I'm court and I'm Jess. And this is Moms and Marks. Moms Uncensored. Hello. Hello everyone. Where's Nancy? Where's Nancy? Nancy, come home and that's the podcast. That's the end. That's it. That's all we, that's all we have to say. Where is Nancy? The end. That's it. Ah, but on a real note, it's been a week. It's been a week. I woke up thinking it was Friday. So. Is that tells you there's that, there's that. Well, it was a three day weekend, so I feel like that just screws up everything. I never know what day it is. I know. Yeah. Don't like that. Well, how was your week highs, lows? What's, well, first of all, we are during, oh, these are. Maple cinnamon, espresso martinis and um, my new favorite, they're so good. I do highly recommend if you make coffee at home. This is my go-to. Anytime we go camping, I bring like a jug of cold brew and then I do a little bit of maple cinnamon and a splash of whole milk. Mm-hmm. And just 'cause it's higher in protein. Yeah. And mix that up. Not a ton obviously. 'cause then the coffee color's wrong, but like, it's like my go-to and I was like, let's make an espresso martini. It's bomb. I said, because it's rainy here today. I said, it makes me feel like I wanna be curled up on the couch in a ball with this martini watching Halloween town. That's the vibe it's giving. And if you don't like that vibe. Stop listening now. You are not our people. No, no. Because we are gonna be insufferable once fall hits. Yeah. You won't wanna listen anymore. No. No. So enjoy it while you can. Enjoy it while you can. Yeah. Highs and lows. Um, my high, it was a three day weekend. My husband got a three day weekend. Can we just clap for that? Because that never happens. Um, it was fun. My sister was here, my nephew, my brother-in-law. We, um, had a barbecue with both families on Friday night, Saturday we went and got coffee, went to a little breakfast burrito, taco truck. Went to Home Depot. Went to V Taproom. Have you ever been to V Taproom? No. I've seen it, but I've never been there. Very good. Is it? Um, and then, you know what? The rest of the weekend we were. Oh, we went to sushi the next day. We did go to sushi happy hour. Um, and then we hung out at my in-laws. But like, we were pretty lazy the rest of the time, which is like rare for us. We can't do that. We feel guilty if we're being lazy, but we watched, um, like Disney movies with River 'cause we don't let him have a lot of screen time. Mm-hmm. But we did, Tyler got me this new, um, this like comfy oversized lounger lay chair and he mounted this gigantic TV for me in the room that like he plays video games and I watch TV at night. Yeah. Um, I've been watching Scandal. My niece got me on that. Great show. So it was just like a chill, it was like, yeah, it was, it was what, what was needed. That sounds so nice. Yeah. Wait, so you, you've never seen Tell me Lies, right? I have seen Tell me Lies, but I Am Behind. Okay. I everyone's like, have you watched a finale? Have you watched a finale? Everyone wants to talk about it. No. I am like, I think three episodes behind. Okay. I have not The Finale's Out. I have not seen it. Also, love Is Blind. Uh, love is Blind Out. Oh, my sister and my niece said they've been that, but they got me on Scandal. There's seven seasons. Oh no. Mm-hmm. And I am like, the first season I was like, I don't think I really like this. I kept telling Tyler, he is like, why do you keep turning it on? I'm like, I don't know. Something is drawing me back in. I don't know what. And now I'm like. Just stuck in, like, I can't wait for the end of the night where I can sit on the couch and watch. I'm not there. I'm not, I I, I don't think I have seven seasons in me. I'm well, and I'm watching too many shows. I'm watching. Tell me lies Traitors and love is blind. Now I have, well, I need to watch. Love is Blind. I need to catch up on Tell me Lies. I need to watch the last season of Landman. I need to catch up on Emily and Par. Yeah. I need to do all those things, but I'm thinking I will be done with Scandal and then I'll have all this other stuff lined up in the Okay. You know, that's, yeah. Like let everything get to its finale. Yeah. That way you can binge pretty much. Yeah. I do love doing that. Yeah. My low, you know what my low is? Um, I'm gonna get a little deep for once My low is, is that I'm really like the older that River gets, I want him to have a sibling so bad, like. So bad. I don't want them to be too spaced out. I come from a big family, which I'm obsessed with. We're all of a sex with each other. Um, I want him to have that. And let's be honest, I'm getting older, right? In the fertility world. Um, but I don't wanna do another transfer to just put it just, you know, like point blank period. I know that that's the only way that I'm gonna get to where I'm going, but it's like, I don't wanna do it. So how I'm at this like crossroads of like, okay, well if you want this, then you have to do this. Like, you tell, you have a fight with your toddler and you're like, well, if you wanna do that, you gotta do this. And they're just like, no, no, that's me right now. I'm having a tantrum about it because I can't get to where I wanna be without doing something I don't really don't wanna do. Did you know a dream of mine has always been to be a surrogate? Okay. I told my sister, can you just carry the baby for me? She's like, I will die. I have to age, I'll die. You know, she's 40. She's like, I gotta can't do it. But I was, you were talking and I was like, I'll carry your baby. Somebody carry my child for me and let me, um, you'd be good because. We've talked about surrogacy, and I'm like, I'm way too controlling. I would wanna know, are you putting fricking shit in your body? Are you sitting in a room with a smoker? Like, what are you doing? Yeah. I wasn't like a crazy pregnant person. Yeah. But there are things that I'm like, don't, like put yourself around certain stuff, you know what I mean? Your baby will listen to a lot of Post Malone. Okay. That's totally fine. And, uh, enjoy garlic. Yeah. Oh man, that's it. That's, that's the low, that's the, that's the low is, is if she was my surrogate. She'd be chewing garlic every day and my child would come out smelling like a little fucking vampire. It would, it would. Well, what is your high low Missy? Uh, my high is also the three day weekend. Uh, so my daughter spent part of the weekend at my parents. She wanted a long sleepover. Nice. Uh, and just have some grandparent time, um, which she had a blast. And, um, you know, we got to hang out. We went to Oso. It was just chill when she wasn't there. But then, uh, she came home. We had birthday parties to go to, and then on Monday it was just me and her. So we started, the day, we went out for breakfast, we, uh, split a plate of chicken and waffles. Her choice. Where did you guys go? Uh, biscuits always. Okay. Always. That's our, I hate breakfast, but I like hear of all these breakfast places. I wish I was a breakfast person. We love it. Well, she always wants biscuits and gravy. Um, so that's like, and she needs my mom's, gosh, my mom has a homemade recipe and the everyone dies over it. I have not had it, but everyone always requests that from her. It's her favorite food of all time. Okay. Biscuits and gravy. So, um, yeah, we went to breakfast and then we went to the park. We actually went to two parks. Uh, the first one wasn't cutting it for her, so she wanted to go to a second park. Isn't cool that, and yeah, it wasn't, well they used to have a zip line, bring her to ours. It has a zip line. Oh, okay. Wonderful. And then we went to a second one that didn't have a zip line, but apparently it was cooler. And then, um, we met up with my mom, and my mom took her birthday shopping. And I guess that leads me into my low, which kind of reminds me of yours. Uh, just in like, it has to do with our kids and getting older. Um, I don't wanna give her a sibling. It's, I'm not leading into that, but it's just, uh, I, I, I don't, I do not love that. Um, I don't, and, but no, it's just the fact that she's turning eight and it's so bittersweet. It's definitely not a low, it's such a blessing to watch her get older and to go Yeah. And like to see who she's becoming. But it's also, and I made a really sad TikTok about this today, but Oh no, she, it hit me because she, she said that she, she didn't want a character cake this year. Oh. Um, and she wanted just a plain Oreo cake. And I'm like, it's not even about the cake. It's like the. So many different activities are just like slipping away. Like yeah, we go to the children's museum, she said that she is, it's officially not fun for her anymore. Like the character or like the character cakes are gone. Like just so many things like where I'm like, I officially You didn't know that the last time was the last time. Yes. Like you didn't, and it just like hit me in my feels. Um, but mm-hmm. She's, she's such a great big kid. Yeah. Um, I definitely, you know, I miss every stage when it's over and I've loved every stage, but yeah, it, it hits me in the feels. It hits me in the feels. So, um, yeah, it's a low, it's a high, it's all the things. And, uh, I will try if I talk anymore about it. So you're gonna have an 8-year-old, I'm gonna have an 8-year-old. You're old. I'm gonna have an 8-year-old and a couple. And she keeps saying in a couple years she's gonna be 12, which is when she gets a phone for the first time. Oh no, I know. I mean, I'm only gonna have a 4-year-old. You're gonna have an 8-year-old. You're old. And I, I'm old. I'm still young and hip. When is your birthday? Have we talked about this? When my birthday is August 12th, I'm gonna be. Got it wrong. Why did I think it was in September? August? No, August 12th. August. I'm gonna be 33, so I am older than you. When's your birthday? May 1st. May 1st. You're gonna be 33 three's three. Mm-hmm. Okay. I'm gonna take her on a, um, I'm treating her, I'm gonna be her daddy and I'm gonna treat her. Mommy, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take my mommy to a little staycation. I am, I'm gonna take her to an overnight staycation. So DM us any of your recommendations if you have any of the best resorts in Arizona, but before we go to that resort. Devil Wears Prada two comes out on my birthday. Oh, okay. I wanna snap. So let's go like out to like, like the nice, like where like we eat and drink in the feeder. Oh yeah, yeah. And then we'll have like a staycation and we should record the whole, we should set thing up and record our whole, yeah. Why did I say, I was like, hang on, it's illegal to record the movie. No, not the movie. We're gonna lime wire this movie. Literally. I was like, wait, do you remember when we would watch and like someone would be in the theater? Yeah. Recording it. Like with a camcorder at that time. Bad, bad, bad. No. Someone would walk in front of it. We are going to record ourselves. Drinking heavily and reacting to the movie. Okay. It'll be your, um, what's it like? Critics of movies? What's that? We will be your movie critic. We, it's probably Yeah, exactly. Said the critic of movies. Yes, we're gonna do that. But, um, yes, we're totally doing that. We're gonna vlog the whole thing. I'm taking her on a overnight staycation. I wanted to take her to the princess, but it was like a thousand dollars a night. And I'm like, okay baby. Okay. Mommy, I don't wanna splurge a thousand dollars in another thousand dollars. Whatever we're doing, we got No, no, no. Yeah, no, no, no. Let's reel it in. Let's re it in. I'll take mommy somewhere nice. And we'll, we'll, we'll let y'all know what, and then for your birthday, we're going to Vegas. Oh, yes. Please, please, please, please, please. Vegas is my place. Um, I will disappear. Like, you know how some people, when they go somewhere in like a group on vacation, they have to stay with them the whole time or they have to be with a buddy? No. My, you're not disappearing. No. Stop it. My family has, like, my mom has threatened, we have to go, our Uber's here, we're gonna miss our flight. And if I'm on a slot and it's hot, I'll tell her I don't care. I will skip the flight and I'll catch the next one. I drive her crazy. I know you're listening while I'm so sorry. I'm putting an air tag Yeah. On you. Um, I am a full mama bear. Okay. Well you can watch me. Okay. Everyone'll be like, we're going to go to this place, or we're going up to bed and I'm like, I'm hot on this machine. Go ahead. Well, what if there's someone creepy or whatever? I'll fucking beat the shit out of them. Yeah. And I will help because I'll be glued. I will glute. I, yeah. Yeah. So that, you know, last time I went to Vegas was, um, my best friend's bachelorette. I actually was like a year, no. Yeah, it was a year before I got pregnant. No, it was like two months before I got pregnant. Oh my God. You haven't been since then? No. Oh, we're totally going. So, um, yeah, I mean, let's, oh, not again Cat, cat again. Okay. You are just haunting us now. Yes. Fat, decent crap. Go. I think she just wait. He, she. He's a boy. He, and you must call him the boy. Okay. He likes to hear, he just has gorgeous hair. Um, he likes to hear the intros and then he dips out. Yeah. Then he is like, I don't wanna listen to this. He's like, I don't wanna hear about IVF in pregnancy. Yeah. This is boring me. Well, yeah. So pre-pregnancy, I, I wanna talk about it. I wanna talk about, yeah. Not pre-pregnancy, but I wanna, I wanna talk about. Stepping into this motherhood journey. Yeah. Um, and what that looked like for each of us, because everyone's journey is so incredibly different. Yeah. And, um, yeah. So I know our journeys alone. Yeah. Were very, very different and, you know, conception, postpartum, everything. So, one thing that we've talked heavily about that I think I wanna dive into today is your journey. Yeah. Because, you know, and you talked a little bit about it, about, you know, not wanting to do a transfer. I wanna hear everything about your IVF journey and what that has looked like. Dun, dun, dun. I'm doing it. Dun, dun, dun. Um, man, I mean, well I think growing up you think. Everyone just gets pregnant and they have a baby and they live happily ever after. That was my like, vision of everything. Um, you spend your whole like teenage years or whatever, um, trying to not get pregnant. Um, and so when you go to finally try to get pregnant and you know you're trying for a while and you realize, Hmm, what's going on? Like, yeah. Isn't this supposed to be the easy part? Is it not getting pregnant? It's supposed to be the hard part. Um, so we tried for a while. Uh, honestly, we never really didn't like try, I guess you could say, but Tyler and I were together for about five years before we got engaged and the whole time that we were engaged, um, we, I. We're actively trying to get pregnant. Um, we just knew that's what that was in our plan. Yeah. Uh, we know that that's not the traditional, you know, you gotta get married, whatever it may be. But we knew we were getting married and we were like, you know, let's just, we wanna start our family. So we were trying and we were doing all the things. We were tracking ovulation, um, just all the stuff, right? Yeah. And for about a year we were like, uh, this isn't working the way it's traditionally supposed to. So we saw a total of six doctors Wow. That continuously said, ran tests, ran different things, and said, no, we're not, we're not finding a problem. So just keep trying. You just need to try harder. You just need to keep trying. And, um, another year passes and we're like. No, that's not, there's something, you know, your body right. And you know when things are not like happening the way that they're supposed to. And I'm sure it felt like screaming into a void. Yeah. You're like, I'm trying to advocate for myself. Like I, yeah, I know that something is not right. Something's not right. I know that, um, there, there's something missing here. Mm-hmm. Something's not working. Something's not adding up. I would see different doctors hoping for a different answer and I feel like everyone kind of just gave me the bare minimum. Honestly. They just kind of ran the general, uh, you know, oh, well this is fine. This is fine. Everything looks fine. You're good. So I just kept trusting my gut. And my aunt had a nurse friend, she's a nurse, and uh, she was like, oh, she works at Bloom Reproductive. They're like, one of the top IVF, uh, Dr. Bahara is on, you know, she's great. She's amazing. And I was like, oh, I've looked into that. But it's. A crazy wait time, so, um, yeah. You know, like six months something. Wow. Like that she's popular. Yeah. And so my aunt got me in and the second I met Dr. Bahara. And I will say, I went into it thinking, I don't need IVF and I don't. IVF was crazy to me. I felt like that was this crazy thing that people did, that rich people did. Mm-hmm. That was only, they just did that because they, they wanted to know, you know, if their kids had any type of disabilities or if they had a boy or a girl. I thought it was just this bougie thing that people did. And so I was like, I don't need IVFI just need you to figure out what, what's wrong going on with me. Yeah. And I went into it thinking she's very popular, so she's probably just gonna be someone who brushes me off. Mm-hmm. No, the second I met her, she was like, listen, we are going to find out what's going on. However many tests we have to run, whatever we have to do, we are going to find out what's wrong and we are going to come up with a plan. And that is my type of people love. I love a person that just reassures you and lets you know, like, hey, yeah, we're gonna figure it out. But also to be a popular doctor and like to have so many patients and to feel like you were her only patient every time. And I will say that even still to this day going through, um, I saw her for a year and a half. It didn't just happen, you know, it wasn't like I just went and saw her and everything. Just, you know, we had to do IUI, that's like the first step. Um, and after IUI, we ran more tests. Wait, and let's hear. So what is IUI. IUI is kinda what you do before IVF. It's kind of like a timed, um, kind of like a timed intercourse thing. Mm-hmm. They pretty much just measure all of your levels at all times. Okay. And they tell you, okay, this is at peak and this is at peak. Take this shot mm-hmm. Of like an extra hormone. And within this two hour frame you have to have intercourse. Yeah. It's like a time. Okay. Version of doing things where they're monitoring everything. Yeah. And, um, they're thinking, you know, that should, you know, some people just have a timing issue, you know, um, that didn't work. We tried that for about five months and she continued to run more tests and they were thorough. I mean, some of 'em I was put under and things. Wow. You know, and I remember Tyler thinking like, this is a little too much. Like what is the, you know, well, there was a point to it because come to find out, I had hidden PCOS, uh, I had cysts on my ovaries that were kind of hidden and kind of not like Yeah. You know, and I didn't have the general, like what you look for for PCOS. Right. And I had Googled before and previous doctors I saw, I had said, could PCOS be maybe what's going on with me? No, you're not overweight. That was just like the one, they would cut it off there. You're not overweight. Well come to find out. No, I was not overweight, but my insulin was always insane. Like my sugar levels were always insane. And anyone that knows me, especially my family that's listening, everyone makes fun of me. I am a die hard. I don't do processed sugar. I don't like processed carbs. I'm a very, I'm celiac. I've always been kind of crazy about eating. So for my sugars to be high, when I'm someone who literally does sugar free and gluten-free, do literally does gluten-free. Yeah, low carb, high protein doesn't do processed sugar and your sugar's high. That's a bad sign. Right? Because if I was eating regularly, I'd, I'd be diabetic. Yeah. So she found that all out and I finally had an answer, a reason, and that alone made me feel better. I felt like I was, um. Like I'm, why am I the problem? But you can't figure out like what the reason is, you know? Mm-hmm. If I'm the problem and you tell me what the problem is, yeah, I can fix it. I'm a fixer, but if you don't tell me then I don't know. Yeah. And Tyler got tested for everything and a little piece of me was hoping like, I hope something's up with him. It's him. I hope it's so, I hope it's not me. Right. Yeah. No. And all of his tests were all just spectacular. And I had a little envy, like, what the fuck? Mm-hmm. You know, like why? Yeah. Why is my body letting me down? Why are all these people having babies all around me? Yeah. Some that don't, um, to put it, frankly, don't deserve them. Don't, you know, deserve that right. To parent a child that they have no, no business, you know, being a mother or a father for, so I felt. Very defeated. Like, you know, the cards are against me. Yeah. And I think I'm just gonna lay down and take it as it is and take it as a sign from God that maybe he just thinks that I'm not cut out to be a mom. And that's really what I like, that's what I took from everything. So very isolating thing to go through, no matter how many people are telling you. Like, no, that's not it, it's not your fault. It's, you know, it's, it's biological, it's this or that. Um, everyone was very supportive, but it didn't matter what they said. It's those comments almost like, it's like you have earmuffs on and it's like, thank you for the support. But like, I also like every You're so numb. Yeah. You're so numb. Everything that you're saying doesn't, um, negate the fact that like, my body is not doing what it biologically was made to do. Yeah. So you're not gonna take that away. No one's gonna take that away. So, yeah, I mean, dark times, dark times. I think that's probably like the hardest, like when, when some, I mean, Tyler and I went through a lot of hard things. I will say that, and that's what kind of like navigated us through and made us realize like, we do wanna grow our family. We've been through so much. We like, you know, we want this together. But that, you know, being told like, Hey, you will never get pregnant on your own period. Yeah. Like that finality of that and that like certainty. Yeah. Was, and do you, so, so when you guys finally, so you guys did the IUI route and then, so IVF was on the table, so Yeah. Obviously you have an amazing partner to walk through this with. Yeah. Um, and but how was, how was that journey like? Was it cut and dry? Was it like, was there a lot that, like, tell me about that process. No, I mean, I felt like. I was fighting it, like I'm fighting the transfer now. Mm-hmm. I was, I it's like, yeah, you find out that you cannot conceive naturally and that you can't get pregnant on your own. Um, you try and can take control of anything else that you possibly can because you feel so outta control. Yeah. That it was like when she said, IVF is your only option. That is your only option. You will not get pregnant any other way. Mm-hmm. Um, yeah. There's God, there's whatever, maybe a miracle could happen, but like in the scientific world, you won't. Um, I fought it. I was like, no, no. You know, because I just felt like that was my only, the only control I had was like shutting it down. Yeah. I know that sounds petty and it sounds whatever. Um, but I know there's someone out there that's done that probably can relate to me right now. Um, so she's explaining the whole process and I'm thinking, okay, so everything I've seen, I have to do a thousand shots, a thousand, um, and I'm just gonna be shooting myself up all the time. And then a baby's gonna come. No, it's so much more. I mean, we had to meet with the IVF lawyer and do an hour phone call of, um, the rights to our embryos. Once they were born, we had to sign them over to somebody like, okay, if I pass away, am I signing 'em over to Tyler? Am I signing them over to my mom if both of us pass away? I mean, it was like a custody battle before a child's even. Like, and I was just like, whoa. Like this is like, mm-hmm. This is intense. And then they lay out, you know, here's what your, your medication, not only your medication, um. Your testing, you gotta come in every other day. We gotta monitor you. You gotta come in for these tests, this test you gotta come in for. You know, we need to clean your cervix. We need to, oh my God. All these things. I mean, like, make your head spin. Yeah. Right. And that's someone, did it make you question like, I'm sorry if this is like a blunt question, but like, did it make you question if this is like what you actually want? Yeah, I mean, I fought it. I fought it. I was like, I know I want a kid, but I don't wanna do it like this. This seems unnatural, this seems forced. Like, you know, and there's a lot of people out there that say IVF is not, um, you know, you shouldn't do that. You're, you're interfering with God's plan. There's religious people that say that, you know, and I, I let those things get into my mind thinking, you know, maybe they're right. Maybe God is showing me something and telling me, hey. This isn't the route for you. This isn't the plan for you. I don't plan for you to be a mother. Um, but again, I had to go with my gut and there was always something down there that was like, I, I could never not be a mom, so I have to do what I have to do. Like, yeah. And that's just in what, what do you wish you knew about IVF and about this journey before you stepped into it? I mean, everyone talks about the financial burden and there is a huge, um, I won't downplay that. It's extremely expensive, but more than that, I wish people would let me know how isolating and how emotional it was. There's totally a physical like toll that it takes on your body. A hundred percent. You're pumping yourself with, you know, five shots a day and pills and this and that, and you're tracking this and you're doing that. But more so than that, it's the mental emotional part that comes with all of that. Mm-hmm. You know, um. You have to build yourself up to swing and do those shots. Some of 'em suck ass. I'll throw that out there. There was some that like would burn so bad that I was like dreading doing them. Did you get the knots? I got knots. There's the ones you know that are in the top of your butt, the progesterone that feels like peanut butter shooting and you have to do it really slow and there's the chance that you do it in the wrong nerve and you're gonna get paralyzed. I mean, there's all the things you know, I actually, so. Thankfully, thankfully for TikTok, um, I, I learned a lot about IVF, um, through this obviously. Like, I want to know, I, I'm gonna ask these questions because there's so much, I don't know, and like, also like there's so much that's not talked about. Yeah. Which is why I really wanted to have this podcast today because like, I think so many people silently go through this and we talk, you know, they always say miscarriage is like a silent battle that a lot of people face, but I think IVF is a silent process that a lot of people go through that people don't talk about. So, um, I made a friend through TikTok, um, and I hope to have her on the podcast one day, but also and someone who's going through IVF. Yeah, she's actually about ready to have her daughter. Um, and actually she found out her daughter is missing an arm. Um, yeah. And, um, but her family and she's so funny. Yeah. Like she's, she's just, she's awesome. Yeah. I really, really wanna have her on one day, but she, so she went through IVF, but she documented the entire IVF process and I think I severely underestimated just the toll. Yeah. And like, the amount of, and I, this is something I wanna talk about too. So you have, you're, you're going through obviously, like you, you're under this guidance of your doctor. Yeah. Um, your IVF doctor, you have all these shots, like you have the security of everything, and then all of a sudden it feels like. At least it looked like from, from an outsider perspective, like you jump out of an airplane and your parachute hasn't Yeah. Come out yet. So like all of a sudden you're pregnant. You, it took, it was so much work to get pregnant, to get to this stage. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you're treated like a regular patient. Yeah. Um, what was that process like for you? Like, has it made you more of an anxious, like did it make you an anxious, I guess, pregnant mom and then, you know, just like once, like once River was born, like, were you, I, I know you're anxious. No, I know you're a naturally anxious person, but I wanna hear about that process. So like, okay. Like it stuck. It stuck. It stuck. Yeah. Um, honestly. I was blessed with the clinic that I was with. Yeah. Um, they stayed with me through my whole first trimester, which I had to continue to take medication. Um, and they knew me by then. They knew how, you know, I would come in there and be like, I'm not doing this shot in my butt. I could get paralyzed. I'm not doing it. And they're like, Courtney, you're doing it. You know, they all, I built this. I'm seeing them every other day. Um, I built this rapport with them. They were a huge support system. Um, after your transfer, you are supposed to come in 10 to 11 days later and get your blood work to find out if it stuck. Um, I had, and I, and I still to this day, had the most peace when I had my transfer and the days following, everyone says, that's the worst time for them. I was like, you would think I was high. I just, people would come over and they're like, are you nervous? And I'm like, I'm, I'm not. I feel so, I felt like I was on clouds and day four, right. You're supposed to wait till 11. Day four. I woke up in the middle of the night and I said. I'm taking a pregnancy test and if you're IVF, you know, you just have freaking pregnancy tests laying around everywhere. 'cause we're psycho. Um, my husband said, absolutely not my sisters. My mom said, no, no, no, no, no. They said, wait, don't do that. I don't care. I'm not listening to anybody. I do it faint little line. The next day's following darker, darker, darker. It's Thanksgiving. I'm like, guys, I'm pregnant. And they are all terrified. Yeah. They're like, Courtney, just wait. Yeah. You know, I'm calling my clinic. Get me in for an ultrasound. It's too soon. We won't be able to see anything. It's too soon. Relax. We told you not to do that. Get me in. They get me in a little heartbeat and a little stinked on that screen. Right. And I'm like, I knew it. You know? Yeah. Like, I already got the mom, I already got the mom instinct going on. Um, after that, once I saw it and knew it was there, panic. Like I did everything, all these things. I spent all this money, I went through all this emotional, physical, everything that I possibly could do. Everyone is so ecstatic because they know, you know, they've been waiting too. Mm-hmm. They've been like, you know, part of this whole thing and I was more worried like. I I, if this doesn't work out, if this doesn't stick, then like, I'm not just letting myself down. I have a whole crew invested in this. Yeah. And it felt like when you're doing a presentation at work and you're, I am gonna bomb this, or I'm gonna do well, you know, like, it just, it was terrifying to me. Now I have this toll of keeping this baby alive for 40 weeks. 40 weeks. And at that time I was only six weeks pregnant. I went in so early. So yeah, I was very scared. I had a very smooth pregnancy though. I like, I think God was like, here you go. Here's a knife. Yeah. I worked out every day. I never got nauseous. Um, literally the only thing that bothered me, I had restless legs when I slept in like sciatica, pain. That was, it didn't have any, anything. Yeah. Like smooth as can be, but I always had you asked if I was anxious or if I had, I always had that little handheld, um, ultrasound thing every night and there'd be a little sheer panic when it was like hard to find, you know? Yeah. You had too much water or whatever. Um, I think this is it. Yeah. I paid hundreds of dollars to go to a third party ultrasound place once a week in between appointments to just, I mean, every time I went I had to pay 50 bucks. Yeah. Just to make sure. Yeah. Um, and I didn't think it was crazy at the time, but looking back, we passed that place and I'm like, oh my God, I cannot, I was insane. Yeah. Um, uh, normal people don't do that. They wait till their appointment and they don't think that the worst is going to happen. Yeah. But that's what IVF puts in your head because. The worst is happening to you when you find out you can't conceive on your own. That that's terrible. So like you've already crossed that bridge. No. Like you've already, yeah. You're waiting for doom and loo. Mm-hmm. That's what IVF does. It just makes you just always think something's not gonna go right. Yeah. Because this whole thing is not right. Yeah. So, no, it was not. Um, I mean, it felt like the longest fricking chapter of my life, but I thought, this is it. Right? I'm gonna see his face and I. It's all gonna go away. Everything's fine. Yeah. But I was, I was, uh, I wasn't taken again. Right. Yeah. So I go in, I, I had worked out that day. My mother-in-law and my mom were setting up the nursery, and I go in for my regular blood work with IVF. You have to go in for, you know, you are considered high risk. Um, I had some high blood pressure things. Mm-hmm. But I incorporated it with the fact that like, I would still do caffeine sometimes. I wasn't like psycho about that. And I did work out. So I'm like, oh, it's just, you know, um, fat. But I go in for my regular blood work. I get it done all of a sudden. Um, they're putting me in a room at the hospital. They are. Bringing in like a nurse that's admitting me and I'm like, what's going on? I still have a month left in my pregnancy. Like, what's, what's happening? Um, and they're like, no, you, your blood pressure's through the roof. His heart rate is not what it needs to be. We are going to, um, have to induce like right now. And at the time, Tyler was in like a new job, um, like a work from home office position. So he was in the office at home working and my mom and my mother-in-law were in the nursery. I called them. I'm like, they're saying they're gonna induce me. I don't know what's going on. Don't tell Tyler till he gets off of work. Like, you know, he's still in his probational period. Um, and I don't even know if this is real at this point. It was, I spent. Freaking five days in labor. I was dilated. I was having contractions every, um, you know, couple minutes, but I wouldn't dilate any further than a three. His heart rate was dropping, mine was going through the roof. I had to pee in a bed pan. I couldn't get up. I was, I mean, everything was going wrong. Again, I'm like, you would think I went through all of this. I made it to this point. I, in my head, I'm like, I'm gonna have this smooth pregnancy. There's gonna be no ripping. I'm gonna push like four times. This baby's just gonna pop out. Like, yeah, everything's just, you know, God's got me. Yeah, this is gonna be smooth for everything that I put in here. Um, now it didn't happen that way. So, um, after five days of just brutal, I mean, everything they possibly could do, and I'm in so much pain. I didn't even feel the epidural I was in. I. They were putting balloon, I mean, just things that shouldn't happen to somebody's body. Um, they said, you know, I think we need to do an emergency C-section. His heart rate isn't coming up. And then at this point I'm thinking, I went through all this and I'm gonna lose it. Yeah. Like, I'm gonna lose him. They're worried about me. Am I gonna die? Yeah. Like everything was just up in the air. And um, it was in that moment that I was like, you know what, I, if I'm gonna be a mom, I have to be stronger than this. I have to believe that this is happening. And whatever God's reason is, this is how it's supposed to happen. And I never wanted a C-section, but we're doing this. Yeah. If it's right for him and it's right for me, let's go, let's go in there, let's do it. And I wasn't scared that, that sounds crazy because like right now thinking about a C-section, I'm like, oh my God. Yeah. But you're in cut through six layers of, but when you're hearing that your baby's heart rate, it doesn't matter. You're. Just the mom shield goes up and you're like, okay, get him out. Get him out. Yeah, and I'm in there. I start hyperventilating. I had the best anesthesia doctor who was calming me the whole time, calm down, you're fine. Cracking jokes. Trying to get me to not pay attention. I was not scared of being cut open. I was scared that he wasn't gonna come out crying. That was my fear. He's not gonna come out crying and all this. It's not gonna pan out the way that we wanted it to. Yeah. He comes out screaming at the top of his lungs and my whole body just, I mean. I could just like, it was like, yeah, a weight was just lifted off of me. I saw his little fricking face and I was like, okay, I did it. He's fine. We did it. We're here. We made it. Um, so not smooth sailing. Yeah. But he was there and, you know, we had to stay for like five more days after that. There was more issues, but it didn't matter. I was he was there, everything was good and it was all worth it. Amazing. Amazing. You're such a warrior. Like it's, I I don't, because there, there's so much trauma in the story that you just described and obviously like I know, um. I like, we're moms, we're relentless. Yeah. Like we, we literally warrior through so much, but like, take a minute and like acknowledge how much you did overcome and, and he's such a great kid. Yeah. Like, he's such a great rambunctious kid. And I, I, but I also totally understand like where you come from, like when you say like, you're afraid to cross that bridge again. Yeah. So, um, like is there any, uh, like, I don't know, like what, like what does this look like right now for you? Like it's. Yeah. I mean it looks like, honestly we were supposed to do this transfer like a year ago. Mm-hmm. If it were up to my husband and, and everyone else. Yeah. And, um, I always just kept pushing it like, Hey, I have this for work, or I have a lot going on. Yeah. I don't, I don't, you know, let's, let's push it after summer. I want one more summer on the river. Um, just a lot of excuses on my end. Yeah. When in reality it was just not me admitting like, I don't know that I'm mentally and emotionally ready to take it on. Yeah. Um, I know I can physically, 'cause I've already just been through all of it. Like the physical part doesn't seem. That big of a deal to me, honestly. But, um, you know, when you go through postpartum anxiety after something that's already traumatic and then you experience those lows of just feeling, you know, at the darkest part of your life, and I do attribute some of my postpartum anxiety to just all the hormones that were pumped through my body for those two years. Yeah, two and a half years. I mean, I still had to do it through my first trimester. Um. I think I was on a huge just hormone drop, um, after those two years. And I was just at the lowest, you know, I just wanted to push everyone away. I didn't know if I was capable of being a mom. Um, I didn't wanna be a wife. I didn't wanna be anything to anybody. And, um, it was really dark and I am terrified of ever feeling that way again. And it's a selfish thing. Yeah. 'cause I know that this, you know, I know I'm in a different place now. Um, we're going on, you know, river was gonna be four in July, so my last transfer was, you know, five years ago. And it's like, I'm different. I, I've been through a lot, I've experienced a lot. I know what to look, you know, look out for, I know what to like, prepare for, but there's still that little inkling that's just like, I. Don't wanna feel that way again. And I'm terrified that if we do another transfer and I go there again, that it's, it's just like, it's not just bad for me. Like my husband. Okay. So yes, it was a lot. Everything was a lot. Um. That's my fear going into a next transfer is just, um, I don't wanna be in that place again. I don't wanna put everyone around me, them watching me go through that. I know that was extremely hard for them. My husband was a saint and I just was constantly pushing him away, telling him to leave me. I just didn't want anyone to care about me so that I didn't have to feel anything for anyone else. Yeah, that was, and it doesn't make sense, but postpartum anxiety doesn't, and, um, it's not talked about enough, and that is my fear. I don't want to be that person or that version of myself again, but at the same time, I have to. Know that I'm in a different spot and in order to grow my family, unfortunately, but fortunately, I am blessed with this gift of science that allows me to create a baby when my body, um, you know, is fighting against me. But it, it's not, it's not an easy decision to make and I battle with it every day, but everyone has these different journeys, you know? Mm-hmm. Like for you, you didn't go through IVF, but like what, I've never asked you what your, um, experience was like. Were you planning getting pregnant? Did it take a while? Like, what was the version of yours? Yeah. And actually as you were talking, I realized, um, it's, it's kind of crazy that we came together because we have a lot of weird correlations. Yeah. In our story. So when I was younger, I was unexpectedly gaining a lot of weight and was having like different issues, um, with my body. And I realized, well, and after going to the doctor figuring out the pain was due to cysts and I had PCOS as well. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and then actually my PCOS led me to start a blog, um, because I started making different, healthier versions of certain recipes. Yeah. And cooking, low carb, high protein, low sugar, all the things, things that if you have PCOS, you know, that you should be eating Yeah. This certain way. Mm-hmm. And um, you know, like to help you like not only with weight gain, but also like your hormone function, your glucose levels, your insulin levels, like everything. Yeah. And. So also with PCOS, um, I unfortunately did experience a number of losses. Um, so, uh, I won't dive into those, uh, too much. But basically going into my current relationship, we, I'll never forget, we were on an off-road trip and, um, my partner at the time, well my partner now, my partner now my partner, uh, looked over at me and he was like, Hey, um, basically like I have been thinking and like, I want to have a baby. Yeah. And this was so outta left field. Like this is a man who always said like, I never wanna get married. I never wanna have kids. He still doesn't ever wanna get married, but he doesn't. Yeah. He's like, I don't wanna have kids. And you know, we were sitting there talking and we were like, okay. Um, and I was like, well, I just like need to let you know I have experienced loss. I have PCOS and I don't expect this to be an easy journey. Yeah. And, um, I went and got some blood work done because like I also, to be fair of like my current, you know, like of my spouse, I wanted to just like make sure I'm like, if he wants kids and I can't have kids, I need to have that conversation. Yeah. I know at this point we were together for about a year and a half. Yeah. Um, so I'm like, then like, we should probably call it, you should find someone who can have kids. Yeah. Give you what you want and, and go from there. So, um, fortunately enough, um, so basically I went to the doctor and they said. Your hormone levels basically are just like all over the place. Like your androgen. Yeah. Like this, you know, like your, um, estrogen. Like everything was just all outta whack. Yeah. And so I was like, I don't, I don't know. Like we, we can give it a go. Yeah. We can give it a go. And also, like my ovulation was never on, on target, nothing. Mm-hmm. So, um, very, by the grace of God, um, we were able to conceive. And pregnancy was wonderful. Yeah. It was, it was, it was a dream. It was absolutely, it was amazing. Um, at my daughter didn't wanna come. Uh, so at 41 weeks, in five days, oh my God. I finally was like, okay, we will get induced. If it were up to me, it would never be induced. Yeah. I think that the baby, it, it's so much less stress on the body if the baby just comes naturally. Okay. But at this point they were like, Hey, it's more danger than it's, so I go in and she still didn't wanna come. Yeah. So very, very similar. Uh, she did not want to come. We started with Pitocin. Oh, or no? No, we started with Cervidil and then we started with Pitocin. That baby got all the way up to 40 and I wasn't moving. They did the Foley bulb. Oh, the balloon. Okay. Can anybody that's done a Foley bulb got worst thing contraction? It got me to a five and I was like, I'm not doing, yeah, I was like, I'm not, I'm not doing an epi. I was so, I'm not doing an epidural and I'm in so much pain. So we got Pitocin going. We have the Foley bulb going, we have Cervidil and like we got everything. We have the whole nine yards. And I was like, if she's healthy and I'm fine. I'm not doing a C-section. Yeah. I'm not doing it. I was like, just keep it going. And like I was bouncing on a ball, I was keeping everything. I was like, get me out of this bed. Let me walk around. Yeah. Like, let me do, I just, I also wanted to eat chicken tender, so I'm like, if I'm in here, like do not give me an epidural 'cause then I can't eat. Yeah. So, mm-hmm. Um, I was trying everything. Yeah. And then it reached a point where obviously C-section after, so I was in, in labor for 49 hours. So very similar. I was in labor forever. And then they were like, listen, like you are not moving a muscle, like we're probably gonna have to do a C-section. And I was like, can you turn off everything and let me just sleep? And then I'll like think about it. Yeah. Like if he's healthy and I'm fine. Like can I just have like a minute? 'cause I also have not slept. Yeah. And. So they turn off the Pitocin and all of a sudden, and I'm at a five, uh, they turn off the Pitocin, they shut off the lights. Within 10 minutes I start insanely throwing up and I feel movement. Yeah. And I'm like, oh. And I will say, so actually right before they turn off everything, um, I, I was like feeling some type of way and I was like, also like, I really want to sleep and the contraction sucks, so I will cave and I will get an epidural. Yeah. The epidural only worked on half my body. Ooh. So, um, I was able to like move still and like they were like, oh yeah, I'll get to that in a minute. But like, I was able to be acrobatics. Um, so with an epidural not right. Yeah. Um, and yeah, so they turn off everything and I start throwing up a lot. A lot. And I start shaking uncontrollably and I'm like. I'm a mess. So I was like, call the doctor in here because like, something's not right. And I was like, can you check me again? And they were like, oh, you're outta a 10. Like baby's coming within 20 minutes of them turning off everything. Oh my God. So we call like wake up Taylor. Um, call my doctor. My doctor was sleeping. He had to come in, he had to go get a diet coke and like stuff, and I was like, I'm running it off this baby. Yeah. Like get your, I was not good at pushing. It took me three hours. Um, I was like pulling on a towel. Oh yeah. I was doing like the tug of war thing. I was doing like, move, this is where me moving around. They were like, all right, turn this way, turn this way, go this way. And thankfully I was able to do all the things, but she did come, she did have a fever though, so obviously there was a lot of pressure on her and me. So we stayed three extra days as well. Yeah. And um, yeah, no, it's. It was, it was a lot, obviously, you know, like I, I experienced loss before her and I think that contributed to, yeah, my anxiety as a new mom. Um, I always. Feel a lot of trauma and sadness that, like, I never remember her early baby days. Yeah. Like I almost get like, there's like a weird bitterness that I had for a while when people would talk about snuggling their newborn, and I was like, oh, I hated the newborn stage. Like, I, but like, I'm like, do I hate it? Because like I, she was crying and I didn't know why, or did I hate it? Because I was like, so like, what did I, like what, like, what's going on? Yeah. Like what? Like what did I do? Like I wanted this so bad and now like, I'm like so overwhelmed. Like mm-hmm. Why? Like, I, I just like, there were so many emotions. Yeah. And like there was so much going on and like, I almost felt ungrateful that like, I wish for this so much. Yeah. And I found myself getting irritated and stressed and like this schedule and that schedule and I was like, I wanted this so bad. Mm-hmm. And now I have it and I'm like irritated about it. And, um. I, I'm like, that's my best friend. Like, how do I, how, like how was I so up in arms about this? Um, and yeah, obviously I, I, I just don't think I can ever go through it again. Um, because I, I wasn't a good person during that time. Yeah. I took out my anger and my stress on everyone else and like, it was an all new low. But, um, you know, I, I, I would be lying if I said I didn't dream about having like, her having a sibling. Yeah. And, um, just experiencing pregnancy again. I loved being pregnant. So did I, I loved it. I know there's people that don't, but like, I felt beautiful. I felt so confident. Yeah. I loved feeling the little movement. Nice. But yeah, there's definitely that guilt that comes with after the baby's there. You're supposed to be so grateful and you are, but like, two things can exist, right? Like there can be. Gratefulness, but also just completely overwhelmed on the situation. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm terrified. Um, why are you crying so much? Why are you crying? Why was colicky so he just, Mila was colicky, threw up 500 times a day. Gosh. Didn't sleep, just cried all the time. And I just felt like, you know, Tyler would get off work at like 8:00 PM from the little office. He would take River and he would put like the oil diffuser and country music on. I would cry myself to sleep and then he would come in about 2:00 AM and that's when he would bring River and like, he'd bring him asleep. But then it was my turn and I remember hearing his footsteps on the wood floor and just waking up and crying again. Like, oh, it's my turn. Like I can't do this. I can't do it. I don't, he's gonna wake up crying like. When you hear the, the noise of it, please, please, please, please don't let this be and you love them. There's not like, if there's not this, like this deep, deep love, but it's just this overwhelming feeling of like, this is so permanent. I'm supposed to be just so happy right now, and I am feeling so loop. So, um, and nobody talks about that. So then you feel guilty for feeling that way. Right. No, I remember like when I was like going through the trenches around like the same time that other people were having kids, and I would go on social and I would see like the newborn bliss Oh, the newborn smell. And I was like, I, I feel so guilty that I don't feel any of that. Yeah. Like I, I just like, I love her. I love her, but I also am like, so like there's a, we're entering a whole new chapter and a whole new stage and it's like, yeah, you go from like. Sleeping and pregnant and like this whole thing, and then all of a sudden it's like, whew. Yeah. And life is like totally different. And like, I think people, it sounds really negative, so I think that's why people don't like to talk about it because it sounds like ungratefulness and like, you don't like kids and like, and like you don't like your child. And obviously like, I think anyone that knows us, like being a parent is my favorite thing in the entire world, obviously we're, we are long past the newborn stage and we are long past all of that. And, um, you do come out of the fourth trimester, I think you and your baby are both experiencing life in this stage for the first time. Yeah. And you guys are both overwhelmed. You guys are both experiencing a lot. Like there's so much and like it's okay to talk about it's okay to be uncomfortable. Yeah. And it's okay to talk about, um, that experience for everyone and, um, yeah, I think I just. I coming out of that was like a whole new world. Yeah. Um, I think I've said this a million times, but like once my daughter turned five months, I was like, okay, rad. I love every single stage of this. Yeah. But for those first couple months, I it, like I've trauma blocked it out unfortunately. And like that, that part makes me really sad. Um, I don't even remember Cuddling River. I know I tell Tyler, you know, he's like, oh, I loved, you know, he'd be snuggled up or this or that, and I'm like. I, I don't remember any of that. No. I, I feel like, um, I do say if I have another kid, like I have to, I, I pray to God that I can soak that all away. I wanna chair shift because I, in my mind, I didn't experience that. Yeah. Mine was the opposite. I, I, I couldn't wait for Tyler to take him and for me to cry myself to sleep. And you'd never want to admit that. But I can tell you right now, um, it's hard to give someone advice when they're, when they're going through postpartum anxiety or depression because. To me, your brain is not, um, it's not on the wavelength that it's supposed to be, to like, interpret, you know, these, this advice the way that you're not operating, right? Mm-hmm. Your whole operating brain system is totally off. So anything that's supposed to make sense when someone tells you it's not going to. But what I can say is if you are in the thick of it, um, just come out and say everything that you're feeling, no matter how guilty you feel from it, no matter how bad you think it'll feel, um, or how bad it'll sound to someone else. Like, I just remember pouring my heart to my mom and saying, you know, like, I'm in over my head. I don't think I can do this. I feel sad all the time. I feel all these things. Um, and then, you know, and why are you crying? Yeah. Go to the doctor. Go to the doctor, explain this to her. She was with you through this whole journey. Yeah. Explain it to her. She will understand. And I was terrified. I did. Everything started to change once I just, um, came clean with the way that I was feeling and didn't feel guilty about it. And that's like my best advice is just to like, feel all the feelings, but like be honest about them and tell them to somebody, like tell 'em somebody and, and not just your partner. So you have to remember if you, if you have a spouse that like goes back to work, they get a break. Yeah. And e yes, they are working, but like they, they get a minute out of the house. They get a drive to work. Yeah. They get, they get time at work, they get, they get these things. So when they come home that quality time, they're like, my baby, my wife, my all of you miss them. They miss them. They have a chance to miss them. Yeah. Um, and if you're home, you are figuring it all out. You are, you're doing the newborn appointments, you are doing the feeding schedule, you're dealing with the, you know. Cry for this, cry for that. You know, like whatever it is. And like, there's so many new things you don't time space on your plate, um, that all of a sudden you go from like not having to have it all figured out to, you need to have it all figured out. Yeah. And I remember like the first two weeks where I was like, this is cake. And then, but it was like month, it was month one through three where I was like following the leaps and I was like, what the hell is going on? Yeah. The leaps were insane. I'm like, please tell me when I open this app that it's gonna tell me he's in a leap. And he's crazy because I am going insane. Just the fact. But the first two weeks he came home, he was sleeping so well, I was taking him to lunch. I'm like, anybody wanna go to coffee, this or that? Then like every two hours after that he was awake, he was crying, he was spinning up, he was, everything went to shit. And I was so envious of Tyler 'cause he got a break. And then when he came back he was so refreshed and so loving and such a great dad to river. Yes. That I just was like, bitter. Screw you. Yeah. I was so envious. But like, it's. I was like, how are you so calm? Yeah. But I mean, there are those funny things to look back on. Yeah. You know, we do wanna lighten the mood. It's not all dark, it's not all crazy. Um, if you, if you are in the darkness though, like Yeah, we see you. We see you and yeah, we definitely don't see complaining podcast. But one thing I do kind of wanna touch on, and I guess just, I'll leave it out there too, if anyone has any questions either for the IVF process, but I was also an egg donor. You were? I was. Oh. So I was a two time egg donor. As well. So he has babies out there. So I got babies out there and I know that I got babies out there. Um, actually I You were a mummy. I was, I'm a mummy. Um, so yeah, so I, I did a lot of the medication, uh, different medications Yeah. Previously to like fertilize the eggs and process and, you know, to get them all grown and ready. Um, but I also dealt with all the hormones after those medications Yeah. And during those medications. And I just have to say, yeah, if you have any questions on egg donation as well. Yeah. Reach out. I would love to my doctors. And also, um, if you've. Are in a donor or dealing with hormones or issues with your body after. Yeah. Um, you may be, you, you, you may be, you may be entitled to compensation. Oh my god, no. Reach out to us. Also, if you're going through like an IBF journey, um, adoption, fostering, whatever it may be, we wanna hear from you. Yes. Because we want to expand that dialogue on our podcast and not just. You know, um, have people thinking it's just a traditional way that gets you pregnant. 'cause more and more, especially in our generation, um, it's less of the traditional way. Yeah. And more on, I I think we should change the non-traditional to traditional. Oh yeah. I mean, I think fertility, like women's fertility is down. Like, I mean, I won't go on a conspiracy, but like she's going, we want us women's fertility is, is, you know, highly impacted by foods and medications. Yeah. And things like that. So yeah. People are taking different routes. I would love to have someone on the podcast, um Yeah. You know, who has taken different routes and No. So we're going to go through some rapid fires. Um, just to kind of end this on a lighter, on a lighter little note here. Um, did you ever cry because the baby was too cute? Ooh, so I didn't, um, in the newborn stage, obviously you just heard my whole, my whole gig. But I will say like last night, um. Very hormonal right now. You know, the period ovulation stations going on. And he was sleeping, river was sleeping, and he and I had a really rough day with him. You know, he's, he is something else, but he was asleep and he had the most precious little face. And I did, I wanted to cry. I, and I looked at Tyler and I was like, Ugh, he's so perfect. I love him. I love him so much. And then when he wakes up, I'm like, God, damnit. Bobby. Bobby. Um, yeah. I mean, like if you, I cry a lot. I cried on the way here when I was making that TikTok. She was so excited to see me. She was crying. I was, I miss her so much. Yeah. No, I cry a lot just about her. I love her. Yeah. She just loved me so much. First fight with your husband after the baby. Ooh, ooh, ooh. Oh, ooh. I can't remember in particular, but I was just mean. Yeah. I, I think I was just mean, like, tensions are high. Mm-hmm. Jealousy that they, you know, he got a break. Yeah. And just, I'm like, this is on me. And then I, I went back to work two weeks after because I had a Oh my. Wow. Um, my job was a virtual. Yeah. And I just told them that I could come back because I thought I could work. And, uh, yeah. Take all your time off is the biggest thing I can recommend. Yeah. Take all your time. For real. Um, okay, so we already kind of talked about that, but let's talk about something you wish you could apologize to your partner for. Um, I think about this all the time because. I really put my husband through the ringer, and that's why I knew he was a, I always knew he was a, he was the one. But after that, seeing what I put him through and just how hard I tried to push him away and he just stuck through and not, never like, held it against me. He just was so just smooth, you know, way better than I would've been if I were him. And, um, I, I would tell him all the time, even still, I'm like, I'm so sorry that like, I, you know, I was like that and he will apologize to me. I'm so sorry that you had to go through all of that and I appreciate that you did all of that to get us. We have. So, um, your partner matters. I will say that, you know, like if you're going through postpartum or even just, just regular pregnancy hormones and, and the the fourth try, all the things, um, who you're with matters. If they don't understand you, if they don't want to try to understand you or be there for you, then you're gonna have a way rougher time than you, than you actually should. And it's already rough enough. Mm-hmm. I'm sorry to my partner for having to watch me poop on the table when I gave birth. Oh, you are one of those. I am, you know, I like to, I like to boast, you know, in my difficult to all my stuff. I technically have like a virgin birth, um, vagina. That's nothing came out of it. Oh my God. I mean, they pulled right back, but like you are, there you go. Your brother does have to see you full. No, my partner fledge just had to see me and he admits that he saw it and turned white. He just had to see six layers of me getting cut open. No, but my At least you didn't poop. My little girl is, she's, she's intact. She was never, nothing ever came out of her. So if I wanna brag, that's what I'm gonna brag about of that Virgin Mary over here. Okay. Weirdest thing your kid has eaten. Oh God. Um, actually, oh, you might have one for this. Mila is, she's, she's my little risk assessor and she doesn't eat anything without Really? Yeah. River. Um, I'm gonna talk about me instead. When I was a baby, I ate a caterpillar. I, that's disgusting. I. I used to eat my dog's pepperoni. Oh, that's not as bad as a caterpillar. I did like dog treats. Love my brother and I, we'd go to Petco with my mom and, you know, the like dog treat station where you could fit. Yes. The fancy one. We would go up and be just like eating, chomp 'em and eat them. Yeah. You ate a cat. What, what drove you to do that? Do you remember? Uh, we were in Blythe and at the time, like the sidewalks had a bunch of caterpillars and my mom had me just crawl it out there and Right. And she looked at me. I didn't, in half, I left, I left the bottom half to simmer. So, no, I didn't think the whole thing, but she, they still all talk about that. They think that's so funny. Um, river, I can't really think of anything. He picks a lot of shit off, but when he was a baby, he would pick a lot of stuff, probably his own throw up when he was colicky. Oh wow. He'd be like eating it off a little swing. Ugh. And then I'm just like, you are. You need the ick. Yeah. Feral little children. Yeah. Something. Oh gosh. I feel this is like one, I don't ever wanna give unsolicited, unsolicited advice, but I'm always, this one always makes me laugh. Something you swore you'd never do as a mom, but you do daily. Mm-hmm. Gosh, there's too many things. I mean, I do a lot of things that I said I would never do. Um, give in to them after I've like, I'm absolutely, you're not having that. No. Yeah. And then he's throwing a tantrum and I'm just like, my brain's fried. And I'm just like, all right. Here. I think the only things I've ever stood firm on is YouTube. She knows that YouTube's a no go unless, like it's Sheriff Labrador River watches. He's obsessed with Sheriff Labrador. I, well, I'm Sheriff Labrador. It's actually cute. It's, and it like, they, they learn a lot. Yeah. Like I, I actually could be going bring my mom. Like if you go in the street without your mom. You will get arrested by Sheriff Labrador. She also told me like, you can't have too many things plugged in. No, yeah. To my strip, because I'll start a house fire. I do let him watch that. Okay. He's only allowed 30 minutes of screen time a day. Yeah. But Sheriff Labrador is usually the sheriff lab tech. Yeah. Blippy Mika. Oh my God. Ika on Netflix. No, no, no, no, no, no. The most feral public meltdown. Oof. Um, oh, I think I talked about this on an earlier, her worst meltdown was on her camping trip. Oh yeah. In Colorado. She had Oreos and when she had, yeah, she had Oreos and some other stuff, but no, thankfully she was not too much of a meltdown kid. Um, river is a meltdown kid. He is definitely, um, would you call it like, okay, so is neurodivergent, does that mean that you're autistic? I'm not trying to get, I don't know the spectrum of it. I don't, yeah. My child is not autistic, but he definitely, neurologically he thinks differently. Yeah. Um, he processes emotion very deeply. Yeah. So things trigger him. He's very emotional. Um, yeah. He's, he, he doesn't regulate the same way we, we talked about karaoke. This is my karaoke song and Zombie by the cranberries. I have nineties music on there. Um, but he has a lot of meltdowns, if especially, he's not a napper, he doesn't sleep well, so he's always running on like not a good amount of sleep. And when he gets to that point. It's just like we're gonna go zero to a hundred and, um, and when you're trying to stand firm and not give in, you're gonna deal with some meltdown. So we've had He's also glued to you. Yeah. So like, if you're not emotionally available, I'm sure like it or even physically available, like I'm sure, yeah, it sent back drives him nuts. Um, he's gonna go to school soon, so I'm hoping that that helps. And when anyone else has him, they're like, he does not act like that. Yeah. He would not throw a fit over that. Um, when we go to the park, my mom's like, the way he's throwing a fit because we have to leave. He would never do that when, if you weren't here. So a lot of things are driven by mom. Um, I think they're always, they're always different around mom. Like that's where they feel the safest. Yeah. So I should be grateful. But yeah, lots of little, lots of little meltdowns there. What time do you mentally clock out? As soon as river freaking, as soon as he's asleep, my show's on, like, my show's on, I'm hitting my pen. I don't care. Weed's legal. I'm not a smoker, but I will hit my pen, um, some nights if I feel like it's just been a long day. Yeah. And my brain, my brain goes too much. When I hit one little hit of the pen, it just kinda like, lets me relax. I go get in my chair, I watch my show, and I just zone out on things that don't matter. No, I recently took up gardening. It's great. Okay. Yeah. I can't kill everything. No, like weed. Oh, oh. I was like, I can't garden. I will kill everything. No, no. They, they called that on TikTok, so I took it over. But I recently, I was like, anti weed. And then I was like, wait a little, a little baby hit of a pen. There's something wrong with it. Would you rather, you know, at the end of the night, just chug a fifth of vodka? Or would you hit a pen that just chills you out? Like, let's not, let's not judge here. This is a non-JD place. Um, snack you hide from your child. I do that a lot with certain things. She's too, oh yeah. I can't hide on anybody. It's getting to that point with River too. Yeah. I'll say, oh, it's just for big girls and he's just like, I don't care. Yeah, bitch. Give that shit to me right now. Except there is this trail mix at Safeway. It's by the brand overjoyed and it is a mint chocolate chip trail mix. And I personally love it but she doesn't and like that's a huge bonus that she finally doesn't like one of my snacks so she won't go in there. Okay. I like that. Have you ever eaten dinner standing over the sink? I do most nights. So after I make my cooking videos, that's what you do? I serve Taylor and Mila and then I usually end up finishing up filming and I kind of graze while I am. Yeah. Cleaning up. 'cause why not? What about you? Okay. Do you, do you sit down and eat with Pam? Yeah. Honestly, like on the nights that river goes to sleep at like 6, 6 30. 'cause he doesn't nap. Yeah. So sometimes he goes to sleep really early. Um, I will wait till he goes to sleep to eat just so I can eat in like, SI. But other nights we usually just sit like up at the bar or I'm just like picking at what he's eating. Not really, you know? Yeah. Like taking bites while I'm cooking and then I'm cleaning up the kitchen and like, yeah. But no, it's so rare that like I sit down and like, no, let me, that's a strange, okay, here's some this or that. Um, silence or white noise? White noise. Okay. I just recently got into white noise. Isn't it great? Yeah. Tyler doesn't like it. I, I kinda, I like it when it sounds like waves or something, or like. Thunder rain. Oh. I like, like, no, like a straight up static. Yeah, because like it, you tune it out after like five minutes. At first you're like, what is this? Yeah. I can tell you that I, it's probably like two minutes and I just cast out, which is not a normal thing for me. So it works. It works. Yeah. What else? We got shower alone or eight hours of sleep. Eight hours of sleep? Yeah. Eight hours of sleep. I, I couldn't tell you last time I showered alone. Really? No. You wanna know something weird? Tyler River night, we have a three, we have one of those gigantic showers and it has three shower heads. Yeah. It's got the rain in the middle and the SH two showers on the side with the bench. Yeah. We shower together a lot of nights. Not on a way. Yeah. We all are showering. Yeah. Um, but it's like he gets home and then I get home with river and we're all like, let's just go take a shower. Yeah. I do like to take a bath by myself with like a candle lit and some music going. Mm-hmm. But usually it comes with river running in and getting in with me. So that's fair. But I would take the sleep. See again, luckily we are at, we're at an age where we, we all get to show and peace. iPad or survival. Hmm. I'm so anti uh, survival. Yep. I'm against the iPad. Same on one of those. Remember, he used to have one and turned him into a freaking demon. He, like, it was, he was so controlling over it. Yeah. I thought he was just this, like, I will give him, um, this iPad that we use, like if we're on a trip and no one else is in the car, like if it's just him and I traveling, like we're gonna probably go to San Diego next week. And, um, I'll, I'll probably give it to him then, but never anywhere else. And, yeah, no, she gets, she gets her tablet out at the Dunes, um, only at night to like watch a movie or like, if we're all like, working on something. Yeah. And, um, but only movies that are pre downloaded on Netflix. And then in the car she'll call, like, I'll try to give her like a movie and then she's like, I get car sick. No thanks. Yeah. Like, okay. You're like, okay, you're on this. All right. Oh. Date night or bed by eight. This is my dilemma. Date night. I, I go to bed at eight every night. So yeah. I want a date night. Mm-hmm. I love a good date night. I like getting dressed up. Yeah. Tyler night, we didn't get dressed up. It was like a last minute date night, but we went to like a sushi happy hour on Sunday. Nice. And it was just one of those where we were just laughing and talking in a little buzz the whole time and it was just like good. Like we needed that. We needed that little like reconnection refresh. Like this is why I like you. Yeah. I do like you. Yeah. My friend, my pal France therapy or Margarita in your case. Espresso Martini. Marini Espresso Martini. How about I'm lucky And my espresso martini comes with a therapy session between you and I. I, right. So we actually get the best of both worlds guys. We actually leave this every single, single time and we're like. That was so nice. Yeah. We both needed that. Yeah, we did it. Um, okay, we're gonna answer a couple more. Who, no, I'm not gonna do that one. Who spirals more? You really wanna compare both of us. Oh my god. Yeah. I overthink everything. Mm-hmm. That goes with the, who's the stricter mom? Oof. I think you're probably way stricter than me. I'm extremely strict. Yeah. And I like to call myself strict, but let's be honest, when you have a three and a half year old, um, child, you can only be so strict. Yeah. Your child is in control somewhat still at that age. That, that's true. 'cause they are just not emotionally regulated or like thinking on the wavelength to ration and reason. Mm-hmm. So at some point you will not be the boss Yeah. In the equation. And you just have to. No. Yeah, I don't even, I'm very strict. Yeah. Unfortunately. I, I would like to let up the reins a little bit, but it's just not in my nature. So. Well, she'll be, she'll be better for it later. I hope so. I, or she'll go to therapy. Um, she in therapy, she'll be better. Yeah. Uh, let's see, who, who needs a break first? Courtney. Me. I need a break. I'm gonna take her on a staycation for her birthday. But it's really partially for me. For us, it's for us. It's for both of us. Yes. Every mom out there, you need a break. Okay. Yeah. The sooner you can like accept that, because when I was fresh into things, I thought like if you take a break, like you should feel like a quitter. You should feel weak. You should feel this. No, not anymore. No. Drop that kid off. Do whatever you're gonna do. You don't have to drop 'em off for a reason if you wanna drop 'em off just so you can shut your brain off and watch a show. You can do that, baby. I was, you know, I was just having this conversation and then I know this is like a long pod, so thanks for hanging out. Yeah. But I was just having this conversation with Taylor the other day and I was like, Hey, like you need time with your friends. Like you, you need to have that time, like that one-on-one time. I think it's like, it's good to step away and like Yeah, just have that quality time with people other than your family. Yeah. And like we get our kids forever. Yeah. A night away is fine. A night like a, a night with your friends is fine. Like you will be better for it. Yeah, you will, you will come back refreshed. Full cup and your kid needs a full cup. They don't need, they don't need a half, half-assed mom. Um, you know, who's running on fumes 24 7. They have, they want, they, they want the love, they want the support, they want all the things. And if you find yourself running low, recharge yourself because you'll be better for it. Your relationship will be better for it. Everything will be better for it. A hundred percent. That's a great note to end on. It's like, fill your freaking cup before you fill anybody else's or you're gonna be a shit mom. Shit parent shit. Like, shit, shit, shit, shit, shit, shit. And on that shit note, that's beautiful shit. Even less. Um, and dude, we have some fun stuff coming. We have some serious stuff coming. We will still have guests on. I know we had to take a little pause, you know, schedules, schedules to interfere and, but we, we got some stuff coming baby next week, is it moms after dark? Do I get to teach you guys if we're about the Mandela effect? If we're doing Moms after Dark, we're talking about Nancy. Dammit. Oh my God, where is Nancy? That's where is Nancy is freaking coming. And maybe by next week we will have more answers, but with this investigation I doubt it. Maybe I doubt it. I highly doubt it. So if, if Nancy's not found, it's the Mandel effect. Yeah. I don't even, and you guys, but I agree. I'm, it'll be about me teaching Courtney and talking about your jaw's gonna be on the floor, hearing about the Bandel lesson about it. It'll be fun though. It'll be fun. I love a conspiracy so much. So. Anyways, if you like to get a little woo woo, we will see you next week. Yes, we will. All right. We love you. Love you. Have a great week.