S1E12 From Ricky’s to Retail Empire: The Man Behind a Billion-Dollar Obsession Spirit Halloween

From the gritty, anything-goes days of Ricky’s NYC to the nationwide takeover of Spirit Halloween, this episode dives into the evolution of retail as experience. We unpack the rise, the fall, and the unexpected rebirth of Halloween as a cultural and commercial phenomenon—plus what it really takes to build a pop-up empire at scale.

Ricky’s walked…
so Spirit could run.

NYC chaos → national takeover.

The rise.
The fall.
The pop-up empire.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hi, I'm Monica Nova. Welcome to Canvas, a podcast where every episode is a fresh Canvas. We dive into stories that make you pause, conversations that open your perspective, and the ideas influencing art, lifestyle, entertainment, architecture, and the way we connect as humans. Together, we look beyond the surface into the moments, the places, and the people quietly shaping how the world moves and why we keep evolving. Hello, everyone, and welcome to Canvas with Nova Collective. We are so happy to have you guys joining us today. We have a special guest who I've known for a very long time and holds a very special place in my heart. I want to welcome Jason Stanlofer, who is the vice president of Bearett. Jason has a past history that we're gonna have a lot of fun hearing about. Jason used to be formerly from Ricky's, which I'm sure any of you who were late 90s, early 2000s would know what Ricky's NYC was. Jason, welcome. Thank you very much for joining us. I really appreciate you taking the time out of your busy schedule. Welcome.

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Hi Monica. So happy to be here. Thanks for having me. This is gonna be fun.

SPEAKER_03 1:15

This is gonna be a lot of fun. Jay, you and I have known each other for 24 years. Yeah, yeah. Just about.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

I remember when we first met. Oh, do you want to tell that? Yeah, well, I'll tell I'll tell part of the story.

SPEAKER_02 1:32

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:32

I was in Brooklyn. I was looking at the Gresch building to possibly buy a unit. Never met Monica before, and she was just a bolt of lightning, and we hit it off from the beginning, and we became friends. I actually wound up buying a place, but we wound up staying very close for over 20 years. And I think that's the the most important thing about life is relationships. And Monica and I have fostered an amazing relationship from that day through through today.

SPEAKER_03 2:05

Yeah, it was really a very interesting day when you walked in. And I remember you were with your fiance at the time, Janine. And I did a beeline because I saw this six foot three, tall, tatted, hot guy walking in. And I tell my sales associate at the time, I'm sure you remember Lynn Brown. I'm like, Lynn, I've got this. Let me take care of that. And she's like, okay, but aren't you dating a woman? I'm like, doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. But it was, it was a lot of fun. It was great. It was amazing that you and I ended up actually knowing a lot of the, I knew a lot of the same people you knew, which was your cousin Todd at the time and his wife Carmen. That's a whole other series and episode to get it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

But we're New Yorkers through and through. So we're going to just know people through that. And we had so many similarities and we we clicked.

SPEAKER_03 3:02

No, it was definitely. And then your cousin was good friends with now my then girlfriend, now wife, Stacy.

SPEAKER_02 3:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:11

So that was a fun time. And for most of you people who are familiar with the Gretch, it was in Williamsburg, and it was the time in 2004 where Williamsburg was not really a market that was desired. It was the up and coming. And most people said that it was going to take some time to grow. But I think it kind of blew up within five years after that, pretty much.

SPEAKER_01 3:35

It did. It did.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:36

Yeah. So my oh, listen, always my always my pleasure. Always my pleasure. But let's let's just jump right into it. So before before you were the Halloween guy, you were the New York cool kid. You know, Ricky's was the ultimate New York City destination, costumes, hair dye, adult toys. Thing things your mom probably didn't want you to buy. But how did growing up in that world of retail as an experience shape you the way you think today and what you do now in spirit?

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Listen, I think being at Ricky's uh allowed me to build on skills that I was working on prior to that. I think being part of Ricky's, I was very proud of. It was an institution in New York City, of course. And we built something pretty special. And being part, you know, the few people that ran that company, we had a lot of wins. And like I said earlier with you and I, with relationships, I think that was one of the biggest parts of my time there. I ran Rikki's for 17 years, left in 2012. But it it taught me how to think differently, how to be more analytical, more strategic. What do we need to think about down the road in terms of product and what are people really looking for? I still have people that work for me at Rikki's working for me at Spirit. So it's, you know, providing opportunities there uh is pretty special to me as well.

SPEAKER_03 5:06

So what were the fun, exciting, yet risky experiences that you had? Like if you could say one of the moments of being in the multiple stores, because there were multiple stores throughout New York City. I think the original one started on the Upper West Side. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 5:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:30

So can you tell me like one of the let's just say wild and crazy incidents?

SPEAKER_01 5:36

There's a lot. Well let me enlighten us. Well, let's start off by saying we started as a basically an edgier pharmacy. And we had to evolve. So we started off with Health and Beauty AIDS, we had fragrances. It was it was just a cooler-looking Dwayne Reed. And and and then we started realizing, you know what, that's not gonna fly. That's not what people want. That's not gonna separate us from everybody. And then we started leaning into high-end hair care. We started our own cosmetic line. We got rid of all the fragrances, and we made a whole wall full of wigs. And that kind of metamorphosized into something different where people started all the stylists in New York City would come to us. Anybody in fashion, anybody in makeup and beauty. But then we started becoming that household name where people, and this is before the internet. So you're gonna go to the store and you're gonna touch it, you're gonna feel it, you're gonna smell it, you're not gonna click a button. So we created an experience within the stores that really didn't exist yet. We accidentally stumbled on Halloween. So I don't know if you remember, but we became the Mecca in New York City when it came to Halloween.

SPEAKER_03 6:52

You were.

SPEAKER_01 6:54

And and I think that was one of the, especially for me, considering what I do now, it was a transformative moment and it happened by accident. One of one of our friends, I don't even remember who it was, needed a costume. And like you said earlier, we were selling some adult, we had a video rooms in the back with all the adult toys and lingerie and things of that nature. And so we had some connections. So we we couldn't buy the one costume, we had to buy three. And and so we're like, okay, let's buy a few more and see what happens. And sure enough, we we bought a few and sold out. And we're like, Okay, this is something different. We didn't know that what it was gonna turn out to be. But then we decided to really lean in. And there was really three of us that were running all of the stores, and it was it was we were like one stop up from a mom and pop, Monica. We weren't we weren't refined, it wasn't highly engineered, and we were kind of just picking what we liked for the stores that we ran and sending it to the stores, and it was like a fun competition between the three of us.

SPEAKER_03 8:17

But you would have the lines going out the door during Halloween.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

It blew up. So what we wound up doing is in October, really just the second week of October, we would start covering all of our product with costumes. And it took off. And we would have lines outside the store waiting to get in. We couldn't have enough product, the store would get trashed. When you think about crazy, there was no fitting rooms. So women were basically getting down into their underwear and trying on costumes right on the sales floor. And at that time, I'm a young guy. It was a fun experience. I would tell all my friends to come and help and work for me, and they they all were good, they would do it for free. And but it was it was something really amazing. And then we decided to say, all right, there's opportunity for more, but we don't want to do more Ricky stores right now, so we're gonna do pop-ups. And so at one point we had over 40 pop-ups in all the boroughs, and I think we had one in in the Hamptons. And it just became this beast that I'm very proud of, and and that was the segue to Spirit, because when I decided that it was time for me to leave Ricky's, you know, Spirit Halloween, who's the right now the largest Halloween retailer in the world and no one's even close, they would continue to try to get into New York City. And so I would take a a pop-up and I would put it right across the street or right next door. Just to fuck with them.

SPEAKER_03 9:55

You would crush them.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

And we crushed them. They couldn't survive. And and so that that was fun for me. And this was before I knew I was gonna be leaving Ricky's, and then they found out I was leaving Ricky's and they reached out to me and they're like, Hey, would you be interested in coming in and and working with us as a consultant at that time?

SPEAKER_03 10:15

But didn't they reach out to you while you were at Ricky's?

SPEAKER_01 10:18

They reached out to me when I was still at Ricky's, but I knew I was leaving, and people knew I was leaving. So it was like right at that moment in time, which was a short amount of time, there wasn't a a big window where it I made it known that I'm out and and then I remember that. A friend of mine. Yeah, a friend of mine was friends with somebody on the board of Spirit, let them know, and then somebody reached out to me.

SPEAKER_03 10:44

So before we jump into the evolution of Spirit and how you catapulted that, you know, a little, maybe a little uncomfortable question I want to ask you. What happened with Ricky's? Well, let's let's be honest. How how did the evolution be so big and the fall happened so quickly?

SPEAKER_01 11:09

Monica, I wish I could answer it with certainty. The I don't the answer is I don't know what happened. And that's the that's the honest truth. We had an investor that is has a lot of money and he owned fifty percent of the company and I was not the CEO. I I ran it, I was I guess my title was director or whatever you want to call me. But I I did not run I did not run the company as a whole. And there was a fallout, and because I was called the number two or number three guy, the three of us were getting pushed out for for whatever reason I don't know. I think there was something between him and my the CEO at the time, but nobody knows the truth but them. So at that point I was in my y early thirties and I needed to figure out what was next, maybe mid thirties. I was angry because I thought I was be more of a victim. You know, as I get older and more mature, experience more and I take a step back, I pro me personally, I probably could have managed some circumstances a little bit differently. And I didn't, and which probably didn't help my relationship with that that investor. I don't re I don't regret what I did because it opened the doors to where I am now. And I am a very competitive person, as you may know. And I said, Okay, it's gonna take me five years to put Rickies out of business. It took me six. Ricky's, you know, they I think they thought they could do more than what they could without the three of us, and they quickly relearn learned that you you can't replace people. You know, and and just teaching processes is one thing. Relationships, leadership, you know, focus, being, you know, being able to see down the fairway and understand what's next are skills that sometimes you can't replicate. And they were humbled and they and they went out of business.

SPEAKER_03 13:27

Well, it's kind of true because I I mean I remember hearing through the grapevine, and I'm not gonna say that this is a hundred percent accurate. It was speculation in hearsay that the investors essentially pretty much pushed Ricky out and was, we're gonna do this, we don't need you. And uh, like you said, you can't replace people. You can't replace the heart and soul of a company if it wasn't broken. There was no need to try to change it and think you could fix it or make it better. You need the people that were the infrastructure that truly made this company what it was. And therefore, uh my belief and my understanding was that was the true demise. And here you came bringing in doing exactly the same model that you were doing with Ricky's, doing it with spent with spirit. And yes, you you you you crushed Ricky's, you crushed the way you crushed spirit when you were Ricky's, you destroyed Ricky's because I was angrier at that point.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

So it was a mess. And let me be abundantly clear. Spirit was already huge, you know, at when I came on board. So it's not like I want to be clear, I didn't start Spirit. I I like to think that I've been a you know a part of its trajectory. And when I came on board, it was roughly 500-ish stores, which is a lot, and now we're doing 1600.

SPEAKER_03 14:50

Well, I was just gonna say because Spirit basically was a national obsession, like it was outside of New York City.

SPEAKER_01 14:58

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 15:01

You went to the company, you started the company in 2012.

SPEAKER_01 15:05

2012.

SPEAKER_03 15:06

2012. And now, like you said, you're basically overseeing approximately sixteen hundred locations in the northeast alone.

SPEAKER_01 15:13

No, not the whole cut, no, the whole country and Canada. So 1600 stores is everything.

SPEAKER_03 15:20

Everything. So and what's the divid what sector of the country do you cover?

SPEAKER_01 15:27

I I now I oversee everything.

SPEAKER_03 15:30

Wow. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:32

That that's amazing. So that then I guess really then it was like I'm like, fuck.

SPEAKER_01 15:40

You got a little tongue tied in.

SPEAKER_03 15:41

I'm like, when did that happen?

SPEAKER_01 15:43

So yeah, it was a very, you know, so in the last 12 years, it's been a quite the ride. I started off in 2012 as a what a quote unquote consultant, and they wanted to help, you know, with just the cities, New York City, maybe Philly, maybe Chicago, just understanding, because it's a different breed than, you know, Nebraska or all these other, you know, cities and towns that just uh have a different look, feel, pace to it. Then we started connecting more and we started building on that. Then I became what we call a director and oversaw a small area of the country, and then it's it's grown to where I oversaw a few years ago half the country, and then two years ago I got the nod to vice president, and now I oversee all spirit stores.

SPEAKER_03 16:28

Bravo, Jay. That's I'm very proud of you. That's a huge achievement. And to be covering the entire country and part of Canada is no small feat for sure. I mean, it's it but it's interesting because you know, every Halloween store that you oversee and put out there, it's a whole cultural moment and movement. It it really is mind-blowing with all the memes that you see. Did didn't I send you one with the White House?

SPEAKER_01 16:58

Yeah, it's you know what's the best part about this, Monica? We have nothing to do with that. We have nothing to do with these memes. These are people out there. As soon as a business closes, the Yankees lose the the championship, the White House shuts down, you know, whatever, somebody puts our banner on on the stadium or the building, and it's all over social media. It is hysterical. So we are the meme.

SPEAKER_03 17:25

It is, it is truly hysterical.

unknown 17:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:28

So I I have another question for you. And we're gonna segue a little bit into a little bit of the real estate aspect of what you do. Pop-ups is a model, it's low-key, it's a genius. It was not ever really something that was seen, uh especially in New York City. Uh how did pop-ups become? Because you are the you basically, for me, are the one who started all these pop-ups before 2012. Can you explain how did something go from like September being nothing in empty space to magically appear the next day of 10,000 plus square feet of like skeletons, costumes, wigs, everything you can think of? I mean, what actually goes into pulling all of this to scale? Like it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 18:19

Well, I'll break it down to a couple different ways. So you said what will, you know, how did it start? Yeah. When we started it back in the day in the early 2000s, it was more of a play to test markets for Rickies. Right? We're like, all right, we we think we can possibly have a a good area to put a Ricky store permanently, but we're gonna test it because we know if we do relatively well for Halloween, we think it's gonna translate to Ricky. And that's how and so we would take some of these temporary spaces and then we make them into long-term deals. Right? And many we did not. We're like, all right, it did well, but based on what we've learned, maybe not yet. Maybe let's let's test it again next year, we'll see what happens. So that was the the original thought process behind it. And then we started saying, all right, well, let's take the permitted aspect out of the way. We have an empty space here. Landlords typically don't like not collecting rent. So we're gonna keep this place warm for you. We're gonna pay a reasonable, we consider a reasonable rent, and let me let me give you advice. The week before Halloween, I want you to send somebody there with a camera and take pictures of what your space can do, because there's gonna be a line outside of your door and it's gonna show the value of your real estate. And they start saying, Okay. That's brilliant. And then with spirit, it's you know, listen, all these businesses are closing, right? Yeah, Party City went out of business, right? Joanne Fabrics, big lots, sports authorities, toys are us, you name it. You know, so now these landlords are sitting on this these these spaces, and this is perfect for us. This is perfect for our business model. So we are going and we are looking for all of these locations, and my business spirit is the most highly engineered business you can ever fathom. Because if you really think about what we do, it's not about just finding sixteen hundred stores, it's you're you're you're planning two years down the road. We have a buying department, we have a whole real estate department, we have a field that's going out and finding every viable piece of real estate in the country to give us options. Because if we do sixteen hundred stores, we need at least sixteen thousand options. And and oh, by the way, this year we're hiring 55,000 seasonal employees.

SPEAKER_03 20:53

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 20:56

Well, nobody can say that they can't find a job. Call call Jason.

SPEAKER_01 21:00

We are the number one employer in the month of October.

SPEAKER_03 21:06

So how long typically from start hire to end, is it really? You gotta manage people's expectations.

SPEAKER_01 21:14

It ranges. So we have we have different roles and responsibilities. So we do have plenty of permanent people that work for us year-round. And then from a district manager down to a sales associate or all seasonal employees. District managers, depending on the market and the the real estate that we have currently, will can start as early as the first week of June, but the the lion share start the last week of June.

SPEAKER_02 21:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Right? And and they will work all the way through let's call it November 15th. And store managers the same. We start trickling them in. District managers will run anywhere between three and five locations. Store managers one, and then every store averages. Around three to five assistant managers and then twenty to thirty sales associates in location.

SPEAKER_03 22:07

That's a hefty staff.

SPEAKER_01 22:09

Yeah, and then ranges. So we're not going to hire a staff until we have possession and it's ready to go. So but we're we're essentially building 1,600 stores at once, if you really think about it.

SPEAKER_03 22:20

So the average of the store sizes go from the smallest square foot to what's the largest?

SPEAKER_01 22:28

So well, there's a the build to is what I'll talk about. So the smallest we really want to do is let's call it 5,000 square feet. That's small for us. With Ricky's, it used to be way smaller, but for what we do now and the experience that we create, 5,000 is small. Typically, we're gonna build a store to roughly 10,000 square feet, but we'll take a store that's 50,000 square feet. We'll take a Toys R Us, we just won't use the space. We'll we create a store within a store. And that's how we build it.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

So we don't care. We we take Kmart's, we take Sears, we take uh, you know, all these big box locations, but when a guest walks in the store, they they're no matter where they are in the country, they know they're walking into a spirit. We have what we call an ISD, an in-store experience where those big displays uh which we change every single year with different animatronics, so it's interactive, it's immersive. You know, people are coming. We uh we have a fan club. If you go to social media and look for spirit, there's a spirit fan club that we have nothing to do with, with thousands and thousands of people.

SPEAKER_03 23:34

That's insane.

SPEAKER_01 23:35

And yeah, we do a grand opening store, the one that's closest to our home office. Last grand opening, there was over three thousand people that showed up from all across the country. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:49

That's mind-blowing. I mean, that's a lot of that's a lot of uh loyal customers and fans.

SPEAKER_01 23:58

Absolutely incredible. And listen, we have an amazing team. Yeah, you're talking to me, but I'm one piece of it. You know, there is our CEO is incredible, he is just passionate and brilliant. You know, our buying department's amazing. We have an incredible real estate team, you know, our logistics teams is off the chart. Like there are so many moving parts that make us what we are.

SPEAKER_03 24:23

So being in the position that you are and knowing how this uh industry is of you're so I don't want to say isolated, but it's so specific that you have, like you said, that short window. What is the most stressful part of your job putting this together? You're overseeing it all now. I mean, at one point you were just doing a section of it. So you had that section to deal with and to your upper leadership and management to answer to. Now being the boss in this sector, how does that affect you? Let's pull back the curtains, let's put it that way. And give us what is the most challenging part of your day.

SPEAKER_01 25:09

Well, it's it's crazy because I am so busy right now planning for this season. Right. So it's it's all about strategy. And and I was saying, I'm like, execution will eat strategy for lunch. We can have all the plans in the world, but if we don't execute, it means nothing. And because our our business is we don't have the luxury of time, right? Monica, when you went to buy your costume for the last Halloween, when did you buy it?

SPEAKER_03 25:47

I don't know, I usually call you and tell you put it aside and I'll pick it up.

SPEAKER_01 25:50

Yeah, and it's usually October 30th.

SPEAKER_03 25:52

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 25:53

Right? Yeah. So what's incredible about our our business, and for the for the life of me, I can't figure out the why. We start opening our stores the first week of August. We do 60% of our business the last two weeks.

SPEAKER_03 26:10

Crazy.

SPEAKER_01 26:11

New York City does like 70% of their business or 80% of their business the last two weeks. It's like because there's different curves. Cities, colleges, they have a different curve. So what I would say now is my stress is making sure that everything is ticked and tied. We have a strategy, a bulletproof strategy in terms of people, in terms of processes, to ensure that the stores are built, set up, executed to maximize the most what we call operating days, right? Because every single day that we're open has value. The earlier is less value, and the later into the season, more value. But every single day has value for a variety of reasons, not just in sales, but with people. The longer the stores are open, the longer people are hired, the better our retention is, the more that they're invested, the better they're gonna do. And so doing that is very important.

SPEAKER_03 27:11

So do you have to travel and visit the locations? Do you go to all of them or do you have a a team within your division that goes to stores and reports to you on what's going on? Because I can't see you having to travel. I know you travel a lot, but I can't see you traveling to every single location.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

I'm lucky if I can get to hundreds stores in a season. Yeah, so we have so we have what we call zone managers, right? They're regional zone managers, and they they run any, you know, roughly 25 stores. And then they report to directors, so and the directors will have anywhere between four and seven zones. And then they report to the divisional vice presidents, and and then the DVPs report to me. So there's always boots on the ground, there's eyes, and that's why we can get a lot more touches. So every store gets visited by by people that are established and been doing this for a very long time. But I can't get to, it's impossible to get to.

SPEAKER_03 28:15

Well, I didn't think so, but it's like come come Halloween time, or just like you said, June to mid-November. Like I never get to see you.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

I know. It's it's become this, it's become this beast, which is great. It's a good problem to have, and it's funny. You know, listen, I have I just mentioned I had that that whole org chart, and I said zone. I have six, we just hired seven new zone managers. We have up to 66 zone managers and 13 regional directors. It's incredible. And we are just and what's also pretty incredible is most of those people started off as seasonal employees. Well, right, and it's created these opportunities to to kind of grow as we have as well.

SPEAKER_03 29:02

Well, there you go. I mean, someone has an opportunity to shine and grow and go from seasonal job to a full-time job. And that's fantastic. I want to talk a little bit about I want to talk a little bit about Spencer's because Spencer's and Spirit are under the same roof, so to speak. But yet they but but yet they feel very different and in their personalities. I mean, the two brands vibe really well together. I remember go being young and going into malls and staying at Spencer's store, and it had all the little toys and bracelets and everything you can think of, every kind of tchotki you can think of. Tell tell us a little bit about like that crossover and how how did they, because they started the Halloween sector, how did Spencer's being the store that they are, which you could tell a little bit about that, segue into wanting to do Halloween? What's their version?

SPEAKER_01 29:56

Well, this was way before me. So I know I'll tell you my what I know. Listen, Spencer's is an incredible, iconic brand. And you said it when we were younger, they'd be in the malls and we'd go and they have a lot of just like cool t-shirts and lava lamps, and and now they're you know huge into the body jewelry and and and they be have become a destination. Now malls have kind of gone in the wrong direction in many areas. Some people just don't go to malls the way they used to. Some are great malls. There's you know, there's malls within the tri-state area that are Garn State Plaza, for example. You know, great malls. But generally speaking, not there. But our our stores, Spencer's, has continued to do very, very well. And I think it's a testament to our people also. We continue to evolve with our buys. But with with Halloween, it was the same kind of thing. We we had those those back areas of stores, we were doing lingerie and things like that, similar to Ricky's, and then they would segue into into Halloween more costumes. But the difference with Spencer's is there's there's footprints small. So they're typically 1,500 square feet, maybe 2,000 square feet. So you can only fit so much into the stores. So it wasn't a sustainable model. And then so Spirit came along and and then we were able to kind of just take it over. And so Spencer's has a small little section, but it's not necessary for them anymore. Since we are under the same roof, one team, one goal, two different brands, but the same company.

SPEAKER_03 31:34

Can you say or share which of the two companies is the highest grossing?

SPEAKER_01 31:42

Spirit is. Thank you. I'm not gonna take credit for it.

SPEAKER_03 31:55

I again You have a team, it's it's it's a collaborative effort. I 100% agree with you.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

100%.

SPEAKER_03 32:02

But knowing you, you've always been extremely passionate about what you do and anything that you do. I like you, like you said, you are you you love a good challenge and love it. You do, for sure. So tell us about how you guys manage, because like all stores, you know, there's always profit, there's loss. And you know, you get a lot of people that come in and it's so chaotic and so busy. And as many salespeople you have on the floor, things disappear. Things walk out the door, as we all say. There's what we used to call back in the day the five-finger discount.

SPEAKER_01 32:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:40

How do you value this? What what's what's what do you guys do with that? I mean, because truthfully, I mean the costumes, what what's the price average of the costumes?

SPEAKER_01 32:51

$40, $50.

SPEAKER_03 32:52

So what do you do when somebody comes in, grabs a costume or two, and walks out?

SPEAKER_01 32:56

I know you guys have security, but how do you guys have very, very different than when I started in retail where we used to take them into the basement, but but uh it's you see social media, it's a scary world out there. And there comes a point where it's not worth it, right? We have a lot of people that work for us that are very invested and they protect our stores and they treat it like they own it. We love that. But we don't want anybody getting hurt, it's not worth it. So what do we do? We try to give an amazing guest service. Really amazing guest service to let that person who might be thinking of stealing. I know we I know you're here. We have cameras, Ethan said we have guards in some instances we have off-duty police officers, we we develop relationships within the the townships with the police force, so hopefully they can get to us quickly if something arises. But we're it's going to happen. And it's part of doing business, and that's one of the toughest parts about doing retail, is that you know, but we try to create an environment where at least our our staff and our guests feel safe, and you're just gonna have assholes that think that they're entitled to our product, and they're gonna do it, and but you know what? There's a lot of stupid assholes too out there who then start trying to sell their stuff at flea markets or on Facebook Marketplace, and we have an amazing LP department as well, and if we find them, they're getting prosecuted.

SPEAKER_02 34:33

That's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

So we've gonna we've done it and we would continue to do it, and I love getting pictures of people in handcuffs. It's one of my favorite things.

SPEAKER_03 34:44

So essentially, whatever they steal, because it happens, like we said, they are selling it online or selling it at a flea market. And and I mean, I I could see finding things online if you search and you find like, but how do you find someone in a flea market or in like just you know what?

SPEAKER_01 35:04

There's a lot of amazing, there's there's more good people out there than bad people, Monica. And and so somebody will just say, you know what, I see somebody selling a ton of spirit stuff, and they will call our c our office and say, Hey, I saw this.

SPEAKER_00 35:17

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 35:18

Yeah, because if you what's different with us than anybody else is everything that we sell is spirit branded product. So if you see it on Amazon and it says spirit, it's us, we're selling it. But if you go out and you're going to a local parent place and you're seeing somebody that's selling a volume, then it's highly unlikely that it was not stolen. Let's just put it that way. And so and we have a lot of great employees that you know, 'cause we have internal people that steal too, let's be honest. Retail sucks when it comes to that. A large percentage of of what we call shrink loss is internal. And so we've we've evolved with our POS, our computers, we have great analytics, we've learned what to look for when people are trying to get a little shady. It's way harder to steal money now than it is product. Now we have cameras at every door and we have alarms and we have all these things that you know you're gonna get caught and then you're gonna get prosecuted. And so it's it but it does happen. I'm not gonna minimize it, but it's it's part of retail. It's different than you know, I'm sure there's i issues in your business that you know wish didn't exist. So you, you know, it's part of doing businesses, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_03 36:35

There's always issues in every business. I mean, but it's it really is mind-blowing when you look at a lot of brick and mortar stores. Like you said on social media, there are people crashing in, breaking in. I mean, from Chanel, like the Chanel stores, the Louis Vuitton stores, they just bum rush in, grab rip bags off that are there. There are alarm cables on them and they're ripping them out. And the thing is, it's like the salespeople, they're like, what do we do? We're not gonna jeopardize our lives to do something and try to stop something. They let people run out.

SPEAKER_01 37:04

Sometimes you have a guard chasing them and you're but you don't, it's not worth it because you don't know if that person's carrying a gun. Correct. You don't know if they have a knife, you don't know what this person's capable of. Listen, we're not selling Louis Vuitton priced items, but even if we were, it's it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_03 37:20

But it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter whether it's $50 costume or $5,000 bag.

SPEAKER_01 37:27

I mean 100%.

SPEAKER_03 37:28

Just recently I saw in London at a Rolex store these guys rolled up on uh on scooters, smashed the windows, went in, grabbed, I don't even know how much in Rolex is, and people are just looking. Like there's not much you really can do. I mean, it's all covered under insurance. I mean, that luxury brand stuff is definitely always covered under insurance. But it's mind-blowing to think that people could truly just come in. I think a lot of this stemmed during COVID. During COVID was where everybody was. Yeah. I mean, you didn't hear it much before that, or it wasn't newsworthy as much before COVID. After COVID and during, it really became where all like I remember in down in Soho, all the stores were boarded up because I remember the store on the corner, literally the entire window was smashed, and they started doing whatever they can to protect. So I it's it's a challenging thing for any retail business. I look at the restaurants, you know, Stacey has to worry about like people dining and dashing. It's a little harder nowadays, but they still do it. But I mean, I give you a lot of credit. I it's Spencer, Spirit, great company. I'm really, really impressed by how they have evolved. And I know that you and your team, and like they say, it takes a village to really make it become what it is today. And I'm sure that by the next, I don't know, I think what your projections of hitting 2,000 stores are by when? Because I know you guys are trying to hit to 2,000 stores.

SPEAKER_01 39:00

Within the next five years. You know, we're a crawl walk-run company. We we've been very fortunate with our sales and everything's been very good. But we've also been investing a lot back into the company. And and we want to make sure when we do stores and we and we continue to build on our store count that we are creating the the right experience and we have the right people in place, and so we're very methodical in how we do it. And so we'll probably get there within the next, I would say, five years to 2000. And we're also we just also start piloting a Christ Christmas concept.

SPEAKER_03 39:34

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 39:35

Yeah. So we did two years ago we did eight stores, and it took off like a rocket ship, and I think that's a testament to our brand. Last year we did 30 stores, and this year we're gonna do 44 stores.

SPEAKER_03 39:46

That's amazing. And they are you doing any in the city?

SPEAKER_01 39:49

We haven't selected all the stores yet. So possibly we'll we we shall see.

SPEAKER_03 39:55

Okay. So, you know, in in kind of wrapping up, what advice do you have for a young entrepreneur who's looking to start a business and is looking to do something in retail? Mostly everything is e-commerce, everything's, you know, I'm buying on Shopify, I'm, you know, all eBay, all of that. But if somebody really wants to try to do something, what's your advice to, like I said, to a young entrepreneur that wants to do a small store and eventually expand it to other locations? Like what what's the what's the best advice you can give?

SPEAKER_01 40:31

Well, number one, the first, the most important decision somebody can make is are the people that they choose to bring on board. Okay. It's highly unlikely if they're doing a retail store, they're doing it by themselves. They need they need support. They're number one, if they're gonna have a manager, it has to be the right person. Understand how to interview, look for, you know, what are the skill sets that you're looking for. It depends on the concept and create an experience because people quickly just go online, click a button, and it's very easy to get whatever you want. Sometimes that same day, if not the next day. So you need to create an experience that's gonna get people into the door and want to stay there and separate you from the rest of the people. And and so doing those two things is important. And don't get too aggressive. Take your time. You know, be very smart how you spend your money. It's people sometimes get over their skis and they're not really thinking about what it takes to get to that next level. And you can't think micro, you have to think macro if you're looking to scale. If you're looking to do one store or two stores, okay, but you still have to be fiscally responsible. You know, I think you know, you see all these companies that close, then their number one reason why they're closing is they don't know how to manage their payroll. They don't know how to manage their expenses.

SPEAKER_03 41:54

Well, it's interesting. You used an expression, the way Spirit and Spencer operate is a crawl walk, which is amazing because a lot of people just like to hit the ground running. And that's not necessarily the most optimal way to do when you are starting a business in any business.

SPEAKER_01 42:11

Yeah. Yeah, well, I think because if you think about a lot of businesses over the last number of years, it's it's online. It's it's these things where they're they're getting all these ventures and they're looking to really pop. And so they're throwing money, they know that they're gonna lose money and to to do whatever, right? Because it's about it's getting to that IPO, again, that stock. In retail, it's a little bit different. We're not a we're a private company, we're we're not a publicly traded company, right? So you have to be every dollar counts and you have to be really smart about how you spend it. You need to treat your people well, but it's it's more about what you pay than it is how you treat them. And making sure, like I'm a big believer in what's called the inverted pyramid. And what that means is no matter if you're the top, like your title's the top, take that pyramid and flip it upside down. And essentially the people that work for me are my boss. Right? And I have to you when you have that kind of mindset and you're thinking about what it is that we need to do responsibly for our team, things typically fall into place.

SPEAKER_03 43:17

That's that's great advice. It really is. So, where are you now? Because I know you're traveling.

SPEAKER_01 43:23

I am it's personal. I'm not traveling for work. My son goes to Ohio State, and so I am in a hotel in Columbus, Ohio. And after this, I'm gonna go meet up with Ethan. And I don't know what we're gonna do. I'm just here today. Tomorrow I leave Sunday morning. It's a Friday, by the way, for Lizard.

SPEAKER_03 43:41

Go go buckeyes.

SPEAKER_01 43:43

Yeah, baby.

SPEAKER_03 43:44

There you go. That's fantastic. Well, Jason, thank you so much for joining us. I really love catching up with you and getting a little bit more insight of how things evolved from Ricky's to spirit to you in general and what. You do and how you do it. You know how I feel about you, and it's admirable. Thank you very much. I love you too. And everyone, thank you very much for joining us and listening in. We look forward to you joining us next week on our next episode of Canvas. Thank you all and have a great day.

SPEAKER_00 44:19

Thanks for spending time with us on Canvas. Don't forget to subscribe, download, and follow the podcast on all platforms so you don't miss what's coming up next. We'll be back with a new conversation and a fresh perspective.