Using the Best Hotel Systems for STR Success

The short-term rental industry is professionalizing at lightning speed. To stay ahead, operators must move beyond "heads in beds". In this episode, we sit down with Frank Bosi, a luxury hospitality veteran from The Ritz-Carlton and Four Seasons now at Hostfully, to see what can be learned from the rigorous systems of the world’s leading hotel brands. Frank breaks down the five core pillars of hotel management that every STR owner should implement to increase ADR, owner and guest retention and more! 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:03

This week on the check-in, we look at exactly what hotels have known for decades that we can learn from in short-term rentals. How standardization and optimization of check-in processes, concierge services, and others can completely change the trajectory of your business. Welcome back to The Check-In.

SPEAKER_00 0:22

Hello, everybody. Frank Bosti, my friend. How nice to see you.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

Good seeing you. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_00 0:29

Very well. And Sarinan Dupree, my old friend. Old in time of friendship, not old in age, of course. How are you?

SPEAKER_02 0:36

Doing great. I'm really excited to have Frank join us today. It's gonna be it's gonna be a great episode. Frank brings a wealth of experience, particularly formerly from the hotel industry and has done a really great job of implementing some of the learnings there into our industry in general and kind of overall just helping us bring up the standard. So really excited to have him on today. Thanks so much for joining us.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

Yeah, no, thank you for having me. I'm really excited. I always like talking about hotels.

SPEAKER_00 1:01

Well, look, that is the topic of the day, my friend. So before we kind of dive in, I'd love to know a bit more about your journey, how you became to came to be at Hostfully and where hotels fit in.

SPEAKER_01 1:11

Yeah, I mean, it's it's a long, it's a long story. So I'm gonna keep it short for for today's episode. But long story short, I started my career in the luxury hotel space selling, being on the operational side first of the front desk guest services, specifically for brands like the Trump Hotel Collection, Four Seasons, uh, Marriott Luxury, which include the addition brand as well as the Ritz Carlton brand. So by having all of that experience, and I'll kind of touch on a few, a few topics as well, but I feel like that guest experience and my career experience is just transitional into the short-term rental world. And by transitioning from the hotel world to the short-term rental world by kind of by choice, kind of not by choice. Uh, it was COVID-related. You know, hotels shut down during COVID, which means jobs were lost right here. But I've always wanted to get into the short-term rental world. Airbnb has always been something I've been interested in, short-term rentals in and of itself. And I just really stumbled across hostfully six years ago. Um, and that's where I started my career in the short-term rental world. So it's it's been been fantastic. And I'm definitely definitely not going back to the hotel world. Because I think, and this will try this will translate well into today's conversation is you know, that hotels are they're there, you know, they put their systems in place, their foundation is strong. Short-term rentals, we're only seeing the ice, the tip of the iceberg at this point. Um, and I think that there's so much future and growth in the in the short-term rental world. And I think, again, having the these hotel tips and tricks would definitely elevate a guest experience in this industry.

SPEAKER_02 2:54

I hear also you actually put this into some really actionable insights and sort of bite-sized things of this is exactly what hotels have been doing for years that works. And these this is exactly how we can apply it to our industry, which I think is going to be great for our operators because a lot of times we always try and compare ourselves to the good things of hotels and not the bad things, or vice versa. So we're always trying to say, like, oh, we're so much different than hotels, we're so much better because we're more personalized, we're more all of these things. But there are definitely things that we can learn from the hotel industry. And so I'm really excited today to hear a little bit more about that. And in particular, as I said, like specific actionable things that the audience can take into their day-to-day operations to build up that kind of level of professionalization.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Yeah. And it's it's also something that I've been noticing more and more lately is it's something I get asked about, as I mentioned, pretty often because of my background in hotels, specifically luxury hotels. Ultimately, what it is is the best short-term rental operators today, they're not just hosts anymore. It's not just heads and beds on Airbnb. The professional, successful operators are operating like hotel brands. And again, I think the biggest takeaway and difference between average operators and top performers. It's it's not how nice your furniture is. It's not how how nice your photos are or how big your home is or if it's located on a beach front, although that sometimes helps. But it's it's the systems that they have in place. Top operators and property managers, they don't rely on memory alone. So they have these like repeatable systems that they rely on. And those repeatable systems deliver this consistent experience every single time. And it really matters. I mean, you know, guests, they're about like two times more likely to leave a side five-star review when the expectations are clear and consistent right from the get-go. Um, so you know, hotels figure this out decades ago, like you said, Sarah. So, you know, they don't just hope for a great guest experience. Like they've engineered them, they put systems in place that they can guarantee a great guest experience right from the start. And, you know, based on the hotels that I've worked at, the Ritz-Carlton, Four Seasons, I just got turned on to the Amon resorts. I've been, I didn't know about them before, and now I do. And they all do this differently, but they all follow the same principle, which is you know, they design the guest experience intentionally and really focus on the guest. Uh, and the thing is, like, even with short-term operators, uh, short-term rental operators, is you don't need a full hotel team to do this successfully. You just kind of need the right systems in place to make it make it more of an intent.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

Makes sense. Tell us, tell us a little bit more about those systems. And also, I am curious to learn a little bit more about. Seems like there's some things that the hotel industry has the advantage of not only time, but also um a wealth of inventory, right? So just as you mentioned, like I go to a courtyard marriott, I know I'm getting one's experience. I go to a different kind of marriage, I know I'm getting a different experience. Um and it is known generally. You can tell by the website, you can tell by um the information that is sent to you about the hotel room. One of the things I see as a potential challenge for short-term rental operators is like maybe all their properties don't have the same amenities, maybe all of their properties don't allow them to have that same level of experience. So I guess that's another question is if you are an operator that has maybe a varied portfolio. One, would you recommend a varied portfolio? I've even seen some managers that break it out into different brands. So for example, they have one brand that's all operated by the same company. So they have one brand which is known as their luxury brand. And every time that they take on, even if it's one or two properties that are different from that, they'll start a new brand so that it doesn't cross-contaminate. I'm curious if that is something that you have seen in the short-term rental industry or you've seen work like it does in hotels. Sorry, that was a long question.

SPEAKER_01 6:56

No, no, no. It's it's great because it also gives property managers or owners of the operators this opportunity to have different brands. I think with the courtyard Marriott from the Ritz-Carlton, which is part of the Marriott collection, is the reason they're so successful is because the experience feels consistent. It feels intentional and it's familiar to the guest. If you're at a Marriott courtyard, it's consistent, it's intentional, you know where you're gonna get. Same thing with the Ritz-Carlton. It's consistent, it's intentional. You know what you're going to get. It's very familiar. And again, just based on the conversation, and this kind of leads to my to my first point is this standardization of the experience across every property. Um, and even with property managers, there's different owners, and every owner has a different home. So you, as the property manager, have to make a concerted effort or just you yourself be consistent on which owners you take on. You know, you want to make sure that the properties match your brand. If you have a luxury component and then like a lifestyle or upscale component, similar to what Marriott does. You know, they have they have the luxury, which is the Ritz-Carlton and the addition, then they have the upscale, which is the West End and the W. And then they have, I forget what their words are, or lifestyle, I think is their verbiage for that. Like the courtyard Marriott and all those others. Again, the reasons they're so successful is because no matter where you stay, the familiarity and the consistency and the intentionality behind that brand is there. Like Four Seasons in particular, right? They're known for delivering the same high-end experience across every property globally. So you always know what you're gonna get, and it's always exceptional. And that's where many short-term rental operators fall short. You know, one property feels amazing and the next property feels completely different. And that inconsistency is what kills your repeat bookings. Um, and like even in practice, I mean, this means it's easy, actionable takeaways that you can take, that you can take from today's conversation. It's just creating a simple but clear brand behind the scenes. You have a checklist for every single property or every single collection. So, you know, the tone of your messaging, the way you, the way the space is set up, and just the overall guest experience really just feels aligned to the brand. And it also means, you know, standardizing the essentials, right? Like your linens, uh, your toiletries, the way that you set up the coffee. It's even how you communicate your check-in instructions, you know, while at the same time auditing your listings to make sure that what the guests see online actually matches what they experience in person. So standardization, I think, is the most important ways of kind of leveling up your current operations, but also setting yourself apart from the competition because every day there's a new competitor or other listing uh that you're competing with in the market. So again, standardization is really important. That was the first one. Uh kind of I'm I'm thinking about just going through each individual one.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Go for it.

SPEAKER_01 10:07

The arrival, you know, hotels, especially the luxury hotels, obsess over check-in because they know that first impressions are formed within like the first 10 to 15 minutes. Um, so going back to the four seasons, if you can't tell what my favorite brand is, now you know. I wish I could afford it so often, but one day. At the four seasons, you're often greeted by name and checked in seamlessly and effortlessly. There's no waiting, there's no confusion. They know who you are the second you walk through that door. Now, comparing that to a typical bad short-term rental experience, you're scrolling through your messages, you're searching for the lock code to get into the unit, not knowing where to go at times. And that friction immediately impacts the stay. And again, the best operators, short-term rental operators, are the ones that are removing all of that guesswork. Everything is clear, everything is simple, and it just works. So you're anticipating these guest needs, which brings me to my third. But before we go to number three, some things you can do as a short-term rental operator. So instead of like, you know, this scattered communication, I would recommend just delivering one clear automated day of arrival that includes everything that the guest needs to know in one place, whether that's via text message, WhatsApp, email, or even using a digital guidebook. You know, include the address, the parking details, the access codes, the Wi-Fi code. Include pictures and videos on how to find the location, especially if it's kind of hidden away or if it's a unit amongst 200 units in a in a luxury high-rise. You want to provide that right from the get-go. And also, speaking about lock codes, you know, the smart locks, you want to make sure that they're automatically generated and that those expired codes are tied to the reservation, just ensuring and executing a seamless check-in arrival, because the last thing you want is friction right upon arrival. And what I could also suggest is even if you have a short-term rental and you've been running operations for five years, regularly test your own check-in experience. Have your friends, have your family stay at your unit and treat them as a guest and ask them for feedback the same way the guest would. This way you can catch any friction before the next guest arrives. And so I always suggest doing that. And no matter, you know, again, if you've been in the industry for one year or if you've been renting out your listings for 10 years, like just being on top of that and just, you know, consistently, not consistently, regularly, just checking in on that and making sure that the check-in experience is seamless and frictionless is a huge takeaway.

SPEAKER_00 12:50

So the check-in is something that I feel feel very passionate about because I don't know if I've ever told either of you this. Sarah, I must have mentioned this in many of the hours that we've been working together. My first job in the vacation rental industry was with One Fine Today. And my first mission was to design a check-in process, right? And execute it. And at the time we were doing face-to-face check-ins because it was 2011, 2012. And the tech wasn't there to kind of, you know, screen the guests pre-arrival, do all of those things that people now need to do to feel feel really comfortable. So but we were so important to the experience as the the meeter-greeter team, you know, we were vital and we would often get referenced in the feedback. Um we asked in the MPS, it was referenced, asked you to score your greeter. And people really liked the fact that they got off a flight to get lagged tired, but with high expectations. So it's like such a crucial part of the whole experience. And when you walk into a hotel, if they do it right and you're greeted with a smile and here's the Wi-Fi code, and this is what time breakfast is, and this is what you can expect. And have you seen the coffee machine over there? It's uh hand pressed, whatever, you know, all that good stuff. If you can create that check-in process that doesn't like just befuddle people with too much information, but gives them enough, you are like buying yourself so much goodwill. You're buying yourself so much goodwill when they maybe find something that they didn't quite think was right or something like that. If they have a bad check-in experience, the whole thing can just cascade from the off. Now, I think there's a conversation we could be having, let's not have it today, but about how maybe AI is going to mean that operators have more time to go and bring back the face-to-face check-in. That I would love, by the way. I love that if we could just be like, you know, just checking people while the while the machine does everything in the background, because that really is what makes the big difference. But like, let's think about that, Frank. We're talking about like automating your check-in process. This is why you have to automate it because it has to feel as as warm and cuddly as if you were there in person, even though it's not practical for you to be there in person, right?

SPEAKER_01 14:40

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And even just ensuring that your check-in process is standard and that it's seamless and effortless is kind of where the hotel industry thrives. The Ritz-Carlton, for example, they stand out because their philosophy is around anticipating guest needs. So, same thing as ensuring your check-in process is seamless. The hotels don't wait for problems. Um, what they do is they instead design the experience to prevent those problems. So just anticipating the guest needs right from the get-go. In your case, Leo, was you know, the check-in process. In short-term rentals, way too many operators wait until checkout to ask for feedback, which in my opinion is way too late. Um, I think you can really prevent any issues right from the start. Even like a simple, what I love and what I do a lot of my demos is show our automated messaging. And after the stay starts, you can create an automated email or text or WhatsApp that goes to the guest two hours after they check in, just being like, hey, welcome to the property. I'm Frank. We're thrilled to have you with us. Should you have any questions, please do not hesitate to email me directly and I put my signature there. So now every single guest, two hours after they check in, receive this personalized email or WhatsApp from me directly. And again, that that simple, proactive answering of common questions and offering assistance that can prevent issues before they even happen, which ultimately, right, it's gonna, it's gonna dramatically improve your reviews. So I think, you know, kind of going back to that is instead of reacting, just taking that shift to proactively support the guests throughout their stay. Again, by sending a follow-up email, check-in instructions, making sure that common answer questions are answered, like Wi-Fi, thermostat controls, parking, just taking that away and providing that right from the start. You can answer it, like you said. You don't want to provide too much information all at once because it could be a bit overwhelming, but you can have all of that stuff in a guidebook. And you can even use messaging that feels personalized even when it is automated. So over time, it also doesn't mean you know you're you're paying attention to recurring issues and fixing them off the source, the source, but you're not solving the same problem over and over again because you will be taking care of it due to your proactiveness, if that makes sense. Um, which was my third, which was a very nice transition there. Oh no.

SPEAKER_00 17:13

I love it. I love it when you go to a restaurant and the waiter pops back halfway through the starter and just says, Is everything okay? And there's a skill to it because they're not like they're not like in your face like asking you to like review the food. They're not asking you to write a Google review, but they're just checking in. So that if there is something wrong with your starter, they can rectify it, hopefully, by the time everyone else it hasn't finished their food and they can get you something out and do it. So so I think and I always put it back to those uh like I I don't think we talk about this enough as an industry, but it is like it's a hospitality experience, right? From the minute they book with you to the minute they leave. Well, even after they've left, right? And you're retargeting them, you're in that you're on that journey with them. And again, yeah, like just um just giving somebody time to to to uh give their feedback and feel listened to. In in the short-term rental context that uh context that's oh actually you didn't bring the towels. Okay, right, okay, cool. Well we better we better quickly get those out so you can get them out today instead of them all sharing a towel for three days while you're while you're trying to get it out. The again, you know, I I've heard it said that basically, and I I can kind of relate to this, I guess. I don't my kids are too young to start complaining about the whole the holiday yet. But if you've got a family, especially and your kids are at moy, is that you know, the person who's paid for the holiday and booked it all and organized it, which is more times than not probably the mum, but in my house it's me. The and I feel like it's you in your house as well, Frank, but they don't relax until everybody they've checked that everything's okay in the property, otherwise they feel like they haven't done their job properly if their job was to book it. And maybe we can all relate to that when you book things with friends. So we as operators need to be, you know, aware of that.

SPEAKER_01 18:48

Yeah. And I mean it could be this also this domino effect, you know, like you said, the kids are upset, the wife is upset, you're now upset. We're gonna take it out on the property manager. Why did you not have, you know, you knew that there were there were four of us. Why are there only three towels? So yeah, and that, you know, that does that does impact significantly. Um but that's that's preventable. It's just checking in on the guest an hour or two after they check in. Um, and then also the other thing, and you don't get this with too many hotels, but again, it's it's this curated local experience, like a concierge. So I think that that will really elevate your operations. If there are towels, you call down to the front desk, somebody's gonna help you out and bring that right over. And then because ultimately, hotels they don't just provide a place to stay, they guide your experience at the location in which they booked. So, even like again, with horse seasons, the risk, the Ritz-Carlton, their concierge team builds personalized recommendations and itineraries that elevate the entire trip. Now, that's the luxury component of it all, but even the smaller lifestyle hotels, they offer guidebooks. They have somebody at the front to help you with that. Even though it's not a dedicated concierge, you still have someone who's familiar with the area to really just elevate your experience. But then I brought up earlier the Amon resorts, they take this all take this even further. They they're designing highly personalized experiences where everything feels intentional and tailored to the next level. And today's guests expect the same level of guidance, maybe not as dramatic as like the Amon Resorts, but they still do expect hotel-like amenities and service uh that they normally didn't a few years ago. Um, and uh, I did a podcast recently, I forget which one it was, but I remember hearing that about 40% of travelers say that local recommendations improve their stay, which duh, right? Like obviously, how did we not think of this? So operators who did this, who do this well, are consistently seeing better reviews because they are providing local recommendations to their guests. So, again, going back to what Leo said, instead of overwhelming guests with endless options all at once, you can still do that by curating just a thoughtful set of recommendations. Uh, you know, like your favorite top restaurants, your favorite coffee shops, the activities that are fun to do, and organizing them in a way that's that's just easy to navigate. You could also take it a step further by tailoring those recommendations to different types of guests. Um, you know, if you have families, couples, like who recognize, and this is another whole topic that we can discuss at a later date, but like recognize who your avatar is. If it's families, if it's couples, if it's business travelers, building partnerships with local businesses, exclusive perks, even introducing these small upsells like early check in or local experiences, that really directly impacts the experience of the guests as well as their journey. So just kind of recognizing who the avatar is, but then curating that local experience like you were yourself. A concierge. And you can do that with AI. You could do that with digital guidebooks, which we've seen so much success with. So that's that's also super important. But then ultimately, just taking those four and just running your operations like a hospitality business. And this is where everything comes together is having the right systems in place. So growth without systems, you're going to ultimately create chaos. And this is where many operators struggle as they scale and then find that they fall short. And then they just sell their business. So hotels really rely on integrated systems for everything: your communication to guests, your housekeeping, your reporting. This way, nothing falls through the cracks. And that's how they deliver this consistency at scale. This is how they're able to grow and build more properties, is with that consistency. And it's technically not all through effort. Yes, in the beginning, there's going to be a lot of effort, but once you get the right systems in place and you have a nice, strong set tech stack, you can build that through your systems. And kind of a takeaway there and kind of a best practice. It doesn't mean automating guest communication across the entire journey. Although we that's ultimately what we want to do with a personalized approach to it, from booking to checkout to review requests, you can automate all of that by putting systems in place. You can even put systems in place for cleaning, maintenance, turnover, just to ensure that nothing is missed. And at the same time, I would highly suggest tracking key performance metrics. So majority property management softwares, they have like an analytics tab where you can track your performance metrics, like your occupancy, your ADR, your average a year average daily rate, your review scores, the response times that give you visibility into what's actually working and what's not working. And then you just centralize all of that stuff into a platform. And that ultimately will eliminate the complexity of just juggling so many tools and integrations. So again, just kind of, you know, going back to running your business like a hotel. And there's so many more tips and tricks that you can do. But ultimately, just when you zoom out, it just comes down to one simple idea. Uh, and it's you don't need to become a hotel. You just or should absolutely adopt how hotels think. You know, whether it is a Ritz-Carlton with anticipating the guest needs or, you know, a four seasons by delivering consistency and creating these intentional experiences, they all prioritize systems that make great stays predictable. Predictable always has like this, I don't know, negative connotation to it. Um, but when you're a guest going into or visiting an area in which you've never been, you want predictable. You want to know what's expected. You want to feel comfortable, um, even though you know you're a 30-hour flight away from home. Um, and hotels do that with the familiarity of their brand. So even like with platforms like Hostfully, you know, operators can bring all of this together without adding more work or stress on themselves or even on their guests. So it's not really a way of working harder, it's that they're working smarter. So ultimately, you know, operators who win long term aren't the ones that are doing everything manually, even though sometimes property managers feel like they need to do stuff manually because it's extra work, and extra work means better work, which isn't the case anymore. The operators that are winning are the ones that are building better systems in an effort to think and act and provide as hotels do. Um, so that's I think we covered a lot. Even if it's just like five tips, I think it's still like just it's just you can really take a lot from what hotels are doing. And even as a short-term rental operator, when you travel, you stay at other short-term rental listings. I would say stay at hotels once in a while and kind of pick up on what they're doing and how you can really benefit your own business by little things that hotels do in order just to improve your guest experience overall.

SPEAKER_02 26:12

Yeah, I love that. I think one of the things that's coming out to me today is really where we can pick up good things from hotels. So, for example, the things that stand out to me are that that idea of standardization of the processes, especially as you scale and grow. And what I love about that, plus all of the cool stuff that's coming out with AI, is that it's ultimately freeing us up to be able to do what we're best at, which is which is hospitality, right? So maybe that that means that it's gonna eventually free us up to do the guest check-ins or to do more of at the minimum that concierge component of things. We know one of my colleagues here at AirDay, um, James, who we've had on the podcast before, he also owns two properties out in the canaries. And he does something really cool, which is he doesn't, he has somebody go and do the check-in for him. But as soon as they check in, like the same thing, he sends them a personalized WhatsApp. He also calls them just to like see how everything's going. Like he physically calls them. And then the other thing that he does, which I think is really cool, is and this is the bit that he loves the most, he kind of does that concierge. So he'll ask them, like, hey, I noticed you guys are here for three days. You know, you're a family, these are the things I would recommend. Would you like me to make a reservation for you? Like, I know, you know, you know, Manuel down there and I can get you a discount. He always had like, and the cool thing is now he's had property, you know, his property's in operation for a while. So everybody local knows him. And he has a house down there that he goes off in anyway. So they knew him before. Now he's sending them business. They always end up like, and we'll give them a free dessert or, you know, coffee included for free or whatever it is. It's those little tiny things that make the experience totally different. And that's the component that hotels will never have. Maybe I'm wrong, but that is what really sets us apart. And so I think we need to take the automization, automate automation. I speak English, I promise. This is what's my Spanish coming up. Uh anyway, we need to take this the automation that we can from the hotel industry. And we need to take the things that make us unique, which I think in the concierge concept in particular is where, as a short-term rental industry, we can a hundred percent win over a hotel. That's what differentiates the experience for me.

SPEAKER_00 28:22

I I agree with that. Sorry, Frank. I I was gonna say before you answer Frank, I completely agree. And short-term rentals also do themselves a great service by bonding with local restaurateurs and people because then they understand the value the industry brings to tourism more than ever. Because I bet the people that work with James, and James is so good at it, James is a natural-born concierge, you know, they're like, oh, great, we can see he's bringing tourists. And and like the hotel has its own food and beverage facility. So the awkward thing is they probably don't want you out the whole time. They want you in as well. Whereas the short-term rental wants you out. Frank, sorry.

SPEAKER_01 28:54

No, no, no. That's that's actually a great point. Again, another whole topic that we can cover. But like, there is a negative connotation to short-term rentals being in certain markets where the restrictions and the regulations stem from. Um, and I think it's important to get to know your local vendors because when the time comes, and I hear this all the time, it's not if, it's when the regulations come, you have a solid backing and a solid foundation of people to vouch for your short-term rental. You know, like with Manuel bringing X amount of business to that restaurant, if you need to bring in that person during regulations and have your contact at that restaurant be like, Manuel brought us$100,000 last quarter. That's that's enough because that$100,000 is going towards that market and that city. So it's it's definitely something that a lot of people don't necessarily think about. And that could be like a whole advocacy topic that we touch on at some later point. But yeah, you you both brought up a really good point is just cultivating that relationship with your area as well. And we are going off topic. But again, hotels want to keep everyone in so they make the FB revenue, whereas short-term rentals don't have that, so they leverage their contacts and local vendors to do so, which benefits everyone.

SPEAKER_00 30:11

Frank, this has been incredibly interesting. Thank you so much. You'll have to come back on. So we'll get you back. Um, we'll also do a co-blog with you with these actionable insights, these five insights um that you can STR operators can learn from the hotel space. Thank you for taking the time to talk us through your unique journey, as it is, into short-term rentals and and how that and how that means you've got these kind of insights in mind. It's it's really cool to see how how you see the industry. And um, yeah, love your passion for it. So thanks, buddy.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

Yeah, no, thank you for having me. Ultimately, what it is is just bringing the hospitality back into the hospitality industry. You know, long gone are the days where you can just put your listing up on Airbnb and make money. There's competitors, you know. We have competitors now as short-term rental operators. So it's setting yourself apart from those other short-term rentals in the area. And the way to do that is true, sincere, genuine hospitality.

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Frank, I love it. And look, we'll see you very soon in London. We've got paddle plans, we've got conference plans. We'll do, we'll do a big bear hug, I'm sure, with Sarah and I when we're on the main stage. Um, and to all you at home, if you've enjoyed today's show, please hit like, share, subscribe in all the usual places, and keep an eye out for that co-blog with these actionable insights. Thanks very much.

SPEAKER_01 31:22

Awesome. Thank you for having me.