In the last few years, the fracking industry has boomed, leading many—including the President—to declare that soon America will be energy-independent, and free of the influence of foreign oil and gas suppliers such as Saudi Arabia and Russia. Not so fast, writes business journalist Bethany McLean in her book Saudi America: The Truth About Fracking and How It's Changing the World. Just as she revealed that Enron looked too good to be true in her 2003 bestseller The Smartest Guys in the Room, McLean connects the dots to show how this burgeoning industry poses a threat to Saudi Arabian and Russian energy dominance, with possible repercussions for our own politics. This discussion between McLean and All the Devils Are Here co-author Joe Nocera will persuade you to think about the power of oil in a new way.