15 minutes with...Dan Smith

In this episode of 15 Minutes With, CLA Midlands Regional Director Sophie Dwerryhouse sits down with Dan Smith — a self-described "farmer-ish" from Monmouthshire who's been making waves across the sector.

Dan shares how the Company of Rural Leaders (CRL) programme gave him the confidence to push beyond his comfort zone, leading to a life-changing Nuffield Farming Scholarship. His study, Generation Regeneration, took him to Brazil, Canada, and New Zealand — and fundamentally shifted how he approaches farming, food systems, and leadership.

From his evolving views on regenerative agriculture to his new role as a director of the Oxford Farming Conference, Dan makes the case for profitability without apology, the power of networks, and why agroforestry might be the one idea the UK should adopt.

In this episode:

• How CRL kickstarted Dan's leadership journey
• Applying for a Nuffield Scholarship with "not an ounce of belief"
• What three months travelling the world taught him about UK farming
• Why he now has a "love-hate relationship" with regenerative farming
• His role at the Oxford Farming Conference and having a seat at the table
• Why farmers shouldn't be embarrassed about making a profit

Transcript

15 Minutes With Dan Smith

SPEAKER_00 0:01

This is fifteen minutes with from the Country Land and Business Association in this edition. CLA Midlands director Sophie Dwerry House talks to the field scholar Dan Smith about his farm in Monmouth, the power of building a network, and what he's learned about our globalized food network.

CRL & Leadership Journey

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Welcome, Dan. I'm delighted to have you with us. We met a few years ago on the Worship of Company of Farmers Challenge Aurora Leadership course that we were both lucky enough to attend. And goodness me, you've been super busy since and hitting the headlines everywhere in our sector. But for those who don't know you, who's Dan Smith?

SPEAKER_02 0:41

Yeah, CRL, that was quite cool. I'll just do that quickly as you've mentioned it. I am a farmer down in Monmouthshire. Uh, and we've recently taken on a 15-year tenancy on a 200-acre land, and I just actually describe myself as a farmer-ish, because you're right to identify that I've got quite a few different things going on. That's a kind of a conscious decision at the moment. And CRL really for me was the kind of kickstarter of that for lots of reasons.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Brilliant. And if I could sort of bounce back to that course, did it change anything personally for you or shift how you sort of think of leadership, I suppose?

SPEAKER_02 1:22

Yeah, leadership's an interesting one in that I guess I was doing a bit of that. So I at the time I was managing a charity farm where we had lots of they're described as disadvantaged, but I'm not or underprivileged. I don't really like either of those things. Um, but I guess in that role, I was doing quite a lot of sort of leadership stuff as well as quite a lot of regenerative farming stuff. I was really embedded in the industry at sort of at that level and and loved it. CRL opened up a world of like really capable people doing really great things and this kind of a really strong network of people that I could bounce ideas off. And actually, to be honest with you, some of them kind of has inspired me to kind of push on and challenge myself a bit more, certainly knowing that they were the kind of we've got a group of cheerleaders in the background kind of championing us as well. It gave me quite a lot of confidence. And actually, I'd realised a part of the work we did with these children was to kind of build them up and send them off the farm, a kind of better version of themselves. That's how we used to describe it. And and and after CRL, I kind of realised that I was a bit of a hypocrite in that world and that I hadn't really done that for myself for quite a long time. And that's when I kind of made a conscious choice to get involved in all of these other things because I felt that that I could see the benefit for others and that I was helping others do that, but but to some degree, where where was I going with that?

The Nuffield Scholarship

SPEAKER_01 2:48

I think that was a very honest sort of description, and I totally can agree and sort of understand where you're coming from with that. It's just it was an absolutely fantastic opportunity, wasn't it? And definitely can concur. So you're going on from that, you fairly swiftly applied for a Nuffield scholarship. And I'm just wondering what motivated you to do that.

Generation Regeneration

SPEAKER_02 3:11

Yeah, it was that kind of there was actually a very vivid point where I was putting in a new gate on a new hedge with these young lads. And these young lads had they were from a school in Leeds where they'd come to us because there'd been sexual assault on females in in school, and it was all this kind of Andrew Tate era. It was pretty rough stuff, and and and that we were having these great conversations with these kids, and then literally I just remember thinking, I'm such a hypocrite for telling these guys that they could go on and like conquer the world and they can do anything if they sort of open their minds a bit or challenge themselves, and I was like, I I really need to do this. I applied for Nufield with not an ounce of belief that actually I was going to get it. I'm not saying mine is worse than anyone else's, but as someone who very much dropped out of the education system way too early and doesn't have any formal education, I kind of I've always really felt like a imposter. So all of these things that I've applied for, I never thought I'd get. And then all of a sudden, you get this letter, you've been accepted, you've been granted enough field, and yeah, to be honest with you, I sort of haven't really looked back since then. It was a brilliant experience that I'll be forever grateful for. And the other thing it did, it combined my two passions. So my title was Generation Regeneration, so combining regenerative farming and the future generations. And I've got loads of conclusions that I talk about in my report. Anyone's welcome to read it. But actually, the the biggest conclusion for me is that I know loads more than when I started my Nuffield, but I also know a lot less about so many things. And as someone who'd never traveled out of Europe, it completely opened my eyes to so many things, and I just approach things in different ways now, I think.

SPEAKER_01 4:59

But this, you you've really made the best of those opportunities, haven't you? And it's just brilliant. And I think you would say anyone if it's silly a boots, take those opportunities.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

Yeah, absolutely. Challenge yourselves, try and push on. I cannot tell you how humbled I've been by the generosity of people around the world. Now I did three, over three months away travelling, and only for 12% of the nights did I stay in hotels. The rest of the time I just stayed with farmers, I stayed with people, and it's that thing of networks again. I really didn't understand the kind of a power of a network. And now, now not only do I understand it, but I also really enjoy it. And the fact that we can go around the world with my family now, visiting people and stuff, it's just it's in good good people, it's pretty amazing. And likewise, we love hosting people here. I did uh we worked out, we'd have 32 different people come and stay. It was our first year on this farm, 32 different people last year through Nuffield or other networks, and I love it. I learn I learn so much from from being around other people.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

Yeah, it's extraordinary, and that being able to get back is it's a lovely feeling, isn't it?

SPEAKER_02 6:13

Yeah, for sure. For sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:15

Whereabouts did you go on your travels?

SPEAKER_02 6:18

Uh so I had a month in Brazil, month in Canada, a month in New Zealand, a bit within Europe, and actually quite a lot within the UK, which I think is really powerful. I basically use it as an excuse to see all the people who I didn't think would really ever want to see me. And it was a yeah, amazing experience. And I would I'm a huge advocate of it, and I really, yeah, I wish more people would sort of push themselves into it because there's loads of really, really good farmers who who I think would really benefit from it.

SPEAKER_01 6:48

What surprised you most obviously talked about the network, and I can imagine, and having now known you from the start of our journey in this sort of sphere, if you like, besides that, what that's opened up to you, is there anything else particularly that would surprise you?

A Globalized Food System

SPEAKER_02 7:04

Yeah, I think what surprised me and actually changed our business is the real understanding that we're in a globalized food system and we talk about food security, we talk about whether the UK are doing this, whether the UK are doing that. And to be honest with you, it's not that I don't like that conversation. I just view it from a completely different way. I've stood in these huge, great big arable fields in Canada and Brazil where they're doing it really, really well and peer and productive. And I come back to one of our arable fields is nine acres, and I'm a little bit like, well, why am I even bothering? I just think it's approaching problems with a slightly different view because I have more of an understanding than than I did. The other thing is so this regenerative farming thing, whereas actually two, three years ago when I started it, I was really like passionate about it, and there was quite a lot of movement there, and a lot of my networks of people I really, really respect would kind of be identifying within that. Now I have a complete love-hate relationship with it. It's changed so much in in that time and doesn't really it doesn't really stand anymore for what I believe it to be. So I kind of there's quite a personal struggle there, and I don't think things necessarily need defining, but also it meant it meant so many different things to different people around the world. So now I just sort of say, well, I'm just trying to be a better farmer than perhaps I once was.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

And I think very open-minded.

unknown 8:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:33

Probably more open-minded than you were, I reckon.

SPEAKER_02 8:36

Absolutely, yeah, absolutely. Being inspired by some like really, really decent people who, and actually, one of the things I think I say in my report, I certainly did in my speech, is that I found the best information, the best learnings I had who were from people who thought my topic was like complete nonsense. Who get in the bubble of just listening to people who agree with you, and now I really actively try and step outside of that. It was a conscious decision, really.

Agroforestry: One Idea to Adopt

SPEAKER_01 9:05

And that's really satisfying, isn't it? If there was one idea from another country that the UK should adopt, any thoughts on that?

SPEAKER_02 9:16

The thing that impacted me the most, actually, we've just done a bit of it here now. It's a very small thing, but trees within farming and agroforestry, I saw so many examples of it around the world where not only, I mean, I love the environmental stuff, I'm a nature, all that, it's what gets me going. And also, I do think that one of my other learnings, just briefly, is that farming should be fun. It should be joyful. We should enjoy being on our farms and we should feel invested in them. And I'm not always sure that that's the culture that we're in at the moment. The agroforestry, to me, everyone I visited, not only were they making money and in being profitable, but they also had a slightly broader vision. And I actually I I really kind of enjoyed being around those people. So that yeah, that's one of the things that we that we brought back, absolutely.

Oxford Farming Conference

SPEAKER_01 10:00

Cool. Moving on, you've just become a director of the Oxford Farming Conference. What does that role involve?

SPEAKER_02 10:09

Yeah, so that's me, that's me pushing myself out of the out of my comfort zone and out into rooms that I wouldn't necessarily feel I that I would sit in. Certainly more my kind of my tribe for one of a better description would be in ORFC, if I'm honest with you. I see the OFC as where the change is actually made and where the people are in the room who can who can enact change. And again, that's been a learning from me. Policy controls everything. I really wasn't aware to the extent of that in Tilnufield. If you're you haven't got a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu. And I kind of want to represent the people who more like me or are in similar scenarios to me, and I want to have a seat at the table to kind of put my view and potentially their view across. And I said on my interview to you that I'm the most unqualified person to fulfill this role, but I'm prepared to kind of try. And it's great I get to sit on the council with some really, really capable people, again at another network in terms of what it involves this year. So the one that's just been, I describe myself as in charge of opening doors and smiling at people, but actually it's you're, I mean, you're involved straight away. You're organizing some of the programs and really looking forward to next year. And it's a three-year term, and I'm very lucky to that there's three each year, and I've got some great people alongside me, and hopefully one of one of us will be here chair in in 2029. I'm really enjoying it. And again, it's one of those things, it's well outside my comfort zone, but I'm learning, I'm learning so much from from the kind of comms piece, and yeah, it's great.

Industry Conversations & Policy

SPEAKER_01 11:52

Um going on from that, what conversation do you think the industry should be having right now?

SPEAKER_02 12:01

Oh, great question. Again, to the policy piece, it's so it's really hard to farm and to work within an industry that that just feels so unsettled. But I think that that is broader. And one of the conversations I keep trying to have with with people, or even just we're quite like stuck in a trench of of agriculture, and I think sometimes we need to look outside of that to actually see what's going on in other industries or or kind of barriers that other people are facing, and trying to look where we sit well, where we sit into that. There's quite a lot of funding issues, but actually, there's a lot of people who are looking for funding, and kind of we're in a scenario that we've we've been quite comfortable for a long time, and it's really hard at the moment, and I think that's a huge shame, and I really think the policy has played into that, but equally, I think we need to start start being a bit more robust within ourselves in industry. And I'm not saying that's easy. I think the supply chain has a lot of responsibility in that. I now work a little with a lot of players in the supply chain and and really enjoy it, but some of those conversations are quite uh quite tricky because of uh there's just a kind of not a misunderstanding, but a miss of understanding between between players. A good friend of mine actually described it as the supply chain has Stockholm syndrome farming. We we're kind of infatuated with it and we don't know how to same as like people selling us stuff, and yeah, we're in quite a funny scenario, which is why we gear our our business. I no longer, thanks to Nuffield, take responsibility for trying to feed the world that I now have responsibility to have a profitable business and look after my family. You know, that was quite a liberation to some degree in how we operate, I think.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

Yeah, and profit profitability is just it's at last a buzzword, isn't it? For sure.

Closing

SPEAKER_02 13:58

And I see so many why why are we as farmers, why are we embarrassed about making a profit? It doesn't seem to make any any sense to me. It's just changes around that sort of stuff. I think farming needs a lot of support, but I'm not sure it's just as obvious as it might appear with kind of monetary support. I think there's a the things like RCF and you know, they're doing loads of good work, and we we need to support that on a kind of revenue basis as well.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

Thank you so much, Dan. We could talk for hours, and we often have in the past, and I look forward to doing so again in the future. But I think we're probably on time for today. And I just want to say a massive thank you for you coming along and giving your time up and for listeners, and best of luck with everything going forward.

SPEAKER_00 14:44

That was 15 minutes with. If you enjoyed the podcast, why don't you leave a review on your podcast platform? See you next time.