10 Keys to Thrive
10 Keys to Thrive is your go-to podcast for building real traction in your business and unlocking your full potential. Hosted by global business strategist Jim Krigbaum, each episode delivers practical insights drawn from his work across 82 countries and thousands of entrepreneurs.
You’ll learn how to find the right YOU, the right product, the right market, and the right strategy—plus Jim’s signature CHARM DANCE framework to help you communicate better, think clearer, and execute with confidence.
If you’re ready to stop guessing and start growing, this podcast gives you the clarity, tools, and direction to thrive.
10 Keys to Thrive
Inside the Mind of a Recruiter: What Actually Gets You Hired
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Landing the right job today is harder than ever — AI filters resumes, recruiters see thousands of applicants, and standing out feels impossible.
In this episode of 10 Keys to Thrive, international business strategist Jim Krigbaum sits down with talent acquisition leader Chaz Bantle (Bulletproof Coffee) to reveal what recruiters actually look for when hiring.
They break down how to get your resume past AI screening tools, position yourself for interviews, use LinkedIn strategically, and tap into hidden job networks that most candidates never access.
If you want to get noticed, get interviews, and move your career forward, this episode gives you the real-world strategies recruiters see work every day.
How do you communicate what you've done in the past?
SPEAKER_00Are you sick and tired of spinning wheels, wasting time and money in your business, but getting nowhere fast? With the Ten Keys to Thrive podcast. It's your masterclass in momentum by International Business Strategist and your host, Jim Craigbaum.
SPEAKER_02Well, I'd like to thank you all for joining us today. I have uh Chaz Bantel, who is a recruiter for Bulletproof Coffee Company, and he's also a major in the Army Reserve. And we've having him join us today so we can talk about what it is that recruiters look for and kind of how to position your CV and yourself in an interview, but also and how to get their attention and get it past the involvement that these days have with AI and other things that help kind of narrow down who makes it to Chaz and how do they get to that point and what they're looking for. So if you want to spend a little bit of time, Chaz, introduce yourself and kind of your role and what you do and how long you've been doing it and that type of stuff would be great.
SPEAKER_01Sure. Thanks for having me on, Jim. Yeah, so my name is Chaz Bantel. I'm currently the people and talent manager at Bulletproof 360, best known for Bulletproof Coffee. That's where I've been since 2017. Prior to that, spent some time in other industries recruiting, notably in IT with uh in the greater Seattle area, and then spent some time with a government contractor and kind of also on the commercial side with professional services. And yeah, I am a major logistics officer in the Washington Army National Guard. Although I should say that pretty much all of my talent acquisition recruiting experience is actually not pretty much all of it, is on the non-military side, so all commercial and private sector.
SPEAKER_02So you haven't demanded any recruiting boosts of trade shows or fairs or anything? No, no.
SPEAKER_01The closest I've gotten to military recruiting is you know, anyone that asks me a question, I get them in contact with a military recruiter. Those are those guys are the experts.
SPEAKER_02All right. So when somebody's looking for a job, like I say, they start out and they're finding themselves in either a career change or just kind of focusing on something different from where they were. And what are the most important things? Obviously, there's CV, but how do you address the CV so that you get the attention, particularly nowadays with all the AI scanners that can kind of narrow it down? I know some companies you send your CV and it takes several steps before a human being even looks at it. So how do you get past that and how do you maybe focus on where you should be?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's a big question. Uh nowadays AI is in most talent acquisition tools that are out there, to some degree or not. But ultimately, you know, when it comes down to your resume writing or your CV writing, you kind of want to optimize a bit for that first pass, that first look, usually will not be a human. You know, single posting can attract hundreds or thousands of applicants, especially just given the industry, or if it is a global search, or if it's a you know completely remote role or hybrid role or whatnot these days. So you kind of have to take a little bit of a systematic and a pragmatic approach to creating your CV. Really want to focus on role alignment uh with the job level, right? If you're a VP and you're applying to a manager role, um that's gonna that's almost the opposite of you know that AI is gonna not gonna match you up well like that. And you see that often with sometimes in smaller companies, you get some title inflation and you know, folks going to other company sizes. You know, yeah, that your title is a vice president, but is that a vice president of a$1 million organization you're applying to a vice president of a hundred million dollar organization? So um yeah, role alignment within function and level there. Always, of course, years of experience. You gotta you know create some scope um and scale of what you've done in the past. And I hate to say that, but it's still a lot of keywords tied to the job description. That's an easy thing to do. So kind of three areas to look for, at least initially.
SPEAKER_02What do you consider uh preloading or overloading of keywords? I mean, I've seen things where it's you know almost if you put a hashtag on it, it's hashtag, hashtag, hashtag on a keyword, and it looks like you've just stuffed it with anything possible so that you can find those things. Yeah, I know when you talk about uh LinkedIn or Instagram or something like that, it says, or even YouTube says you know, five hashtags or five keywords, no more than that. Otherwise, it looks like you're just trying to get more attention or attention beyond where you're at.
SPEAKER_01Is there a sweet spot there or yeah, it yeah, I think that comes down to the maybe the role and the level that someone's applying at, so that you're applying at. I think you know, when you're thinking about use of AI, um obviously, yeah, like much older AI systems would just you we could query someone's resume and say, you know, um, this person used this keyword a hundred times in the resume or something along those lines. Now AI is actually reading and understanding people's resumes. So um yeah, where it's used is that resume parsing and ranking. Um keywords are are still a great function there, but I think too what's where uh AI and keywords fail is what's not trusted in AI still. It's the culture fit, it's the leadership judgment, it's uh the final hiring decision, of course. Like you know, AI doesn't really play a fit in that. But um ultimately when it comes to keywords, import seems yes, but you don't want to overload um your resume or CV with just a bunch of keywords that don't actually explain what you've done or how you've done it in the past.
SPEAKER_02Should I have AI write my CV and then review it and uh get rid of some of the uh computer talk and put in human talk on that? Or uh can you tell that it's been done by AI and you throw those out, or do you feel that AI is actually uh kind of helping out?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so uh you can I like to use AI. My thought process around AI is kind of more of a starting point because at the end of the day, if if I'm using AI to write my C V, is that good or bad? It it's Yes, people can tell when you have used AI. You know, the signs is maybe overly polished but a very vague language throughout your resume. Um, maybe just generic statements, I've seen those. Um absolutely perfect formatting is another way. You know, I mean, hey, it's great if if you are gonna take the time and actually have a great format of resume, uh, but usually there's always one little thing that's often AI correct stuff for you generally. Um and then just the metrics themselves. So some people when they're looking at your CVs, you know, they're looking at uh qualitative and quantitative data points, um, metrics that feel theoretical, or uh maybe those were the goals, but what were the actual metrics? Um so it's not bad to use AI, but the best use of AI I think is definitely structure and clarity. Um yeah, I a lot of times I could type something out, it might be a page, and I can ask AI to summarize that in you know the most five impactful bullet points. Uh and that AI is going to provide a good structure and clarity. And then from there, I can add in my own personal personality into those bullet points as I see fit.
SPEAKER_02Um so to talk about bullet points, uh, what is a good length of a CV? I mean, if I wrote a CV with everything I'd done, and particularly I know a lot of the people in the development industry, they'll have a CV that could be you know 10 pages long, talking about the different roles they've had or different reports they've written, uh, how important uh is the length of the CV? I mean, again, I've written a book about myself and I could include that as a CV, but nobody's gonna read it. So, how do you get it down to something that somebody's gonna read? Uh, and when do you use bullet points uh versus going into details?
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, so I think uh length of CV is gonna be industry driven. Um yeah, you may, I think yeah, a lot of people in the development industry could, especially working 20 plus years, could talk about themselves in 10 pages and still have more to say or five pages. Um for me, I'm looking at the most relevant and desired projects, perhaps, you know, should definitely be on that first page or two. Most of the time, most resumes I see are two pages, um, you know, and that's just maybe the industry that I'm in. If you can't say it in two pages, um maybe you should reformat things. But so that's why I go back, it's it's industry standard. It's likewise with doctors who publish research papers and everything they want to talk about. Totally understand that different industries are going to command longer CVs, but it's also the content that's in those CVs. And for me, you know, maybe it's my personal opinion, but I like to see you know the most relevant on the first or second pages.
SPEAKER_02How do you narrow that down? I mean, uh, like I say, so and how do you kind of contrast that with LinkedIn? I know LinkedIn, when I first used LinkedIn, I used it as a kind of a Facebook or a uh a friend network. Uh, but I now with know that with LinkedIn, if I send my resume to somebody, that is probably the first place they go to look. Um and I noticed, you know, well, as I've been educated on the value of LinkedIn, I see that I can post papers that I've written there, I can have videos that I've done there. Do you as a recruiter look at those to get deeper into somebody?
SPEAKER_01Yes. So yeah, I mean, recruiters, talent acquisition professionals around the world use LinkedIn from and much deeper than just that front page. Um you know, of course, what perhaps someone like me is looking at is you know, experience beyond your resume. So what else are you doing that you may not say in those two plus pages or or don't want to say or don't have time to say in those pages? Of course, like career velocity and consistency, I think, is important. You know, the content you engage with or publish is also can be looked at. If someone has like, I guess, posted about different product launches, different results they've done, or if they've shared reports or case studies or projects that they've done in the past, it shows how they think. And generally that's a signal of a bit more seniority or confidence in their experience itself. So LinkedIn isn't just a resume or your online resume, it's really a what can be used as a working portfolio of your career. Um definitely something that should be taken advantage of too.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, I like I said, I'm really just kind of learning LinkedIn. I today, for the first time, subscribed to my business premium, um, which allows me to send things out. One of the things that I did, you know, back in the old days before all the social media was there, I'd do my research and I would identify a company that I wanted to work for. So say I wanted to work for Bulletproof, because I know I like your part, your market position, I like what you're trying to do, but there may not be a job listed. In fact, the first job I got, uh I chased the job, I knew where I wanted to be, and actually was at the groundbreaking of a new uh export elevator, and I was the only one that ended up in the office in Portland that was at that groundbreaking. But when I went there, I met with the chairman of the board because he's there to cut the ribbon. No jobs were available, but I pursued it. If in today's world, is that something that can happen if somebody says, hey, I know I should be working for bulletproof, I reach out and get in touch with you. Are you gonna respond to them or are you gonna go, I don't have time for that. I'm gonna wait until I have an opening, then I'll send it out there and post it up and see where it goes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's a good question because I've been in the past consistently always tried to reply to people that reach out to me on LinkedIn. I think um, you know, going back to what I said earlier, if we post a job where we may be having a thousand applicants in the first day alone, you know, it just you know 5%, 10% of those people reach out to me on LinkedIn, all of a sudden my inbox, that inbox, right? That's not my you know email. My um LinkedIn inbox is just flooded. So is it important? Is it still good to reach out to companies proactively? Yes, when done correctly, I think. I say that in a good example of you know, if it's a supply chain position that you're applying to in, let's say, uh manufacturing, but you've never stepped foot into a manufacturing facility before, um you can reach out, but you know, generally I don't know if people will respond, um, just given that you don't have that experience in manufacturing. Maybe you're you've only been on the planning side or whatnot. Um you know, likewise, if you find a role that you you can just check off every single requirement, say I've done that, this, and that, and you've demonstrated that on your resume, you reach out on LinkedIn, you're trying to set yourself apart from the thousand other people who've applied, someone like me takes a look at that and says, Oh, yes, you know, Jim has all the experience for this, let's get back to the gym, you know, immediately. Um, I just think it's on the type of person, you know, if you give back to everyone.
SPEAKER_02So one of the things that I've found is uh particularly when you look at a mid-career shift and you're looking for something to do in a different industry, um, and you put your CV together, I have a little bit of situations where the people that I'm being interviewed by don't really understand what I've seen and where I've been and everything else, so I'm overqualified for the role or I'm intimidating. Um, you know, that was one of the things my father ran into a lot of times is that he, you know, was being interviewed by CEOs, but he'd been a CEO, so people didn't want to hire him because he was going to threaten their position and stuff. Do you see that happening in today's world where you want to state your skill set, but you don't want to overstate it and kind of intimidate and overreach really what the job qualifications are?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I think hypothetically, I think you could see that. I don't see it too much in my position at bulletproof per se. We don't do a ton of hiring throughout the you know a calendar year. And when we do, I guess, pointed you know positions, you know, we're generally not hiring for that C level, that more executive leader, that you know, um, just because you have experience in marketing doesn't mean you can't oversee, say, a commercial team or a revenue team or something along those lines. So I think when you're trying to translate different titles or make that mid-career shift, it's trying to translate whatever title or role that you had before into the responsibility and scope that could ultimately benefit that company or that organization that you're applying to.
SPEAKER_02And one of the things in the development industry is that a lot of people have been project management in economic development or medical distribution or whatever it is, um, that doesn't have a direct translation into the private sector. So what I've tried to encourage people is instead of using terminology that we'd use in in USAID or the development industry, try and convert that to terminology that you'd use if you've been involved in distribution of AIDS medicine with PEPFAR into Africa. How do you change that into I understand the supply chain, understand logistics, uh, and make sure that they kind of, when they go looking for these jobs, they have a different mindset and they talk about their accomplishments. And they don't overinflate them. One of the things USAID had a habit of doing is that they would overinflate the results and super report it and say, look at how what a great job we did. And that doesn't work in the private sector. People understand that the numbers and where they're coming from. Um so how do you take what these people have done in the development industry where everything they've done has just been to hit certain milestones and they don't directly translate into the private sector, but the skill set does. So how do they readdress their skill set uh so it doesn't sound like they're just I'm focused and exclusively on the development industry, but the skills that I've learned, the leadership roles that I've learned, the ability to communicate that I've learned, the multicultural stuff that I've learned can be applied to the private sector.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's uh delicate balance. Uh obviously I don't have the talent acquisition in the experience in the government of the USAID, the development sector, obviously, industry, to speak to I would say translate perfectly into the private sector, but uh I think most private sector companies and you know hiring professionals care about I would say three or four things when it comes to like reviewing your CD, decision-making authority, right? Like so if you were the chief of party that you mentioned, obviously it sounds like you're almost you know like a director, general manager, program manager, something along those lines. The financial impact, right? Like, so are you managing an annual budget of a million or fifty million or twenty million? What does that look like? And then how you've managed it, right? Accountability, what are the results from your work? And maybe something that you know uh is a bit uh uh not as common in the government sector or is really speed and agility. So how fast can you pivot when things come up? And do you have examples of of that? You know, thinking about the you know, look up the smart way of interviewing, which now the acronym lapsing on of what it would actually mean. But um, but you know, basically you're just thinking of that situation, um what you did about it, that the actions you took, and you know, ultimately the results. And if you can uh basically combine that and show those three or four things, I think it's it translates well into the section.
SPEAKER_02So when I actually wasn't looking for a job, but I found a product that I wanted to market and uh it was perfect size for the market to go pizza going to Japan and it was an eight-inch pizza, it was perfect. I contacted the company that manufactured it and went down and had a meeting with them, but it wasn't an interview. I was trying to get them to supply the product to me. And the first thing I sat down was the guy says, Well, our pizza's not important, it's Wolfgang Puck that's important. And I go, Well, who's Wolfgang Puck? And you know, granted, this was 30 years ago, and Wolfgang didn't have a restaurant in every airport in the world and wasn't in every grocery store, but he was on Good Morning America, which I'd never seen. But that really emphasized to me the importance of doing the research. And back then it would have been very difficult to do the research because we didn't have the internet. Now you can go to the internet and I can say who's Wolfgang Puck, and it can give me his profiles, background, his history, his everything about him. How important is it before somebody does an interview, uh even at your level when they're first having the first interview, that they actually understand what the company does and a little bit of their philosophy?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think it's I mean immensely important, obviously, that anyone first thing a new job, whether it be a uh you know within their industry or you know, mid-career change or whatnot, has some sort of background information or some sort of their own understanding of that particular company. And yeah, to your point, you know, 30 years ago, I guess, yeah, you could have just not known who Wolf GameFuck is, obviously. Um, you know, now uh I mean again, here's where some AI comes into play. You can go to any AI source you want to and say, you know, give me a high-level overview of you know Bulletproof 360 Inc. or something like that. Um and it's gonna tell you, you know, from basically our main products, uh probably our founder, and just kind of give you a synopsis of what Bulletproof is. Um I always ask various questions like that around the brand itself or maybe what interests people in the brand. Also, for me, you know, it's kind of a time test. Uh, you know, sometimes I chat with people that Bulletproof is brand new for them, and that's totally fine. It gives me an idea of how deep I need to go into talking about the brand. Likewise, I talk to other people that you know they've known about the Bulletproof brand longer than I've known about the Bulletproof brand. Um, and maybe that they know more about the biohacking lifestyle that Bulletproof brand used to be. So obviously now we're more of a your traditional CPG company, but yeah, it's immensely important to have your own understanding of the company ahead of time, um, even if it's just something that you can speak a quick you know 15, 30 seconds to.
SPEAKER_02So well, it's been amazing. I've been able to go on and say if I wanted to find out about Bulletproof, I could ask one of my chat GPTs who I've named Sue, I could ask Sue to give me the marketing strategy of Bulletproof and where they've been successful and where they're failed. And I could probably also tell them, you know, ask them how do they go about hiring and what they're looking for, and it'll give me an answer. Now, again, it's chat GPT, so it's just just gathering information that's out there in the public realm. It doesn't necessarily have the human insight, but at least gives the person a starting point. So uh one of the questions and one of the things challenges that I've run into is that uh a lot of times people won't take a job because they feel it's below them. And you know, particularly when you're making a career shift, how important it is that first of all that the people have a job before they take a job. And that's I've always said it's easier to find a job when you have one. Uh that at least was the strategy before, it may not be now, but when you have a job, you show stability, show that you're dedicated, as opposed to um sitting and waiting for the right thing to come along. And then the second stage of that is you know, upward mobility within the organization. How frequently do you move people within the organization to a higher task once they've got their foot in the door?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, definitely going to depend on your obviously company size and reach and whatnot. I think you know, we're talking about promotion eligibility for at least in my experience, we've always looked at potential of people, of course, but there has to be that business need for it. Um, you know, it's not just be in this role. It's very, very much unlike some other industries, like, you know, I I think the private sector is really, is there that business need, that justification for it? And then who currently within your workforce has the potential to um be promoted into that role? Um I think that speaks a couple things about the organization. Like, you know, one, obviously, promotion from within is great. It's investing your people, it's hopefully using that can we can use that as a retention tool, and they're you know promoting the the people that want to stay there. Um and and that helps retain them. How important is it have a job before you get a job? Um yeah, I would say that was probably true um, you know, pre Pre-COVID days, you know, so maybe pre-2020, maybe maybe even 2022. Unfortunately, now in this economy that we've seen massive layoffs, you know, the big name companies laying off tens of thousands of people at a time. You know, it is a very candid, I guess, saturated market. Whereas I can think back 10 years ago where it was difficult to get people hired for specific roles. And maybe that was just kind of, you know, we're maybe maybe in our instance we were hiring only in the Seattle area and you know having people relocate to the area. No, we're not. But you know, there's different industries or different I guess jobs that have been affected by AI, and you're thinking that that AI is causing these companies that have massive layoffs. There's a lot of candidates out there right now. So to your point, I don't think it's uh super impactful if you don't have a job currently when looking for a job, but be able to explain why you don't have that job, what happened in your last role. It can just be something as easy as I was laid off, or I've also heard a lot of times that people, you know, they had the you know the return to office policies, the RTO go into effect and they did not want to move back to whatever state that they had recently moved from. And then just others you know saying that, hey, they had a difference of opinion with leadership and they're now looking for a new role. I think that one is a little bit more tricky. If you can show then a consistent work history before that, then great. But if you're in you have that inconsistent work history before that, then it's a bit tricky to you know to really s say something along those lines.
SPEAKER_02So well, as an entrepreneur um and a uh renegade, I've always had a hard time working for other people. Uh luckily for me, I've been able to parlay my own companies and businesses into decades as opposed to years. But if you looked back at my pre-starting my own businesses, I always had conflicts with my bosses. Um and uh I I don't want to say how many times I was actually fired, but uh every time that I was fired or left a job, the next step was a step up, even though sometimes they were unexpected. Um in fact, one of the companies that I had was named Phoenix Marketing because we were rising from the ashes of the destruction of the business that we had. Um, and the resilience and the ability to bounce back was important, but it is important that you get along with people. And I think that's one thing in the development industry or in any industry where you can say, I manage people, I work with people. Uh one of the things I try to tell people is at the end of the day, you still have to work with people, whether it's AI, whether you're in computing or in numbers or whatever, you still have to interact with people. Same thing on a supplier. If I'm trying to sell to somebody, they have options, they have all kinds of options as to who they buy from, and they're gonna buy from somebody they feel comfortable with, somebody that they like. And that's why, you know, when I'm in an interview or talking to somebody, I'm looking at the pictures behind them, I'm looking at the things on the wall, I'm listening to what they say. You know, if they say, Yeah, you know, if even if you get their secretary and the secretary says he's out for the day because his kid's at a baseball tournament, well then next time you can talk to him, you can say, hey, how'd the baseball tournament go? Sure. You know, and you try and develop those personal relationships. Um, how important is our personal relationships these days? Uh and you know, how many jobs, referrals, how many people do you get because they know somebody else that worked within your company and they were referred to with you by them?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, let me just answer that question real quick. I don't have the exact numbers off the top of my head, but I think for most uh talent acquisition folks, myself included, uh referrals are just the number one like most trusted source typically. You know that whoever's putting forth this person is ultimately vouching for them from a performance standpoint. And then a lot of times too, we also get the going back to the personal relationship side. We also have uh a lot of times come up where you know maybe someone knows Jim and knows you know Bob and they're referring Jim to Bob, even though that Jim has never worked with Bob type thing, you know, the outside referrals. You see that a lot in the you know consumer package kids industry in today's job market with so many candidates looking for work.
SPEAKER_02So I think that's where LinkedIn comes in too, is because I can look at there and say, okay, who does this individual know? And hey, we have somebody in common here. Can I get Bill to introduce me to Sam or to Harriet or whoever it is? And I think that does add some credibility. But we've also had situations where we've introduced and we said this is a great person and then fail. Yeah, and they fall down. And when that happens, and it kind of reflects back on you or whoever made the recommendation. So one of the things that uh I encourage people to do is not to refer people and recommend people if you don't know them well, uh and not to you know to put yourself at risk because you are putting yourself at risk when you say, Hey, I know Stan over here and he's a great guy, but he turns out to be not a such a good guy. And on that note, how you know one of the things people talk about is you got to be careful what you post on your social media. So if I'm applying for a job as a schools teacher and I show a party where I'm uh hanging out the window of a car and screaming, I'm probably not likely to get that job. Um how frequently do you look at the social media accounts of people that you're interviewing and kind of correlate that with what they say they are, who they say they are?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, generally not too often. Um also a lot of people nowadays, I think we've seen a lot of examples like the ones that you just described. So they have their profiles set to you know friends only, you know, or whatnot. And maybe that's how they manage who sees what they post online too. Um so yeah, LinkedIn for me is generally this the main source of you know any type of social media, I guess you can say when it comes to hiring. Um and then uh it just also comes down to time too. Like I most of the time I don't have time to really analyze and go through someone everyone's social media accounts. You know, perhaps if we were hiring for a C-level role, I think, yeah, sure, we'd probably take a little bit more of a look at it, or maybe more of a leadership role. But if we're hiring for your individual contributor type role, you know, at least I don't see many people in my industry having the amount of time to really dive into it. Flip side, public sector, obviously, yes, you know, school teachers are setting the example for 20 to 30 kids. You know, uh athletes, of course, they can get blown up if on social media if they post the wrong thing. So yes, it's definitely industry-driven.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, one of the things that I've found is that from time to time go out and do a search on myself online and see what's posted on me out there. And sometimes I'm pleased with what it says, and other times, like, no, that's not wrong. It recently it stated that I was a keynote speaker at a conference in Central Asia, and I wasn't. But you know, that's what social media and that's what AI came up and said. I actually was a speaker, but not the keynote. But it is important, I think, to go out and and do a research on yourself, see what's out there so that you can counter the you know the negatives that are out there, you can emphasize the positives. Um so we talked a little bit about LinkedIn, we're gonna wrap up a little bit here, uh, but let's leave the people, the listeners, with some tools. Obviously, LinkedIn is a tool back again in the day, and I haven't looked for a job for decades, uh, thank God. Um but there used to be bulletin boards where I could go and look and see who's looking for what and post. I know with LinkedIn I can set it up as a to where it will notify me when people are looking for certain job descriptions that may be of interest to me. Uh are there other tools out there that that people should use to get their name out there and to find what they're looking for?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I mean yeah, LinkedIn is definitely the leading, probably the leading tool, um, honestly. And I know LinkedIn is also getting better at uh marketing the sponsored jobs to the candidates or you know, to the people who they feel is the audience versus you know marketing an accountant job to a you know uh engineer, forklift driver or an engineer or something. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, outside of LinkedIn, I would say uh some easy ones, uh industry associations, um, you know, like I know at least in my world you have Sherm, the uh the association. Or um, of course, you can always it depends upon if you're involved in the Greek life, fraternity sororities in college, but always call back on those for connections, as and then as far as like resources to learn more about companies, of course, AI. There's also different, you know, for publicly traded companies, you have the company investor decks or the earnings calls information that is generally available out there. Um another good one is just really like kind of recruiter-written content out on LinkedIn. Um it might be you know someone's point of view of how to um write a CV for the development world, um, or for career for professionals transit uh going from one industry to another. Um and then lastly, I think uh you know, resume writing services. Unfortunately, I don't have like a recommendation for them for like one specific one, but I know there's a lot of good ones out there, so do research and and they get probably help folks tailor their CV to specific jobs or specific industries.
SPEAKER_02So now you're employee of bulletproof, but there are also headhunters out there that's their job is to place people within industries. How important is it and at what level do I contact them? There's a couple of big companies, I can't think of their names right now, um, that have offices around the world. And you know, how important is it and how valuable of an asset are they? And then do you ever bounce off of them and utilize them?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so uh initially, no, we don't use live. Only uh purely out of a cost standpoint. They're generally fairly expensive for the uh employer or you know, for their client, that's that'd be me. Um uh but yes, uh I think there is uh use of those companies, or there's good uses of those companies, especially when it comes to um you know highly skilled industries. You can be thinking about, of course, software engineers as well as um you know doctors, lawyers, etc. Um, a lot of times once you get to a certain level, perhaps the candidate themselves is is actually paying the recruiter to go out and get them a job somewhere. I haven't worked too much with on that side of the business. Um but I know in the IT world that's where I started my recruiting, uh, was in IT, and it was all um you know direct placement services um as well as uh getting folks on basically on a contract for X amount of months, and you know that recruiting firm is is making money and you know for every hour that that person works at their client ultimately. So um it just depends upon the industry, I think, and when it comes or depends upon the job and the industry specific, but uh of how deep you want to go with the relationship of those types of firms.
SPEAKER_02I I guess as a wrap-up would be a vote of confidence or a cheer me up uh tiramisu of uh you know not to give up and to keep uh focused and to continue to strive for what you want. Um, you know, you don't get anything if you don't ask for it. Uh the old uh I know where I should be, so how do I get there type of strategy? Um and uh you know, keeping a focus and keeping involved. You know, one of the things people don't understand is looking for a job is a job. Uh it's not something you do in a pastime. You do it uh, you know, you get up in the morning and get engaged in it right away. It's funny we had a neighbor who every morning when he worked out of home, he'd get up and he'd put on his suit and tie. We all scratched our heads and said, Why do you do that? You know, it's nobody sees you. This is back before all the visual uh communications and teams and Zoom and that type of stuff. Sure. And he said, Well, for him it put him in the state of mind. It got him thinking that I'm professional, I gotta get a job, I gotta look, I gotta do what I'm doing. It also told his family that, hey, dad's got his tie on, don't go talking to him. He's focused. And that particular individual has done very well for himself. And part of that was the attitude. Um so one of the things that I encourage people to do is that you know, you get returned down and you keep trying, like I say, the jobs that I got when I was looking for jobs, uh, it was I chased after them. You know, the first job out of college, I knew what I wanted to do and I wasn't gonna give up until I got it. Again, that was a different time, but I knew where I should be. And I think if people do the assessment, and one of the things we talk about on the the 10 keys to thrive is doing the assessment of who am I? What are my skills and where do I want to go, what do I want to accomplish in life, and what company is going to get you there. You know, at the end of the day, you have to like where you work. If you don't, your your whole life and your life outside of work is gonna be miserable. Um, you know, and there is a trade-off between money and health care and child care and location and everything else, and only you can answer that for yourself. And all those things come into as a play and as a factor, and you have to understand what your value is and uh understand that you know the people that hire you have to make money off of you. That's the whole benefit of hiring you. They're going to get a benefit from hiring you, and they're gonna you know market your services, your product, or whatever it is that adds value to their product, and you have to understand that. Um, and uh you know, just keep your chin up, keep moving, and keep putting your nose to grind wheel, and sooner or later the right thing will fall into place. And sometimes you need to make an adjustment. You may need to move to a place that fits you better. I mean, I'm here in Seattle and I'm not in IT and I'm not in the salmon or wood industry or airplanes. You know, and there were times like you know, it'd be a lot easier to move someplace else where my particular career was more in style. And you know, you have to look at it and say, is that something that fits you and your lifestyle and your family and stuff? So I want to thank you for your time. I appreciate it. And we will be sharing this with people that are uh in the industry and and in the world trying to figure out where they're at and where they fit. And uh, do you have any any parting insight or brilliant wisdom that we can pass on to them before we say goodbye? I should have told you that, I should have warned you that before I threw it on you. At the end, getting that proof of something critical.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, I think uh you've pretty much summarized it. Um, you know, keep chasing it. Yes, you know, applying for new jobs is you know part of the process, but you know, there's other methods, there's other strategies to you know get in touch with the right people. Um don't forget about, like I said, all those hidden networks, alumni networks, former colleagues. Um you know, a lot of times the best job postings sometimes never go public. Um you know, they know someone and you know in their course of business that they see a role popping up, they know someone's available right now because you've made that personal connection, they recommend you there. So it's kind of a uh good hidden network there. But nope, I think you you have hit it. Just you know, know yourself and chase what you're after.
SPEAKER_02So well, and the other last thing is uh kind of a mechanical type of thing. Um Chaz and I both have backgrounds of books. Um, you know, you can have a background of a playground or background of a factory or whatever it is, but you have to make sure the background reflects what you're trying to market. Um, if I was a basketball player, maybe I'd have a basketball hoop in the back or a court. You know, if I was a farm, I'd have a farm, whatever it is, you can adjust that, but you also have to be critical of what is back there because people are gonna look at that and remember it's on camera. And the other thing that's interesting is we started out this uh cast, my visual image was negative. There was not the correct lighting on it, and it took some time to adjust that. So when you're interviewing with people, you don't want to be the shadow like one of the people that I work with all the time. She says, You look like an axe murderer because I'm hidden behind things, and that I can take care of, I can adjust. Um so it's important to take into consideration everything that that's around you. And if you are on a phone call, you know, make sure your dogs and your kids and the workers and stuff are not uh gonna stop in and chat with you. In some situations, that's the there can be a positive on that as well. Uh, you know, it does show that you you're family-oriented or whatever. And as an interviewer or an interviewee, if you're interviewing being interviewed by somebody and their dog comes in or their kids comes in, that gives you something to talk about. That gives you a point to talk about. But you don't want to be the one who brings that topic up with your dog coming in and interrupting the interview. Turn off your phone and pay attention to what's going on there. So thanks everybody. Thanks, Chaz, and uh we'll see you next time. All right, thank you, Jim. Thanks.
SPEAKER_00So that's it for today's episode of Ten Keys to Thrive. Head on over to Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen and subscribe to the show. Be sure to head on over to tenkeys to thrive.com to pick up a free copy of Jim's Gift and join us on the next episode.