IN RECOVERY - The Ark House Podcast

IN RECOVERY - The Ark House Podcast - S1 EP11 - Feat MIKE PHENIX (Mad Mike)

• Ark House Rehab • Season 1 • Episode 11

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Ark House Rehab in Scarborough brings you Season One of our recovery podcast. IN RECOVERY - THE ARK HOUSE PODCAST is with you every Monday. 

A companion guide for those on their addiction recovery journey, we also want to offer advice and support for those still suffering and offer solutions for those who just want to know more.

Every week we speak to someone in the spotlight who shares their struggles with addiction. This week an English footballer who played for teams including Barnsley, Southport, and Salford City. MIKE PHENIX (known to many online as MAD MIKE) went down a dark road when he was banned from 4 years due to his cocaine addiction. He opens up about his journey and his recovery, in the hope it may help others. 

Recent graduate of Ark House CARL joins us to talk about how he has managed to turn his life around. Declared dead at one point, laying on a high street, Carl has shown immense bravery and dedication to change his life. 

And every week we get a recovery hack from a professional working in the community. We are lucky to work alongside some of the leading drug and alcohol services in the UK. This includes FORWARD LEEDS, and we are once again joined by group worker MICHAEL WATERS, who this week discusses how we need to learn to accept our emotions when in recovery.

This new podcast shares real conversations, lived experience and honest stories of hope and transformation within the recovery community. From personal journeys to professional insights into addiction and treatment, IN Recovery gives a powerful voice to those walking the path of change. 

Join our recovery conversation...

If you or a loved one need help from addiction, please know there is help. Reach out and speak to Ark House today....

PHONE 01723 371869

EMAIL info@arkhouserehab.co.uk

ADDRESS 15 Valley Road, Scarborough, Y011 2LY

WEBSITE www.arkhouserehab.co.uk

FACEBOOK  @arkhouserehabltd

INSTAGRAM @in_recovery_podcast

SPEAKER_05

In recovery.

unknown

In recovery.

SPEAKER_01

Welcome to In Recovery, the Addiction Recovery podcast brought to you by our cow tree hub in Scarborough, which opened its doors of effects years ago and up thousands of people on their journeys, including me.

SPEAKER_02

And me. I'm Richard, and I've been in recovery for over five years, and along with Sam, we'll be speaking to others who give us their stories of faith, hope and courage.

SPEAKER_01

We get recovery hacks from professionals to help you stay on track and speak to some of the UK's biggest stars who have all battled addiction.

SPEAKER_02

Today, a former professional footballer whose addiction led to a four-year ban from the sport he loved. Known to many as Mad Mike, Mike Fennix joins us today to speak openly about his recovery from addiction.

SPEAKER_01

So sit back and join the recovery conversation. Making the decision to change our life can be daunting and scary. Every episode we speak to someone who has taken that decision and has chosen our house to start their recovery journey.

RECOVERY GRADUATE - CARL

SPEAKER_01

Today's guest has not long graduated from our treatment centre and wants to share his story with us. Massive hello to this week's recovery graduate Carl. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, things are good.

SPEAKER_01

We always start with our quick fire intro questions. Are you ready? Yes. Age?

SPEAKER_03

33.

SPEAKER_01

Where are you from?

SPEAKER_03

Middlesbrough.

SPEAKER_01

How did you arrive at our house?

SPEAKER_03

Um, through recovery connections in Middlesbrough.

SPEAKER_01

And how long were you struggling with addiction?

SPEAKER_03

Er, 15 yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Coming clean time?

SPEAKER_03

200 days.

SPEAKER_01

Brilliant. Going back in time, can you pinpoint when addiction started for you?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, the start of it was um 2013 when my daughter died. What I didn't realise at the time was I was just wrapped in self-pity and I played the victim for a lot of years with it and it nearly killed me as well. But what I noted is through learning and and being teachable is that life's gonna get lifey. It doesn't matter what scale it's on. You know, it it just it just it's my reaction to situations today. You know, and I can't play that victim anymore. You have to accept situations for what they are and grow and learn from them and move on. I'm only able to do that today because I got here and I got taught.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I can relate to like, you know, playing like the victim and that. I remember like when my children's nan and granddad wouldn't let me have my kids and that, you know, I was like, you kidnap my kids, rah rah, you know, not realising that it was because I was drinking and stuff. That that was the reason why. Do you know that I still went out there and carried on, do you know, thinking that it was a solution to ease the pain inside. Um do you remember when things got out of control?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, when it got really bad, um it was the start of COVID. What I was doing, I was letting the lads go to work, I was just earning a wage. But that allowed me to have an income and isolate on my own. And that's when I really fell in love with vodka, and that's when they started going to getting locked up to hospitals, getting closer together, more serious, going to jail, fighting for my life, comas, paralysed twice. But even then, I remember the first time I was paralysed from the neck down. Maybe he's not walking again and stuff like that, but it was irrelevant because once I got on my feet, I was at the corner shop for Vodka before I even knew what was wrong with me. You know, that's not once, that's twice. And then um I died outside pre-mark. Thank God they brought us back, you know, just drinking gin violently. That's the only way I can explain it, and just to black out, I wasn't comfortable in my own skin. You know, it was impossible for me to do good in the world and be a nice person when I hated me. I despised myself, you know, but I forgive myself today. I realised that how like irresponsible it was of me. I am accountable for for what drunk Carl was doing, but I'm alright with that as well because I know it wasn't me. I love that.

SPEAKER_01

It really shows the insanity of our addictions, doesn't it? Like you've died come back to life and still carried on.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, absolutely. Um the levels were it take me to, the levels of insanity were looking back now, it was scary. You know, I've got two little beautiful daughters there who I would have just pushed out the way to get a vodka. You know, that my love for them was absolutely irrelevant because I fell in love with vodka a hell of a lot more. And at the end, it wasn't it wasn't a case of you know, I was living to drink, I I had to drink to live. You know, the seizures had got that bad. I was really I was alcohol dependent, but everything just went, you know, contact with my kids went. And even when that stopped, it was a bonus. I was like, well, I won't have the mum's torch for me anymore now, you know. So I was left to my own devices then. And obviously I was a roofer, I had a roofing company. That that went to pot. I'm an alcoholic how am I meant to be a roofer and run a roofing company? And uh just everything went. But I'd shot the towel in at the end. I wasn't bothered, it was just a case of like, well, when am I gonna die? Because that's what I'm waiting for now. And I'd completely accepted it. That this life wasn't meant to be for me. And I got a work house, for the grace of God, you know. Everybody who made it possible in Middlesbrough, life just is not the same today. I could I I can't imagine life without a 12-step programme at the end and a higher power. I'm just grateful that I made it through that dark moment because they always say that there's light at the end of the tunnel, and well, if I was waiting for this flight, it was worth it.

SPEAKER_01

I'm guessing, like most of us in addiction, the consequences soon piled up.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah, it was one after another. But what I've learned as well today is that through one bad thing going against me, I would drink on that, but while I was drunk, I'd create another four or five things. So every time I was drinking a mask problem, I was creating another five or six for myself. So by the time it's time to sober up and come back to the world, I thought that I had a stack of problems what I could never get through, but sober and working this programme, I'm able to get through them today.

SPEAKER_01

And you were shining an example of what working the programme can do, do you know, for everybody here in Ark and for those out there as well, do you know, it's just beautiful to see. What was the hardest thing about admitting you had a serious problem?

SPEAKER_03

Do you know what? It's an hard question because I I honestly don't have an answer for that. I'd lost everything. I knew I was an alcoholic. I was ready to die, so I d I don't know. You know, I'd literally gone that low. There was the only thing that was left was the phone call that said Carl's finally died.

SPEAKER_01

Something's been looking after you, haven't they?

SPEAKER_03

100%.

SPEAKER_01

What things helped you change your mindset whilst you were here?

SPEAKER_03

I mean, I c I've I've come here and I d this I'd done it for myself, you know, it was personal. Because I tried to do for everybody who I thought I was I loved. I do love, but I loved Alcoholmore, you know what I mean. But it was when when so once I started growing into it, certain things were coming back slowly. Like I call my kids, and then my oldest daughter came up and visited me, and for the first time since she's been alive, I could actually look into her eyes and talk to her, and she believed what I was saying. I was more present for her in them visits than what I have been for the last 10 years. And I just knew this was for me because the ripple effect it had on me when I was drunk and my family, recovery has a much better ripple effect on them. You know, my mum sleeps that night, my kids believe me again, they're genuinely happy when I'm with them. So it's just it's beautiful.

SPEAKER_01

It's amazing, isn't it? When I put down the drink and drugs and picked up this programme, honestly, like it's just a different, it is a different bloody whole existence. You know, I have my children back in my life, you know, and I could be there and be present for them, do you know? I have this inner peace. Yeah. It's just priceless, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03

Beautiful.

SPEAKER_01

If people listening are struggling to come to terms with the fact that they may need rehab, what would you say to them?

SPEAKER_03

You know, I didn't realise it was any help. I didn't know anyone in recovery. So I kind of guess it made it easy for me to shut the towel in. But the people signed me where I couldn't see myself, you know, even though I was doing wrong. I wasn't a bad human being, so I can imagine people feeling like that, you know, they're only only doing wrong and they're a bad person, but you really aren't. You know, you're not, it's just this is a disease what takes over. And until we reach out and accept help, you know, the way I went about it, I started with recovery connections in Middlesbrough. I was going to appointments and I I wasn't even going sober, but I was getting there, and that's what got me to uh to work house. But I can imagine how lonely and and and dark it is, you know, it's just it's it's horrible. But there is a solution and it's here and waiting for you.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I won't I didn't know there was any solution. You know, I knew I had a problem, I just didn't know where to go to get help until somebody I knew came to our house and then came back and carried the message of help and you know and a solution. That's why I'm here today. As we know, leaving rehab is another huge milestone in the journey of recovery. You only left a couple of weeks ago, so tell us how has it been?

SPEAKER_03

So I was I was riddled in for you when I first left. Not so much about relapse and all going back over, it was more for well, what am I gonna do? I've moved town. You know, I'm gonna have a load of free time, but it turns out we don't. I go to bed on the night and I've forgot to do stuff because you're as busy as you make yourself, I believe. I believe I've given I've been given a purpose today in life, and that is to help the still suffering addicts and alcoholics. You know, and I'm happy with that as well.

SPEAKER_01

What have you done in your daily routine to help you stay clean and so bad?

SPEAKER_03

That's a simple one. I've done what was suggested by the people who taught me in our gout. I get up, I pray, I meditate, I go to a meeting, and all through the day it's how can I be helpful to somebody else? You know, that was never on my cards before. It was all about me, but today it's it's the exact opposite. You know, it's just follow some simple suggestions and don't complicate anything. Keep it really simple, and that's when it works the most.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it is really just a case of keeping it simple, isn't it? Do what's suggested, like get to meetings, I'd do service in meetings, be there for the still suffering, alcoholic or drug addict, you know, and it's just a beautiful life, isn't it? Like always busy. But that's that's how I like it, to be fair. You know, and I'm not stuck in self to reach out and help others. Yeah. If people are struggling, returning to life outside of rehab, what advice would you give them?

SPEAKER_03

I would definitely keep in contact with alcoholics and addicts. Number one, it was get used to picking up that phone. Yeah, really, really get used to connecting with with the people who were in the fellowship, you know, get a home group, get a service position, and just keep just keep doing it and keep it simple, and that that's when it's most effective.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I like that what you're saying about um picking up the phone and that, because I know a lot of people do struggle to pick up the phone, but if you don't pick up the phone and reach out, how is anybody supposed to know if you're suffering? Do you know you you know, once it's done, you'll feel miles better. Yeah, so you said you've moved towns. How are you finding it in Scarborough? Are you liking it being near Ark House? Is it helping you?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, absolutely, yeah. I mean, the support what Ark House have shown me since I've left, you know, it's it's it's unbelievable. What I realised is I went home for a home visit a couple of weeks ago, and I realised that absolutely nothing has changed, but everything in me has changed. What Scarborough gives me, it's it's it's a solid community. Like um, it's solid for recovery. So the only people who I've know today is people in recovery. Whereas back home I didn't know anyone in recovery. I just knew, you know, I did I didn't pick this place, it chose me.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, same. When I go back to all and that, the only people that I know there are users and drinkers, you know, apart from my daughter and I know grandad. It's just like I like it here. Getting to the present, what does your recovery look like now?

SPEAKER_03

Depending on what day, what time it is. I'll always get up at half six. I'm committed to an online meeting, quarter seven until twenty past seven. Just prayer meditation meeting, get your day on the started on the right foot. Oh, god, I'd do too much in a week to say my head's gonna fall off. Oh, and another good thing, what I've done as well, I've picked up a little hobby. So you had a little thing. I was in Italian gardens about two weeks ago, and I was just sat with the squirrels, feeding squirrels out of my hand, which is crazy. You know, and a little thought could mean I I didn't know what it was. I didn't know the feeling what I had because I'd never had it, and I can only describe it as an inner piece. You know, I thought I've looked all my life for this and I'm just sat on my own with a squirrel, then I finally found it. Tears streaming down my face, you know. I thought, finally, I'm home. It was beautiful, man.

SPEAKER_01

I've got bullshit, getting emotional. The little things in life, what would you, you know, would miss it all when we're out there, don't we? But like today we can see it, and it's beautiful to have that contentment and have that inner peace. What's the reaction been like from those close to you?

SPEAKER_03

Good question. Um, absolutely incredible. You know, I'm more happy for my kids, my mum, my sister, my niece, you know, my close in their family, because they're seeing me, they're seeing it. And just letting my mum sleep on a night, you know, not getting that dreaded phone call that his family died, because that was next. That was the only thing. What was yet to be done? Yeah, she sleeps easy now, you know, and my sister's happy, my my niece, and above all else, my daughters are happy, you know, and they trust me again, which is incredible. Like, yeah, full of gratitude towards her. The ribble effect it has on my family and my friends, everybody around me, it's it's just beautiful.

SPEAKER_01

That's a beautiful thing about this programme, isn't it? Not only does it help us, but it helps all families and that as well, and puts their mind at ease and you know, gives them the family member back. We will end with another quick fire question round. What's your new healthiest habit?

SPEAKER_03

Jogging.

SPEAKER_01

Jogging.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Nice.

SPEAKER_01

What's your favourite recovery cliche?

SPEAKER_03

Let go on, let go.

SPEAKER_01

What's your favourite activity to beat boredom?

SPEAKER_03

Feeding squirrels.

SPEAKER_01

And finally, if you could give a younger Carl some advice, what would it be?

SPEAKER_03

It would be the day that my daughter died that I prayed for God to God to give me the strength and guidance to get past it. I wouldn't attend to the alcohol.

SPEAKER_01

Thanks so much for coming on the podcast today, Carl. Finally, if you could pick one thing you were grateful for today, what would it be?

SPEAKER_03

My family's happiness.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you so much. And all the best on your recovery journey.

unknown

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02

Today's guest under the Recovery Spotlight is a footballer who was born in Manchester in 1989 and has played for various clubs, including Barnsley, Telford United and

RECOVERY SPOTLIGHT - MIKE PHENIX (MAD MIKE)

SPEAKER_02

Salford City. He has been on a roller coaster of a journey battling addiction and his own demons over the last few years, but has now committed himself to sobriety and is a graduate of Ark House. It's a very warm welcome to Mad Mike himself, Mike Fennex.

SPEAKER_00

Hello, Richard, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_02

Was football always a dream of yours?

SPEAKER_00

So, yeah, always a dream. Always love football, still playing these days. Not at the standard of was, but it's a bit always been part of my life, do you know what I mean? Saturdays football. Yeah, to make it as a professional, I was really happy with.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, and when did you sign your first professional contract?

SPEAKER_00

So I didn't actually sign. Uh I didn't sign, I signed for Barnsley in League One at 25. Um, got two and a half year deal. So yeah, it was a dream. I was buzzed, really happy, but yeah, addiction took over at that point.

SPEAKER_02

So I guess you know, being a professional sportsman, I presume it was quite a drain mentally on you.

SPEAKER_00

There's a lot of things that come with being a professional footballer, ego being the number one. Uh, as much as at the time I never admitted it, you know. I pretended I didn't like the attention when deep down I did. It's a it's a game of up and downs, you know. If you're playing well and you're in the team every week, it's great. Life's great. I got to a point when I was at Barnes like I didn't feel like I deserved to be there.

SPEAKER_02

You went to Barnes or you signed you signed for Barnes in 2013 for about 25 grand and what have you, which is you know, which is even a lot of money today and what have you. When you started your substance misuse, how did that impact on you as a professional footballer?

SPEAKER_00

Massively. Yeah, wouldn't say I really started to see problems until I was around 24. When I signed for Barnsley, I was 25, and I remember doing my medical fitness test, and I've been on a two-day bender. They pulled me in on the Monday and I was like, shit. And he said, Are you gonna like knock all the drinking drugs on the head? And I said, Yeah. But you know what? I think I did about a month and maybe two and no charla. The thing I didn't I went out weekends, I couldn't play till the January.

SPEAKER_05

Right.

SPEAKER_00

So basically, for the first month, my head had gone because I'd gone from playing week in, week out, being the top goalscorer in the conference, to sat in the stands at Barnes there. I think I lasted about four weeks of watching the games. Do you know what I mean? And then I'd just I'd just shoot off, mate, and go and get high. Do you know what I mean? Because my wages have gone through the roof. And I just want to be back in my hometown, mate, milking it all. I remember I weren't in the squad for, like I say, for the first four months. But I think three times the drug testers come in on a Monday morning, and my heart sunk. Nobody knows what's going on. No one's got a clue, do you know what I mean? I just remember my heart sinking, but I couldn't get tested at that point because I weren't in the squad, but I didn't know that. So yeah, I played like three three games for him. My Crohn's disease flared up, and that was that was the last time I played for Barza. But in my head, I'm thinking, go back to the conference, I'm only half an hour from my house, I can live at home again, and I can get away with sniffing drugs.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, but you know, that insane thought that you had there, where you know, you sat as a professional and your head's telling you, let's go play conference so I can get off my sits, it starts to run our lives, and that's why you know now I'm clean.

SPEAKER_00

I like to spend a lot of time at home.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I like being on my couch now with the two dogs.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

That's what I like, and I find that's what works for me.

SPEAKER_02

You know, it's taken us a lot of years to get to that, yeah, and a lot of and a lot of work on ourselves, I think. You're a shining example of somebody who's been in the spotlight who's gone through a lot of stuff, you know, banned from football, which I'm I guess must have been one of the lowest points of your life.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think that's when it all starts to hit home. I'd not been bad since the Saturday night. Yeah. So I've been straight through from Saturday night, I've been on a 48-hour shift, and ultimately I got done for steroids. I had an anivar in my system, I got done for the the uh the most amount of coke the FA's ever seen in a single person. They're like, Are you still alive? You know, I turned up to Wembley with about 30 bags of cocaine in my pocket. You know, why would you do that? I was insane, and that was that's seven years ago. So I remember licking bags on the way down to Wembley on the train. Do you know what I mean? Just for another little bit of a hit after two weeks of wages stopped, I got sacked by the club. I was at. I think the thing you think about the most is how am I gonna feed this addiction I've got. So quickly, very quickly, I took out a lot of credit cards. Dealers were still ticking me a thousand pounds a dealer. Dad paid paid them off me. I ended up owing my dad 20 grand.

SPEAKER_02

You know, I I I I was in arc when I was told that you were coming into treatment and that were you in a bloody mobile home or a van with your dog in the woods?

SPEAKER_00

As soon as I left Manchester in my van, which was uninsured, untaxed, no MOT, but I didn't care. I had 800 quid in my back pocket. It was either give it a dealer that day or go and try and and just get away and just live in a van for two weeks until I reached out for help with the PFA. They don't need such you guys.

SPEAKER_02

I left my house for five days to go to a hotel before I could come into our because it was COVID. It was like a green light for me. Magic, I can just do what I want now. I don't have to answer to my wife, my kids, anybody else. I can just go for it. You know, the reality hits that 10 o'clock that that Monday morning, the outreach director's picking me up, bringing me down here and asking me whether I'm clean. And I'm like, Yeah, yeah, I've had a shower, I'm all right. He went, No, have you been taking drugs? I went, oh yeah, I've had a bit. But weirdly, when I got parked up in the back of this car park at arc and I walked down the stairs, something overwhelming came over me that said to me in my head, you've done. You know, that obsession to use had gone when I walked down the stairs. I didn't know how it was gonna remain like that because I didn't know anything about this programme.

SPEAKER_00

All I knew is that I was coming into a place where I had an opportunity to change my life, and yeah, you know, you you feel like you're at home a bit, you know, with your people that understand you because nobody else understood me. My dad didn't, my dad does. I don't think my dad still don't understand me today, you know. Yeah, but that's it, you my dad's not a drug addict.

SPEAKER_02

You know, you became very chilled out and very wanting to help people was the biggest thing I can remember.

SPEAKER_00

I think step five will do that to you because I remember I remember like first time I cried in years, second year my questions, and you'd be scared in it. Do you know what I mean? You don't you don't see all that, do you? And I was just scared of life. I was scared of life, man. I was scared of everything. I can't deal with life on life terms. Can't I can't. And it's the first time I'm gonna actually realise this without with all my defences are down and and I'm crying. I'm sat there crying in front of another man. Do you know? Yeah, and that didn't happen to someone like me.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, what's amazing as well, you know, you've turned your life around, haven't you? You know, your partner Lauren is obviously a huge part in your life, as she should be. You know, you've set up Mad Mike Watts, which is an aim to you know promote mental health and what have you, and the struggles that you have, and you're quite open around that and and quite vocal around that. How has that helped you with your mental health?

SPEAKER_00

And I talk the truth, I hit the nail. I I a lot of people say to me, like, you know, you don't hold back, and I don't hold back, you know. I don't hold back, and I'll tell you how it is and what I did and what I did and how I did it. It's relatable to a lot of people, but I see a lot of people talk about it on social media and they probably don't go to the depths that I go to. So when I go to the shots, I get stopped to the shots by a guy and he'll go, Mike, can I have a chat? And I'll go, you know what, I've got half an hour, let's go. Yeah, and that's what I love. You know, I used to be known as a drug addict who failed his football career. Now it's people can have a chat with.

SPEAKER_02

You go through this life, don't you, as being totally self-centered, worlds all about you. But what I then found was the I I've I can relate to any other drug addict in the country, whatever they've got, whatever they haven't got. And you know, I I try and use that as much as I can today to help people.

SPEAKER_00

I seem to be the guy now where in my hometown, if anyone's struggling, they'll be or have the family members reaching out. I used to get I just I was so hated in my hometown, like nobody could stand me, mate. I was ripping people off left, right, and centre with roofing jobs, with anything, with stealing in supermarkets. I was you know, and I've got a bit of respect back now. And people look at me and go, you know, this guy can be trusted these days.

SPEAKER_02

Recovery's given you a purpose in your life, I suppose, and it's and it's given you the opportunity to help people.

SPEAKER_00

I'm very grateful for every day now. Something I'd never had, gratitude, never had, never understood it. Honestly, before they went into our council, I didn't even know what gratitude meant. Do you know what I mean? And it's the little things with my kid and my family, and I am a completely different person. My partner will tell you that.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Right, I've got one last question for you. If you could give uh some advice to a young Mike, what would it be?

SPEAKER_00

Oh, I suffered with ADHD for many years, untreated. I'm gonna kind of welling up a little bit here now because ADHD and addiction are massively links, like so many links, and I could never sit down on my couch. I couldn't, you know, and I'm I suffered with ADHD after football and stuff like that, and a personality disorder as well, which I didn't understand. Very high moods are very low moods, very quickly. I could go from high to low very quick. The first thing I'm doing is picking up a bag to make myself feel normal. So I'd say go and get your ADHD diagnosed. I was a million miles an hour. I was trying to build a business at midnight, and to do that, I need a bag to stay away. You know what I mean? And oh and the amount of times, yeah, I used to go a full day with no sniff, get in bed at 10 o'clock at night, and then all the five bags is unbelievable. When I signed for Barnsley, yeah, I had a two and a half year deal on very good money. Do you know a week later? I was searching for sales jobs, mate, for two and a half years' time, and that's the kind of worry I lived with where they couldn't go, you know, you don't need to, you know, HLO.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Do you know what I mean? Take a day like a day at a time, I do a day at a time, and I do that every single day now.

SPEAKER_02

When I look back now and I and I try and give advice to people, it is that it's that one day at a time, it's just try and be alright for one day, try not to take drugs for one day, try and do something that's gonna help your mental health today. To get try and get a diagnosis of that can go on for years, and and and that's one of the major problems in in the country today, in that you can't get a diagnosis quick enough to help you. And you know, I'm like you, you know, um at 12 o'clock at night, my wife's laid in bed fast asleep, and I'm thinking, right, what house can I buy? What business can I open?

SPEAKER_00

Well, it's all good for you, man.

SPEAKER_02

What's gonna happen tomorrow? She's 24 hours, mate. Good to sleep.

SPEAKER_00

That is honestly, that is ADHD to a tea. I remember sitting in a bath for an hour, and I just that had never happened in my life. I just sat in this bath for an hour going, Wow, this is amazing! This is amazing, you know. I'm not in a rush to go anywhere. Yeah, I can and the best thing for me I can say is I live in the present moment today.

SPEAKER_02

Brilliant.

SPEAKER_00

When you turn up every day and you've done that, I've done that for 22 months now. You make a lot of progress in your life. Yeah, you do. Day by day. You will, you will.

SPEAKER_02

I think there's you've got a really, really powerful message, and the more people that hear you, the more people you can help and we can help. And I just want to say thanks very much. Well, there's a lot of people out there that need it, and I'll leave you uh I'll leave you to enjoy your day. Not for me, hair colour.

SPEAKER_00

Right, listen, look after yourself. Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_02

Every episode we bring you a recovery hack directly from someone working in the recovery community. This episode we're going to be chatting about accepting our emotions in recovery. And back again is group worker from Five Ways at Forward

RECOVERY HACK - MICHAEL WATERS (ACCEPTING EMOTIONS)

SPEAKER_02

Leads, Michael Waters. How are you? Hi Richard, I'm very well, thank you. Excellent. So before we embrace our emotions, let's just talk about your journey. You started as staff here in 2023, but you actually were supported by the service yourself.

SPEAKER_04

Absolutely. That was what helped with me, particularly group work. In terms of emotion specifically, it was about receiving a bit of compassion from other people and realising that I deserved that. And then eventually that it kind of nurtures the part of you that can give that to yourself. And you always practice that, don't you, by kind of being part of a community and trying to help people out and stuff. Talking over a lot of that same stuff, it helps keep my eyes on the prize, you know.

SPEAKER_02

So it's been over four years now, so so fair to say this stuff really works.

SPEAKER_04

Absolutely. Massive transformation in terms of how I approach my own mental health and how I deal with certain challenges, and it's ongoing as well. Obviously, in addiction recovery, you pull yourself out of a crisis and then you sort of try and reassemble the basics. Yeah. But then there's something about remaining teachable and learning off other people in recovery as well. Even in a position where I'm facilitating groups, every group that I'll run, I'll learn something new from somebody else in there. Even if it's just something a different way to phrase something, yeah. So it's a real ongoing process for me in terms of handling feelings specifically.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, I you know, I can remember, you know, when when somebody said to me, You're gonna get all your emotions back, and you're gonna feel things that you've never felt before, you know, and then all of a sudden I got these emotions back, and I'm feeling these things that I've never felt before. And I found it really, really difficult to manage that. You know, how I could deal with that on a day-to-day basis because for the last 17 years I've put a drug in and just pushed it all down, you know. Today it's today, it's different. I can't have a drug and I have to handle my emotions.

SPEAKER_04

You know, how did you manage to do it for yourself? It's a slow process of learning what works for you, isn't it? Personally, um exactly as you say, we're not used to dealing with them. What we think of as a coping mechanism, it's just avoidance. And we're denying ourselves the opportunity to learn those skills. For me, social anxiety was a big thing. Drink seemed like an option to solve that. But it wasn't solving it, I was putting a plaster over it and it was making it worse and worse and worse because I could never learn real confidence, for example. And I think this is true of pretty much everyone. We are hardwired to pursue things that cause pleasure and avoid things that cause pain. The very nature of pleasure itself, it's that release of dopamine. The whole point of that chemical is do that again. Do that again. You've done a good thing. And it's about rewarding you for like meeting survival needs. Now, in drugs and alcohol, we've had the misfortune to find these inappropriate shortcuts to dopamine, right? Yeah. It's a load of fake pleasure almost, isn't it? Because it it tricks our body into thinking that we've met a need when we haven't. We've actually ignored all our real needs. It almost establishes like a fake need. You know, we feel like we need it, don't we? It affects what we believe. Uh every time we go, I can't stand this, and we pick up. We've kind of proven to ourselves that we couldn't stand it. Whether it's masking the pain of trauma or it's just a kind of habit of partying that got out of hand, either way, you end up traumatised because the addiction itself is traumatic, right? And addiction kind of limits how we deal with the feelings, it erodes our resilience. It's our own responsibility, therefore, in recovery to slowly build it back up with different skills that look different for everyone.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, anything that I wanted to feel, I would or had to feel, or something went on, drugs took that away. And I you know, I suppose how do you express that to people who are coming into five ways, you know, being able to handle their emotions as opposed to closing them off?

SPEAKER_04

There's a few sort of steps you can take with this. There is this idea of kind of turning toward your emotions as the starting point. Emotions are actually signals to unmet needs. Emotions are not the thing that's wrong, they're the lights on the dashboard telling you something's up. And how every time we just mask the emotion or self-medicate with drugs, we're basically just putting tape over the lights on the dashboard instead of actually taking the car in another shop. Yeah. Do you see what I mean? Okay. If we get curious about our emotions, actually listen to them, what are they actually saying to me? Where is it in my body? Uh, what are my thoughts saying? What are the actual words coming into my head? We start to get closer to what the actual need is that it's trying to point us to. It's really unclear to us at first when the need becomes, I need a drink, or I need to I need a drug. But really, any sense of unease that an addiction's collapsed into a craving, it's actually there is something underneath that. There's an unproblematic desire to feel all right. We just need to listen to ourselves a bit more with curiosity rather than judgment.

SPEAKER_02

So can we take a bit of time now just to talk through the steps of accepting your emotions?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, I mean that's the that's the number one right there, that turning towards them with a bit of curiosity, befriending the emotion, if you like. The second one is kind of being able to identify and label them. I couldn't tell you when I was hungry in addiction, I couldn't tell you when I needed to sleep. Yeah. I couldn't tell you when I needed a friend, when I needed company. We lose our instincts for our own needs. Our emotional literacy suffers as a result. So emotional literacy, literacy, the ability to read, emotional literacy, the ability to read our feelings. That suffers massively in our addiction. So actually having the language to talk about how you feel and being able to label it is a big part of this. So, for example, being able to identify what your anger feels like or what your sadness feels like. So you can actually spot it when you're in it. It involves learning your own signs, learning your own signals. So, like your body sensations, is it in my shoulders, is it in my stomach churning, the patterns of thought that come up. What are the things that let you know that you're feeling that feeling? This makes us able to be aware of them sooner and to better be able to respond to them. In early recovery, every sense of unease gets collapsed into an urge. I need, whatever that need is, is I need a drink. Right? It just that that's become the one trick and it's we've become one trick pennies. Now, over time in recovery, when we learn different ways of dealing with it, or we just endure the suffering and gain evidence that we can, that's when we slowly shift in our attitude. We gain a willingness to kind of coexist with our feelings, come alongside and listen to what they want from us, like they're friends rather than enemies. We often use the phrase uh this two short path in recovery, right? That's really it's a recovery cliche and a good one, a cliche for a reason. Every feeling we have is impermanent, it's transient, it's not here to stay. Right? And just getting into that belief, getting into that felt belief that every every feeling that comes up is a bit like a wave. Yeah. Like like the cravings themselves, you know, we can ride them out, but they're not they're not gonna stare us in the face forever. Feelings arise, they reside within us for a short time, and then in that instance it will pass, or at least the intensity of it will pass. Because it's easy to forget that when you're in it. Yeah, if you're in a period of intense sadness or anger, it feels like it just spreads out in both directions, right? It feels like that's all that exists. Yeah, but if we keep in mind that this is two short parts, the same forever. Learning to ride the wave is key.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I like that. And I also think for for me, you know, what I've learned is to talk about these things when I feel them. You know, I I I I see a I see a psychotherapist every every Wednesday. She looks like Nanny Murphy. She's got the stick, got the teeth, you know, and we talk rubbish or what I perceive as rubbish for that period of time, but all we're talking about is emotions, trying to find out because I've buried them down so much, I don't know what I don't know what what I'm feeling some days.

SPEAKER_04

And when we can't label it, yeah, we've got no information, we don't know where to go from there. So having someone's help is is really crucial, and it brings us to that that step five of inquiring and investigating the feeling. Ask yourself in that moment of pain, what is it I need right now? Rather than just saying, Oh, this is horrible, make it stop. And talking to people with it and getting that better understanding, it sheds light on things, doesn't it? Okay, so what do you what do you mean by needs? Well, insofar as our body has needs, we have like physiological needs that are a bit more obvious, like rest and like hunger and things like that, we need to be fed. But we have emotional needs on top of that, don't we? Yeah. And they're kind of more on the social scale. Like if you're feeling really lonely, you've got an unmet need there for company, yeah, for connection. If you're feeling really bored, there's an unmet need there for something to be stimulating, something to be meaningful to you.

SPEAKER_02

Early into recovery, it's really hard to understand that, isn't it? That what is that need? What is that emotion that I'm feeling?

SPEAKER_04

But our instincts do improve as we go through recovery for sure. Basically, if we didn't have emotions, we wouldn't be motivated to take any action of any sort ever. If we look at stress, well, without those stress chemicals, we wouldn't even wake up, let alone be alert to more important information in our environment. Grief when we lose a loved one, that's a measure of the importance of that loss. You know, it's a measure of our love for that person. Life without feelings wouldn't be worthwhile and we wouldn't even survive. You know, but we can learn a new mindset to be less afraid of these things. Now, in my addiction, my ideal self was someone who never had any painful feelings ever. So that's what I was striving for. And I yearned to be in complete control of how I felt at all times. And I believed that that's what safety looked like. But it isn't, is it? You know, early on in our addiction, we kind of fool ourselves into thinking that level of control is possible and sustainable, and we just regulate our feelings with drugs quite successfully to begin with. But that way of regulating our feelings, as we know, we all learn the hard way. It's at best diminishing returns, at worst, completely life-destroying. In recovery, our mindset kind of shifts, and we realise not only is that not possible, it's not even desirable. This is a long-term process of self-discovery, really. Yeah. Getting to know ourselves again. It's like getting to know a whole new person. Yeah, it is. Yeah. You know, it's finding these little kind of incremental changes that can regulate your emotions rather than solve them as a problem. You know what I mean? Yeah. Often with a really difficult problem, I picture like a big rock and you're kind of chipping away at it with a pickaxe, and the first thousand hits you don't see any difference. And then on the thousandth one, big chunk of it breaks off, right? Yeah. It's like that with our feelings a lot of time, isn't it? Yeah, it's it's cracking the code to how we deal with our anger or how we deal with our sadness. Can feel a lot like that. Very little progress until suddenly you get a big chunk of progress all at once, especially if you're getting help with a psychotherapist or you're doing some journaling. That's where some real leaps forward. And there is no end game to this, it's just slowly getting better at it. Patience is from the Latin word patiens, which just means suffering, right? Yeah. Just the ability to endure some suffering. And the biggest leap forward in my recovery is when I got through a really horrible craving where I was really angry that I couldn't drink, and I was really hateful of everyone who was trying to stop me drinking. And I just wrote it out and I was like, I can't stand this, I can't stand this, I can't stand this. But what I was doing whilst I was saying I couldn't stand it was standing it. 20 minutes later, I thought, wait, was that it? Is that all I had to do all these years? Yeah, yeah. Just endure the suffering. And it does, you know, it's not a good sell, is it? You don't go, just endure your suffering. Yeah. But once you're the other side of it, you realise, well, it's just a bit of suffering, it's just a bit of pain. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. So once again, thanks very much for your time and take care.

SPEAKER_04

Thanks very much for having me.

SPEAKER_01

If you have a loved one suffering from addiction, then please get in touch with Ark House today.