To The Moon With The Luna's Podcast

Bitcoin Is Bigger Than The Price l with Marcus

• Anthony Luna • Season 2 • Episode 30

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 Bitcoin's price may move up and down, but does the strategy change?

In this episode of To the Moon with the Lunas, Anthony and Danielle sit down with Marcus from Michigan to discuss Bitcoin's latest pullback, market cycles, and why experienced Bitcoiners often view volatility as opportunity instead of fear.

Marcus shares his perspective on where we may be in the current cycle, why patience and a long-term mindset matter, and how studying Bitcoin's history can help remove emotion from investing. The conversation also explores Michael Saylor's Bitcoin treasury companies, ETFs, preferred shares, and other Bitcoin-related investment vehicles, breaking down how they work and the trade-offs investors should understand.

The episode wraps up with a discussion on self-custody, building conviction during market volatility, and why every Bitcoiner should have a plan based on their own goals and time horizon.

In this episode:

* Bitcoin's latest pullback and market psychology
* Understanding Bitcoin market cycles
* Why a long-term investing plan matters
* Michael Saylor's Bitcoin treasury strategy
* ETFs, preferred shares, and Bitcoin investment products
* Self-custody vs. third-party products
* Building conviction during market volatility
* Practical advice for new Bitcoiners

Follow Me on X: https://x.com/AntMoon5
Follow Me on X: https://x.com/MrsDanielleLuna
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Guest's Socials:
X: https://x.com/Observant3121

Referral Link for Microseed
https://microseed.io/?...
Use code LUNA at checkout for a discount

@fincreighton on X
bitcoinsuccessschool.com


⚠️ Disclaimer: This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only and should not be considered financial, legal, or investment advice. Always do your own research before making financial decisions.

#bitcoin #money #cryptocurrency #podcast #finance #crypto #BTC #MichaelSaylor #BitcoinETF #SelfCustody #Investing

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SPEAKER_01

I think Bitcoin's bigger than me. And I kind of had that conclusion over the years that it's just bigger than you. You know, like a joke we'd say Bitcoin doesn't care. That's what we always say. Like Bitcoin doesn't care about support and resistance. It'll just clamp through support and go down. Or it'll just go up. It doesn't care. It doesn't care what anybody's doing. It just kinda does what it wants. And I kind of like that about it. I kind of like that it's bigger than the government. It's actually bigger than Michael Saylor. It's bigger than the ETF. It's bigger than the US dollar. And they can't kill it.

SPEAKER_03

This episode is brought to you by Micro Seed. Microseed engraves your entire Bitcoin sea phrase onto fireproof, waterproof, steel, or titanium. Small enough to fit in your palm, strong enough to last a lifetime. It's durable, easy to hide, and built for secure storage.

SPEAKER_00

If your seed phrase is still on paper, it's time to upgrade and take self-custody to the next level. Because not your keys, not your coins. Go to microseed.io and use code LUNA-L-U-N-A for a discount. Or check the link in the description below. Welcome back everyone to To the Moon with the Luna's podcast. The Bitcoin price today is 61,000. Today we're joined by Marcus from Michigan. Marcus is a husband, father, author, business professional, and passionate Bitcoin advocate who has spent years helping others think differently about money, investing, and the future of Bitcoin. Today we're going to discuss some re recent market pullbacks, Bitcoin treasury companies, Michael Saylor, and where Bitcoin could be headed next. Marcus, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, thank you for having me. All right, let's go, Marcus. Uh well, thanks again, Marcus, for hopping on here. We really appreciate it. Uh Bitcoin gave us best case scenario yesterday, uh dipping into the 50s. Uh it seems like everybody freaked out. We buying or we selling?

SPEAKER_01

Oh man, we're just it this is just kind of a part of the game. You know, this is just where we're at. Um bear markets can be painful for some, but I mean, this is like my third. I actually posted that I like bear markets now more than bull markets almost because it's like such a buying opportunity, and you can kind of see anybody being scared. I just think I just hasn't really dealt with this before because Bitcoin always prevails eventually. Yeah, it's kind of I thought I was walking my dog and I called it like a genius idiot index of what people think of you, you know. So we're kind of at that point of where you're everyone kind of thinks you're an idiot, and as long as you can bear that, uh, when everyone thinks you're a genius will be great, which will be soon.

SPEAKER_03

But yeah, no, I I love it. Everyone just freaks out. Uh like this is great. Everyone's like quiet, everyone's like all sad, everyone's just posting like I thought this, you know, this XYZ, blah, blah, blah. But this is great, especially if you're new into this Bitcoin space. We're, you know, we're not where we want it on our uh Bitcoin goals. So like anytime it takes a dip, I'm like, dude, like some buy, right? And so uh we're super excited for it. Um, I know like you're you like you said, this is your third time.

SPEAKER_01

So uh Yeah, I think it's it's being more strategic know it's coming. Uh I I've been waiting I I've been waiting for well for low 50s, to be honest. Like, I I kind of I'm like cheering it on, and it's funny because people are like, man, I can't wait, you know, for you to be more bullish. It's like this is just a part of the show. You just have to like accept you have to deal with the market you have, right? Like this is this it's selling off. Okay, fine, right, good, you know. But then there's there's there's comments. I remember from past cycles where I'm like, okay, we're getting close. And I'm sorry, but I don't feel like we're close yet. We're like, you know, we're getting there, but like things you want to see uh out in the world are like ridiculously low targets. Like, oh, we're going to 20k. It's like, that's that's a bottom signal, you know, just nonsensical targets. People were saying that 1200 went uh in seven, like in 18. Oh, we're going to 1200, never went there. Uh, everyone was saying 11,000 last cycle never went that low. You know, so it's kind of like we just haven't really heard that. We're, you know, you're almost looking for huge buying to come in, and we're just not seeing that. We're just seeing weakness in price. Every rally is a relief rally. It's like it's funny because like the bills come back out and people message me on X, and I'm like, dude, don't listen. We're not there yet. It's okay. Like, just let this work itself out.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Um, and it'll be all right. But you have you kind of have to kind of go through the pain, right? Of like, but you have to go through a bear market. Yeah, you know what I mean, and like deal with it. You have to accept that you're in it. Yeah, I think I think denial is just stresses you out. Like, I can't even imagine the stress people like seeing it slam down. And I used to be that person, right? Yeah, um and it should give you like a uh you should have a plan in the in the bull market. Like, okay, like maybe, maybe I sell some. I know that's like cliche, but it's like maybe I take some off the top net over 100k, right? Maybe I sell, I don't know, a quarter, whatever, and we get slammed like we're getting slammed now, and you reinvested. I mean, you could be at a half, you could be adding 15 million satoshi by just being patient. Yeah, and so but there everybody has their own strategy, you know, do what works best, but yeah. I mean, yesterday I was like, I'm like cheering it on, like hit my hit my buy order, just keep going down. Yeah, and I joke with people, I'm like, I'm about to start posting bearish comments, like, oh man, gut this pig, man, you know, just just trying to push the price down. You you know, and uh I told a buddy in Texas yesterday on the phone, I was like, it's literally the say uh not sailor, um the Buffett quote where it's like the market is the patient taking money from the impatient. So just just I'll be patient and wait.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, absolutely. So uh since we're on this, how how low you think we're gonna uh go or what what what are your thoughts on this?

SPEAKER_01

Man, it's hard to call the complete bottom. I I just I don't feel like we're at the low right now. Like I feel like everybody wants it to be 60k, so it won't be 60k. Yeah. Um man, I feel like 48 to 51 could just be like uh and I don't mean we sit there, I mean we slam down and recover fast. And again, that's what I'm looking for is like massive volume coming in, who's like the real money, you know. Like, okay, that looked like the bottom there. It slammed down like November. I always remember November of 18 going from like 6k to 3K, and I know it sounds like nothing now, but um, that hurt, you know, because the it was like my first like dang, is it really over? You know, and it but then it snapped back up above 4k and that was it. And you know, looking back, you're like, see, that was that's what you should have been watching. You know, it's kind of like uh playing sports, you know, you watch film, your film is the past. It's not absolute though, those plays aren't gonna exactly happen that way. Some of these gospels will fail. I, you know, the power law, whatever laws out there, not everything's absolute, but it's you know, you're using that to kind of you know prepare for the game. And so you look back at some of those previous cycles of those slams, um, because people say, Oh, well, it's gonna require an FTX event. No, it don't. No, it don't. It doesn't require that, you know. Um, like a gambler, it's coming. No, it doesn't have to, you know, it doesn't have to hit, you know. So uh just use the past to prepare you for like your you know your actions for buying. But a lot of the new breed, you know, I'm getting old. The new fee, everybody just dollar costs average now. That wasn't even a thing back then. I mean, but because you could buy so much more, right? Yeah. Why would I dollar cost average into a Bitcoin when it's five grand? I'll just buy, I'll just throw a couple grand in and get a half. Um so it just depends on your strategy.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that's really good. Um, and going back to what you kind of just shared right now, uh looking at the past, right, and looking at what what kind of data we have so far with it. So Bitcoin being like 17 years old, it's still considered a uh in like a teenager, right? So with the data that we have so far, do you think like that's enough data to like kind of make a an honest prediction or these hypotheticals? Or do you think it's per it's pretty solid? Because I know a lot of people from what I hear, and again, I'm not like a in the uh I don't know too much in the stocks and all these other different financial instruments, but at the same time, it does seem like just a little glimpse of of data uh or you know, hey, this is what it's gonna look like, you know, five, 10 years from now. Um, so what are your thoughts on that?

SPEAKER_01

So it's funny you say it's 17 because I was joking with a friend. I was like, we're not kids no more. You know, we were in 2017. I think we're, you know, what is that? Like nine years ago. I was like, we still were kids, you know, the memes were super funny, like people are making funny songs. It's like now, you know, we gotta wear a suit, man. We got Wall Street involved. It's like watching like those old teenage movies, like, you need to take your life seriously. Did you apply to Stanford? You know, like there's all this pressure to the senior now. And I feel like there's all this pressure to Bitcoin to be taken so much more seriously, where it whereas Wall Street's involved, there's all these different vehicles you can use um to you know to earn a return. Um I you know, when it comes to you just take everything into consideration, just be careful holding on to like like I call them gospels, like it's never gonna do this. No, uh, it did like it's never going below the previous all-time high. It does that all the time now, yeah. You know, or when we hit the all-time high before the halving was like that can happen, you know. Yeah, and then the uh we haven't had a real blow off top. I mean, 2017 was so so crazy within a week. I mean, and it's not even that much money now to think about it, but at the time to go from like trading to like stocks to like options, and then see something like Bitcoin, like have just a go from like every every swipe, every refresh was a thousand, a thousand, a thousand. You're like, what what is this? You know what I mean? And it was just was so incredible. Whereas now we just kind of have this slow kind of play up. I I think that the cycles have everyone's gonna argue this, but it it's kind of clear at this point that they do follow a pattern. Yeah, there's a pattern there that it follows, whether it's based on the halving or uh just liquidity or whatever's going on in the markets, it does still seem to do it like really well. And so you might as well take advantage of that. Uh, and even if something doesn't work and your 100% strategy ends up being like 85%, well, okay. You know what I mean? You're still you're still gonna be okay. Um it's it's all good till it's not as far as unless we just go up like a the only way I had a thought the other day, I was like, the only way I would actually consider like cycles to just be completely over is if the king dollar fails, all of a sudden people don't take it seriously, like oh treasury bonds are paying like 15%, and now nations are like I don't feel comfortable buying that because you're just printing the money to pay me. If there's it's something dramatic where it's like, well, now we need to find a better vehicle, and there's this huge shift into it, and it just it just does like the the pictures people draw where it goes straight up. Well, then that, yeah, then I'd be like, okay, it's over, but I mean, God, it's like a gift. It's like you don't even got to be good at trading and investing, just kind of follow the the the pattern it's doing. I mean, technically you'd probably be fine if you bought here, right? Then 52k. You know, it's like you're probably fine. Um, I'm just stubborn and patient, so I'm just waiting.

unknown

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01

Well, uh, I don't think people aren't telling me to buy a couple bucks away, you know. Like I get messages like Wendy, do it, just do it here. Even my youngest son was like, wait a minute. So if it was like two bucks away, would you not do it? And I'm like, I don't know, I'm kind of stubborn. And he's just laughing at me. He's like, Why not? And I'm like, I don't know, that's the price I want, you know.

SPEAKER_00

And yeah, that's that's cool, that's really cool. And I think for for me who came into Bitcoin a little bit later, Anthony kind of introduced uh introduced me to Bitcoin. It's been neat to see this market go up and down. And I know not every uh partner is as involved, right? And not really paying attention. And so seeing it dip, uh, I think I remember the first time it dipped from like a significant amount.

SPEAKER_03

Like from 125. Yeah, it was 125.

SPEAKER_00

And I was like, geez, like what so what now? What are we doing? You know, like what are we and um then I started kind of asking more questions because I was like, okay, and I was like, you we were talking like, oh, this thing's gonna go to the moon, you know? And so having those realistic conversations, like what you're saying, you gotta have a plan and kind of like you there is a pattern, it's just not this beautiful picturesque pattern. It's gonna go up and down um slowly and truly. But and um, but yeah, it's just nice to be in this market right now because I feel like if you can handle it right now, it's gonna be great when you can handle it when it you know goes to the moon for sure. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I think you made a point about like, oh, Bitcoin's 17. Well, if you think about it, so what eight, nine, eight, nine years ago, what somebody could have been 11, right? Or 10 years old or nine years old. Now they're like they're kind of going into adulthood. So there's this new group coming into the investment world, and they're probably like terrified at this. And then you're gonna end up being the sages and the wizards explaining, like, calm down, it's gonna be okay. You know, but it does, it does get fun in the in the bull market, you know. 100k was like huge to see, yeah, you know, for me. I mean, you know, there were some really cool like videos people were making on X. I'm like, man, you gave me emotional, man, you know, like that's crazy. This thing's gonna be a hundred thousand. Like, because I remember 10,000 just being the the final boss of like, yeah, there's no way, you know what I mean? And then it just went through that like hot knife through butter, like, holy smokes. I mean, we did hit 125,000. I do think society has had some changes. Um, there's been some changes through society over the years since 2017 to like lower to make people's expectations need to be so much more ridiculously higher. Uh but man, uh yeah, 125 is a lot, and it sucked too, because it happened well in my time zone. It happened at like night, and I was like, oh, it's cool. Uh, we'll see what it's at in the morning. And I really got it's like 117. I was like, dang, that's already over with. And then that was kind of it. Like from there, I just didn't it just lost its like it lost steam. It almost seemed like at the inauguration when Trump got in was kind of the high. It was like 108, and it just kind of like it would kind of go up a little bit, and it just could never really get going. Yeah, so that that also goes back to being like, Well, there's all these companies buying it, there's nations buying it. That didn't seem to matter, you know. And so, you know, it and that and you'll see that in other assets, that's not just Bitcoin. So they were saying all that about silver. Oh, everybody needs silver for all these these electric engines that they're making over in Korea or whatever. I read, and it's like that doesn't seem to matter. It's down 50% from the high in February. So it's like some of the things you think are like absolute, again, just be careful, you know. And so, again, have a plan. Be like, okay, if we reach this point, you know, having a family, you know, it's like, okay, it's gonna, it's gonna go here. I might as well take, I might as well trim, why not? You know, trim some, yeah, improve my life. You know, I always joke with people, I'm like, pay for private school, whatever. You don't, you know, let let Bitcoin Bitcoin can make your life better, you know, and just and and people you get really hardliners that are these you gotta live this. And it's like I said to a friend last night, I'm like, this is like a hundred-year game we're learning, you know. Yeah, it's extremely powerful, you know. Like we thought that in from 17 we were like, it's over, it's all gonna collapse, the dollar's gonna go away. Bitcoin's such a slam dunk, it makes so much sense. Uh, the dollar has proven to be a pretty formidable enemy. And uh we're in the States. So um, yeah. You know, it has some it's pretty powerful. And so don't underestimate it. You know, you're not gonna live forever. If you need to trim some, it's okay. Uh, but just use Bitcoin to your advantage. It's okay. You know, like if if you enhance your life through it, that's still a win, you know.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I I agree with you on that. Everyone's going through a different battle, right? And everyone, it's personal finance, right? So it's it's personal. So whether you trim some on the top, uh, whether you wait for a million, whether you hold forever, whether you want to just hold them as power, like do you. Like, I'm always just like, just do you, or whatever make your life better, right? If Bitcoin make, because Bitcoin at the end of the day, it's another instrument, it's another vehicle, right? And so use it to make your life better, right? Whether that's even with the hey, trim some off the top to go on a trip, right? And some people listen to this might be like, what are you talking about? Like, hold on, hot hodl, right? I'm like, dude, like again, everyone just do you. Like, I'm not, I'm not here to like tell you my way is the best way, Marcus is the best way. Just do you. So kind of pivoting a little bit. So Bitcoin's dipping, and it just seems like there's a lot of products right now out there in the regular financial world with Bitcoin dipping. It looks like people are just looking for different opportunities, different strategies. Uh, Michael Saylor is coming out with, right? Strategy, uh, SATA, stride, stretch. Uh, if you could just do me a favor, because I know there's a lot of people out there that are huge Bitcoiners and you know they love Michael Saylor. Uh how do how would you describe these vehicles on how they work? Uh, and if you can kind of just give us like a basic elementary uh breakdown on these, if you don't mind.

SPEAKER_01

No, that that that's fine. So, okay, so I it's funny because uh I did I'm such sometimes I feel like a boomer. Like I didn't know stretch was STRC. So I was like, I actually own some of that. When you when you're messaging me about stress, uh stretch, I was like, oh, there's like a name for it. I'm like, man, I know I was like, man, because I was like, what are you talking about? Then like I looked at them like, oh, I actually own some of that. Um I was like, oh, it's kind of funny. Um and so okay, so so it's funny because I brought these out because I was like, I was like gonna say, uh, you know, if if you really want to learn about finance, there's a pretty thick book, you know, a series seven top off. But like I was like, to me, I think if you wanted a 101 view, you know, uh, there's a little tab where it talks about preferred, but then there's also a series 66 you can look at, which is another boring book if you're willing to get licensed. But I do want to just show this page because I think this is important for people to understand because everyone's so scared of like sailor failing. And I'll try to get it up there. Can you see that? The one, two, three, four. Yes, yes, secured debt, unsecured debt, preferred common. So what makes a preferred special? It in a in a liquidation scenario, it's gonna be compensated before your commons. What's a common micro MSTR? That's the common share. It's the bottom one. They're the last to get paid if things go bad. So secured debt's gonna get paid, unsecured debt, and then preferred. So that's what makes it special. Why is it called the dividend payment? Because it's not a bond. Bond would be interest. So they call it this just the name they call it.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

I actually wrote this down, so don't judge my left-handed writing, but I was like, I'll write this down. So STRF. So they're all stacked that way. You need to probably read the prospectus to confirm some of this stuff, but STRF is safe, meaning it's higher on the hierarchy. It's the highest. Uh, so it's like secured, unsecured, strf is considered the safest one. So meaning if it if it all goes down badly, you're considered to get compensated for it. It does pay a dividend. Uh STRC so has a variable dividend, which means that the dividend can readjust as the price goes down. They're trying to keep it towards par. Par is 100. Okay. Um STRK is real quick, real quick, where where's it at right now?

SPEAKER_03

I know they're trying to keep it at par, so where's it at right now?

SPEAKER_01

Oh man, uh, I want to say like it's between okay, I'm totally guessing right now. I didn't look it up this morning. No worries. It's in like a random account I don't check often, but it's like, I want to say it was like like 70 to 80 range. It's kind of low. So that just means that whatever the you know, whatever the uh the uh the divvy was, they're just gonna adjust it to try to like pull it back to bring buyers in to move the price up to then bring it back down to the original price. So it kind of has a it's a variable, it floats kind of okay. Um STRK is a has a uh I put convert. Yep. So it has the ability to convert to shares. I think it's double check the prospectus, but I think it's something like a thousand if micro strategy goes to a thousand, you can convert it to like one is like 0.1 shares, so you need like 10 per share. So you have the ability to turn it into a micro strategy share, which I kind of personally tinfoil hat, I don't think he really wants it to go to a thousand because then that could create more shares. Yeah, yes. I think he wants those shares simply for just buying Bitcoin, not for that to happen, but it still pays a Divi. And then STRD, that's the lowest on the list, and it's so it pays a higher dividend because you're taking on more risk from the stack. Um and then SATA like SATA, I uh they pay a day daily Divi, which is crazy.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I I think we when you messaged me and I just laughed because it just sounded like it just sounded like old school like nonsense. And I know I'm probably gonna get tomato, you know, vegetables thrown at me, you know, uh, you know, but um a daily dividend, I guess that's super cool because it would ridiculously compound. I mean that that that's interesting. Um it does have like a tax advantage uh called return on capital. So like obviously, you know, do your own taxes, but basically it's like if I bought a hundred of it, uh, and then they pay me ten dollars, now my average is 90. I don't technically get taxed on that 10. So it's a little bit different of a tax structure rather than being like considered ordinary income and being taxed that way. So that's kind of cool about I thought that was cool. Um, because you could take that 10. I mean, these are small numbers, but you could take that 10 and invest it somewhere else and just leave that in there. You're not gonna go negative, but you never really got to worry about being taxed on the hundred if you're taking the money and putting it here and putting it there.

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

So there are all these other options, right? There are these are the things that are good about those choices.

SPEAKER_03

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Do you need to buy them? Man, that's kind of to you. I mean, it's kind of funny. Like, there was never a moment in my youth where I was like, you know what, I really need a preferred share strategy. You know, I just never really thought about it that way. I need to make yield. I think people are just really trying to find something in the bear market. Instead of just accepting, you know, that this is just a tough time, uh, as far as price appreciation and looking at buying your growth capital, right? Preferred shares, um, those kind of investments, in my opinion, you can buy. And I know not everybody's gonna like that. And there are some really smart guys out there that I follow that know way too much about it. Like you almost get lost in the knowledge of it. Um, but man, you're just like, it's almost like don't overcomplicate this. Bitcoin's down 50%. You might get a little bit more, you can wait totally fine. You could be buying a ton of this here. I do think MicroStrategy is an attractive play. I just don't know. Uh I'm hearing a lot of people talk that $1,000 target, and I'm like, you gotta be okay. Okay, look, if you bought it for $90 and then sold at $180, dude, that's like a hundred percent win. You know, we're kind of getting lost here on like, yeah, that's a great win. That's a good return for you. You could ride it to like three, four hundred, well done. Um, but if you want that much exposure to Bitcoin, then just buy Bitcoin.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01

You know what I mean? Like, um, so that's kind of how I look at those. Like, those are like 101 level. So I own the Divi that adjusts, yeah. But I own it for a randomly different reason. As you said earlier, personal finance, what's your risk profile? Exactly. And I joked about that. My dog, I was like, I bought the I'm gonna buy this at 90, and my it's a photo of my dog looking at me silly. I'm like, his risk profile's changed over the years. I bought it basically because I sold something that I gotta pay tax on, and so I bought that to make money while I while I wait 12 months and go into a different tax and go into a long term, and if it's down, what do I care? I I made money, yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I don't even care. Like, all right, fine, I'll sell for a loss, I could buy it. I'll just you know, so it's like everybody's got a different kind of strategy out there, so I guess it just depends.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, and it's so interesting that uh thank uh dude. Thanks again for breaking that down. Yeah, I really appreciate that. Um I it's so funny because it's like it goes back to like the simplicity of easy peasy with Bitcoin. It's like, dude, it it dips, and you're like, okay, well, right now is a perfect time to stack more, right? Let me just go add to my stack. And you know, again, this is a long-term play. If you know, if you're listening to this, Bitcoin is a long-term play. This is not a get rich quick thing, right? Here, and so the fact that you can just stack and go live your life, it's really it really breaks down how easy it is. And then there's all these other vehicles. Again, I understand why people would like uh want to just participate in this. Inflation is high, uh living is not affordable right now, it's very hard, you know, especially in certain places in America right now. And so I understand you trying to make moves and like go like go do you, right? But it's wild, it really feels like Bitcoin dip, and then all of these products like almost as like it's just a new headliner. Oh, and then to add on to this, uh Michael Taylor recently sold 32 Bitcoin, and again, this is so wild to me, Marcus. Everyone's freaking out. This guy said never sell. I'm like, dude, you have to just understand the asset that you're playing, and like again, it goes back to personal finance, just stick to your plan, right? Like, who cares if Michael Saylor sells? Who cares if Marcus sells? Who cares if Bent sells? Who cares if all these people sell, right? Who is the president starts a Bitcoin reserve or not? Like, what are we talking about? Who cares? In our in our family, we have a we have a saying, it's called MYOB. So you just mind your own business. That's what it is. We mind our own business, we do hard things and we mind our own business. And so when someone sells like that, it's like, man, everyone's freaking out. So just to bring it back to Michael Saylor real quick, what are your thoughts? Like, like, is he is he good for this space? Is he bad for this space? Um, you know, I I uh personally, we uh like Michael Saylor, I love what he's done with it. Um, but I'm I'm I'm also not like, oh my god, like I can't, I'm not watching every one of his moves, I'm not watching every one of his buys, I'm not watching every one of his sales, and I'm not and then I'm not participating in every one of his uh vehicles, right? What you think Michael Saylor is good for this space, bad for this space? What talk to me on this, man?

SPEAKER_01

So when he sold 32, I was like, yeah, sell them because I have a low price target. You know, I'm like, yeah, he's a bad guy, man. You should sell MicroStrategy, man. Don't invest in that. Because I'm just kind of wanted to just dump to my price target, you know. I'm like, good. I'm like, go contradict yourself again, you know, because people have like goldfish memories, right? It's like, yeah, within three months, he's gonna be this stock could be at 190, and everyone's like, Man, Michael Saylor's just so smart. You know what I mean? It's like seeing everybody I forgot. We kind of got we're kind of getting there to a bottom though, because I had somebody be like, Man, it's gonna go lower than your price target. I'm like, oh, really? Like originally my price target was unbelievably bad, you know, and now it's going less than that. I'm like, oh, those are kind of bottom comments. Um do I think Sailor is good or bad is kind of irrelevant because Bitcoin is open to all to priests and prostitutes, you know, so anybody can use it.

SPEAKER_02

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01

Um, I kind of don't like the financialization of it a little bit because I think it kind of pulls people away of what the point is. And I always kind of, you know, living through COVID, you know, having something like lightning shock your life, like when COVID happened, like the two, two-week lockdown, all this crazy stuff happened. I I noticed things at the store where if I go to a self-scan, it'll say, This one only takes credit, can't use cash. And I think it's like engineering us to get used to like a cashless society, you know, it could just be the Bitcoin or in me. And I think people kind of get away from why you buy Bitcoin in the first place is to have the freedom to transact, not necessarily to make all this money, right? Like that's kind of like a benefit of the fact that you have the freedom to transact. So, you know what I mean? And so, yeah, I think I think it's probably not the best bet to vet against a guy who's got what like 800,000 Bitcoin, regardless of what the price is doing now. And a lot of the slam now is tech, you know. Really what it is is rates the Fed comes out behaving somewhat hawkish. I like wrote a post about this, behaving somewhat hawkish, and so there's the threat of raising rates because other central banks have raised rates, a bunch of blah blah blah stuff. But what they they don't want that, so they're slamming tech. Tech gets slammed, you know, that's where everybody's money's at. And so everyone's like, hey, wait a minute, you know, maybe things aren't as good, you know. And so they slam all these assets that everybody's in to try to like influence the Fed is the vibe I get. I think I think people need to have like a better time frame. They need they need to apply. Don't look at the price every day, you know. Kind of look at least give your I mean, try like look at 60 days out. Like, okay, it's like where are we gonna be at the end of the summer?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Like today we get slammed, we snap back over 60, which is like, dang, because I want my price targeted. I'm like, man, this 60k is just like someone buying here. Is this just like nonsensical weakness here? Is this algo buying? Like, what's going on? Like, how is it not getting slammed below 59? And uh, and I just sound so opposite of a Bitcoin, like, but I want to buy cheaper, you know what I mean? I'm sorry, I've been this longer than you. Yeah, that's like my attitude. Like, I I'm not scared of a lower price. Somebody said that, like, would you be freaking out if it was 40? I'm like, this thing could go to like 20k, and I wouldn't care. I would just be like, oh my gosh, man, here's your opportunity to like you know, get a generational amount, you know. And so um, but yeah, I think Sailor just is a part of it. I think we need to be careful saying gospels, having a uh, you know, a Christ-like figure, right? Yeah, because he went through a period where people were making all these videos, and again, he has some great lines, you know what I mean? Like he has some really good analogies, he was really fun to listen to, appears to be pretty much a smart guy. I mean, he's pretty successful. Um, and then like people like assign the faith to their you know Christ-like figure, and they're like, you're not fulfilling it, you know. I mean, and like you changed your you vote in you know, Sailor 1232 here that you would never sell, you know what I mean. It's like people, it's like, dude, he's human, okay? He's human, and what's your plan? Did you make were you able to you know jump on the ski lift of wealth making with him a little bit? I mean, his stock went to a thousand split and then ran again to like 500. There was a ton of money to be made with him. Yeah. Um, yeah, you know, but as far as good or bad, I think it's kind of irrelevant because anybody can use Bitcoin, you just have to be okay with that, you know, like exactly and that's the thing, people are people, right?

SPEAKER_00

So, like we've been in a society of following the government or following the way this this money system has worked. So when you're not fully knowledgeable about the money system, then you are gonna look to things because we've been great, we've been trained to look for people or things, or you know, to be we go to our school, our teacher, we make sure that we're following whatever they say. We go to our coaches, we follow whatever they say, we go to our job, we have a boss, we follow whatever they say. So it's just these like we've as a human race, I feel like that's how we've been trained to go and for so long. And so 100%.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

When people are entering into Bitcoin, right? They're like, Well, I need to find someone that knows, which is a good thing. You do want to surround yourself with people who are, you know, like-minded and stuff, but then you're you're definitely like trying to figure out, okay, who should I listen to? Right. And so that discernment comes from your own personal knowledge and your own personal growth, I think, from reading books or you know, just getting a wide range of influence rather than just one person, like you were mentioning. So I always think about that.

SPEAKER_01

Um well, you go to your bank, they don't. I worked at the bank, they don't, they can't a teller doesn't know the three functions of money. Yeah, like they don't know the answer to that. Your bankers don't know that. That was my attitude in like private banking was like, I'm your favorite banker's favorite banker. Who's your banker? Oh, you don't even have a name. Well, now hello, nice to meet you. You know what I mean? And like that was kind of my attitude. And like, there's not your money is like I've seen an old post, it was like a 60 minutes post from like 09. And he was like, I'd like to go into the bank and just see my money. And I thought about that and I was like, what are they gonna do? Turn the screen? No, yeah, are they actually gonna show me the cash? They don't have it. Okay, they don't, they barely have five percent. Yeah, like barely. Yeah, I think the max they can put in an ATM is like 400,000, maybe. Yeah, yeah. But it they don't keep your money, ain't there? Okay, yeah, it's the worst way for a bank to keep money is cash because they could just invest it, they could buy treasury bonds and make money off of it rather than do that. So the point is it ain't even there, and so people don't even understand money, they're just told this is how it works. Like no one ever actually asks, like, why is a great one? Is like what if I reach in my pocket and I have brand new Chris Bills and one's a dollar and one's a hundred, how do I tell the difference to pull it out? They're both this, they both feel the same. Is it just because the picture on it? Yeah, basically, that's basically it. If you can spend it, because you know you go to a cell scan, they'll say, we don't take cash here, right? And just make it more difficult for you. And I think that's an event. I oddly have a feeling like that's an event that could come, and people are gonna wish they had Bitcoin, right? They're gonna wish they had a way to transact it. Um, but uh like we're in peacetime now. You don't know when wartime's coming. Like a car accident. I uh uh over the weekend I'm coming back from an amusement park. I got all these kids with me. We're in a construction area. This car in front of me slams on the brakes, and the two cars hit each other and go off, and I just you know veer off to the side to get out of the way and freak out. And somehow I end up on the other side of the construction and I get back on and I'm driving. I'm like, okay, and the kids are like, Oh my gosh, that was like Grand Theft Auto, that was better than the amusement park. They're like, like, oh, they're like, you know, 11-year-olds like, that was so crazy how you did that. And uh, I told them I'm like, an accident will be like that. You're not gonna see the car coming and going, all right, I'm gonna hit them, I'm gonna hit them. You know, it's just like, oh my gosh. And that's kind of like an event that'll happen. Like you can prepare as much as you want, but preparing is just owning Bitcoin. That's not hard, you know. Like, just buy Bitcoin. If you're gonna and you think you don't have a lot, you actually do. You know what I mean? You actually have way more than you think. You know, do you even if it went to like $10 million? It's like, all right, you got like it's like, man, I don't got six Bitcoin. It's like $60 million. Like you could literally just live off 10 million, you know what I mean, for lifetimes. Yeah, you know, like how much money do you need? Technically, with like four million, I think you could draw an interest 100 grand a year. You know, so how complicated do you want it? Like, how much Bitcoin do you think you need? And we always joke, like, what if it was a dollar of Satoshi? You know, it's like, holy smokes, you know what I mean? That's so insane. You know, like you could if it was a dollar of Satoshi, right? And I can just, I don't know what a hundred thousand satoshis right now. What is it like 50 bucks? You know what I mean, or something like that? 50, 60 bucks. It's crazy to think about that.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it is, it is crazy. And then to add on to you, uh, Dan, it's so funny. Um, yeah, definitely do like your own research, right? We have to think for ourselves, and thinking is like hard for people, right? No one thinks these days, bro. It's so funny. Um uh and then all on on to what you just shared too, Marcus. It's so funny. You go into a bank, right? And you ask them, hey, what's a factual reserve banking? What? Like, and that's like that is like your foundation, that is their like base layer, that is like their where they're at, right? And they don't learn that. They learn that.

SPEAKER_01

There's a training, they can do that on that. They're just asleep at the wheel. Like, we just don't care. Yeah, what Daniel said about like, you know, just these people you listen to. I mean, I've noticed that they kind of like have a rise and a fall in Bitcoin, like these people become really great and they kind of just fall off. Um try to source a community. There is a community online, but then there's also like real life, and real life is way more brutal. Real life ends up being like people will oh, all those people who are spectacle are calling you uh when it's down, you know. They don't reach out when it's up, they don't want to like you know pat you on the back. Um, but if you can source, it's funny. If you could source like two to three real life people that are as passionate about Bitcoin as you, you're living pretty good because most people, it's just they don't want to, they like you said, they don't want to think about it, they don't want to like dial in. They honestly, I joke with my youngest where I'm like, you really think we need to explain like all these conspiracies to some of your friends that are like blissfully happy at like 11 years old? Like, just let them be happy. Like, maybe they don't need to know about fractional reserve banking. However, if you work in a bank, you should probably know about fractional reserve banking. It's like if you're processing food and you're like, I don't know where this comes from, like that's kind of a problem. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe you should know that. Um, but yes, I I think people just need to um keep it simple, like we said. It's actually quite simple. You could just buy Bitcoin at a very discounted cheap price right now and just stop paying attention. Don't a lot of this stuff you'll completely forget about.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And uh and overall to end that kind of topic too, where it comes to like, you know, all those other things Michael said, all those other strategies. Do you think this is all good? You think these ETFs, do you think all of this uh because it does kind of like um take away from like just buying Bitcoin and chilling, right? And keeping your life simple. Do you think all of this is good for Bitcoin or bad for Bitcoin?

SPEAKER_01

So there was like a famous quote when they first came out with futures in like 17 and 18, where it was like we will tame Bitcoin. Google it, I can't remember who said it. But you can literally just be like, we will tame Bitcoin, Bitcoin futures. There should be a quote that comes up. And they did. It went from like 20,000 to like 3,000. Like, dang, they weren't lying. Weirdly, they did the same thing to gold. Yeah, the same thing to gold and slammed it. And there's all these other, you know, ways to invest. There's bit ETFs for gold, you know. So you have to ask yourself, is it better to buy an electronic vehicle that represents the asset or the asset itself? There's that's debatable, right? Like people would debate you and be like, yeah, you gotta go to a coin shop, you know, buy buy you know a little bit more in spot or whatever. Um but again, if something bad happens, you know, and you're an apocalyptic event, you know. Allegedly, I've heard that like 75 ounces of silver would buy a home if like currency completely collapsed. So I was always like, hmm, maybe I should get 75 ounces of silver. I was like, that's an interesting number to think about. Um but do I I don't know. It's one of those things where I think it's difficult to say good or bad because everybody can participate. I just do think it pulls it pulls people in and out at the same time. So you're pulling an investment group in, right? So you got wealthy people who don't care. You know, I know there's this adage of like, you don't really need a financial advisor. Okay, rich people just want someone to deal with it, right? They just want someone to like work through like, you know, my taxes and I like him. He hunts, we both hunt duck. That's it. Yeah, that's how they pick their guy. Like, wealthy people have totally different problems. Um yeah, and they're like, they might say, Hey, look, you know, the the the the wealthy, I had him come up to me. Like I was the Bitcoin banker guy before we broke 20k. All right, before we broke back through in 2020. So everybody laughed, right? I was like the butt of uh uh butt of all jokes. And uh well, we'd have wealthy people come in and and be like, hey, do you got a second? And I'm like, yeah. They're like, Hey, so like what is it? Like, how do I buy it? And I'm like, I really can't be telling you this at the bank, you know what I mean? Because it's like it's I'm not trying to give you advice, you know, like you're kind of always scared about giving advice, but I'm like, there's websites you there's companies you go to, you know. When wealthy people don't want to be like, well, what's the best one? It's like go to Coinbase. I don't care, you know what I mean? It's like just go to that one, whatever. I know everybody hates them, but just go to Coinbase. Yeah, um and so they're introduced to it. So that's what I'm saying. So you're pulling this group in, but then you got, like I said earlier, you got this new younger group that's like, oh, there's all these other things I can buy other than the real thing, you know? Yeah, so you're kind of like not, they're kind of taking a new route for like education instead of learning about why Bitcoin would be important to you. It's like, can I make more money?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And so it's hard to say good or bad, right? I think it's just like I think Bitcoin's bigger than me. And I kind of had that conclusion over the years that's just bigger than you, you know, like it's it's gonna do what it wants. A joke we'd say Bitcoin doesn't care. That's what they'd always say. Like, Bitcoin doesn't care about support and resistance, it'll just slam through support and go down, or it'll just go up. It doesn't care, it doesn't care what anybody's doing, just kind of does what it wants. And I kind of like that about it. I kind of like that. I kind of like that it's bigger than the government, you know. Yeah, I like that it's actually it's actually bigger than Michael Saylor, it's bigger than the ETF, it's bigger than the US dollar, and they can't kill it. It's kind of like the movie uh you ever seen um the day the earth stood still, it's like a Keanu Reeves movie, and it's like he comes. I don't know if you ever seen no kind of movie guy, but he comes to Earth and it's like this robot, and like nothing can destroy it, and then it ends up like turning into like these, like like a cloud, and it just eats up everything. And every time they shoot something at it, it gets stronger. And I always kind of feel that way about Bitcoin. It's like yes, it's the most secure thing ever in human history from like an online perspective. You think like your bank's DDoSed a lot? Can you imagine the attacks on Bitcoin and nothing stops it? Like it is just uns, it actually just gets stronger over time, and so yeah, go ahead and buy the ETF. But if an event happens, you're probably gonna wish you just would have bought the Bitcoin. Yeah, you can't log into your bank and look at your ETF. You know, it's kind of one of those things. But if you're just ball and you're just rich and you can just buy that too, then fine. But yeah, good or bad, that's debatable. You know, I can go on all day about that one.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, the wealthy have different problems for sure.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, you have uh yeah, you know, they'll say stuff like, you know, I'll never forget because I come from humble beginnings personally, and uh, you know, they'll be like, Oh, you know, it is, you know, with your horses. It's like, of course. You know, like I have no idea. Like, actually, like, you're just it it's kind of a thing where it's like they're just on a different level, and that's okay. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02

Like exactly. I'm not gonna be able to do it.

SPEAKER_01

You're just gonna be chasing, like, if you make and you're and it would happen. It's like, all right, you got five million. Well, the next guy's got 15, and then there's actually the next guy who's got 50, and then there's another guy who's got two fifty. It's just like crazy, you know. And if you're not happy, like you gotta find happiness, and I I'm I I always you'll see me saying, like, family is wealth, you know, like that's your wealth. You know, you got 10 million dollars, but had to get put in a home. I'd rather have nothing and my kids take care of me, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, yeah, but but they do have different problems and they'll say stuff that's interesting. Um, and some of their strategies are cool, yeah. But again, it goes back to the beginning. What's what's your personal risk tolerance, your risk profile? What's your personal strategy? Feel free to you know explore some of these um preferred. But a great quote I heard years ago, uh, can't remember her name, but she said have an exit at entry on any. thing you do. And I always was like, that's actually smart because what ends up happening is if you don't, yeah, what do you do when what do you do when you own Sandisc? You know what I mean? Like yeah. Just like, yeah, I just own Sandisc. And now it's like 200 a share. It's been a nothing stop. And now it's 2200 a share. And you had no strategy. You're just like, I don't know, I guess I'll just keep holding it until what? Like what if something collapses it? You know, and like you're like, oh I you know, so just like that should then and that goes back to me saying not sell the top but like have an exit have an idea of what you want to do. You got multiple kids, you know I agree.

SPEAKER_03

I agree so much. And that is something that's not talked about enough in the Bitcoin space because everyone's like okay well hot hold on for dear life right hold on forever. I'm holding I'm not selling you know you hear all these all the time uh I'm DCAing. Like you said well then what's your extra like may uh you know I heard some different ones too um from our podcast like maybe DCing me out right when you're when like that's a you know again uh so I did that I could tell you that did what I did.

SPEAKER_01

So yeah over the years I went like this and was like man F that you know I was so mad I was like man I could have like took some some some lot too. And so I was like all right every dollar I ever put in I'm gonna sell over 100K and I'm gonna do it in lots. You know what I mean? And so it was 10% of the whole position. So I was like who cares? You know what I mean? I was like and I just get to keep the money. And it wasn't like I just sat on it. It was like all right well oh we got you know private school you know there's a national program there's probably stuff I'll just take care of that I'll just take care of that I'll just take care of that and I was like cool that this enhanced my life and I'm still in Bitcoin and it's like my cost average is you know what I mean like I don't have I don't have to worry about the price I bought back my piece of mind. Yeah you know people are stressing because they got money in it. It's like well take your bread back. Yeah you know and then just be happy with your strategy. And that was something I was like I'm doing that man because like man went last cycle when it went to 64 and then back to 30 it was everybody was so sure we're going to 100K and we didn't you know what I mean like it just went down to like 15k like holy smokes man we ain't gonna live forever. So even if let's just say you sold there you're like I'm out I'll take 60 grand man you could have bought back dang near four yeah at 15k you know it's like you still need a dollar cost average now you just need it's like it's like uh you just need discipline you know what I mean and that's kind of what age and the war of Bitcoin will do to you because over time it beats you up. These cycles are tough. You know that's just me being straight up with the new group out there first couple cycles it's hard. You know it's yeah it's so much fun going up you know and it's just like yes you know you know there's like I'm uh as thinking of like an analogy of like I'm right I'm always right I'm wrong I'm always wrong you know what I mean and you kind of go through this like staircase of it and it's so much fun everybody's making money you can't lose and that's how I think people should kind of look go back to the preferred conversation so really want to buy these in the bear market they're all coming off par they're kind of getting slammed down I mean maybe you know don't you just want to buy those when we're just going up you know what I mean and just then you could just you could be dollar cost averaging into that and making interest you know what I mean and just kind of you could just be doing that all the way up you know and I think people are trying to like really like overthink the strategy.

SPEAKER_03

It's yeah even age even age plays a huge factor. You're young you're in your 20s and you're like DCAing right and you're like well again you probably don't even need to sell then right you're probably like oh let me for the next 10 years let me just DCA into this and then uh maybe skin some off the top I'm gonna you know who knows maybe you're older right and you just saw your wealth just get cut in half right if you have a ton in Bitcoin. Yeah you know so everybody is it's different right and you have kids right you have a family you know uh you're maybe you have to skin some off the top maybe pay for private school so it's very unique right it it's so like and it feels like everybody's so like one dimensional sometimes where it's just like and it also can be like can turn people off that are coming into the space where they're just like dude you're telling me all I could do is like I'm gonna make make a lot of money but all I'm gonna do is just hold right um you know like I don't want to do this like I I need the money right uh inflation is uh not two percent or four percent inflation is 10% that they're not talking about right uh you know so everybody's it's different again our situation is different you know we want to hold on for a long time you know I love it and um you know I really enjoy these prices I know where Bitcoin's going we've understand it we've done the work we get to talk to people like you it get these different perspectives um bitcoin is just I don't know I just I I I love Bitcoin I I think that's like like everybody goes through that the first six months to get into Bitcoin you know yeah because I remember telling like all my friends like yo and like in like literally March of 17.

SPEAKER_01

So we're like 1300 I'm like you guys gotta and everybody just thought I was crazy. They're like dude this dude's out of his mind you know what I mean and I'm like I'm telling you like I'm telling you and I had people come back in like 23 like okay I'm gonna buy it you know what I mean and that's when I calmed down so I'm like no you think no you think everybody wants to hear it right you're like man this is such a easy and nobody wants to hear it. And then uh and then you get quiet and then the real ones come back the real ones that can admit like dang I didn't listen man you were right I'm in. Yeah you know so that's always like a really reassuring feeling like all right man you know um it's gonna be a rough ride. You know what I mean? Like it's not gonna just be straight up. Yeah. Dude I'm the same way about Bitcoin. Like I would never I always be like I'll sell some but I was like I ain't ever just gonna like liquidate everything. You know what I mean? Like I would never do that.

SPEAKER_03

Like I I you know to the end all cold storage you know what I mean like very little on exchanges uh if any you know yeah even though I kind of started to be like is it really that big of a deal like are are have we matured this is just me talking here but like have we kind of matured beyond like a an exchange just stealing all your stuff like these are publicly traded companies like if Coinbase just stole all your Bitcoin like just shut down like I'm not talking about oh I can't log into my account I'm talking about like what these things were doing in like pre-2020 where it's like bye we got hacked and we would always say by yourself you did it I mean I know everybody's like take your take your stuff off exchanges don't mess around and I I am in cold storage but sometimes I'm kind of like have we have we grown up have have we become like an adult asset you know yeah for me it's not even like oh um are we grown up yet it's more like I just don't trust I just don't like these people at all and we're we're you know it's when it when it's like Coinbase and all these other people it doesn't matter the exchange for me personally it's just I just it's more of like a trust issue right like and it goes back to again Bitcoin like like don't trust verify right and I don't trust these people I don't care how many like how backed up they are by the government how much they're solidified how much they have a presence they're marketing you know they're you know you see all of them like on basketball courts Coinbase you know arenas and stuff like that crypto arena like I do not care I do not trust you I do not like you like you are the same people that take my taxes like you know like and I'm going again I'm going beyond no no I I like it I like it I like it I do not this is not a like you know uh are we grown up type of deal it's more of like I just do not like you I do not trust you I I like this my family's uh you know I take my wealth very seriously right and when I say that well like people need to think like that I think people don't think about their wealth right because when when you you have 0.5 Bitcoin you have one Bitcoin you have multiple Bitcoin you have 0.1 like in the grand scheme of things I do believe that's a lot you just don't understand like you said you it's more than whatever you think it is.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah and when it comes to that I'm just like hey this has to this I take my wealth seriously I'm gonna put it in cold storage right um zero trust zero right trust presidents governments countries like I do not care about any of you guys like no that's super funny because I think the the true tr the true stress test of that would be as if like a hundred thousand people try to withdraw their Bitcoin you know it's just like a bank like a bank run like do you have the Bitcoin could you pay everybody you know like that that that would be the real stress test of that um but you know again the good and bad the pull and push of new people man trying dude trying to explain cold storage to some people like it's almost it's it's just like again like Bitcoin's bigger than me and I feel like to onboard you you be to keep onboarding people to Bitcoin like some people are okay with it like for example with Fidelity is like yeah you know Fidelity or like even Chase Bank you know you can have an investment account with them through JP Morgan. It's like okay well can I just can you guys just hold my Bitcoin I could totally see people a sector of people being like yeah whatever you know especially rich people if you got like 10 million dollars you're like yeah I got like three Bitcoin can you guys just like custodian that for me and they're gonna be like absolutely you know and so I just think there is an evolution there.

SPEAKER_03

However if you can't log into your account you know what I mean that's where the gold spirit comes in a major event you know like you said major event has you know happened and uh and again going back to that right like let's just say Bitcoin doesn't even exist. Why is there a 1% right? Why you know Bitcoin can be that new where people are going to be like like you uh like people get in the space and they're and you're just talking to somebody who's new to the space and you're like yeah man you got to like uh self-custody your Bitcoin and I'm like what well I feel like you got to kind of navigate people right because they'll say they'll say stuff to you you're like okay they'll be like so what do you think of XRP?

SPEAKER_01

You know I'll get questions I always get that and I'm like I don't think anything of it you know what I mean and like I've had convoys where like well it transfers real fast I'm like so does my credit card you know I guess I can just use my credit card why would I buy XRP you know and uh there's just like levels to it. But it's like it's a commitment. It it's actually not hard to to stop Russie but it's intimidating a little bit for people where they're like all right so I gotta like you know write these words down and you're like do I ever take a picture of it like okay you know what I mean and like you know it's just intense like so I've I was kind of scared into it. Yeah where I was like these exchanges you can't log in now like transfer that off immediately you know what I mean get it on cold storage and so like I come from that world I guess what I was saying was more like we almost kind of want people to because you kind of start on an exchange right so it's kind of like you kind of want people to go there and it's like I always tell people it's not buying your Bitcoin it's transferring it the first time because I for me it was because I was like dang I can just send it like that. You know what I mean? If you buy it it's like whatever it's like buying anything in the world like any kind of any kind but when you transfer it you can kind of follow it you could search it on you could follow where it's going when it gets into the block and stuff it's like dang nobody could stop me. That's interesting. You know and so that's when you start to be like wow this is a tool not just like something I just you know can just sell it back for a a dollar amount it's like oh I could just transfer it you know yeah because everyone's scared we always joke about sending like from a large amount sometimes you know and like I always think the OGs are just man it's it's like impressive these guys can just be like thousand Bitcoin one slam don't do a test one I'm like dude no way scared to send five million to Toshi you know like it's like all right let me just let me you know because in the beginning you didn't care you're like first four last four is like an old joke like eh it's close you know but the dude today I'm like looking at it going RJ capital M. You know what I mean? Like just trying and so I think that's kind of challenging too I can't wait and maybe I'm just old and haven't seen some new version but I feel like it should just be kind of a little bit easier with like an email address or something. Yeah but we'll get there. We'll get there. Yeah I again we'll we're getting there we'll grow but I am the I am the same I'm like RJ M2514 instantly I'm on uh there's like there's the uh oh it's a website you can follow I can't remember but I always look at it all the time but I'll just go on there and I'll just keep searching the address you know what I mean until it shows up and I got an old old Bitcoin friend from like 15 you know 2015 he's like dude it's straight you're totally he's always like it's straight dude I'm like it doesn't have any confirmations in it he's like it's straight like relax I'm like no no no no no I'm just sit here and now I'm gonna be late for my appointment because I got to see a confirmation. You know what I mean? Like you know what I mean and so uh so funny that's so funny. To wrap things up though Marcus uh one of the last questions we always like to ask people is uh anybody that's entering the Bitcoin space they're listening to this podcast for the first time they're like man I want to learn and I want to get into Bitcoin uh what's some advice uh that you would recommend for someone just entering into the Bitcoin space overall question um be careful who you listen to you know um Bitcoin is for everybody so that means it's you you can participate um start simple you know learn how to buy it learn how to transfer it um and avoid off ramps into the next best thing it is the best thing um we had an altcoin world for a long time which yeah there was a time when you know there was like this idea that maybe they'd make a cooler thing if it never happened we were all we were right then there was mean coins which were just basically like gambling fireworks um and now we kind of have a treasury company thing you know but stay the course you know if you want to participate you can and any amount is a good amount yes such good amount that was good yeah that was really good thank you awesome yeah and where can people connect with you Marcus I'm on X follow me on X Marcus7 observant uh 2131 uh I'm usually talking smack on there here and there if you like what the content I say want to get into a you know you could you could DM me you know that's how I thought people DM me all the time and I'm gonna I'm a real person I'm not a just I mean it's an avatar picture I I made with AI back in the day but like I will talk you know I I I actually like engaging with people getting newer ideas so yeah next that's the world we're in right yeah awesome well thank you so much Marcus for your time and spending time with us and our audience and thank you everyone for tuning in to To the Moon with the Lunas and we'll see you guys on the moon.

SPEAKER_02

Later