Midwest Besties
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Midwest Besties
Episode 114: Chappell Roan Hates Nepobabies
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Despite allergy season woes, your besties are locked in this week! In this pop culture potluck, we dig into Chappell Roan’s latest security drama, and do our best to delicately discuss Taylor Frankie Paul, The Bachelorette cancellation, and Secret Lives of Mormon Wives (trigger warning: domestic violence). We move into lighter territory to recap the latest Summer House episode, where we are yelling justice for Bailey and in awe of Ciara, Mia, and KJ’s vulnerability. We chat about TV we’re super excited about, including The Pitt, The Valley, and Hacks. We end the episode by letting you know what we’re currently reading—that’s right, we don’t just watch Bravo TV all day, okay?!
Intro and Let’s Talk Allergies
SPEAKER_04I'm Lauren and I'm Emily. And we're Midwest besties.
SPEAKER_01Even if she yelled at the little girl, I wouldn't give a fuck. I don't understand why everyone's going to war for this random little girl that didn't write red wine supernova.
SPEAKER_04Correct. Correct. That was Huckleberry Finn on TikTok, who wanted the content for this has been amazing. Amazing. We're talking about Chapel Roan. But before we get started on that, welcome everybody.
SPEAKER_05Welcome back, everybody. Oh my gosh, we're just we're having some wacky spring weather around here.
SPEAKER_04It is literally 30 degrees one day and 90 degrees another.
SPEAKER_05It's not hyperbole. So if you hear me sneeze, cough, blow my nose, no, you didn't. That's none of your business. Okay. We're doing our best. Also, don't look at any of my child's sleeves. Let's just say I'm keeping Kirkland Xur in business. Whatever it is. Kirkland Tech. Children. Oh my god, I love it. Um, okay, so we have to talk about Chapel. She is making waves yet again.
Chappell Roan’s Latest Drama
SPEAKER_04Okay, so for those of you who don't know, Chapel got into another kerfuffle. This time, and I have to give a shout out right in the front to my best friend, my boo-boo, Pete, who texted me like the minute this dropped.
SPEAKER_05And it was essentially because he's a huge soccer fan.
SPEAKER_04And he basically said, Okay, at on Saturday, a former Arsenal player's stepdaughter got into an incident with Chapel Roan in Brazil. Worlds colliding. When my hyperfixations collide. Um, and then of course I like obviously did a deep dive of this football player.
SPEAKER_05Pete gave us the exact pronunciation. So shout out, because I was like, How do you say his name? No, I didn't know. Jorginho.
SPEAKER_04And he is like super famous.
SPEAKER_05We're probably I'm probably putting the emphasis on.
SPEAKER_04Jorginho.
SPEAKER_05Jorginho. Jorginho.
SPEAKER_04Jorginho. Whatever. We're two white women, we're doing our best. Okay. So he um very lengthy. Put her on blast. I mean, we're talking like, get your magnifying glass out, kids, because it was tiny print on the thumb is holding onto that screen while you read for dear life. So essentially, Chapel is in uh Brazil for Lollapalooza. She is eating breakfast uh at her hotel, and um, this soccer star's stepdaughter, who is the actual daughter of Jude Law. So she's why is Jude Law involved in any of this? So many famous parents. She's a big fan of Chapel. She sees her allegedly sees her, then like walks at hotel breakfast. Yes. Like wants to see if it is actually her, like walks around her near her chapel round, does not like actually go up to her or anything, and then sits back down, and then a security guard very rudely, what um a large security, this is a quote, uh, a large security guard came over to their table while they were still having breakfast and began speaking in an extremely aggressive manner to both my wife and my daughter, saying that she shouldn't allow my daughter to quote disrespect or quote harass other people.
SPEAKER_05In our last episode, I was like super annoyed with Chapel and I was like, she's being crazy at Paris Fashion Week. This whole thing, I first of all, I'm not super invested in. Yeah. Second of all, Kim, there's people that are dying. Correct. Kim, there's people that are dying. She did a crazy response laying down in bed.
SPEAKER_04She's like, whoa, I didn't I've I don't even I've never seen a daughter in my life.
SPEAKER_05I never even saw a mother and a daughter. What are you talk what's a mother and a daughter look like?
SPEAKER_00I'm just gonna tell my half of the story of what happened today with a mother and child who were involved with a security guard who is mommy personal security. I didn't even see, I didn't even see a woman and a child.
SPEAKER_05But she then like shifts the blame to the security, which is not good. And then she's like such a bad guy.
SPEAKER_04I don't hate kids.
SPEAKER_05The lady doth protesting.
SPEAKER_04I don't hate people who like my music. Um, so obviously it that didn't help. Um No, it was like an insta meme. But the way this is catching fire, the way people are like, okay, there was one uh I think it was like a a tweet or like a thread where someone was like it was a picture of the girl and it was like this is right before the incident, and someone was like, they're acting like she murdered her.
SPEAKER_05There's like two very distinct sides, and there's the one side that's like they're going to crucify Chapel, and she is like insane and evil, and she has she tortured this girl and traumatized her for life, which is just like it's insane. And then there's this other side who like is just like this is so fucking funny.
SPEAKER_04And like I mean, the way people are talking is like wow, crucified like Jesus. We should we should all remember this girl on this day.
SPEAKER_05Like, this was her before, and this like truly BC. Like, two meanings. But then there was like this footage who was like, Chapel does send secure. Chapel said she never sends security after her fans, but that's not true. Look at this footage, and it is like footage of Chapel like pointing people out and her security going up. By the way, they're filming her, like in an airport.
SPEAKER_04I don't think for one second, she either didn't send them or she was like, if anybody gets in this vicinity, if anybody looks like they're looking at me, yeah, you go after them. Yeah, that is a hundred percent someone was acting on her or her people's at her. Yeah. Um I just think that we can't accept the fact that she would say that. Yeah, if it was like Mick fucking Jagger, if it was like any male star, no one would bat an eye.
SPEAKER_05There sh hey, I just want to be so fucking clear that Chapel Roan is not the first person to hate her fans or to treat her fans like shit. This is a tale as old as time, and she has she is for some reason. Here is what it is it is that she came up in this industry overnight, and everybody expects her to be so fucking grateful for it. Now, I think that's partially because she's super young. I think it's partially because she's a woman, and I think it's partially because like she had an atmospheric rise overnight. And she's a nobody from the Midwest. And she's a nobody from the Midwest. I think this is like there's a lot of like we could talk about it probably for hours of like there's some classism, there's some elitism, like there's some misogyny going on in this. Like that, like they the expectation is that she needs to be so fucking grateful she should like self-sacrifice and give everything to her fans. But at the end of the day, it's like, you know, Georgia was like in all caps said without your fans, you would be nothing. And to the fans, she does not deserve your affection. That is in that is that it's kind of insane. Like, just let Chapel cook, let her do her thing.
SPEAKER_04My ride or die, baby. And she's if she's dying, I'm riding.
SPEAKER_05I mean, truly, at this point, it's just like we just need to back off and accept her for who she is, and just like who cares? Yes. There are so many celebrities who have famously treated fans like shit. Kendall Jenner being one of them, like Hayley Bieber is like a notorious apple.
SPEAKER_04Nothing to society. Correct. Whereas, like, bitch, if you're about to drop another subway, if you're not, if you're about to drop another giver, I don't give a shit.
SPEAKER_05If you punch me in the face.
SPEAKER_04And honestly, like, celebrity kids, fuck them.
Taylor Frankie Paul
SPEAKER_05I just, it's like, are we really gonna get are we gonna ride for a Nepo baby? I'm not. Oh God. Moving on. Okay, moving on. We've gotta. This is I don't know how dark we're gonna get here, but it's gonna get dark in a hurry because we gotta talk about Taylor Frankie Paul. I so we were on spring break last week and we were together and we were discussing, you know, this whole situation, and there was this like, will they, won't they cancel the Bachelorette season? Because all of a sudden, this news drops that there was another domestic violence altercation about a month ago and that filming for Secret Lives, they're already filming what, season five now? Yeah. Uh, filming for Secret Lives of Mormon Wives had been paused. None of the girls wanted to film with Taylor Frankie Paul, and we don't know like really what's happening. And then there's all this question about like, is ABC gonna air The Bachelorette? It seems it's full steam ahead. They are still advertising. She does the weirdest fucking interview on GMA about it.
SPEAKER_04Oh my god, it was so awful.
SPEAKER_05She has this like weird statement to ET where she's like, it's just a heavy time, but like says nothing. It was so bad.
SPEAKER_04Because in this time frame, normally, and again, I am not a Bachelor Nation member, but I do know enough that the results of the show are on lockdown, who they end with very much so if they are still together, like it is it is locked down, they're sequestered for some reason in this season. Again, this is the first time ever that they picked a bachelorette that was not from the franchise. They picked Taylor Frankie Paul from Real Housewiveswives, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, um, who is essentially on again and off again with her most recent baby daddy uh to be The Bachelorette.
SPEAKER_05Well document, well documented that she is on again and off again.
SPEAKER_04And it seemed very clear that she did not end up, so I think they wrapped, they wrapped filming of this season in January.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, that's maybe a little before. And already people, there's all these leaks about what happened many concepts, and like uh she didn't end up with anybody, she didn't choose anybody, like it's a whole or she did chose someone and they were maybe together for like a month, but they weren't even really together to the point where the guy's like, I'm not doing this.
SPEAKER_04Um, we also find out that um on Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, because this is is this season four is going on at this time, or it drops and the and it it drops all at once, right?
SPEAKER_05But it was filming, yeah, it drops all at once and it was filming right before she left.
SPEAKER_04She slept with this guy, Dakota, I can't, the night before she left to go to film The Bachelorette.
SPEAKER_05She's like, I might be pregnant mess.
SPEAKER_04As most people I'm sure know, The Bachelorette is on ABC, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives is on Hulu. These are both um major arms of Disney's media conglomerate. It has seemed from the very beginning they were cut off your nose despite your face, is how I can describe how they are promoting Secret Lives of Mormon Wives at the detriment of this woman's bachelorette season.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. It's all it's like I think that they thought it was going to be this like amazing crossover type of situation where like they were going to get this awesome cross-promotional. Like people who were watching Secret Lives but maybe weren't watching wouldn't have watched Bachelorette, like were going to watch Bachelorette. I mean, I was certainly thinking about it. I was not because I just can't. It's so much content, but like I'm sure that was a huge I'm you know, they did focus groups, I'm sure they like researched all of this and like they were gonna get a lot of new viewers because that franchise needs like a revamp, a refresh.
SPEAKER_04And as you know from this podcast, we are Whitney Leving stands, yeah. That stands, but we just appreciate her rise to fame. She is another star of um Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, and so we saw this cross-promotion work with Dancing with Stars.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, but I it's just such a different vibe, so different from like a dance competition show to like a show about finding your one true love. And she's the first bachelorette who has children, you know, like Emily said, the first out of the franchise. So kind of from go, this was like a really crazy decision, and it was a really risky decision on ABC's part. And it was like one of those, it was like, we are either gonna win big or we're gonna lose everything. And guess what? Like, they're losing everything. So then, so we kind of know, like, okay, now there's like new domestic violence allegations because if you remember, there was a huge, like, she was arrested in 2023, and that is where the first season of Mormon Wives actually picked up. Like, it was body cam footage of her arrest, and then it would like flash forward to like six months later, and it was like talking to her.
SPEAKER_04The pilot episode was literally like them filming like normal, and then they have this horrible domestic violence incident, and they have to stop filming first season for like yeah, six to nine months before they pick up again.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So, like, we already know this woman has like a very problematic past with this partner. Now, Secret Lives initially was like all about the women. I stopped watching after season one because it is dark as shit, and I'm not interested in like that type of darkness in my reality TV.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_05Um, but you know, it's like you they are very much in the pop culture reality TV space, so it's like you are you keep up enough that like I'm aware. Get them out, get them banned. Get them banned. We don't do that here.
SPEAKER_02Get them banned. Get them banned. We don't do that here. Oh, now I'm pissed.
SPEAKER_05So bad. Like these women are all super young, they all have religious trauma, whether or not they want to admit it. Now we're seeing like several of them are getting divorced. It's just like ugly. It is just one of them has an eating disorder. It's just not they all have tons of plastic surgery.
SPEAKER_04This is not, this is not fun for me.
SPEAKER_05It's not entertaining.
SPEAKER_04And you okay, so someone says, like, what is the difference between real housewives and secret lives mormon-wives? Age. We are dealing with women who are in their 40s and 50s, they are established. A lot of times they have their own money and they're like delusional in the best way. I don't want to watch a 21-year-old try to reach this level of fame. They're like frontal lobes aren't developed.
SPEAKER_05And I certainly don't want to watch them do it within the confines of an extremely like restrictive, oppressive religion that defines, has a really strong view of what social norms are and like a really restrictive view of what you can and cannot do. And don't get confused.
SPEAKER_04This is this show exists to normalize the Church of Latter-day Saints. 100%. Even if it's like, oh my god, these women are this is actually terrible for the religion, it's not. No, no, because we are talking about that religion more than we ever. 100%.
SPEAKER_05There was that whole magazine cover, like Mormonism and pop culture, is it's like a takeover.
SPEAKER_04So, okay, so to we're gonna try and land this plane. When this newest domestic violence accusation happens, again, it's with Dakota, the same guy from four years ago. It is revealed that Taylor is not with any of the guys from The Bachelor. Yes, that she is then in fact with Dakota. Yeah. Which would make the entire season a moot point at this point. Right.
SPEAKER_05So then everyone's kind of like, are they gonna move forward? There's all these new allegations, like there's this is sounding really, really bad. And so it's kind of like, nope, they're moving forward. Then we're sitting there, Emily and I are sitting at the pool, pod daddy. Jake goes, Oh my god. Because we Emily and I are not on our phones for once in our lives. And join the moment, god damn it, present, Jake, and Jake's like, oh my God, look at this footage that just got released. And it's Dakota has obviously leaked this footage, and it is footage of her so intoxicated, probably on something, out of her mind. Like it is it is the footage of what the events in 2023 described. None of this inf none of what we saw is new. No, we knew all of those things, but to see the footage is really disturbing.
SPEAKER_04So, one of the reasons why I stopped watching it in season two was just her surrounded by people who are manipulating her and using her because she is famous for literally being hot and dancing on TikToks. This is not someone who is equipped for any type of fame, let it let alone a 20-year reality show franchise. Yeah. And every single person has fed her to the sharks. Yep. And we are seeing the ramifications of that because now we are seeing someone go back to their lowest form, their lowest form of selves, and probably like should receive jail time from it. But like she did not get there fucking alone.
SPEAKER_05No. God, have you seen Million Dollar Baby? You know what? I've never seen Million Dollar Baby. Oh, it's don't watch it. It's really that's what I've always heard. Okay. Extremely sad. But one of the you know plot points toward the end is like her family is trash and they are awful to her, and she's like paralyzed from boxing. Yep. And they just want her money and they just want what she has to offer them. Like they show up to like help, but they like go on a Disney trip, and then they're like having her sign away rights to things with her mouth because she can't. It's just like it is giving that. Like, it's just I can't that this is part of the reason I stopped watching this show. But so anyway, so all this footage drops, and it is awful to watch. I will say, I was like, oh my god, this is very disturbing. Like, she is launching these chairs. She could have like killed Dakota, she could have like killed a child, like it was so bad. Um, and like, don't ever make me feel bad for a man. Like, I don't ever want to feel bad for a man.
SPEAKER_04Certainly not Dakota, certainly not him.
SPEAKER_05And I watched this footage and I was like, they're gonna cancel her season. Like, they will not be able to move forward after this. This is so bad.
SPEAKER_04She like says it out loud, and then literally again, Pod Daddy, who I guess should pay attention to his kids and wife on vacation, screams from across the pool, they canceled that lady's season of The Bachelor.
SPEAKER_05And I screamed, I was like, I called it. But yeah, Pod Daddy was like on it with the current events. So now it has just been an absolute thunderstorm. Yep. And I just want to say, like, there's so much to be said about this, and I have so many feelings, and I want to talk about this in the right way because it is a very delicate topic. Like when we're talking about domestic violence, when we're talking about kids being involved, especially in like truly at the end of the day, the the biggest victims here are the children, and like my heart goes out to them for whatever they've witnessed, whatever they can have continued to witness and like seen. It is so awful and traumatic. However, I do just want to say the swiftness with which she has been cancelled and taken down and judged and like put to task, taken to task. Like, would we ever see that with a man?
SPEAKER_04We have yet to see it with a man.
SPEAKER_05Because I made a list in our notes because I was like, I don't want to forget like Brad Pitt, great fucking career.
SPEAKER_04It is well documented. There is not a video sent to TMZ, but there is well documented that he choked one of his children, that he poured a glass of red wine on one of his children. And we are giving him Oscars. We are giving him we are giving him millions and millions of dollars to star in in features. We're shipping him with Jennifer Anderson.
SPEAKER_05Oh my god, where we started on that.
SPEAKER_04Look at how hot he looks in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, which he did look fucking hot.
SPEAKER_05But he's fucking gross.
SPEAKER_04But like just we can live in this world where we do not condone what she is doing, but we can also live in this world that the double standard is painful to witness.
SPEAKER_05Like when we look at Colton Underwood, who recently who's been, you know, he's given this like redemption tour by Peacock and Bravo. Yep, Sean Penn just won an Oscar. I haven't forgotten what he did to Madonna, but everybody fucking else has. I also just want to be really clear that like domestic violence, like is okay, so so many times it's like people want like a very black and white situation. Yep. And and that's what our brains like. We like to put things in neat little boxes, and domestic violence is not neat, and it it doesn't make sense a lot of times to people who don't understand the dynamics of it and what it can actually look like. And that, you know, Dakota is probably very much abusive. Like, I'm not gonna sit here and pretend like I know the ins and outs of their relationship, but just because we didn't get a video of him like hitting her or being crazy with her does not mean that those things aren't happening.
SPEAKER_04I saw him be emotionally abusive in season two of that.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, and I didn't watch any of it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04I mean, and that's why I stopped.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, totally. And I for sure, like, for sure. So it's like this word is overused, but this is an incredibly toxic relationship.
SPEAKER_04To wrap things up, I I'm gonna go back for one thing. Everyone should read Q the Sun. I'm gonna say it again, um, by Emily Nesbaum. It's about the invention of reality television, and it talks about how reality is always going to be a medium that exploits people.
SPEAKER_05A hundred percent.
SPEAKER_04And we have to, and a lot of the times it exploits the most vulnerable, which is another reason why Real Housewives works because these women are not vulnerable. They are have a have a very strong proximity to power.
SPEAKER_05And I will just say. Like when it gets when there are because there have been housewives like uh Kim Richards, who was like an active addiction on the show that wasn't fun to watch. No, you know, um, with uh Taylor in Beverly Hills, also, who there was domestic violence like going on, and that was also terrible to watch. It's like get these people off our screen. Yes, this isn't fun anymore.
SPEAKER_04And I think that about pretty much this entire franchise.
SPEAKER_05I totally agree.
SPEAKER_04And I think this is an opportunity for us to look and see maybe this isn't good. But of course it was announced that they're getting there's gonna be a spin-off.
SPEAKER_05There's gonna be a spin-off, and I just am like, who, why, who asked for this? Like, why? And sadly, I do think that this situation is probably gonna increase viewership.
SPEAKER_04I and we can talk about this like off mic, but like whether I want to give this oxygen anymore. This is on our podcast. Yeah, this is like a death gasp for me.
SPEAKER_05I don't we typically don't really talk about it. No, and because like we don't watch it, and again, like I agree. So, you know, this may be the last we're talking about it because it's just not in the space of like fun stuff we like to talk about.
SPEAKER_04Because even though we talk about shit and we it we are not perfect, I definitely think there there are lines that are crossed when it comes to exploitation, and I think that we're crossing them.
Summer House Recap: Make Ups and Make Outs
SPEAKER_05And I'm not like I don't think like even before before this all happened, and it kind of became undeniable that we needed to talk about it, and there was all this stuff going on with like they stopped filming. Like, I we weren't posting about it to our Instagram because it's like this isn't entertainment for us, like no, we don't find this shit entertaining. No, so but now it's to a point where it's like, oh my god, the bachelorette's canceled, and so there is like a lot more tied in that I think it's worth us talking about and trying to be like as delicate as we possibly can and like respectful. But it's like I want to be really clear that like I'm not like foaming at the mouth, like this is so funny and crazy, and like this is like sad, and these there's children involved, and it like makes me so sick for them. Yeah, so yeah, I'm kind of with you. I love it. All right, well, we need to wrap that up. That's we've we've talked about it way too much already, and we gotta talk about Summer House, maybe.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, let's talk about lighter stuff.
SPEAKER_05Because we had another we were served up another delicious episode. We got to watch this one together. It was you guys because we did a little staycation together. Um, and we made our husbands take care of our children for the morning. Um, and I scampered on over to Emily's room and we had our coffee and we sat up and we watched it together, and it was truly a delight.
SPEAKER_04I like texted her, I was like, You can't watch Summer House because we're gonna watch it together.
SPEAKER_05It was so hard. She was like, I'm bringing my laptop. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Be like, popped up, open the laptop. She had no idea.
SPEAKER_05I was like literally about to make a cup of coffee and watch it myself. And I was like, damn, I love you. Which speaking of shout-out to Pete, I also use his Peacock. Pete, I don't want to watch commercials anymore. Pete, what the hell? I logged into my Peacock account because she was like talking about all these T-Mobile ads, and I was like, bitch, I don't watch those money. I'm a premium subscriber. So Pete, I think you make a lot more money than me.
SPEAKER_04I need an upgrade, please.
SPEAKER_05What are we doing? My God, Peacock Daddy. No, it was such a good episode as all of the episodes have been this season.
SPEAKER_04It was so a good okay. So we start with a little spin the bottle, which was so funny. I love this cast. Um, where we see Ben and Bailey kissing makeup literally. Like a full-blown with tongues, makeup with a hand delicately on his like structured jaw.
SPEAKER_05When she put his hand on the jaw, I was like romantic. That's intimate. Oh my goodness. I'm gonna leave the room.
SPEAKER_04Um, so uh it is funny though, we also had like a Justice for Bailey moment. If you remember, like Bailey, Ben crucified her because she made a joke about uh Ben wanting to sleep with Amanda. And so in the spin the bottle game, someone was like, Well, the married couples don't count. And then of course, Ben's immediate, like, nar. Um, and then Jesse.
SPEAKER_05Like, no, the married, no, same rules for everybody.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. And then Jesse goes, how convenient. Ben wants to kiss the married people again. And everybody fucking left.
SPEAKER_05The fucking room goes wild.
SPEAKER_04Everyone thought he was the funniest fucking thing they've ever heard that Ben wants to kiss married people. What are we doing?
SPEAKER_05What are we? I mean, I am so triggered as a funny woman, like who has not been in a situation where you just fucking know that if a man made the same joke you did, it would have been received totally different.
SPEAKER_04And we witnessed it literally in real time.
SPEAKER_05My husband knows this is my biggest fucking pet. Don't ever say this to me. Don't ever say you're funny for a girl. I will fucking kill you.
SPEAKER_04That was one of the things I clacked in this episode when they were talking about Amanda. Amanda, I know you're such a funny girl.
SPEAKER_05Such a funny girl. We gotta qualify it.
SPEAKER_04Honey, I'm a funny person.
SPEAKER_05No, I'm a funny fucking person.
SPEAKER_04I don't think I know a single man who's funnier than me.
SPEAKER_05I know. I'm definitely funnier than a man. Listen, I just like I can't stand this shit. And it was on full display. So justice for Bailey. So we did get uh Ben kind of apologizing to Bailey. It was like, I didn't love it. Like he went up there after the spin the bottle.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05And they were kind of, he was like, Are you okay? kind of like checking in, but it and then he did a he's like, I don't want you to be upset, kind of situation. And then he did say, like, all right, I'm sorry, and they like hugged and it was all good. But like, I just didn't feel like he was sorry enough. Or like he, I felt like it was kind of like sorry I made you cry.
SPEAKER_04It was very much like him like sitting next to her during the spin the bottle and like acting all cute and charming, and it's like, no, we're not gonna play this game. No, like you need to apologize, correct? Which he eventually did, but it was it was very stop and go for a while on whether I was going to like Ben again. Yeah. Um, because like I'm not gonna do like cute boy fake accountability.
SPEAKER_05No, it's jury's out. Like, I he lost me, he really lost me with the like going after Bailey the way that he did, and then like I didn't love the apology that just didn't feel like he took accountability. No, like at all. So, like, I'm not he didn't win me back by any means.
SPEAKER_04I mean, I think he probably won me back because I want to like him because he is so cute, but who knows? I think he's like that. Who knows?
SPEAKER_05He's in he's on probation, he's definitely on probation. Okay, so then we have a Carl and Bailey date back in the city.
SPEAKER_04Yep.
SPEAKER_05Which was very cute. And I'm like, are you shipping them? What do you think? He's so much older than her.
SPEAKER_04I'm not shipping them for that exact reason.
SPEAKER_05Totally fair.
SPEAKER_04I and I just don't I've never bought any relationship Carl has been in since like day fucking one. It always seems like it's always giving, like, yeah, that chick is so hot. Like, it's always so forced. And I'm feeling the same way about this, this, this Bailey relationship.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. I I think they're really cute as friends. I enjoy seeing Carl make a good connection with somebody. I feel like Bailey needs it right now. Like she needs, like, I don't know, like a daddy. An OG ally.
SPEAKER_04She needs an ally with the OGs. She hasn't had that yet.
SPEAKER_05Totally. But then it comes to light, like at a group dinner, like Lindsay and Bailey got together, and basically Lindsay was like, Yeah, you should go for it. Like, go out with Carl, but he's probably not gonna have sex with you.
SPEAKER_04It's just so like the Lindsay and Carl of it, like they are getting closer, but it is still like prickly, I would say.
SPEAKER_05She's definitely prickly with him.
SPEAKER_04And I don't, and it doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be anything else, but it is so funny how they are like guiding or maneuvering this relationship where they have to like work together and they have this like really torrid history.
SPEAKER_05But we are reaching a tipping point with Lindsay where I personally do not have much more patience for her treatment of Carl. Okay, I feel like you have gotten your pound of flesh, and it's time to go with Grace, which Lindsay Hubbard will never do.
SPEAKER_04I mean, never. Grace and Lindsay should never be in the same sentence.
SPEAKER_05And that's why she's a great reality star, and we love her. And Emily like had to remind me, she was like, he humiliated the fuck out of her. Like he called off an engagement. Like Lindsay would rather have gone through with the wedding and gotten divorced three days later than have like the humiliation. But at the same time, I'm like, we also have to remember how bad a shape their relationship was in. Yeah, it was abusive. Actually, insane that they were ever engaged. Like it was just actually insane. But like, I'm kind of it's kind of like how we've gotten with West and Sierra. It's like, okay, enough is enough. And like that's obviously a much smaller situation than Carl and Lindsay. But like, I'm ready for her to just sort of like let it go a little bit. I totally agree. Loosen the fist around, like, get your foot off Carl's neck.
SPEAKER_04And I think she gets close, because I'm always gonna defend Lindsay. Like, I think she always gets better close, but then when like someone comes up to her and has and is like, Can I date Carl? Like, she's not gonna be like, get it, girl. Like she's gonna throw her dig. When it gets brought up, which I think is she has to get her licks in. Because everyone wants her to be like best friends with Carl. I feel like everybody wants her and Carl to be good, and she's just over here being like, We are never going to be good. Yeah. Like, if you're gonna ask me about it, I'm gonna be a bitch. I'm gonna try really hard not to be a bitch, but I'm gonna be a bitch.
SPEAKER_05I guess I'm just like, Lindsay, you've gotten everything you ever wanted.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_05So, like, can't you afford to be gracious in this situation at this point? It's been years now.
SPEAKER_04I just think she just wanted Carl. Like, I just think she's gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_05I know she wanted to be related to Carl. I think now I do always think she was in love with Carl. Yes, I just like gave in. Yes, a hundred. I got sober and I wanted to like settle down in the yeah, I know totally, totally, totally. What else happened in this episode?
SPEAKER_04We got to witness a really, I would say, sensitive and impactful conversation about race, which was the first time we've ever talked anything about that on Summer House.
SPEAKER_05There was one episode where they talked about it like years ago with like Sierra and Maya. I want to say maybe Danielle. Okay, but it was not like this. They were all at dinner and Sierra and West kind of talking about their relationship. It was basically like West realizing how much he like dogged Sierra and like that he was such an asshole for like going talking to the press, and like he was just like, I maybe it was Jesse and Lexi, where he was like, I realized like how detrimental that was, and I'm really sorry, which was like a really sincere apology. Definitely, and Sierra was like, I just think there's an aspect of this that people do not understand, which is that like it is this was an interracial relationship, and I got so much hate as a black woman, like being with a white man, like how could you let a white man treat you that way? And I was like, Oh my god, I never even thought about that. Like, that's it. Sitting in our privilege, totally, and I like looked at Emily and I was like, Wow, that wasn't even something I like thought about.
SPEAKER_04I literally like as soon as she said I would like to, okay, and then what preceded was like five solid minutes, seven solid minutes of like uninterrupted conversation of what it is like to exist as a black person in these spaces.
SPEAKER_05Um, you know, the pressure, like KJ was like it's so it's so fucked up that she felt that way. He's like, I have sisters and I know how they have to operate in this world, and like he just like he was like so emotional. Yeah, and he was like, even for me, like I'm the first black guy on Summer House, which is so banana. And he was like, I just keep saying to myself, like, don't fuck this up, don't fuck this up. Like the pressure to be a black person for the first time or anytime, I'm sure, like in these like predominantly white spaces, and how you're gonna be perceived because you know that like what so many people will use you as a representation for an entire race, and that's so fucked up.
SPEAKER_04He used this this um this example of like staying 20 steps ahead and like not ever appearing like really angry.
SPEAKER_05Yep.
SPEAKER_04And I thought it was so profound how Kyle was like, I am allowed to lose my shit on national television all the time, and I never once have to think 20 steps ahead. Totally. I don't think we should like be giving Kyle like a medal for admitting that, but I do believe it's really powerful to see a white guy so clearly say, like, it is different between like we I am up, I live, I have to the standards are different between totally.
SPEAKER_05There was somebody, a creator on TikTok who was like, Kyle, Kyle Cook, shitty husband, good ally. And I was like, that's true. He is a complex character. I know he really is. But then we also saw like Maya talking too about how she was like, yeah, KJ, like my brother, like all my brother had to have that conversation that every young black man has to have, like my parents had to have, that I'm sure like you your parents had to have with you of like don't appear too angry and always be nice, don't appear threatening, even though like you are the furthest thing from that.
SPEAKER_04I mean, Sarah has to like carry the like reputation of all black women on her shoulders when she goes and like makes a fool with West, and it's bullshit.
SPEAKER_05It's like she can't just like have had a shitty relationship where a guy like treated her like shit. There's just there's a racial aspect to it that like me as a white woman and a white viewer of this show I didn't even consider.
SPEAKER_04So that was really well done. I thought it was really important. It's another great aspect of this season. And then moving forward, we get our mid-season trailer. It looks crazy. Which connecting segue two, it does look like West is going to make a fool of her again.
SPEAKER_05I know, I know. It looks like, I mean, there's like this scene of them like dancing slash grinding. Grinding. Grinding that I was like, I watched this trailer like eight times, and every time I was like, I don't want to watch this part. Um, and then there it's so hard the way they chop these things together. Like sometimes you can just like they franken edit this stuff to make it like so salacious, but then it looks like there's a scene where it's like, I don't know, like something happens and she sees it like let's say he like kissed a girl, and then she gets really upset, and Amanda's like, what the fuck were you thinking? And he's like, I don't know. Like, so we will see what the truth what really happens.
SPEAKER_04The trailer is like leading us to believe. So there is this in another another um scene in this trailer, Amanda says, Uh, Ben did try to fuck me in Italy. But it is said in such a way that it it does sound like it could be spliced together. Like a wild line. She could literally say Ben wasn't trying to fuck me in Italy, and they just like removed the wasn't. Or like Kyle gets mad at me about something ridiculous like Ben trying to fuck me in Italy. Like it but if that's like said as is, that is that's huge.
SPEAKER_05If that's said as is, like I'm gonna start writing Ben hate mail after what he did to my girl Bailey. If that is if Amanda says that, like it's on. Like I'm going to USPS, I'm buying postage, he's getting hate mail from me. We also see this conversation between Amanda and the girls, and they're clear they did some type of like old lady party. And so it's so funny because they're all like they're having this very serious conversation and looking like golden girls. It's so funny.
SPEAKER_04It's like, so there is obviously going to be two like very serious conversations about Amanda leaving Kyle. One, she is dressed like a snowball, and one, she's dressed like an old lady. The ridiculousness, delicious, yum, yum, yum. I love it.
SPEAKER_05No one's doing it like this show. And I think we get this that conversation this episode because the preview for this episode, they were dressed like the old ladies. Oh no, no, the old ladies. So either we're gonna get it like very much at the tail end, and then it'll be a to be continued, and it'll pick back up at that. But like that, that is going to be in the works. And did you see how on um Andy's podcast Andy Cohen said that this episode that we're probably both gonna immediately watch? Wait, no, it airs tonight.
SPEAKER_04It airs tonight's. Because we're recording on a Tuesday. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05So the episode of Summer House that's on tonight, he said is Kyle's Kyle Cook's worst episode in 10 years. I am nervous. So I wonder if it's the fight with Carl.
SPEAKER_04For one thing, he should not be growing a mustache for several reasons. It's gonna be the Carl episode.
SPEAKER_05It's gotta be the Carl episode.
SPEAKER_04It's gonna be the one where he like says, like, I already know Carl was so sensitive.
SPEAKER_05And he's like, he seems to be as delicate as a China, China doll.
SPEAKER_04It seems to be extremely upset that he is being called out for not investing in soft bars.
SPEAKER_05Sucks to suck. I can't believe we're already at midseason.
SPEAKER_04I know. It's been it's going so fast. It's so good.
TV We’re Excited About
SPEAKER_05I don't want it to end. But then it'll be actually summer. Oh my god, is that gonna be immediately following? I think it's gonna be really soon. Yeah, I think it's gonna be really, really soon. And then we're gonna get the Valley premiering here soon. I think in April. I think the Real Housewives of Rhode Island is gonna premiere. Um, I mean, we've been watching Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. There's nothing to say. It's such a snoozer.
SPEAKER_04I mean, I so I caught up yesterday and I texted Lauren and I was like, I might stop watching it. Yeah, no, there's no the Rachel stuff is fabulous. Um, no one else is bringing anything. Amanda, we again we've talked about it. She's a really bad housewife.
SPEAKER_05So bad. Um, but there is good Bravo shows coming up. I think I'm gonna start watching Ladies of London.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that is looking really good.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_04It seems like that's what like the internet's talking about, too.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, and I'm wondering if a next gen NYC season two is gonna drop soon.
SPEAKER_04I will say this is not a Peacock podcast, but I've also uh on the non-reality, I just started watching The Fallen Rise of Reggie Dinkins. What's that on? It's on Peacock. It's actually on NBC, like it's straight up like it is a Tina Fe universe. So we it's Robert Carlock, but um Meredith Scardoni, uh so she wrote Girls Five Eva, she Okay, yeah, um the same people who did um Kimmy Schmidt. So it's like Tina Fe 30 Rock Extended Universe. If you are interested in any of those shows, it is a laugh riot. It's basically about it's Tracy Morgan, he's like an ex-NFL player. Okay, the jokes are ridiculous, and then Daniel Ratcliffe is his is shooting a documentary.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen clips of this.
SPEAKER_04It does seem okay. The first I've seen the first five episodes, they were like solid or first three episodes, and then this random episode, it really did seem like it was a regular episode, and then they like spliced Daniel Ratcliffe's scenes in. It was so bizarre.
SPEAKER_05Weird.
SPEAKER_04Um, but uh that was the first like uneven episode I've watched. The last three were solid laugh riot, cackling a minute.
SPEAKER_05Okay. Um I've been watching The Pit, which I know you're not watching. It is so, so, so, so good.
SPEAKER_04Is it is it because I know it's like I get nervous about shows like that where it's like they got so famous and now they have to keep up with the fame. How are they doing that?
SPEAKER_05I think it's really good. Perfect. Like this season is really, really good. Um, and and you know the format of it. It's like literally one shift. So it is like one day. And it is like kind of like 24. Um back when we had 24 episode seasons in the glory days of television.
SPEAKER_04My mom was late to pick me up from volleyball.
SPEAKER_05Every practice because of fucking 24. I don't, I can't even fault her for that. Let's show her in.
SPEAKER_04Can you imagine not having not having on-demand television?
SPEAKER_05It's a no, no, terrible. So it's like every hour of the episode is an hour of their shift, and it's a 12, I want to say a 13-hour shift or something. So it's a 13, which actually is so much more content than we're used to. I did not know that it was a 24 format. Intense. And it's crazy. Every single time I watch the episode when the credits come on, I'm like, what? Because there is no soft transition. It's literally like something happens and then it's roll credits. And then you and obviously it's so good you don't you don't even realize an hour went by.
SPEAKER_04Correct. Every single time. I'm shocked. Why? Because obviously I have internet brain rat. I do know about baby Jane Doe. Baby Jane Doe? So baby Jane Doe is uh ongoing. Very much so. Okay. Very much so.
SPEAKER_05We're still figuring out Baby Jane Doe. Um, but it's just so good. Emily and Jake don't like medical dramas. I understand, but I love it. I also shrinking season what is this for? Yes, I haven't started it.
SPEAKER_04So I've seen the first like couple episodes. It's good.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I think I might wait until it's all out um and then I'll watch it. Shrinking is such a good show if you're not watching it. And then we did get the hacks uh trailer. So fucking excited. I'm very glad it's their final season. Same. I was very relieved because if they were to keep going, it would jump the shark.
SPEAKER_04It has jumped the shark a little bit. I agree, but I think pull it back. Definitely. I think they will be able to pull it back. I have hope. So we I feel like we'll have to do like a whole segment on hacks and my opinions on hacks. I'm not gonna get into it right now. Yeah. Basically, hacks is hacks season one and two. Are my favorite television shows of all time. So good. So when it gets close, maybe next week we'll like do a half deep dive.
Love Story Recap
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, so we have lots of good TV. Love story is killing it. Are you caught up?
SPEAKER_04I am caught up. That last episode was tough. So the last episode that we watched when this aired, I think we'll still be in between those episodes. Yes. Is um we kind of see how because obviously it was no one knows for sure, but basically the dramatization of the downfall of their relationship. Yep. And how they do that is a bottle episode. And baby, I fucking love it.
SPEAKER_05They did a really, really good job of that. I want to see a stage play. I know. I know. It felt like it a little bit.
SPEAKER_03Half the time you're sleeping in the other room. I talk to you all the time. You're not interested in me. You don't solicit my advice. You're not fascinated by what I want to say. You're not curious about me. You talk to me just long enough to keep the peace just long enough to prevent more conversation. You used to be desperate to spend every single second with me, and now you treat our marriage like it's this layover between places they really want to be.
SPEAKER_04I I will Paul Anthony Kelly, right?
SPEAKER_03So good.
SPEAKER_04Can we just sit here? I cannot stop talking about his performance. I cannot stop talking about the fact that I literally Coles, fun thing, good play on Coles. Coles gave me a sponsored ad with him as the model on Sonoma goods shirts because that's the kind of work he was doing before being the star of the show. I will say maybe once or twice, I'm like, ooh, that line read was rough. But other than that, he has been spot fucking.
SPEAKER_05I think he's been so good. Emily Pigeon is amazing. She was amazing that Sarah Pigeon. Oh my god, Sarah Pigeon. Yes.
SPEAKER_04Um, someone was like, oh yeah, just give her the Emmy now from that. She was in that scene. Yes.
SPEAKER_05Oh my god, it was so good. So sad. I just felt like this whole episode, I was like, this is depression. This is what it feels like to be depressed and listless and sad and have no purpose.
SPEAKER_04And it really we see a really well-done fictionalized account where they are taking stories what they know and making dialogue between those two characters. Yeah. Where they're taking bits and pieces of what is known and creating a really interesting narrative. It's not like, and here's the part where we say this because that's what's known. Like and there is bits and pieces of that in this show. Of course. But this was not, it was just a really great take on what we know of or what could have happened.
SPEAKER_05And just like a marriage falling apart. Yep. And like how it's everybody's fault and nobody's fault. Yep. And there's just so many other forces outside of them too that are that are working against them. And it kind of reminded me of the movie The Breakup, where um such a low-key great movie. Such a low-key great movie, but like that scene, one of the like opening scenes, is this fight between Jennifer Aniston and Vince Vaughn, who were together in the movie. And it was like a very realistic couple fight. So much. Like you felt like I felt like my heart was beating fast. I was like so, and that's how this really felt of just like being in a relationship, and it's like you don't know how you're gonna move forward. Like, how are you gonna get to a better place? And everything feels like hopeless and sad. And they're obviously on a much larger scale. So it was just a really well done episode. And I'm getting sad though, because we're getting to the end and we know it's a very sad ending. I know. But did you know this series is gonna be an anthology? So they're gonna start faux. So next season, they're gonna have a second season, love story, and they're gonna focus, they're gonna have a different couple. Ooh, I can't wait. Yeah, so I'm really interested to see who they pick.
SPEAKER_04I wonder who it's gonna be.
SPEAKER_05I know, I know.
SPEAKER_04I mean, I would love these people to do Jackie and Oh shit.
SPEAKER_05John or or uh Onassus.
Our Current Reads
SPEAKER_04A little column A, a little column B. So that goes into what we're reading. I'm currently reading um the JFK Jr. An Intimate Oral Biography by Liz McNeil, who she's been doing a lot of press, and then this Rosemary Terenzio, which I had to look up, who like she is this little girl.
SPEAKER_05Because she worked for him at George. Yeah, she's in the show. She is? Yeah. There's a couple of names like Rosemary.
SPEAKER_04She's written like more than one book.
SPEAKER_05Like T.
SPEAKER_04And it definitely is. I'm not the hugest oral history people, like I want a narrative. Yeah. Um, so it's very much like I saw John one time and he was really nice to me. And then they're like, sometimes you get teachers who are like, he was the stupidest stupidest motherfucker I've ever seen in my whole life. He doesn't deserve anything. Um, so I'm loving it.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. So I am currently listening to, it was so funny because I texted Emily and I'm currently listening to Once Upon a Time.
SPEAKER_04Without even talking to each other.
SPEAKER_05And she's like, oh my god. So mine is Once Upon a Time, The Captivating Life of Carolyn Bissett Kennedy, and it's by Elizabeth Beller. And it is really good so far. We're gonna be fucking historians by the end of this. We were already like Kennedy people, and now this has just like reignited that flame within.
SPEAKER_04If you were curious if we have ADHD in O C D E. Um we can't just watch a television.
SPEAKER_05Like Emily says, column A, column B.
SPEAKER_04Why not?
SPEAKER_05Why not both? Okay. There's a pill for that. Um then I actually just started reading um The Vanishing Half by Britt Bennett, which I was in the biggest reading slump and it was really upsetting me. I DNF'd like four books in Q1. Yeah, we like talked about it. Like I talked to Emily about it. I was like, I'm having a crisis, and I identify as a reader, and I haven't even finished a book in this year, and that's very upsetting to me. So I forgot I thrifted this book like a year and a half ago. I love when you thrift a good book. Oh my god. And I went upstairs, I was like, do I still have that? And I grabbed it and I started reading it. Because as Emily pointed out, she's like, smut can't pull you out of a reading slump. And she's right, because I tried and it did not work. It can do a lot of things. It can't pull you out of reading. Pull you out of a reading slump? It cannot. I DNF'd. I went through, I cleaned up my Goodreads. So I'm like, because I am not a person who has like a big giant TBR. I'm very much like I finish a book and then I'm like, huh, what should I read next? And it's like sometimes I go and I like read if I like get really into an author and then I keep like reading titles by them. I love it. So it really just depends. So I'm listening to the Carolyn audiobook, and then I'm reading uh The Vanishing Half, which is very I'm like 200 pages in so far, and it's really good.
SPEAKER_04I just finished um The Irish Goodbye, which is on my TBR by Heather Amy O'Neill. It's uh a read with Jenna book pick. You cannot go wrong with like with Read with Jenna. She picks the best books. Um I am a liberal, but I am a Bush family girly. I mean, we do have soft spots for them. I mean, my God. Uh compared. Please so don't come for me. But uh so great for all my Midwest girlies, even though it is not set in the Midwest. It is, I'm gonna assume if you don't know a Catholic, you are a Catholic or have Catholic roots. Um it's it's just fabulous. Great family drama. My cousin, who uh shout out to Anne, we are in a book club and she recommended it to me. She's a librarian, so she reads like literally five books a day.
SPEAKER_05I love that so much.
SPEAKER_04Um, highly recommend.
SPEAKER_05Oh my gosh. Yeah. So I'm really enjoying getting my identity back as a reader. So that's been really fun.
SPEAKER_04I cannot wait.
SPEAKER_05I need to go on this journey with you. I know, it's feeling really good. So, anyway, all right. Do we have anything else we need to talk about?
SPEAKER_04No, I don't think I think we're good.
SPEAKER_05Well, thank you so much, everybody. I hope you have a great rest of your week wherever you are. I think like everyone's having crazy weather right now. Yeah. It's like heat waves, the up and down. So, like, God be with you and your sinuses, you know? And your furnace and your air conditioning. Oh my god. In tandem. My God, it's so crazy. The amount that I have to be invested in my Sensi app right now, it's just so ridiculous.
SPEAKER_04This is actually a good reflection of our friendship. All it is is pop culture. Our friends, which we will not be discussing, even though sometimes we do like help feed out for not having premium.
SPEAKER_05That's embarrassing for him.
SPEAKER_04And the weather and our signs. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05Thumbs it up. Three most important things. We're literally just recording our regular conversation.
SPEAKER_04Are there mics here? All right. Hi. I'm gonna leave that in. Oh my cough.