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Unashamed Table Talk
Unashamed Table Talk is a Christ-centered, Gospel-focused podcast from Unashamed Women’s Ministry, hosted by Denise Bowens and BJ Garrett, where we tackle honest conversations about faith and life.
Unashamed Table Talk
I can't believe God said it's ok!
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Have you or someone you know been living in the guilt and shame of the past? This episode will encourage you to hold your head high and take hold of the flowing river of grace that never runs out! No matter the past, God loves you and has made you for more!
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Happy Thursday. It's Thursday. It's podcast day. I love recording podcasts with you. It's so much fun. We are weekly now. So that's exciting.
SPEAKER_01Very exciting. It's also very intimidating to me. I've already shared this that it I don't know why it stresses me out that we're weekly, because I'm like, dude, I never we never have a quiet moment. When we meet on Wednesday mornings to pray, we talk for an hour before we pray for an hour. There's never a quiet moment. So I don't know why it stresses me out, but I'm always like, do we really have something important to say every single week? But here we are, making it happen. And God is faithful and showing up. And it's fun to sit around the table and have scriptural conversations with my girl Denise.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, here's the thing. I mean, we love the word, we love Jesus. And so we have important things to say that come from those, you know, comes from the word and comes from the Lord. Thankfully, our listeners are okay with all the other stuff that we have in between that's not really important, like this conversation that we're having right now. So thank you for listening anyway. Hey, before we get started, we do want to just remind everyone Unashamed Women's Conference is coming up in just a few weeks, September the 25th and the 26th. Doors will open at 6 o'clock. It's at the Hot Springs Convention Center. There's a lot of things to do in Hot Springs, y'all. And then worship will kick off at 7 o'clock on that Friday night. We do have a few vendors lined up already. So come on in at 6, get your seat, and go around and shop. And if you haven't gotten your tickets yet, then go to Eventbrite and you'll find the tickets there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, or you can go to our website, unashamedww.com. There's a link there. If you scroll through our social media, there's a gajillion links on social media. There is no reason why you should have any problem finding tickets.
SPEAKER_00None whatsoever. We're so excited.
SPEAKER_01We're so excited. Okay, and on that note, we are gonna break down a song today, which I think is gonna be super fun. And we're gonna have Chad Evans as our worship leader at Unashamed Hot Springs. And he's amazing and just the heart of gold to lead us in worship. And because we're highlighting him today, it would be fun just to sing a song. I mean, I'm not gonna sing a song. Don't worry, you don't have to mute your podcast. BJ is not gonna sing a song. We're gonna discuss a song.
SPEAKER_00These are one of those things that's not important. But one time BJ and I were at Galveston for a retreat, and she and I we get there usually a day early and we're cooking food and we're getting everything set up and we have worship music planned and we're both just singing and going along and and just enjoying our day and and prepping and everything and having so much fun. And this, I don't even remember the song, but this song came on, and she BJ said this line or whatever, and I can't remember it's like it the it went up a note or two or something, and she was still way down here or whatever. And I said, Okay, BJ, listen, listen, come here, look. And so we stopped it, and I said, just do this, just make it sound just like this. And I said, whatever, and she tried it, and it was no around that note. And I said, You can do this, BJ. Look, just make this sound, just make this note, and she tried it again. I said, Never mind, let's just keep worshiping Jesus. So we just kept on going. So I'm not I'm not a great singer either. I can usually sing what I hear, but you leave me to my own self, then I am all over the place. Um if I'm when I was in the choir, if I'm sitting next to the bass and tenor people, whatever, wherever they went, I'm I always were was in the auto section. Okay. I sing whatever I hear around me. So if I'm in the middle of the autos, I'm singing alto. But if I have a guy sitting next to me to my right that's singing bass or tenor, the line, one line may be auto, then I may skip over to tenor and then bass, and then I make up my own notes all in between.
SPEAKER_01So well, that's kind of what I do. I just make up my own notes.
SPEAKER_00It's just the for the whole song, you make up your own notes.
SPEAKER_01So true. I did not sing, but I love to sing. I I literally pray that God would change my voice so that I could sound good when I sing. I love to sing, I would live my life like high school musical. I would sing everything. That's why I can't, that's why God's like, no, girl, you can't, we ain't doing that.
SPEAKER_00And he's like, No, you'd be getting on people's nerves. So today we're going to look at the song Made for More. And I know that this was a song that was super popular for a long time. It's still a very good song, still popular. But there for a while, that particular song, I mean, every time you turn the radio on, you heard it. I do recovery on Monday nights, and I love this song. We've used it a lot, but it we just kind of want to go through the song and just break down these lyrics. And and before we even jump into that, I just want to challenge everyone to think about the songs that we do sing when we're at church or driving down the road in our car or whatever, what we put in to our minds is very important. I've shared this before. If I if I'm at a gas station, which is never I don't know why I always say a gas station, because this song literally has never played at a gas station while I've been there. I don't even know why I use this as the analogy, but if I'm pumping gas out there and the song from ACDC comes on, dun, dun dun, dun, dun dun dun, dun dun dun man, I'm fit to start singing those back and back. I'm fit to start saying all of a sudden my whole attitude changes. I think I'm cool and tough. Never do that again. Never do that again. I am all of a sudden I change it to this whole different person because that song comes on, and I just think, hmm, I'm I man, I'm bad to the phone. I can't wear no spikes, I break my neck. But what we put into our minds, what we listen to, it makes a difference. It changes our attitude, it changes our perspective, and so it's very important what we listen to. And I think it's really important that we pay attention to the lyrics of a song. Are we singing it just because it sounds good and we like the tune, or are we really thinking about the meaning of the song?
SPEAKER_01I think that's the biggest concern that I have sometimes with worship music, is that do you really listen to what you're singing? It's almost like a prayer, right? Like you're praying these these words and praise to our Lord and Savior. And it are you just saying them because they sound good, or do you actually mean the words that you're saying? And are they biblical? And I think that they're I mean, I don't think that every song has to be biblical. I don't mean that. I mean, I like all kinds of genres of music. Some of them, some of them are good scriptural, and some are not, but do they counter scripture? I think is the danger when you're specifically talking about worship music. And I think that a lot of churches, there's a lot of uproar about like Bethel and Evil, Evil. What what is the other one?
SPEAKER_00I don't know. My mind wandered. And I'm thinking, are you singing Jesus music at church and getting in the car singing, I'm on the high, I won't be the hell? Yeah, there's something wrong with that. I used to love that song. I didn't even know what the heck I was singing.
SPEAKER_01You may you know you did know, you just didn't really grasp the severity. I didn't care. You didn't care because you were on the highway to hell.
SPEAKER_00I was on the highway to hell and I was proud of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you were.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Okay, so back to the band you were talking about. Elevation.
SPEAKER_01Elevation, thank you. Yeah, those there's a lot of controversy about them having some issues with their theology and different things, and can they make beautiful worship songs? Absolutely. But and I'm not just throwing them under the bus, there's other people as well, but is the worship songs that you're using for worship actually doing that? And I don't think that everything is bad, but you know, in the context of being scriptural and worshipful, is it only takes one bad line to ruin the whole pot, you know? Right. I think about this is so dumb. You know, I love Loretta Lynn. I just watched Colminer's daughter last week, and the there's a scene where Loretta Lynn bakes a cake and it gets auctioned off, and her not then yet husband, doolittle Lynn, buys the cake and he takes it and it's disgusting, and he spits it out. And he's like, How much salt do you put in a pie, Loretta? She said, Oh, you don't put no salt in the pie. You just put sugar, and she's like, Oh, and she realizes that she put all this salt instead of sugar in this pie, and it was disgusting. It just took one bad ingredient to ruin the whole pie. And that's how it can be whenever you're looking at scripture and worship music. It just takes one wrong ingredient to make the whole thing spoiled and not any good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's a whole podcast right there. One wrong mindset, yeah, one wrong attitude.
SPEAKER_01That's why we had to go to weekly. We do have something to say every day. Let's get to this song.
SPEAKER_00Let's get to this song.
SPEAKER_01Okay, I just I just want you to sing it.
SPEAKER_00I'm not singing anymore. I've already sang too much already.
SPEAKER_01I mean you're gonna sing some A C D C and Highway to Hell but you want to worship. What is wrong with my misery partner? Lord, forgive us for G sins so much.
SPEAKER_00This is true. This is true. I am a sinner. Save grace. Thank you, Lord. Okay, so the first section of this song is I know who I am because I know who you are. The cross of salvation was only the start. Now I am chosen, free, and forgiven. I have a future and it's worth the living. Let's just talk about that to begin with.
SPEAKER_01So good.
SPEAKER_00So good. I know who I am because I know who you are. Talking about Jesus, talking about the Lord. You share share what what you have on your mind before I get going again. No, go ahead. Say it. Well, I'm just looking at this like I know that I'm nothing without him. Right. And I can get so caught up in not knowing who I really am because I'm focused on who Denise she is. I'm focused on who the enemy tells me I am. I'm focused on guilt or shame or past mistakes. I'm focused on that highway to hell living that I used to be on, right? And I think, oh, I'm not, I'm not anybody because I'm such a failure, I'm such a sinner. But that is not what the word teaches us. The word teaches us that we are his masterpiece. He looks at us and he knows that out of all of his creation, humans are his masterpiece, and we are worth something. And not because of anything I've done, but because of who he is. We were made in his image. And we know when we learn who we are because of Christ, it changes everything. It says the cross of salvation was only the start. Coming to know Christ in the very beginning, when he died on the cross, that was just the start of a new life for me. The acknowledgement of Jesus died for me on the cross, that was just the beginning.
SPEAKER_01Well, it really is the only beginning. I mean, I've shared this a gajillion times, but when I first got saved, I was so biblically illiterate that I didn't even understand that I had just gotten saved. I did get saved, and I know because there was an immediate change in my heart and my thought process. The Holy Spirit was living inside of me, and I knew I was different, but I didn't understand why. I literally, even up until I don't know, the first few weeks after I had gotten saved, had thought I was already saved because I knew I believed in God. And, you know, how do you not be saved if you believe in Jesus? Because there's more to it than just a head knowledge. And and we can, that's another theological discussion, but I I really was so biblically illiterate and spiritually immature that I didn't even understand that I had just received my salvation. It was just the start, and it was the start of really some hard choices and processing and learning. And and really the more that I have learned over the past 24 years of this salvation journey is the more I know, the less I actually know. The more I learn, the less I know.
SPEAKER_00Right. Yeah, I've I agree with that 100%. The next part of that section says, now I'm chosen, free, and forgiven. I have a future and it's worth the living. Like once I realize who I am in Christ and that He died for me, then I understand that I have been set free, that I'm forgiven of that past, and that I do have a future and it is worth the living. That very next line, this next section is my favorite of the whole song because I wasn't made to be tending a grave. I was called by name. I love that. I wasn't made to be tending a grave. No one listening today were created to be tending a grave. It's in the past. Quit staying in the junk, quit staying in death, quit staying in that that has already passed. Quit sitting in the grave, quit tending it. I was called by name, born and raised back to life again. I was made for more. So why would I make a bed in my shame when a fountain of grace is running my way? I lied. This is my favorite part. Why would I make a bed in my shame when a fountain of grace is running my way?
SPEAKER_01But you know, the enemy wants us to make, he wants us to make a bed in our shame. He wants us to lie in that bed of shame and he will bring up our past. Even if that past was yesterday, he will bring it up and he will remind us how much we suck, all the things that we did that were horrible. And he loves us to be just and the reality is, is we do have this fountain of grace. And when you really focus on that and how good God's grace is, and that he has forgiven us and he has washed away all of that ugliness. I mean, it is awesome. It's awesome.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm sitting here, I'm just singing it in my head.
SPEAKER_01I wish you can see her moves too. She's also dancing it. It's not just singing.
SPEAKER_00Oh we had a song on uh Recovery Alive on Monday night, just this past week. It was celebration night, and it's an exciting night for us. And we had on a Forrest Frank song celebrate celebration or celebrate is what it's called. I love Forrest Frank music, I just love it. There's so much truth in it, so simple, it's fun. And anyway, I was listening to that song and turned the sound system off. Everybody was walking out, going into their small group rooms, and I come walking out and I'm just dancing and I can't dance. I ain't got a dancing bone in my body. And see, you can dance and you can't sing.
SPEAKER_01I cannot dance.
SPEAKER_00I do dance, but I can't dance. But I'm walking out and I'm trying to do this little jig. Well, that right there tells you I can't dance because I'm calling it a jig. And about that time, I tripped over my own feet. And my friend standing there and she's like, What you doing again? You trying to dance? I said, Girl, I was trying, but my feet got in the way. I can't dance.
SPEAKER_01But I wasn't there because I would still be laughing.
SPEAKER_00You would think about the fountain, a fountain of grace, though. Like, let's look at let's break this down a little bit. When a fountain of grace is running my way, it makes me think of water when you have a river that is flowing. It's a fountain of grace, it's running my way. When water is running, then it is all it's it's running, it's always moving, it's active, it's living, it's not stagnant. It's not stagnant. It's not stagnant, just catching bugs and stinking and getting nasty looking, right? Grace is always living, it's always flowing, and it's running through us. It's a living blessing that is being given to us moment by moment, day by day, week by week. It is always available. Like God's grace never runs out. There is not an ending to where it comes to a place where the Lord looks down and says, Okay, Denise, I have shown you a fountain of grace now for five years on the daily, many times a day, and I'm just wore out. I'm tired of this. I'm I'm uh I'm stopping the dam, you know. I'm stopping it here. The water's gonna stop flowing. I can't do this anymore. It doesn't work that way. It all started back in the very first verse there. The cross of salvation was only the start. He died for my sins, and grace stepped in, and it there's never an ending to it.
SPEAKER_01That's good. I'm sorry I keep muting this because I've got my dumb dog in here, and she is playing with a toy and going, she's been asleep at my feet all day. And now that I'm trying to record a podcast, she is acting a complete fool.
SPEAKER_00What did I tell you? That your dog cannot be a guest on our podcast anymore. She does not follow the rules.
SPEAKER_01She does not follow the rules. She is the boss of this house, and she doesn't follow any rules. She is a pest, but I'm obsessed with her.
SPEAKER_00I know you are.
SPEAKER_01I love her.
SPEAKER_00Anyways, okay, moving on. All right, so let's look at this again because I wasn't made to be tending a grave, I was called by name. What does that line mean to you, BJ?
SPEAKER_01Well, I think that the important thing is that names are important. There's so many ways to even go into this, but names are important. And he has called us by name. And I don't want to, we've talked about doing a podcast on this and we haven't about the free will and the elect and the called and all of that. But we have been called out of our shame, we've been called out of our grave ultimately, and it it's personal, it's a it's a personal, very intimate thing that we've been called by name. That's what I think.
SPEAKER_00So when it says I was made for more, what when you were before you come to know Christ, what did you feel like you were made for in the beginning?
SPEAKER_01Oh, well, I thought I was made for nothing but grossness. I mean, I was I really was laying in a bed of shame, was completely and totally broken. Even when I was married and trying to like not sell my body and not do drugs, and I had even quit smoking cigarettes, you know, I didn't even smell like a cigarette anymore, like I was, you know, a you know, quote unquote good person, finally, which was better than not being a good person, but I was still so lost. I was desperately seeking a savior, and I didn't even know what that meant. I didn't even know that that's what I was doing. And yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I remember, I know I've told the story before, but I remember when I first started going to church with my mama, she would ask me to come on a Saturday night and leave those messages on the answer machine, and I would come every now and then on a Sunday morning, and a lot of times I would be hungry. Over from the night before. Just in this mindset of I'm here to make mama happy, but I've been living a life full of sin. I mean, but I didn't look at it as sin. Like that's I mean, I knew that it was wrong to an extent. I really didn't think what I was doing was wrong, but there was pieces of what I was doing that I felt like crossed the line, you know, like I shouldn't have done that. That was wrong. But I didn't see anything wrong with me getting drunk every night. I didn't see anything wrong with me doing a line or getting high. I didn't see anything wrong with any of that. But when I stood in church before the Lord, there was something inside of me that knew that lifestyle is not what I was made for. I was made for more. But I couldn't grasp that. I didn't understand it. And to be honest, I didn't think I could ever be anything other than a failure and an addict. Many times I would, like most addicts, try to stop on your own. And I would do good for 30, 60 days, and then I would relapse and I'd go right back into it. And I can't tell you how many times I told myself, this is just who I am, and this is who I'll always be. That's what I thought my life would always be. I didn't understand that God created me for something more than that until I come to know the Lord. And I still didn't really grasp it. Like you said, like I still didn't get it. But what I did get was that he loved me anyway, even though I didn't understand it. Yeah. I believed what I was being told, what was being preached. I believed that God did love me. I didn't understand why. I didn't grasp all that, but I knew I needed something different than where I had been, because that lifestyle was getting old. I didn't even know who I was anymore. So he says in this, they say in this song that we were made for more. And then it says, I know I'm yours and I was made for more. Again, it goes back to I know who I am because I know who you are. It just keeps repeating that that line. But then when you go down to there's a chorus, or I don't know, I say chorus, I don't know what they are. It don't tell me on my little sheet, but says, Oh, hallelujah, you called out my name. So I'll sing out your praise. Hallelujah. You buried my past, and I'm not going back. I love that right there. Not going back. You buried my past. Not I buried it. I tried to bury it, but when I buried it, it always came back. And then I ended up tending that grave because I was trying to do it all on my own. But once we understand that the Lord's the one who buried our past, we don't have to go back to that. We don't have to tend that grave.
SPEAKER_01Right. It makes me think, and I don't know, just a very visual person. And we all know I love my, you know, baptism stories, but it makes me think about baptism where baptism is literally a representation of burying the old you and talking about the grave, and I wasn't made to be tending a grave, and then you buried my past, and I'm not going back. You can't, no one is gonna be buried in a grave and then come out of that and then dig back into that grave. And I just see this visual of that, like you're never going back into that grave. You there's no reason for you to ever do that. You are raised up new, and I I just I just love that visual.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think sometimes we can tend to go back to the things that we've done in the past, like our nature is to fall back into that sin. Like it even in the Bible, it says that the sin that entangles us, it's it's our own fleshly desire, that we're not fighting against humans, we're fighting against flesh and blood, and that there's these sins that we tend to go back to. It's because they're sins that our flesh desires, that we want. And I think that all of us as humans can tend to step back into certain sins or certain things from our past that gave us some sort of, gave us some sort of recognition, made us feel like we had power or made us feel important, made us feel loved, made us see, be, feel seen, whatever it may be. But I also think that we kind of like want to stick a toe in there and we start going that direction because we want to feel all of these other things, or we don't know how to cope with something in life. So we tend to go back and start trying to cope with life the way that we used to. And I think sometimes we get a toe in there, and then maybe we might get a foot in there and we start going back that direction. But if we know the Lord and we've been living with the Lord on a continual basis, like striving to glorify the Lord and be in his word and things, I think what that foot get, I'm over here literally in my chair with my foot stuck all across the room. Like I'm I wish y'all could see, because you could understand better. If you could see my foot, so visualize my foot's all the way over here stepping back into sin. But after it's there for a minute, I'm reminded of what that sin cost me. I'm reminded of what that sin felt like. I'm reminded of the ugly and the guilt, and I'm reminded of all the people and the things that's going to hurt because of my actions. And so I don't stay there near as long. I pull that foot back out so y'all visualize that foot's coming out and it's coming right back over here because I'm shaking off the dirty. I'm like, I can't go back there anymore. And the the one line says, because you called, let me see, what does it say? It says, You called out my name, so I'll sing out your praise. Like you called out my name, so I'll sing out your praise. You chose me, I'll praise you. You freed me, I'll praise you. In the good and the bad, I'm gonna praise you because you love me. You chose me, and I'm gonna sing out your praise. You buried my past, I'm not going back. You chose me, you called me by name. And truly, no one can pluck us from his hand.
SPEAKER_01Right. And I think it is so important though, is if you don't truly understand even in this the littlest ways, if you can't grasp who he is, then you will be limited in who you are because of him. You have to begin to grow and understand the characteristics of God, who he is, what he's done for you, how much he loves you, before you can really begin to grow in that knowledge of who you are because of him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, Ephesians 2.10 says, For we are God's masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago. I love that. He planned for us to do things long ago before we were ever even thought of or created on this earth. He already had a plan for our lives. I say this all the time. It blows me away. I will never understand it. But God knew all the stupid things I was going to do in my life, and he allowed me to be created anyway. Why? Because he also knew that there would be a day that I would accept him and that he can take all that ugly and all that dumb, stupid stuff I did, and he could take it and use it for good. You find your scripture?
SPEAKER_01No, not the one that I wanted earlier, but this one, and you may have mentioned this earlier, or we may have just mentioned it before we started recording, but it's Romans 8, 1. So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ. And that is just a hard mic drop right there. There is no more condemnation. If you know Jesus as your Lord and Savior, the condemnation has been put away. You no longer have to live in that shame. You're raised again in Christ and you are a new creation.
SPEAKER_00Man, absolutely. And here's the thing: if you're laying in that bed of shame, get up. Get up. God created you for more. And if you've accepted Christ as your savior, dead gum, get up out of the bed, rebuke the devil because he's the one holding you there. I heard someone say this before, and it just hit me so hard. It's like when we lay in that bed of shame and we're looking at the guilt. Look, what we're doing is we're looking at our actions. We're looking at what we did. And basically what it's saying is thank you, Jesus, for dying on the cross, but it wasn't quite enough. Right. Look, if it was enough to save you from eternity in hell, then it was enough to keep you out of that bed of shame for all the days of our life. We were made for more. Is it easy? No, it's a battle. We are in a battle. We are sinners saved by grace, and there is an enemy on this earth that is battling us. And it the Bible tells us that he is an accuser. He always wants to bring up what we've done in the past to try to hold us down. And I also got this from someone else is look, when I start thinking about all the stupid things I did, it's where I just need to turn around and say, devil, you're right. I sure did do those stupid things. But my Jesus died on the cross and he saved me from it. And just keep on stepping. Don't get in that bed of shame. Yeah. You were made for more.
SPEAKER_01We've talked about that before because we talked about the Mandisa song, Not Guilty. That's another good song. We could break that song down. That would be a fun one. That'd be good. So good. Okay, we got to close out of here. Thank you so much for joining us. We will be right back here early next Thursday morning. Hope you will tune in and share this podcast with someone that might could use some encouragement. Thanks.
SPEAKER_02You've been listening to Table Talk with BJ Garrett and Denise Bowens. To support this ministry through prayer or giving, visit our website at unashamedww.com. May you be encouraged, rooted in truth, and unashamed.
