Episode 20: Charlotte Olerud; What We Owe The People Who Stay

One decision, one returned phone call, one job opening in a tiny Southeast Alaska town and a whole family history gets rerouted. I’m sitting down with my mom, Charlotte Olerud, to capture the stories people have been asking for for years: growing up between Fort St. John and rural Minnesota, learning to work early, and watching my grandpa keep going after losing an arm in a brutal construction accident. These are the kinds of details that don’t show up in official records, but they explain everything about how a family thinks, survives, and loves.

We follow the leap to Haines, Alaska in 1964, when “we’ll try it for nine months” turns into a lifetime. We talk about what small town Alaska used to feel like when freight arrived once a month, when catalogs mattered, and when community was the safety net. Mom shares what it was like teaching home economics and PE, helping start what became the Southeast Alaska State Fair, and then building a family business that grew into Alaska Sport Shop and Olerud's Market Center, plus the unexpected chapters like bringing Sears to town and stretching every dollar to keep it all afloat.

Then we get to the moments that changed us: a house fire that forced a reset, the economic shock after the sawmill shutdown, and the high-stakes gamble of the commemorative Winchester rifle tied to the American Bald Eagle Foundation. Finally, we talk about the hardest turn, my dad’s 1987 accident and what decades of care giving really require, from rehab limits to daily pain to rebuilding a life around new constraints. It’s also a conversation about what remains: baking, quilting, passing skills to kids and grandkids, finding purpose, and counting blessings.

If you connect with stories about resilience, care giving, entrepreneurship, and Haines Alaska community history, subscribe, share this with someone who needs it, and leave a review so more people can find the show. What family story do you wish you had recorded?

Transcript

Welcome And Listener Callouts

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hi, thanks for joining us for this episode of Doug HasQuesti. If you enjoyed today's conversation, please like, subscribe. We're available if you want to watch us on uh YouTube or if you just want to listen to the podcast version on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. And each episode goes live on Thursday morning. So I hope you enjoy this episode. Um, and we're happy to have you here listening. Welcome to this edition of Doug has questions. Today, my guest is somebody that I've been getting numerous requests for. Nobody else knows her as Charlotte Holman, but I know her as mom.

SPEAKER_00 0:37

Thank you, Douglas.

SPEAKER_03 0:38

Thanks for joining us, Mom. Thanks for agreeing to do this. I know you're hesitant a little bit at the beginning, and but I just thought, what the heck? What the heck? What the heck? Well, I I I hope I don't make it too tough for you.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Yep, I hope so too.

SPEAKER_03 0:54

Actually, we gotta wait, we gotta pause for just a second. I forgot to grab something. We'll just uh I've got my bot.

SPEAKER_05 1:05

Yeah.

unknown 1:06

Thank you.

Early Years In Canada

SPEAKER_03 1:08

There's there's a there's a high likelihood that we one or both of us might need those during during the time of this. Better be be prepared. Be prepared ahead of time. Man, you're starting right at the introduction. This could be this could be bad. This could be rough, mom. All right. Okay. So you let's let's you've been in Haynes for a long time, but let's let's start Barrett, Minnesota growing up.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

Well, actually, I spent the first three years of my life in Fort St. John, British Columbia. My dad was master mechanic, and they wouldn't he was rejected from the Army, but he wanted to participate, and so he came up to work on the Alcant Highway.

SPEAKER_03 1:50

So you you were born in Minnesota, then went to right away.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

I I think I was just a couple months old.

SPEAKER_03 1:56

When they got when they moved up to Fort St. John.

SPEAKER_00 1:58

Yeah, mother and dad said his best years of their life. Yeah, they had a wonderful time. We lived in oh, excuse me. Apparently, we lived in a tar paper shack. Dad would have to kick his boots free in the wintertime because it'd freeze to the floor. But um he would go hunting. He had a native guide from Trutch named Saint Pierre, and they'd go by horseback.

SPEAKER_03 2:19

And mother would pack sheep hunting or boots or caribou. Sheep and caribou.

SPEAKER_00 2:24

Yep. And uh mother would pack his food in glass jars, and then he'd come back with the jars filled with blueberries.

SPEAKER_03 2:32

That's a good trade. But just crazy for me thinking going out on horseback with glass jars. I know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:37

Well, they didn't have to have the plug bags, no.

SPEAKER_03 2:40

It's probably better because you don't have the microplastics and everything, but still, I would think I'd I'd have a very high tendency of breaking glass jars on horseback.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

Yeah, yeah. I don't know how well they must have packed it well with clothes around it or whatever. She didn't divulge those secrets to me.

SPEAKER_03 2:56

Do you have any memories of being there?

SPEAKER_00 2:59

I don't really have any memories, but um mother and dad made some really good friends. And of course, I hear stories, I heard a lot of stories from them. And one of the stories that always kind of tickled me was this one guy that worked in the shop, and he had this big hairy chest, he always had his shirt open, and it was kind of a bully. And so one time um he was being nasty to this guy, and the guy had had enough, and so he reached behind him into a barrel of uh metal shavings and just rubbed it into his chest. And that kind of calmed that guy down for a while.

SPEAKER_03 3:37

Didn't have any issues with him, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:38

Didn't have any issues with him anymore. Yeah, so if you're gonna be a bully, watch out what the other guy hasn't had.

SPEAKER_03 3:44

Keep your shirt buttoned up.

SPEAKER_00 3:45

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 3:47

Do I remember? I think you guys have told me this story that in the sports shop, dad always had under the glass counter, he had a bunch of pictures. And there's a picture of grandpa with his guide, Sam. Yep, and that a guy came in, he's like, that was that his grandfather or his uncle? His uncle. So if his uncle, he's like, That's my uncle.

SPEAKER_00 4:05

That's my uncle, and I said, and that's my dad. But he said, Saint Pierre, if he said there was an animal around the corner, there was an animal around the corner. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he said he was an excellent guide.

SPEAKER_03 4:17

Well, the old school guys that knew where everything was. And we did Grandpa have any remembrance? I mean, did he ever tell you did he get sheep? Was it caribou?

SPEAKER_00 4:27

Oh, we we came home with with a sheep head, and it always sat out in the garage.

SPEAKER_03 4:32

Grandma wouldn't let it in the mouse.

unknown 4:34

No.

SPEAKER_00 4:35

And as I remembered, it wasn't that great a one, but I mean, I don't know. I was so young that who cares, you know.

SPEAKER_03 4:42

There's kind of dead sheep in your garage.

SPEAKER_00 4:43

Yeah, dead sheep in my garage. And I don't know if it was when we came to Fort St. John or when we left, but there was no Peace River Bridge. And so Mother told about the the soldiers as we were in the boat pushing the ice flows away. Really? As we crossed. Yeah. My my bed was a dresser drawer.

SPEAKER_03 5:11

Set you in the dresser drawer and oh you're smaller.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

I was a little, I was I was just a couple months old. So yeah, right now. And my I had an older sister, she was three years older than me, so she was three when we moved. My younger sister was born there before we left in 45. Okay. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:31

So then when did the job finish or did you not like it, or you were too young to remember why we I have no idea why.

SPEAKER_00 5:42

War was over.

SPEAKER_03 5:43

Yeah. After three years, you moved back to Minnesota then.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

Back to Barrett, Minnesota, and um we lived there for the rest of my life until I moved up here.

SPEAKER_03 5:52

I was gonna say, not the rest of your life. Well, no, not quite yet. You you've been up here for quite a while. But um so Barrett, Barrett's small town, small town, western Minnesota, right at Barrett Lake, yep, Alexander, Fergus Fall area.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

Yep. And dad uh was still working construction, uh, being uh a mechanic. And then in 49, when he was just 39 years old, he was uh working on the Minneapolis Airport, they were building a new runway.

SPEAKER_03 6:21

So when he when he got back to Barrett, was he going for jobs like that, like in Minneapolis? Because didn't he work for the county for a while? That was later. That was later. So when he first moved back, there was times that from Minneapolis to Barrett, he would go in for work for however long and then come back on weekends kind of thing, or I think so.

A Life Changing Work Accident

SPEAKER_00 6:39

I and we had I know one summer we were at Cloquet on a road project. Okay, you know, and so I think we moved kind of around in the summertime when there was a job. But yeah, he was um working one day and um working on the fan of a caterpillar, and a guy came and didn't know that he was working on it and started it up, and it just pulled him right in and tore his arm off at the shoulder, and everybody was standing around just going, Oh, what do we do? And he had to pull himself out.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

Pull himself out.

SPEAKER_00 7:11

And the doctor said if he didn't go into shock, he would live. And he didn't go into shock.

SPEAKER_03 7:18

Do you so you're seven years old? Yep. Wait, do you have do you have memories of like was there was grandma panicked about that when she got the news?

SPEAKER_00 7:29

Was that just I don't remember that, but I remember writing letters to him while he was in the hospital. Okay, you know, and we we stayed in bare mother probably went down there. I don't remember. Yeah. But when we were living in town, um, we had either a Model A or Model T, I don't know, some old car. And in the summertime, if we played on the roof, it would melt the tar. And so we weren't allowed to do that very often. Well, I would think not. Yeah. And so then we lived in town for I don't know how many years. But then when I was probably about third or fourth grade, we moved out to the farm, a mile and a half from Barrett. And when Dad went to look at the property, the the fellow we we bought it from was a carpenter. So dad knew, you know, that things would be good shape. So he looked at all the barn and the you know, the granary and the chicken coop, and they were all well done. Never looked at the house. Well, the house had no electricity, no running water. Um, the support in the basement, dad could pound a nail through with his hand. But, you know, you make do. And that first year without electricity, mother said we were a very close family because we went wherever the lantern was.

SPEAKER_03 8:49

So you guys went from living in town in Barrett, where you had electricity, you had a bathroom inside and all that, to going out basically homesteading on the farm where all those amenities goodbye.

unknown 9:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:03

It was 40 acres, 20 acres under cultivation. We were high on the hill, overlooking the lake, and then we had a low spot down in front where the natives camped a lot. The Indians used to have a ton of arrowheads, yes, and he was always looking for arrowheads, yeah. And there was a a boy from town who would sneak over to come and look, and dad always had to chase him off because he wasn't going to shake share his arrowheads with anybody.

SPEAKER_03 9:30

So when I don't know if you remember the details on this, but when grandpa got back from the hospital, before you're buying the house out there, what what was it like for him trying to find a job with just one arm?

Moving To A Farm Without Power

SPEAKER_00 9:44

He became foreman of the construction companies. Yeah, yeah. And um we I I think we were really poor, but I never knew because we always had food on the table, we always had heat, you know. So you just kept living. And being young, you don't pick up on a lot of this stuff. Yeah. So he became foreman of uh John Mark construction out of Fergus Halls, and um we just kept on a living. And it was several years later when my youngest sister was off on her own, and um one of her friends found out dad only had one arm, and she said, Oh, what was it like living with a handicapped person? And Jen said, We didn't know he was handicapped.

SPEAKER_03 10:35

That's my memories as a kid of grandpa, too, is you know, anything you were doing, he anybody else was doing, he was doing it. Exactly. Like when dad had the bobcat, he was the one doing the maintenance on the bobcat. Yep. And I always thought growing up that driving a stick shift wasn't that big of a deal. Grandpa had a left hand, only left hand, didn't have his right arm, and he would, I still remember he would raise his knees up on the and hold the steering wheel, he'd reach through and shift and then go back. And I was like, Oh, he can do that. How hard is it with just your right hand?

SPEAKER_04 11:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:08

And but the number of things that he did that made he made him look really effortless with one hand. There's a few things because below Reetha is there in the garage. Yeah, in the summertime, whatever, I'd go visit him all the time. I think you'd hey go see what your grandpa's doing. And whether it's there's sometimes helping, I never knew if it was he was trying to keep me involved with it or if he actually needed help. I don't think he really needed help most of the time that he asked for it. But yeah, I the term handicapped with him because he just had the one arm never crossed my mind. No, unless somebody else brought it up.

SPEAKER_00 11:43

He couldn't tie his dress shoes, he couldn't tie his tie, so I learned how to tie a tie. But otherwise, I mean he drove tractors, he drove equipment, he drove cars, trucks, whatever. Um one time uh we had had a hay uh wagon there, and we were pitching it up into the hay mile, and this guy came looking for work. I think dad was uh supervisor or foreman of the county then. And uh he kept telling dad what a good worker he was. And so after he left, dad said, such a damn good worker. Why didn't he offer to help a one-armed guy and three young girls?

SPEAKER_03 12:25

That sounds exactly like grandpa.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Yep, yep, yep. He probably wouldn't have accepted the help, but I mean just the fact that you didn't know.

SPEAKER_04 12:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

But with with him the arm being torn out, they could never uh he had several operations, but they couldn't uh um connect the nerves or cauterize the nerves. And so he always had a lot of pain, and so you'd see him, you know, clutching his shoulder. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:53

And of course the kids too, that was Sarah and I will oftentimes he'd have the liniment and he'd want to step, rub a shoulder on it because of the pain on there.

SPEAKER_00 13:01

Yeah, he had lots of scars down the middle of his back.

SPEAKER_03 13:05

So I never knew Grandma Judy. No, she she passed a month before I was born.

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Two months.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

Two months. So what what she's now got a husband that's got one arm. He's still working hard and everything, but at home, she was she was tending the house. Did you guys have a garden?

SPEAKER_00 13:21

Was she Oh oh dad loved to see things grow? So he would plant a big garden and then we would have to weed it. But then later on, mother worked at the grocery store and at the post office. Okay. Yeah, to help supplement. And when she worked at the grocery store, she had this little tablet, probably three by four, little brown paper, and you'd write down all the items and the prices, and then page after page, you know, depending on how many groceries, and then you'd have to add that up manually.

SPEAKER_03 13:52

So when somebody came in, you'd have to write all that down, and then I like our way now, it's much more efficient.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Yeah. But mother didn't have much of an education, but she had a very unique way of doing math, and it always worked. People marveled at how how she did it, and I I don't know her method, but it worked.

SPEAKER_03 14:14

Worked.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Yeah.

Small School Life And Plays

SPEAKER_03 14:15

There you go. So growing up on the farm, you're getting into how many how many people were in the high school? How many kids were in your graduated class? Because right now Burr doesn't have that many. Oh, they don't have the school. Well, well, they've got the they've got the county school. The county school, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

But back then there were 20 in my class, 10 in 10 in the year ahead of me, and I think all the classes were kind of 15, 16.

SPEAKER_03 14:40

Still a decent sized school at the time.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

Yes, yes. Well, you had all the farms, small farms around the area. And um, I know uh we were looking at my yearbook one time not too long ago, and you said, Man, there's lots of kids in choir and band. And I you just, yeah, that was part of it. You did it. And the um juniors and seniors, seniors in the fall, uh, juniors, uh anyway, seniors in the fall, juniors in the spring would have a class play.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

And so, since there weren't a lot of kids who were interested in it, I was in practically every play.

SPEAKER_03 15:17

Well, I don't know if I was aware of your experience as an actress before, mother.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

Well, I think it was my senior year and I I had um won a contest in sewing. And so it was the same weekend as the play. And so I had an understudy, and I was being charged with murder. And so, anyway, after Friday night. I wonder you didn't tell me you're in a play.

SPEAKER_03 15:46

You would have traumatized Sarah and I that her mother was charged with murder when she was in high school.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

So Friday night after the play was over, mother, dad, and I get in the car, drive 150 miles to Minneapolis so I could be in this show Saturday. And then we had arranged with our friends, the Gustafsons, to drive me home because they figured they'd make better time than mother and dad. So mother and dad get back to Barrett and they say, Where's Charlotte? I said, Oh, she's not here yet. But I made it on time. And the first night I was judged innocent, but the second night the uh director, the teacher, went to the back because the jury was selected out of the audience.

SPEAKER_02 16:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 16:25

And the second night he came back and he said, Hey, she was innocent last night. Let's make her guilty jury. So is that jury tampering?

SPEAKER_03 16:33

Double jeopardy. You're not supposed to be twice tried twice for the same crime and jury tampering. You can't have the you can't have administrative.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

I think I didn't have to act that I was surprised. I was shocked. What do you mean I'm guilty?

SPEAKER_03 16:50

So did with you doing that, you ended up going to college for home economics, but based on winning a contest on sewing when you're still in high school, was that something that started at home? Well, that out of necessity back?

SPEAKER_00 17:05

Uh Mother did some sewing, but she didn't really teach us, but it was taught in school. And of course, we would belong to 4-H.

SPEAKER_01 17:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 17:14

And so um, I never did the big animals. I don't like big animals, but I did the chickens and the baking and the sewing and some of the gardening and things, those types of projects. And then uh I ended up having a very good home ec teacher and um taught me a lot. And she can I wanted to be a librarian so I could read a lot. What mom liking books? Yeah, I tell you. Get out of here. And she convinced me I need to be a home ec teacher.

SPEAKER_03 17:42

So I well, you I think I mean you're a great home ec teacher, but I think you would have been a great librarian based on at least the influence you've had on me over the years with the number of books that you picked out for me to read and get me interested in that. So yeah, anybody that's asked me when they when they see the books in my house, it's like, yeah, it's my mom's fault.

Work Ethic And Odd Jobs

SPEAKER_00 18:02

Yeah, yeah. I'm I'm I'm the reason you're up late at night a lot of times. Yes, not getting any sleep.

SPEAKER_03 18:08

And I and I remember in school when you'd be you'd come and you're like, hey, you need to put it down. I'm reading a book. I was like, it's or the next day you're uh most days it was hard to get me out of bed, but it was very hard to get you out of bed. But you'd ask, like, well, how late were you up last night? I was like, oh, like one o'clock, you're like, Douglas.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

Yeah, because I'd go up and you'd say, Okay, yeah. And then if I check back later, you were under the covers with the with the can uh uh flashlight.

SPEAKER_03 18:31

Well, yeah, it's it was your fault because it's usually a book that you had given me and said, I think you'll enjoy this. And I enjoyed it enough that I didn't want to put it down and go to bed.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

But let me tell you, when I was in high school, uh to show how antique it was, one of the jobs I had on Saturday was to set pins at the bowling alley. And it was ten cents a lane.

SPEAKER_03 18:55

Ten per game? Per game. So you'd be standing in the back and then with the pins.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

You'd be up on this ledge, then you'd have to jump down, put the pins up, jump back up, oh my legs would be so tired by eating. Then I would have a So how many games would you Oh, I might make a dollar or two dollars that day. And then I would go home, have a quick supper, and then go babysitting till four o'clock in the morning. For twenty-five cents an hour.

SPEAKER_03 19:20

25 cents an hour.

SPEAKER_00 19:21

Yeah. And that meant not only playing with the kids, entertaining the kids, but doing the dishes, cleaning, cleaning up, etc. You know, you you didn't just sit to the three and four kids.

SPEAKER_03 19:33

The the work ethic that everybody comments to me about with my mother, it started young.

SPEAKER_00 19:36

It started young.

SPEAKER_03 19:37

It started young.

SPEAKER_00 19:38

Then when I was in college, I got a job at the neighboring town working at the drugstore, Christmas and and summer vacations. And so at the drugstore, the owner, the pharmacist and his wife lived upstairs. Well, I learned how to decipher the doctor's handwriting and their shorthand for whatever. So if someone would bring in a prescription at night after they'd gone upstairs, I would grab the bottle, grab the prescription, bring it up to Cliff and say, okay, is this the right bottle? Is this what it says? Go down, type the label, count out the pills and sell it.

SPEAKER_03 20:12

That sounds illegal.

SPEAKER_00 20:13

I know.

SPEAKER_03 20:16

I'm hoping the statute of limitations is run out. I hope so too. So in college, you're handing out prescription medications. Yeah. All right.

SPEAKER_00 20:28

But he he trusted me to have the right bottle, and if I I was going to take out of that same bottle that I brought up.

SPEAKER_03 20:35

Well, I mean, you were going and checking with him and making it. It's not like you're making up just pulling pillars.

SPEAKER_00 20:40

But then you type the label.

SPEAKER_03 20:41

Type the label, and here you go.

SPEAKER_00 20:43

Sell it, and you go. So what and that was 75 cents an hour. So that was a big raise.

SPEAKER_03 20:48

Well, it should be. If you're dealing dealing drugs, you should get more money for that. When you went, did you get out of high school? Was your plan when you went to the University of Minnesota? Was the plan to become a teacher?

SPEAKER_04 21:03

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 21:03

And so that and home economics was that was when when did that first cross your mind that that's the route you wanted to take for your career?

SPEAKER_00 21:10

Probably my senior year in high school.

SPEAKER_03 21:12

And was that due to like the 4-H and stuff like that that you really enjoyed that, the teachers that you had? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:18

Yeah. And I don't remember what my tuition was the first year, but I think when I graduated, it was$125 a quarter.

SPEAKER_03 21:25

$125 a quarter. There's a lot of people that would love to pay that now.

SPEAKER_00 21:32

And I was on St. Paul campus the first year I was in a dorm. And the second and third year, I'd babysat for this professor's family my first year. And then the second and third year, they moved to a different house where they had a third story with a bedroom upstairs. And so I lived with the Edwards then for two years. And I did babysitting, housekeeping, you know, for my room and board.

SPEAKER_03 21:52

So is that tell the story of the sponge cake. When I was at the Edwards, right?

SPEAKER_00 21:57

I was at the Edwards. Dr. Edwards was a Professor of kinesiology, I think. They were Jewish. I mean, coming from small rural Minnesota where it's all Lutherans, it was a very educational. They were a wonderful couple. They had three kids when I was there. And Dr. Edwards loved baked goods. Mrs. Edwards very seldom baked. And so I'd bring back goodies from wherever I went home, mother would have a box for them and a box for me. Yeah. Because I could take upstairs. And so mother and dad's 25th wedding anniversary, uh, her sister was making petty fours. And of course, there's a little piece of cake with frosting all around it. So her husband decided, hmm. So he cut some sponges the same size and frosted them. And so I brought some of those back for Dr. Edwards.

SPEAKER_03 22:48

Did you know they were?

SPEAKER_00 22:49

I was. So you did it on purpose. And he said, And finally I said, Dr. Edwards, that's a sponge. But yeah, and they came to our wedding, and Dr. Edwards, very tall, skinny guy. And we, of course, the ladies' ate had all these nice cookies and goodies out set out. And he was the one standing at the goodie table with the kids eating all the goodies.

SPEAKER_03 23:20

That's my kind of guy right there. I would have gotten along well with Dr. Edwards.

SPEAKER_00 23:23

Mother had never met Dr. Edwards, but she had met Mrs. Edwards. And so, you know, just before the wedding starts, she goes to check on everything, and she said, I know who Dr. Edwards is. Because he was the only one with a, I think, a plaid shirt and a polka dot bow tie. And this was rural Minnesota, as I say, where it's white shirts and long ties. But they were a fabulous family to work for, and we kept in touch until they died. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:52

So where what when was it that you met dad and how did you meet dad?

SPEAKER_00 23:58

Well, the first time I saw him, he'd come up to Barrett fishing with Floyd Gustafson, and they stopped at the house. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 24:06

Then uh how old were you then?

SPEAKER_00 24:08

Probably about sophomore in high school.

SPEAKER_03 24:10

Sophomore high school. Okay. So he was senior year in high school or in college then.

SPEAKER_00 24:14

Yeah. And so then, I think it was either my junior or senior year, Floyd Gustafson invited Janet and I, my sister, to come pheasant hunting. Well, we were going to be hunting with Dave, who's a very serious hunter. And he was quite miffed because here were gonna be these two girls who are gonna slow him down. Well, we not only slowed them, we did not slow them down whatsoever. We kept pace. And one time I got a shot off at a pheasant before Dave did. Of course I missed and he got it, but that was the first time he really noticed me. Sounds about right. So then uh, you know, we'd see each other occasionally, and you know, and then um because he grew up in Boyd, which was which is what's about a hundred miles south? Hundred miles south. That was uh Dave's hometown, so he knew the Gustafsons, and so you know it was a convoluted different friendships there.

SPEAKER_03 25:05

Grandpa grew up grew up down there, and that's how he knew the Gustafsons, right?

SPEAKER_00 25:09

So that was the connection between the connection, yep. And then when I was a junior in college, Dave came to the cities and called this gal to go out, and she had other plans. So I think he was staying at Floyd and Waltz, and so he had my number, so he called me. So we talked for a while, but then it was right at supper time, so I had to get I had to hang up. And so after supper, I thought, I got it, I'm gonna call him back. And so we talked for a long time, and he said, if I wouldn't have called him back, he probably never would have never would have called again? Called again. So because of that calling back is the reason we're here. Dang.

SPEAKER_03 25:50

Glad the phone lines were working.

SPEAKER_00 25:52

So that was in January, and a couple weeks later it was President's Day, and I had the weekend off, and he had the he was teaching in Dawson, Minnesota at the time. And so he was going to drive up the hundred miles.

SPEAKER_03 26:02

So this is your junior year?

SPEAKER_00 26:03

In college. In college, yeah. Yep. And so he drove the hundred miles to take me to a movie. Dang!

SPEAKER_03 26:09

That's some commitment there. Even now, driving 100 miles for a movie is crazy. I can't imagine back then driving 100. That was what, 1959 then? Or no, 63. 63. 63 driving 100 miles.

SPEAKER_00 26:23

And that first night, that first date after the movie, he kind of mentioned, do you think you could marry somebody that likes to hunt and fish?

SPEAKER_03 26:34

Wow. Pretty forward there.

SPEAKER_00 26:38

So then I think in June or July, he proposed and wanted to get married then. And I said, nope, I'm gonna finish my last year of college because otherwise I probably won't finish. And it was, I was going to finish.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

Yeah, because if he was in Boston teaching and then going back, that wasn't gonna work.

SPEAKER_00 26:57

It wasn't gonna work.

SPEAKER_03 26:58

So so you you finished your degree.

SPEAKER_00 27:01

Yep, got got married in July.

SPEAKER_03 27:03

Graduated what in June or May?

SPEAKER_00 27:05

June. June.

SPEAKER_03 27:06

June.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

End of June.

SPEAKER_03 27:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Wedding was 25th of July. We went on a short honeymoon, then packed up and moved to Alaska.

SPEAKER_03 27:14

So when did you start looking for? Because obviously you didn't wait until you graduated before you found a job. What was the job search like?

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Well, well, first of all, Dave wanted to go to uh Montana or Wyoming. He'd hunted out there and he liked the areas, and there were no openings for both of us. And then one night he said, What about Alaska? And I said, Yeah, why not? You know, for nine months we could put up with anything. So what we knew about Haynes was that it was a small town in a valley.

SPEAKER_03 27:45

But how how how do you I'm trying to think back there? Right now you go online, find out where the jobs are. Were you guys writing letters or how was there like a central place that was had all the job hostings?

SPEAKER_00 27:55

No, we just uh dad said you want to be on the road system, but I don't want to be in Noam or Bethel or up north. And so I don't know how we pick Haynes, and I think we'd apply, I think we did apply in Petersburg also, which wasn't on the road system. I think there were a couple places, but Haynes had a position for both of us.

SPEAKER_03 28:13

So here you come. Yeah, so here we come. So you get married and then short honeymoon and start the drive from well, and and let me tell you about the honeymoon.

SPEAKER_00 28:23

Because in March of that year, um there was a sportsman show in Minneapolis. So mother and dad and Dave and I went, and of course, as soon as we hit the door, mother and I start signing up anything free, gifts, you know, whatever, drawings. Well, dad and Dave were giving us such a bad time, so we quit. Well, a week later, I get this letter saying, uh, you've won a week's vacation at this lodge in northern Minnesota. So that was part of our honeymoon.

SPEAKER_03 28:53

And that that brings up because throughout my life, the number of raffles that you have won seems to be inordinately high. Yes. After that first one, what did it take some more wins before dad was like signing up for everything? Because I remember as a kid, anybody asked for a raffle ticket, he'd go see my wife.

SPEAKER_04 29:11

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 29:12

If there's something, he's like, Charlotte, fill this out. Yep. And it was for that reason because he never won anything, but you seem to win stuff.

SPEAKER_00 29:18

One time at a trade show, if he bought so many scopes or whatever, it was a drawing for a gun. And so uh he said, Oh, I'm not gonna sign it. He said, Charlotte, sign it up. And I won the gun. And Ralph's wooden has it today.

SPEAKER_03 29:31

Yeah, Sacco 7mm.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

Beautiful rifle.

SPEAKER_00 29:36

And I won a big TV. And what one year I wanted to support the groups that were selling tickets. And so I'd buy a raffle ticket for everyone that came along. I don't know, there were five or six or seven that year. And I won something, either first, second, or third prize on all of them. People would stop buying tickets if they knew I had bought. So, you know.

SPEAKER_03 30:00

Well, but you got a free honeymoon out of it too.

SPEAKER_00 30:02

Started off. That's the way a good way to start off. But part of the honeymoon and the trip up here, because I had the home economics degree, but I was also gonna be teaching physical ed. And I didn't have enough credits for physical ed. So I was doing correspondence courses on the way up here.

SPEAKER_03 30:24

I apologize, Mom, but it cracks me up that you're teaching physical education.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

Uh yeah, no, you have a right to laugh. You have a right to laugh because I'm the most uncoordinated person around. But I'd say, okay, Dave, what am I teaching today?

SPEAKER_05 30:38

He's writing up two lesson plans, his and yours. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 30:42

Okay, what are the rules for this game? How do you play this game?

SPEAKER_03 30:50

I mean, I don't think you're trying to get up here in like any quick hurry, but from driving from Minnesota to Haynes, how long did that take you guys?

SPEAKER_00 30:58

Well, we allowed two weeks because people said the road is full of these huge potholes and these huge boulders. Fill your car with spare tires because you're gonna have so many flats. We thought, oh boy. So we allowed two weeks. Well, we made it to Whitehorse and we camped along the way. We were having a great time. And um got to Whitehorse in less than a week. And so, okay, now what do we do? And uh, and of course, one of the funny things about getting into Whitehorse, we were camping. Dave hadn't shaved, and he said, Oh, we're getting to a big town, I've got to shave.

SPEAKER_03 31:29

You know, of course he does. He still didn't leave in the house, I gotta shave.

SPEAKER_00 31:35

You gotta shave, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:36

Dad, you're going for a car ride, nobody's gonna see you, you don't need to shave.

SPEAKER_00 31:40

But so then we camped, oh, at every spot along the way from Whitehall, I think it took us four days, you know, because we didn't have a place to stay.

SPEAKER_01 31:49

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

When when we had accepted the offer from Haynes Haynes, and I I wrote back and I said, We'd like to rent a two-bedroom furnished house. And I'm sure they just laughed their heads off because we absolutely so would other people. That doesn't exist here. So we spent the first several months living at the Thunderbird Motel.

unknown 32:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

Because that was what was available. When we first got here, there was just a room available with no kitchen facilities. But then after Labor Day, then people had moved out, so we moved into the unit that had a kitchen. And so uh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:22

So it's 1964. What was your starting salary in Haynes?

SPEAKER_00 32:29

I I think it was about$8,000.

SPEAKER_03 32:31

$8,000 each?

SPEAKER_00 32:32

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 32:33

So$16,000.

SPEAKER_00 32:35

But see, Dave, when he left Minnesota, was making$4,200.

SPEAKER_03 32:40

Oh, so that was you guys were rolling in dough.

SPEAKER_00 32:43

Oh, oh man, we were gonna but we realized that two can live as cheap and only half as long.

SPEAKER_02 32:52

There you go.

SPEAKER_00 32:54

But uh the first year, of course, Dave wanted to go hunting. He's a hunter, and no one would take him because he had not proven himself as to I mean, you can say you're a hunter, but can you actually shoot and can you get the you know, can you do it? And he was just moping around because he was the only man in town over 12 that wasn't out hunting. That wasn't out hunting. Well, the last weekend the Loomis's Loomis family said they would take him.

SPEAKER_03 33:24

So they went up the road to the cable car, which is pretty much where the 26-mile bridge going over to Porcupine is now, but just up above that, there's a cable car going to the city.

SPEAKER_00 33:35

And so you had to pull yourself over, and then they walked in to almost to where the farm is now.

SPEAKER_02 33:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:41

And of course, they was so excited, and they set up camp and whatever. They had a three three-sided cabin. Um and the next morning he got up early and realized that he didn't have the proper scope. But he got a moose anyway. And he not only shot it, but he started to gut it, and they let him carry a lot of it out to see if he, you know, if he to prove himself. And so that weekend he had that, and then Carol McHenry had come over and uh they helped uh him pack out a moose, and they had a skiff that went out to the water to get the first moose, and then they'd paddle it back, and then carrying it back to the uh cable car, they had a wheelbarrow. One was pulling the wheelbarrow, and somebody else was pushing with a pack on your back. And you know how far it is into the farm.

SPEAKER_03 34:34

That's a that's quite a ways. That's a pack there.

SPEAKER_00 34:36

And and there was no road.

SPEAKER_03 34:38

Yeah, no, you're going through the brush and everything. That's for a moose. That's a that's a good pack. And and that weekend, I But I don't know if it'd be I I don't know if it'd be better in a wheelbarrow.

SPEAKER_00 34:48

I think it'd be easier to just put it on your back and go through it. But see, then you've got one piece in the you can double your time, you know, you've got one in the wheelbar and one on your back. So, but I had gone to a conference up in Anchorage, and we landed at the water down the harbor. With the old Gorb and Goose. Yep. And so I thought, I'm gonna surprise Dave. And so I walked up the hill to the Thunderbird Motel, knock on the door. I said, He's gonna be so pleased to see me. And so he comes in or he says, Oh, it's you. He was so exhausted. I thought, wow, what a greeting.

SPEAKER_02 35:24

Did it make sense once he told you about a moose maybe you've been back in the last couple days?

SPEAKER_00 35:29

So, and then the next year the teachers group over at Murphy Flats invited him. And so then we knew there was a moose because they would hang a sheet if there was a white sheet in the trees.

SPEAKER_03 35:41

I remember as a kid going up, we'd go for a ride because moose season would hit, dad would be gone, and we would drive up the road looking for a sheet on the other side of the river.

SPEAKER_00 35:50

Yep, yep. And that was our signal to okay, this is what we're going to be doing in the next couple days. Yeah. So then by then we well, that was in 64. We moved four times. In 65.

SPEAKER_03 36:03

60, you moved four times?

SPEAKER_00 36:05

Well, we moved from the Thunderbird to above the food center.

SPEAKER_03 36:09

Okay, which is right next door, so it wasn't a big move, but still.

SPEAKER_00 36:12

Upstairs.

SPEAKER_03 36:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:13

Um, and then we moved to Lynnview because we were taking care of the superintendent's son. We were he was a senior in high school, basically cooking and keeping an eye on. Yeah. And then that fall we moved into Eddie James's house, where the Nashes live now.

SPEAKER_03 36:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

And so then we lived there for a couple of years, and then um Doc Jones came to us one day and said, you know, Doc Allen is selling his house next to us. I think you'd be good neighbors. So why don't you look into it? So we thought.

SPEAKER_03 36:40

So Stan Jones recruited you guys as neighbors?

SPEAKER_00 36:42

Yeah. I didn't know that story. So then we moved up the hill, up Mannequer Road, Allen Road.

SPEAKER_03 36:50

What year was that?

SPEAKER_00 36:52

67.

SPEAKER_03 36:53

67.

SPEAKER_00 36:54

And we owned the house we were moving out of. We're gonna be renting it. And I was seven months pregnant with Sarah, had the worst cold of my life, and I said, let's just take this, you know, a box at a time, because I had to clean the house before we could kind of move in. And I said, This is, you know, let's just do it slowly. Okay. Well, then the people who were renting from us wanted to move in. And Dave said, Oh, we can do this all at once. That was fine. It was the end of August. First of September, Dave went moose hunting. Moose hunting. He was hunting every weekend.

SPEAKER_03 37:29

I'm I'm I'm seeing where that pattern started where Dad got the rest of us to kind of oh, this will be easy. We'll take the August out in no time.

SPEAKER_02 37:38

He's like, Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:39

Yeah, yeah. So, yeah. But then we had uh a three-sided garage down at the end of the or halfway down the end of the driveway, and we'd hang the moose in there, and all we'd put in front of it was a piece of plywood to keep the dogs out. And the women would wash it down, the guys are hanging it would wash it down, put a new sheet over it. Uh, with Bill John owning the Thunderbird Motel, they had lots of old sheets. Okay. So we'd make bags out of the sheets. Yeah. And then Thursday night would go to uh one of the houses and cut it up, and then everybody would get okay, you get a roast, you get a roast, you get a hamburger, you get, you know, divide it up for all the all the people, and then they'd go out hunting again Friday, and we repeat the process.

SPEAKER_03 38:21

So that on Allen Road, the garage we had down there, that you guys would just hang the meat in that, yeah, and there's never any issues with bears or anything in there?

SPEAKER_00 38:29

Never, never.

SPEAKER_03 38:30

That's I don't remember, I don't remember that part where you guys were hanging meat down there. Yeah. That was before my time, I guess. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:36

Well, you were pretty little.

SPEAKER_03 38:37

Yeah. So the one thing that always cracks me up about dad, he loved the hunt. Yep. But I I don't think everything always followed the law. Because there was times if things were the stories he would tell about Murphy Flats teacher's cabin, that superintendent's like, Dave, you're gonna have to take today off because it's getting towards the end of the season. And so he'd get the day off school. They'd send him over there. And he was the one time he had like two or three moose down by the day then, and then the rest of the teachers came over and they were just started packing it out. These are the people that are supposed to be setting the standard for everybody else.

SPEAKER_00 39:24

I hope the statute of limitations have gone on that too. Well, yeah, he's gone something.

SPEAKER_03 39:30

Good luck putting that. Like even when he got in his wheelchair, he's like, what are they gonna do? Put me in jail? They don't have a spot for me. Even more so now.

SPEAKER_00 39:38

So then in 66, we've drove out with two other teachers, and um we drove to Minnesota in 72 hours.

SPEAKER_03 39:47

Dave That trip that is crazy to me when you guys talk about because you guys are just switching people out. But still from Hayes in 66, from Haynes to Minnesota in 72 hours on gravel roads. That is ins. And you guys would give us a bad time about driving too fast.

SPEAKER_00 40:04

Well, and the thing, we were going to take turns driving. Well, Dave said every time he woke up, we were in the same spot. He said, I'll drive. Well, we got to mother and dad's, and mother fed us, and Dave and I went to bed, and I think we slept for 20 hours. Well, then our friend Walt Gustison flew us to Iowa, where we picked up a new truck, and then we drove to Toronto to get a jigger, which was uh all-terrain yellow fiberglass bathtub with eight wheels. And um brought that over to Murphy Flats.

SPEAKER_03 40:40

How much did the jigger cost? Do you remember?

SPEAKER_00 40:42

I think it was a couple thousand dollars.

SPEAKER_03 40:44

So you're making 16 grand and you spent two grand on a jigger.

SPEAKER_00 40:48

And I don't remember what the truck costs, but I I know the car that Dave bought before we came up here was eighteen hundred dollars.

SPEAKER_03 40:54

$1,800. So the jigger cost almost as much as a new car.

SPEAKER_00 40:57

Yeah, probably. Maybe it's I don't I don't know. But yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:02

I never asked dad the price of that, but that was always because I remember any time for like ATVs and stuff. Nope, nope, can't afford them, can't afford them. It's like and then he showed about how much fun he had in this jigger, which was like one of the original ATVs. Like, well, you got to have fun, eh? And it would float, you know, you could take it down the river. You could it's like the early early version of an Argo.

SPEAKER_00 41:24

And then coming back from Toronto, we had stopped at my Aunt Uncle's who lived in the um Uncle Yain Eldine, who lived in a suburb of Chicago, and we stayed there overnight as we were going to Toronto. And one of the things they said, you don't want to get on the Dan Ryan Highway because there's all these shootings, etc. So we'd stay off the Dan Ryan Highway. So it's getting close to midnight. We're driving back from Toronto, and all of a sudden we realize we're on the Dan Ryan Highway. And the gas gauge is short empty. And with the new truck, we have no idea how long we can go on empty. Usually not very far. Yeah. And so there's all these dark, and people, you know, were just they saw that yellow thing in the back, and I was sitting closer and closer to Dave, almost pushing him out the door. But we got to the end of the Dan Ryan Highway, and there was a gas station. Perfect. But it was scary. I oh dear.

SPEAKER_03 42:24

So then you come back, got the jigger in the back of the truck, or was it on a trailer? Nope, in the back of the truck. Back of the truck, come back to Alaska. That was what what was different, I guess, between you're in a small town, western Minnesota, small town in southeast Alaska. Did you guys know, other than obviously the geography and stuff like that, what were there similarities, were there differences between how the people interacted and things like that?

SPEAKER_00 42:53

Was No, everyone was very pleasant and very, very nice to us. Um one of the things we had seen, we we knew that there was no Lutheran church in town, but we knew there was one in Juneau, so we thought we'd just take the and we knew there was a ferry, so we'd just take the ferry to Juneau to go to church.

SPEAKER_03 43:12

How well did that work out for you?

SPEAKER_00 43:14

That did not work out at all. Well, and one thing that was different, of course, we got freight only once a month. So all the groceries, all the parcel posts came once a month. And so the first Christmas we Was that a steamship at the time? Okay and the first year, uh first Christmas, we were at a party at Carl Ward's and someone said, Have you checked your mail? And I said, Post office is closed at 10 o'clock. Said, No, they're open until midnight. And for years the post office would be open until midnight on Christmas Eve, because that's the day the barge came in.

SPEAKER_04 43:47

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 43:48

And if you if they knew you were looking for Christmas presents for your kids, they would call you if you hadn't picked them up, you know.

SPEAKER_03 43:55

I I remember even later because Retha Young, who's the postman. For a long time. That she was great friends with her family. Sarah and I always considered her like another grandmother. But she was always at her house, you know, for Thanksgiving, for Easter, for Christmas. And there's a couple years when we were younger that she had to go back. And so we went down as a family and are like sorting mail, and she's calling people to come pick up their packages on Christmas Eve.

SPEAKER_00 44:23

And I have told that to some people who work for the posts. Oh, don't tell me. Oh, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 44:29

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

That's exactly like you'd say, Oh, Joe Smith, whose box is oh 22, you know. She just knew all the boxes.

SPEAKER_03 44:37

She had every single one. If there, if there was one that didn't have a box number, you just shout out it and she'd tell you exactly which one it was. Yeah. But no, I think they did that twice. I remember going down there and calling people up. But and then the people that were coming to get the packages, of course, they're really, really grateful that they're there.

SPEAKER_04 44:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 44:54

But I think her going down at that time, and I don't even know if they'd let them do that now, even if they wanted to.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:00

But to go down and and take that time out on Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

It was a real crit uh customer service. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:06

And to make sure people had their packages and stuff that uh to make sure Christmas was, yeah. That was something one of those, you know, you'll you'll learn from the people around you, and learning not that not only from you and dad, but from Retha, from grandpa, and just the people that are always going the extra mile on that. But yeah, I've Retha was one of a kind. Yes. Oh, yes. He was a pretty and then I remember with her for the when scouts with Pinewood Derby, I've still got the picture. I think with she'd come with the postal scale, and she had their big hat, they'd have a big hat and stuff, but she was the official wear on everything with their certified postal scale to make sure all the cars are the correct weight.

SPEAKER_00 45:49

Yep, yep.

SPEAKER_05 45:50

They made a big deal out of that.

SPEAKER_03 45:53

So, but you guys felt other than you know that first year took dad a little bit to get into hunting and stuff, but you guys felt welcome right away.

SPEAKER_00 46:04

Yeah, and you know, our our click was kind of the teachers. We were all kind of in the same boat, and so um it took some getting used to where you had to order stuff a month and ahead because and of course everybody just waited for the JCPenney, the Sears and the Montgomery Ward catalogs. So those are the dream books, you know, you can sort through. Oh, I think I went. In fact, I was so dumb. Um, one of the my responsibilities was I was supposed to be advisor for the drill team. I'd never seen a drill team. Oh, and another reason I got into home acting hours, I wouldn't have to teach boys. So my first class of the morning was cooking boys cooking.

SPEAKER_03 46:43

Boys cooking. I've heard I've heard a lot of stories about boys cooking class over the years.

SPEAKER_00 46:48

I think they taught me more than I taught them.

SPEAKER_03 46:52

I don't know how old I was when I first started hearing from Bill Thomas, Mike McHenry, and some of them they'd come into the store. You know, when we had your mom and boys cooking. I think they felt bad about it later, but at the time they really enjoyed picking on you. Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:15

But I got very nice gifts from them at Christmas.

SPEAKER_03 47:17

Did you?

SPEAKER_00 47:18

Yes. But anyway, so you'd order, I there's 20 girls in the drill team, 18, 15, whatever. And so you'd order all matching shirts. Well, that come in different shades of gold.

SPEAKER_04 47:34

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 47:35

Oh, yeah. You know, they're never the same color. And just yeah, in fact, one of the first things when I was starting with PE, I said, okay, I want you all to come with white shorts. Well, there's no place in Haynes to buy P.E. shorts. And for sewing, you had Neil Duty, who would get one bolt of fabric in a year.

SPEAKER_03 47:57

And so everybody's everybody, whatever they're sewing, it's all gonna be out of the same fabric. Oh dear.

SPEAKER_00 48:05

So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:06

So you were for for home acts, you had you had boys cooking. Did you have a another you didn't have women and boys and girls couldn't cook together? They had just a special boys cooking? Just special boys cooking. Boys cooking.

SPEAKER_00 48:17

And then there was seventh and eighth grade home ac and freshman, sophomore. I don't remember how many classes I had. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:23

Okay. And then PE. PE. And that was at what grades was it were you teaching PE to? High school. High school. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 48:29

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:31

Just one PE class? Yeah. Were you the only PE teacher then? You were the only PE teacher for how long?

SPEAKER_00 48:37

For the women. Dave was for the men, for boys.

SPEAKER_03 48:39

So you couldn't have you didn't have co-ed PE classes? Oh no. Oh.

SPEAKER_00 48:43

Although I think one time we did invite the boys so we could teach ballroom dancing.

SPEAKER_01 48:47

No.

SPEAKER_05 48:52

That wasn't that long ago that you're having separate PE classes for boys and girls.

SPEAKER_00 48:59

I did not know that there were separate classes for that. And for the drill team, I was so fortunate to have Barb Henderson, Ann Henderson, Sue Shook, you know, so many of these gals who had been in the drill team, and they just basically ran it. They they came up with the drills. Uh um, just so many of them that really, I mean, I was just kind of there to make sure they didn't misbehave.

SPEAKER_03 49:30

So you come up in 64. Sarah's born in 68.

SPEAKER_00 49:34

67.

SPEAKER_03 49:35

67, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 49:36

Yeah. So I quit teaching that year. You quit teaching that.

SPEAKER_03 49:40

And so um So you taught you only taught for three years.

SPEAKER_00 49:43

Three years, yeah. And Dave taught for seven. Yeah, yeah. And so I wanted to be a stay-at-home mom. And Carl Ward, Frankie Perry came after me, and then she got pregnant. So someone was gonna have to finish out the school year. So Carl Ward came to me and said, Would you finish out the year? And I said, Only if I can bring Sarah to class.

SPEAKER_01 50:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

And he said, No, that's not gonna work. So then I think Anne Quinlan took over again because she was the teacher before me. Yeah. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:14

Wait, Anne Quinlan was a home act teacher? Yep. I did not know that. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:18

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 50:20

And so I I succeeded her and then Frankie Perry.

SPEAKER_03 50:24

And then Frankie's who I had for home act in junior high and high school.

Homemakers And Starting A Fair

SPEAKER_00 50:28

Yeah, and she took off for a while. Um, and then in March of '69, we had homemakers meeting at my house. And Allie Cortis and um Lola Vogel, and I think a couple others who had been here a while said, you know, we used to have a fair. I think we should have a fair. And so that was the first year of the Southeast State Fair. And we held it at the Legion.

SPEAKER_03 50:54

In the Legion Hall.

SPEAKER_00 50:55

In the Legion Hall. First couple years was at the Legion Hall. Frankie Perry really headed that up. She and uh Pauline Helms did a fantastic job. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:04

And um was it just exhibits at the time then? Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:08

But we had a little fashion show.

SPEAKER_03 51:10

Oh, fashion show too. All right.

SPEAKER_00 51:12

And so it was basically cooking and some gardening and so forth. And I don't remember what year.

SPEAKER_03 51:17

So this homemakers you're talking about, was this was this uh an official like group you guys had a homemaker.

SPEAKER_00 51:24

It was called a Haynes Homemakers, yeah. And we would just meet monthly and have a speaker or whatever and talk about canning or whatever. One time a gal um said, bring a mushroom because she was going to teach us how to identify mushrooms. And the one that I brought was the most poisonous. Good job. Yeah, and I've never picked mushrooms.

SPEAKER_03 51:44

You never picked mushrooms. You're gonna go to extreme. You're gonna hit the top, go one way or the other. That's right, yeah. Yeah, gotta win one of the awards.

SPEAKER_00 51:54

And so when they built Harriet Hall, Dave built that. And um he had made some arrangement to where I think he supplied the labor or whatever, if they would buy the materials. And then there was a little earthquake, and he he the sides were kind of just up, and so it started shaking. He thought, Oh my gosh, this is gonna be, but it stayed up and he was able to finish the building.

SPEAKER_03 52:22

I remember being out there, I think it was just him and I. Yeah, I wasn't doing it, I wasn't old enough to do anything other than get in the way. But I was playing in the dirt, whatever, and watching him spray paint the outside of Harriet Hall the first time. I can't remember who it was, it was about 10 years ago or whatever, and they're talking about Harriet Hall. I think it was when they remodeled it and stuff. Probably. And I told him, I was like, Yeah, my dad built that. And they're like, No, he didn't.

SPEAKER_00 52:46

Yeah, watching them do it. And one time he was up on the ladder and hear a deer deer walk by.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

Really?

SPEAKER_00 52:53

Yeah. And dad was out there helping.

SPEAKER_03 52:57

So so when he first, when you guys first got here, because he had North Star construction, he had other stuff. Was that did that start that first year where he had these side businesses outside of teaching?

SPEAKER_00 53:06

Or no, that was a few years in, probably three or four years in. And for some reason he decided that we needed to get in construction.

SPEAKER_03 53:14

He had several other guys, they were well, he always had a reason to get into something else. That didn't that never that never that never ended.

Construction, Demolition, And New Ventures

SPEAKER_00 53:21

No, that never ended. And so there were about four guys, and they formed North Stark Corporation. And so for some, I have no idea how, we started selling Lindel Cedar homes. And so Dave would send the floor plans down to Sears. Sears would do all the mechanical, and so that they'd send up whatever pipes, whatever faucets, whatever electrical we needed. And so I had a very good relationship with with Sears. And so we built several, uh, he built, helped build several of the Lindel Cedar homes here, a couple in Juneau. He had to go down and work. And so then in 71, he decided to quit teaching because the guy doing construction kept interrupting his classes, asking him, hey, what do we do about this? And this didn't show up. And he's he was getting too many interruptions, so he decided, no, he'll quit. Since he likes sporting goods, let's open a sporting goods store.

SPEAKER_03 54:16

Yeah. Last time he went hunting and fishing. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 54:18

Yeah, right. So we had enough money to buy a half a lot. And so we put up a 24 by 48 building.

SPEAKER_03 54:27

And that first year And most of that was leftover materials from Lyndall Cedar homes, wasn't it? Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:33

Was a lot of that well, and then, see, I think it was the second year we were here. Uh Haynes House was where the Presbyterian Church is now, and that was a three-story boarding school uh for the natives from other villages. And so the Presbyterian church wanted that torn down, and so Dave and I said we tear it down. And all I can I think we must have done it in the wintertime because all I can remember is being blessedly cold. It was so cold. But the bricks from it, went to Gilbert's house. You know, we built Sharmboy's house with it. Of course, oh, it was so cold. It was so cold. Dad worked on it and helped tear it down, and yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:13

So you just recycled Haines house into other buildings in Haynes.

SPEAKER_00 55:16

Yep, yep. I mean, he was always doing something.

SPEAKER_03 55:23

Yeah, and then uh there was a time that you guys had Haynes sanitation as well.

SPEAKER_00 55:26

Yeah, Haynes sanitation, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:28

And at the time, if I'm not, it's like where Haynes home building supply is now, it was behind there where you guys are doing it.

SPEAKER_00 55:34

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:35

And this is I I correct me if I get this wrong, but it was kind of funny because it was what is it a year or two ago, we're having, I don't know if it was at Christmas or if it was at Thanksgiving, Easter. One of the times the whole family was together, and dad was talking about that, and he was talking about just going out and he goes, Yeah, when you get too much, you just light it on fire and you burn it. And all of us are like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a second.

SPEAKER_05 56:00

We just put a pile and put some gas on it and goes, yep, you just burn it. All right. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 56:13

But I think for for us, it wasn't as much the fact that he was burning garbage, or that was it was just the matter-of-fact way that he was a did it. Yeah, it was a pilot that would just burn it.

SPEAKER_04 56:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 56:26

And so how long did you guys own Hain Sanitation as well?

SPEAKER_00 56:29

Just a couple years. A couple years. Two or three years. And then the other partners wanted to get out, and so we said, you take Hain Sanitation, we'll take North Star Enterprises and Alaska Sports. Then I think it was Alaska Sportshop, or maybe then we changed it to Alaska Sports Shop.

SPEAKER_03 56:44

I saw something, I think it was North Star Sports.

SPEAKER_00 56:46

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_03 56:47

Because I think there was a letterhead or something we saw somewhere where it was North Star Sports, or as a sign, I think that said North Star Sports, and then he changed it to Alaska Sports Shop.

SPEAKER_00 56:55

Yep, yep. And the first winter, I think we started in the fall building it, and of course we were down there every night pounding on the floor. You kids were down there, you know, passing Dales or whatever. And the first thing Dad had to sell at the Alaska Sports Shop was surplus Sears winter boots at$15 a pair.

SPEAKER_03 57:19

Fifteen bucks.

SPEAKER_00 57:21

And he'd call us up, sold two pairs a day, sold four pairs a day, and thankfully it was a long winter and they didn't last long, so people had to keep buying them.

SPEAKER_02 57:29

What 15 bucks? Sears robuck discontinued boots.

SPEAKER_00 57:36

And then trying to f we couldn't find a supplier because the where um there was already a sporting goods store down the street, and we couldn't find a wholesaler that would sell to us. We finally found Washington hardware that would sell to us. And so somehow we had some money, so we went down there, and dad was like, kid in the candy shop, was you you you well aware of his habits at buying shows. Yes, yes, yes. And so little by little we got a little bit more and a little bit more. And then uh my friend Ruth King came by one day and she said, Charlotte, we need a fabric store. There was a gal over at Port Chilcoot who had some fabric and some patterns in her basement. She said, Charlotte, we need something on Main Street. I said, Oh, okay. Well, I'd been with Dave to Sears a couple times, and uh, one time I got to go to their employee store, and they had these pre-cut fabrics. And I thought, look, I didn't want to be working full time. So I thought, well, pre-cut, you know, the women would buy them, Dave would tell off you go. Well, they sent bolts. And a lot of the women were very skeptical as to whether that not dad could cut that straight.

SPEAKER_03 58:43

It's all about he he informed me of this. It's all it's just like shooting free throws. Yep. It's all at the elbow. Keep the elbow in, keep it straight.

SPEAKER_00 58:51

And if they questioned him, he said, if it's crooked, yeah. I he would either either give him half price, or I mean, there was some, and nobody ever had to take them over. So then he started getting more and more sporting goods. I well, if you have fabric, you have to have some notions. If you have fabric and notions, you need some patterns. And so I was I was in the back corner, and so it's getting too crowded for both of us. But it was a wonderful setu situation because the women would be happy over in their corner and the men could talk hunting over there. But he said, I'm gonna buy a gun. What? If you're gonna buy a gun, I can get some. But so then we decide, okay, we'll borrow some money and we'll add on. So we borrowed$50,000 to add on from my store and to stock it really well. Well, oh the reason we got the the patterns in there, I talked to the gal who had them over there, and we traded a gun for the course David kept saying you never paid me for the gun. But we had just gotten kind of enclosed. And um, here comes this head honcho from Sears. Because David always told Haynes needs a Sears store. And we and he came up, he hated to fly, but he flew up here, checked at the post office, see how many post office boxes, did his research. He said, You build it, and we'll come. And so then we had to take that money and build another section with a higher roof because they were gonna have the carpet rolls of carpet. And so they had appliances, you know. And for several years, Haynes was the top uh seller in Alaska for Sears. Yeah, they had the the best, and they had some really good gals working there.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:40

Yeah, I remember they used to have that back room. Oh, yeah. It was just the front, like third, yeah, was they'd have their display of whatever it was, appliances and stuff, but then the back, they had it marked out on the floor, all these grids where they'd stack the freight, and there's quite a bit of stuff that went through there.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:57

And then they'd call and say, Here it is.

Building The Store And Bringing Sears

SPEAKER_03 1:01:00

And so it it was a very and so that was 75 that that was built. I don't remember. I want to think it's 75 because 76 because with the bicentennial in 76, I want to think that was the year that when we're doing the float that the you had the full front of the store.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:20

Okay, that could be.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:21

I don't remember because I was well so then we decided because what well what what year did I start kindergarten? Was it 76 or was it 75? Was I six?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:35

Because I remember coming over after kindergarten and helping with nails and everything like that. It was when I was in kindergarten.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:42

And you'd give him a sixpenny nail or whatever size he needed. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:48

So it was 75 and probably finished it in spring of 76 or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:51

So then Jimmy Combs' dad was building it for us. And we said, Well, if we're going to do that, and then his dad said, Well, I'll let's build another section on and I will rent it and have bulk groceries. Well, by the time I got done, he decided not to do that. So Joe somebody came in and had sort of a thrift shop, bulk figs and stuff, and just kind of a hippie shop. And then he moved out, and about that time, Sally Thompson didn't want to do the bakery anymore, so we moved the bakery up here.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:23

So where I I remember going to that bakery before I was up here. Where was that?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:29

Um, just above Bears Den.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:32

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:33

I'm trying to remember because I remember going in there with grandpa, and but then that I was still really, really young, and then it was all of a sudden there's no bakery anywhere. Then I'm going with grandpa. Yeah. And until it was over here. Yeah. Well, I was at the store for a little bit. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:48

But then it was an insurance thing, right? It was insurance.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:50

Insurance went way up and he said, Ah, we can't afford this. So then he had been talking to John Dobler, so he bought the building where the bakery is now, that which was four apartments. And we'd been working with the farm at that time, and so they redid the inside to make it into a restaurant and and bakery.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:07

And then they ran it until they sold it.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:10

And so then he moved the sporting goods from the original section over to the far end, and then you put men's clothing in the sport shop.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:17

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:18

You had the fabrics on the far end, the other one was Sears and Roebuck.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:22

So there were four individual doors.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:24

Four individual doors to go in there, the Haynes Mini Mall. Yep. And I one of my I still have this distinct memory. I know it's Kurt and I. I don't know if Carl was involved with this too, because you were you and Jeanette were Girl Scout leaders at the time. And I distinctly remember Girl Scout boxes of Girl Scout cookies, the cases of them. And I think it was Kurt and I that we made forts. Because you didn't you didn't have any merchandise in there yet. There's just this big room, tile floor, and all these boxes of cookies. It's like, let's stack these suckers up and make some forts. Perfect use for it. I tell you, yeah. Perfect use for Girl Scout cookies. That's right.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:00

That's right.

Living Tight And Stretching Every Dollar

SPEAKER_03 1:04:03

So now you're mid-70s in 1970s. You're you're not 70 at that time. That was much, much later. You've got two kids, that you hadn't been teaching for a while. Dad had just it's been a few years in business. Was this at that time were you thinking that was a good decision? Or were you going, my God, what the heck were we doing?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:29

Well, we were living on$300 a month. Because that's all we could afford. 125 went for house payment. Holy cow. But you know, we did it.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:43

Well, that was one when you had mentioned earlier that you figured you're looking back on it, you were probably poor, but you never knew it.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:49

I never I I never thought we were poor. Yeah. But I look back at the things as a home ec teacher that the the meals we had and everything, we were always well fed, we always had good food. But I look back now at what you were feeding us, I was like, mom knew how to stretch a dollar in the kitchen. She she could make a dollar go a long way with the different, and it was always uh there's a lot of variety to what we're eating, but looking back at what we're eating as a kid, it's like mom knew what she was doing. She she she knew how to shop.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:24

And you know, you just have to make do with what you have.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:27

Well, and part of it too, because grant we always had a big garden down below the house with grandpa for several years, he would help with that. Then we had the chickens, so we had eggs, and at the end of the year we'd have the chickens. Dad didn't do as much hunting anymore after a few years, so he didn't have as much of the moose meat and stuff. But yeah, it was just figuring out a way to make it happen.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:46

Yeah, yeah.

The House Fire And Starting Over

SPEAKER_03 1:05:47

So the net the the next big thing for me in my memory, and you can correct me if there's something in between this, things seem to be going along well. Stores growing, happening there, and then Was it I want to say it was September or October of 78 when I was in third grade when the house caught on fire or the garage. It was third grade, and so I'm thinking because I so it had to be fall of 78, because in 80 was my I was in I finished fourth grade in 80. Okay, yeah. So it'd have been spring of 79 that I got out of third grade.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:29

But dad was in Seattle on a buying trip.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:32

On a buying trip.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:33

With Frank Putnam, buying for four seasons of the stuff. So he was buying for the four seasons.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:37

Is that what they were doing?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:38

I couldn't remember which where where they were going. But you and Sarah and I were home. Sally our black lab was home.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:45

And that night Retha had come up for dinner because the next day Scott Pattison was coming up.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:50

Oh and so I was coming right up.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:52

Extra chicken, extra potato salad, you know, for the next day. And when Retha came, she said, I smell something burning. I said, Oh, my oven, you know, it's just so dirty. Yeah. Really? Yeah. I do not remember that part. And then when she left, she said, I still saw something burning. I said, It's just my oven, you know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:09

Yeah, like five o'clock in the morning, Sarah's waking me up because Sally's outside of our bedroom window going crazy. Yep. Look out the window, and the whole garage is just engulfed in flames.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:21

And and for some reason, I banged, probably a paint thing broke or whatever, exploded. But I woke up and I said, Kids, there's a fire. Get out of here. Crawl out your window. That's where the fire is.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:31

I remember that part. And then we came down and you were in the living room trying to call the fire department. But with the party line, they you could hear them. I could hear the police, but I they couldn't hear me. They couldn't hear you.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:44

Yeah. And so we crawl out your bedroom window.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:47

And so then I'm saying there, okay, now what? I I need to get some stuff out of here. What do I need to get out of here?

SPEAKER_03 1:07:52

And that's when Stan Jones and Craig came over. Craig came over.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:55

Craig said, get out of there.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:00

But then the fire department comes up. We're over. I mean, pretty soon because it was cold and everything, we didn't have really any clothes on whatever we're sleeping in. And so we go over to Stan and Pat's. And uh so I remember I think it was that night we slept in their basement, and then the next night we're out in their travel trailer. Yep. Yeah. And to this day, if I'm in a travel that it was raining, it was fall, it was raining. That sounded so much like the flames to me. I could not sleep in that travel trailer. And any time that I've been in a camper, travel trailer like that in the rain, that brings me back to that time just like in a heartbeat. And I just I think it's probably why I've never had one.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:41

Because it always sounds, I I don't know if I've ever slept well in one when it's raining. If it's not raining, it's fine. But when it's raining, that's still that sound on the roof.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:50

Well, and and see part of it too, with our ceiling that had that funny tile, and it it crackled and crackled and crackled. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:57

And it melted everything. It melted, melted down the walls. Oh, that was such a mess.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:02

Oh, it was such a mess. We had to strip it down to the two by fours because it was.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:07

Between the smoke and the smoke.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:08

Oh, and you guys were so sensitive to smoke smell after that. Oh, yeah. For such a long time. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:15

Because all of our there are our clothes were fine. Yeah. Most of them. Yeah. But they were just black. Yeah. Or really stained from the smoke. And you could not get that. That yeah. And I didn't. I I don't think for me it was so much that they were stained with the smoke, but the smell. And the memory back to waking up and seeing that. Yep. But I look at it that Sally, our lab, saved us. Saved us. Yep. Exactly. And yeah, maybe we would have heard it when it was. I know as anybody that knew me at that time, and I probably would have been roasted before I woke up. Yes. I wasn't going to wake up on my own, more than likely. No. No. So without Sarah and Sally there, I would have been cooked. But uh yeah, no, Sally, she for however whatever reason she knew right outside, she was right outside of her window between us and maybe she'd started barking at my window.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:09

No, I wasn't getting a response. Who knows?

SPEAKER_03 1:10:12

She might have started over there. But no, that was I think for me that was that was a that was a a big moment and just so many things changed right then. And so we're we came and were Elsie's Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:30

Well first we stayed out uh Marty, Tanges.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:33

I thought that was later. I thought we stayed there at the beginning, and then in the spring we moved to Tang's.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:40

I thought it was vice versa, but I don't remember.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:43

Could be.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:46

It could have been. Yeah, I don't know. I know we stayed at both places.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:52

Because actually, well, if Scott came right away, it was at Tang's first because they uh Scott was there.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:59

I remember him being there and that's where Gene Martin was.

unknown 1:11:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:03

Gene Martin's house, right? Yeah. Was that Tang's? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So Gene Gene Martin's where he was at. I always thought that was a really cool house.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:11

It was a cool house, yes.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:14

And then we were staying at Elsie's down on Main Street, which is cool. It's right, I mean right right across from school, right next to the store.

unknown 1:11:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:22

And she had cable TV.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:24

Yes. That was the first time we got to watch TV. But do you remember how you'd you wanted to watch uh what was that, Highway Patrol or whatever? Chips. Chips. Of course. Yes. And Dad wanted to watch uh uh Lawrence Welk. Oh, grandpa would always want to watch and they're at the same time, she would be switched channel back back and forth.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:45

There's many a day that I thought he should go watch Lawrence Welk with Retha and leave us to watch chips. Because there there was a conflict there.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:53

There was a conflict there.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:55

That wasn't my first and only conflict with my grandfather. The next major one came when I when uh I was 14 and Retha gave me that Toyota Corolla that uh and I only had my learner's permit. And so Grandpa's like, he's thinking, huh, he needs somebody to ride with him. Yeah. He's like, Doug, how about you bring me down and help with the tomatoes early in the morning? Yeah, four o'clock in the morning. I was like, what time, Grandpa? He says, Well, I should be there by five. I'm like, that is not happening. And he was so mad at me. I'm trying to reasonable, like, when have you known me to be up at five o'clock in the morning? And you know that I hate tomatoes.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:36

Why would I start changing my sleeping habits now for tomatoes? For tomatoes. Give me something else and maybe, but not for tomatoes. That is not happening. But I I remember because he'd always want to. I'd either drop them off at Retha's or at the bakery. I wasn't supposed to tell you if I dropped him off at the bakery because he wasn't supposed to go there. But he had diabetes. But he had diabetes. But because the school is right across the street here, and a lot of times in the morning, there'd be a police car that'd be stationed somewhere looking at that, and you couldn't drive through the back. You had to go out on Main Street and I'd park alongside the store. And he always wanted me to drop him off and then just drive over. I was like, Grandpa, I can't do that. Oh no, no, it'll be fine. It'll be fine. Grandpa, they're watching me go over to middle to the junior high school. They know I'm not 16. I'm gonna get a ticket on this. They'll just pitch you, it won't be that bad. Don't worry about it. I'm like, yeah, I'm not if you're gonna if you're gonna bail out, go ahead. But I'm driving over to the store and you're gonna have to. I apologize, but you're gonna have to walk back. But just about every morning that I drive down, he's like, you can just drop me off here.

Grandpa Moves To Alaska And Works

SPEAKER_00 1:13:44

Like, yeah, no, I can't, Grandpa. Yeah, no, I can't. Well, one story I want to tell you, because you probably don't remember it. In 65, mother and dad came up to visit.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:53

Of course I don't remember it. It wasn't born until 69.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:56

Well, but I mean telling the story.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:58

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:59

And so dad wanted to go goat hunting. Well, Dave and Shell John, and I think somebody else had gone up 18 mile, 1st of August. I said, I'm not gonna go if it's as hot as it was the day before. Well, we left at four o'clock in the morning.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:13

So of course it was cooler.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:15

It was the hottest day of the year. I about died. So anyway, mother and dad come up. Dad wants to go goat hunting. So we start, and Dave kept saying, Don't take anything more than necessary. Don't take anything more than necessary. And mother said, Oh, we can just carry a shopping bag between us. And I said, No, mother, we can't. I know we can't. So mother was game to go. She had did not have hiking boots. So she wore Dave's Converse high tops.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:42

And how old is grandma and grandpa at this time?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:45

Um so 66. Mother was um 55, and dad was 56 with one arm. With one arm, rifle over her shoulder, climbing through the bush. So we get to the top and make camp. Next morning we wake up, fog down to the ground. Well, Dave and I had been very kind. We gave mother and dad the double sleeping bag, and Dave and I had the single sleeping bag. And then since it was so warm.

unknown 1:15:12

Wait.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:13

You guys shared a single sleeping bag?

SPEAKER_00 1:15:15

Yeah, yeah. And then since it was so cold out, he invited the dog in into our single sleeping bag.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:30

How do you fit you and dad and the dog in those sleeping bags? Because he he only had labs, right? Oh yeah. Even up here. So you got a black lab that you're all right.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:42

Continue on with your and mother kept saying, I would die right now, but no one would have the strength to carry me back town. So anyway, they go back to Minnesota. Before they even get back to Minnesota, Dad said, We're moving to Alaska. That trip was 65, they decided that we're moving. Moving to Alaska. So they move up here in 66, and P dad wanted to be partly partly employed.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:11

And people said, You're over 50. You've only got one arm. Where are you going to find work? Uh wherever he wanted. Within a year, he was making more than Dave was teaching. He cleaned the Pioneer Bar, he cleaned the bank, he cleaned Schnabel's office, he cleaned the food center. I forget what else he cleaned. You know, he also didn't he doing the state parks. He did the state parks, he did Mosquito Lake, uh Chilcoot, and um uh one on the edge of town here.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:37

Um Port Chilcoot.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:38

Port Chilcoot. And he supplied all the wood, cut all the wood for the can. Of course the Chilcoot wasn't as big then. It was just down at that one area. Supplied all the wood, hauled the garbage. Yeah. And then I don't know what year the Wickersham came, but he contracted to clean the Wickersham between Haynes and Skagway. So a bunch of us women would go out there, meet the Wickersham, ride over to Skagway, clean the state rooms, and come back. And we called ourselves Hubs Harem.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:14

So in the two-hour, three-hour trip or whatever, you guys would clean everything and come back. So that was before obviously they had onboard stewards and everything on the ships.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:24

And that ship was so gorgeous, it was so beautiful. Yeah. But yeah, Dad, I mean, and I think he he made more than he'd ever made in his life.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:36

I remember Tim telling me stories, especially at the Pioneer, yeah, that he loved working there because everybody they dropped the coins and whatever, that there's usually quite a bit of money left on the floor in the morning or whenever he went in to clean.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:50

Well, then mother got cancer, and so she went out. And so if dad went out to visit her, then Bonnie Sharmboy and I would clean the pioneer. And so it was early in the morning while the kids, you kids were still asleep, so the men husbands were at home. And you and Bonnie are out cleaning the bark. Yeah, and so you could that buffer, that big bumper. If you didn't do it right, I mean it was dancing, that's all around the floor. And Vern Moray would sit over in the restaurant just laughing.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:18

I wish I had video of that. Dad and Terry home with the kids. You and Bonnie bucking out the pioneer.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:33

All right. So yeah. But then mother died in '69. And um she found she had cancer shortly after she got here. She just had a physical, but around Thanksgiving time, she went to see Stan Jones and she said he wants some further tests. He said, No, I'm gonna wait until after the holidays. Well, they uh she just kept having uh surgery after surgery. And the doctor in Juno at one time said he'd never remove such a large tumor from anyone. Yeah. So uh, but then she went back to Minnesota. Dad stayed here to work and would go back every once in a while. Yeah. And then after mother passed, then he just stayed up here.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:11

Yeah. So how how long did he continue working? Because I remember as a kid he was doing when I was really young, he was doing some work, like helping out Arethas and stuff, but I didn't see, I don't think I knew him for a long time where he was doing all of the cleaning unless that was just out of my head.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:28

I don't remember how long he did that. Yeah. But it was mainly in his later time where he just basically worked at the laundromat. Yeah, it kept that going. And he'd come home and say, so and so was jamming all these pants in the in the tub. I was pulling them out as fast as you won't even get wet if you put them on. And then I'll have to, I'll have to uh fix it when you break it.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:56

Well, one of my favorite things with him is at dinner, he would tell us what because him and Ed Vogel would, or Jim Burlet. Yep, they would any construction project that was going on, specifically road construction or anything, yeah, they would go out and we would get the rundown, how far they're making, what they're doing wrong.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:16

Yep, yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:17

Verily, very rarely was it was they were doing right, but we always knew what they were doing wrong on any kind of project. And I distinctly remember when I was on the borough assembly and they were redoing Fourth Avenue from Main Street up, and they were talking about, well, we don't know exactly what we're gonna get into. There's these problems, and I said, Here's the deal. The problem you have is when the last time that was redone is they took a bunch of tree stumps and they turned them upside down and they just put some fill over the top. If there's no rock in it, there's a bunch of so what you're getting is you got these roots and stuff that are coming up through the chip coat on there, and that's caused it, and they're looking at me like you don't know what you're talking about. And one of them came over and said, Why do you? I said, I would go after school and I would sit over because grandpa was in the Gene Hills place over here, Jim Broulette was over there, and I'd be at one of their because they always had milk and cookies in the afternoon. So wherever they were at, there was an incentive for me to go visit them and have some milk and cookies, and they're working on the road, and these guys are telling me exactly that. And so they tore it up, and the guy's like, I don't know how you knew that, but that's exactly what the problem was with the road. I was like, Jim and my dad and my grandpa told me about that 30 years ago, 40 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:31

Well, and also uh dad was on the assembly or mayor, whatever he was at the time, and they'd have the meeting the next night for dinner. Dad would say, How come you guys decided on da-da-da-da-da? And Dave said, That wasn't even discussed, you know. But at the coffee shop, at the coffee shop, grandpa was one of the key ones.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:55

He was definitely dialed into the coffee shop.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:58

Oh, yes. If if there's certain times of day, if you were looking for him, he was he was at he was at the coffee shop, and I would fix him breakfast, and then he'd go to the coffee shop and have pancakes.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:09

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:09

And he went back one time to Minnesota, and my sister was fixing pancakes, and he said, These don't taste right. He said, What are you doing? Because Vern Morey makes the best pancakes. He does, and my sister, that's what I'm doing. Well, it doesn't taste the same.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:27

So what as as we're talking about food and stuff with grandpa, I distinctly remember I had to be it had to be my junior year because I remember I had the blue GMC and I bought that before my junior year in high school, and it was the next spring. And I know it was before dad had broken his back, but I was I'd always pick grandpa because he wasn't driving at that point. And so on the way home, I would I'd pick him up to take him home. And I stopped up to see Retha. Grandpa wasn't there. So I go down the garage, grandpa's not there. I go back up, I was like, Retha, and she's like, nope. So I go back down and I start walking towards the bakery, and in that field where uh Mickey's got the containers right now, I hear something, I go over, and he's laid out on the ground. And I'm like, Grandpa, he goes, No, no, no, just give me up, give me up. I was like, Grandpa, what happened? He said, I think my because he had he was diabetic. His blood sugar was off. He had passed out, hoping somebody was good there. And so he's like, Take me to the food center. I need to get a candy bar. And and I was like, All right, whatever. I'm panicking. I said, Do we need to go to the clinic? No, no, I'll be fine. I just need a candy bar. And he goes, and so then he goes, You can't tell your mom about this. Yeah, sorry, grandpa, that's not gonna happen. Uh this there's a there's a lot of things I'll I've covered for you over the years. This isn't gonna be one of them. I didn't oh, he was mad at me that I was gonna I told you about that. Like, she doesn't need to know, it's fine. I just want blood sugars. No, she needs to know. You're passing out in a place where we don't know where you're at.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:01

She needs to know. Well, and the reason he wasn't driving in those later years, because he had been back to Minnesota for Christmas and driving his the pickup, whatever, and he put on the gas instead of the brakes and ran in the ditch and took down a tree. Well, he made the mistake. We picked him up from the ferry when he came, and he made the mistake of telling us that at supper time. Well, Dave and I were going out on that same ferry to go down for a show, so we said, Dad's not allowed to drive. Yep. So Sarah had her license, but then she left a couple days later for a basketball trip. And so then you had to drive, you would drop him off, bring the truck to the store.

Driving Lessons And Winter Stories

SPEAKER_03 1:24:43

Yep. No, I was I always grandpa, I think, taught Sarah and I to drive more than you and Dad did. Yep. Because he was I he wanted he wanted somebody to drive him. Right. There was a vested interest from him, and I I know Sarah's gonna back me up on this, but it was always like, give a little more gas. Yeah, give a little more gas. Grandpa, I'm going to speed line. Yeah, you can usually go five to ten over, it'll be fine. Give a little more gas. And so everybody, and you're you're a very good driver, you follow the rules. Dad, when he was in town, he would be at a crawl. Yep, it would seem like it take us 15 minutes to get the mile from our house down to the store, getting ready. It's like, Dad, I can walk. He was just so, and everyone's like, My God, your dad drives slow. It's like, yes, he does. Soon as you got across the border, he's that car. You see a car, it's like two miles. We need to pass him. Yeah, we need to pass. And and when Sarah and I were driving, I remember the one time we're going to Anchorage when Vincent um was here from Switzerland. We're going to drop him off at the Anchorage Airport, and Sarah and I were taking turns driving, and it was a he made it a competition that yeah, okay, we passed this many cars, you need to pass them. Yeah. And we tell my friends, and they're like, Yeah, your dad's not like that. I was like, Yeah, my my grandpa, hub, and my dad are both like, put if you're in town, you need to be careful. But as soon as you get out of town, hammer down. And so I was crazy because later, you guys are like, you guys are growing too fast. You guys go too fast. You have the teachers. Who's teaching us to drive this way? Who's teaching us to drive this way?

SPEAKER_05 1:26:28

This is not our fault.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:33

But the the one time that you guys got us, because you you could see at that time where DeWitt's house isn't our house. You guys could see down the road partially, but Pat and Stan could see right down Allen Road. Yep. And Sarah and Ralph were dating. He had his big truck. I was in the Toyota Corolla at the time. I don't know why all three of us couldn't fit in the truck to go to open gym. I don't think Sarah wanted her little brother with her and her boyfriend, probably. Probably. So we go in different vehicles, we're going down there, and we're kind of fake racing going down the hill. Were we going really fast? No. We're going faster than we probably should. Yes. Get home, you and dad. Dad sits us down. You guys are both there. So you guys driving a little fast today, were you?

SPEAKER_01 1:27:21

And Sarah and I are like, the hell? There's no way they saw us. And we're like, what? Well, going a little fast. Like, where did you hear that? Doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:34

Going a little fast. I don't think it was until 20 years later that dad told us that it was Pat Jones. And this is after Pat had passed away. Like 15 years out, 10 or 15 years after Pat had passed before he gave it up that that's who. And from then on, anytime I was driving, I'm like, who's watching? Who's watching? I it was it was extremely, extremely effective for my driving. In town after that.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:02

Well, remember, like you say, we could see down the road when you were in kindergarten or first grade, we had wonderful snow conditions for sledder. Um, rudder sleds. It was just sheer ice going down the hill. So you would lay on top of dad, Sarah would have her sled, I'd look out the window and see if there was any cars, and I'd say, go! And I could just watch you go. And every once you'd hit a uh piece of gravel, so I'd see a spark. Okay, and you'd make it downtown in just record time.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:29

Oh, we're down, we're down by the DOT in no time at all. And then we'd we'd hoof it up to uh union and then we'd sled down um Fifth Avenue. We'd stop at Rekas and we'd sled down the last little hill coming down to the store because that one winter is perfect conditions.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:43

Perfect conditions.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:44

Yeah, we wouldn't even go to the end of the driveway. We'd start right in front of the house. We'd put your dad would just say, Give me a push. Yep. So Sarah would have to run, but I'd push him and then I'd hop on his back and down to school it went.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:28:57

But going uphill, this is one I've given you a bad time about this. I know you guys have heard this. Most other people haven't. This is my trauma, one of my early trauma stories. Sarah thinks I'm everybody in my family thinks I'm overselling this. But this is my story.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:13

Sticking to it. We did not have for the longest time a vehicle that would make it up the hill if there was if it was snow. Winter time. In the winter time. So we were walking back, it's a mile. It wasn't that big of a deal, walking back and forth. So a lot of times we'd pull our toboggans down or ride in the toboggans down, and then we'd pull them back up. Hardly any street lights on Allen Road at that time. I distinctly remember one time there's two distinct instances. One of them we're coming down the hill, and the snow pal is coming up, and we're right above Lap Hams, and I see that, and the snow seemed to me like over my waist. I can hardly move. And I see this plow coming up faster than I think I'm gonna. I thought I was gonna get run over by the plow. And you guys are just like, hurry up! Better hurry up. I'm just gonna get sucked away by the snow plow, and it's gonna be in it. And my parent, my family doesn't even care. They just want me to hurry. They do not understand that they're all much taller than me at this moment. And the other one is going back up the hill. It's dark, it's night, and you guys, Sarah's much taller than I am. You and dad, you guys are taller. You guys are just plowing your way up the hill. Nobody will let me ride in a sled and get a ride. I gotta hike. In my mind, I'm hearing wolves howling in the distance. My family's just gonna leave me in the dark to be eaten by the wolves in the wintertime because I can't get up the hill in this deep snow.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:40

And I remember so many times. Oh, look at Douglas, look at the shadow. I mean, you know, trying to get me up there.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:45

But you're not anytime I anytime somebody complains I'm walking too fast, I'm gonna go talk to my family. And now I complain you're complaining. They're the ones that are like, keep up, keep up.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:59

I remember one time you were riding your bike up the hill, and we came along with the pickup, and you grabbed the handle and we're just riding. Well, unfortunately, there was a policeman living along there. And he came along and said, uh, no.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:11

Do you want to know where I learned that from?

SPEAKER_00 1:31:14

My dad?

Mill Shutdown And Reinventing Haines

SPEAKER_03 1:31:14

No, Stan Jones. Stan, there's a couple times when I was a kid. I'm I'm trying to ride, I'm riding my bike up the hill, and it was towards afternoon. He's done with the clinic. He's coming up and he'd pull up and he'd say, You need a ride? I was like, I don't know. I said, No, I can get it, I don't need to put it in the back. He's no, no, no, just grab onto the mirror or grab onto the side. And so I'm having him going up the hill. And and I should ask him this sometime because I don't know if he was looking for business for the clinic. Yeah. Or he was trying to help him get to the top of the hill. There was more than once, yeah. I I hitched a ride with Stan going up the hill. And so, yeah, when you guys came along, I was like, this must be a thing. This is what Stan does. Yeah, we do, yeah. So now we're well back, we've traded some good stories here. Yeah. But was it 78 or 79 that the mill shut down? The two saw mills shut down in Haynes.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:12

I don't remember.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:15

I'm trying to figure out when it was that dad first got it in, they first had that Haynes Independent Businessman's meeting, and he got the idea for the American Ball Legal Foundation.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:25

Yeah, because when the mill shut down, we thought, okay, we're losing 200 and some jobs, you know, all the equipment has left town. What are we going to do? Is Haynes going to survive? So Dave and Doug Hess and John Hollowell and several others got together and said, let's sort of have a town meeting and discuss, see, see what Haynes has to offer that we can make money on. We had lots of dinners and meetings and so forth, and uh different divide up into smaller groups and decided, okay, you take this, you take this. And uh Bruce Gilbert had outdoor recreation and he wanted to build an ice rink up there 26 mile. And I don't know, for some reason they said, Well, we got lots of eagles, can we capitalize on that? And for some reason Dave got selected to deal with eagles. And so then he got the bright idea that, well, it's coming up with the centennial for the bicentennial.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:22

The bicentennial of the eagles of national syndrome was 1982. Yep, yeah. And so he was gonna have a commemorative rifle for that. How's he's told me numerous times about you know trying to get the funding and everything like that? What was going you've never really shared your thoughts during that time. He's flying back, he's gonna make 3,000 guns.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:45

Which is what the minimum was.

The Commemorative Rifle Gamble

SPEAKER_03 1:33:46

Was the minimum was 3,000? You've got to, you're basically signing, putting everything you own on the line to make this happen. Everybody's telling him don't do it, it's not a good idea. What was going through your head at that time? I'm I'm guessing you're probably like at one point you're trying to slow him down. It's like, David, is this a good idea? Well, you know your father slow him down. Yeah, they're not I've seen this since then. At older stages, I've seen how this process goes where he gets an idea and you're like, David, I don't think that's the best idea. I think we do it, and he just keeps whipp pushing and pushing and pushing and pushing, and he makes it happen. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:25

And so you you're you're at home, you've got two kids, you've got this business going, and he's like, just put them all on the line and we make some good. And at one time, wasn't it five or six boats that you guys owned that were and helping people buy them?

SPEAKER_00 1:34:45

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:46

So then he wants to build 3,000 rifles.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:49

And so Hans Fuller provided a lot of the money, but Dave had to come up with a letter of credit, I think, for$500,000 or whatever. And okay, where are we going to get it? He went to the bank here and they said, Yeah, no, this is this is Haynes Alaska. No, I don't think so. He's like, okay, what do I do? And so he just sat back in the office, just fretting and fuming and calling different people, and he finally said, Well, may as well call, go for shooter supply. They've been at would you be interested? And they did. And so they took half the guns. Problem solved.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:22

Problem solved. But when they delivered the 1,500 guns up here, that still boggles my mind that we unload we unloaded 1,500 guns at one shipment.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:34

And there were um seven locks on the back of the container with seven people there to unlock.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:42

Really?

SPEAKER_00 1:35:42

Yes, because they weren't gonna it'll that was too valuable a cargo to you just trust with because we had had guns stolen off the off the freight before, you know. Oh really? Oh, yeah. I remember one time a Smith and Wesson went missing, and yeah, well, it got lost along the way, you know, and so they weren't gonna let 1500 guns go.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:01

Well wise on their part.

SPEAKER_04 1:36:03

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:06

But what was that a little nerve-wracking for you as he's going down this? Like, what are we thinking here?

SPEAKER_00 1:36:12

Yeah, but you just go with the flow and hope it works out.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:18

At the time, I I mean, I remember he had his notebook, and he was pretty much anybody that came in before they were even made. Oh, you want one? Yeah, you want one? I can get you this number, I can get you this number, I can get you this number, and you can get a match set, you can and all this stuff that he was he was constantly talking about it, and he had all these names, and he's like, Oh, some but some then it's a name would be scratched out because then they're like, Well no, I can't do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:40

And uh and when he was talking about building the gun, this one guy said, stupidest idea he'd ever heard. Well, then when the prototype came and Dave had it in the counter, the guy was bringing his relatives' company and said, See what's being made from anything. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, that was some trying times, but we made it.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:02

Because they didn't sell all right away either. No, no, it took a while to sell all of those. It took a long time. Because shortly after they were produced, the clutching with gun bar just collapsed.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:16

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:16

Up until then, they were pretty much a guaranteed sale on it, but right after that. And because he was that was the if I remember correctly from him talking about it, that was the first one, first Winchester commemorative that had kind of been made by a non that wasn't Winchester, yeah, that a private party's commissioned it and said, Listen, we want to do a commemorative rifle, this is what we want to do. And that was kind of a the first. And I remember because of that rifle, you guys went back to Chicago and he got, I forget what what small businessman of the year small business award or whatever. But you were showing us, you gave me the brochure recently that you'd found some when you're cleaning out the house, and it cracked me up because Walmart got an award at that same one. There's there's another one that was like Dick Sporting Goods or something. That was before they were the Dick's sporting goods they are now. But it's kind of there's like, yeah, Walmart, Alaska Sports. I'm like, whoa, what? Yeah, what the they're in a different class that they got and everything, but still reading that program, I was like, damn, dad, way to go.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:21

But very few people knew that we got the award. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:24

Still over there in the office.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:25

No, it's at my house. Oh, you got it, you brought it home? Yep, yep, they wanted it home.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:38:29

Yep, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:38:32

Does anyone in town have one like that?

SPEAKER_01 1:38:34

Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. Do you want one?

SPEAKER_03 1:38:38

We see there's still a couple available. But yeah, there several people in town bought them already. Um, I've I mean, our family has has a couple of them, but yeah, yeah. And so and then fast forward in 2012, actually they didn't come out until 2013. I worked with Winchester to come up with a 30th anniversary of it. And dad was ticked because I only had to do like 200 guns total or something like that. He's like, What the heck?

SPEAKER_01 1:39:05

I had to do 3,000.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:06

I was like, Well, you know, I'm better at negotiating than you are, apparently, Dad.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:10

But he always kept rubbing in. He said, I sold 1,500 guns in one day.

Building The Eagle Museum Dream

SPEAKER_03 1:39:13

Yeah, yeah. Yes, yes, I never got over that. He always he always told me that one sale, one day, 1,500 guns. And he was always asking if I was gonna top that. Right. And uh, yeah, I never came close. Yeah, never came close. And you don't want to, and I don't, I mean, but if the circumstances are right, yeah, you know, the the risk reward on guns these days, uh yeah, buying 1500 and selling them now. No, no, don't need to do that. Yep. So did so that was 82 that the guns come out. So then things keep kind of progressing because then like in 84, we put in sport uh Sears moves out in 80 83 or 84, put in hardware in that section where Sears was kind of changing it up again and going down that direction, and everything seems to be moving fairly decent, right? You can correct me if I missed anything until October of 87. And dad breaks his back building the ball. Well, during this time, since he sold the gun, he couldn't just like not do anything for a while. So he decides to build the American Ball Legal Foundation Museum, and so in '87, and I think he even started in '85 or '86 when they cleared the ground.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:32

Clearing it, and so quite a bit. And then and what he was doing too, uh your dad was a salesman. I mean, he could talk you to death.

SPEAKER_03 1:40:38

Well, yeah, he just keep talking until you do it just to shut him up.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:42

But he came up with this the idea if he could get, I think it was 200 people to pledge$1,000. Yeah, that would basically pay for the materials and they'd use volunteer labor. And he knew most of the people in town didn't have a thousand dollars. Yeah, but he could pay$200 a year for five years.

SPEAKER_02 1:41:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:02

And so some did pay a thousand dollars up front, and some just paid the two hundred, and some didn't pay anything after that. But anyway, it was a good idea. But yeah, then he breaks his back.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:14

Well, before we get into the breaking of the back, we were it was I one of the things that drove me crazy with dad, because he's at this one of many, but he was at the store all the time. And as soon as I got a driver's license, it was in the summertime, and he's like, We're gonna work at the center tonight. It's like, well, no, I was gonna do this. Nope, we're gonna go over there and work at the center. And a lot of times it'd be you, Sarah, and I and Dad. Sometimes you'd find somebody else, but he would quite often, if there's a bigger project or something, he's like, I need X number of people for tonight. These are some names. Go go see if you can get them. So I'm driving around town calling in favors. It got to the point that people did not want to see me at all because they knew I was gonna want them to go volunteer when they had no desire to volunteer over there at all. It's like, that really isn't that fair, dad. Well, I don't have time. You need to, I need this many people. I'm like, come on.

SPEAKER_04 1:42:15

Okay, yeah.

The Accident That Changed Everything

SPEAKER_03 1:42:16

So, but in 87, they get it was moving, it was moving along really well. And so the the the main exhibit area, you got three walls up, trying to get the fourth one up. October 14th, wall don't have enough guys to quite get it up, comes back, he gets caught underneath it, bent in half, head to his knees, crushes one vertebrae, half a vertebrae on the other on each side, gets metabac to Juno. I'm in Juno. I I I still remember because you had called, we're Santa McFeeder's house, and uh finding out you were telling me that he was there, and I was down there for a college fair, and you said go to the college fair, and then they'll drop you by the hospital. I don't know why I went to the college fair. I don't even remember being at the college fair. I I got nothing out of going to the college fair out of there because I'm trying to figure out what's going on. But walking into the hospital and first seeing you and the expression on your face, and then walking in there and seeing dad with all these tubes, I was that was a whole new world. Now it took a I think it it was instantaneous, but it also took a little bit that things are really different right now. Things are changing, things changed rapidly in a huge way. In a huge way. Thinking back at it, I mean you're trying, I know you're trying to keep things together for me, but I could tell it's like this this is something different.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:00

But what was interesting, they let you on the plane the next morning to say goodbye. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:44:05

So we we're at the hospital, dad's all drugged up, and he's kind of saying a little bit. I don't even remember what he said, but he was able to talk a little bit. And uh I go back to McFeeder's and go out to the airport the next morning. And the I have no idea why this thing, I I think I've told this story before, but leaving McFeeder's house, and I didn't want to wake anybody up. And first of all, you're not supposed to drive cars when you're traveling for school. And that day we had Steve McFeeders, he's like, Bring me to work, and then you guys have the car. And he goes, Me and Bent and Bruce and Mike Flegel and Kurt Heinrich. So he wasn't really worried that we're gonna get in a lot of trouble. But the he's like, We got got back to the house that night, and he's like, Doug, what do you need? And I said, Well, this he goes, just take the car. So I didn't want to wake anybody up. So I back out of the garage. I have no this first time I've driven this car at night. I have no idea how to turn on the headlights, and so I'm trying to get to the airport and trying to turn on the headlights. It wasn't until I got to the bottom of the hill I figured out where the headlights were at. But yeah, get to get to the airport, go through at that time, it was just the X-ray machine. Yeah, you didn't have to do anything else, didn't have to have a boarding pass or anything, and get through that, wearing my letterman's jacket, and get to the jetway, and they're like, Where's your boarding pass? I was like, My dad's on the Medevac on there. They said I could come, and like, okay. Yeah, yeah, just go ahead and walk on walk on the plane. But the house apart, and I think I was I think Bill was one that I shared this with when we were talking about that because he was on he helped dad get home because he was in the Juneau airport when dad came back that first time. But the the flight attendants were great, were thrilled because no smoking, yeah, because he was on oxygen. Yeah, well, you go back and they had like three layers of seats just.

SPEAKER_05 1:45:52

I had to buy nine seats. I had to buy nine seats. Nine seats.

SPEAKER_03 1:45:55

And so three rows, three rows, because he's strapped down on these seats, and there's people all around. I'm like, I can't even thinking back at it now. We got Life Light and Airlift Northwest and everything.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:11

And when the flight attendants were making their announcement, you know, getting everybody ready for the flight, they said, and as you realize we have someone on oxygen. So if you feel you need to smoke, just step outside.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:22

Perfect. But the the thing on that, that I I don't know if it's because I didn't have a bag with me or anything, or it's my letterman's jacket, but the look from the passengers as I was walking back, that pity or whatever, that that's a the hospital was one thing. Seeing that that morning, oh man, I was like, this is even worse than I thought. This is worse than I thought. And then so I think that day, I don't know if we flew home, I think we flew home. And uh the next day going to school, the the the rule when you traveled was you always had to have your lessons done when you got back. And Harold Morton was one of the most strict on that. And it ticked me off because when I got back, he had said, Doug, it's all right if you don't have yours. And that I was like, Hell no, I got my homework. Why wouldn't I have my homework? And how I understand why he did that, yeah, and that was amazing that he was doing, but in that moment, I was pissed. I was like, this is the role, this is what you're supposed to do. You're supposed to have your homework. And you're saying that I don't need to have my homework in that instance.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:48

Yeah, and yeah, that was and then uh well, and then I was so worried because for you, because here you were gonna be staying at home, and you were the kid that I had to call five times to get up in the morning, and I thought, you're never gonna be at school on time.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:07

I was late once, yeah. And I I I remember going to the office, and I was like, man, I slept in. I was like, but I said, I'm supposed to have a note, but I don't have anywhere. And I think it was uh, was it Mrs. McBride? I think she's like, Doug, write a note explaining it and sign it. And I'm like, I can do that, and she goes, today you can. And so I wrote a note. I said, I apologize that I'm late. Yeah. I slept in, signed it, Doug. Here you go. She goes, Okay, go to class. But I think it was that I can't remember if it was the first day I got home or the second day that I talked to you the night before, and you said you need to go to the, you told me you have to go to the bank tomorrow um to meet Dick Fleggle. Um, because you didn't know how long you were gonna be in Seattle. You needed somebody to be because you and Dad were the only signers on the Jacking Account. And so I go to the bank and go in there, and again, everyone's looking at you, and it's like I hate that look. Um, I understand it, but it just drove me crazy. So we go into his office at the old bank. This is before the they hadn't moved into the new one yet. No, hadn't moved into the new bank yet, and so in that the old bank, his office in the back, and he sits down, and I thought just go in, sign some stuff. I got I gotta get lunch, I gotta get back, get to get back, check on the store, get back to class.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:37

So, how things going?

Rehab Limits And Coming Home

SPEAKER_03 1:49:39

He starts on just this whole thing, and and I was like, Do we need yeah? He says, You know, we're not supposed to do this. Bank regulations, he started talking about your parents should be here, we have to do this. He says, But under the circumstances, I need you to sign here. I need so I signed the paperwork, and he's like, Okay, see you later. And done. I was able to sign the job. I could I could have signed that I could have signed whatever I wanted over myself if I wanted to, but but yeah, so that so that was middle of October. You came home for like a week.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:16

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:16

Uh beginning November, sometime in November.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:20

Just to see what things were doing, just get my mind and trying to figure out insurance forms. I just I was just oh yeah, I just had to get my life kind of back. But Dave was so worried I wasn't gonna come back.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:34

Well, and and right rightfully so, because I I remember being in Harborview. Um, because I think I the first time that I think I saw dad in the hospital, I think I'll we went down for Thanksgiving. I because the only time that I was in Harborview in the spring I went back down when he had a second surgery, but for that first one it was over Thanksgiving. And I remember having a discussion. I don't know if the doctors were telling us then, or if you guys were telling us what the doctors had said, that like 98% of people in that situation get divorced. Yep, and they were telling you guys the best thing that you can do for financial and everything like that is to get divorced. Yeah, and that I that just hit me at that point in time of why why would they suggest somebody get a divorce? And then watching the next 38 years of the amount of effort you put in and taking care of dad, I understand why that would happen. There's not a lot of people that would do what you did and give up so much. You were 45 years old when dad broke his back, right? Yeah, so for 38 years, you're in the prime of your life at 45, and that you guys, I know you guys had a lot of plans because I was gonna graduate the next spring. And we were going to Africa. You guys were gonna go to Africa. Dad had these hunting trips he was gonna go on, you guys are gonna do a bunch of traveling, and goodbye. Yep, yep, that's all gone. Yep, but you you stayed for 38 years.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:04

You do that.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:06

You do that, not everybody does, and I think that's what so many people admire about you is first of all, you're an amazingly sweet lady, but you work hard, but they see that that dedication you had to your husband. I know there's a ton of people admired you before that, but that is that is so rare.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:34

But I don't want to go through it again.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:39

No, nobody does.

SPEAKER_00 1:52:42

Well, and the sad part was our insurance ran out for ph uh physical therapy, yeah. And so we left after about eight weeks, and they said, Don't tell anyone, no one leaves after eight weeks after breaking their back.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:57

Yeah, because you only had like three or four days for the insurance policy, wasn't it like four days or something of rehab? Oh, and they said it was supposed to be like two months?

SPEAKER_00 1:53:05

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and so we came home and he had just gone off his pain cocktails. We didn't know what the pills were gonna do, and he was in so much pain. We had this hotel room out by the airport, and I learned then that you don't have a thick carpet with wheelchairs. Yeah. And oh, he had a miserable flight home. Uh yeah, it was miserable. But then he had to go back in January.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:30

I thought it was February or March. I think it was a little later.

SPEAKER_00 1:53:33

Okay, but anyway, we went back the next spring, the next uh year to get more physical therapy. Well, then when they were teaching him how to get up over curbs, he kept having this awful pain. They said, You shouldn't have that. So they did an x-ray or an MRI or something, and there was a bone spur in there. So then he had to have another major surgery. Then we had to go back in October for the rods to be taken out. So that was the third major surgery in a year.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:59

Yeah, the the third one, I was at UW then, so I was able to stop by the hospital and come and visit. And I remember in the March one, I think it was March. I remember you guys being there in March, because I think that's because we went to look at colleges. We went to look at colleges, we went to UW and then we went to USC and ASU. Yep. I came down and grabbed you and we went and did a quick tour. And but uh I still remember when it came for Thanksgiving. We played because at that time basketball started the end of October, beginning of November. And the weekend before Thanksgiving, we were playing in Wrangle. And so since I was coming down, you gave me a list of stuff you wanted to bring down. So I get off the ferry and Wrangle, and I've got my book bag, and I've got these two big duffel bags. And one of the kids that's arranging the housing that was on the basketball team is like, geez, you some of the fact that you don't travel late, do you? And I was like, Well, my dad's in the hospital in Seattle, I'll bring his stuff, and he's just kind of looks like, Oh crap, I just said the wrong thing. But it was like, he didn't know, and I was probably more blunt than I needed to be because I was kind of stressed out at the moment, but yeah, hauling all that stuff down. And then I got home on Friday because I had Thanksgiving. I think I flew Friday morning out of Seattle and got home that afternoon, and I I'm quite sure I played that weekend, and there's a couple teachers ticked off because I hadn't turned in my homework from the Wrangle trip, and they didn't think I should be eligible to play. And I'm like, Well, um, I haven't gotten back to school yet.

SPEAKER_05 1:55:34

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 1:55:36

I haven't gotten back to school yet. So the homework's done if you want it. I can it's in the backpack, I can give it to you now, but I haven't had an opportunity because it was on break. But yeah, we're playing Friday after Thanksgiving, playing basketball games. But that was that was a weird senior year.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:54

Yes, yes, it was a bad senior year for you, and I apologize for that.

Rebuilding Life With Caregiving

SPEAKER_03 1:55:58

Well, no, it's I don't don't apologize because it it it it was I wouldn't say it was a bad one, it was just a very unconventional one. Yes, and very learning experience other than high school. I I I grew up much quicker than probably I normally would have due to that. Yeah, yeah. But yeah. No, that's all that makes you who you are today.

SPEAKER_04 1:56:24

Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:25

But that was so it and that was one of the things too, is dad coming back. You'd be I was we're talking pretty much every night on the phone. Um and shortly before he came back, such and such is gonna be there tomorrow to do this, such and such is gonna be there tomorrow. So when he got back, there's the guys from the farm, Steve's Amy, they had the ramps built, they had uh the um, they'd gotten uh uh um galvanized pipe, they had a uh thing for that was so we could practice walking. So we could practice walking with his steel braces and everything in the living room, and yeah, they had things other than you know the the bedroom situation at the time was next to impossible to get a wheelchair back there with the narrow halls and the in the because you guys' room was upstairs and we didn't have a way to get them up there.

SPEAKER_00 1:57:15

And that's why we decided, you know, we could either put an elevator in at sixty, eighty thousand dollars, which would have no resale value later on, or just build another house.

SPEAKER_03 1:57:26

Yeah, I like the building. There with the way that house was set up, there would have been so much wasted space there with terrible dad being in a wheelchair.

SPEAKER_05 1:57:34

Yeah, it was it would not be fenced up. It would not have worked well at all. No, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_03 1:57:40

So but so you're you're this still this still boggles my mind thinking about 45 years old, you're going through this traumatic experience. Well what what was going through your mind at that time? Because we did at the time we had no idea how long dad was gonna live. I mean, you know, obviously, because the doctors told us that this is this is something that really affects somebody, and we don't know what that's gonna be. Did you and him talk about I know there's times that it was just one day at a time at a time, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:58:20

And you just do what you have to do and just keep on living.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:27

But that I your recollection, you were here more than I was because after he got home, I was here that summer when I was at college. But I want to say, with my recollection, it was like two years minimum that he did not have the best outlook. No, no, no, that it was it was really hard. It was extremely difficult. Yeah, and I'm sure it was even more difficult for you. He was probably sharing stuff with you that I mean the things he shared with Sarah and I about the pain that he was in and how he didn't want to be in pain, I'm sure he probably shared more with you than he did with us. But what he was sharing with us was enough that was like, oh, yeah, how's this gonna work?

SPEAKER_00 1:59:13

Yeah, yeah. And he didn't want to take pain pills because they told him if he took too much Tylenol or whatever, that it would affect his liver or kidneys, or and he'd lose that. And so he said, Okay. So he had the TV on and he would just focus on as long as he had something to focus on. And sometimes he'd be just grimacing the pain, he said, Okay, just a minute, just a minute, I just gotta focus on something, I just gotta focus on something. You know, to get his mind off the pain to get it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:59:37

And there were those tells up and up until the end that he you could see him sitting there and you're like, oh, he's in a lot of pain right now. Just the way he would hold his body or whatever it was. I I know there's ways I've told you this before. Um and I just don't know how to how to say it eloquently enough, I guess. I'm just what an amazing role model you have been. Not only since the accident, but before that. It was just no matter what was going on, you're just I just figured you're just happy and it's like, you know what, this is where we're gonna go.

SPEAKER_00 2:00:30

Do what needs to be done. And I've always felt that I don't like being around crabby people, so I decided I wouldn't be a crabby person.

SPEAKER_03 2:00:41

Just in case others didn't want to be crabby.

SPEAKER_04 2:00:43

You're leaving.

SPEAKER_03 2:00:49

Okay. We might come back to that, but we'll we'll we'll we'll we'll leave the the Can I tell a story on you? Be ready to cut this morning. We might go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 2:01:01

I don't remember what grade you were in, but you were traveling someplace at basketball, and you called one night to tell us, and he said, You know how you might you and dad always told us that we should be nice to the people that we stay with. He said, Well, I just broke my host's son's leg.

SPEAKER_04 2:01:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:21

So that was that was our my sophomore year. I think we'd played in Metla Catla, and then we're playing um Ketchan JVs on the way back, or we were just playing Ketchikan. We're in Ketchan for two games, and I remember grabbing a rebound right about the free throw line, and I just turned and I was like, There's got not gonna be anybody behind me. I'm gonna get a layup, turned around, right, ran right over this kid from Ketchikan, and he was on the ground, we'll get timeout, take him off the court, and everything. We hadn't met anybody yet, because we just got there, played the game. So the lady, we meet our housing lady afterwards, and she says, I'll take you home, but we gotta make a stop first. He's like, Okay, she goes, Yeah, I need to stop at the hospital. And we're like, Oh my gosh, what happened? She goes, Well, my son broke his leg in the game. Crap. That was me that broke your son's leg. She goes, Yeah, I know. And so we go to the hospital. She checks on her son. He was staying with his dad, they were split. Okay, so he was staying with his dad, so I I never met him, but I'm like, oh crap. So I tell you that that's not a good way to make a first impression at the house. She was absolutely an amazing person. She treated us very well. So further the story, senior year, regionals is in Ketchikan. So I'm down there, and we've got, I think we're who I can't remember who I was getting housed with, but I think it was uh a girl that was on the K Highlights dance team. And so we're going on the way back or to one of the games, and it was her and her mom, and me and whoever else from the Haynes basketball team was on the on the trip. And I asked him, I said, So your guy's the starting point guard for the boys. Did he break his leg a couple years ago? And they're like, Yeah, how'd you know that? I was like, I was the one that broke his leg. And they're like, What? It wasn't on purpose. I didn't do it on purpose, but I was the one, they're like, Oh my god, how did you? I was like, it was a mistake. I just turned and ran, and and yeah, they thought. And so that was the same regionals. The day before we get there, we've got our practice early in the morning. We walk in, and the hallways are flooded. There's all this water in the hallway, and we're like, what the heck? And they had the exposed sprinkler heads, and they had a deal where you'd put they take the lockers, it wasn't built in, you just have the padlocks, and people would, if they you left it unlocked, they take it and put it on there, and somebody went to grab theirs off of there, set off the sprinkler. So there's water running down the hallways, and then we're in there. RV is running our practice, and all of a sudden, all these students start coming in and filling in up above, and a guy comes in and he's talking to RV, and um RV, you see him nodding over there and comes up, huddles us all around. He goes, So, um, just so you guys know, uh, somebody phoned in a bomb scare to the school. So they're they've already checked the gym, we're safe, but they're bringing everybody else in here while they check the rest of the school to make sure there's no we're in a high school. What do you mean there's a bomb scare? What the heck is this going on? And so one of the one of my proudest moments of playing basketball. We finished practice. I was supposed to shoot free throws in the free throw competition on Saturday. Everybody's shooting at one end, RV takes me down to the other end and wants me to practice free throws. So I'm shooting, I'm making two or three, miss, make two or three. And so the catch-can students that are in there, they start counting.

SPEAKER_04 2:05:09

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 2:05:10

Which was actually beneficial to me because I don't know if you remember when Sarah and Dad and I would shoot free throws, dad was always making us shoot free throws. Yeah. And you had to count one, two out of two, three out of three, four out of four. You'd have to count. That was the whole thing. So the whole time, every time I'm shooting free throws, I'm always counting my head. One out of one, two out of two. I always know how many I've made and how many I've missed. And so they start counting. I'm like, I don't have to do that now. Yeah. And so I was I was shooting it, and I I got to I got 25 in a row, and then I missed, and there's like, oh, you just grown from them that they're all ticked that I missed. And and uh one of the coaches I can't remember who was from, he came over after practice. He goes, he goes, That was pretty impressive. I'm like, I don't know, just practice didn't mean anything. Saturday's winning it. Yeah, and so Saturday I missed like my seventh, and and I was like, Wow, this is over with so I I only made like 10 or 11 of the 25 during the practice. I guess so. I should have saved some of those.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:06

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 2:06:07

But uh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:09

Well, that was also the trip where you lost the contact because you called me said, Mom.

Passing On Home Ec Skills

SPEAKER_03 2:06:12

Yeah, first first game. Yeah, we played at Edgecombe the the weekend before, and we were directly from Edgecombe down there. I thought I played pretty well, and Edgecombe had a lot of confidence. First quarter, lose the contact. I never lost contact. I didn't I never had any spares. Yeah, they'd last me for several months at the time, never had a spare. And so, yeah, they had to you talk to the optometers in Juno, they gold stripped it down. I had to go over to the I think one of the coach, I can't remember if a coach went with me. I don't know if Ron Smith, I think, was our JV coach. That we go over to we had to take the Gravine Isle ferry across to the airport to go pick up the small little package so I'd have contacts for the game the next day. So I could see because I was down to one contact and everything was all I could play defense, all right, but I couldn't tell where the basket was or anything. It was all yeah, that was not a that was not a fun trip. No, no, other than making 25 in a row while you can't see the body count of them off for me. So going back, we're gonna we're gonna go back a ways. Okay. Actually, before we do that, let's take a break for a second. Okay, yep. All right, we're back, mom. Okay, so I want I want to backtrack a little bit because one of the things that I think um is really cool with you is you were a home ec teacher, you did it for three years, right?

SPEAKER_04 2:07:30

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:30

Then you quit to raise your kids, but I don't think you ever stopped being a home teacher. Because not only Sarah and I, we were your students while you had us in the house, because we learned to cook and sew and uh knit and you know, quilt any of that stuff, but then the number of kids growing up over the years that have come up that their moms or whatever is like, hey, my kid wants to learn to sew or she wants to learn to bake. Uh the the imprint I think you've had on a lot of kids later on. I I think I think it's there's a lot there.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:13

I think you should share your knowledge, yeah. And if you ask, I will help you.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:17

Yeah, but I think that's been a really cool thing that you you have that knowledge, you were trained in that. That was kind of something you gave up, but in a way you never really did. Because even now, you're if somebody comes up, you're I mean, all your grandchildren were in your kitchen. Yeah, pretty soon you're gonna have grandchildren in your kitchen. Great grandchildren, yeah. They're gonna be in the kitchen learning how to do that.

SPEAKER_00 2:08:41

And that's what makes memories. That's what makes memories.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:44

Well, in in the times that I go up there, like when we're making Lefsa at Christmas and stuff like that, I can see how much that means to you. That and and I think some of it, at least for Lefsa too. I think it's the holidays, you've got everybody kind of working together on it. Um, but other times when I've been up there and you've had young ladies that are learning to sew, and they're in the just that giving that knowledge and sharing that and creating those memories with somebody else, that's a big part for you, isn't it?

SPEAKER_04 2:09:14

Yeah, it is.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:16

And it's not just at the store. And and this is the other thing is you've you love to bake. Yes, I do. I think everybody knows that. And especially anybody that works for us knows that you love to bake, as well as Deanna and Diana can do this. That there's always some very, very nice treats over there.

SPEAKER_00 2:09:43

Well, we like to share, and you know, now living alone, there's no way I can eat a batch of cookies. I mean, well, I probably could, but I shouldn't. So, and I like fresh cookies, so you may as well bring them down to the store so everybody can have some.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:58

And speaking of cookies, I've given you a bad time about this numerous times over the years. I still remember in the office, this is probably 15, 18 years ago, and I was telling you at that time that I was trying to get in better shape, I was trying to make better, asking you, it's like, how can I cook healthier? What are the things that I can do? And you were giving me some great advice. And the next morning, working at the store, go back into the office, and there's a big bag of, there's like a half of a gallon bag of chocolate chip cookies sitting on my desk. And I know they're yours. It's like, Mother, why is it you're like your dad and I can't eat them all, you need to eat some. Did you not remember what I was just talking about yesterday? And so, since then, anytime that I'm trying to eat better, my one thing is I I cut out sugar unless it's made by somebody I know. So if you or Deanne or Diane or Sarah, Kaylee, anybody's making cookies or cake or something like that, Doug, you want some? I am not, I'm never saying no to that.

SPEAKER_04 2:11:04

Nope, nope.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:05

But store-bought stuff, I will say no to that. That's kind of my that's the that's the Doug diet for anybody that wants to try it.

SPEAKER_00 2:11:13

Well, you know, when it came to quilting, anybody when we first started doing more quilting in town here, if people had questions, I'd say ask Dave. Because Dave had made many more quilts than I had.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:24

That's right. He used to, when he was a kid. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:11:27

On the winter nights, you know, with nothing to do. Hey, you're gonna be doing something. So I we still have several of his or a couple of his quilts. One of them, it's called a friendship quilt, where his friends wrote in the blank spot and then he embroidered their names on their names. What? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:11:43

I don't think I've ever seen that.

SPEAKER_00 2:11:45

I'll show it to you.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:46

I remember because you've got the the yellow one or whatever. Well, but then you've also got the kitchen towels and stuff that have the embroidery on it. Yeah, that for the longest time I thought you had done that, you know. Yeah, no, that was your dad. No, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:11:57

Wait, what? What are you talking about? Yeah, no, no, he and and they would have a a frame in the hanging from the living room ceiling and then they'd just bring it down to to quilt and tie the quilts and so forth. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:10

And a lot of those were um on the towels and stuff, weren't those like flower sacks or something too? Feed sacks, feed sacks and stuff that was the fabric.

SPEAKER_00 2:12:19

I remember my mother going to get chicken feed, and she'd say, Well, I want that bag and that bag and that bag, because it was all the same print. She did three bags to make us a skirt or something. Skirt or a dress. And heaven forbid if it got ripped on the way home.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:39

Yeah. Because I was this last this last weekend I was moving stuff, and in that in that trunk, there's like four different, some of them were smaller and stuff, but there are quilts that you'd made. One of them was from Grandma Vivian, but that I'd put away because I wasn't using because they're getting frayed on the edges. And I learned my lesson from when I was younger because I had my baby blanket from Grandma Vivian. From grandma Vivian.

SPEAKER_00 2:13:03

And embroidered.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:05

And one day it went missing.

SPEAKER_00 2:13:07

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:07

And I was in absolute agony in tears that my blanket was missing. And you would not fetch it. I think it was probably 12, 13 years later. I think you brought it out to show somebody. And I was absolutely I was shocked. I thought this thing was lost forever. And you pull this out and like this was Doug's baby. I'm like, wait a second, my mother has been lying to me all these years.

SPEAKER_00 2:13:33

But you look at the rags that's just and I've shown it to several really expert quilters. I said, What can I do with it? And they go, Well, you wore it to death. Same with Sarah's. But that's what you're supposed to do. That's what you're supposed to do. That's what you're supposed to do. You're supposed to use them. Yeah, we're supposed to use them. Yeah, when I when I give someone a quilt, they say, Oh, I don't have a space to hang on the wall. I said, It's not just hang on the wall, put it on your bed or on your couch. Use it. Use it. That's what it's for. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:05

So what with um with quilting. What is it that is that just a relaxation thing for you? Or is it just more about is it the creative aspect of it?

SPEAKER_00 2:14:19

It's it's relaxing. It's fun to create something different and see if I can get the colors right. Sometimes I have to have help. See if I can make something halfway beautiful.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:31

I still feel bad. The one time you had that quilt and you had it all done, and you asked me to come look at it. And I asked you, why are those pieces out of line from the rest of it? I thought you did it on purpose and you had everything, and you're like, oh crap.

SPEAKER_00 2:14:51

Well, you know, a couple times I've asked you to have to do that.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:53

Now you've got after that, after that you've asked me to come over to look at the patterns.

SPEAKER_00 2:14:57

You have the vision to see, oh, okay, yeah, that should be that way or whatever. Yeah. I'm sorry. I didn't see you. So now I'm trying to weed down my fabric stash. But I know the next time I go to a fabric store, I'll buy some more fabric.

SPEAKER_03 2:15:12

Oh, guaranteed. Guaranteed. I don't think that's ever happened that you've gone to do it. When we went to New Zealand, you bought fabric, you bought fabric in New Zealand.

SPEAKER_00 2:15:19

That was one of the places we'd had to stop, was a fabric store in and I was very disappointed because it wasn't as big a fabric store as I wanted to see.

SPEAKER_03 2:15:26

But you still found something. I still found something. Have you done anything with that yet?

unknown 2:15:29

No.

SPEAKER_00 2:15:29

I haven't figured out what to do with it yet.

SPEAKER_03 2:15:33

About a week and a half after Dad passed. I remember you came over to the store here and you're talking to me about um you f you felt a little unsettled because you had all this free time. And I was like, Yeah, you've you've been dad's caregiver for 38 years. I would imagine you've got a lot of free time. And I told you, I hope you find something fun to do. Have you found something fun to do? I mean, everybody gives Sarah and I a bad time. They're like, how come you guys are making your mother work? You're right. You guys are always having your mom come down, and both of us are our answer is always going to be the same. It's like, do you honestly think we're making our mother do anything? She does whatever the heck she wants to. There's there's none of us making us do anything. We've told her stay home and she comes, she shows up.

SPEAKER_00 2:16:23

There's nothing we can do. And people say, What what days do you work? And I say, Well, practically every day, but you know, I I come and go when I want. And so that's that's the beauty of being retired. You can work when you want, how long you want. I haven't uh really found any fun, fun things.

SPEAKER_03 2:16:40

I mean, I read more, I do more puzzles, I'm sewing more, and I'm just so with sewing more, are you making a dent in your fabric?

SPEAKER_00 2:16:49

Not really.

SPEAKER_03 2:16:50

Not really.

SPEAKER_00 2:16:53

I just finished three quilts and I've I've got the binding um on two of them, and so I'll be glad to just have those projects finished, and I can move on to something else. I've got another one on the wall that I'm working on. I've got several others in the w in the making, in the in the in the head. And I'd I'd I'd like to do a little bit more traveling someday. Probably I'm I'm happy where I am.

SPEAKER_03 2:17:26

Well d I think part of that, and correct me if I'm wrong, is you've you and dad built a home here. You know, you were welcomed by people in Haynes, and you your original intentions will stay for a year and see what happens. Yep, and that's gonna be what 63 years-two years in July. August August. Yeah. 62 years. So that one year kind of apparently turned out fairly well.

SPEAKER_00 2:17:57

Well, and every once in a while, dad would say, I think we should move. And I said, Okay, tell me where and what are you gonna do? And he could never come up with an answer.

SPEAKER_03 2:18:06

I have the same problem. I don't know where or where what else I would do.

SPEAKER_00 2:18:09

Yeah, yeah. So but I I still haven't figured out what I want to be when I grow up, what I want to do.

SPEAKER_03 2:18:16

But but looking at that, you know, when I talk about building a family, it's not only other people in the community, but both your kids are here. You've got you've got grandkids here, you've got two, a third one coming in, you've got two great grandkids here, a third gonna be coming here shortly for great-grandkids. So I get to take up the story hour, you know. I get and that's the thing with the with the k with the grandkids. When you when the grandkids started showing up, everybody saw you out with the strollers, taking them wherever you're going, and you're doing the story hour, you're doing all the stuff with the grandkids, and now you got the great-grandkids you're doing the same stuff with. How special is that?

SPEAKER_00 2:18:56

It's very special, very special. I remember one time I went into the bank and um my sister-in-law Leslie was a magistrate. And so her noon hour would go for walks, and I'd take Tyler's Justin, whoever was there, you know, and would would walk, solve the world's problems, and walk during this hour. And so one day when I went in the bank, this gal said, it was winter time. And this gal said, My son was home from school yesterday, and he said, I saw two crazy ladies pushing this stroller through the snow. And said, Oh, I know who that was.

SPEAKER_05 2:19:31

I know, I know those crazy ladies. We can put a name to them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:19:42

So do you do you think that helps keep you young and keep you active? Just kind of trying to chase them around?

SPEAKER_00 2:19:49

Yep. And it helps me to go to the store because I get in steps. I don't like to just walk on a treadmill. To me, that's the most boring thing ever. But if I can walk my hill, if I can walk the dock, if I can walk in school, if I can take the kids for a stroll, you know, then I'm getting my exercise, but I'm enjoying it.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:10

And also, I I get the sense too that the the store is kind of a social outlet for you. Yes, oh yes, because of the number of customers that you see here that you might not interact with them in another setting.

SPEAKER_00 2:20:23

I I think I've been so fortunate for being at the store and at the Eagle Foundation for the number of people that I've met, the very broad variety of people that I've met and gotten to know, and some just for a very short time, but just see different aspects of people. I I think that's one of the pleasures of of working with the public. Yeah. I I've really I enjoy talking. And what I remember a couple years ago I was talking with this one couple, we were talking and talking and talking, and he said, Are you an owner? And I said, Yeah, and he said, Well, that makes sense because you're you can take the time to talk to us.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:03

Probably wasn't setting a good example for the crew, but but at the same time, that's kind of what I think that's what a lot of pre people appreciate about you and dad with the store, is it wasn't necessarily just a transaction, but you would sit and talk to people. Dad obviously would talk. I don't know if he'd talk with them or at them. There's kind of sometimes it was more of at than with, depending on the conversation. But you know, it could be some very well.

SPEAKER_00 2:21:32

I remember one winter this young man would come in, he'd bring his wife to work at eight o'clock, he'd come to the sports shop and stay until he picked her up after work, and spent day after day after day. And we had a door connecting through the back, and I'd have to go over there and just take any old sheet of paper and say, Dave, you need to work on this invoice now. You know, you need to place this order. I'll watch the storm a little bit. If that happens.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:10

What what uh what got you into swimming?

SPEAKER_00 2:22:14

I don't know. I think someone mentioned it uh that it would be kind of fun, and I thought, well, yeah, I like to swim. So I of course I couldn't do it when I was working full time.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:22:23

But then when I kind of when I retired.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:30

You were never at the pool. No, no. And then now it's like this constant that that if there's morning swim.

SPEAKER_00 2:22:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:37

I try to go three times a week, but pretty there every day it's open.

SPEAKER_00 2:22:40

Yeah. But it's good exercise. And there's a really neat bunch of gals that go, and so we just have lots of fun. It's a good social time as well as exercise. And I think more people need to come because they don't realize what they're missing.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:57

I I remember I I forget as if I was when I was on the assembly or when I was mayor, and somebody was talking about the cutting the funding to the pool. And they're like, I was like, Do you have any idea who my mom is? Do you think I'm gonna be the one to vote? If if everybody else votes that way, whatever. I don't have any control of that. But do you really think that I'm gonna vote to shut my mom out of the pool and and all of her friends that are there? Not only my mom is gonna crucify me, but her friends are too. That's not a that's not a road I'm willing to go down.

SPEAKER_00 2:23:31

Well, since we lived on the lake, mother insisted we take swimming lessons. And I did pass my junior life saving, barely, because I've never had the endurance. But uh mother didn't want to get in above her ankles. Really? Yeah, no, she that was it, huh? Oh, yeah, yeah. But even with one arm, dad would come swimming. Grandpa was yeah, grandpa would swim.

SPEAKER_01 2:23:55

Never knew that.

SPEAKER_00 2:23:56

Do a side stroke. Yeah, yeah. He didn't swim very often because the water was often too cold for his shoulder.

SPEAKER_03 2:24:01

Yeah, yeah. But but getting back to the pool on that, and that's one of the things that I think is good because you and the ladies, you're always invited. I always hear you, why don't you come swimming with us? Why don't you come swim? So it's you realize that you need to get more revenue at the pool. So if it's gonna be stay open, it's like, how do we get more people over there? How do we keep and so you do you invite a lot of people to hey, let's come over to the pool.

SPEAKER_00 2:24:24

Someone was saying the other day, said, Oh, I should come. He said, How many are usually there? And I said, Well, it depends on who's on vacation, who's getting done with surgery, who's who's sick. But we've got a wide range of ages, and we just have a blast.

SPEAKER_03 2:24:41

And it's more, it's it's like a water aerobic sketch. You're not swimming laps or anything like that.

SPEAKER_00 2:24:46

No, to me, laps are the most boring thing ever. I mean, when when the instructor isn't there and it was just a couple, we're kind of on our own. I'll kind of half swim laps, but I think that's the most boring thing ever. As I say, I I will exercise when I've got somebody to do it with me. Not necessarily because oh, I've got to do 14 laps.

SPEAKER_03 2:25:11

What do you what do you think life would have been like if you and dad didn't come to Haynes? Oh, I just have you ever have you ever thought about that? I have. You know, Haynes is the Haynes is the one place that had opportunities for both of you. And you look at everything that came off of that. How lucky were you guys that Haynes is the place that had that we ended up that this is the place you ended up?

SPEAKER_00 2:25:34

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I've thought about that often, and I thought, oh, what if we lived in Montana? You know, I mean we're I I'm sure we would have been happy, but you know, it might have been amazing. It might have been the best.

SPEAKER_03 2:25:47

I I just look back at the the way the community accepted you guys and the friendships you guys have developed, and subsequently Sarah and I have developed over the years, and Haynes has its limitations, there's challenges to living here, but the the people that are here, the relationships that have been built by you and dad and our our family over the years.

SPEAKER_00 2:26:09

I I can't imagine when mother and dad moved up here, mother had a hard time. And then as I got older, I realized she was leaving her sisters, yeah, she was leaving two grandkids, she was leaving two daughters, she was leaving her coffee buddies of 25 years, her church. Yeah, you know, and in fact, they came just a few weeks before her birthday. That's why I planned this birthday party for her. Well, I was over at Moose Camp.

SPEAKER_05 2:26:38

You bailed on your mom's birthday party to go to Moose Camp. Mother hosted her own birthday party. People she didn't know. Oh man.

SPEAKER_00 2:26:54

So and the year we moved here, we were the only people to move to Haynes that year.

SPEAKER_02 2:27:03

Wait, what?

SPEAKER_00 2:27:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:27:05

The whole year.

SPEAKER_00 2:27:06

The whole year. That's crazy. Yeah. Everybody knew us, and we didn't know anybody.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:13

Well, was that kind of normal for a while during that time? That was just not a lot of people? Because there wasn't there much turnover at the school, or oh no, there wasn't much turnover at the school.

SPEAKER_00 2:27:22

Okay. Yeah. And so I think then when the mill started going better, then there was more people moving. More people in for the mill? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:31

Yeah, everybody did know you, didn't they?

SPEAKER_04 2:27:33

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:36

What's the if you could if you could say one pick out one thing that's the biggest change from 1964 to 2026. Yeah. I mean, there's there's a ton of change.

SPEAKER_00 2:27:55

There's a ton of change.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:56

But just something that might be off the wall, or just something that strikes you that I mean, because we've already talked a lot about it. We you get freight more than once a month right now. You get, you know, there's all there's a lot of advantages. You're not ordering out of Montgomery ward all the time.

SPEAKER_00 2:28:12

What what one of the things right now is that I've lived here 61 years. Bryce has lived here for. And I'm always saying, Bryce, who's that? Oh, that's so they've got they live on a mud bay, they drive a red truck.

unknown 2:28:29

Excuse me.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:32

Bryce does know everybody.

SPEAKER_00 2:28:34

It's the older people who say, Who's that? Oh, that's you know, I could tell their life history. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:40

Yeah, if they've been here three decades, we'd know them.

SPEAKER_00 2:28:42

We know them.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:43

Everybody's moved here in the last 10 years. We need to get Bryce to tell us who it is.

SPEAKER_00 2:28:46

Who it is, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:47

Oh, I'm this I'm the same way. I have yeah. That that is crazy how that kind of goes in cycles, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_00 2:28:56

I remember the first concert we went to here, and of course everybody dresses up nice, and there was everything from fur coats to car hearts and extra tufts. Yeah. Because I thought, oh, you go to a concert, you dress up.

SPEAKER_04 2:29:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:29:09

And in fact, going way back, the old Presbyterian church was so cold and drafty. Well, to me, when you go to church, you dress up. So I had this nice coat, three-quarter length sleeves for winter time. Oh, so stupid. But anyway, I would sit there freezing, and this one older lady from Port Chilk would come in a snowsuit, full snowsuits, and I thought, oh, and I thought, hmm, she's the smart one.

SPEAKER_03 2:29:36

Yeah. Well, so what do you what uh what's uh what's coming up next?

SPEAKER_00 2:29:45

Ah, just going day by day and enjoying life.

SPEAKER_03 2:29:47

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Got any uh how how much longer until you can get the grandkids up at the house and or the great grandkids to start to start doing some bacon and stuff.

SPEAKER_00 2:29:58

I'm thinking Stella's going on too, so she's gonna should be pretty soon.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:02

This this summer she might be going up to great grandma's and start learning how to measure out some flour and getting your hands in the dough.

SPEAKER_00 2:30:13

All right. Gotta start them young.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:16

What what what stories have I missed, Mom?

SPEAKER_00 2:30:18

I think we've hit them all.

A Gift For Future Generations

SPEAKER_03 2:30:22

So I I've I've got to make an admission. There's there have been a lot of people that have wanted to hear your story. A lot of people that love you. I I hope we've hit on enough of the stories and that they they know more about you than they did before. Just I I think what a lot of people get is just your your generosity and the number of ways that you give back, whether through your effort, through bake goods, the you know you you're you're always sharing with whatever you have. And uh I think that's but they're not the people that I did this for. This is for your grandkids and your great grandkids. So they can I wish I'd had a chance to do this with dad. Yeah, but so they can look back, this especially the great grandkids that might not have as much chance to spend as much time with you that the this is this is my present to them. So thank you all.

SPEAKER_00 2:31:24

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:24

Love you.

SPEAKER_00 2:31:25

I just figure counter blessings every day.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:28

That's a good way to go about it. Yep. See, look at this. Now we need more tissues. Yep. Good thing I have a whole box.

SPEAKER_00 2:31:37

As you know, I cry very easily.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:39

Yeah, and you pass that down to me. Yeah, so there's there's three things, there's four things that you can you can correct me on if I got any of this wrong. There's there's four things that I directly attribute to you. My poor eyesight, yep, my uh clumsiness, awkwardness, not not not the most graceful athlete, my love of reading, and the fact that I can cry at the drop of a hat. Yeah, it can be something very it's crazy sometimes. And I was like, I'd start crying. I was like, dang it, mom, really? This is what you had to give me.

SPEAKER_00 2:32:17

I could I cry when I'm happy, I cry when I'm sad. I mean, there could just be some happy moment on TV and I'll be sobbing.

SPEAKER_01 2:32:24

I remember as kids, you'd be something would happen, you'd be crying. And we'd Sarah and I'd look at dad's like, what's wrong with mom?

SPEAKER_00 2:32:30

It's like, she's happy, like, really? Dad had to read to you each night because as he was reading Charlotte's Web or whatever, I'd be sitting there doing dishes crying.

SPEAKER_03 2:32:40

Really? I didn't I always remember sitting there and having him read Little House on the Prairie and stuff, sitting on the couch. I didn't know this because you were crying the whole time. I was not aware of that. Well, thank you. Thank you for sharing. Thank you. I need a hug. Oh, yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:32:59

Always give up.

SPEAKER_03 2:33:03

Thanks for watching this episode of Doughead's questions. Just a reminder: if you've enjoyed the conversation today, please like, subscribe, and we're available on YouTube if you want to watch us, if you just want to listen. Uh, it's on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. And we have new uh episodes being launched every Thursday. So thanks again for watching or listening and following us. We appreciate your support, yes, yes, yes, yes.