Reading The Multiverse: A Marvel Comics Journey

S1E3: Fantastic Four #9-12 - Dr Doom Returns, Namor Schemes, and The Incredible Hulk

• Earth's Mightiest Nerds • Season 1 • Episode 3

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In this episode, I dive into Fantastic Four #9–12, where Reed Richards loses the team’s fortune, Doctor Doom returns for a mind-swapping revenge story, the Impossible Man makes his chaotic debut, and the Fantastic Four face the Incredible Hulk in their first major crossover.

Stories Covered In This Episode

"The End of the Fantastic Four" - Fantastic Four #9, written by Stan Lee, Penciled by Jack Kirby, Inked by Dick Ayers, Color by Stan Goldberg, Lettered by Artie Simek

"The Return of Doctor Doom" - Fantastic Four #10, written by Stan Lee, Penciled by Jack Kirby, Inked by Dick Ayers, Color by Stan Goldberg, Lettered by Artie Simek

"A Visit With The Fantastic Four / The Impossible Man" - Fantastic Four #11, written by Stan Lee, Penciled by Jack Kirby, Inked by Dick Ayers, Color by Stan Goldberg, Lettered by Artie Simek

"The Incredible Hulk" - Fantastic Four #12, written by Stan Lee, Penciled by Jack Kirby, Inked by Dick Ayers, Color by Stan Goldberg, Lettered by Artie Simek

Resources & Links Mentioned In This Episode:

Joe: What's going on Marvelites? Welcome to Reading the Multiverse, a Marvel Comics journey presented by Earth's mightiest Nerds. I am your host, Joe, and welcome to the podcast. If this is your first time being here, we are connecting the MCU to the comics that built it, and we are doing that one issue at a time.

Well, technically four at a time in each episode. With that being said, if you are coming from the MCU and you wanna learn more from the stories that built the MCU, this is the perfect place for you. If you have read these comics and maybe you just want a nostalgic reread, this is also a great place and or maybe you just don't have the time or resources to read these things and you're just looking for something to listen to, welcome, welcome to Be here.

We are currently reading through Stan Lee and Jack Kirby's Fantastic Four run, and we have four issues on the docket today. There is not much that we need to know from the previous two episodes. There is one thing and I'll talk about that when we get there. With that being said though, let's get into our first issue today from September of 1962, the Fantastic Four issue number nine, the end of the Fantastic Four, written by Stan Lee.

Penciled by Jack Kirby, inked by Dick Ayers, color by Stan Goldberg and lettered by Artie Simek. In the first episode that I did, I talked about how does the Fantastic Four have so much money because they talked about having so many different Hideouts and they even had a private jet. They have all these things, but it's never actually talked about as to how they're able to afford it.

And we finally learned in this issue that Reed has basically been inventing things and selling off the patents to companies for said inventions. And that is how they make all of their money. Now, unfortunately Reed blew it all in the stock market. And honestly, I love this for Reed, if you are just kind of coming into this world, uh, of mine, I am not the biggest fan of Reed.

And honestly, you'll learn over time that Reed is not the best human being. So again, I love this for Reed. So the FF is having to sell off all of their equipment to pay off their debts, and they're actually thinking about disbanding because they don't know what they're going to do. I mean, y'all are are pretty smart.

Why don't you just figure out a way to make some money or re can just keep inventing things to make more money. But. Anyway, lucky for them, they get a mysterious letter offering them $1 million if they head out to Hollywood to make a movie. And little do they know that Namor has caught wind of their dire situation and is the one who sent them that letter.

Now, when they get out to Hollywood, there is one thing that's pretty cool in this issue is that there are a ton of celebrity cameos. Including Alfred Hitchcock, Bob Hope, Dean Martin, Bing Crosby, Jack Benny, Jack Benny, and many others. Once the team finds out its Namor who sent them the letter, they kind of question if they're being set up, but he gives each of them a down payment for the roles and given their situation, they decide that they can't kind of pass it up, so they go along with it.

Now, one thing is that they decided that they would use all the money that they make to pay off their debts and once. They get their money. Johnny is the first one who spends no time buying something that he doesn't need. He goes and buys a brand new sports car, and I'm surprised no one smacked him across the head and was like, what are you doing?

We need this money anyway. Namor takes each of our heroes to their own location to film their part of the movie. He first takes Reed all the way to the Mediterranean, to a deserted island where Reed thinks he's going to face a mechanical cyclops. And before we get any further, I gotta say. How petty is it of Namor to make them pretty much hitchhike all the way from New York City to Hollywood to then only take them back east to the Mediterranean anyway.

Uh, basically Reed ends up fighting a real giant cyclops on this island, and Namor, of course, left Reed to face the giant alone. Namor then takes Johnny to Africa, where he leaves him with a tribe of Africans, which, uh, given the time, there are definitely some unsavory takes regarding. Uh, the African tribe and kind of just how they're depicted, but, uh, the reason why Namor left Johnny with his tribe is because they are immune to fire.

We then have Namor versus the thing on the beach back in California, and we get a good little fight between the two of them. And the thing eventually figures out that Namor gets weaker over time when he stays away from the water, which this is very reminiscent of the battle we saw between Namor and Shuri in Wakanda forever.

Namor lucks out though because as he's about to get clobbered by the thing, the thing gets hit with a bolt of lightning, which actually turns him back into a human, allowing namor to defeat the thing. Namor then finally meets up with Sue and reveals his whole plan. The attire time was to show that he could defeat the Fantastic four.

He then asked her to be his bride again. Sue is appalled at this and Namor essentially loses it and doesn't let Sue escape. He even like posts up against the door where he's like kind of floating and he's in this like awkward position. I will post that panel. Into the earth's mightiest nerd discord, which is completely free to join by the way.

So if you're listening to this, uh, via audio, wherever you're listening to podcasts, that link will be in the show notes. And if you're watching on YouTube, that link will also be in the description or yeah, the link will be in the description because I definitely think it's worth, worth looking at. Um, anyway, that is when Reed, Ben and Johnny show up and start to fight Namor, but once again, Sue steps in to defend him, which is very confusing because she was just appalled with him.

And just in general, Sue is very confused about her feelings, uh, that we've learned in the first, uh, two episodes. And with any kind of issues involving Namor. Anyway, she says that they held up their end of the bargain and Namor does agree, and he says that the movie will get made, which apparently was a huge hit because that gave the Fantastic four a bunch of money and allows them to continue being the Fantastic four.

Anyway, this is easily one of my most favorite issues of the Fantastic four that I've ever read, just given how crazy it is. In fact, it's probably honestly one of my most favorite comic issues I've ever read. Like all time for just like how wild and strange it is. The fact that like, Naor gets wind of this.

Reed lost all of their money. Naor gets wind of this, and he's like, oh, you know what? I'm gonna lure them to make a movie. He, of course, lies all this stuff, right? It's just, it's really good. I, I, I hope that you enjoyed it as much as I did, but given that the Fantastic four would not have been in that situation, if it wasn't for Reed gambling all their money away.

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Let's get into the next issue. From October of 1962, the Fantastic four issue 10. The return of Dr. Doom, written by Stan Lee, penciled by Jack Kirby, inked by Dick Ayers, color by Stan Goldberg, and lettered by Artie Simek. Uh, in episode two we go over in issue six where doom ended up and basically he was caught on a meteor and just traveling further and further into space, which was the last that we saw of him.

So we are obviously going to get the return of him in this issue. So the thing is at Alicia's apartment and. Shoots the Fantastica flare to get them there, and it wasn't for anything serious, but to show off. Alicia's very lifelike statues of the Fantastic Fours enemies that we've seen thus far. That's when things get a little awkward between Sue and Reed because Sue once again defends Namor saying he isn't bad like the rest of the villains they face.

And now Reed finally confronts her about her feelings, and in episode one, in issue one, we learn that Reed and Sue are engaged to be married. And that's kind of like where it's been and it's just been kind of awkward that she has these feelings for Namor. But Reed doesn't really do or say much about it.

Anyway, that's when our issue takes a sharp right turn to the Marvel offices where we see Stan Lee and Jack Kirby trying to figure out who the next fantastic four villain is going to be. Now, we never actually get to see Stan and Jack's faces, but we do know it's them based on what they're talking about.

But that's when Dr. Doom shows up, he tells them to call up Reed so that he can kidnap him. Reed of course, shows up and doom gases him taking Reed hostage and returns to his lab. Now, this is where we learn how Doom returned to Earth and kind of got off of that Meteor Doom while in space. Met a alien race called the Ovoids, and he learned that they have great mental powers, including the ability to transfer minds into another body.

And he basically then had them return him to Earth. So with his newly found power of switching minds. Doom does exactly that with Reed, the rest of the Fantastic Four arrive, and of course Reed is now inside Doom's body attempts to convince the team that doom has swapped minds, which of course they don't believe.

So doom inside of Reed's body convinces the team that the only way to stop doom forever is to trap him. So. Uh, doom in Reed's body takes them to the basement of his lab and shows them a container of unbreakable glass where they put doom, AKA reed in which then doom tells Reed that the oxygen in the container will run out in an hour.

So back at the Baxter building, we learned that doom has been constructing this shrinking ray and testing it on zoo animals and convinces ban Johnny and Sue that if he shrinks them and then returns them back to regular size. Their powers will be even greater than they are now. Which honestly, as there's a lot of mental gymnastics going on in this explanation, uh, because Doom kind of talks about like the dinosaurs and the reason they became extinct is because they got too big for their brains or something along those lines.

I'm just like, you guys are smart. Like none of this actually really makes sense, so I don't understand why, why you got persuaded so easily. Anyway, meanwhile, Reed stuck in doom's body. Is able to escape his unbreakable glass container by hitting two of the oxygen containers together, causing an explosion, which again, how he survived that explosion.

I don't know Either way, Reed then heads to Alicia's apartment to convince her that he's stuck in doom's body, but unbeknownst to us and Reed Sue was there and is invisible and gives him a good whack and knocks him out. They all end up back at the Baxter building and Doom is in doom in Reed's. Body decides that he needs to act quickly with his reducing ray, but Johnny feels like something is off and creates this mirage of a stick of dynamite going off, and Reed and Doom's body goes to jump on it to save everyone while doom.

Ian Reed's body tries to get away. That's when everyone realizes that they've actually switched minds, so they return to their original bodies and during a scuffle, Reed falls into the reducing ray, which actually hits doom and shrinks him down to nothingness, and that is where we end that issue. I really enjoyed this particular issue.

I love the, just the creativity of how Doom got back and using this new power of being able to switch minds, which again is something that we see him do in. Later issues of his abilities and powers that he has. But I think one of the best parts about this issue too, is we get some really great faces drawn by Jack Kirby.

Uh, some like really sinister faces, which again, I'll post in the Earth's minus nerds. Discord, totally free to join. I highly recommend you check these panels out. If you're watching on YouTube, you're probably seeing them, but if you're not, it would be great for you to see them. Um, I also love some of these inventions as particularly the names.

It honestly just feels like a kid is making them up. But at one point, doom reveals that he has a weapon in his finger and it, and it's called, I quote, the sub miniature transistor powered atomic blast gun. It's just so funny to read that it's just like, uh, two mouthfuls of, of a name that I don't know if we need that much.

Anyway, I think the real question at the end of that issue is when are we going to see doom again and how is he going to get out of being shrunken down to nothingness? That leads us into our next issue from November of 1962, the Fantastic Four, issue number 11, and we have a part A and part B to this story.

The title for A is A Visit with the Fantastic Four, and the B title is the Impossible Man. All written by Stan Lee, penciled by Jack Kirby Inked by Dick Ayers, colored by Stan Goldberg and lettered by Artie Sinek. In the Part A of this issue, the Fantastic Four get fan mail and we see them go through it.

We also see that Reed has made another serum for Ben to try to return to human form, which he does, and that allows them to go down memory lane of how Reed and Ben met in college and fought in World War ii. However, this brings up some hard feelings for Sue because she still isn't sure how she feels about Namor, and also according to the fan mail.

Sue doesn't do anything to help out the team, which then Reed and Ban remind everyone of how she has actually helped out. And there is actually a little editorial note at the end of this part A of the story showing us that these were basically them answering questions that they have gotten in real life from fans.

And it's no surprise that they probably got letters about Sue not doing much and kind of complaining about her. Um, we know now that Sue is easily the strongest member. Of the Fantastic Four. Um, I do think that part of the reasoning behind them not necessarily writing to her, uh, advantages just yet is because it was just kind of like one, they were figuring out what the team dynamic was going to be like, but also just the era of just misogyny unfortunately.

Um, so onto part B of the story titled, the Impossible Man, an Alien from the Planet Popup arrived on Earth and we learned that he can basically change into anything he wants. A steal sheet, a rocket, a bomb, literally anything. Well, as he's going around on Earth, he just seems very interested in earth and humans, but doesn't understand all of our words or customs.

He ultimately learns that he needs money for something and was told that he needs to get money from a bank, so he just shows up at a bank and takes money. AKA, he pulls off the easiest robbery of all time, and since no one can catch him, the Fantastic four are called in to help. So our team tries and tries and tries and they are just unable to stop him.

And that's when Reed decides that everyone just needs to ignore him. And it was honestly amazing because Reed tells not only the Fantastic Four, but everyone in like New York City to ignore the impossible man. And I haven't seen everyone collectively together for an entire effort, uh, since the fantastic four first steps when everyone worked together across the entire earth to build like those teleportation things to get Galactus kind of gone.

Eventually Reed was correct in that the impossible man just wanted more and more attention, and when he wasn't getting what he wanted, he said Earth was boring and that he would never come back again. So honestly, this issue could be considered one of the most comic bookie issues in terms of just like craziness that happened.

Part A was a good kind of. Departure from our normal storytelling to answer some questions and to kind of get some more allure into the fantastic four. Uh, part B, the impossible man though. And as much as you know, as much as I love, like wild and strange stories. This one is not doing it for me. I just did not like this.

It's probably my least favorite fantastic four issue. We've read this up to this point so far, and it's just, I don't know. It's just something about the impossible man. He's like an irresponsible child, which is what Sue calls him in the issue, and it's exactly that. He's an irresponsible child. He just wants attention and is literally the same thing over and over and over again like.

I get it. He doesn't understand the customs. He's just like a bratty little kid, and it just kept going over and over again. Uh, so with that being said, we get into a better issue from December of 1962, the Fantastic Four issue number 12, the Incredible Hulk, written by Stan Lee, pencil by Jack Kirby, inked by Dick Ayers, colored by Stan Goldberg and lettered by Artie Simek.

This issue is arguably one of the first crossovers between major titles, which is pretty cool given the fact that we see that happen all the time now. But given the fact that they just pretty much kept the Fantastic Four in their own comic, they've kept the incredible Hulk in his whole comic, the Avengers and theirs.

And now we are finally getting crossovers between major characters. So in this issue at the beginning, the Army is patrolling the streets of New York City and mistakenly thinks Ben is the Hulk and attacks him. They finally realize it's not the Hulk and apologize, but it's not long after he returns to the Baxter building that the Fantastic Four is joined by General Thunderbolt Ross who asked for their help in finding and destroying the Hulk.

And before we get to the next part of the story, I have to point out how Ben actually got up to their headquarters because he dropped his like little electronic ray thing that opens up the elevator. So he destroys the elevator door and then decides to climb up the elevator cable, like 35 floors or something like that.

And it's just a, a really funny drawing to see this like little, little thing climbing up the elevator, but also just totally ridiculous. So Ross believes that the Hulk is the one who has been destroying some of Dr. Bruce banner's recently designed military weapons. So they all head out to a military base in New Mexico where Reed and Banner meet, and we also get introduced to Rick Jones and Karl Kort, who are associates of Bruce Banner.

Now Banner lets Reed know that he doesn't believe the Hulk is causing this destruction, obviously. Uh, knowing what we know that obviously Bruce Banner is the Hulk, but he believes someone or something they've deemed the wrecker is causing the damage. So the thing and Johnny are waiting outside of this meeting while they're talking, and Karl Kort leaves and gets scared by the thing and drops his wallet, which they give to Rick Jones afterwards.

And after that, basically the thing has his typical toddler tantrum and, uh, breaks down the door and just says like, why are, you know, why am I not in this meeting? All this other stuff. Again, if you've been listening from the first two episodes so far, you know that I'm not the biggest fan of the thing right now, just given how angry and how toddler like he is, it just is.

So, so annoying, honestly. But Bruce and Rick Jones head back to their secret cave hideout, and Rick goes to find Karl to give him his wallet back, and that's when we see this paper sticking out of it, revealing that Karl Kort is a member of a subversive communist organization, which means he's a red. But then court takes Rick Jones hostage and given the actual timeframe of when this is written, this is obviously a big deal given like the Cold War and whatnot, but the way you read it now and like it's like he's a red and it's just like all in big letters.

Uh, it's just funny to read now, but again, makes more sense given the era and the time when this was actually written to be a big deal. Bruce finds a, a note from the wrecker stating that if he doesn't get the fantastic four off base, that he will never see Rick Jones again. Obviously letting us know that the wrecker is Karl Kort.. So Bruce turns into the Hulk to get rid of the Fantastic Four to save Rick Jones. And we have some really good action and good fights between the Hulk and the Fantastic Four, most notably the thing. But as the fighting continues, the Hulk is hit with some sort of ray from underground. It's never actually said how that happens is just like does.

Anyway, the thing and, and also I gotta say the Hulk just like disappears. Who knows, he's just gone. Uh, but the thing then digs into the ground to find the source of this ray. And it's a big robot, AKA, the wrecker being run again by Karl Kort, and it doesn't take long for court to get tripped up by Sue and eventually captured.

The Hulk escapes and turns back into Bruce, who is able to get back to the group to thank them for their service. And that's pretty much where that issue ends. The thing, this was a good issue, obviously, uh, the first major crossover between characters. So with that being said, there, definitely trying to feel a lot of stuff out.

I felt like there was a lot of things happening and a lot of introductions in this. In this issue. Um, so a lot of stuff, but obviously we needed to get that, especially if you weren't reading, say, the Incredible Hulk, you needed to know more about like Bruce Banner and his associates, which I'm assuming has been alluded to in those issues.

I have no idea 'cause I haven't read those issues. Um, but with that being said, it's interesting to see how they've kind of changed how the Hulk kind of functions. Um, 'cause the Hulk kind of won. Maintain his intellect while he was fighting against the Fantastic four. Whereas in knowing what I know, he's usually kind of dumbed down a little bit and doesn't necessarily maintain his intellect.

Also, after Bruce Banner is transforming from the Hulk, he kind of takes a while to like. Regain his composure and you know, be a person again. Whereas he's like, pretty much immediately okay and is able to go talk to the Fantastic four and thank them for what they've done. So like it, it's interesting how that's kind of changed over time.

I do think, again, this was a, a good issue. Overall some really good issues. I do know that going into the next episode of this podcast, we are going to be seeing some more new villains for the Fantastic Four, including the Red Ghost, and I'm pretty sure we get the return of Dr. Dooms. So make sure you follow along wherever you're listening to this on, uh, podcast, hit that follow button on Apple.

If you're on Spotify, hit that follow button or subscribe, whatever it is. If you are watching on YouTube, make sure you hit that like button and subscribe as well. Uh, if you are watching on YouTube, leave a comment. If you have the time and you're watching, or sorry, listening on Apple or Spotify or wherever, uh, hit that rating.

Give the show a rating, maybe write a review if you have the time, I would love that. That would be awesome. Um, but yeah, until the next episode. Excelsior

still don't understand how the Fantastic Four made a bunch of money from that movie. Like literally, there was no script. Namor brought Reed and Johnny to remote locations and then left them with the camera crew. So there was technically no one recording them. I don't even think the recording crew was there when he fought Ben.

And again, there's no script. So there's like literally no storylines, just these three people fighting, fighting monsters, tribes. And then the thing who is paying for this movie? Who is paying a bunch of money? So I, I, how, how do they make all this money? I don't get it.

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