019 The Truth About Spiritual Awakening with Pamela Downes

From Corporate Life to the Great Council of Light: Embodiment, Intuition, and the Next Phase of Spiritual Awakening

Dr. Toni Reilly is joined by Pamela Downes, founder of Spirit Calling, to explore Pamela’s shift from corporate life into soul-path healing, coaching, and channelling what she calls the Great Council of Light. They discuss how spiritual awakening moves from seeking external answers to embodiment, living the guidance, not just hearing it, and how intuition can override logic once it’s trusted. 

Pamela shares what the Council feels like to her and describes intense energy experiences on major podcasts where the equipment malfunctioned during channelling. They also reflect on younger generations who default to intuition, and on common misunderstandings of spirituality as “instant enlightenment” rather than repeated choices between love and fear. 

00:00 Podcast Welcome

00:34 Meet Pamela Downes

02:00 From Corporate to Soul Purpose

05:27 Channeling to Embodiment

10:22 Trusting Inner Guidance

11:55 Breaking the Box

14:45 New Phase of Authenticity

19:57 Reframing Channelling as Streaming

20:51 Council Encounters In Between

23:28 What the Council Feels Like

27:02 Energy on Big Podcasts

30:19 Sceptics and Credibility

31:19 Communicators and Adaptability

32:19 Mirroring Communication Styles

32:58 Stop Seeking Go Within

35:13 Gen Z Intuition Shift

39:34 Elders Wisdom Gap

42:25 Womb Healing Activation

46:29 Teaching Soul Path Coaching

50:34 Spiritual Path Misconceptions

57:27 Closing Resources Next Episodes

Connect with Pamela Downes using these links:
Web https://spirit-calling.com/
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@spiritcallingpamela
Instagram https://www.instagram.com/spiritcallingpamela/

Schedule a conversation with Dr Toni
https://calendly.com/tonireilly/scdtalk

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

This is the Soul Life Psychology podcast where intuition meets logic. I'm Dr. Tony Riley. Today I'm joined by Pamela Downs. Pamela is a multidimensional soul-body healer, trans channeler, and a founder or the founder of Spirit Calling, a global community supporting people through spiritual awakening. And her work focuses on helping people clear deep imprints, reconnect with their inner guidance, and understand who they are beyond what they've been taught to be. Before stepping into this work, Pamela came from a corporate background and made the decision to leave that life and follow this compulsion that was calling her. She now works closely with what she describes as the Great Council of Light, translating that guidance into something people can actually understand and apply in their lives. I'm excited to find out if the Great Council of Light is the same as what happens when people come for past life regression and end up in the in-between phase. Um, and come and meet with the council.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

What's the definition of insanity?

SPEAKER_02 1:20

Pamela, I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Welcome. Meet you.

SPEAKER_01 1:24

Oh my gosh, I'm so excited to be here. You and I met, and it was just an instant connection, and we couldn't wait to start having our conversations and sharing them with our community. So thank you for having me, Tony. I'm very happy to be here.

SPEAKER_02 1:39

Oh my goodness, I've got so many questions. I'm so excited that you come from a corporate background, and it's probably not dissimilar to me coming into this realm that was so unfamiliar. And yet um it was unavoidably calling, and it just felt good to follow it. So I wonder if you would go back to before you came to be called to channel the Council of Light and let us know where you came from, what happened.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

Yeah, what was life like before the Great Council of Light? It's interesting because they they do and are so present in my life now that that's a very interesting way to present it. Um for a very long time, like you said, I was in a certain uh I call them avatars now. I call them whatever comes to my mind at the moment. But yeah, I was a certain version of myself. And that happens when we're journeying on life's path and through the different seasons of who we are and how we change and how we evolve and how we grow. And I didn't know the council was going to be a part of my future, and I know you didn't know your work was going to be a part of yours. We are just born with this bag of you know, the unique qualities and attributes that create us, and we take them with us and we do our best and we achieve and we create and we connect and we work and um we share and we love in our journey the way that we know how to at the time. And but underneath all of that is really the core of who you are, and that at the moment through most of my life, I didn't know was my soul, my program, my spirit, the essence and energy of who I was. It was sort of buried under all those other layers of the ion of musician, artist, mother, daughter, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know, business owner, employee, um, trainer, like all this stuff. And when I had the shift and the purpose part of me with my soul, I always was purpose-driven when I was with in my in the capacity of leading my company because I always knew that I connected with a certain kind of company leader, um, business owner. I was able to connect because I had that creative intuitive part of me that was pulling on some of those things that I have now that are my skills that have been more expressed. But I always knew that I had a purpose in helping, say, nonprofits be able to articulate their message or or their brand or their marketing because I knew how to work with color and I knew how to work with words, and I knew how to work with photography, and I know how to get the best bang out of a budget for them, and I knew how to help them with the pieces they needed to communicate what they did to the world. So I had all of those kind of skills that cultivated and got, you know, better and better and better through my life. And I still have that purpose part, but the soul's driving it with now this awakened part of me. So that's what that's what happened. It's like, it's like um, you know, you just start working in a completely different way, and the pulls and the nudges and the things that keep opening up for you along your spiritual journey, and they never stop. They just they serve in different ways and different ways of having priority to others. And so now we're moving into sole purpose work. You and I, and many others like us, have great missions to help support humanity as they expand their consciousness and really hear what I just said. We get to do that, isn't it amazing? We choose to do that to help others open up on their path. And now I'm moving into healer teacher. The channeling is, and I've been told, even since you and I spoke, the channeling is kind of closing its space now. And healer and teacher are really what needs to happen right now. Channeling will be involved in that, but healer and teacher, and I know it. If you're gonna say that's what you're hearing, that's what's happening. It's time for embodiment, it's time to help people understand who they are so that they can express these gifts, this purpose throughout through themselves in that way. I can't wait to hear what you're gonna say.

SPEAKER_02 6:06

Wow, Pamela, I've got goosebumps. I I'm so excited to hear this because with the development of soul life psychology, and even, of course, my own development, personal development, awakening, um, I got tricked along the way into thinking that spirituality, which is our um, I guess our intuition and that stream that we have, and confusing it with awareness of the self, which is I think what really changes us on this planet anyway, or the purpose of being here. So to hear that things are changing and that you're stepping into teacher role to help people understand that aspect of themselves excites me the most. I think um I think this journey that we live, each incarnation, because very much into past incarnations as well and how they all weave in. But this one actually each of them is the same. We're moving through a process each time as the person or the spirit that we are that time. So, wow, lots going on in your world. And I wonder actually, I know with the channelings and things and the fabulous information that comes through that seems to be so pure and also in line with what I've discovered from working in those transcendent spaces, is it all seems to be saying the same thing these days, which makes me so happy. Yeah. Because I think through the through the years, or when I first got into this, was actually only 20 years ago, even though it's like, yeah, it's quite a while, but but it was not clear then. It was very a very murky space, and there was kind of this, I guess, new age way, which was sort of sort of on the way, and then I guess we had religion, which was sort of um alluding to what was possible, and now we've got this, and it's very different, and I think very clean and clear. And I guess what happens now is people are ready to whether they like it or not.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

I think it's part of the evolution that they're it is they're ready, they're ready, and we're ready to help them, exactly, and we have to rise and continue to step into our unknown spaces to be able to serve those who are stepping into their unknown spaces. It has to, it's a natural evolution, a natural unfolding. And I love what you just said because um, you know, I said, I said, Well, why did you start my journey with channeling then? Like, why did we do that? Because you needed to be seen, because there was a moment and a pocket of time where the council had to be seen from through me in this way, but it is now that's like an oversaturated space, and it's it's not the talking and the intelligence part of it, it's getting into the wiring, it's embodiment, it's understanding, putting it in practice and living it, expressing it, being it continually, and and expanding through it with it. People need help with that, and nothing lights me up more than that. Uh I get, you know, I'm just like everyone else. We're business owners, we're trying to achieve, we're trying to create, we're trying to serve. We have noise in our head. How am I doing this? You know, every year when I had my own business before, there was a strategic plan. You know, what are we doing this year? And how are we marking the goals and what are we achieving and how do we measure it? And what's success and what's not. And so in spirituality, you are doing those things, but you're you're sort of doing that as like a lower kind of underneath action-oriented place for clarity, but you have spirit completely in the driver's seat. You have because you have no idea what is coming, and your brain kind of clouds it a little bit, and and the the chaos in your overthinking mind kind of get you off course a little bit. But knowing that these directives that I receive are very clear to me, it's now time for this. And I'm watching it happen in real time. I'm working with people in my soul path coaching, and by the time the three months is over, they're they're starting to pull on their own um guides that are wanting to come through, and they're starting to, it's it's kind of amazing.

SPEAKER_02 10:36

It is quick, it really is amazing, and um that people coming in, kind of what I'm hearing from what you just said was when they I guess when they know how to tune into their own guidance and their own stream or connection, that's when the gold happens. But I think they have been everyday people for their entire life until this strikes them that they've got this other capacity, then it does take a little while for them to trust it. And if they've never heard of it before or been into it before, then it's foreign. This even intuition um how that how that works to us as a person, and it's it's one of my favorite things, and it's probably the the starting point for most people to embrace that change within themselves is when because that intuition, that connection with our soul, it's it overrides our logic, and sometimes that's confronting. It's like, oh my god, it said this. But once we trust it, it's like, well, you you trust it, you go with it, and good things happen from that.

SPEAKER_01 11:50

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 11:51

Change is always positive, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:54

Yeah, and um, Tony, I love that because there's so many times that I receive messages in my inbox, in my in my email, on my social platforms, on my comments, on my YouTube videos and podcasts and stuff, and and people say there's something about your voice, there's something about your story, there's some, it's their intuition, it's their soul pulling because there's recognition there and they know they didn't know how to put words to it, they didn't know how to express it, understand it. But when they hear the story and they hear how I push through to courage out of fear and the and the path that unfolded before me, there's something about that that makes sense to them, and they are starting to experience and it helps them understand the spiritual path because many people are inside of. I always make a box, whatever your box is, if it's if it's the religion that you were brought up in, if it's um some sort of fear that makes you stay in here that makes you comfortable, people are starting to like break that the box and they're starting to jump out of it and try to find new ways of believing and seeing and understanding and using their discernment. And they have to take those, they have to take those risks and send those emails and post those comments to explore more because, like you said, it's just an inner knowing, it's it's pulling them into the next version of themselves, basically.

SPEAKER_02 13:17

Absolutely. And isn't it so interesting because right now, well, I'm assuming it's happening for everyone, but right now it's just happened in a massive way for me. And it's like it's like this life has had phases, and once you pass through one, work through this whole process, and it makes sense, and of course you've got hindsight then, but then when you reach it, it's like it's like it was another lifetime within this one, it's so cool, and it's also so fun to see or uplifting, I think, to see it happening with other people as well, and like you just explained, when they they're following the calling anyway, and then it's sinking in and they're realizing that there's something going on with them, yeah, and they've they can't stop the compulsion to follow now. Even um, I bet this has happened to you as well. A couple of I just started a circle again um late last year, and some of the girls that came, they were like, I I don't know how I ended up here, and it's that happens to me too.

SPEAKER_01 14:29

I don't know how I ended up here and why I'm here, how it happened.

SPEAKER_02 14:34

Yeah, but here I am, and they're phenomenal, they're phenomenally collected connected, so yeah, it's really yeah, just so exciting. I think, do you feel like you're in a new phase? I know we're similar, similar ages as well. So it's like that, I guess as you described, where you we we do put up these masks, but they're survival mechanisms, and then for them all to come down and then just step into being yourself, um it just feels so good. I could give an example that's very everyday. I like to try and find everyday things so that it all it makes a bit of sense. But so for me recently, I've always been a swearer. There was something always in me that could turn it off if you're at work or if you're with people and you don't know if they are okay with it. Um, so it it all was very natural. I never had to think about it, just it turned off. But in my everyday life, I was a swear, not swearing at people, it was just part of those sentences. And and now leading up to this new phase, uh it something so simple as that, it was like you have to be yourself now. And so we it's come into just just be yourself and speak the way that I would normally speak. And I guess it's been a little, I don't even know if it's confronting per se, but it's been hard to do that because there's this sort of fear of oh, am I going to be judged? Will they not like me? Whatever it is that is what held us where we were, and maybe other people who are listening can recognize that they stayed a certain way so that others felt comfortable as well as them. And that's what's interesting.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

Yeah, I had the flip side of that. Isn't that interesting? I had the flip side of that, but it but it's the same thing, it's just the other side of the coin.

unknown 16:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

I I had this thing about myself where I was like, do I want to curse anymore? Do I really I started wit witnessing myself hearing it? I don't know if the guides were showing me, and I don't know if it's because I'm stepping into this new teacher role, and I was having my own thoughts about it because I'll I'll drop the F bomb. Like I'll use it in every tense, every action, every like for everything. And I just it's just a part of who I am, and I started witnessing it, I started noticing it, and it I actually this is a great story. I saw this woman on a reel, and she was talking about how to be a better speaker, and so I do I always aspire to to be better at everything that you know, if I want to be a professional at this or that or whatever, if I want to learn how to be a better podcaster or paint better musician, and so I I felt I I I looked at this video and I thought, oh, that's so interesting. Well, maybe I should think about a course or a class or so. Then I had a friend, a brand new friend, that reached out to me from the other side of the country, was one of those emails that I get all the time. And I get I get these nudges from spirit to say, you know, you need to put action behind this and meet this person. That happens every now and then, and I do it because I know it's important. And he taught in a global capacity, just left a religion, but he was a teacher and he taught hundreds of people all over the world. And we were talking about something, and and he's like, you know, there's different things that I can help you with as you're moving into teacher, because I I taught piano as a kid, and I've taught my clients how to show up for whatever they need in their marketing and communications, but it's different. And he goes, you know, Pamela, I want to tell you something with like such an open heart with so much love. And I said, I I will receive it that way. I I would love to hear what you have to say. And he goes, You know, sometimes when you're speaking to so many different types of people in so many different types of spaces, that could be one thing, and I have such a huge mission that I feel like Spirit was telling me because I was saying it, that could be the one thing that makes someone go to the next place to hear something. And he goes, you know, it's just something I thought you might want to, and I was like, I can't believe you're saying that to me because I was already thinking that. And it's like we are getting what we need, like you're getting exactly what you need to show up the way that makes you feel so authentic and full and complete. And I'm getting what I need to help me with the fear I have of teaching, so that that makes me full and complete, and um it's it's just really quite profound. You said, Are you going through another expansion? Yes, that's one of them. That's one of them. And a guide that um came when I first started opening up the channel has just come back, and he said it's it's there's gonna be a big change again. There's gonna be a whole new expansion, and I'm like, here we go. Okay. We're ready, we're ready for the next, we're ready for the next mission. Right? It's fun, isn't it? To share those stories. I love that. I totally love it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:54

It's very cool. Gosh, these are my favorite topics to talk about. But I feel like the listeners are gonna be pretty excited about what it means to be channeling the council. I call I always called channeling streaming. Part of developing this solo psychology was to try and change the language that was being used at the time that made people be like, oh god. And they wouldn't, they were not interested in listening if it was a bit too fluffy or anything. That's why I I mean, I guess it was sent to me to call it streaming, which is pretty funny because we've got our you know, our streaming telly and all of that now. Right, right. But it's the same thing, it's streaming down. Exactly. Yeah, yeah. Um, so I want I would like to, this is curiosity for myself, actually. Yeah, channeling the council back in really early days for me. I didn't read very much, a lot of it's just come through my channel or stream, but I did read um Michael Newton's work, which was the in-between life stuff. And I think it's personally, I think it's been done at a time when very human minds had to try and accept that there was this these different realms or possibilities. So I think it's it's presented in a very human way and it with hierarchy and things which I don't find exist in that space. But the council, I can remember having a I'm gonna say it's random because I was never, I was not expecting it or having it facilitated. But I went so deep into out of body, so deep. I'm lying on a couch with a friend. We'd just been to mediumship school, and I went so deep. And I went home. It was home. And it's basically black at home, it's really not that much there, except Except the most extraordinary feeling that you can't articulate in our terms. There's nothing like it. But when I was there, there was this figures, figures, just kind of outlining figures. And they looked so cliche, like um, or at least how Michael Newton had described them. And they had this sort of thing around their neck and their sort of dresses on. And I couldn't see their faces, but I could see their figures there. And you know, they said only one thing to me, two things actually. You're on your own, and I knew exactly what it meant in regard to my work. And remember who you are.

SPEAKER_03 22:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:43

It was so meaningful then and there. Yeah. And it's really meaningful. But it means so much when to well, not only us, but when people come along and they are told from their own soul what's for them. That's when I find they have a real shift. Sometimes it's only a couple of words, and it's like it's time, I guess, when they get it. So do that. And tell me about your council people. Are they or council energy? How do you find it? Do they have a look or do you just have a feeling when they're there?

SPEAKER_01 23:27

Yeah, both. It's uh I love I love hearing you talk. Like your words and the tone of your voice are just so so comforting and lovely. I get lost in your story too, because I'm a visual person, so I'm like seeing as you're describing them. And yeah, my experience visually with them is sort of similar. They're shapes, they're they're like statuesque kind of forms. And when I was first starting to connect with them, you know, you go into you have to learn, you have to learn the process. Um, well, for me I did because I was having so many different experiences and with so many different frequencies, so many different beings. And when I would connect to the council, they were in almost like um, this is so hard to describe. They were in like a cavernous sort of area, but it was it was shallow, but it was vast. And it's and it's bright and white. To me, it's not black, it's bright and white, and but they are figures, and I don't know how many there are of them, but they're it's a collective of them, and they are statuesque, and it that's not even the right word. They're forms, they're like a group of forms, yeah, but their feeling, their vibration is just complete. It's a it's a super high frequency, and when I feel them, they're always in me anyway, and I'm an aspect incarnate now that we all are. We all those of us who have these missions are finding each other right now. But um, I just got introduced to my higher aspect and told her name and got integrated with her, so it's a continual process of learning more and more and more about this council aspect of myself, and um it's just love. It just it feels I feel it's just a complete resonance when they're with me. And they're there are a lot of energy to harness, a lot of energy to harness, and I'm still getting used to the physicality of it. There's still some part of lower aspect of me in my throat that still deals with fear and public speaking and teaching and and um channeling live and all that stuff. Um, I've been told very recently through I work with two practitioners every six months, um, and I already knew this was happening, that this next like of abilities and healing and work is about to just exponentially open up for me, and that this will be no longer an issue because it's just what's supposed to happen next. Um, when I first started channeling them live, and you'll see early videos of me, you know, I had to get this energy somehow to get acclimated in my physical body, to work with my language, my voice box, my intelligence, um, you know, my my physical body. And it's painful sometimes to watch some of those older videos because I'm screened. It's like my I really can't control it because I'm trying so hard to just allow and not know that I'm on screen or live in an audience, which happened, you know, two times I channeled live and they were on big, huge podcasts, and um, the whole world got to see it. I had a huge ego death with this one very, very, very, very viral video. But they had to happen for me to have karmic closure, to elevate my frequency, to give two bleeps about what people think of me to bring me to the next, to bring me into the next part, and so on and so on and so on. Um, but I will tell you, Tony, like when I went to Next Level Soul, and I haven't told this story in a while, and I actually told it yesterday. Um, he showed us and he gave us a tour, uh, Alex Ferrari, the host, he gave us a tour of the studios who were brand new, and he was so excited to show his equipment. He's so kind and so nice. And then it was time to sit down and record. And the monitor we were we were doing great, and I was channeling and it was great. But then he's like, Hold on, something happened. Like the energy tripped the monitors, and he had to go into the studio space and restart things, and he's like, This has never happened. And we started laughing because it's the council's energy. Like my friend was with me, it's council's energy. And when I was done channeling, he goes, You know, Bashar, right? I said, Yeah, he goes, This is like a stronger energy than that. And and it was because they were like, We are and and then when I went to Sean Kelly Digital Social Hour podcast, um, which was the beginning of uh, I don't know, this year. It was last year, I don't remember anyway. Um, he films nine or twelve episodes in a day. I mean, like people are coming in and coming out of his studio, coming in and coming out, they're shuffling them in, they're putting them in the queue, they're bringing them in. Like he's he's he just hit like number three overall podcast, like all podcasts.

SPEAKER_03 28:24

He's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 28:24

It's amazing that it's a lot of hard work. This kid is young, he's got a lot of energy. Um, I had there were podcasts before me. Then I came in, and my friend Dina sat down, and I went and I sat down, and the I'm getting to know Sean, and we're saying hi, and the production manager, whomever, comes in and Sean's like, What are you doing? He's like, There's this weird thing happening with the monitors. I can't figure out how to make it happen. And he's like trying to fix it, and Sean's like, I'm sorry, guys, I'm sorry. And Dina and I start laughing, and Dina's like, it's the council, and Sean didn't really believe it because he didn't know at that point, and he had never seen me channel anyway. So when I channeled, like part of the part of the funny part of the teaser video they had uh had pinned was that Sean's like, he hadn't really, I think, been exposed to it. But anyway, they they had a trip in the monitor the entire time, and he got on to Instagram stories, and he says it didn't happen before Pamela came in the studio, and it didn't happen for nine or ten episodes after it was the energy of whoever she was channeling, and it's the truth, it really is. It's a lot, and now with this healing work that I'm doing that I'm channeling through them, like people start like unzipping, people get hot flashes, and they're just red, and it's a lot, it's a lot of energy.

SPEAKER_02 29:55

Isn't it it's so again? I keep saying it's exciting, but it is exciting to me when when I see all the puzzle pieces coming together and these people unbeknownst to them before you turned up in this case, they're part of getting the message out. They've created these podcasts, and here they are. I've got a lot of people listening, and then you come in. I know they see the proof of the strength of energy that's that's happening, and and because it's so I guess it's visceral when that happens.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

It's visceral.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

So they've got there's nothing they can do except to say, this happened, we saw it, and we're in awe. And I think that that helps people who maybe uh either not interested or just a little skeptical or completely cynical. It's like, oh, absolutely. With all of this cred, I suppose. Yeah. Saw it, heard it, and is saying that's what happened. And I think that's all of the all of these layers that start to break down. So wow, you've got these cool stories of of what happened with the biggest podcast. Um, I I was also on the Alex Ferrari podcast before he's got his gorgeous space now. But I found this is a little off topic, but I've found some of these podcast hosts, or the ones that I've been on, they're so good at asking questions and engaging. And I noticed how they fit into the pattern of a lot of them are number one, or they have this inherent curiosity, and they ask great questions, they engage conversationally, and then there's you and I are both fives, and we are number fives because it's called communicators, so it's like it's okay we we're here to converse with anyone, and part of being a five person in the life map system, it's a part of being a five on the five mission, is we can adapt. So you can we can adapt to um someone who's really excited and open and and taking everything in, but also if they're much more reserved, we would adapt and really as a communicator, everyone can feel comfortable. Yeah, so isn't that exciting?

SPEAKER_01 32:24

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's so interesting. That goes back to where we started the conversation because I never knew that I was five, and I knew in business, I would say I was able to mirror whoever was in front of me. So if they had a really low kind of calm, I would that's how they needed to be communicated to, and it was it just would happen naturally. And I as I got older, I was like, I I I didn't know that I did that, and then you start to understand who you are, and then all of the things like being five. It's just so interesting. Yeah, there's there's there's there's something for everyone on this journey. There really is. There's something for everyone who wants to learn, hear, watch. There's so much to consume. Sometimes there's too much to consume, but um, and that's that's what we're talking about now a lot in my community, and specifically when I work one-on-one with people, the guides give instructions, you know, not just divine wisdom and the healing, but like instructions, like just like we talked about embodiment is the thing, it's to go within now, not to go everywhere trying to seek all of your answers. It's it's time to go in and really allow this to be heard, this to be to be uh acknowledged, expressed, considered, flexed. Let that be flexed. Absolutely. Um, yeah, a lot of change happens when people start to do that. When they really hear it and go, Oh, yeah, I'm trying to find that I'm in this house and this card and this thing, and I'm born on this date, and then this star system, and this, and it's great. It's great to have you understand yourself, but like it's time to go in this in this direction now. Yeah, big time.

SPEAKER_02 34:11

That's the best, it's the best clear information in there, yeah. And again, again, this excites me because it fits everything you're talking about fits with what I've observed. And you'd already said it, but I'm just gonna repeat it. People people get what they need at the time to help them understand themselves, which is never gonna be a bad thing. But then it seems to become it's too much, it's too much, and then even perhaps they become overwhelmed. But when you go in, the answer's clear, it's simple, it's simple, clear, and it's it's right for you at that time, and it's just really phenomenal. I'm so I'm so excited to hear that this is happening across the globe, and it definitely fits with my observations of uh even I'm getting a little off track here, but I'd love your thoughts because you have children too. Yeah, yeah. Um when I first started developing this psychology, this new psychology that included intuition and streaming and all of these things, I didn't realize that it was for the new young people who were born already very, very connected. And even if anyone tried to shut them down, like it did happen in our generations, just only purely because people didn't understand, but these kids come in, even if you don't understand them, they're like that's what's happening, and they question us and it's it makes me so happy to see it. I I do understand, and I can see when people don't get it, they're like find them aggravating, but for me it's like doing changing things, it's their job or their mission and they naturally sit with their intuition. The way that I like to explain the difference is, and it happened around 2000, there's a little bridge um on the other side of it, and the generations worked up to it, but they default to intuition. This is my simplest explanation, whereas we defaulted to logic. So, and that so it's a reverse in a way, and it's just so beautiful to see. And can you hear when your kids are talking to their friends and things? It's like sometimes I hear them say things to each other, and it's like, what the fuck? I didn't know that until it's 47. I mean they're so heartfelt. They talk in terms of well, I feel like this, and it's it's just so incredible, and I feel like it's so wise when you hear them talking, it's like they're really wise. Have we found that?

SPEAKER_01 37:10

I have, and I I I feel like you're in my head, or we like it's almost like we sort of prepared that we were gonna talk about these things because last night my beloved and I were out to dinner, and we sometimes we just sit at a bar, we go to our favorite places, and this man that was always there that we've never said hi to before, we struck up a conversation with him. So it started this whole thing, and we were talking about exactly that. Like you said, I and this was my experience, and my beloved was talking about it last night. We used to go to outside people, places, elders, for confirmation, direction, guidance, acceptance, approval. That's what we were trained. That was our generation. No, these kids have a confidence about them. I have one born in 2002 and 2005, and they are so self self-assured about their decisions, they know what they want to do, they are so connected to their friends, they are so smart and confident in in their decisions. Yeah, even my eldest, their friend group, are so loving and they're like a little family, and they do everything together. Like, I mean, these are 25-year-old kids.

unknown 38:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

20, 22, 23, 24, 25. And for years they've been traveling like this, and they love being together, and they're they they make decisions about their life without even talking to me, or that's what my beloved was saying too. Like, they're just so confident in themselves and different than we were. They they go to that inner tool, they go to that inner guidance, that discernment, they use them, they use their tools.

SPEAKER_02 38:55

They do. And that's I guess those are the differences that that people who feel really confronted by them are seeing. It's like, no, they don't, they it's not that they're being disrespectful, but they don't they don't go with respect your elders because what if that elder doesn't right. They that elder doesn't know their world.

SPEAKER_01 39:16

That elder doesn't understand what they're talking about, right?

SPEAKER_02 39:19

Yeah, like what what no that doesn't make sense. I've I'm really fine with them. I know, I know we're generalizing, but most of them will pretty well fit into this. What they're like, that doesn't make sense, so no, I'm not doing it.

SPEAKER_01 39:33

Right. But there's also there's also something, Tony, on the other side of that, that um I see is missing because there was a part of my upbringing where I really enjoyed being with elders. I I loved, I felt very safe with them. I enjoyed being with them more than sometimes my peers. I waitressed and worked in diners, and I had friends that were like older people, and I would have so many conversations with them. When we were growing up as kids, I walked, we walked up, we talked to our older neighbors. We spent time with them, we played in their gardens, we had lunch with them, um, spent lots of time with with the elders in our communities. And I don't I don't know that I see that as much because there's wisdom there. There's so much to learn there on the other side of it that you can't get in other ways. So I do wish that that existed more.

SPEAKER_02 40:31

I'm like, this I love that you've said this. I was like that as a young person as well, where I loved older people. And I I'm wondering if because our mission is what it is, that we had we needed that that wisdom that they had grown into. Whereas a lot of our peers were in a very different phase or doing something very different. I I too also I still do love older people. One of the things I saw in the patterns or I noticed in the patterns of a person's evolution here as an individual is we get through our predetermined mission. We get through it whether we become really spiritual and self-aware or not. And I think in the day it certainly happened because we got older and wiser and more patient as we aged, and things that bothered us before don't anymore. So it happened in that way. Yeah. And but now I think with these kids, they're kind of already there. It's a flip. So there must be some connection that's going to be required for them, and maybe it's to be a bit more logical to maybe um work work through life, and it's so it's almost a flip.

SPEAKER_01 41:56

But yeah, older people they're being trained for their new babies that they'll bring onto the planet, which are going to be even higher and uh you know, a higher frequency, more mission-driven, and I mean like big time. And um I I find this, I find these conversations so interesting because I don't talk about things like this for a while, and then I thought I was talking about it yesterday again. Um, I channel messages every month from the Great Council of Light for my community members, right? And I was in the middle of doing this message, and out came this meditation. It was a womb activation meditation, and it's for women of all ages, not just women who are reproductive age, older women, women in menopause, younger women, women have had sexual trauma. You know, there's medicines that have created trauma in our womb in our wombs as women to heal the womb, to clear the womb. Like to, and I said, why? And they said, everyone needs, there's a variety of reasons why, but one of them is to help these younger women clear that space for these higher vibrational beings. And I'm like, oh my gosh, it makes sense, it makes sense, and I was talking to a woman last evening who wants to have like Reiki-infused birthing experiences to help support the exchange, like these are wonderful and exciting new ways of doing and being that are breaking the norm of what our world was, which is just in in tandem with everything else that that's happening. And I keep describing this lower frequency that's been kind of you know occupying and kind of you know running our world. It's it's breaking down, right? But we're rising into our spaces and our cre the creation and collaboration. All the things are coming now. It's a shift, it's so cool.

SPEAKER_02 43:59

In inside. In some ways, it it seems like we're working back to where we started, where we were as a as a human, I guess, hyper aware of energies. I mean, I know they called them different things then, but uh they were so much, people were so much more reliant on their own instincts and their own guidance. So, and I think the way that life went, and it went exactly as it was supposed to, um, it it squashed those things in us a bit. I say us as humanity as a whole, but it's certainly um, it's certainly coming back now, and it's just it's just wonderful. And I think one more thing about the kids who, as you said, they're in their 20s now. They're not even kids anymore.

SPEAKER_01 44:51

And it's like they have salaries and healthcare.

SPEAKER_02 44:56

So before we know it, it already it started, they get into positions where they can they make the call on how things change, how we educate the children, how we run our degrees, if they even stay, but they will be the ones calling the shots. And that's how you can see that the change will absolutely permeate humanity because these young people came in and they're buttoned down, yeah. And also the way that the way that um, well, numerology is a way to see who you are if anyone's interested in it, but with this life map, you can see exactly how the whole evolution of humanity transpired. And now with these young people coming in, and what you know is when they come in with this energy, this softer energy, it happened with every single child. It doesn't matter what culture we're born into, it doesn't matter um where we are on the globe, it's it's happening, so it's really um I think it's just a really exciting time for us, and I'm very excited to hear that you're called into teaching. That's the that's the mission of a five, also. Actually, I don't know if I told you that, but it's that's calling, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:23

So it's happening, it's happening big time. Yeah. Moving into all of the things, and um, you know, it just sort of evolved and I listened. And uh one of the things that one of the things that was not bothering me, but like it was always important to me that everybody was able to work with me in the council in some capacity. Like, I don't want anyone to feel like they can't, so that's why there's all these different places and spaces I've created, but that's not even enough. There's so many questions, so many. I had this experience, Pamela. I heard this story, I had this happen to me, this happened to me. What do you think about this? It's everywhere. And I just said, What can I do? Like, how can I serve people? And so I just created this thing every month, and people can come and ask questions, and I can guide them, answer them if I can, and just help them. Um, and then I create a workshop for that. So if they want more, they can do it. And they're the things that I'm starting with. The the Soul Path coaching is it it kind of evolved into it's it's teaching. There's nothing better than helping someone change their life. Like marketing was fun, it's just not the same thing. It's just not the same thing, it's not the same thing when you see someone change their life and everything opens up, and then they're have different relationships with people that they didn't have relationships with in their life for 10 or 20 years, and now everything is healing and purposes revealing, and everything is changing, you're like so rewarding, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:08

Yeah, amazing. I wonder the channeling or even intuitive reading, for example, where you're reading for someone and they come for it. They're always coming for some sort of counseling. That's that's they're coming for some some help, whether they know it or not. But I think there's a there's a threshold there where we can take them further, and or some of them will be ready to step into where they are getting that guidance from themselves, which we talked about before. So there's all these different, I guess, threads that that people are following to come in, and ultimately it'll all lead to that they understand themselves better and probably will go within. Yes, amazing.

SPEAKER_01 48:53

Oh yeah, so they're not afraid to it when they're ready, they're not afraid to go into spaces that are really, you know, maybe so different than what they've experienced in their life.

SPEAKER_02 49:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:08

Um, even even in the in the space of just being completely in a space of being able to say, I love you. Yeah, you know, I love you. I met you, and there's just something that I feel such love for you. Do you know how hard that is for some people to say? Yeah, almost to be able to be able to just openly say, I just love you, Pamela. Yeah, or I could say to my person, I just love, I just I love you. Yeah because I do. And that expression to be able to give it so easily, but really truly, it's not just I love you, I love you too, bye-bye. It's really coming from a from a place of uh intention.

SPEAKER_02 49:51

Yeah, absolutely, deep, deep, heartfelt, yeah, true, amazing. Whoa. So there we go, we've had the best conversation. The time really fast, actually, it always does, it always goes by self fast when you're having fun. Yeah, time just doesn't exist for a moment. I had I had a question for you. Um, I'm gonna see if it if it's still relevant because what once you get talking, the plan was like didn't really need that. Oh, okay, it's this what do you think or feel that people misunderstand about this path?

SPEAKER_01 50:42

Oh okay, so the first thing that came to my mind is, and I I feel like it's been breaking down as people are rapidly expanding and and and also tapping into their gifts, that the spiritual path is just like ta-da-da-da! I I did it, I'm now enlightened, and I I've done all the things, and uh life is happy, go lucky. And there, you know, the spiritual journey is rainbows and sunshine and unicorns, and it's not it's not there, it's it's it's who whoever started that or created that, I don't understand it. Number one, and number two, it's a series of number one, remembering yourself, and while while you're doing that, you get little little choices, little decisions, little opportunities to choose love or fear. Love or fear, love or fear, love or fear, love or fear, love or fear over and over and over and over again. And they might start with small, small things, and you see, oh yeah, that benefited me. That turned out to be a really good decision. Yeah, I'm gonna do that again, and then if you get too fearful and you don't make the right choice, you get to try again, you get to do it again, but it's pushing through that. You got to embody it, baby. You have to live that journey. You're not just going to um, you know, people think that because I did plant medicine, I did plant medicine, I was enlightened I channeled in the life of no, there's a series of never-ending choices where you get to show up for your soul and express your soul and listen to your soul and honor your soul, your soul journey, and you see your life change, you see new people come in, old people leave. I just had a conversation with someone I hadn't seen for about a year, and I was getting caught up with her to hear what's happening in her life, and she completely started. She's always like, I'm gonna do a session with you. I know I should do a session with you, da-da-da-da-da. But I heard her talk with her story, tell me about self-empowerment, how she ended a friendship, lifelong friendship, because she realized she was disempowered in it, and there were these roles. And so I heard in my mind, ooh, self-empowerment, you know, and I ended this zigzag with this person, this relationship or you know, entanglement with this man, and we will go back and forth and back and forth, and and she realized because she's starting to flex a muscle of self-empowerment, I don't want that anymore. I want higher and better. And I said to her, now it's your job to honor that decision that you made, that conviction to the universe, you don't want that anymore. Now you have to continually choose that you don't want that because a big carrot's gonna come and the universe is gonna say, Do you really want that? Or do you really want this? And it's your job to say, No, I decided I'm honoring my soul. I already made the choice, and it's benefiting me, it's changing my life, everything is better. I'm going to honor that choice. I'm gonna know that that higher vibrational relationship that has everything that I want in a person to show up to mirror me, to learn and grow, support, co-create, and grow together is there. Yeah, it's there, and that's that's I think um a common a common um something that I hear. Also, I think that people minim minimalize, is that the word, or is the word trivial trivialize? I don't know if that's the right word, but um people make fun of people who are on this path. They want to make it so it's not real and they want to act like you're you're just sensitive, or you're doing your woo-woo thing, or you know, don't don't acknowledge that as your own truth. Just know that they're meeting you at the level of fear that they have within them, and that it's not important what anybody else thinks. It's important what you think. And so that's that's I think the message to take away is just keep on moving forward, even when you feel afraid. Find your community, find people like you, Tony, and me to listen to, to get regrounded, ask your guides, your team, your soul, what does my soul want? What does my soul need to show me that's best for me right now? Then I need to support me while I'm feeling wobbly, you know, and you'll get it. And then you get bigger and bigger decisions to make, bigger and bigger choices to make in marriage to leave a a job to change, like to sell a house and move to another country, like you don't know, you know. But um, but they're but they're wonderful things because it opens everything up to a whole new way of living.

SPEAKER_02 55:49

Absolutely, and I think just to a few things that you just said, we we gotta remember that even on our spiritual journey, we're people here, so we we are here to enjoy what life offers us because we can't when we don't have a body. So we can have we go down, have a have a drink with our beloved, or whatever we do that's very everyday is important, it's really important, but certainly this human road is it's full of ups and downs. As people, we fall back, we fall back into the same pattern again. But eventually we do work through the process and the clarity comes, you make a different decision. So it's it's really important that people just I think understand that it's it's a journey.

SPEAKER_01 56:43

It's so quite a journey, but it is.

SPEAKER_02 56:46

You just keep going and where your interest is peaked is most likely your inner guidance guiding you to where you need to be at the moment or what you need to read or listen to, those kinds of things. So yeah. That's so perfect, at least. Yes, it's been absolutely wonderful having this conversation. I knew it would be. What's going on with your big packages and everything?

SPEAKER_01 57:21

You're gonna be on my podcast too. So that'll be fun.

SPEAKER_02 57:25

I look forward to that. That'll be brilliant. So I just want to say a big heartfelt thank you for being just so open and no gatekeeping telling us where you're at, where you come from is beautiful. Thank you, Pamela. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 57:41

You're so welcome, you're so welcome. I just want to tell everybody who's listening to you that if you go to spirit-calling.com slash soul life psychology, I have a whole bunch of free things for them to check out. And um, I just built an assessment so they can do the assessment and see where they are on their spiritual path. So you don't have to guess, you can see. And I'm just so grateful for our conversation. So thank you for having me, and thank you everybody for listening.

SPEAKER_02 58:09

Fantastic! Well, I hope you really enjoyed that conversation with Pamela. If you want to check out more of what she offers and the work that she does, you can visit her website. There's a link in the show notes, it's spirithy-calling.com. And if you've got any questions, you can send them through via the form in the show notes. If you are interested in learning about your life map, I'm doing Life Map Foundations. It's a 10-week program, begins June 22nd, which is really soon. It actually starts Monday or Tuesday if you're in the UK. It's designed to help you understand your personality, your purpose, that is uh who you are and why you're here, and the plan that you were born with. I will be teaching it live online. You'll really enjoy it. Self-awareness positively impacts how you experience life. Okay, now looking ahead in upcoming episodes, we are going to be talking about lots of different things, but synchronicity. And we also have still to cover a couple of the bruises, namely betrayal and injustice, which we'll get to. If you are enjoying these episodes, it would really help to reach more people if you hit subscribe or follow. For now, I want to say thank you for joining me for another episode of the Soul Life Psychology podcast. And until next time, self awareness is the ultimate activism.

SPEAKER_00 59:57

What's the definition of a DNA?