Brand Identity: What Makes a Bike Truly American

Defining a truly domestic vehicle in an interconnected global economy is a massive challenge. As global supply chains become increasingly fragile, riders are questioning what actually constitutes domestic production. Richard and Jansen sit down to tackle the complex reality of building American motorcycles from a strict boots on the ground perspective.

We dive straight into the mechanics of modern production and how a hyper local fabrication shop in Elkhart County balances global sourcing. The conversation covers FTC compliance standards, the logistics of sourcing single cylinder engines overseas, and the intricate details of the new 250th Americana Edition. The standout moment comes when analyzing the philosophy of legacy brands and how mortgaging the future for the present is actively threatening the original manufacturing spirit.

The reality of building a motor vehicle from the ground up involves navigating intense logistical hurdles and balancing high domestic part costs. Sourcing the right components means acknowledging that pure domestic production is often impossible without sacrificing affordability or reliability. You will walk away with a clear understanding of why finding the best supplier matters more than geographic purity and how small manufacturers survive against massive odds.

If you care about domestic supply chains, the mechanics of small scale manufacturing, and the future of two wheeled culture, you will get a lot from this episode. Please subscribe to the channel and share this video with a fellow rider who appreciates the realities of the industry. What is the biggest compromise you are willing to accept to support a locally assembled product?

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:05

Hello everyone, welcome to the Ramble Stream Podcast. I'm Richard, and I'm Jansen. Each week we sit down for rambling conversations about motorcycles and the experience of rumming design and whatever else catches our fancy. Bring a beverage of your choice or stories, and we'll see where this takes us.

SPEAKER_04 0:21

If you're interested in thoughtful conversations, friendly and informative banter with fellow rummers, and the latest dispatches from Janice Motorcycles headquarters, you're in the right place. Let's get started. Hello everybody. Welcome back.

SPEAKER_01 0:37

We're here.

SPEAKER_04 0:38

The pre-ramblers really got a an extra show. It was like a special edition.

SPEAKER_01 0:42

It was like it was like the I wasn't even on it. Richard wasn't here. It was like the Cleveland Moto podcast, but in Northern Indian employees. Everyone was just chilling. But we won't talk any more about that because if you wanted to experience it, you have to be a part of the pre-ramble. And you can do so by hitting the join button down below. There you go, folks. Bam. How y'all doing? This is episode number 134. Can you believe it, Richard? I yeah, I can blame it. You just count, you know. Last episode is 133.

SPEAKER_04 1:19

We were on uh Cleveland Moto. It was pretty crazy, and they were saying that they were on episode 556.

SPEAKER_01 1:25

Five, six. That was that's a lot of episodes.

SPEAKER_04 1:28

That's a that's and their episodes are longer than ours.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Three hours is how long we were on.

SPEAKER_04 1:32

I was on an extra long one, I think.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

Yeah, but yeah, it was fun. It was a good time. You guys should check that out.

SPEAKER_04 1:35

It was a lot of fun, although I will say by the end of it, I had definitely had about three whiskeys too many.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

I am glad that I wasn't drinking because I would have been in the same boat, and then both of us would have been bad.

SPEAKER_04 1:50

As it was, it was just me that was bad.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

It was just Richard that was bad. I was very quiet because I was very tired. I was a sleepy boy. We've got a good episode for you guys planned today, though. We're gonna be talking about American manufacturing.

SPEAKER_04 2:04

Motorcycles.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

What is the American motorcycle? The question is, what even is an American motorcycle?

SPEAKER_04 2:12

Yeah, that's a good way to. I don't, I mean, I think it's better, not not detracting from your clickbait thumb thumbnail, but is it American enough? I prefer what is an American motorcycle.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

And then you can ask the secondary question is it American enough?

SPEAKER_04 2:25

Is that one enough? Is that one enough? Is Janus motorcycles American enough?

SPEAKER_01 2:29

We'd love to hear what you think in the chat. The chat's a great way for you to talk to us. Rich and I have these little microphones and you guys have your keyboard, so please keep the chats coming. We will do our best to stay on top of it. Uh, if it's anything like last week, you guys kind of had your own conversation and we were just here talking to ourselves. So if that's what you want to do, sure. But first up, oh, you do that. First up. No, you do you do that.

SPEAKER_04 2:54

My name is Richard Worsham. I'm uh co-founder and head of design at Janice Motorcycles. I'm broadcasting live to you all from Goshen Indiana at the Ramble Studio. Uh I ramble with a um variety of two-wheeled and three-wheeled and four-wheeled vehicles. Um, we'll pick three. Just a couple. Uh a Kawasaki KLR 650 from 2009, a 1999 Ducati 750 Super Sport, and a Halcyon 250 um number 68 from 2017.

SPEAKER_05 3:31

Way back when.

SPEAKER_04 3:33

I didn't get a lot of riding into the weekend. Wait, no, I did I did take a bike out of it on Saturday. It was Saturday. Friday. Friday. But the rest I was um I was busy doing a lot of yard work.

SPEAKER_01 3:46

And I had to run the from Cleveland to back home, back home to Cincinnati, Cincinnati to back home, all within two days. Wow. That was something else. I don't want to.

SPEAKER_04 3:57

Well, I had family in town. My mother was in town. Oh, nice. That was nice. Did she take the Vespa for a spin? She did not. It needs cables. But I'll have it, I'll have it ready for for August when they come back out. Perfect. There's the cables are on order from Midland.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

The specialty Vespa cables. My name is Jansen. I'm also coming to you live from from Goshen, from Goshen's World Headquarters, from Janice's world headquarters here in Goshen, Indiana. More particularly the Ramble Stream Studio. Uh, I ramble in a Ford Lightning and seem to be rambling on a Phoenix 450 named Fours, and I am sipping on today a delicious, contrary to what Richard thinks, beautiful, yummy pina colada cream M43. It's a New England India pale ale. It is very, very good. And also my first alcoholic beverage in 77 days.

SPEAKER_04 4:51

It's so you didn't have one over the weekend?

SPEAKER_01 4:53

I had three sips of a myclobe and then I fell asleep. And I'm not counting that.

SPEAKER_04 5:00

I also take periodic breaks from certain fast at certain times of the year. And you do have to watch out when you um it's not just alcohol, it's but like different kinds of food. When you get back into it, it will destroy you, it will do weird things to your body.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

I had Taco Bell. This is I had Taco Bell on Sunday, yesterday. I felt I woke up this morning and I felt hung over. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:23

And I think that actually is a thing. That's a real thing. No, I've absolutely experienced that.

SPEAKER_01 5:27

Brutal, brutal. But we're here now and I feel alive and well. First person to tune in to the ramble stream. This is a first. Arlesberg, I don't remember you ever being here first. Even your even you were like kind of questioning it. You're like, am I really first? Congratulations, you did it. Here's here's your high five.

SPEAKER_04 5:51

We have uh 1059 and 1140 second, Kelly.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

That's that's close. Kelly was coming in real close. Uh who knows? It could have been seconds. Um, Kelly, you're in here again. Good to see you. Speed Racer, you your four-week stri uh streak has ended. Um I'll pray for you, and maybe you'll get them next time. Eric Green, live in five hours, and people are already showing up. Eric with Outlaw in Vancouver, Washington. Yeah, you guys are pretty sick. You guys are pretty cool. Uh Semtech, yes, sir. Halcyon 1000 148 here too. And then, of course, Harry Smith. New member of the channel became a member. Welcome. He was tuned in to his first ever pre-ramble, and it was a special one. It was a special one.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

I didn't even hear what they were talking about. I was literally in a different room on the phone.

SPEAKER_01 6:46

He's gone, just away, just doing his own thing. He said, Ah, those guys, those young bucks will take care of it. It'll be amusing at least. I wish uh we'll probably watch it back, maybe. Uh, Michigan Road found this interesting place called Motor City Axe. What is that? What is Motor City Axe? Please explain. Um not everyone, I missed it by seven hours. Bad work day. And the rest of this week is only gonna get worse. Well, hopefully that this can be a beacon of light on your your Monday.

SPEAKER_04 7:18

Tex Moto dad. Good evening, my rambling brothers and sisters. Enjoying some Shinerbach and freshly made barbecue ribs. Ooh. I had a really nice dinner. It was very rushed, but the good thing about steak is it doesn't take long to cook.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

Nope. Well, depending on who you are.

SPEAKER_04 7:34

Broccoli out of the uh garden.

SPEAKER_01 7:36

Fresh broccoli, a nice medium red. Second growth broccoli.

SPEAKER_04 7:40

Second round of our broccoli. Producing. It's like more tender, honestly. It was good. Oh, the best broccoli I've had.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

I wonder if there's any science behind that.

SPEAKER_04 7:49

Maybe it could have just been the way my wife cooked it.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Hality from Wyoming. Finally made it to the live stream. Halcyon 450, number 422. What's up? I've never seen your name before. So welcome to the stream. Glad you're here. Who else is in here? There we go.

SPEAKER_04 8:07

Scott Spence. Scott saw Scott over the weekend. He came down for our discovery day. Halcyon 250 number 21212, and Halcyon 450 number 178 here from Elkhart. Sipping on, well, I haven't decided yet. Well, now's the perfect. You've got about an hour to make up your mind.

SPEAKER_01 8:21

You've got it, you've got time. You've got time. Uh Spanova, Steve on Boris, Halcyon 250, number 1000 85.

SPEAKER_04 8:29

Go ahead, finish up.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

Uh and Nancy on Natasha, Halcyon 250, number 1080 from Georgia, sipping on coconut water and water. I feel like neat.

SPEAKER_04 8:40

Am I just missing things or have they not been on in a while? We haven't seen them in a while.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

I haven't seen them in a quite while if they've been here. If you guys have been here, you've been lurking. Yeah. And that's good to see you. That that's not good. So glad you're here. Tuning in, chatting it up.

SPEAKER_04 8:54

I forgot to mention what I was sipping on.

SPEAKER_01 8:55

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:56

Angel's Envy, courtesy of Kelly Christmas. And Jansen's gonna up his drinking game shortly, so we can at least have a little bit of this. I will.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

In honor of Kelly. And on thank you, Kelly. I'll I will let you know uh how that's that's tasted.

SPEAKER_04 9:10

I brought a bottle um of uh Elijah Craig to the um to the um Cleveland Moto podcast.

SPEAKER_05 9:21

I think we made it off.

SPEAKER_04 9:23

Uh if we didn't polish it off, we got real close. It's close. I think I made a big dent in my own.

SPEAKER_01 9:29

You weren't the only one, though. That's the thing. Everyone was kind of sucking that stuff down. Uh I'm I'm seeing some comments about some lag. Um, everything looks good on our end, uh, as far as I can tell. Uh, if you guys could go ahead and refresh, that might fix it. Um, if not, I don't have a solution present right now. So uh maybe next week we'll be hardwired in uh to fix that. But let's uh let's get a poem in the meantime. Yes, the laptop is plugged in, Jason.

SPEAKER_04 10:03

It looks good on my phone, but maybe I'm not seeing it.

SPEAKER_01 10:06

I think a good refresh would uh would help a lot.

SPEAKER_04 10:09

Yeah. Um, so this is uh from our friend A.E. Stallings, um called Dutch Flower Paintings from the 1670s. The ladybird or bug exits stage right. Or no, stage left, tiptoeing the tabletop, but somewhat towards us, toward the source of light, while overhead towers the scalloped cup of brindled tulip, pillowy peony, bouquet of blooms that never blew together, golden age, Idenate Iden Idenaton. Oops, new word. The bee that crawls away behind the base, however, as if to hide some sadness in its face, or disappointed in the painted bowers, stigma and stamen, vanishes apace behind what isn't there, that vase of flowers. It doesn't fly. Is it allegory? It drumbles off to where oil's darkness hives. Natura morta cum momento mori, as by withdrawing, mystery survives. I think that she was looking at um uh Richard Wilbur's poem on um another Dutch painting by Pieter de Hooke.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

You think she was pulling which we've read on this stream.

SPEAKER_04 11:28

I think she well, she's definitely a um disciple of Richard Wilbur. With all the allegory and the word. I mean, look at all the wordplay in that, like just like even alliteration. Right.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

It it almost it almost sounds the same when I hear you read an A-stalling uh you could I I couldn't even mistake one for Wilbur sometimes. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 11:46

Yeah. I really, I mean, man, I just found this. I know I've said this, but I found this in a wait, no, how did I find this? It was some kind of happy accident. And I was like, this sounds like what is this? This is like right up my alley. Wait a second. I know. And then I realized that she was a Greek scholar and all this stuff. I was like, okay, all right. She's she actually lives in Greece, I think. How cool would it be to live in Greece? I think it would be nice for either a brief holiday stay, or maybe if you were a monk.

SPEAKER_01 12:17

Oh, fair. Well, one of my life goals uh is to be able to go on vacation for three months.

SPEAKER_04 12:25

That's kind of a probably a lot of people would share that.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

I'm not saying it's unique, I'm just saying it's one of my life goals.

SPEAKER_04 12:31

I find I'm not trying to like one-up you or anything, but I do find that about two weeks and I start start getting a little antsy. Getting really antsy. Now it may be you know, entrepreneurialism or whatever, but um I I really like a challenge, and unless there have been the best vacation I ever took was walking across Spain, and that took that was a month.

SPEAKER_01 12:58

And it's and you were like you had a goal.

SPEAKER_04 13:01

We had a start point on one side on France, and then we were walking all the way to the other side, and that was very engaging. And I did not think about anything else.

SPEAKER_01 13:09

I couldn't imagine that being engaging at all.

SPEAKER_04 13:12

Yeah, but it does, I do I do when when when I travel, this is really off topic, but when I travel, I do I feel like you want to do something that's makes you a part of the place where you have a role to play. Right.

SPEAKER_01 13:23

Is it I just can't like sit on the beach for I mean you just I my brain just starts atrophying and it's like I'm I'm just now think thinking about this as we're talking, and maybe the goal is uh to be able to go on vacation for three months, to turn that side of your brain off for a second and just like really be present where you are and explore.

SPEAKER_04 13:48

Or what if you flipped it and said that the goal of the goal is to find out how to pursue your vocation in different places? I mean because I think that what the key to to really good traveling is to figure out how to live like the people there do, right? Where you have something to do. Well, another another example, times I've spent overseas at least, is studying.

SPEAKER_05 14:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:12

And that I felt that the that is the most rewarding because you you have a job. You're you're you're you can't dawdle around, you gotta be at this place at this time, and right, and then you start like really experiencing the place for what it is other than this. Not like the touristy if you come to Goshen and you're just on vacation, yeah, you're gonna get an experience, but you're not gonna actually learn that place like a local would know. Right.

SPEAKER_01 14:34

Anyway, that that's a we that America. That was your philosophical segment on the ramble, Richard. Uh we've we've kept people waiting for too long.

SPEAKER_04 14:47

No, I'm uh very excited to announce that we have uh a new limited edition of Janice Motorcycle. We do that we're going to tell tell you all a little bit about.

SPEAKER_01 15:01

We teased it last week. We did fringe versus tassel. Which one? Well, I hope you picked tassel. Did we did what did we do last week? I can't remember what we shared last week.

SPEAKER_04 15:16

I think we showed on the pre-ramble the uh tassels.

SPEAKER_01 15:19

Did we? Yeah. We showed them again today during the pre-ramble.

SPEAKER_04 15:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

Well now we should we should just show the people.

SPEAKER_04 15:26

Okay. So we um we've uh we are launching, and I think some of you all uh may have already received an email, but we are launching our 250th anniversary Americana edition in celebration of the upcoming 4th of July and our um national birthday. Um we're really excited about it. Our our owner's rally is called the Ramblers Roundup.

SPEAKER_03 15:52

Man, look at that. Let's get all the the tassels.

SPEAKER_04 15:57

You know, I've never really been a tassel kind of guy, uh-huh, but I'm pretty excited about this. It's pretty cool. It looks really good on a 250. Yeah. I should also mention that the 250th anniversary specials are only 250s. We're not doing this on the 450. So if you want to um have a 250th, 250 now is the only year we will be doing this. The only time. So uh we're excited. It comes along with the saddlebag. It comes with a tasseled seat. Um, and these I wish I could show it to you on a bike that's been worn in, but as you know, uh the deluxe seat, which is what it's available with, it's not available on any other seats. Um with a deluxe seat, it takes a little while for that to break in and really take its shape. But these tassels hang down all the way around. Looks really, really cool. It looks so cool, and it really actually matches the bike. Yeah, the bike just fit it really well.

SPEAKER_01 16:55

It takes it like a champ. It's it's really cool. Last but not least. This okay, now this one, I love the seat, I love the saddlebags. This one you're going with tassels. This one is questionable to me.

SPEAKER_04 17:08

I also serves as a whip.

SPEAKER_01 17:13

Yeah, just in case your co-host starts acting out.

SPEAKER_04 17:17

Now, these are um awesome handlebar tassels that that actually uh with leather cords attached over your handlebars, so you have a uh leather grip. Super cool. Turns your grips to matching leather as well.

SPEAKER_01 17:31

It it reminds me, and this is like in a good way. I've I wouldn't personally have them on mine, but it reminds me of like my sister's bicycle growing up that had like the pink frilly tackles hanging out the end.

SPEAKER_04 17:45

Well, those were trying to emulate this, right? Because it all started with real leather ones on American made motorcycles, very American.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

This is the truest American motorcycle you've got.

SPEAKER_04 17:55

The legacy of the of the of the West.

SPEAKER_01 17:59

That's a cool line. The legacy of the West.

SPEAKER_04 18:02

So we're really about these. Um, it's been a fun project to see these come together and kind of blow the team's mind a little bit too.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

Because they're like, Wow, yeah, especially with the color combos, the cream. Um I believe it's cream, the cream, red, and blue one. Yeah, the cream, red and blue one looks really good. It looks really really good.

SPEAKER_04 18:24

And the leather options, we're adding a leather color. Is that on this uh I think it's just document on the dock? Yeah, one more time. Leather, choice of leather color, saddle brown, black, oxblood, and white. White. You can get white leather with this uh this uh package. And we're still waiting. We haven't gotten one of those yet. We're still waiting for that. I'm really excited. Actually, I I designed a limited edition halcyon back in the 50cc days with white leather. I never I never built it, but I spec'd it out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:00

Production is limited. Uh, there's a late time about four to six weeks. Uh, and these are all built to order, as you guys know.

SPEAKER_04 19:06

So um, if you guys would like to order one, I believe the configurator might have the configurator is it should be alive either late today, which it already is, or tomorrow. Okay. Um, if you are a Janus owner or if you subscribe to our mail list, you sh well, if you're an owner at least, you should have already received an email. Um, but that order form is available for download. Yeah. Um, and if you haven't gotten it yet, you will soon. Right. Um, because it'll be we're kind of phasing the launch of this out.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

So you guys are some of the the first people to know. So you should feel so special being on the Ramble stream. Thank you so much for tuning in. Uh, we appreciate you, and we're glad to release stuff to like to release stuff like this to you all first.

SPEAKER_04 19:50

The Marquis de Sad wants to know your location.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

I had so much fringe on my Kawasaki Drifter, it it got me over it, but it was cool to have Nancy. Speaking of expertise, those tassels will whip up from the wind and hit your arms, and they'll remind you that you're alive and it shouldn't matter because you always wear your gear.

SPEAKER_04 20:16

The cool thing with um these tassels is if you're kind of like an eight-inch tassel guy, we got you covered. If you're like a four-inch tassel guy, if any any longer, very easy to adjust the length of your tassels.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

And any longer if you want them longer, we could probably arrange that. You can make two sets and then cut and then tie. Options are unlimited, really. You could do whatever you want. The speed racer just says, hell no. Are you saying that to the white or to the tassels? I think the white is gonna be would be something that I do. If I if I were to buy a 250th uh anniversary bike, it would be the with the white, which is so unique. What is Mike's name? In 1976, consumer sand and gravel painted their concrete mixed drums red, white, and blue for the bicentennial. Huh. You know, you know, America only turns 250 once. French braids? Yes, you can French braid it if you really want to. You can put weights on the end. I don't know what I would I would be interested to look into the history of tassels. Like I see some motorcycles that have like the big, like super long ones, but they can't be able to do that.

SPEAKER_04 21:32

Like the whip on the on the um they put it on their actual levers, which there's gotta be a way it works. Uh-huh. But like all I can imagine is like catching one your like front brake lever on something.

SPEAKER_01 21:45

Sending you over the handlebars. Right. I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 21:47

I never understood. There's gotta be something I'm missing, right? Of course.

SPEAKER_01 21:50

There has to be. I would love to to see the history. Um, we've got a couple things coming up. Uh the 250th anniversary motorcycle uh is. Is one of them. Uh the second one, which we've referenced already a little bit, is the Ramblers Roundup that's happening September 17th through the 20th. Uh, we're super excited about that. That's still coming together. You guys can get your VIP tickets. Uh now, um, I believe spots are filling up. What where are we at? On I don't know the actual count.

SPEAKER_04 22:19

Okay. Um, but no, there's there's there's room for more. Yeah. But uh we we do, we want to, we wanna we we're putting even more work into this year's um I've talked a little bit about on previous rainbow streams the fact that we're gonna have workshops that actually mean like you can come away with something, you'll be able to participate in the process. So uh uh one of them will be uh pinstriping.

SPEAKER_05 22:41

Very cool.

SPEAKER_04 22:41

So you can make make what you will of that, but uh the spots for those are limited. Yeah. Um, so if you do want to get one of those workshops signing up sooner than later is a good idea. But we'll do a lot of educational workshops.

SPEAKER_01 22:54

Um yeah, there'll be a live ramble stream, live ramble stream, uh lots of stuff.

SPEAKER_04 22:58

Rides, parties, food, uh concerts. So both outdoor Janice concerts and big concerts right next door. Heck yeah. So be a fun time.

SPEAKER_01 23:11

It's gonna be awesome. Uh, we would love to see you there. Whether you own a Janice or not, can fend it.

SPEAKER_04 23:16

Build your own fenders. No, we're not doing fenders.

SPEAKER_01 23:18

B B Y O F. Sorry, bring your own. Uh Tassels workshops, Chop Rocks, of course, just for you specifically. Um, I I haven't talked to Richard about this, uh, but I would say that we could give away a VIP ticket eventually.

SPEAKER_04 23:30

Oh, yeah, we can do that. Not tonight, but not tonight. We can we can we'll we can publicize it ahead of time.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

We can.

SPEAKER_04 23:36

Maybe we'll get some more viewership.

SPEAKER_01 23:37

You gotta be more likes. Um, but really excited about that. We've got the George Wyman ride uh as well coming up this weekend. Uh we had a great discovery day. Um, it was good to see. I didn't see you guys, but I'm sure you guys had a great time if you came. Um always love hosting Janice owners and future Janus owners here uh on our in our in our shop, uh getting everyone on motorcycles and having a good time. So thank you all so much for coming to that. There will be another one of those here in a couple months. Uh, we'll have more information as it gets closer.

SPEAKER_04 24:12

Yeah, it's gonna be June 27th. Um leave from here at Janice Motorcycles at 9 45 a.m. And we're gonna ride to uh Kendallville. Kendallville? Yeah, Kendallville, where uh this amazing old school teacher um has taken this George Wyman story as a personal project, and he's hosting a festival of George Wyman at Kendallville. Um Kendallville was along just like uh Goshen, George Wyman's route. So we're gonna retrace his route from here to Kendallville, and then we are gonna um Wednesday night preceding this coming Wednesday, I'm giving a talk there. If you're interested in coming to that, I'll be talking about my adventures all the way across the country. And then on the day of the event, um, I will be kind of doing a brief version of that. And uh Tim Masterson, who is the founder and operator of the George Weman Foundation, who got me interested in George Weman. He got me interested in long distance riding and Iron Burton Association riding, will be riding in um to um deliver that and present the plaque, which they're putting up. So it's gonna be a fun kind of historic uh event, small town. I think there's a hot dog eating competition. Nice. Um, fun stuff.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

Welcome to the 250th. It's it's well, let's eat let's eat a whole bunch of hot dogs to celebrate things because that's just what we do.

SPEAKER_04 25:36

That's this weekend. So if you're in the area, we really encourage you all to come out for that and ride your bike and uh participate in the long tradition of George Wyman.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Yeah, it's gonna be a good time.

SPEAKER_04 25:46

Somebody said that no, Richard starts it out on the 24th. Oh, I see. Yes, that is I start the the Wednesday night presentation is on the 24th. The actual event is the 27th. Um, does that make sense, everybody?

SPEAKER_01 25:59

Jansen, why did you shave your beard? Um, because I spent like a day and a half with Richard and just decided that I wanted to have a mustache too.

SPEAKER_04 26:08

He wanted to join the police as well.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

Yes, that's why. Secretly. Secretly. Don't tell anybody. No, I trim I trimmed my beard and it was and then I walked in and Danny was like, why don't you just do the mustache?

SPEAKER_05 26:21

It looks really good. Thank you. I I I think it's a it's a good look. Thank you. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 26:26

It's it's good to like change it up every once in a while, you know. Um what do you what do you think about American uh motorcycles, Richard? What do you think is what do you think makes an American motorcycle an American motorcycle? Is an American more motorcycle more than just the sum of its parts?

SPEAKER_04 26:43

Oh that's a good question. It's a good one. We set we set ourselves a real a real uh challenging topic.

SPEAKER_01 26:49

We gave ourselves 16 minutes to tackle this.

SPEAKER_04 26:52

But uh I definitely want to hear what the folks in the chat think about this.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 26:58

But we're in an interesting position as motorcycles because we simultaneously uh founded this company and operate this company as a extremely local manufacturer. When you say extremely, for those of you, for those of the people who don't know, how extreme well we assemble everything here, we paint everything here, we fabricate much of the components within a mile in our fabrication shop. And we partner, and we have partnered from their very inception with local suppliers to do the vast majority of the manufacturing production that goes into every motorcycle. At the same time, we import parts from literally the other side of the world. Talking to Chansen earlier, we were talking about like what defines made in America in the strict Federal Trade Commission definition. You're saying it was 60%. I was saying I thought it was higher. 60%. But um, let's Jansen says it's 60% of components of a product need to be made in America for it to be defined as made in America. However, one of the things that I've learned is that to be made in America is not those those components are not equal. So the the example that the FTC gives for how to define made in America, there you go, um, is a lamp. And so if a lamp if all if the light bulb in the lamp is not made in America, that's weighted against you because the light bulb is like the centerpiece of the vehicle. So right in the tens of in terms of a motorcycle, what would be the centerpiece of a motorcycle?

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Hmm. The headlight.

SPEAKER_04 28:44

No, the engine. Um, so you can obviously tell that right up right under the gate, our our engines come from the other side of the world. That puts us in a unique kind of position um where we are simultaneously a glob have a global supply chain and hyperlocal one. Um, and so what makes something made in America, I think, has to do with that. You know, where the parts come from. Obviously, um, we are huge proponents of not just domestic manufacturing, but Elkhart County manufacturing. Right. At the same time, you need to contrast that with are you is the what is the the business? Is the business a American business? Right. Is it supporting Americ the American jobs? Is it supporting the American economy? Um, all those things have to be weighed when you say that. And the last piece that I think is probably the most difficult to pin down is I think that there's something that has to do with the spirit of the product, right? Especially when it comes to motorcycles. Right. And is that spirit American? Um and that's just like I mean, what do we mean when we say that? Like I mean, because you can have you can take like the super like patriotic kind of national kind of approach, or you can take the sort of like what feels appropriate.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Right. Like to help explain it, because I I don't think either of us have it completely kind of figured out, ironed out. So that's what like why we're here. Uh but when I think of uh Harley and like the starting in like the mid-50s up until like, I don't know, I would even say like early nineties, uh that they had they held the American spirit.

SPEAKER_04 30:38

Well, they held the American experience from 1903 on. Do you think it was that early? Oh well, I mean, think about the absolutely. I think that the you had the battle between Indian and Harley Davidson was battled on the on the racetracks of America.

SPEAKER_02 30:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:53

But absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 30:54

But those felt like like tried and true. They held the spirit of an American. I mean, you're saying that because against all odds.

SPEAKER_04 31:04

And in this fact that a lot of the other brands died in about the 50s, right, or 30s.

SPEAKER_01 31:09

And and and hardly almost did. Right.

SPEAKER_04 31:11

But an Indian did in 1953.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

But they pushed through, and like that, that that ability to push through like that, it feels like there's a portion of the American spirit in that. Absolutely. So, like beyond how, and I know this can be kind of heady, right? But beyond how the the motorcycle actually functions, um, there needs to be some passion behind the brand itself. And I think that Harley has lost that passion in pursuit of profit.

SPEAKER_04 31:40

Well, I don't think that's a very controversial opinion, right? Right. But somewhere along the way, a brand um does reach an iconic status. And Harley Davidson certainly has reached that status. Yeah. Indian reached that status. And and many other great brands, American brands did. Yeah. Some brands that didn't necessarily make very many motorcycles. Yeah. Like think about um something like Crocker, for example. Crocker produced very, very few motorcycles, but they are they're they're such a so defining in even, I think that Harley would, and you can look at the way that a Harley Davidson looks, owes some of that to Crocker. So you can just look at it and say, that's an American motorcycle, right? Right. And that has the spirit. And that's what I mean. Like then you look at a uh Envy Gusta or a Gorelli and you say, That's Italian.

SPEAKER_01 32:32

And then that one's English. Uh Arlesberg says, hold the spirit. What does that even mean? Does Motor Marina hold the Italian spirit today? No, it does.

SPEAKER_04 32:42

I don't think so.

SPEAKER_01 32:42

Why is that?

SPEAKER_04 32:43

Because it's not Italian. I mean, and it and it and it literally doesn't even have an Italian engine. Like and you see what I'm saying? Like we get our engine from China, but we've picked an engine that what for what we do, and it's um it's different than the V-twin that defines American engine.

SPEAKER_01 33:05

A lot of how we respond to people who are saying, well, just get an American engine. A lot of how we respond to that is like if you can find a small displacement single-cylinder engine that's made in America, we would be all over it.

SPEAKER_04 33:21

Right. But there's nothing I guess. Another the other thing you could say that is like, well, if you want to be American, you need to make a V-twin. That's a thousand cc's.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

And that's fair.

SPEAKER_04 33:30

You know, that's one thing. But I guess to answer that question about Marini, it's a great, I love that point because it's a lot of those marinis are using a um basically a Kawasaki Ninja 650 engine. Um, great motor. Those marinis are great bikes, yeah. But you're talking about a motorcycle that is entirely from a different imagination. It's not the the the motor. Look at a marini three and a half from the 70s. It's so inherently Italian. It just speaks of it. It has this flair. And a new Marinis are great, but they just they don't do that. I mean, they're very great value, right? Um, and the same thing could be said for I mean, like, look at is Indian really Indian? That'd be another question.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

Like it's like the thesis, what is that thesis chip of motorcycle manufacturers?

SPEAKER_04 34:20

That is the old thing. You look at Harley Davidson and you say, Yeah, that is a continuation of the same vision for a hundred and what, you know, however long, however many years. Right. Um, it's it's incredible.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

So I I guess I want us to really nail down to figure out how to nail down and articulate what the spirit of America is. Yeah. Um, and I don't know, I don't even know how to do that. I mean, I I we can take some stabs. I I I think um visually there's there are cues. Um, but I I think mostly it's what is what is the American way?

SPEAKER_02 34:59

Well, on some level, the American way has to do with um optimism and uh seeking your few your your fortune.

SPEAKER_04 35:16

And this it's it's built into the the not just the founding but the uh discovery. Right. These were these adventurers that went west and went here and survived unimaginable hardship to to seek to to to at the with the for the very risky potential of making their fortune in the and preserving or in some cases finding religious you know freedom or whatever.

SPEAKER_05 35:43

Right.

SPEAKER_04 35:45

But like some of them were just adventurers, right?

SPEAKER_01 35:48

Or or uh investors or or a risky and capitalists, or they got into some financial trouble trouble.

SPEAKER_04 35:55

This seems better than adventured servitude. Seems better over here. Anyway, where I'm going with that is is that I think that the the American motorcycle, if you look at that's the way I would describe it, is that it has this sort of optimism and this kind of long-leggedness where they are thinking about going west. Yeah. And this sort of travel is built in the idea that not everything has been found. Like if you look at an English motorcycle, it's designed for English roads, yeah, where everything has been found.

SPEAKER_05 36:26

Right.

SPEAKER_04 36:26

Everything is worked out, everything is everything has been discovered, and this is a motorcycle for winding your way through that. And so same with an Italian bike. It's like it's almost designing a motorcycle. The road is almost a racetrack in the sense that it's cured, it's it's been figured out. You know where you're going. Yeah. Whereas in America, it's sort of this what's around that corner. I don't know what's over there. It's so big. Right. And so I think that's one of the reasons that the V-twin has become popular. Um, and to to really participate in that, kind of going back to what you were saying, like, is it possible to lose that? Um, I think it's certainly possible for if your brand has been bought by a different entire economic machine, right? Yeah, you can lose that. It's no longer Italian. Um, you know, our engines coming for the F 450 are not Italian engines, right? They're they're Japanese engines that are made in China. Right. Uh it's very, very, but they're very much so. But we picked it because it speaks to this language of this purest form of simple single cylinder um that that is that that is fitting for this kind of a new kind of running. So we're really off on our we're off in like Lululand. Yeah, in some ways.

SPEAKER_01 37:40

I I would say that that in and of itself, and this might be coping here, and I'm completely aware of that. It that in and of itself, of like the pursuit of a very specific vision, is very American.

SPEAKER_04 37:51

I would agree. So I think that the story of Janice is extremely American, right?

SPEAKER_01 37:55

Yeah, I I agree. Whether our our light bulb is made in China or not. Right. Yeah. Um, but does it does it another fun question is does made in America hold uh the weight that it it feels like it does? I hope so.

SPEAKER_04 38:15

I think it's gonna become more important too.

SPEAKER_01 38:17

You think?

SPEAKER_04 38:18

I do. I think that we're all getting used to the cost of things rising. And the more I'm not getting political here by any means, but as things are the way they are, and the cost of just for whatever reason importing climbs, oil prices, whatever war is going on, and they're just seem like they're more and more frequent. The and we realize how fragile, as certainly as we I know, like few people do how fragile the supply chain actually is.

SPEAKER_01 38:48

In it.

SPEAKER_04 38:49

Yeah. Uh how it does shore up the ability, the the fact that if things are expensive, well, then why don't we just make them over here in Iowa or in you know Pennsylvania, York, you know, like that that reinforces that. And I think that the people people recognize that value. I I maybe I'm being optimistic, but I think the people we're all we're all human and we're all want of our money to go to the what is the best value, right? And um, yeah, yeah. But but I but did we leave any strings like with the with with Harlow the question of they somehow losing that American thing.

SPEAKER_01 39:31

Yeah, I would like to go to go back to that for sure. Just wondering about looking at even just some of the design language behind uh their newer models, um, just feeling we talked a little bit about um can motorcycles be have have too many jobs? Uh and I feel like they're steering into that category, which to me is un-American.

SPEAKER_04 39:53

Well, the the counter, sorry, I don't mean to this is good. I'm just kind of diving around. The counter is like, as we saw in the chat, somebody was talking about their Buell and their, you know, their chassis made in outside of Bologna, and their you know, different parts are made all over the world. I don't think anyone can find a more American company than the original Buell motorcycles.

SPEAKER_01 40:14

Like I mean, for real though.

SPEAKER_04 40:16

For real. Like it's it's a a a group of optimistic, wild motorcycle passionate people that started a company and they and they built it from with with with against great all odds. That's that's what's Ducati is a pretty American company. In that in what sense?

SPEAKER_01 40:37

In that in that sense of like just some good old boys who want to race.

SPEAKER_00 40:41

Well, there's a there's a certain there is a language language that's universal to motorcycles.

SPEAKER_04 40:48

And I think you could say the same thing about um Monogutsi. That's fair. Or these, but but like but but Duccati has that, but what they focus on is something different, which is so Italian, which is this amazing sense of style and of flair, and of course, also performance um that that that Harley doesn't need to worry about. Their style is much different. And and and I'm not even gonna apologize for the kind of stereotypes that we can find in motorcycles for different places they come from. It's beautiful, right? But you have this diversity, like, and you can recognize an English motorcycle for its failures and its strengths. Right. Failures and strengths and American, they all have their own failures and strengths, but they're all uniquely the way they are and they're uniquely appropriate. Right. Um, it does what we're trying to do at Janice is very, it's a difficult balance. Yeah. Um, to quote Richard Wilber, because it it um we are trying to, we are operating, I believe, in that in that tradition of ingenuity, entrepreneurship, starting from nothing, building a motorcycle the way you want to do it. But we're we're kind of inverting some of the like tr what traditionally an American motorcycle is. Yeah. What you know, we we did the first engine we came out with was not a V-twin, it was a Spanish 50cc two-stroke.

SPEAKER_01 42:18

Right. It's like fighting against the stigma. So again, coming back to that question, is like being made in America, is that still a uh a badge of I don't think a badge of honor is the correct term, but is that still something to strive for?

SPEAKER_04 42:34

Yes. I but I I I would say that it's something to strive for for more practical reasons than the spirit. The spirit must be there for for for transcendent reasons, which are more important than practical ones. But the practical reasons are very important, like people want things that work and that are affordable and that that uh yeah, that that are reliable and that the supply chain works, right? That's a reason to make things in the United States, right? And if you want to just make if you're you're trying to argue with an economist on on a transcendent level, they're not gonna listen to you. Well, and a customer isn't on some level too. Now it matters, but if you can make it like Buell is a great example, like they're gonna try and find, like we argue, we're gonna find the best supplier for this component. And if that supplier is in Australia for shock absorbers, then let's go, let's go there. If it's the best fit, and it isn't necessarily the best one in the world, it's the best fit for us. Right, right. Um, and and maybe for some people that would be that they have to go to you know China just because it's cheap. Right. We don't go to China because it's cheap.

SPEAKER_01 43:45

American bikes.

SPEAKER_04 43:46

I mean, hint hint hint. I mean, that our motors are not cheap.

SPEAKER_01 43:49

No.

SPEAKER_04 43:49

We go because that's the best place to get them.

SPEAKER_01 43:51

Right. Because that they accomplish the goal that we would want that we want them to. American bikes, famous for their affordability lol.

SPEAKER_04 44:00

That's where I would the maybe maybe this is a closing point. Yeah. Would argue that I think that brands like Harley Davidson have lost the thread. And I think that any Harley rider wouldn't wouldn't disagree that the American dream, the American spirit, is that when you're young and passionate and ready to ride a motorcycle, that you can afford to buy one.

SPEAKER_05 44:28

Right.

SPEAKER_04 44:29

And that's what we strive for. Now our books, relative to other small displacement motorcycles, are not the cheapest. And we're never going to try and do that.

SPEAKER_05 44:38

Right.

SPEAKER_04 44:38

But we're also not trying to sell our motorcycles for $40,000. Because what you end up with there is you mortgage your future for the present. And that is not the the the future of the American spirit is building something great.

SPEAKER_01 44:56

You mortgage your present for the future. That's a pretty no mortgage your future for the future. Your future for the present.

SPEAKER_04 45:04

That's a pretty well, but you see what I'm saying? It's like I completely understood. Okay, we're just gonna only sell these bikes to people who can afford them. Right. And it's not even like a good business model because you want you do want to think about your kids and your grandkids and being able. I mean, I'm not questioning the quality of their bikes or anything, but like but if if that's the way that you that's kind of like a uh a boomer move.

SPEAKER_01 45:34

I thought that statement was very profound. Uh to mortgage your future for your present means that you are uh you are you are sacrificing what what is important to you now, but you're like pushing it off almost in a way. Huh. I'm I I legitimately think that that's something that you can write on a poster.

SPEAKER_04 46:05

What do you all think? What do y'all think you think?

SPEAKER_01 46:06

We got a lot of good comments. Um Janus may be the most American-made motorcycle at the moment. I mean, I I legitimately think that it is, and I can say that because I have some partisan here. We can talk about that later, Kelly. It's because I did a challenge, nothing too deep.

SPEAKER_04 46:34

You had a serious problem.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

I had a serious problem, guys. Uh people is a bit nebulous word when it comes to dictating what they value or don't value. Some care about origin or quality or working conditions, other continue to buy Nikes made in Thailand.

SPEAKER_04 46:48

Yeah, everything is a generalization.

SPEAKER_01 46:50

Everything is relative. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 46:51

Uh well, no, I don't think it's when we talk about people, we're we're we're making generalizations. I think things are not relative, but that's just we can we can talk about that later, Richard.

SPEAKER_01 47:01

We can fight in the you wouldn't be the first. Speaking of engines, would an SWM Stormbreaker powered at Janus come around anytime soon?

SPEAKER_04 47:10

Stormbreaker is the new uh 883. Oh, is it really? They have uh no.

SPEAKER_01 47:18

Richard, you're a part of the reason a Janus is a Janus. What do you think? What do you think about that? I mean, I did design the thing, you said.

SPEAKER_04 47:29

Yeah, well, I mean, I I do think that that what we're trying to do here is a little microcosm of the American project. And by America, I'm talking about what we've been trying to do for 250 years, which is make a make a mark on the world trying to do something different. Yeah. Um and it doesn't matter where where you come from on the political spectrum, I think that that we can all identify behind that. Um and and there's a it takes a certain amount of grit and it takes a certain amount of um optimism um and and just stick with it-ness. And I think that if there's if anything, anything categorizes Janice, it's our ability to just stick with it. Um, you know, I one of the things I wanted to talk about tonight was all the different American manufacturers. Um, there's some great ones. I think uh we would be remiss not to give a little shout out to Rokon. Rokon. Rokon? I don't even know what Rocon. You know what Rocon is? Rokon, I bet you there's some people on this chat that have one. It's a two-wheel drive motorcycle made in like I think they're made in New Hampshire.

SPEAKER_01 48:34

That's cool.

SPEAKER_04 48:34

Or they were originally Vermont or New Hampshire.

SPEAKER_01 48:36

A two-wheel drive motorcycle.

SPEAKER_04 48:37

They're hideous little things that are just awesome. You can fill the tires with water or gas. You want a little extra fuel? Fill up your giant tires. Uh but like companies like that, it's like, how do they still exist? That's so cool. And I'm sure people say that about Janice. Like, how have they lasted 15 years?

SPEAKER_01 48:55

I wonder if that's the question then. The question that determines if something is like has the American spirit is how how are they still in business? That is that the question. The fact that I can own a motorcycle that was made here in the US and I can take a long trip and go visit the people that made it, talk to them, ride with them, and be in community with them is wild.

SPEAKER_04 49:16

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 49:17

I'm I'm we're glad you're part of uh part of the family, it seems.

SPEAKER_04 49:21

Uh it's a two-wheel drive, ATV is what it is. That's an arocon. That's pretty cool. All right. Well, we could probably ramble on for another two hours like we did on the Cleveland Monocoto Podcast. If you haven't, go check out Cleveland Moto Podcast number 556. Jansen and I are on there. Um, I think it kind of degrades toward the end, but it's a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_01 49:43

I I got tired. I got sleepy, like legitimately. I got intoxicated. Chris Smith, Chris Smith just uh hopped on over and fell asleep stairways. He really so that's the kind of show it was.

SPEAKER_04 49:57

It was really fun. We want to give them a big shout out. Thank you for having us on. We'll do it again sometime.

SPEAKER_01 50:01

Yeah, I would love to go back.

SPEAKER_04 50:02

It was it was we're gonna we're gonna have some of them out here.

SPEAKER_01 50:04

We should definitely do that. We should have as many as possible in this room. It could be fun. We'll see you next week for episode 135. Thank you all so much for tuning in. We'll see you then.

SPEAKER_04 50:19

That wraps up this episode of the Ramblestream Podcast. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed the show, subscribe wherever you listen, share it with a fellow rambler, and please consider leaving a rating. And join us live every Monday at 7 p.m. on YouTube for our weekly ramble stream.

SPEAKER_00 50:35

You can also find us at ramblestreampod.com and on social at ramblestream. We'll be back next week with more conversations, more stories, and of course, more rambling. And remember, many of those who ramble may very well be lost, but that's probably the point.