28 - Popsicles, Summer Pressure, and Living Your Best Summer

Summer can feel magical... and surprisingly stressful at times.

This week we're talking about everything from popsicles, movie nights, swim lesson disasters, and expensive ice cream runs to the pressure parents often feel to create the "perfect" summer for their kids.

We share why one of Patty's boys still remembers unloading hay with the family more than all the vacations, and why sometimes the memories that matter most are the simplest ones.

Then we dive into each of the nine Enneagram types and explore what a healthier, more life-giving summer might look like for each personality. Whether you're a Helper learning to receive, an Achiever learning to slow down, or an Enthusiast learning that enough really can be enough, we hope this conversation helps you embrace the season God has given you.

We wrap up with one of our favorite book recommendations, Theo of Golden, and why its message of kindness, generosity, and truly seeing people has stayed with us long after finishing the last page.

If summer has started to feel more like pressure than joy, this episode is your reminder that maybe the best memories aren't the expensive ones—they're the ordinary moments shared with the people you love most. 

Bible / Faith References

Although this episode isn't centered on one passage, these themes came up:

•  God's gifts are already present in ordinary life. 
•  Rest and presence instead of striving. 
•  Living fully as the person God created you to be. 
•  Seeing people as they truly are. 
•  Ordinary acts of kindness can change lives. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome back to 27 Good. I'm Patty. I'm Amy. We're so glad you're here with us. So when this podcast goes out, it's the Thursday before 4th of July. Yeah. Or in the dead of summer.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

Dead of summer. We have a heat wave in Ohio. I saw someone post, maybe it was Trish Moore, that said, like, just remember this is better than negative 10 in one chill. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

Was it the same thing that said I don't have to go out and shovel in the sweater?

unknown 0:22

No.

SPEAKER_01 0:24

Or all the layers you have to bundle your kids in.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

We just walk right out. Yeah. But everyone does cry the car is so hot, but pick your poison.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

I just absolutely would rather the heat than than the dead of winter. Yeah, same thing.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

We're loving popsicles. That's the thing you guys do, probably.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

I just went today to Aldi. I got two different things of ice cream. We got the Bomb Pop Popsicles and then the oh, what is it? With it's like a cone with ice cream in it. What are those called? Drumsticks? Yeah, drumsticks. We got those. Stocked up. But then it was like, okay, wait, why did I buy all this stuff on a 96-degree day? Yeah, rush home. Yeah, rush home and then make everybody quick. But I mean, I think it was fine. We threw it in the deep freeze in the basement. It's fine. But as I was buying it, was the thought this was something I should have bought last week in anticipation of the hot weeks. Can't win them all. We also went to Meyer, different than Aldi, and got fun spindrift. We got a spindrift, a LaCroix, and a big gallon of iced tea. Just fun drinks. Good to get, yeah, high rehydrated. I love like a spindrift or a LaCroix on ice, like it's just such a treat. Yes. And I feel like Meyer has the right flavors.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

I think Meyer has everything that's wonderful. Yeah. It's just if I'm going to a store and I'm going to enjoy it, it's Meyer's or Bueller's. We're a big ice cream family too. I feel like we are just nonstop with ice cream lately. Like almost every night, and it's just such a treat. It's a fun treat.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

Just at home or are you going places? No, just at home. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:48

We went to Scoops once or twice, maybe. Which is so fun. But we just can't afford to go every night. No. I cannot. And you wait and sit all right.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

That's what actually motivated me to buy a bunch of ice cream is last night we went and got ice cream at this place in Worcester.

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Yeah, the milk house.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

And it's like $23 later for the three of us.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

And a bunch treat, but we couldn't get like I could really buy a lot of ice cream for that amount of money. Yes. Jason's birthday was this weekend, so we made the most delicious homemade chocolate cake, and that was so good. We went and saw Toy Story 5 at the Ashland Theater. How was it? It was good. It was cute. I didn't cry. It wasn't like I feel like the others kind of pull on your heartstrings a little more, but it was fine. The kids are just like we're in movie theater era. So it was so fun.

SPEAKER_01 2:36

It was just a blast. I remember the first movie that I took the boys to see was Trolls, and I remember I just kept looking over their faces. Their cute little faces. Yeah, so like taking pictures of their face. Yeah, it's like just totally sucked into the movie. It's so cute.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

And there's these massive chairs. Do they have all booster seats? No. But my kids, I don't think, would sit in them. Boston's just, you know, he's ready to be a big kid. Okay, so I grew up with five siblings, and when we went to restaurants, it's water only, no one's getting apps. And the movies, I don't ever remember buying popcorn or treats there, probably because it was so much to just get like everyone in the door. And maybe my maybe I'm remembering it wrong. But Jason grew up kind of the opposite. There's two kids, they went out to eat all the time, did all the things, and so it's fun that we got we go in, we get the large thing of popcorn with the kids, we're getting drinks, we're getting the chocolate-covered cookie dough bike. No, we don't. We don't. I know we used to. I mean, I used to. We always at the dollar store before and then I think at the Ashland Theater, because it's a non-profit, I feel like we can't. And if we want to like a little cool.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Sorry. I mean, I still buy the popcorn.

SPEAKER_00 3:37

It's like those delicious Ash. It's the candy is from Ashley's candy.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Yeah. Um is it like the Lyric Theater in Worcester? They have the Lyric Theater. Never been there in there. They have these leather recliners. It is that. It's like that. And they like rock. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:49

But the kids are too light, so like theirs don't rock. Oh yeah. But it was fun. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay. We also had swim lessons. How are swim lessons going? They're going absolutely wonderful now. Good. But the first day was a disaster. Was a disaster. I told Patty the story already. So last week it was so cold. I think the first day.

SPEAKER_01 4:06

Yeah, here we're talking about this heat wave and it was so cold. It was so cold. Was it last week or the week before?

SPEAKER_00 4:11

It was last week because this is week two. But on their voicemail, I think we skipped the first day because she's like, come if you want, but the water is 50 degrees. Yes. But just first rough day. And when I told you the story, so we get there. I think I signed all the kids up for the wrong class. And so I got that fixed, but it just was no one was having it. It was so cold. Lots of tears. Yeah. Was it both the boys? Andrew just straight up refused to get in the water. Austin's crying because he's so cold. I don't know. It was just terrible. And then Santa was in maybe too hard of a class for her. Yeah, she freaked out because there were two male teachers and she didn't want to be in with them. And I think I also made her nervous because I told her she had to learn how to float and we had to get that down before we went. And then I just realized. It's like high stress. Yeah. Mom's got to ruin everything. But then when I put her in the class, I think she should have been in. She was great. She's doing great.

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Yeah, I only did some lessons with my boys one time, and then after that, I just taught them to swim on their own. We went to the pool all the time. When they were little, we had a pool pass and we were always at the pool. We also didn't have air conditioning until I think maybe three or four years ago in this house. So on a day like today, we would have spent the afternoon at the pool. But the first the reason why we didn't do any swim lessons is because I did it one year. It was in the indoor pool in Worcester, and you had to sit up. There's these these big bleachers like way up high, and you have to sit as parents way away from them. And so I'm far away, and I'm like, is he enjoying himself? Charlie? I can't tell. He's he's probably three, and Sam was one. And I had Sam with me. And when they carry him back to me, the instructor has him in his arms and he's sobbing. Like he had been crying the whole time. And I was like, world's worst mom. Like just from far away, like he looks like he's having a good time. The instructor was holding him, but I really just thought, oh, it's nice, the instructor's holding him. He doesn't really know how to swim. He's three. But here it was, he was sobbing. So then I have to get somebody to watch Sam for the rest of the rest of the session that I can go to so that I can sit down there. The first day, he wouldn't, it was kind of the same. He wouldn't get in the water. He stood on a step with me where I sat by the step. And maybe we eventually got him in, but I was like, this is stupid. I know. And was like, I paid money for this, and I don't think he learned a thing. He hated it.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

Right. Gosh, the things we do that were just like this will be so fun. And then Jason's like, so I call Jason afterward to just give him the rundown. And he's like, You should have just made him get in the water. Like, just handle it, just make him all. Force them. He's like, Yes. Okay, Jace. You can take him to some lessons.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Yeah, the dad always, especially when the dad, well, we maybe both do it, both parents, a little bit, when we're not in the situation where like, this is what I would have done. Yeah, you could have handled this. Would have made this better. Jason's like, I would have made that better. I could have done it.

SPEAKER_00 6:37

They would have just obeyed.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

They would have obeyed.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

And listened to their dad. Probably would have. And been little angels in there. Sobbing. Jumped right in. Uh-huh. No one's crying. So the one thing with summer, I think, though, can be it's not as much for me, because I am a teacher on summer break. But there are big expectations. There's that thing. You have 18 summers with your children. Make the memories. And we used to do bucket lists, and the boys and I, and it was as small as go to scoops for ice cream. Wasn't anything huge on these bucket lists, but there's such an expectation for summer bucket lists and doing all the summer things. And we post about it on Instagram and the summer vacation and and all the things. And do you feel an overwhelming sense of that with your little kids? Yes.

SPEAKER_00 7:18

And I feel actually like I've been trying to be off social media a little bit. Because I feel like we'll have the best day. And then you're like, oh, well, they're doing that with their kids. I should have been doing that. I should have bought this. My kids should be. I don't know. It's just all the things.

SPEAKER_01 7:29

I remember it a lot more when my kids were little, your kids of feeling that way of that I was depriving them in some way because I wasn't doing all these things. And there are a lot of things that are only certain weekends. Like this past weekend was the boon fest in Ashland, so you're like, well, we missed that.

SPEAKER_00 7:42

Didn't go. Didn't go. Ruin their summers. And then I felt so guilty about it. And someone at work was like, it was terrible weather. Don't feel bad. Right. It was a lot of it was canceled. Like, you just can't do everything.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

It actually feels very similar at Christmas time, I feel something. Yes. Because of the same thing. There's all these things. Go see Santa. Go do this. Go sledding. Go like build the snowman. So remember that summer though? I think the boys, I don't know, maybe they were like eight and ten. It was before things got busy with 4-H and with sports. We did all kinds of things in the summer. And this particular summer we did everything. We had gone to my mom's probably a couple times. When we were at my mom's, we went to the pool. We went to the beach. We had gone to Lakeside. We had done the beach there. I'd spent so much money taking them places. We had the pool pass. We did all the things. And then at one point in the summer, we bailed hay. And when we bale hay, most of the time we do big round bales. And so you just pick it up with the skid steer. And really, nobody really has to help too much. But this particular, I think it was toward the end of the summer, even Brian was like, let's do small square bales because I think the boys are big enough to help. And that was like something that he had in his childhood memory that he loved. Like the whole family helps unload square bales. So we did it. It was a terribly hot day, but it was like we were all together, all doing all the things. And so then, you know, we're we go back to school, and maybe the week of back to school, it's like, what was your favorite thing you did all summer? And it was unloading hay with mom and dad. Out of all the things. Out of all the things, all the money I spent. All the money spent. All the time traveling in cars. We had gone to Sheena's. I mean, it was one of those summers where it was, I felt like almost everything. And yeah. And I just feel like I feel like they like being kids love to be home. Yeah. Really. They love really simple things like the sprinkler in the yard. Yes. And popsicles. And girl and hot dogs, eating outside. A bonfire. Reading under a tree. Right. Things that and actually, as kids in the country, which our kids are, they have such awesome things like that that other kids don't have the opportunity to do. I mean, my kids are outside all the time. Yeah. And now it's now it's sports and 4-H, but it's still.

SPEAKER_00 9:50

I know. And I feel like what I catch more and more, and especially with Samantha, because she is such a talker. And I just that girl at bedtime. She could make bedtime take three hours just chatting. Which I love and I never want it to stop. Yeah. You never want it to stop. But she just says things like, I just love my family and I just love when we're together. And it really is like, that's all they want is us to not be distracted by our phones. They really do know how to get you though. She told Jason that he's always at work and that I'm always doing other things around the house. And I was like, you just know how to cut so deep.

SPEAKER_01 10:21

Right. What was she like? For nobody to work and just to sit and look at it. I know. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Me too.

SPEAKER_00 10:27

Actually, this sounds great, Samantha. Right. Not really. But yeah, it is. It is such a struggle. And right now it just feels like the time is going so fast. Like, how is it? It's July tomorrow. And you just are like, at least I am. I don't know if all moms are probably like this, but you're just always criticizing yourself of am I to her point, which even if it's not true, it is. Gosh, I'm always doing dinner, cleaning the ki oh my gosh, are we always cleaning the kitchen? Always sweeping the floor.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

Especially in the summer. Well, we're home in the summer. And so I am always cleaning the kitchen. Always running the dishwasher.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

Always doing laundry. But just trying to, I don't know, find that balance of what could be done when they go to bed. What can they help with? My kids are big enough, they should be helping more, probably.

SPEAKER_01 11:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:08

But and the 18 summers thing. I used to think, oh my gosh. Uh, but it's so ridiculous because so many summers after that was.

SPEAKER_01 11:16

It makes things too, yeah, high.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

It's like a scarcity mentality of quick, do everything you can in 18 years, because it's all right. Like, God, I feel like that's the worst case scenario, too.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Is that your kids don't want to hang with you after you also really only have like 10 because after what if they're in sports? Right.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

Just add to it. You have 10 summers. You actually have 10 everyone, so enjoy that.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

Well, I think that summer has a way of revealing what we need. Some of us need adventure, some need rest, some need connection. So we thought it would be fun today to look at each Enneagram type. So this is something that we've talked about before, and if you still don't know your Enneagram type, we'll link a free. We're gonna make sure this time it's free because one of them might be are there any free ones that still exist?

SPEAKER_00 11:56

Maybe not. I don't know. You also could just go to the Enneagram Institute and read the types and yes, that's an easy way to probably guess. We could probably guess.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

Or we can ask some questions to help you figure it out. Um so we thought it would be fun to to look at what it would be like to embrace the healthiest, most life-giving version of yourself this summer. So for each of the Enneagram types. Do you want to start with type one?

SPEAKER_00 12:18

Yeah, why don't you do it?

SPEAKER_01 12:19

Okay. So type one is the reformer. This is Brian. And so the best summer life was permission to relax, and I love that for him because he works, he's a farmer, so actually we struggle a little bit in the summer because he's working really hard and I'm on the porch having a popsicle. And so I do think that he's gotten so much better. As you get older, you just get so much better with realizing things will it'll happen, it'll get done. So last on Saturday we floated the river down in Mohican. That that'll probably be one of the boys' highlights. They just love when we're all together. So it says try taking a spontaneous day trip, which that would be that, leaving some items unchecked on the to-do list, enjoying a hobby just because it's enjoyable. And the growth question is what if this summer isn't about getting everything right? It would probably be for him too, like getting everything done. But some things have to be.

SPEAKER_00 13:09

Yeah. Gosh, I feel like the try thing, the leaving some items unchecked just sounds like such a stress for a number one. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 13:19

It doesn't have to all be done today. Yeah. Like it'll get done.

SPEAKER_00 13:22

Yes, always tomorrow. What's that saying? Why do it today? What you could put off for tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01 13:27

That's what that agreement seven would say. That's me.

SPEAKER_00 13:31

Alright, the next one is the helper. So I'm this is me. Um, best summer life is receive instead of always giving. The challenge is don't spend the entire season planning everyone else's fun and try letting someone else host say yes when people offer help and take a solo afternoon for yourself. And the growth question is what do I need this summer? And I have no idea. What would I need?

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Well, you probably could take a solo afternoon for yourself. Yeah, we're besides work. That would probably be something that would be really good for you.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Yeah, that'd be fun.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

But you and Jason are doing your trip. Maybe that'll be something that will fill your cup.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

Yeah. So just in a month I'll do it.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

Just kidding. Yeah, in one month she'll get to fill her cup. Type three is the achiever. The best summer life says to be present, not impressive. So the summer challenge is stop turning summer into another achievement project. Try putting the camera down occasionally, taking a vacation with no agenda. Choose experiences over accomplishments. The growth question is who am I when I'm not performing?

SPEAKER_00 14:32

Gosh, those are so good for threes. Do you think that you're a wing three? Yeah, I do. I'm so sorry because I feel like that one I was like that's a little bit useful. Or later on in my life. I feel like yeah. I think three's a hard number for me. And that's probably why. It's like it's things I see. Yeah, you know what I mean. The stop turning summer into another achievement project. I'm like, what? I should pick one thing every day to be decluttering my pantry. You know what I mean? That does sound just relax.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

Also, why do things have to be done like that in the summer always? I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

It's like a winter project.

SPEAKER_01 15:01

Why would I do that in the summer and waste time and or a project for when it's raining?

SPEAKER_00 15:04

That's when you're cleaning out your pantry. Or like why? Who cares? I feel like I can be type A and then just type C of like shove it in and close the doors. I'm sure everyone can, maybe. I've just like a flip. I feel you there. Charlie tackled my pantry. Oh yes. I mean that's probably about old enough to do something like that. She would love it. They still organize it. Yeah. Because it is, you're like home from groceries, it's just like quick.

SPEAKER_01 15:28

He cleaned out all the old stuff and he organized it all. He even made this little map of where everything is. I'm having a hard time as I'm grocery shopping, putting things in the right places. Because he's made this like he drew out this here's where everything belongs. And I'm like, I'd usually just kind of stick it in there. Yeah. Like that's the stuff for this week. That's so funny. But yeah, he he did that one day this summer.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

Okay, type four is the individualist. Their best summer life is embrace the joy that's already here. Their challenge is don't miss real life beauty while searching for the perfect experience. And a few things for them to try are watching sunsets, create something artistic, gather friends, even when it isn't picture perfect. And the growth question is can I find wonder in the ordinary? Do you know any fours? Yeah, a lot of people I work with are fours. Oh yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

Kind of a creative place. Type five is the investigator. Best summer life. Get out of your head and into the world. Summer challenges, experience life instead of researching it. Try learning a new outdoor skill, attend a community event, explore a new town. What experience am I postponing because I don't feel ready? So this is my dad, and actually, he can't really learn a new outdoor skill because he is in a skilled nursing home with you know, but he could go to a community event and he listens to this podcast and listen, Dad. Go play bingo this week.

SPEAKER_00 16:47

Go listen to music, like in Theo of Golden. Yeah, go listen to the music. Yes. Right. Love that. Type six is the loyalist. Their best summer life is taking one brave step. The challenge for them is don't let fear make all of your summer decisions. So try planning a small adventure, try something unfamiliar, and trust yourself more than your worries. And the question is, what would I do if I believed God was already going before me? Gosh, love all that for a six. A six is one of the best. That's one of the best people. They really are.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Annie, what would you do if you believed God was already doing it for you?

SPEAKER_00 17:20

Isn't that a crazy thought? A crazy question for anyone to do.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

I know. I force her into adventures. Yeah. Because I'm her seven answer. So the type seven is the enthusiast. Best summer life. Saver instead of chase. Summer challenge. More plans aren't always more joy. What? What? Pick a few meaningful experiences, practice gratitude, stay present instead of planning the next thing. What if enough is enough? Gosh, that is.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

Well, we were just talking about this that you feel like you've grown so much in this area of not cramming every minute of fun. I'm like learning to be still. Yeah. Read my book on the porch. Just be quiet. Yeah. Okay, number eight is the challenger. So this is the one I just laughed because historically we said it's the worst type. And then turns out someone I love dearly is this one.

SPEAKER_01 18:04

Michelle. I have some people I like too.

SPEAKER_00 18:05

And like they're healthy. I think it's when it's a healthy person, but I just had never seen it.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

We said before that a type eight, like you want them on your side. So if they're on your side, they go to war for you.

SPEAKER_00 18:14

But they really are. I think it's true though. Any number in health, you know. Mm-hmm. Okay, so type 8 is the challenger. Their best summer life is to let their guard down. Their challenge this summer is that strength is not your only superpower, and they should try being vulnerable with trusted people. Let others take the lead sometimes. Rest without feeling guilty. And the question for them in terms of growth is where might softness create more freedom than control.

unknown 18:40

Whew. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:41

Tough for an eight to let go of control.

SPEAKER_01 18:44

Rest without feeling guilty. Type 9, the peacemaker. Don't disappear into everyone else's plans. Summer challenge. Figure out what you want. Try making one summer bucket list item your priority. Speak up about your preferences and take initiative. The growth question is if I mattered as much as everyone else, what would I choose?

SPEAKER_00 19:07

Okay, so I can still to this day, I don't know what Jason is. I think he is, he teeters, he's either a I think he's a nine, probably, but I also feel like he could be a five or six. Because like reading this one, he's just a wait. Like it's never about what he wants. You know what I mean? He's always like, whatever's fine. Yeah. I don't know, or maybe that's just a guy thing.

SPEAKER_01 19:29

But you should make him read them and see which one kind of like.

SPEAKER_00 19:32

He'll be like, none of them. Right. But yeah, I should. Mm-hmm. I'll try. We'll try again. It's been a few years, probably. So the thing to remember is that God didn't create us to spend summer striving, hiding, performing, worrying, or pleasing everyone else. He created us to be fully alive. Whatever your Enneagram type, your healthiest summers may simply be the one where you become more present to God's gifts, more aware of his goodness, and more fully yourself. Yeah, I love that. Let's talk about Theo of Golden again because I feel like that just sums up that book so well.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

If you listen to our last episode, Amy was reading Theo of Golden and I had just started it, which was just coincidence. It had been on hold with the library for months from yeah. So it was a total coincidence that you had looked I think you listened to it, right? Yeah. And then I finally got it from the library. But the end has an afterword from the author, which this is his debut book, which is always so fascinating to me. Oh my gosh, they don't how could this book be so good in this person? This isn't what they do. No way. He just wrote this down. And he said that when people ask him what the book is about, because I've had people, I've been telling everybody to read it, and when they say what's it about, I don't know how to say it without giving it away. Um without because I want them to read it themselves, you know. So the author says that it's about seeing people as they truly are, the quiet power of kindness and generosity, the importance of stories, art, and genuine conversation, and the belief that ordinary acts of grace can profoundly change lives. And then he said he never really meant even to get it published. He was like, I was gonna put it on my shelf.

SPEAKER_00 20:56

He just like wrote it for something to do. Yeah. Like a challenge. To prove to himself that he could write what'd you say, a long fiction. A long fiction, I think he said.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

And then his friends read it and they were like, oh my gosh, you have to publish this. And then even just Which thank God the the way it's spread is mainly just from readers telling other readers about it. I guess it's he hasn't done a whole lot of cleaning or anything. At least it seems like he hasn't done a ton, but I don't really know. Maybe now he has, because I would think people want to interview him now. Right. Because it's wild. I mean, I read a lot of reviews of books before I get them, either in Goodreads, which you you and I both do, or just even on Amazon, because there's so many reviews. And there are so many reviews of this book.

SPEAKER_00 21:31

And I feel like it was like 43,000 or something. And it's like a 4.8. Yes, it was so high. Yeah. So And the few people, of course, I was like, who's writing a number one about this book? Because it's so good. Right. Somebody got really called out.

SPEAKER_01 21:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Or isn't religious.

SPEAKER_01 21:45

I actually would say when I read it and they said he was You read some One Stars. I did read it. I did read the One Stars. What's interesting is I feel like a lot of really popular fiction these days don't talk biblically about things. Yeah. They hint on maybe like there's a greater meaning or like hope that something happens after somebody dies. A lot of times books have, you know, death in them.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:02

And so this one at first doesn't talk very much biblical. And I was like, it's just gonna be another. It's actually so beautifully woven in, too.

SPEAKER_00 22:09

Because it's just his character. And then there's opposing ones too. But uh the other cool thing about it is that Theo really lives that out. There's the situation um at a at the church that there's this major, I don't know, distraction or something. And the way he disruption, yeah. He handles it is just beautiful, and it's just he's just so loving. But you find out he's 86, just that his life has been full of hurt like anyone else.

SPEAKER_01 22:34

And well, actually, of all the people that you meet throughout the book, because there's tons of other characters, they all have something really profound and that has hurt them and has has changed their lives for them. And I think that's just so true that everyone's carrying something like that, and you don't really know. Yeah. And the difference of there's one where they say, What if you had just looked at his face? Remember that like with the court scene, and he was like, if you had just looked at his face and like looked him in the face, then maybe you would have felt differently. And that's just so true. If we just really think of just see what people for who they are, yeah, see people for who they are. Yeah, so I've said it was a life-changing book. I just loved it. It was. Everybody reads it. I'm with you. Maybe we'll have the author on for an interview.

SPEAKER_00 23:13

We'll reach out to him.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Well, happy Fourth of July, everybody, and thanks for hanging with us this week.

SPEAKER_00 23:18

And we hope that you guys have a great weekend and Lord, help us embrace the gifts you've given us and release the habits that keep us from fully living. Teach us to rest, to play, to connect, and to notice your goodness all around us this summer. Amen. Amen.