The Denominator Matters

In this episode of To the Moon with the Lunas, we’ve got Jordan on the moon with us for a powerful conversation on money, mindset, and the system we all live in. 

We break down why The Denominator Matters and how inflation and the growing national debt quietly eat away at your purchasing power. We also dive into why owning hard assets and sticking to a solid budget has never been more important. 

Most importantly, we talk about taking action: start investing with whatever you have and begin building today. We also highlight the importance of teaching financial literacy early, because understanding money isn’t just about getting rich it’s about creating freedom and a real path to abundance. 

#Bitcoin #Money #Crypto #Finance #Cryptocurrency #Podcast

If you enjoyed this episode, share it with someone who needs to understand Bitcoin Better.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

The plan is surrounding yourself with people that actually want the best for you and that you also can look up to and that you admire and respect. And at the end of the day, not comparing your chapter one to someone else's chapter 10. Like I didn't think, oh my gosh, Joe has more money than me. I'm like, I'm starting with what I can afford and what I have. And I I never look back from that point. And then that started with me explaining these stuff, this stuff on platforms to other people. So don't be afraid of just starting with what you have. I know everybody's like, oh, get to this amount of Bitcoin, get to this amount of net worth. Literally just put your head down, surround yourself with good people, trust God. Keep God first at all because God can take all of that away from you. Like I don't give a crap how much Bitcoin you have. Like, like it doesn't matter at the end of the day, you can't take it with you. So, like, just be a good person because the system that we live in is trained to make people think they have to rush to get more. Like, live in the moment, be present, and just be a good steward of whatever you're blessed with. And then I I believe you would be blessed more and abundantly.

SPEAKER_00 1:00

All right, everyone. Welcome back to To the Moon with the Lunas podcast. Today we have a really great guest, but before that, today's Bitcoin price is$70,600. Um, he's the founder and CEO of SympMe, a platform focused on simplifying complex ideas through creativity, product development, and powerful analogies that actually stick. He's built out courses and training curriculums that help curious learners level up their understanding in a real way. On top of that, he's a product manager at Splunk Technologies, working on data solutions for Fortune 100 companies, and he's also contributed to innovative startups like Bowie Health, helping scale their product capabilities. He studied finance and entrepreneurship at Villanova, and he's earned his MBA from NYU Stern. So he brings both the academic and real world perspective. Jordan, we are so excited to have you here. Welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_03 1:57

Let's go.

SPEAKER_04 1:58

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you all for the warm introduction. It's just happy to be here, as I told you guys offline. Super excited. Love what you all are building in terms of giving people a space to share their insights and expertise. So super happy to be here. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 2:11

Yeah, man. I am super fired up. Um, I've been uh following you now for a little bit, and I know you get you hop on uh, you know, Bitcoin spaces on there with your crew. Um and so everything that you do is super valuable, and that's why we are super excited to have you here today. And um, you know, just to kick things off a little bit, uh, you know, how did you first get introduced to Bitcoin?

SPEAKER_04 2:32

Yeah, so ironically enough, uh, my introduction to Bitcoin was back when I was in college. So I graduated college, undergrad at least, in 2015. Um, I think it was around 2014. My fiance, uh, at the time she was my girlfriend, she was the first one. Her name is Renee, she was the first one to mention Bitcoin. Um, ironically enough, you know, like most people, they just like thought it was a scam initially. So, you know, she came to me and she was like, hey Jordan, there's this really cool thing called Bitcoin. I was watching this video on YouTube, and you can send money peer-to-peer. And my first inclination, just from my background studying finance and working in the field, I was like, Yeah, no, I don't know. That sounds weird. I don't know. That sounds like a scam. I don't think that it's anything like that's gonna really like mean anything. And pretty much like her background was in is in um is in healthcare medicine. So she had no understanding of it, but she understood the problem, right? And she understood why it was valuable without having to know everything about the financial system. So that was the first introduction that I got to Bitcoin. Um, and then I had some friends in college that were really deep into gold and um some that were into Bitcoin, and they kept telling me the problem, um, which I'm sure we'll go into. Um, and that's kind of like what kept sparking my insight about it. So that's kind of like a little bit of background on when I first got introduced to it. But I think for me, I only do things as I learn and as I've studied it before I make the decision. So it kind of gives me a better appreciation of what I'm trying to like dive into.

SPEAKER_02 4:00

So yeah, thanks for sharing that. And it's kind of crazy because you study finance too, right? So it was almost like everything like you're like, no, like this ain't it. Like, I I I know I've done my work on this, right? And so, and for her to just be like, hey, there's a problem here, whether it's like investment vehicles, all you know, all these vehicles that we have, and you're like in the trenches, like studying it in school, and it's like basically like almost like misleading you a little bit, right? And so it's just so funny how like that how it works without like somebody who barely knows anything about you know monetary, and then you're just like, I'm in here studying it's like, I'm sorry, babe, I love you, but you're wrong, you know. But literally, she was right, you know. She was so right.

SPEAKER_00 4:41

I was gonna add something because you know, when you're in school, you're kind of getting indoctrinated into a system, you know, and so you're getting what they want you to learn, what they want you to understand. And it has to sometimes take those outside eyes to go, hey, there's something that's been mentioned here, you know. Oh, yeah, maybe there is something else. And I think having an open mind, being open-minded enough, um, is also, you know, kudos to you. You know, you were like, hmm, that is true. Maybe there is something else out there.

unknown 5:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:11

No, and and like to that point, like I think, you know, with with school and at least from my experience when I was at uh Villanova undergrad, uh, and and at NYU too, right? Like, one of the classes that was formidable for me during my learning at NYU at Villanova was this fixed income class that I took my sophomore year. And I feel like out of all the classes that I took, like understanding the stock market, understanding equity markets, understanding that stuff is for the headlines, right? Like everybody gets excited. Like when I when everybody tours Villanova for the business school, they'll show you the Bloomberg terminals, they'll show you like all the stuff about like just the stocks, right? My best class that I ever experienced was fixed income. And a lot of my friends, we talk about it to this day. Like, we all appreciate that class because the bond market is what props up the system, the debt is what props up the system, and I know that's something that we'll probably talk about, right? Like, as as um in terms of the solution for the problems that we see in this world, that fixed income class opened my eyes to the system. So even when Renee mentioned it to me, I kind of was hearing her, I just didn't know much about it. But as other friends started saying stuff too about gold and what they were doing, and some of my friends, like I said, one of my best friends, he had been buying gold and doing that since we were freshmen. So he kept explaining the problem. Like he doesn't own anything other than like gold and bitcoin, and he's been doing that for a long time. But the point is like his background and what he experienced and where he where he came from, where he's from, his family, he's from Africa. So his perspective was totally different on financial systems. Um, so to your point, Danielle, right? About like some of this stuff being indoctrinated, the way they're teaching it from the curriculum. That class stood out to me a lot. There were other classes that were great, but that was a great class because we went through the whole financial crisis, like from the beginning to what happened, to AIG, to all that stuff. And then that's what kind of got me sparked. Like, hey, printing money isn't good. Interest rates, the way they're shooting them down, isn't good. And that that was kind of like my real like crash course into the denominator and like the whole issue, the problems that we see, right? Like with debt.

SPEAKER_02 7:13

That's so good, Jordan. And then also, so I know um the denominator matters, right? That's everything goes back to the denominator matters. I know we have a lot of listeners on here that don't quite know what that means. Um, you know, they're like, what are you talking about? Um and please, it's on your shirt, you preach it in everything that you do, and it's something that needs to be heard um and repeated over and over until people understand. Please share what the denominator, why the denominator matters.

SPEAKER_04 7:40

Sure, sure. So um, ironically enough, like, you know, when I talk to different people about hard money, right? So put Bitcoin aside for a second, whether it's gold or silver, I say, hey, would you want to own something that is constantly increasing, or would you want something that has a fixed supply? If and taking it back to fractions, right? Like, I know for some people they may get um intimidated by math, and that's a whole nother conversation in terms of I feel like people get discouraged early. There's kids that like are really good at math. They just because you got one math problem wrong, you had a trouble in class, the teacher could be wrong. It may not be because there's something wrong with you. So I like to go back to fractions and I say, okay, I think a lot of a lot of people, especially after COVID, people obsess over um their net worth and they're like, oh yeah, like I have more money, I have more dollars, I have more of this. And it's like, okay, cool. But understand that's your numerator, right? And when you have a fraction, and if you increase the numerator, or if you increase the denominator, excuse me, faster than your numerator is going up, like you're gonna get the output is gonna be lower and lower, the value. So one divided by two, one divided by 100, 5 divided by 1,000, and then so on and so on. That denominator is the supply of dollars in the system. Kind of that example is what I like to use the individuals when I'm like, okay, ignore Bitcoin for a second. The fact that the fixed denominator is there. Think about anything in your life that you have that is scarce, the value of it probably will go up because it's not just created into abundance. So I like to use that example. I'm like, hey, listen, if you're blessed to have a hundred thousand, fifty thousand, twenty thousand, or a hundred million dollars, you can't run away from the fact that the denominator is always going to be increasing in a financial system, the fiat system that we all live in and operate in. So that's kind of why I put it on a shirt. And then shoutouts to Renee, she actually designed it and drew it. Um and then I threw it on some shirts and stuff like that. And people have been buying them and loving it. So it's been a good way to an easy way to get the message out and not be like, hey, let me tell you about this thing called Bitcoin. Like, I'm really not trying to like scare anybody. Um, but at the end of the day, it's the truth. So they understand the denominator. When I explain that example to them, they're like, hey, where can I buy this? So that's been my kind of like orange pill methodology.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

Yeah. That's awesome. That's really helpful, actually, because I was I was curious myself, you know, just understanding what that means. That's a really great way to get the conversation started instead of saying, hey, Bitcoin.

SPEAKER_04 10:04

Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, like it's it's it's like at the end of the day, like I just try to bring it back to things that people that relate to them. That was essentially the whole story behind Sent Me Anyways, and why I started it was making making finance simple, making complex simple and redefine education through analogies. So, you know, Sean loves to use this example. I know you guys like talk like Anthony, you know, Sean Dale and Danielle. I'm not sure if you've met Sean, one of our good friends, but um, Sean always uses the example of like a sports team, and I use sports as well to break through to people with explaining anything financial and stuff like that, because I played sports, and I'm like, hey, but at the end of the day, like they don't really say they're gonna come out with a bunch of NFL teams, new teams every year. Same thing with NBA, there's never like random expansion teams that just pop up. That's because the people that own the teams don't want the denominator to just grow fast, they want to retain the value of the team, of the valuation of the company, of the brand, of the product. So I try to use that example. That's another good example, too. Kind of bringing it to something that people, you know, people can relate to sports, some people, right? So people see it on TV, you know, the Super Bowl, you can understand there's only a select amount of people that own an NFL team, and it will always be that way. So yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:16

Yeah, no, that's really good. And then so speaking about the denominator, so do you think we're shifting towards a new denominator? What do you what are your thoughts on this?

SPEAKER_04 11:24

So honestly, like I I listen to a bunch of people on YouTube and stuff like that, and I don't I don't think that we're switching to a new denominator yet. I don't even know if we'll ever really truly switch to a new denominator because if we do, the people who are really in control of the fiat system will lose their edge in terms of what they want to like do. So, but I do think that for the individuals at the sovereign level that understand that they can control their own denominator for themselves. Like you don't have to wait for we don't have to wait for anybody else to tell us that the math in front of us and what we're seeing with our eyes and we're feeling it like in our personal and lived experience is happening, right? So that's the thing that I think is super cool. I think for I for me, I'm like at a micro level, I can't change the world, but I could definitely like what you all are doing right now with your podcast, you're changing the individuals around you to then be able to like collaborate with people and share the message. That actually will probably that could that could super charge the denominator changing and us seeing a shift at the sovereign level. If all people are taking control and knowing that they can change their own denominator, that will be cool. But I think at the macro level, I think that there are probably countries clearly that are definitely like taking hard money seriously if they can within reason. I think that the countries that have less debt and are more sovereign, they will probably be able to have an edge in the in the new world shift that we see. But I don't know at what point we'll see it. I I feel like unfortunately there'll have to be more pain for individuals at the individual level before they really realize that there's something structurally wrong. But at the same time, too, there's people who are in Bitcoin that are more obsessed with they're more obsessed with freedom go down as a result of a number go up and they don't understand what they're even doing. So they're like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Like anybody that's like institutions are of course gonna buy Bitcoin. Like Michael Saylor is gonna buy Bitcoin, but think about who they work for, right? Like think about who's the board, like who runs those companies. And I'm not even saying that from being a conspiracy theorist, like I worked in finance for a while, and I have friends that still work in there, so that's how it works. And their objective is to literally make money for the shareholders. So if you're literally giving your time and energy away and working for your dollars and you're giving it to them to buy Bitcoin on your behalf, you could just buy it yourself. Doesn't mean that you don't buy the stock. I'm just saying, like, understand that as more Bitcoin gets centralized in other like institutions, it's there's there's like what is it? Like Rajat always says, like, oh, a thousand more people can't get a whole coin today, or like don't even worry about a whole coin, a half a coin, a point one, it doesn't matter, whatever you can accumulate. The point is that like people are cheering for number go up at the expense of freedom go down, and that's kind of what I'm trying to show. And then you can see it when the price goes down, like the institutions are gonna dump it. They don't care, like they really don't care about it being like accessible to everybody, but you can go buy it, you can just power up your own node, you can power up your own strike app and just buy it yourself. So we'll see if it ever really moves that way. But I think at a macro level and at a geopolitical level, the people who are controlling in the institutions that really control the way in which things go, they would give away their entire power. I do think they want self-custody in Bitcoin for themselves, though. So they'll tell people not to custody Bitcoin and like buy like through ETFs and rappers and stuff. They want that for you and for everybody else. They want to tokenize the world for you to like get to fall down that psyop, but they don't want they want self-custody Bitcoin for themselves. It's kind of like having countries that are domiciled with favorable tax um policies in islands, right? The Cayman Islands and stuff like that. They want that for themselves, they will they don't want that for the average partisan, so it'll never go away. I think the next story we'll see, it'll become a self-custody story more than anything else. Like, what can you take with you or have that nobody can seize when there's another print?

SPEAKER_02 15:15

That is so good. And I just want and I just want to um let me know if this makes any sense and uh if I'm leaning in the right direction. So just to kind of break it down for someone simpler uh who's listening. So basically, like whenever you could take Bitcoin uh to yourself, you can take self-custody from Bitcoin, you take it off exchanges and you keep it to yourself, you put it in cold storage, right? It's a very, very big deal. No one can take that away from you. And to kind of correlate it to what's going on right now, like uh, and let me know if I'm wrong, with stocks, right? Like nobody owns stocks, like it's it's a very small percentage of people of your everyday uh person who is investing in stocks, right? And it's almost like their little own casino that they can control and prop up. And so going back to institutions buying Bitcoin in Sal Custody, it's like it's almost like they're like uh a next level stock market, right? Hey, only we can have access to this type of deal. Am I wrong on that? Or is that uh or a little bit?

SPEAKER_04 16:09

No, you're definitely you're definitely leaning in like the the right direction. Like at the end of the day, for me, like I think about it like this. I you know, we were talking about it a little bit on Spaces last night, and I've been talking about it with some friends during the week. Like, there's nothing wrong with buying a stock if that's what you want to do. I I always tell people like you can't really truly appreciate the solution until you understand the problem. So I never tell anybody like what to do. I may tell you what I'm doing, and I'll tell you what I know, and then eventually the hardest assets that you own will become the biggest thing that you own because of math. Yeah, nothing to do over time, it has literally nothing to do with emotions and what you thought in the past. It's just mathematically driven is um by facts, right? So for me, right, like when I think about stocks, and to your point, you said like nobody really owns it, like, yeah, like you're a beneficiary legally of the stock, but you technically don't own it because they lend it. So not even to go down the I could go like on and on about the rabbit hole as it pertains to it, but the moral of the story is the moment you sign the the fine print on any brokerage, right? So Robin Hood, Charles Schwab, anywhere, you're the beneficial owner of that share. However, that brokerage through like the DTCC, um, the depository trust and clearance corporation, they can lend the shares to anybody, like they can lend the shares and they can make more shares than actually are issued and exist. It's like uh the shadow market, right? So, moral story, kind of think about that for anybody listening. It's like the black market of like stocks and just like investing, where you don't really know how much exists. I have no idea how many shares of NVIDIA are actually issued because they're lending them and they're creating them and they're they're selling what are called derivatives on those shares, and as a result, they're just lending it, lending it, lending it around. So you log into your app and you see I have ten thousand dollars worth of Apple, but it it says it's there, but it's really not there, kind of like your money in the bank. So that's another example, like right, like it doesn't mean don't own shares if you want to. However, understand what true ownership in your own custody means. They don't have yeah, they don't have to share proof of like anything of reserves or anything. Yeah, yeah, they don't.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

No, that makes that makes so much sense. Did you have a question, Daniel?

SPEAKER_00 18:23

No, I not a question, but uh, it made me think of loans too, like when you're buying a house. Like when he was, I mean, that's how the stock market got crashed, you know. So when he was doing loans, working in the loan uh industry, it was interesting because he was like, I'm just loaning money that I don't even know if it's actually assistance.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

I used to like, yeah, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 18:41

Like it was we it was crazy. These people are just asking, especially in 2020 when it was just a wild time. It was it was interesting because I was like, do they even have money to pay this back? You know, like I don't even know how these people are gonna be paying off these loans that are we're down to what was the percentage of insurance.

SPEAKER_02 18:58

It was like uh low, it was like low threes, high twos.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

Um then yeah, it goes up. And so that's what made me think when you were sharing that, you know, that's what I thought of immediately. I was like, I don't know, this loan system is working because I don't even know if there's money in there.

SPEAKER_02 19:12

Yeah, there's no money. They they just lend out more than what they have. And if they and if they for whatever reason, if they're like if there's an emergency, they'll just print all this money because there's no money that's existing. Really quick, just to pivot on this, I love this. Thanks that's a great question, Danielle. So the um right now this week, we just passed$39 trillion in our national debt. A lot of people don't even know. There's we have a national debt, a lot of people don't even know. You can go on on US world debt clock and look at the actual debt uh live. We just hit$39 trillion. Uh why is it important for people to understand this?

SPEAKER_04 19:51

Yeah, no, so yeah, the the debt, the debt that we see of what's reported is$39 trillion. And and I always tell people, like, I'll have to send it to you all because maybe you you could put it up on um, you could put it up on like one of your social media and stuff like that. And it's like this really big picture of an iceberg, and it shows the iceberg, like it's 39 trillion or whatever the debt was like like last year, and then below the iceberg is like this big, huge like structure, which is the iceberg is bigger than what you can see. You only see the tip of the iceberg, right? The 39 trillion of debt is really only the tip of the iceberg. That under what you don't see is off balance sheet debt, like unfunded liabilities, they will call it. And and it's like in the quadrillions, it's huge, like you know, nobody knows, right? It's like a black hole. Um, and in terms of the debt and where it is, right? The 39 trillion, sadly, it's just kind of robbing from future generations. Like everything that we're feeling now is because of what happened before. And I think the education and the resources that people see to be able to understand what this stuff means, they're probably more relevant because you can just Google, you can watch YouTube. However, I still think that a lot of people don't understand how that trickles into their daily lives. So, like, for example, um, I remember like last year, you know, this is actually really crazy, right? Like, this is a story that I'm I'm I'm definitely fine with sharing to everybody here because it shows you how insane this is, right? Like, I I currently live like in Massachusetts, and I moved back to Massachusetts like two years ago, but for some reason it was weird where like they were New York. I was living in New York before for school and I was there for work, and I was getting, I got like a check for like an inflation reduction check. So because like like um where I was living before, like my little cousin is living where I was living before, like I got the check, but I'm not even in New York, right? And then to me, I'm like, well, they're giving it to me because of that, but I'm getting this inflation reduction check. And that inflation reduction check was like 200 bucks, but it was a stimulus check. Like, and they were sending those checks out, and I remember seeing it. I have a ton of family in New York, and they were talking about it. They're like, hey, we're getting these checks, and I'm like, Trying to tell them, like, hey, you're gonna pay for that through inflation, like like actual real inflation years down the road. You're seeing this money come to your bank account, or you're getting this check, just like the stimulus checks that everybody got in COVID, like, you're gonna pay for that. So, I mean, I took my$200 check that they gave me and I just bought more Bitcoin. So at that point, like that's kind of what I did. And I told them, like, yeah, just go buy Bitcoin. Like, I'm telling you the same thing I've been telling you for years. So, so to your point, like, I don't I I I don't really think the debt's gonna stop. I think it's gonna continue to grow. I think that, you know, not to get super, super technical, but because the weight in which the debt levels are growing and the rate, like the you know, you know, kind of Anthony with your your um lived experience with work, like the treasury yields and all the the the yield that is essentially dictating what people feel personally, with credit card, mortgages, etc., they need that rate to go down because they want to refinance the debt at a lower rate, but it's not it's not cracking right now. Like the debt's not the the yield's not cracking, it's going up, right? And that's a whole nother conversation. So I don't know, it it is kind of daunting, it is scary to think about like over the past year and a half, how much it's grown. Obviously, unfortunately, we see all the geopolitical stuff with war and stuff going on and the printing that's happening there. And I just feel like they're gonna have to paper over it, they're gonna have to paper over it with more printing, and um, yeah, like it's like the people that have the hardest assets will be able to protect themselves from what's coming.

SPEAKER_02 23:31

Yeah. Oh man. It it and it that that is so good because people don't understand, like you talk to your normal, you talk to your average girl, right? And they're talking right now, like, man, and they're these look mo and I feel like most people don't talk about it enough, but like people are working multiple jobs now, right? They are like, and they're it's hard to keep up with your everyday expenses. And um, so when you people are working these multiple jobs, like going back to you know, uh years ago, people would one person could work a job and like supply their take care of the whole entire family. And so what happened? Like, nothing really like it was just more printing that went going that was going on, inflation is going on. It this was a slow path up to this where we're at now. So when people they'll regurgitate what they hear online and they'll or on TV and they'll just be like, Oh yeah, like this is just normal, like things just go up, like no, like literally things should be going down because uh technology is deflationary and technology is going like super quick. So everything actually naturally, and Jack Booth puts this in his book, uh price of tomorrow, but everything should be going down because we are able to produce mass production quicker, right? And service goods and services quicker. And so everything should be going down, but everything's going up. And so going back to that, it's like uh, but we our system is built for everything to just keep going up, and so it's like, man, where are we gonna people like don't think in five, 10 years from now, but because we're so like immersed in today, but we need to be thinking ahead of flow. So we'll just use gas because it's so irrelevant right now, right? With everything going on with Iran and uh just everything in our economies. Gas is like, let's just say right here in in in um in uh in Orange County, it's like$4.50, it's like$4, right? Yeah, and so if that if it's right now in 2026, where do you think gas will be at in 2030? It's like you and then um I heard in Spaces last night, and Johnny was talking about um how a million dollars back in like 20 years ago was considered a lot of money. Like a million dollar house was like you would think a growing up like, dude, a million dollar house is like bam. And now a million-dollar house is like a regular like shack. The goalposts are are gonna keep moving, and I think it might have been nolan. And I keep bringing up stuff from the spaces, but it was so good. But he was talking about how you know, like a it's gonna we're gonna be talking about how you got to be a billionaire to have like a great life, right? Because a millionaire is everyone's gonna be a millionaire, nothing, it's gonna be it's not gonna be valuable at all. Um, I don't know. I just think like a lot of the things we're that were touched on and where we're at right now is really good though.

SPEAKER_04 25:56

So to your point, right? What we were talking about spaces, I think it's really relevant, right? I don't even know if you heard when I was um I was sharing this example where I put up like a um I wanted to ask Grok and I used I put it I posted on Instagram and then I posted it on Twitter and I was like, okay, from 2015 to 2026, I was like, Grok, can you show me the median price of a home from 2015 to 2026 and how much it increased? And then also illustrate how if you price that house from 2015 to 2026 in gold and Bitcoin, explain like kind of like the the like the um how it changed, like the price movements. So when you looked at the price of homes from 2015 to 2026, it increased like 38%, right? So it was like 388,000 is like the median price across the country, obviously, because there's all these remote areas too. And then it shows that if you uh if you priced it in gold, it was about like I think it was maybe like 300 ounces of gold, because gold was about$1,100 in 2015, and then now it's about$4,500 right now. And it was now, if you priced it, it was like it would take 84 ounces of gold to buy a home, right? And then if you priced it in Bitcoin, it was 652 Bitcoin in 2015, and now it's six Bitcoin. So literally, like when you start changing the denominator, right, to your point, and all this stuff, prices are falling like in these other like hard monies. And that's really what I'm what I I try to really communicate. I'm like to Nolan's point last night on the space, like literally, if you save in dollars, the more we we save in dollars for the things we really want in our lives, the more expensive things are gonna go because they're just using that dollar to go create more debt. The moment you take your money out of the system and whatever capacity, if it's silver, gold, bitcoin, nobody could take that from you. And I always think about it like this like nobody's giving you, nobody's giving you something that they like consider worth worth something. Like if somebody gives you dollars for a stimulus, it's because they know they can make more. They're not saying, hey, here's some oil, so uh gas, so you can have gas, like give people gas. Like they're not giving you gas or oil because they know it's a commodity, like they're not giving you gold, right? Like if you go work at a job and you get shares for your like part of your compensation package, there's somebody that saved for uh micro strategy, they're stacking or NVIDIA, and then there's a new engineer or a new marketing person that got maybe a hundred thousand dollars worth of shares printed out of thin air for them, right? So when you start thinking about that, and I think some people they don't really, I'm not faulting people because they may not know anybody that's in that field or industry. And I think like for all of us, we know a lot more than probably the average person. So we're trying to share those experiences. Um, but it it isn't like you're talking from just like hypotheticals, like there could be somebody that gets a job out of college, works at a company, they get the shares that you're saving in that because they make them. Like they're getting it. They're they're printing the shares, they're issuing the shares to them, and then they're just giving them to them, right? So it's kind of like it's really wild when you start thinking about that aspect of it. And then when you go back to the house example, right? Like, and then the whole everybody could be a millionaire, like, yeah, like if you there's people in Massachusetts, like in Boston, certain areas. You would have, I was just talking to our father about this houses like in a neighborhood where he grew up not far from it. This neighborhood was very rough, right? It's changed, it's become more gentrified, but it was rough when he was growing up there. And they literally have houses for two million dollars. Two million dollars, and and and they're not worth two million dollars, right? So it's just mind-blowing. You know, like at the end of the day, like a lot, like nobody could really afford that per se. They're just gonna get indebted, and then things will, you know, they'll there'll be a correction because there always is, because it's yeah, orchestrated.

SPEAKER_02 29:46

So when would you think when would you think there'd actually be a next correction? Because I think they're so they don't want they don't want these correct, they just want to keep uh filling the gap with more money and flooding the system with more money. So, like, because I always thought like around in 2020, I think there was going to be something before if before COVID, like I was like, oh, this is unreal. Like rates are super low, and things were just I was like, nah, like there needs to be a reset, a correction, and it already had been, and people don't know, but these actually, these corrections, they happen like in decades, right? Yeah, and hadn't have there haven't been one since the 08. And you would think they learned their lesson, but they just kept going back to these old principles, right? Of like, I think they're even doing like stated income again for like uh to get housing and stuff. So it's just and that's what kind of got us in the in the 08. Yeah, you know, people were like at a grocery store and they're like, Hey, you got a job, you got a pulse, and they're like, Yeah, and I'm like, okay, here you go. You gotta, you know, you can get but they couldn't really afford that home, right? So uh with speaking on that, like do you think that when do you what what kind of correction do you see? It's do you think there's like a time frame? Like how what what does that look like?

SPEAKER_04 30:56

So honestly, like I feel like we've already seen I feel like the signs, the warning signs have been like kind of flashing before our eyes as it pertains to the macro, macro situation. So I'll I'll give an example. Like a lot of people obviously talk about 08 because it was just super, super like uh domino effect across the world. People talk about 2020 with COVID, obviously. But what a lot of people don't talk about, I feel like post-COVID, in between like COVID and now, they don't they don't mention like Silicon Valley Bank or First Republic in the regional bank crisis. And a lot of people, like a lot of people kind of like gloss over that. And I remember back when that happened, like I was writing about that on SIT me on blogs, on newsletters and stuff. I've been sharing insight about that. One because I had some friends that worked at First Republic on the private wealth management side and they lost their job and talking to him about his experience, and then he's good. Like he got pretty much got a job like a week later at another bank doing what he does. But the point is, like, the regional bank crisis stuff was serious. Um, I have I have another friend, you know, who works in he works uh at a hedge fund that he runs with his uh his family, and the hedge fund invests in banking companies, banking stocks. So even understanding kind of like that piece, because a lot of the banks that the stocks that they're buying will be maybe regional banks or community banks and commercial banks, and they're buying stocks in those. And when I'm understanding what he's saying about the the inner workers of the smaller banks, that's what keeps like the economy going, right? People think about the big huge banks, but at the local level, a lot of people use their local regional community banks. What I think was very interesting about the Silicon Valley Bank situation is that there were a bunch of affluent people that bank with Silicon Valley Bank.

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 32:41

I I had a conversation with a friend of mine literally like a month, two months ago, that has a company, a startup he runs, and they're doing great. And they banked with Silicon Valley Bank, and he was scared out of his mind. Like a lot of his like a lot of his like personal finance and stuff was like banking through Silicon Valley Bank, but they papered over it, they they printed it. Like there were a lot of affluent people that were hopping in spaces on Twitter. I I listened to uh at the time I was listening to like the all-in podcasts, they were like saying telling people, hey, put your money out of Silicon Bank because they're like it's it's not even they're not hiding the fact that there's a crack in the system. But those individuals that are banking there, they're not gonna lose their money, right? Like they they they got they got covered, right? So I say all that to say, like in terms of the next crash, I don't even know where it is. I feel like they keep there's all these like crashes that are happening before our eyes and they're papering over them. Yeah, you see it with private credit right now, like there's all these private credit companies or funds, excuse me, that are like somewhat insolvent because of the valuations and all the money that was raised during COVID. So it works when we're high or low, excuse me, when rates are lower and they're they're starting to trickle up, alternative lending facilities make sense. Some companies may say we're gonna get money from a private credit fund. So so for those that may be listening, like just to explain what private credit funds are and why it's relevant, like private credit is like private debt. So imagine like a big company, um, financial company like Bain Capital. I'm not sure if people may know about Bain, but Bain like is a private equity company that buys businesses. And they'll buy businesses that are private, or they'll they'll take a company private, hypothetically, but for the most part, they buy private companies and they will essentially put in their own leadership and they'll make the company better, more efficient, and then their goal is to sell the company for more than they bought it for. But the only way that they're able to finance that too is by borrowing money. They get debt, they borrow money at like low interest rates from banks to then buy companies, fix them up, lay people off, and then sell them, and then their investors make a bunch of money. So, what what what happened was there was a trend where a lot of these people in private markets realized hey, we have our own private equity fund. Why don't we start a private credit fund, debt, like a debt fund, and we can raise money from wealthy investors for people, and then we can lend that money to our portfolio companies because they need lending facilities. So that essentially has been growing and becoming more it became more popularized in um over the like past like decade or so. And then what also happened was they made those funds available to retail investors through like like you could like I could go on my Robin Hood or I could go on Schwab, you can go on any investment and invest in these types of vehicles. But what happens is in a situation like now, when there's a lot of instability, um, insolvency, right? Like a lot of the cracks in the financial system, some of those companies were not able to give all the redemptions at once to those investors. So there were a lot of reporto about Black Rock, one of theirs, they were halting redemptions, um, first brands. Yeah, there's a lot. Blue Owl, there's a lot.

SPEAKER_02 35:55

It's crazy. And but no, again, we're never taught this. It's really wild. We're never like we're never we're just taught the basics. You'll go to a job, right? And I just started my new job at Tesla, and then they're like, hey, and as your onboarding process, you should really invest in your 401k, and you really and here's a bunch of like Tesla shares, and it's like again, diluted, they could just issue those shares, and then also 401k. Most people, if you talk to someone and you're like, what vehicles is are is your 401k putting into like what Goldman Sachs, like index, like what are your the money you're just pouring into every two weeks, yeah, and you don't even know where that money's going, and they're investing that money, right? And so you're just like you're almost like hoping, living on a prayer, that by 60 or 65, like I'm gonna have enough money to retire. And back then that worked because the dollar wasn't bleeding as much, right? It held a little bit more value back then, and um, but now it's just like when you pivot and you like learn this stuff and you're reading and you're doing the work and you're just like, whoa, like, how does this exist?

SPEAKER_04 36:57

Like, Sean did a great breakdown on like the historical context of like that transition from the pension being the thing to the 401k being the thing. Yeah, like I said, I'm not even telling anybody not to do their 401k if they don't want because one, I think the more you understand the different options that are available and you're using them to know why, you'll realize why the off ramps are so powerful. So that's why I I encourage people like contribute to whatever you want. But the moment you understand why you're doing it and what it is, you may look at that differently. For me, that that to your point, like that that's kind of what what happened to me early on. Like, I would ask a ton of questions. Like, not and and luckily for me, like my I have people around me, like my family, my parents, like they they shared a lot of this stuff with me, things that they did like very well, and things that they're like, oh, I wish I did this a little different. So they were they were um more educated in some of that stuff with financial literacy. And I had an uncle who was the one that taught a bunch of people, like he was like the first one that really told everybody. So that that's kind of how it got trickled down to me. But I think and my sister, but I think for from the perspective of what you're saying with the 401k, like if you don't what I always understood, and this is really what I talk about all the time, and I'll and I'll die on this hill. I remember back when it was probably, I mean, five years ago or so, maybe like six, you know, going to NYU for business school and even going to Villanova and doing finance and stuff. Like, I have a I have people and friends that work at finance and they invest in startups, they may work at private equity, the type of companies you mentioned, they work in investment banking. And the one thing that stood out to me always was like when someone says to you, hey, Mike, you can't invest in this investment because you don't have enough net worth. Like your net worth isn't high enough to get access to like this good stuff. But like they'll funnel you to the other stuff, right? And when you start thinking about those gates and those barriers to entry, and then you think about the 401k component, right? The the wealthiest people, they're not just using the 401k to get like out of the system in a different way. They're buying other hard assets and they're buying businesses, or they're investing in people that are buying those businesses. And what I realized too, like through that experience, was like, okay, well, all of a sudden, like Robin Hood and all these companies say we're trying to democratize finance and investing by offering you access to private shares of like anthropic before it goes public and andor real. And I'm like, listen, like, nobody, I promise you, nobody's doing that because they care. The secondary market for like private companies for people who want to invest in them, that's been around for a long time. Like, there are people who literally will raise money from athletes and really, really celebrities, Ashna Kutra people say, Hey, do you want to invest in SpaceX? That's how they got it, because there was an early employee that probably wanted a liquidity event, and then they're willing to come in and buy it now because they have a bunch of money. Like, that's how that works. By the time it gets to you, and Robin Hood is saying that they're gonna give you private investing in your thing, they're they're dumping the bulls, the bull crap on you. Like, they're not giving you the good stuff, and and that's kind of what bothers me. And I and I get really um passionate about it when I try to explain to people because I'm like, nobody's giving you this like private investment to help you, they're dumping it on you, and and to bring it back home to the 401k point, you know, one of the key things that the administration mentioned, and this isn't even like a politically charged statement, this is facts, right? Like, I remember when um when uh I think it was like at the beginning of uh the big beautiful bill and a lot of stuff, a lot of the lobbies, think about it, like if it was the tech lobby, the financial lobby, the military lobby, which gave a lot of money to the administration, even when you think about the banking lobby, when they were essentially writing up the the writing up some of the um amendments as it pertained to investments that people can access in their 401ks, retail investors, they are now saying, hey, how do we get private credit? How do we get private equity? How do we get VC funds into people's re like 401ks? So now you're like, well, yo, I can go buy these private investments, I can get a seat at the table at what the big guys have. And that's how they're marketing it. They're marketing it because they want to dump that stuff on you. Like you are the liquidity for the individuals that have the stale stuff. And if that goes through, like, like, oh well, that already obviously is going through, like that's been like formalized where now people can invest in that stuff. That's those are the types of questions you need to ask when you invest in your 401k. Anybody listening, like just think about like the stuff that they're throwing in there that people don't want. They want to unlock that trillions and trillions of dollars of just passive money that people who you know you're we're in our 30s or whatever. If we just keep investing for another 30 years in our 401k, how much money are they getting from us? And then think about everybody around you that's just doing it blindly. You don't even know what they're dumping into there, and it becomes like a big black hole. And that's kind of what I try to say like do it if you want, you should do it because the more you do that and you do and you DCA into hard money, you will understand why you want the hard money and you want more of it. Um, but that that's a that's a key component from the the structural foundational aspects of how these vehicles work that I try to communicate in a way that is um understandable and not to go too high level, but just understand it's like someone throwing a bunch of stuff in a crock pot and they had a bunch of stuff in their like uh pantry and they just threw everything in there at once so it didn't go to waste. And then they're like, here, serve it up, like this is for you. So you're like, what? This came from XYZ? All right, yeah, okay, like great. Like you're just serving me up this like concoction.

SPEAKER_02 42:26

Great. Thank you. This is such a nice kitchen. So yeah, it's all joking there. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

Yeah. Um, so how should people then like protect themselves from kind of this environment? You know, what are ways I mean, I'm thinking of you know, me just educating themselves, you know, with the basics of finance. I think that's like a place to start. But yeah, if you could add on to that, what do you what are you thinking?

SPEAKER_04 42:53

So it's it's actually it's actually great. I'm glad you asked that question, Danielle. Like, uh, so I'll I'll give an example about one of the things we're doing right now because it's super relevant to how people can start. Because I don't even think it has, it doesn't have an age limit. So we do work with uh my team, we do work with some uh community centers and some churches, churches that have community centers like in the area. So we're in the we're on week three teaching a group of middle schoolers um about freedom literacy. I don't like to call it financial literacy, I like to call it freedom literacy, and teaching them about savings, budgeting, investing. But the way we started within, we always start with the budget, like literally. We always start with the budget and and explain it to them. And and I think what's very interesting is you know, these these young kids, like they're like 12 to like maybe 13, and they don't know, they don't really know much about money or investing like that, but the way they're like retaining stuff so quickly and starting from the foundational aspects, I think that's super important, especially when it comes to budgeting, right? Because even from the state the the work we're doing with the children, all the way up to adults that we work with too through our community or our course or our Our program coaching, whatever it is, like I always start with that. And everybody on my team will say the same thing, is understanding what's coming in and what's going out. The reason being is because we're living in an environment where if you don't have a real good pulse on that, you're gonna just overspend naturally. So that's where I like to start. And then secondly, within there, like if you take anything away from what I'm saying, is understanding how debt is just a hindrance, right? So there's some debt, obviously, like if you have a house and you had a good mortgage or whatever, like God bless you. Or if you went to school and you had some student loans and that was that allowed you to get a job, right? That's like a debt where you're gonna you could pay that debt down, pay it off, but at least you use your education to get a job to educate yourself. Now, the bad debt, like the credit card debts that may be getting out of control, or car debt, buying a car that you can't afford, I've been encouraging everybody to get rid of that stuff. I feel like it's hard for me to have a conversation with them about investing in Bitcoin and stuff until I really make sure that they understand why the debt is the problem. Because by the time they understand that the debt that they have incurred is printed, then they really are motivated to get rid of that debt to buy more Bitcoin. So that's kind of been my approach lately. Like, I'm like, hey, well, for years, I'm like, hey, you have credit card debt. Yo, don't get upset that you have credit card debt. Pay it down. Like, you know, if you could consolidate some of the cards, consolidate the cards and then get rid of the debt. Why pay the credit card company interest for money they create out of thin air with your time and energy? That's money that could be reallocated to the hard money. So that's kind of like a good starting point for me where I've been going. Like the budgeting and then eliminating that consumer debt. Once they get that, I'm like, understand how that debt you're incurring and what you're paying, they're giving you 30 to 40 percent interest. Oh, 30 per 20 to 30 percent a year. And and for me, right? Like, I mean, I I know Anthony, like, we talk about faith and stuff like that as well. Like, I'm a man of God, right? And for me, usury is a sin. And everybody knows that, and it's permeated into the society where people are accepting usury and it's and it's hindering people, it's controlling them. So that's why I'm like, the moment you can like break free of that, that high usury debt, like you won't feel that that that is the the weight that's lifted off of a bunch of people's back. And then from there to your question, Danielle, then we can really start running forward. Doesn't mean that you can't do the investments at the same time, but you won't appreciate it. I don't want you to ever get back in that position ever again.

SPEAKER_02 46:19

Exactly. So that's so good. That is so good, Jordan, because people don't know, like having that debt, especially student loans that like you're buried in it at a young age. It's crazy. Like you can just get into this debt, but like you can't buy a car or or you can't own a car, or like you can't, you can't even drink a you can't even drink a beer, but you can have you can get into hundreds and thousands of dollars in debt. Easy, what easy talking about? And people understand too, like if you're listening, like debt is like you're you have no money when you're when you pay off your debt, you're basically broke, broke, right? You're broke, right? And then whatever money you have and you poured into ass hard assets, now we're like winning, right? Like that's where you're you're really growing because I'm glad I found this out after, right? But when you have debt and you're paying this debt and people are making money off of you that they just printed out of thin air, Jack Mahler says it's the best. Nobody should have to work for money that another man can print. And that's that is like you're I was like, oh my gosh. Like, and then I almost like get in this other mindset of like, maybe I just take out this debt and just buy Bitcoin with this hard money. Maybe like really stick it to this.

SPEAKER_04 47:26

No, but but it's really it's real. Like some people do do that, and like for me, I'm like, you know, I I always to go back to what you said with the debt is like start pricing your life in hard money. Literally, like start pricing. I wrote a blog about that on our on the Sydney says newsletter, and I was like, start like literally kind of goes back to changing the denominator. Change the denominator on everything around you, and you'll quickly realize that you probably don't have enough hard money because you think that you had to collect dollars that are just melting. Doesn't mean you don't have dollars for your bills. You should have like emergencies, you should have some money allocated to the side so you can continue to accumulate and be smart with your strategy. And if you have children, you know what I mean? Like taking care of your family, like 100%. But I think that, you know, I think hard money because it's grounded in something that's not debased and controlled by central, it's not controlled the same way as printed dollars, it brings it'll start to bring out the better in you to add more value, right? You'll be you're you become more productive, right? You you wanna like you wanna essentially work harder or work smarter, excuse me, and be able to save. You stop you stop spending money on things that you thought you needed. Um doesn't mean you don't go on vacation. You should. You should go on a vacation and have abundance for your life, but understand that like if you can't delay gratification, like legitimately you're gonna go right back to the same spot that you started. So to your point, like, yeah, change the denominator. Even even if you do have debt, for anybody that's listening that has some debt, like change the denominator of how you're prioritizing the hard money and keeping like you know, living below your means and investing in other assets, and then like making sure that like that's starting to like take over and grow faster. Because the debt that you have, whether it's like a mortgage, a student loan, is going to get inflated away. Like there's another person signing papers right now every moment to get another debt. So it doesn't mean that your debt's not um that you shouldn't pay off your debt, right? And get there. But when you start thinking in hard money and changing the denominator of everything around you, you're like to the house example. If if you knew that buying a house was 652 Bitcoin and now it's six, or it was a couple hundred gold ounces and now it's 84, but the dollar it keeps going up, why wouldn't I want to save the hardest thing? I start changing the denominator. I'm working and going to job, I'm working two jobs, hypothetically. So you're working two jobs and you're doing Uber, like Lindsay, shoutouts to Lindsay. She's driving Uber to go stack more Bitcoin. Like she's not going to drive Uber to like go spend it on um um you know extraneous stuff. Yeah, shoes and dumb stuff, right? So once you change the denominator, I for me, I see the world so much different. I'm like, okay, yeah, like I'm literally like denominating my life in hard money. And if I'm the biggest beneficiary of it, awesome, me and Renee, our children, this is for them, right? Like, this is for the legacy. So at the end of the day, like I'm not really in this to um to just like say, look at me, like I have this big portfolio. I'm like, I'm actually trying to help people, as are you all. So that's really what it's about for me.

SPEAKER_02 50:23

That is so good. And um, I think there's a quote out there too. Someone's debt is another man's asset. So your debt that you're paying, someone else is making so much money off of you. And I'm like, I don't want no one making any money off of me and my family. The only thing that's making money is like our money, our hard money is just making money for us. And all we're doing, we're and then you're just in your your world, right? Of like, how am I like leveling up, eating healthier? Yes, hitting the weights, uh, being a better dad, being a better husband. And then you're like, oh, and then at the same time, your money is growing with you. Yeah, and you're just in this world of like growing abundance and just getting better as a human being, and no one's making money off of you, no one can like come after you, no one's sending you a bill, and none of that stuff. And but we live in such a world where everyone's like debt is so natural, it's so organic, it's like in our everyday, it's like you know, in our lives, and so people think, oh, like I gotta have it, I gotta have this car, I gotta have this stuff. Oh, yeah. Like if you don't need any of that stuff. Yeah, all you need is eat right and do the right things. What'd you say?

SPEAKER_04 51:22

Yeah, you know, it's crazy. And just to jump in with what you said about it being permeated throughout life, when I was talking to me and uh my um my uh team member Tom, we were talking to the kids on Tuesday, and we were talking to them about debt, and we were on investing week, but we were talking to them about like buy now, pay later. And I and they they understood what credit cards are, but I asked them, I was like, hey, have you guys heard of buy now, pay later? And they were like, Yeah, like um they and that's and it's scary to me that they know what that is, right? They weren't saying that they were using it, but they know people that have used it, and then they're like, I was explaining to them that like what you're saying, like it, it, it, it trickles in. I remember, you know, we're all like in the same generation. We wouldn't just go if we didn't have the money to buy something, we just weren't getting it, right? Like, I didn't have a phone, like I had a flip phone maybe to make two calls, one my mom and my dad, and maybe my grandma's, and that was it. I couldn't call anybody else. So at the end of the day, like the fact that they know what that is and they could have access to it and get a little loan to go buy a Chipotle burrito, like it's so abundant around you. And that's what's wild to me. Like, yes, they're they're they're securitizing it, Danielle. To your point, like with the mortgages and just giving them to anybody, they're giving that they'll they'll give you debt to go buy Taylor Swift tickets and then package them up and then sell the debt to an investor for a yield, right? To your point, uh Anthony, like they're making money off of you having to pay that debt forever. So now they're just kind of getting lower and lower and lower into these other areas that they can like kind of get these like shorter loans and um charge higher interest. And it's it's really crazy. Um and they're banking on you not paying it off, right?

SPEAKER_02 52:53

Yeah, they're yeah, they're banking on you, like just keep paying, keep paying, and you know, and then they're just in their pocket, you know, while you just keep paying, you're like you're trading your most precious time, your most precious quantity, your time for a dollar that's that being diluted, and then also someone's making money off of that, your time. And it's just when you really learn it, learn about Bitcoin, it teaches you so much of it, just uh cover like removes the blinders, it removes the curtains, and you're just like, Whoa, there's like this whole other world where like we can actually like live abundance, right? And like, like, and those like values pop up, and right, and so it it's just it's really insane how you really think about it, yeah. But everyone's like watching the headlines, watching the news, the number go up, hey Bitcoin's this like that. None of that really matters once you understand what Bitcoin brings to you in your family and where it's going in the future. Um, so if someone's listening right now, feels behind or confused about all of this, like what's the first step they should take to start thinking differently and setting themselves up for protecting themselves?

SPEAKER_04 53:55

Yeah, so I think for for me, what I will recommend for like a YouTube video, I would start with this one animation that's super dope. I can't remember the guy's name, it's like Joe something. But if you if you search what's the problem, like on YouTube, it's like an animated video and it starts to explain about the problem within the system. He doesn't even talk about Bitcoin until like the end, and it's animated and it's really good. I love that video. I think that's a great video to start. The Hidden Secrets of Money. Uh maybe uh some of your other guests have mentioned Hidden Secrets of Money. That's an incredible book, like in terms of being able to understand like what the problem is. And once again, like that video isn't just about it's not about Bitcoin until like the last like video, maybe like it's just talking about the history of money. I think that's a great one. Um if you really want to go down the rabbit hole to truly understand what's going on, The Creature of Jekyll Island is a really, really like crazy book. It's dense, but it's a great book because it's talking about the history of the Fed and that's where all this stuff is stemming from with the banking system and the Fed. I think if you don't, if you are kind of trying to get through the book and you wanna get a if you want to get the book cool, but if you also want to start off with the video, like the guy that wrote the book has an old school video on YouTube. If you literally search it, like, and I'll send it to you guys and maybe put in the show notes, like that's a great video to understand that um the the creature Jekyll Island and the whole financial system and how it works. And then honestly, check out SIMT Me, right? Like go to SIPMe.com. Like we have a lot of resources where we we break this stuff down. Um, you know, I I always try to make sure that in addition to explaining Bitcoin stuff, I'm explaining stocks and stuff as well, but I'm also just telling you the truth. So at the end of the day, you pick your poison, you can understand, you can literally watch a blog, listen to a blog that we're explaining about stocks, but I promise you, the more you go down the hard money rabbit hole, like you'll realize that that's totally different. Some things make sense in hard money world that don't make sense in fiat world because the it's they're two different systems, right? So um, two different worlds, exactly. So I think between those resources, and of course, anybody can always reach out to me directly on Twitter. Like my Twitter is Perry the PM, and on um Sent Me is uh my social media, like we're in a wherever we're on LinkedIn too. So for those that like what you know are big into LinkedIn, I know people like to laugh at LinkedIn. LinkedIn's uh is a great platform. I love LinkedIn. Let's LinkedIn. Yeah, yeah, let's LinkedIn, right? We're on LinkedIn, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, uh, YouTube, everywhere. So, like I said, um, I appreciate you all for just allowing me to be able to speak and uh I love what you all are building.

SPEAKER_00 56:28

Yeah, man, this has been so eye-opening for me. This was such a good conversation for sure. And just because I have a you know, history and education and all of that too, just being with the younger kids and building those foundational um you know insights of delaying gratification and really thinking about not everything needs to be instant. You don't have to keep up, keep up with the Joneses because the Joneses are in debt too. Um like just being able to instill those things in them at a younger age is super cool. And I like, you know, I it could be it's it's just very important. And we try to do that with our own kids, you know, being even just little things, it didn't even have to be about finance. It could be like, hey, it's gonna take hard work to get to where you want to go. So we have to delay that gratification sometimes to get those results, you know. And so I think it's just so awesome. And even working with us, me adults, you know, we're uh we're still learning this whole fiat system too, you know. It's like we're always growing up, we're always learning something new, and just being open-minded enough to listen is gonna, it's just super helpful. So I appreciate you and your time that you took today, this morning, um, to share with our viewers and and selfishly me uh to learn a little bit more.

SPEAKER_02 57:44

Awesome. Now thank you all, dude. Thank you, Jordan. We really appreciate this, man. I was super fired up to get you on here. Uh, I just always been, you know, when I follow you, it's just like everything is like bam, bam, bam, you know, like I love it. It's just like straight to the point. There's no there's no fluff. And um, I was just really like, and I know we can literally go on forever. Um, because it is this is it's endless. These rabbit holes you go down, whether it's health, whether it's you know, fitness, whether it's money, whether it's education, like it it it it uh trickles into everything, like you said. And so thank you again for carving some time out. We really appreciate it and super excited.

SPEAKER_04 58:20

Yeah, we'll have to have her nail. Absolutely, she would love it. She would love it. And um, and the one thing I'll just say too is like for anybody listening, like it doesn't even matter like what you start with. Um, I remember the first stock that I ever bought personally, like in terms of taking it on myself to buy a stock. And I was an intern in working in finance uh during my sophomore year of college. I had just finished my sophomore year of college. I was working in Boston at this finance company, and my my one of my good friends was like, he was younger than me. He got the internship through networking. He had just graduated high school. We went to the same high school and middle school, and he got the job. My my good friend Joe, and I always tell him this. And Joe literally was like, yo, I worked at a fish market for like all of our, I didn't even know he worked at the fish market, and he saved up$10,000. Like at work at the fish market, and that was his first amount of money that he invested, and he kept doing it, and then he sent me the link to sign up for Scop Trade. And I had a couple hundred bucks and I bought this company called Cooper Tire, and it ended up being a good company, it got acquired by Goodyear. But the point I'm just trying to make is that like the idea of just starting, it was nothing about like look, Joe has more money than me. Like, Joe's my one of my close friends, like we're boys to this day, and I respected him, and I actually looked up to the fact that he took that on himself to work in high school at the fish market, right? I didn't have a job in high school working at or anything like that. Like, uh, I just I didn't have a job. I was working on, I was playing sports, I was doing other stuff. But the plan is that like surrounding yourself with people that actually want the best for you and that you also can look up to and that um you admire and respect. And at the end of the day, not comparing your chapter one to someone else's chapter 10. Like, I didn't think, oh my gosh, Joe has more money than me. I'm like, I'm starting with what I can afford and what I have. And I I never look back from that point. And then that started with me explaining these stuff, this stuff on platforms to other people. So don't be afraid of just starting with what you have. I know everybody's like, oh, get to this amount of Bitcoin, get to this amount of net worth. Literally, just put your head down, surround yourself with good people, trust God, keep God first at it all because God could take all of that away from you. Like, I don't give a crap how much Bitcoin you have, like, like it doesn't matter at the end of the day, you can't take it with you. So, like, just be a good person because the system that we live in is is trained to make people think they have to rush to get more. Like, live in the moment, be present, and just be a good steward of what you're blessed with. And then I I believe you will be blessed more abundantly for that. So that's all I'll leave it with.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:45

Let's go.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:46

Hey, that was great. I'm so pumped. Thank you. I'm leaving now, and I'm all pumped up. I'm glad.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:53

Yeah, I'll have a pumped up Saturday.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:55

Dude, thank you, Jordan. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:58

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:59

This is awesome.