journal and create your own confidence map with. And this really will give you some direction and a boost. So first you're just gonna journal out your strengths. And these are things that either you're naturally good at, like I'm patient, I'm organized, you know, I'm friendly to things that you maybe have learned along the way, like, hey, I'm really great at typing. I am, you know, I've done well at podcasting, I've learned how to do that. So strengths, both that you've learned and that you are natural at. Anytime we list that out, it it reminds us and boosts our confidence. And then do some journaling on your passions. Write down what is bringing me the most joy right now in this stage of life. Is it practicing my photography? Is it time with my kids? Is it going on hikes? You know, where do I just feel the most alive? That's your passions. So doing a little bit of journaling on that and then thinking about your values. And if you've never done a values exercise, it's so helpful and your values kind of change throughout your life. But look up a list of core values and kind of go through and choose, like, okay, what they're all good, but what means the most to me right now in this stage of life? Is it family? Is it connection? Is it learning? Those are some of my, you know, top ones. But there's also like adventure. I mean, just so many different health. Choose your top three. And then I want you to sit back. I want you to look at this whole map of here's things I'm good at, here's things that I'm super passionate about, and here's what I value most in life. And then just kind of ask yourself, what's the next thing I can move towards that feels in alignment with what I just wrote on this page? You are going to feel more confident, you're going to feel more alive, you're gonna feel happier with your life when the steps you're taking, things that you're filling your days with, are in alignment with all of those things. That was like three tips in one, but it's it's really helpful.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

That is super powerful and the perfect note to end on. So thank you so much again, Kristen. And if anybody wants to find you, learn more about you, learn more about meant to be me, where should they go?

SPEAKER_00 25:42

I think everything is on the website now, meant to beme.org. We'll take you to the podcast, to my freebies, to my workshops, and everything else like that.

SPEAKER_01 25:53

All right. Well, thank you so much. And I hope that this has encouraged everybody listening. Remember, just take a small step. And you don't need permission to begin, just start where you are, and you are worthy as you are. And so on that note, I will say thank you again, Kristen, and keep creating and keep turning the page.