Back to Business with Sarah Annas featuring Mike Lindell

In this episode of Back to Business, we sit down with Mike Lindell, Founder and CEO of MyPillow, to explore what it truly takes to build a nationally recognized consumer brand from the ground up.

Mike shares how he transformed a simple product idea into a household name, breaking down the key moments that drove real traction and long-term growth. He offers an inside look at how brand identity, customer connection, and clear messaging play a critical role in standing out in a competitive market, along with the strategies that helped scale distribution and drive consistent sales.

He also dives into the realities of expanding a product line while protecting the strength of a core brand, and the discipline required to grow without losing focus. From early breakthrough moments to long-term positioning, this conversation highlights what actually moves a brand from idea to recognition.

Listeners will gain insight into building a memorable brand, understanding what drives consumer behavior, and making strategic decisions that support sustainable growth. This candid conversation is packed with practical lessons on scaling a business, strengthening brand identity, and creating lasting customer connection.

👉 Don’t miss this episode on brand building, scaling a consumer business, and turning a simple idea into a household name.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:10

Hello, and welcome back to the Back to Business Podcast. Today I'm super excited. I am joined by Mike Lindell, uh founder and CEO of MyPillow. If you've ever turned on Fox News, you will recognize this voice very soon and uh the face as well. Mike, thank you so much for being here today. How are we doing?

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Real good. Thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_01 0:33

Awesome. Awesome. And where where are you today? Where are you located?

SPEAKER_00 0:37

I'm actually in Texas today. I'm gonna be heading to CPAC.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Oh, nice. All right. And what are what are your plans there for the day?

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Well, they're they're endorsing me for governor of the state of Minnesota. So pretty exciting.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

Congratulations. That's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

And then I have then I have my Lindell TV. We have a booth there. And uh so we'll be I'll be there all three days, four days, whatever.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

So okay. All right, wonderful. That's super exciting. I'm sure uh there's a lot that goes in behind the scenes to to that and running and and putting yourself out there even more than you already do. So yeah, yeah, and in Minnesota, that's wonderful. Great. I'm sure they'll be happy to have you. So today I just wanna I want to start by going back to the beginning. I want to learn a little bit about Mike, uh, where you started, a little bit about your background, and what led you to ultimately start My Pillow, which has become such an iconic brand.

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Well, you know, as uh as my story goes, I was uh I had to kind of two parallel tracks going. I was a very functioning addict for decades. And then on this, but I was always an entrepreneur. Um on the uh so I have these two parallel tracks going on. But the entrepreneur thing, it goes back, I think the last job I ever had for anyone was uh back when I was um uh 16, I had uh worked at a grocery store and I also worked at a drive-in movie theater. A lot of people probably don't even know what that is anymore. And uh and then um and I started getting into different things. I'll give an example. My sister flooded uh a uh third-story apartment built or apartment um with uh with a waterbed, and I became a carpet cleaner. So it's uh there was here we got a problem. I went to clean our carpet, I go, hey, this would be a good business. And and I had lunch wagging business. I had I had started all different kinds of businesses and uh and usually made them, they were very successful, a lot of them, but then I would switch to something to maybe go up a level or do something different. And uh the pillow was I had a I had a bar, a bar for 13 years, uh bar restaurant, and probably not a good place for an attic, but uh um the I ended up happening to sell that bar in 2003. Um, it was uh devastating at the time. It was something that was beyond my control. And and then in 2004, I had this idea. I actually had the name for my pillow before I invented my pillow. Now the mise, there was no mice back then. I said, that sounds kind of cool. Where's my pillow? You know, and I and the uh but but I um it was a thing, a problem I had. I think most inventions or ideas come from problems. Um, if you have a personal problem, you go, wow, this could fix that problem, or this could solve this problem. Well, pillows were very much a problem um in in many different ways. Uh sleep is about keeping your neck straight. And I was always, I always have a problem that, you know, I'd use my arm, fold my pillow, and maybe um um flip it to the cool side. Um the uh wake up in the morning with maybe a sore neck or a dull headache. And so I had all these problems, and I had tried every pillow out there. Well, and then I reverse engineered what I would want to solve all these problems, and and um one of the things was I wanted a pillow, something you could adjust, because everybody's shoulders are different, and I wanted something you could adjust. That that premise right there was the hardest thing to get around. I tried, oh, I remember my one of my sons and I in the backyard, we tried all different kinds of foams and fabrics and stuff and stuff flying around the neighborhood trying to get, you know, getting these pieces or what would go inside this pillow. And and I think we tried over 90 some different kinds of foams back then. Um, over, you know, this was over months and months, weeks became months, and I was so particular. We finally got down to one that would work. And um, but then I didn't have a machine that made the pieces and the sizes that would that would be needed. So it was it was months more um before uh we came in. I tried, I tried wood chipper, I tried a you know, cutting them with different things, and it didn't work. And uh and I actually had to, from an old piece of farm equipment, I actually had to invent the thing that would eventually cut these into the right pieces so you could adjust it. Then I then I had it all ready to go with that part, but then uh I wanted even more back then you couldn't wash and dry my or you couldn't wash and dry pillows. I wanted them to be able to wash and dry them. I wanted them to last. Uh pillows typically people would have them for you know a year or so and they would collapse or whatever, you'd throw it in the closet and get new ones. And and so I was very particular of each thing, reversing each thing. So if you came up to my came up to me and said, I want a pillow that stays cool, here it is, I want a pill you can adjust, here it is, I want a pill that lasts, here it is, 10-year warranty. I want a pillow that you can wash and dry. Here it is. So I answered all these questions, but it took over a year to invent.

SPEAKER_01 5:56

Okay. Wow, you just you gave me so much good uh good background there. So it sounds like from a young age, you were very much a problem solver. You wanted to, if there was a problem, your sister would call you. Hey, Mike, can you fix this? And that led to, you know, what could we make a business out of with this? And you landed on pillows, which is amazing. Um, because everybody uses pillows at night. Um, you know, you got to lay your head somewhere, get some rest. And to solve all of those problems is awesome. Everybody sleeps different, everybody has different needs, but it sounds like you found that you kind of cornered that niche in the market.

SPEAKER_00 6:32

Yeah, and it was a and it was a it was a product that has a wide filter. And uh yeah, but you know, the the the thing is when when I invented my pillow, I just thought, wow, now I've got the perfect solution here. First people sleep. And then um, but uh I went down, I went to the, you know, where are you gonna sell it? So I went to um different stores and I walked in and I said, hey, my the first one was actually a bed bath beyond. I said, hey, where I said, how many you want? I have the best pill here ever. And uh I was so excited that the manager goes, um, you need to leave. You know, I didn't know anything about about um you know um retailing or selling the a product. Uh, you know, most of uh our you know, in the retail world we're in and the world we're in, I didn't know anything about the marketing part of it. And uh so they turned me down and then I was but I didn't give up. I kept trying to figure out different things. I kept knocking on box doors and and uh then finally said, Well, Mike, why don't you why don't you do a kiosk? Why don't you do a kiosk? And I said, How do you spell that? Um and um and I got dogs barking in the background. Kendra, could you please do something? I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

That's okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

Um the uh um the uh with those doggies. Um but yeah, we had this kiosk. I said, Well, I said, How do you spell it? I didn't know anything about a kiosk. And and it was in a mall, and and for me, it was really hard for me because back then I couldn't I couldn't talk to people. Remember, I had a parallel track of of addiction too. And so I didn't obviously I didn't want to be on drugs or anything with selling, but I was I I had a um, if you read my book, I had like a fear of of rejection. So I couldn't talk to people. Um, you don't get rejected if you don't talk. And they're right up there in my they're right up there in my face. And and I so I only went there one day, but I happened to um um sell a pillow to a guy that uh he says he said you have a business card. I said, Oh no, I'm all out. And remember, I was doing everything myself, even the uh signs and and designing stuff, and and um um I remember it was kind of hokey back then, but you know, family owned and operated, and and uh but that but I was only there of the 30 days or thir 45 days, I was only there that one day and when it and we'd only sold like 12 pillows, and so it was a big failure at the time. And um, but they but though it gets into January, and and uh um I was completely out of money. And they and that that guy that I'd been there that one day, he called me up. He said, Are you the guy that invented this pillow? He said it changed my life. He said, I run the Minneapolis Home and Garden show. Would you like to spot there? I said, sure. And then I went into this home and garden show and I put a table in front of me so that people couldn't kind of was kind of a shield from the people, right? And then I changed my signage and I got all um um you know guaranteed the most comfortable pillow you ever owned. And I changed kind of the marketing part of it. And and I sold 18 pillows that day. But the key was they came back the next day, all of them paid to get back in the show to tell me how it had changed their life. And I and I just uh you know how it was amazing they could sleep. So I was so excited that it wasn't that I was that you know, that I sold them, it was that I helped these people. I just got hooked on that. I just got so I ended up doing home shows and fairs for years and going town to town, and they, you know, these they have home shows, state fairs everywhere, which turns out for any entrepreneur, that's called, you know, that's your best place to bring a product because you can then get feedback from the people. And I just it was like just information, information as they would buy it and they would and they would come back and I would hear from later and give it keep their address and their names and and and giving back, you know, to improve it to uh, which by the way, I didn't mine was really different. I never had to approve it. The same pillow that I invented back then is what we have today. 85 million my pillows later.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

Wow. I was gonna ask if there was anything, because it sounds like customers were very happy, but was there anything that you tweaked ultimately after?

SPEAKER_00 10:57

Yeah, the only sales. The the only thing I tweaked was I made different size lofts in the beginning. I had right in the beginning, I had one size of that. Imagine where you move this pillow and you get your height, but you needed more of the patented fill, so to speak, for it, because if you're a really big guy, you just needed more. And you needed you needed less for stomach sleeping, a little more for uh back sleeping, and then a little more for your side, you're just from your head to your bed. So it was kind of it the patented fill never changed. And uh um, and by the way, I went and got a patent. When I got a patent, I actually was approached at the Minnesota State Fair and they said, Are you the guy that invented this pillow? And I said, Yeah. And he said, Well, we checked out this stuff. No, I didn't know um 100% that it would last 10 years. He said, This um this pillow or this this this phone will last 10 years. And he said, he he told me about the big pillow giants out there that will never let this on the market. He goes, You hear about the cars that got 200 miles a gallon, you don't hear about them anymore. And he said, and he says, you he said, they're gonna go around you get a patent and never let this on the market because it's too good. It'll take away all the other pillows out there, and uh, which kind of scared me at the time. So I went and got a uh I went and got a patent. And uh, and any entrepreneurs out there that invent stuff, you should get provisional patents are very easy to get. They're like$150 or a couple hundred dollars, and you get them online. And I I suggest that to anybody just to at least get that to protect that you can always make your own product. That's number one, because with that, at least you can always make it, even if they if you're copied out there, sure, you can maybe go after them, but you might not have the money to do it, but you don't want to be shut down on your own product, right? And uh, but I learned so much by being directed into those home shows and fairs, just learning so much from your people you're selling to, the customers. And they're and I met a lot of you know thousands and thousands of people over the years that had other products and stuff, and and um now there's there was a lot of them that would tweak because based on the feedback, and it was and I ended up helping so many of them um during that time. Um, in fact, to this day now I have my store.com, which is USA Products and Entrepreneurs made in the USA that I've had for five, six years now where my store uh we have them a platform so they're not copied out there on Amazon and your and your big box stores. That's one fear of people when you invent products. Um it's really bad out there where they try and cop you and then steal your products. But that's there's a lot of stuff being done to protect people now, entrepreneurs that weren't protected back then.

SPEAKER_01 13:45

And that's awesome because there is it's the the dupes of the world. I mean, everybody and people go right to Amazon. If you want something a little bit cheaper, is there a a dupe of it that you can get cheaper? And is the quality there or anything like that? Who knows? But I know that that happens quite a bit.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

No, all the time. And that's one thing that I've learned. Um, you know, I've kept the battle for you for decades, two and a half decades now, or two decades, and and uh that's when these entrepreneurs would come to me to have products and they view copied on Amazon, and there, but there are ways, you know, to to stop them and to turn in, you know, it's gotten better nowadays with that, and with your with um Google AdWords. I mean, there's all kinds of things, Facebook, all these places out there, um, where things get copied and you're just sitting at home, you're devastated. And um, and this uh but those things are changing. I I personally have worked with uh our great president where um he's put some stuff in place to protect us from China that was overtaking our um our Facebook ads with uh at least three platforms. So there's a lot of good things being done, but the uh um but the you know when you have a problem solution and you can get the word out, um you know, it's it's kind of the first one too, is a very big thing uh to be to get that to that name out there. But there's so many things that come into play. Um, you know, that you've got to get uh um, for instance, the name My Pillow. I went and got, you know, people, you know, whatever you're getting for your website, you need to get that first before you apply to your state for your name. Because what they'll do, there's little spies there who will grab that name, and then all of a sudden you go to get your your um uh website name, and and they bought it it's been taken, and then they want thousands of dollars for it. There's just so many things that uh it's um where bad people and bad actors have gotten involved in, but it's getting better and better.

SPEAKER_01 15:48

So yeah. Well, that's good. I uh I love that there's more protections in place for entrepreneurs and patents and all of that. Um, and I was gonna ask you what what was your big break in this whole uh process of starting my pillow? And it sounds like it was the home and garden shows.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

And shout out to Well, that was the that was the you know, that was the divina point when that guy called me. Yeah. That's for for everyone out there. That's the that's the fastest path. It's it is you can take and get any product that and I'm talking products now, and get out there and and you're taking it, you know, everybody's gonna be, you know, you can get in your home shows everywhere, your state fairs and stuff, and and that's a good path there. But now I went a different uh by the time we got to 2011, um, I had a dream of an infomercial. And and I didn't realize, and this is what people need to be careful because they see my pillow everywhere. In the United States, the infomercials, which are half-hour, they only work on the front end in Japan. Now, this is uh it's very interesting. I didn't know that then. What I mean on the front end is here's your infomercial. Um, the money you take in from that infomercial usually will not cover the cost of the of the ad. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 17:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 17:07

But but you're but you're branding to get into the box stores. Okay. So as soon as they see that much, but it's become such a monopoly out there with uh with the box stores, where there um these a few big companies um kind of monopolize that you're as seen on TV people, so to speak. But um anyway, I got into this. So mine was a little bit of an anomaly where I told my friends and family, let's I have a dream of an infomercial. We're gonna, it's gonna be the biggest infomercial in the world. And and um we pulled our money, and like I say, I didn't know it was kind of set for failure um if because they just don't work here on the front end. Well, we went to film this in St. Paul, Minnesota in this in August of 2011, and they brought in a real Hollywood producer to produce the mode. I had in my head a live audience and stuff, and and we were doing our meets, just me and this gal, I did pillow shows with all I had done is these shows at fairies. And he texted the other guy, he said, This is the worst guy I've ever seen. He'll never make it on TV. And and he said, Well, he's paying you, just you know, quiet down, he's paying you. So, but the next day I went out there for filming and I seen the crowd, and I just clam, I clammed up, I was just scared to death because it's a little different. Um, when it was all of a sudden there it was. And like I say, I had fear of public speaking, just a horrific fear of public speaking. And it came out, and I then I said, Well, can we bring a table in like I did at the shows, at the home shows and stuff, and then throw away the teleprompter and just do it naturally. And that's what we did. And it aired October 7, 2011. The middle of the night, I was living in my sister's basement and it just exploded. Uh, I had 10 employees 45 days later, I had 500 employees. In two months, I was the number one inf number one infomercial in the world by December 26th. And over, but here's the deal: the it you talk about, and it says, Well, you grow to grow too fast, too quick. Um, we explode, we just exploded. And in six months, I took in over$100 million. But I woke up in May of that year and I was six million dollars in debt. And I don't have no bank, but we know that was never borrowing money there back then. And and I was devastated. But we take in all those things that happened in 2012. Uh, and it eventually, you know, we took in. I said, well, we have to see what happened. There was betrayal and handshake deals that that didn't work. There was um, there were deals that there was no tracking, no good tracking. So I didn't know which commercials worked where. I didn't know which one worked or not. And and I said, How can you do advertising if you don't know which spot works and which one doesn't? It's like having a ball team of not knowing which one's bad and good and which one's not. So the yeah, and uh so I pulled everything in-house, everything, um, and started taking apart each segment, going, What how can I make this the best it can be? That includes call center, that includes um email marketing, includes you know, doing we were already doing all our own manufacturing, but the biggest thing was tracking the tracking of of the ads, you know, of each one. What if you had to live on one commercial in the middle of the night on on CBS or Fox or whatever it was on that commercial, and if it costs uh$2,000, well, you want to bring in at least uh, you know, two, three thousand to break even, whatever you can eat, you know, so you need good tracking, which would be a one-800 number just for that. You would need a a um a promo code just for that exact ad. It's kind of like what if I had to live on just one show? You want to make that show the best you can be on that day, because that that's the way I did live for all those years. Everything I had was in the back of that pickup truck, right? So we did that, pulled it all in-house, and uh and that's where my pillow just went to levels unseen. Um with this national brand. But they but the thing is, I look back, and I'll tell this for any entrepreneur. At the time, it was devastating, just like back when I had to sell that bar and that restaurant back then. Um, but at the time, 2012 was absolutely devastating. I thought there's no way I could ever dig out of this. But if 2012 hadn't happened, my pillow wouldn't be here 85 million pillows sold later. Because I learned it rather than take it as, oh, this is I'm gonna quit, I'm gonna walk away. No, you learn from things like that so much. Bring it in and take apart. What went wrong? Well, it's called, you know, and and and make it better. And like um, I tell um entrepreneurs everyone. Too. I said you really need to watch deviations. This is so key. When you have your baseline, your deviations, let's say you have um one show that all of a sudden did really good. Well, find out why did that do good? Because you need a different input to get that output. So something had to happen. It's the you know, and you focus on the good. And then if something bad happens, like I had all these things in 2012, you take apart each segment, you go, hey, how can I make this the best it could be? How can I do this? One of the things is that that hurts products is you'll get these manufacturers that will say, um, you know, you if you buy more, if you buy more, you're getting a better deal on your raw on your raw material and stuff. Okay. Negotiating, negotiating that is very, very key in the beginning. You know, if you can get if you can get those down and and get them, whoever manufacturer, get them on board with, hey, we're we're in this together. If this works, we're gonna be making all this. So try and get that price in the beginning. So you're um uh when you have your prototype, but then when you have your have your actual products and you're selling them. I think it's so important to uh um to have the long-term vision too, so that you know, um like me, like I made a lot of mistakes in the beginning. I tried, I actually sold my pillow too at too low of a price. And I I had a guy come out to me that yes, he goes, You gotta be at this price before he gets here. You know, yeah, you know, you need this much margin to make it because of all these expenses and that you have. But um, there was just so many things that I had to learn the hard way. And um, you know, for entrepreneurs out there, I always say that when you're first getting into things, this is really important. Look if there's anything out there that's that's like it, maybe, or that's similar, and go learn from them, the successful ones. Learn from them. What are their successes over here? If you have someone that you have that you even know, say, hey, I'm getting into this. Uh I and it might doesn't have to be exact business, but a like business, and and then pick their brains and go, you know, and say, do your research, do your due diligence before you get out there. And um and um, and then also to take that to take that risk. I mean, you gotta, you know, it's so many, so many great ideas, and entrepreneurs are just afraid. They're afraid of going out there and it stops them cold. Um, it stops them in their tracks. Um, one of the things, too, is once you're there, let's say it's a service business or a product, um, treating every customer like it's your only customer. That's so key. Because if you, you know, they tell other customers, I mean, that that's where you get this set these shows when at the at the um at the we call they call them the trenches, when you're doing the home shows and the fairs. You're out there and you're out there with your product, and and uh, but treating every customer like your only customer and following that customer through. I mean, the uh um customer service is key. That is so key. It's I can't even tell you that the uh how key that is. You can have the best product in the world and ruin the whole business because your customer service was bad. People have other things to do, and um and they they're not gonna, you know, your product can get all the all the recognition. You need both of them to go hand in hand. And um, so giving doing your due diligence, alike, um, to do learn as much as you can, and then and then jump in and then uh and don't be afraid of setbacks. Um, just learn from them and they uh and then also treat um treat every um employee, start getting employees like it's your only employee. The people around you are key too. They need to believe in what you're doing, um, they need to believe in what you're doing, and and uh that's also very key. And then, but the biggest thing too with the product, I'm kind of all over the board here, but a product, if it solves a problem, most products are born out of problem solution. If it solves a problem, solve the problem. Here's what I tell everybody solve the problem first, and if the problem solved, and then you can work on what it's gonna cost and what it's going to be. If you've solved a problem and and it's uh even if it's an improvement on another product, uh, if it's an improvement, it doesn't, you know, look what I did with a pillow. I was going, Mike, it's a pillow. But I had to change a whole paradigm in the industry. I had to change a price point because my pillow was cost a lot to make, versus pillows back then were all their pillows. They didn't even associate pillows with sleep in the early 2000s. It was like, you know, it's just a pillow.

SPEAKER_02 26:49

And uh what were we doing with pillows?

SPEAKER_00 26:52

Yeah, yeah. I come up, people come up at shows and going, um, we wouldn't even let them touch the pillow, whatever, and like this. We want to they come up, how much are they? We would never tell them the price, right? We would say, well, wouldn't you like to know what you're buying? And we go, What's a pillow? So, no, no, no, no, it's not just a pillow.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

Okay, showing them everything.

SPEAKER_00 27:15

Since then, and since then, I want to tell you a few other products that have followed those. What I've told you is um take my towels, that's a really interesting one. The towels we have, the bath towels we have at my pillow, that came out of another problem. I I have uh when I grew up, towels worked, they dried you, and all of a sudden I'm feeling these towels that I'm getting, they felt like like like kind of slimy or like lotion-y, and you got them home and they didn't dry you. It was very strange. I'm going, what's going on? And I did my due diligence and I checked out the tall, what was going on in the towel industry. And sure enough, in 2006, our government made deals with overseas with Pakistan, China, India, all these places, and let towels come into our country unregulated and um with no no um tariffs or no uh fees. And so it became very, very um, I don't know what the word would be, competitive. And everybody started adding additives to the towels like fabric softeners, lotions, oils, so that it would feel soft in the store, but you got home and it took away the absorption, which towels should be.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

You're not actually getting dry from the towel. You're not actually getting dry. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

I dove into that problem and I said, okay, I found a towel manufacturer that would uh they had these this technology where hey, you know, they were soft, but yet they absorb. So I did a commercial and I had two towels side by side. This one here, the water didn't even go in. I said, You could line a swimming pool with this. And so it was very, very um um interesting. And people now too, if you have a product because of our social media platforms, you can actually make your own little mini commercials, um, put them out on social media and they're very inexpensive. So you're not putting all this production into um, you know, entrepreneurs have done that the same way. And then because of it, the platforms that are out there, um, you can even get the uh we're not where I couldn't back in the day, like you know, like we can now. And uh, but that's you know, so I had the towels and then and then um and then sheets. When I did sheets, I study sheets. I thought, you know, I studied bed sheets. I thought, well, maybe if you pay more money, uh, they're better. Well, that wasn't true. It was just uh, but I had to study the weeds. I had to study, I like I say, I just dove in and then reverse engineered how to make it better. When I did beds, when I did mattresses and mattress toppers, I I went to the manufacturer that said, What does this do for your sleep? Well, what does this do for your sleep? What does this do? It wasn't like you know, I want to know why they're putting in all these different things that they put in our beds. Well, this one's decorative. Well, okay, I'm putting that over aside for now. I don't know. No one cares about that. Yeah, right. I don't care what my bed looks like. I want it to work.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

It's covered with a sheet, anyways. We don't need any decoration underneath that.

SPEAKER_00 30:11

Um so they uh it's been and and it's been um with like I say, with my store, I finally put up my store to help entrepreneurs have a platform uh because there's nothing worse than when you get so far, and then your idea gets taken from you. So at least protections ahead of time to be able to um protect yourself to and to go to one level after another. But I can't say enough about home shows and fairs because you can actually make a living too at that, and people love it. They uh at one time I had with my pillow 110, 120 maybe individuals going around this country, and that's all they did was do home shows and fairs. Uh they loved it.

SPEAKER_01 30:57

Um travel, see all these new places, meet all these new people, and spread the word ultimately. I think it's incredible what you've built. Um, it's you know, you brought up fear a lot throughout the podcast, and it sounds like every time you had an obstacle or something that maybe could hold someone else back, you persevered, you pushed through, you learned, and it it really is incredible what you've built over the years. Um and improved so many millions and upon millions of people's sleep and bettered their lives because sleep is really at the core of what allows us to do what we do every day. So um I think that's really awesome. And I normally end these podcasts asking for any advice that you have for aspiring entrepreneurs or you know, business owners, things like that.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

But you've given so many wonderful tidbits of knowledge and I really can't, you know, when and when you um and I'll say one more thing too. When you start regrowing, um, just make sure that communication line is open. Like right now, my my company, um I most of my employees have my direct cell phone number, even though I'm the CEO. Yeah, and I always work on deviations and blocks. So we're all like a big team. And if they if there's something that happens that's a deviation, you know, I'm making decisions here um based on everything's running smoothly. And so anyone can ever, any one of my employees can report, hey, there's something wrong at the, I see a problem here on the assembly line. Something's something's wrong with this that's coming down. If something's wrong, it gets reported because and the same way like my call center, my uh, like I say, the customer service, those are our ears out there to hear, if you hear a problem, if you've got if you if you've got a product and a and you uh or even service and you hear one customer, well, it could be more, but that one customer that had that problem, and you really have to address stuff immediately. It's not like I I get I see the failures a lot in corporate America where they um you the problem arises and then they don't find out about till the third quarter. Let's look at the third quarter report here and see, well, we spent too much money over here in sector three, and there was problems over here. But with an entrepreneur-led company, yeah, um, you know, if you're out there and it's enjoyable, everybody, when you're doing it, you you you just the team underneath you and the people underneath you, you're all working together, and it just becomes amazing. Like I say, have them believe in what you're doing. That's a key too. And then it's really it's really amazing.

SPEAKER_01 33:37

Believe in the mission.

SPEAKER_00 33:39

But I can't say enough about do your due diligence, whatever the idea is, and then and then you know what? You know, take a chance because it's it's so rewarding if you go in there and they uh but learn by someone in a light business and and do your due diligence, and then uh um you can like I say, you can, especially for products nowadays, with the home shows and fairs, you can test it very inexpensively and just get in there and see how it's gonna go. And then and all you're doing then is multiplying it on all the all the platforms that are out there now. There's so many.

SPEAKER_01 34:12

Right. And um, I know the the marketplace landscape is totally different than it was when you started off with that.

SPEAKER_00 34:18

Absolutely, absolutely. And and I and I don't want everybody to feel that you can, oh, I'm gonna get this and be on TV. Like, you know, like I say, the reason my pillow, there's a lot of things that I want to tell people so you don't get discouraged on that when you get out there with that, with all those products on TV. Most most TV products are most products that that make it on the with that kind of advertising because where you're spending a lot of money, it has to be a very wide filter. Like everybody needs a pillow, right? Everybody needs towels. If people say to me all the time, well, Mike, why don't you do that with your dog bed? Well, here's the reason. You spend, let's say,$2,000 for an ad on dog beds. Well, here's people that don't have dogs. Here's people that don't, your filter becomes very narrow. Right. You're gonna you spent all this money on people that don't even have dogs. So you gotta be real careful on that filter. Not to discourage people if they have a specific, um, a specific product uh that is for maybe a um very, very, very directed towards one uh one one need, and not everybody has that need. Well, that's fine. But then you better go, you better spend your dollars there directly to those people that have that. And that's that's key to marketing too. Make sure that you and you can do that by filters if you're on your Facebooks of the world, filter it down to the audience that would need your product.

SPEAKER_01 35:41

So for sure. Well, Mike, thank you so very much for joining me today. I know that listeners are going to really enjoy hearing your story. I know most people know Mike Lindell, but just getting a little bit more background into my pillow and the iconic brand that you have built over the years um and your story of true perseverance as an entrepreneur.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

So well, thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_01 36:03

Yes, no, thank you. And if anyone wants to check out mystore.com, you can find Mike's products along with other uh entrepreneurs.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

Over 1,200 entrepreneurs are there now. Over 1,200 made in the USA products. You guys go check it out. And if you have a product out there, there's a place you can apply right there to uh to our team that can help to get up on the platform.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

So love it. Awesome. Thank you so much, Mike. Good luck in Minnesota, and uh hopefully we'll talk to you soon.

SPEAKER_00 36:30

Thank you, Sarah. All right, thanks.