Jacquelyn Haley: Shamanism, Sister Miracles, and the Day the Tumor Disappeared

In this episode of AWAKEN, Ryan sits down with Jacquelyn Haley — hypnotherapist, counsellor, shamanic practitioner, reflexologist, nutritional diploma holder, and one of the most genuinely alive people to ever sit across from a camera in South Wales — for a conversation that starts with a tarot card prediction and never really slows down from there.

Jacquelyn's origin story is one of the most compelling in the field. She was a resort team leader traveling the world for a major tour company — not remotely interested in spirituality, loudly skeptical of anything she couldn't explain — when her sister was diagnosed with bowel cancer in 2007. A brochure arrived through her door for a hypnotherapy school that specialized in cancer care. She was pregnant with her first child. She rang them up anyway, promised she'd be there by December, showed up, and fell completely in love from the very first session.

What followed was a nine-year journey alongside her sister's cancer — multiple diagnoses, two major surgeries in six weeks, lung involvement, and then something her oncologist couldn't explain. Her cancer simply stopped following its predicted pattern. In 2016, she had her last bout. In February 2023, the NHS told her treatment was over — not because they'd given up, but because there was nothing left to treat. She now runs a Reiki practice and has a gift for mediumship that Jacquelyn says the trauma helped open.

The conversation goes everywhere it wants to go. Jacquelyn walks Ryan through the Incan medicine wheel — snake energy, jaguar, hummingbird, eagle — and how each maps onto the stages of healing. She describes seeing things around her clients during sessions and thinking she was losing her mind, until she stopped fighting it. She talks about a client with a brain tumor, non-epileptic seizures four to five times a day, who came in dragging his leg and left three sessions later walking normally — and then sent a WhatsApp photo of a letter saying the remaining portion of the tumor had disappeared. She doesn't claim credit for any of it. She just says: who knows.

She also talks about building a thriving practice without ever running an ad, buying a derelict old bus garage that her friends thought she was insane to want, and defining her business goal not as a revenue target but as being at every single school concert her children ever had. She made it to all of them.

The sun came through the closed curtains and flooded the room for the entire recording. Her dogs wrestled on the couch. Ryan drew the Six of Cups before they started. It felt like it was supposed to happen.

Three quotes from Jacquelyn worth writing down:

"When you can remove all the noise — guess what happens? You connect."

"If an emotion turns up in your body, it's saying: hey, I need your attention. You wouldn't leave a friend knocking at the door. So why do we do it to ourselves?"

"I never doubted for one minute that it wouldn't work. Not one minute. This is what I was going to do, and this is where I'm going with it."

Connect with Jacquelyn Haley: Instagram: @jacquelynhaleyhypnotherapy Facebook: facebook.com/jacquelyn.haley Jacquelyn is based in Swansea, South Wales, working one-to-one with clients in a city centre office. She is moving into a new space with a dedicated training room and will be launching group training and stage hypnosis shows in Wales later this year — collaborating with a singing client for combined music and hypnosis events. She is also training as a stage hypnotist with Dylan Lovejoy and in advanced techniques with Justin Tranz — reach out through her social channels for updates.

Connect with Ryan DeJonghe / TranceWell: Website: trancewell.help Email: ryan@trancewell.help

Transcript

0:02

Hello, friends, family. Thank you so much. Sincerely, thank you for being here with us today. And as usual, we have another wonderful special guest, Jacqueline Haley. Welcome, Jacqueline. Hi, thank you. All right. So let's just get to it. What got you started in all this uh hypnosis, the spirituality? What what like flipped the switch for you? My sister, who is now 54, was diagnosed with bowel cancer when she was 35. It's back in 2007. It was around the summer of 2007. I was already considering changing careers. Already considering it. This is quite strange actually. I never believed in anything spiritual. I was very clinical in my approach to everything. Never believed in anything spiritual. My family did, I didn't. And prior to her being just getting a diagnosis, I had been to a tarot pad reader here in Swansea, where I'm from. So I'll move into that in a bit. So when my sister got diagnosed with cancer, I'd already had this reading and I was told I was going to go into this route on a path of holistic alternative healing. And I thought it was a load of nonsense. I laughed. I laughed. I was in travel. I wanted to go back overseas to continue my career. I was very happy what I was doing. When she got diagnosed, little a few weeks after it, a brochure came through my door, um, hypnotherapy, a little catalogue. Because back then we didn't have Facebook and any of this marketing on my marketing. And I looked at it. It was based in Swansea, and guess what? They specialized in cancer care. That's what they did. So I rang up, I was pregnant at the time. My first child was, there's a year between them. So my first child was what, eight, nine months, and my I was I think I was um six months pregnant with my my son, and I rang up this lady, this training school, and I said, Look, I'm gonna be giving birth in September, but I'll be with you by December when your course starts. And she said, I thought you were crazy. And then I did. I turned up in in the December 2007 at the start of the course, and I absolutely I can't describe it, it was like falling in love. Like falling in love because I wanted to find, I mean, looking back, no, I must have been, I don't know what I was thinking, but I wanted to find some form of answer for cancer because if if hypnotherapy and everything is held in the subconscious mind, based on that theory alone, surely we can heal. And that's what I did. That's what I did. So alongside the hypnotherapy diploma, I also enrolled in complementary medicine in in a university near myself, and I just got to work with my head done all these rabbit holes. And one day, when I look at um the lady who did the tarot card reading, she said somebody in my family would become incredibly ill. She said that I would be the one that would support or needed. And that whatever the career I chose to do, I was going to become world famous, and I'm a worldwork thing. I guess in the world of hypnotherapy, we are all world famous because we all know each other in the field. Yeah, and maybe more to come. It's funny because before right before we got on, I don't know what made me think of this. I was like, well, maybe I'll do a tarot card reading and seeing how this episode would go. I I just want to say now, okay, I did go down the route then. Um, and again, no, you know, she she might have known, you know, all these excuses, you know, that I had very own real experiences. And I thought, well, I'm either going round the bend and I'm insane, as Western medicine would show us. Yeah. Or there is something out there, and I was shown, and they say you have a rude awakening. If you're not listening, you'll get slapped into it, you know. Yeah. And and something, something very interesting happened to me on a shamanic training course in 2010, and I couldn't, I just couldn't ignore what was out there. It was just impossible for me to ignore it. So, and that's what led me in. So I love now science, I love neuroscience. I'm so passionate about it, but I love my spirituality, and they have to meet in in the middle, they have to, you know. Yeah, they do what they do, you know. Yeah, and it's a blend of both. You used the word just like I do all the time, but I love neuroscience, but I also and it's like I love neuroscience and I love the woo. You know, I love both when they're complementary. And it's funny because the card I I drew for before here was the six of cups. I'm using the the Alistair Crowley one, the one that's and I just so I drew the pleasure, like how would this podcast go? And it's full of pleasure and pomegranates and conversations flowing. So yeah, and we got this light. Now, for those watching, um the light, I can honestly say it's not like this normally ever. And we we tried to close the curtains and it's still coming. Isn't that funny? Yeah, so look at the metaphor there, because you're in you're in South Wales there. And I don't think South Wales is known for its sunshine. I was gonna say if you can screenshot this, please, just for the future reference. And you can see my dogs wandering around in the background. Those are my little dogs, coconut, so you can see them. I love it when working with clients and other people, and when I see the animals appear, it's almost like they're acknowledging, like, what's up? Like you got the dogs kind of looking at that light. And like you said, it's never like that. And you drew the curtains, and it's still coming through. Like it's like you have no wall or window, it's just pure light coming through. They're all sh shut as well, so I don't understand why. And that's what's fun is when we don't understand, we're like, okay, we'll just go for it. And you mentioned you had you make some kind of stones and stuff. What what did you just make? I do um to be honest with you, cry crystals are the only thing, um, gems, that I'm not qualified in. I've never I think I've done it in a qualification with the breaky, but it's the only thing I'm not really I don't hold up a bonified qualification in it, but I just sort of not pre-girated stuff at my first shamanic training with that spiritual experience. They had a stone called Celeste. It was light blue. I don't know if you know of the stone, and I was like drawn to it like a little magpie, and I remember thinking, Well, these are so amazing. But if I could show you, I make them, I tend to make them if you've had a long busy day in work and it's been heavy and you've had a heavy time, you know. I tend to make them just really to get my head out of my a distraction, really. So, yeah, they I never sell them, I just make them. I'm always I never want to part with them. I kind of try to make creations and different different types of ones, but I never sell them. I got lots of them and I never put them. Anybody's interested in buying that. Yeah, yeah. Reach out to Jacqueline if you are. Yeah. But actually, I think with with gemstones, again, they say in my shamanic teachings, and one of my shamanic teachers is a professor. She teaches in our university, she's a doctor, runs a doctoral practice here in South Wales. And um, she believes that these like when we when we look at the way the shaman is supposed to believe, they present something like sorry, can you hear them? Sorry. Zoom does a good job of filtering that out. They're amusing to watch for those that are listening. Her dogs are just playful, they're just wagging their tail and wrestling on the couch. Looks like they've got to pivot. Anyway, so she believes that they've all got their energy, they've all got their own little beings and personalities. That's what the shamans believe. So she so when so when people don't want to part with the crystals, there's there's a meaning there. And then so how much later, after you went to that lady for the hypnosis, how much later did you do that shamanic training? Well, when I went, right, I I qualified as hypnotherapist in October 2008, and I went to the shamanic, it was 2010, and the reason I went is because things just have to happen. Because when you do your hypnotherapy training, for me personally, it's almost like I had this connection with my clients that I couldn't quite understand. It was almost like I could see where they were when they were in hypnosis. I know it sounds crazy. I thought I was going crazy, right? And I was like, what? And I had a lot of spiritual people on my university course, a lot of people who did cars and did things like this. And I never told anyone, I just used to sit back and observe and wonder. And by fate, somebody had mentioned this lady's name to me about shamanism training, and I thought, well, I like to delve into that more. Let's see how we can help my sister with the cancer, let's see what we can do. And that's where I went on it. So I was already a practicing hypnotherapist before I kind of studied all this stuff. So yeah. And can we talk about your sister a little bit? Like you went into hypnotherapy, she had the bowel cancer you mentioned, right? And so what what happened as you're developing your path? How was that affecting your sister? It was really hard. She she was diagnosed with bowel primary, and six weeks after she'd had surgery to move part of her bowel away, she was they discovered that it wasn't actually the primary source, it could have been the secondary, and that it was in her ovaries. So she got she had to go straight back in for major surgery and a hysterectomy. So she had two major operations in six weeks, all at the time when my my child, my little boy, was being born, you know. So it was um quite a manic, very stressful time for my family. So yeah. So with she went on, my sister went on to have cancer several times in the space of a few years, so it was very hard. So she but she did have a run where it was a couple of years where she was cancer free. We were working with a gentleman, his name is Michael Mahoney. You won't really see him in the groups around Facebook, but he runs a company called Healthy Audios. But he was my teacher in cancer and IBS. And when she'd had this worst diagnosis, so we got in touch with him, and I'll never forget what he said. He they'd given us so many months, you know, thought he was incurable. And his words were, who are they to play God? Who are they to play God? You may see me in the groups, right? And sometimes I'll gather my eyeballs about this. It's only because I've had this experience, this miraculous experience, you know. Even her oncologists don't know how she's still still here, you know. Um, but who are they to play God? And I was like, right, as soon as I heard that, I was like, Greg, let's get to work. Let's get to work. There will always be a way. And that's what we did. And it was the shamanistic one of the rituals that we trained in in 2010. I called on one of the ladies that I'd met in the training course. I said, we have to do this, we've got to do it. Come down. She travelled down from another part in Wales, and we did this real deep ritual on her. She just got better. We don't know to this day, was it that? Who knows? Who knows who knows? But she just got better. Yes, she had cancer again, but in 2016 was her last boat of cancer. So this journey of hers went on from 2007 till 2016. Um, it did continue, but her last boat of cancer was in the lungs, and she's been cancer-free all that time. She did have um a call from the NHS, our natural health service, in it was February 2023. And they told us she was not, I don't think they used the word cured. Some interstate treatment's over, no more, there's no more for her because she was done, you know, she was cured in a sense, you know, and now she does a lovely thing. She was she trained as a Reiki practitioner, and now she runs a little Reiki practice. She likes all the cards, and uh, she's very powerful in her mediumship skill, very powerful. And uh which I say trauma does bring that to you, doesn't it? You know, so right. There's something because you're talking about the diagnosis and the birth of your child and the you know life just really cranking up the volume. Yeah. And and there's something about that, it's almost like it it vibrates that shell outside of you, like you're the snakeskin, and like it vibrates the skin off so you can be new. Absolutely. And do you know when we do look at shamanic teachings? When I went on further to delve in a lot deeper into it, the we were training in the Incan way of shamanism. So our south, we have at the bottom of the south, is on the top, isn't it? Do you know when when you look when when we enter into a medicine wheel, and going off this isn't meant to be about hypnosis, but if this is stuck for me, we go into the medicine wheel and we enter on the south at snake energy, sasha mama, as they were saying, could you a sasha mama? We go into her energy and she sheds her skin. Think of a snake, the most vulnerable animal on the earth. Why? Because they walk on the belly of the earth, right? They shed the skin like the path, and then we move round the south to the west, where we meet then Sisteron Tarongo, the Jaguar energy. When we go through a pay, so if we had to look at this in terms of healing, like anything that we have to go into to heal in, we will always have to shed that past, whichever way we do it, into except whatever way we've shared that past. Then we take that and we move around to the west. Sister Ontarago teaches us to take that, and they use the rainbow bridge in this teachers across and they transmute it like the alchemists. So your pain was in an hour, yeah. And it takes it across the rainbow trans transmutation basically. We then go into the other part of the medicine, which is the hummingbird energy, which is set in court. We then teach, we then take what we've learned and we cross-pollinate a bit what we are doing now. We're teaching and showing others away, but then it goes into eagle energy. Where when you get into that space in your life where you kind of it just says an eagle, an eagle doesn't faff, it's hungry, so it will take the sheep. It just does, you know, it just says, but then as life happens, things happen through our life, and we were always we were always walking our meds, and we reach and we walk it, we get stronger and stronger. Yeah, that circle. I I love that. And with the all the animals and the shaman journey. On my own shaman training, they did a thing where we could find our spirit animal, and the thing that popped out to me, like it just it was like this foilage cover, this tropical foliage, and then it's separated and there's a spacus, and all of a sudden a toucan came out and made itself known to me. Yeah, and I don't know, I don't know what that means. Like, how does a toucan like two can I I learn when working with people's animal when that animal energy would come out, and again, when I'm in sessions, I might see an animal around someone. It sounds crazy. I used to think I was going mad, but and you're like, what does that mean to them now? Whereas I used to be there on my phone, animal medicine. What does that mean? Yeah, I stop now, and I I I know they people will come to me, they know I'm very spiritual. The ones I can tell when we we will go there, you know. But we'll we laugh about it, we say, right, what what does a tukan mean to you? What does it mean to you? What's the message that that that tucan has for you, you know? Um, what's you think if a tuka's got a big bird, big beak? I can imagine very inquisitive, yeah, very colourful, black. It could be balancing the this side of the world to that side of the world. I mean, it's so many different things. It'd be interesting to look it up for what it meant. And yeah, yeah, and the blue feet. I don't know. The weird blue feet. I don't know. Yeah, it's funny. The same thing is for the tarot. Like, I used to look up the books and try to figure out what each card meant, and now it's more of like an intuitive thing, like, oh, what's this? What's this, you know? You you you learn, and people I think with with the tarot, I think it's uh to me, it's uh a tool to connect you to the divine. And some people don't need to use the tarot and they don't read them, they just go straight there, you know. So but but move it but from that scenario when I did go into that first shamanistic training, I did think I was loopy-doo, and I started to see things around my sorry, that's sorry, that's a derogatory term, but uh but um I did start seeing things around my clients and seeing things within them, and again, I wouldn't talk to any about it because I was too was I embarrassed, yeah, I was embarrassed to talk about it. So I went this yeah, it's kind of this, yeah. It's like it's almost you mentioned that embarrassment to me, it's almost like almost like a fear, like you you your client, and then something pops up, and you're like, just like I did before when I was talking about that feels like the image that came to me was a snake, and you're like, Yeah, that's what we did, it was that snake, you know. So I didn't know you guys did a snake, it just came to me, and so sometimes I'm like hesitant, like this is weird, why would I want to say it? And then the more I lean into that and allow these weird things just to come out, it's like I don't know what this means, it's just coming, and then all of a sudden it'll be like, Oh, so like how can we strengthen that intuition? Yeah, I'll I'll I'll send you over after this. It's my um my meditation I recorded during COVID times, and it was about meeting your ancestors, about going to meet with them, and imagine that you're sitting around a fire with them and knowing that your stories are their stories, and it's like such a powerful suggestion. People will come out of there and go, Wow, I've I was doing this, I was doing that. It was like, yeah, you know, yeah, yeah. One of my favorites. It's weird and wonderful, and then we go back to the science because you're talking earlier about the neuroscience and then the blending with the woo. So, what's the neuroscience behind what's going on there? Like you mentioned your sister's now kind of intuitive, typing it, tapping into her psychic abilities as she's doing the Reiki. Like, what's the neuroscience behind that? Do you know with with that one? I will apologize. I have my post-menopause now. I get a bit of menopause brain. They do say that when you go through a lot of trauma, it does blow you open. Come connected. During my sister's journey, when she had her last oncologist, this last oncologist was of his he was Islamic, and he asked her what was her secret, because her cancer didn't follow a normal pattern. It went from A to B, back to Z, back to F. It didn't follow what they thought it should have done. And he asked her, What Julie, what is your faith? So I've said a name, I didn't mean to say a name, sorry, because I haven't asked her permission to talk, but anyway, what what's um what's your secret? And she pointed, God. That's all we have a very strong faith in God. I don't say I practice religion, I go to church, but I am have a deep faith in God, a deep belief in God and Christ, and that's what she turned to. When you look at how the Christian faith works, they would demonize people for doing psychic seventharats. Right. But getting back to your question, they do say that trauma she blows you open to that point. What I like to call this ground zero. When you're in that position in life, you've got nothing else to lose, nothing whatsoever. You go back to the very basics in life. So and so and so arguing, we mentioned the hypnotherapy groups earlier, it all becomes complete triviality. Nothing absolutely matters, and when you can remove all the noise, guess what happens? You connect to it where you're meant to be going. That's my personal thoughts on it, anyway. Yeah, it's like being reborn, like the being born again. Because you go back to that childlike nature of I wonder what's possible. That curiosity, that belief in Santa Claus. Yeah, well, you know, as as we go as we grow, as we are progressing through up through infants into childhood, we are living in that very much unconscious realm where children, if you watch children play in, watch them, and you say, Don't touch, that's hot. What did the child do? That's it, yeah. And they learn and they learn that and they know that that doesn't feel good, that really hurts. So they're not going to do it again, they're not gonna go and do that again. That's how we learn, isn't it? You know, we're very much in that realm, and in that realm, this is where you're you're of children with imaginary friends, or as like with me and my sister, we would be surrounded by animals growing up in a veteran. We thought that was normal. But yeah, but um neuroscience perspective of the there is actually been an interview by Dr. Tara Schwartz with Stephen Blake. I think is it Stephen? What's his name? CEO, Stephen. Oh, right, Stephen Bartlett, I think his name is. There is it, there is actually a interview with Tar Dr. Tara Schwartz. And Tara Schwartz says in the opening of this interview, I used to inject people and section people for what I'm about to share with you. And her husband passed away. Now she took it beyond because she saw her husband appear in front of her. She said, From the feet up, you disappeared. And she said, This is she knew what was real. So instead of her. Her asking for a sign, like some people do, she said, right, I'm gonna walk down this street a different way today. I want to you to show me ABC. So she now failed, she was seeing that, and she now she uh will category state that there is life after death. That is life after death, it does exist. Wow. But there it is. If you go on YouTube, there's loads of there's loads of podcasts, loads of videos by by professors who spoke about this, you know. So and you mentioned this, like I want to see ABC. I feel that ties into manifestation. Are you into that? Like manifestation. We could look at the neuroscience part of it and look at the rec is rectaling inactivating system or mirror neurons. I'm kind of very much into that too. Manifestation. But what I found lately though, and this is a really weird story, I've just got back in touch with a very old school friend. Now he's taken his studies beyond God and church. He got he's gone into another realm. I'll I'll share that with you as well later. But we talked about manifestations and things, and I told him about another friend I was looking to connect with to do some work in my house because I'm putting double doors in there to block this out. He's a carpenter. I haven't spoken to him for years. Ryan won't believe this. I got home that night from meeting my friend. There's a message from him in my inbox, sharing a photograph of me and one of our mutual friends who had passed away sadly two years ago. And remember this second and we and I text my friend, well, Bleebram. He said, I can't believe he said he's messaged you. I said, Yeah, but and that's been happening a lot lately. Yeah, it happens a lot when you pay attention to it. Yeah, that's that's the weird thing. Like I understand when we're talking about the reticular activating system, like I understand, like, okay, um, let's just say coins, like maybe that's believable. I I usually don't see coins, now activate it, and now I see coins. It's the weird stuff that you can manifest. For instance, me saying I want to see a truck with that's pink with white polka dots. Yeah, that's something weird that's not my reticular activating system, just noticing it, because in my 50 years of life, I've never seen a truck like that that I can even fathom. And then on my walk home, I usually do like I've done over 300 times. Up pops this fire hydrant that's pink with white polka dots. I've never seen it before, like I've never seen that fire hydrant before, never noticed it. And yet, there it is. You know, it's weird, it's not a truck, but still pretty cool. But it doesn't know you're you're the skeptics who are listening in, and then perhaps the same will say, Well, you probably spotted it a million times, but you've never really, and then when you said you said, Right, okay. And it's interesting why you come up with the pink spotty thing in the first place. I read it in the book, that's the thing. Oh, you read in the box, it wasn't right, okay. And then it wasn't. Yeah. Yeah. It's just weird, you know, and I've been playing with it. I just think when when when I see people in groups, who um I used to be quite passionate with this. I uh this is my story. I'm not wouldn't share my story, but this is my experience. And I used to feel I needed to tell people that you're wrong and I'm right. And but nowadays I don't do that anymore. I just let them, that's their journey. That's they don't believe it. That life has never shown it to them. Thank goodness it hasn't. They're not needed to be fine, you know. And um, but it's when you get the real I know, I know this is right. This research paper says, Well, how can you know? You can't know, you can't, you just don't know. How do we know? We don't know, do we? We don't. We don't, we can only work on our own experiences. And if those people they're going with it, this is because I know because this research paper, who's done the research? On how many people? How was the research conducted? Who was funding the research? Who let's research the researcher? Yeah, let's find out what their involvement is. So now I look at research a lot different, a lot different. I will delve, delve, delve, delve, and you'll always find a link back to something that that was a mandatory. And I'm curious on that about the manifestation, like it's tying it to our practice of hypnotherapy and seeing clients. There's one school that says you have to do it this way to do a lead magnet, do add paid advertising, strive to get your goals. And something tells me that you didn't do it that way. That you didn't do it the way everyone's talking about now. They're like, write a script, put out your, you know, this, do that, advertise, advertise, a formula. I don't, I mean, um, I've never done any of that. Actually, funny thing, I was on a call, I'm arranging if it's okay to say this, I'm arranging a training in the UK with Justin Trance in September, and we were on a call the other night, and um he said, Tell me, Jacqueline, what what why is your business so successful? Why are you so successful? I went, I never doubted for one minute that it wouldn't be. It never entered my head that it wouldn't be. I I'd come back from living overseas. I'd been working as a resort team leader for a very large tour tour um operation company. We had to get up and get on. We had no choice. If you ever started to moan about your job, you they would tell you to shut up and get on with it. A resort needed to be run. If the plane was delayed, you went to the airport with a little tough brush and your overnight back, and you and it was my job to deal with these 300 people that weren't going home that night. Um escape from a all these, you know, we just got on with things, and so coming back and being a mother to two small babies back to back was very easy compared to what I'd been doing. So with me going to university, getting my hypnotic diploma, I come out of university and I'm like that right, okay. I need a business premises. Where am I going? Met this this you talk about meant manifestation. In my head, I believe this is what was going to happen. I took an office on. I had hundreds and hundreds of hours of case studies to do for my degree. I took an office on. I put Facebook then was just become popular. It was 2008, I think. Yeah. I put a little advert out. I worked case studies for reflexology. I was doing then, reflexology. So all these people were pouring in, and all of a sudden, my little office had to become a well-being centre. I found this well-being centre, everyone thought I was crazy. It was an old run-down garage where they used to repair the buses many years ago. I said to the landlord, I love it. And my friends, you're crazy. I said, No, I love it. You can see that that's gonna go there. And I said to him, Can you do this up for me? Because I haven't got the money to do it. And he said, Yes, I'll do it for you. Did it? I wanted it to do it. And he did it, and he was lovely, beautiful. Um, but that's when things started to go a little bit wrong. It I was very, very out that I'm very this is what's gonna happen. People descended upon me with their opinions. You can't do that, even he just qualified. You can't, you can't, you can't, you can't, you can't. And you're solely but surely, Ryan. These energies wear you down, don't they? You know, yes. And eventually, and I I moved to a bigger premises again because we expanded again. And sadly for me, I didn't listen to my gut feeling with somebody I was going into business with, and yes, it was to my detriment that I didn't listen. My dad had just passed away, and I really I had to take a step back then. I had to take a step back, do things differently. I come home to work from home for a while, and then I went back out there to get an office. I've been there for a few years, I have a lovely office um in the city centre of Swansea. I'm really, really busy, which is great doing one-to-one clients, which I love. Um, so the next step for me would go out and teach in groups, but I love the connection between working with one-to-one. Um in the next few weeks, I am moving office again because I want something with my own training room in there because I'll probably be delving into training. Sorry, sorry. Um, and I didn't know where I was going to go. And one of my clients, he's from London, he went, I'll get you an office check. What do you want to have? And he's asked, he's built me an office in his in his in his big office. And when I got there the other day to watch his progress, um at low and low behold, at the other end of it is a small travel company with the girls that I just started my career up and traveling at the other end of it. And they were there to give me, oh, if you want trainings in London, we give you this connection of a hotel, you've got this one, da-da-da-da-da, and it's all really falling into place. So yeah. That's that's funny. There's like a little story there because at one hand, I feel very I resonate with that. At one hand, we try to control what the thing will look like. We're like, it has to be this, this, this, and this, and then something will come up and just fall apart. And then everything just falls together in unexpected ways. Like a client got you got your office, you got the travel company, and it's just like it it fell together even more perfectly than you could have imagined. Yeah, oh absolutely, because I because because with when we uh when we I when I put Justice course out there, it was fully bucked within 24 hours. All the places that we knew, small 20. There's other people trying to get on it. I said, Look, can we stretch to 30? It was like, well, no more, you know, we want to keep it a nice small kind of thing. And I thought, well, if we had a 30, we'd probably need a nicer hotel. We need to move it into a hotel. And um this guy, the guy who's going to be my new kind of landlord, I'll put you in touch with the guy who got the and that you did. That's what it flows with it, you know. We decided to keep it where we were, to be honest. We didn't want we wanted to keep it in the venue we've got because he's he's taught the people, he knows it, he likes it, you know. But um, but it was there for me, the opportunity was there for one today. However, if I decide to go further down the road and training myself, I've now got a lovely contact in in the Hilton Hotel in London and just by Heathrow. So I know that's there or what I may do in the future. So yeah, so yeah, so but getting back to it, was it manifestation for me? Because what the way I have been taught, and I've looked into manifestation, um, I'm a big fan of of Esther Hicks, Jerry Esther. Right, right. Which I hear a lot of sceptics calling them they're not real, though. But but the one of the best books I read was Ask and Is Gibbon. And it's I read that go way back. All my spiritual stuff was done back in 2008, 9, 10 when my sister was diagnosed up until 12. Um but yeah, I I never ever doubted myself for one moment, ever. This is what I was gonna do, and this is where I'm going with it, and this is where I'm when I go this year. I've got some some little tweaks I'm making to my career now for this year as well. I'll tell you that in a minute. But but yeah, I never doubted it for one minute. That's what I need to do. And and this is probably a message for the mothers out there. Now, when I see people that say to me, How have you got your clients and how what you do? My children are now 18 and 19. And obviously, they all you shouldn't always have to come first. If my career had taken off the way it has now, I wouldn't have been the mother I could have been to them. Because when I set my goal up for my business, everyone else was setting up the money they wanted to earn. And mine was like that. I want to be at every school concert for my children. I want to take them to school and pick them up from school every day. I need a full-time wage for part-time hours. And I need to be doing something where I'm so passionate about, but it comes from my heart that it that it it's it's a pleasure to go to work, you know, it's a pleasure to turn up, and that's what I did. So my achievement was, and I fulfilled my achievement at my last at my child's school concert a few years ago. Someone took a photo of us hugging. It was like, I've got you done it, you know. I want to be when my child look out in the audience, there's mum, she's there. Right. You know, that's what my goal was, and that's that's so beautiful. And part of it is you talked about it that trusting your gut, listening to your gut. Like our gut ever wrong, and how do we listen to it? That is a very good question because I look, I'm very big into my nutrition as well. Uh food affects me in a crazy way. Um I've had tests in last year and I now know why, I understand why. Sometimes if you've got that mind space that your head's not thinking or focused, you know, it's linked to our gut. So when we listen to our gut feeling, is it always correct? How healthy are we? This is just again my theory. I have not looked into science, this is just my theory. Because when I have a really good clean diet, and I've been done my C dipping and I've done my exercising and everything's great, I am in a I'm in a brilliant flow. And I'll feel people's energies. I'll feel it. So it's no more of a gut feeling, I just feel their energies, and I know and something is off. Some of this is disappointing to me. Not another one, you know. But it's it's and I feel it and I trust it and I go with it. The one time I didn't go without gut feeling was when I went to business with someone, it was in 2014. We were expanding, and my goodness, does she go to town with me? When we started this conversation for what was being recorded, we spoke about light and dark, didn't we? Manifestations. Some people will say in my journey, what were you doing to manifest that into your life? People are suffering already. Yeah, I I did it the other day, the manifesting. Um, I was like angry like about something, like I was running late, you know, the believing in the illusion of time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was just really into the illusion of this thing called time, and I was like, I'm running late, and I got I felt the anger, and then I was like, I'm gonna get in trouble with my boss. And then like I got there, and it's like I I it wasn't because I was late that I got in trouble, it's something for something else, and yet I feel like I manifested that. Yeah. And how we as society we manifest war because we might get angry at people cutting us off or saying mean things, and we get angry, and then I send that energy out, and it like accumulates like a cloud in the sky, and then it rains down war and divisiveness. And there was they did do some, um, I can't remember. I've I've read so much research over the years. There was a um somebody's just done there when when boxing fights, when there's a big boxing match on, the amount of domestic violence calls get mad during those times it was proven, you know. So I'm thinking, well, if we can do that through that aggression, surely we can do it through love. Yeah. So with you, you were getting angry yourself. I would say to when in the past, if someone shouted at you for not being on time, what was your fear within you? Right. Why, why would what was so frightening about you being being late? Because if it was somebody like me or someone else, we were like, like you tonight, no, I knew I couldn't get the computer on. I was like, right, just let you know I can't get the computer on, I'll be there as soon as I can. Yeah. And then I went off and did other things. But yeah, but you were gonna get into trouble. So you were gonna get into trouble from your from your boss if you were late, then that made frightening. Then when we feel like old stories, yeah, there's old stories, you know, of the past. Your little your little cells are going, hey, Ryan wants more anger. You want why is he s he's asking for anger? Right, let's send him some anger, let's give him some wants. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like we talked about transmuting earlier and then how we can like transmute anger. I like how some societies they look at these things we call it negative emotions, whether it's fear or anger or depression, we call you know, they instead they look at it as a gift. They're like, oh, I have some fear here. What does it look like? And how can we dive in and see what the gift is in this fear? Do you know when you look at it like that? I always say to my clients, you know, if an emotion turns up in your body and it's hey, I need your attention, you know, and then but if your friend turned up at your house, like, Ryan, I need to talk to you, you wouldn't go. Right. Knock louder and louder until you go, right, okay, come in, what's wrong? To a friend knock at the door, you'd be like, Oh my goodness, what I was like, so come in, let's put let's make a cup of tea, let's like some incense, let's you know what you do, and let's let's create a comfortable space and let's listen to what you've got to say. But with it when it's our own self, right? Our own critic, we're like, damn, not today, I can't listen to you, you know. And and then what happens? Bigger, bigger, bigger, next thing we're wondering why the volcano's exploding. And it reminds me when you're talking about the the friend showing up, we talked about church earlier. It's like Jesus talking about knocking on the door and bothering the neighbor in the middle of the night, hey yo, I'm hungry. Do you have some bread? Yeah, you know, yeah, yeah. So so you know, would you turn away from a friend? You know, you you for me if it depends what your boundaries are. But what I'm saying is when it comes to ourselves, we tend to put ourselves last, don't we? We do. Right. Now, speaking about God, you mentioned the G word a little earlier. What what's your impression now? What is it what do you call God? I still call God God. Yeah. Um, but I'm in the middle of studying something that takes it beyond now. I see so deal with um, I'm gonna look because my friend sent me the one I need to watch tonight. Sophia. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've never heard of this before. And looking at demiurges and the something like it's all on your, I'll send it to you later. Yeah, but also you've sent me something about how no one we talk about going to the light. Yeah. If you've ever spoken to someone about near-death experiences, going into NDs, when I've gone to conferences, because there's a lady here in Swansea where I live, called Penny, Dr. Penny, Satori, Santa Penny, you can't think, she was a nurse at work with the dye-in, and she's compiled so many stories and written a book, and she now presents, presents on it. I haven't been to one of her talks for a long time. And when I went to her first talk and she was speaking of what her patients had described as an NDE, I used to run meditation classes in 2011, 2012. And at the end of them, people like to discuss what they saw in their meditation. So we'd sit around the circle and we'd talk, you know. They all had very similar experiences, and what she was speaking about were an NDE. Very, very similar. Right. Same with people that do psychedelic stuff like shrooms or NDA and stuff like that. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just like it was it. And I remember speaking to the end, I I literally felt so emotional. I tears in my eyes, thinking, Wow, there must be some truth. What's going on? But as I catch up, my old school friend, he's like that. There is a fakeness around the light. I need you to look into that, which is about my next next study to go into look into somewhere. I said to I've got some time tonight. I said I'll I'll give you something I can watch I can settle into and then to watch it. But it's all to do with the Gnostics. Yeah, the Gnostics. With the text on the Bible, and yeah, and and Mary Magdalene, who she really was. And I can never say these scenes, that yes, the peaceful the scenes, yeah. Scenes, yeah. So yeah, so not delved into them for a long time. So yeah. Yeah, that'll be fun. And I don't know if you ever heard of the movie Mary Magdalene. I I viewed a bit, but I've never seen it. I'm not televisions, I have them, yeah, but I don't know how to work them, I don't turn them off. Yeah, yeah. It's probably pieces of it on YouTube. It's just it's funny because Joaquin Phoenix plays Jesus and his now real-life wife plays Mary Magdalene. And it's based, it's based off the Gnostic text, the Book of Mary. That's right. There's one, there's something I've my friend's just been um just found God, and she's been baptized into the church. I should always see her. She's so happy. The light in her eyes, she's lovely. She thinks what I what I do is demonic, though. She thinks hypnotherapy is demonic. Yeah, that's a struggle. Like, even I was having dinner with my family, my sister, she's very devout Christian. And I said, I want to make a Bible tarot cards. Bible tarot cards. Oh, you mentioned that. And then she's like, Oh no, not not tarot. Can't you use another word? It's like I don't recall the Bible ever talking about tarot before. You know, it's just like you said, it's to like connect with consciousness, connect with who you really are, like an excuse to be present. And then so I used it this morning. I was like, I just used the Bible as a tarot deck, you know, and I was like, okay, what's the what do I need? I have I feel the sensation that's troubling me, and then ju ju, boom, and then it was like the perfect passage to deal with that. Yeah. And there's there's um something I um read, yeah. I I I every year I go to start a little course in miracles. Yeah, yeah. I've not done it yet. But again, that's from what I've I've read the opening chapters, I've not got into doing the things every day. Yeah. And uh one of my great teachers is a lady called Wendy Weber. Ever get a chance to look at Wendy on the show, she's amazing. Uh I write it down, yeah. But she, you know, quotes it quite often, and um but th these were two psychiatrists or psychologists who suddenly started to get downloads from God. Yeah. And live life. And when you get the book, The Course of Miracles, it's actually like the Bible, it's like very thin pages. Um Um bit like a what you would see in a Bible. And um I've like I said, I've read the chap the opening chapters as to why it came around. I've just not gone actually gone through the theory. Well you could you could join me. I have uh I have to yeah. Yeah, I have um I haven't set up any groups for people, but I set it up by an email. So you put in your email address and then I have it set so every day you'll get the next page and then just my my interpretation of what it means, what I've experienced. So 365 days. I'm on day like 57 now. You did tell me this, and I don't I don't know what happened. I don't think why I'll I'll post it more this week. I'll post it more. But yeah, it's it's incredible. What I like about how it came about. You mentioned the psychologist there in Colombia, and Helen, she was a devout atheist. That's what I remember now. She was an atheist, and then she started hearing the voice of God and Jesus, and so all throughout the Course of Miracles, you hear about God and Jesus and the spirit, and yet it has a little different meaning to it, like when you really let it sink in. Yeah, do you know what I mean? Reminding me now I got back into it because I was brought up in the church, I was one of the only walt altar girls in Wales because they were boys, so it was me and my friend used to be altar girls until we were 16. And there was sadly a paedophile in our church who got convicted, and um so that kind of turned me away from the church, you know. I didn't want to know anything about it. And um when I came back to the UK to live, my auntie gave me a book. My auntie got me to Crystals actually. My auntie gave me a book, and um, she was the psychic one in the family, and she gave me this book by um he was a pastor, I can't think of his name now. It wasn't Neil Donald, Norman Vincent Peale. Oh, yeah, give me his book, and moving back here, we'd moved into this house, there was so much work to do on it, and the children were little, I was in university, they found a nominal tumor in my foot which had to be operated on, and there was so much going on in this like short space of time, and I thought maybe now is the time to read that book. I had this thing about God and Jesus, I didn't want to go there, you know. But um, uh so I was reading the book, and I don't know if you've ever read that book, his book, and it was like he'd give you exercises and mantras, and I swear, honestly, things started opening up for me like nothing before, and my heart was whirring, I was like getting these instant feelings of joy. I love swimming excess by swimming. I was going into the pool and I was swimming, and uh people that always the same gang every morning they'd be going to me, why are you smiling? What are you smiling about today? Come on, and it continued, and I'd be like swimming away, smiling away. I had these two mantras that I would do every single day, and it was going, if God can be God be for me, who could be against me? And I can do all things through Christ which strengthen me. And I would say them as I was swimming, and I would be oh, I would feel an amazing, and I realized that oh wow, there is some truth in this because I feel great, I feel great, might have been because I've been swimming so fast, I don't know, but yeah, it was great, everything was great, you know, and uh and and sweet in that like difficult time we were going through, that it it keeps you afloat when you're going through tough times. And when my father had this back in 2016, my father had a stroke which left him hemiplegic overnight. And my dad was a big strong man, and um yeah, we were very close. And my sister had her cancer come back in her lung. So on the around the time he told her he'd never walk again, she had this diagnosis, and I remember being in work because I was working with clients, and I said to my friend, How am I supposed to cope with this? I remember having my hands in my head, what am I supposed to do? How do I get out of this one, you know? And back to swimming, back to the mantra, back to the good diet, back to my own hypnosis practice. I mean, at the time I wasn't in groups and I didn't really know any hypnotherapists around me to help me. Um, so my friend was a reflexologist, she's like, right, get on the couch, we're gonna be doing these weekly treatments for you, and it was everything which fell into one for me, which got me through that time, you know. So practice what you preach, you have to do new. So it's not and I say to my clients, it it's this is doesn't come from a professional point of view and years of study, it comes from a personal point of view, because whenever I've needed something in my life, it's always been hypnotherapy, diet and nutrition, and movement that gets me through everything, you know. So yeah. And it's funny you're talking about this cycle, how we're at this like peak, you know. I love the metaphor too of the swimming, you're floating, and and then it's like you're being pulled under the water by the heavy weight of this life, and then and then you like just even though the weight feels like it was pulling you, you somehow are letting go of the weight, and then you start floating back to the top again. Yeah, yeah. And and like I said to the start, you know, there is always a way we absolutely can. That is my belief, we absolutely can. Um, but we've got to keep believing in our hearts, we've got to keep knowing that this is a magical, it's magical. And and when people dismiss it, I mean, why would you miss dismiss something that that has been created for us and it's just so magical and we can, you know. I'm not saying I live in Lala Land, I don't, you know. I will I will come down to 3D world if I got to, but no. But I you know, I am practical, you know, I know, but but when someone comes in and they you know, I don't know what your client range is, but I work with complex trauma, and sadly the majority of them are coming suicidal when they come in. I'm not sure we talk about my clients, sorry, but let's the less general, you're just just popular. And when when people come in to me and they tell me, you're my last hope. If you don't work, I don't know what I'm gonna do. They've been everywhere by the time they get to a syndicate, they've been all around the Mulberry bush, as we say here in the UK, everyone. Yeah, and they come to me and I'll say, Well, you've tried that, you've tried that, you've tried this. Let's try this, shall we? Let's do it this way that let's do it this way. And uh still that's a very Eric Sonian too, because he had a lot of people that other psychologists said, Oh, they're hopeless, they're you know, there's no saving them, just lock them up somewhere. You know, if we don't lock them up, they're going to commit suicide. And then they come to him, he's like, Well, you know, and he takes their again. We talk about the alchemy, he takes their what is what they perceive as their biggest weakness, their biggest flaw, and he's like, Huh, let's just play with it a little bit. Oh, look, if you turn it this way, it's actually a superpower. Yeah, yeah, just re-reframing it. And this is why I'm so excited. I brought Justin in a few times. I'm just so excited to train with Justin because I think over the years I see hypnotherapy watered down, and I know that we've spoken a lot about spirituality and not so much hypnotherapy through through this conversation, but it opens us up in so many different ways because we are working with the psyche, we're working with the mind, we're working with the spirit, we're working with the soul. I that to me, there's no other way to look at it. But for I trained with Dave Ellen, I did Elman, not with Dave Elman, sorry, I did Elman's training. My training was very much based on Eric Sonian teachings. Um that what I've just said is probably it sounds very much like something Eric Sony would have said, you know, I probably have I was quite obsessed with him when I was training. I delve into Arcus and find all his videos and watch it talking, and I learned I loved it. I my favourite is Jay Haley and Common Therapy. I loved his, I love listening to his version of um Eric Stone. Anyway, but when I did my Elman training, it was back in 2019 with a lady called Beryl Coomer, wonderful lady, wonderful name on our in our field. And I loved my teacher, my original teacher as well. He was very much like this, go there, why not? You know, and and she reinstilled that confidence in me that don't be fine to go there. And I had a very miraculous story. I was working with a guy at the time who had um a brain tumour. He had a brain tumour and he was having four epileps, four to five epileptic fits fits a day, um non-epilectic fits. So I have a diploma in keto, the diet ketogenic diet in, and a lot of nutritionists frown upon it. It was originally brought into its research in the 50s, it did in my research shows me by looking at its work within non-epileptic fits and that that kind of thing. And um, so we looked at tweaked his diet. Um, nutrition is part of my degree as well, so I'm I've got a qualification. So we tweaked his diet. I sent him, I made him my his own hypnotic meditation and we got to work with him just doing that home, first of all. Then he started to come and see me, so he'd bring in balance in through reflexology. He was dragging his leg, he couldn't get out of my driveway when he first started coming here, he couldn't walk properly. His lip went away, just went through doing his scan, start a treatment with me. The tumour he'd had an operation on it, and there was a tiny bit in his brain that they couldn't quite get because of the because it was too dangerous to operate on. When we did the regression part on him, and I'm talking openly because he's let me in massive beautiful review on my Google. Um, when we when we did the regression, it came out not only had he been through a lot through his time spent in the Navy, something quite traumatic. He was witnessing something quite traumatic when he's younger, involving a family member. And it all just made sense to him. So we did the healing through regression. It was incredible. You he he did need to see me again after the three sessions of that with me. He didn't need to see me again. This was kind of in the November time, and I used to have a dog here called Elmo, and Elmo was like a therapy dog. And um, when he finished working with him, my my dog actually passed away. He had cancer suddenly and passed away. It was really strange. So when this gentleman left his review, we had a picture with my dog. He said that was my boy, my boy, he said, my best friend in the sky forever. Now, fast forward into March, it was just before COVID happened. I used to be a coach for business whales here in the UK. And we were sitting in a meeting, and I said, I've really got to take this call because this call was coming through, and I thought I really need to take this call. And he went, check your WhatsApp. And I looked, you wouldn't believe this. A letter. That part of the brain that the tumor was. Yeah. Let's say it disappeared. Gone. Wow. Who knows? You know, who knows? Who knows? Yeah. Like if we start to take credit for it, it loses its significance. When we leave it up to the mystery, it's even more Yeah. So, anyhow, so I don't I don't want to take everyone's time. This has been an incredible journey. I want to I do want to touch on hypnosis just a little bit. Yeah. What would you say was your big aha moment? I think maybe at the beginning you're talking about maybe a little bit of skepticism in it, or what when did the like it just totally changed for you? Like, oh, this this makes sense now. I'm gonna say you're right, which is not the answer we're looking for. It does I do it every day. So it flips every single day of me. When did I switch with that? I think it the first session I fell in love. I just fell in love the first session. I can't explain it. I just fell in love on my first training. Yeah. First hypnotic experience I had, I was in love. And it was like when we'd meet up, then the monthly trainings I went on, you know, every month, I'd be like, I'm sorry, girls, boys, out of the chair, I'm first, I'm in. Yes, I'm there. And that's something I wouldn't normally do, but would it probably from the very first lesson? The very first lesson I had, I was like, I'm all in here, I'm all in. Honestly, say every week someone comes to an end with my program. And I you know I could cry now, my heart fills with joy. Honestly, when they walk out of my office to see when they come in, when they first come in, and they're just laughing at life. Life's incredible for them, they're great, they feel amazing doing that journey. My heart, my little heart, honestly, just every time every every week, I am I never taken it for granted. Ever. Ever. And every day is like the win for me. So yeah. And that's why the sun is shining upon you. Super clear. Yeah. Before we let you go, do you have anything that's bubbling up that you would like to let the whole world know in this moment? I'm really excited about it. I'm going to train as a stage hypnotist with Dylan Lovejoy um in May in London. And if anyone's watching this, Social Spaces. I can't wait. I'm really excited. And um, I have a singer, one of my clients, it was an incredible story. She's now a singer. She's released some some what do you call them today? Hits tracks, how do they name them today? She's she had a break in her career, she's been to me. Anyway, let's put it this. It's going back in the right direction. We're going to be teaming up doing shows with her singing and me doing stage. And then I'm going to train with Justin, which is only going to enhance that in London in September. So this year, by by the time I finish training with Justin as well, we're going to be launching into some stage shows here in Wales, where I am. And who knows what I'll end up with the world, you know. But uh, my new office, so deep deeper into training. Diamond deeper training and and and some stage work. So I'm really excited about the forthcoming year. Yeah, that is exciting. And we'll be sure to have all your contact info in the comments and the description. And thank you so much for being here. You're welcome. Thank you for having me. Thank you so much. It's been lovely. Thank you.