Two Seed Lines

Today we discuss Genesis 4:19-26. 

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SPEAKER_00 0:05

Well, welcome back. We're in Genesis chapter four, and we're going to finish chapter four today, The Lord Willing. As we've already found out, we can camp out on just a few verses in the Bible and just seem like spending endless amounts of time. And I certainly don't want to wear people out. There's always so much more that can be done. But we're going to finish uh chapter four out. We're going to begin reading in verse number 19. This is speaking of um Cain's son or grandson rather, who um were following the seed line of the snake. These are men that have made the choice to live after the pattern of their grandfather Cain. And Lamak took unto him two wives. The name of the one was Ada, and the name of the other was Zillah, and Ada bare Jabal, he was the father of such that dwell in tents, and of such that have cattle. His brother's name was Jubal. He was the father of all such as handle the harp and organ. And Zillah, she also bare Tubal Cain, an instructor of every artificer in brass and iron, and the sister of Tubal Cain was Naama. And Lamk said unto his wives Ada and Zillah, hear my voice, ye wives of Lamac, hearken unto my speech, for I have slain a man to my wounding, and a young man to my hurt. If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold, truly Lammock seventy and sevenfold. I'm going to stop right there. We'll read the last two verses toward the end of today's study. But look where this line takes us. People that refuse to trust in God. Now we come to a man by the name of Lammock, who decided I can have two wives. First time that polygamy was ever introduced was right here, through this unrighteous seed line. If Cain had one, I can have two. Look here again at what he says about Cain's sin in shedding the blood of his brother. He says to his wives in verse number 23, Ada and Zillah, listen, I'm going to make a proclamation. Hear my voice, you wives of Lemmech. Listen to this speech. I killed a man who just offended me and a young man who hurt my feelings, and nobody's going to do anything about it. Why? Because if Cain received protection for what he did, I'm going to take 70 times seven protection. He's declaring his own divine protection. Think about how unrighteous that really is. God set a mark on Cain and gave him this gift of divine protection when Cain's saying, the first guy that finds me and finds out what I've done is going to kill me. That doesn't happen. And Lamek is so bold about his own actions that if murder's not wrong, I'll do it twice just to prove that it's not. Think about how far down humanity's going right here. What's your thoughts there?

SPEAKER_03 3:31

Just a quick glance. You would think humanity is doing very well, really. They're making progress in technology and industry. They're doing really good. Yeah. But there's no mention of God anywhere.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

No mention of God anywhere. That's exactly right. What man is like when he leaves God, he becomes more proud, more bold, more self-centered, self-focused.

SPEAKER_03 4:02

Yes. And then how I mean, there at the end of it, when what Lamex says, how much more uh self-centered can you be to proclaim that over your over yourself? Yeah, I will do this. I will.

SPEAKER_02 4:14

Because what was given to Cain and the divine protection was not promised to Lamex. It's not promised to Lamex. So you take something that God ordained and put that on yourself, it's impossible.

SPEAKER_03 4:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:28

Put yourself in the place of God.

SPEAKER_02 4:29

You're putting yourself in the place of God.

SPEAKER_00 4:31

Yeah, rebellion is is unbelievable. It can take you to the worst of places. And it it ends up in pointing a finger at God. I dare you. I read passages like this and it's like, where's God at? Is he gonna strike this guy?

SPEAKER_02 4:52

I often wonder in verses like this where Brett was talking of how uh human life is advancing and the the oddity that that is advancing without God, or they say it's advancing without God, but how it truly is the grace of God that it is.

SPEAKER_00 5:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:16

How many I mean it it's God's creation.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:22

And you know, just the and the the ability to learn and to to figure out things, the how the ability that God has given man, I think that's it's completely disconnected from what we're talking about, but it's such a amazing thing to me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

If you look back at time, it's really not disconnected from what we're talking about because these advancements are huge advancements as far as technology is concerned. I mean, someone decides they're gonna make an instrument to of music. Of music, yeah. Or it's the through this seed line where there's a development of weapons of war.

SPEAKER_02 6:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:02

They're metal workers, they're building their own houses, their own tents. It's learning how to be self-sufficient without God. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:14

And I I think it's just so it's so funny that man can think that anything like that is because of themselves. Yes. And forget that it all was because of the creator.

SPEAKER_00 6:27

Yeah. And for him to be so bold, like Lamick was to stand up and say, You think he was something? I'm gonna I mean, is that not the same thing that goes on right now with generations to follow when knowledge begins to be increased? It's like that was they did some pretty neat stuff back then, but look what we're gonna do. And we're gonna do this with with God on them as giving us divine protection, or be more emboldened in our sin.

SPEAKER_02 6:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:00

I mean, that seems to be the the progress, at least in our Western world, that's happened over the last, you know, 75 years. I'll do it without God. He's not gonna get me for that.

SPEAKER_02 7:13

Yeah, or some people use it and do that and put God's blessing on it and say that you know God's approval is there.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

Yeah. Yeah. And was that what he was trying to grab? God don't care what I'm doing. Look, I mean, if he really cared, he could put a stop to it. He's not going to. Yeah. What about the 70 times seven? If Cain be avenged sevenfold, which sevenfold means he had some gift of divine protection. What about the seventy times seven? It's the first time that's used in the Bible. Does that ever is used again and forgive your brother? Uh yeah. In forgiveness, which is also a gift of God. Yeah. So he's trying to use the gift of God toward an evil purpose. And then do you think it's an off-handed comment that Peter's making when he's asking about how how often shall I forgive my brother? I mean, perfect forgiveness would be seven, right?

SPEAKER_03 8:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:18

I can't help but think that some of these texts wouldn't be in the mind of Peter when Jesus says, no, it's actually 70 times seven that you need to do the same amount of vengeance that Lamak wanted for his own benefit. That's the that's the same amount of forgiveness that you need. If you really want to be someone who's used of God. And what was the question that Peter was asking about? My brother? What about this whole forgiveness thing with my brother?

unknown 8:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:50

Oh, if you want to camp out in that passage of scripture, which they didn't have chapter and verse in Jesus' day, let's run on back there to Genesis. That whole passage there is about two brothers that got at odds with one another and the fallout of the one that took the life of his brother. Let's talk about where that ended up. That ended up with some guy saying, I'm going to accept God's divine protection. I'm getting that for myself, and vengeance is going to be mine 70 times seven. And Jesus says, All right, real brothers in my kingdom, in my family, they learn forgiveness to this degree. It's not vengeance. I was just having this discussion recently about God saying, Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord. A pastor friend of mine who I've received a lot of counsel from over the years. He's such a great man of wisdom. He said he was counseling someone one time and they they were talking about, I'm going to pay them back for that. And he's like, Vengeance is God's. He was trying to get that point across. He said, Finally, I stopped him and said, Do you believe in stealing? Do you think that's wrong? And they were like, Yeah, it's wrong. You can't steal and be right with God. And he's like, Why would you steal what he said was his? You're trying to take vengeance into your own hands. The reason why man can't vindicate wrong is because they don't have perfect righteous judgment. And if you study the Bible, you'll find that they either never go too far enough or they always go too far. That's a contradiction in speech. It's either or. They're either not going far enough or they're either going way too far. Think about brothers that got in trouble. Israel's sons, two brothers took vengeance into their own hands for the sin against their sister, and they took it too far. Man has no ability to be a righteous judge. Only God does. He's the only one that can mix mercy and righteousness with the right mixture. So that's why he is the one that's supposed to repay. So in his family, vindication has to come by him. Thoughts? That's hard. I'll just have to admit, this time that we've been recording since we've been in Genesis chapter number four, there's been a lot of times I've paused and be like, hmm, this is tough. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:18

Because I that line of not going far enough, but then going too far. I mean, just our human nature, I guess. We we can't help but try. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

That's exactly right. Because it makes us feel good that we we tried.

SPEAKER_00 11:34

Yeah. Uh think about how far down humanity's stepping right here. Oh yeah. Again, it's from Adam to Cain was a huge fall. It wasn't a step down, it was a fall.

SPEAKER_02 11:47

Right.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

Here again, humanity's fallen so much further down. I go back to what I said in the last app episode. What was Eve thinking about this? Man, there's silence from Adam and Eve all through these verses where their sons are in real trouble.

SPEAKER_02 12:05

A modern saying that I thought about a couple episodes ago, actually. I've heard it many times that what parents do in moderation, their children do in excess. That's proving true in the first few chapters of the Bible.

SPEAKER_03 12:20

Cain at least feared judgment to a point, but now his descendants, they fear no judgment in their murder.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

It's are you referring to what he says about his punishment? Yeah. Yeah. It doesn't seem like Lammock has any punishment. No. No. Isn't it amazing just in a few verses how much uh information you can take in with just a very skeletal bit of words? Yeah. We're now talking about a presumably a long process of time. Several generations have passed, and the fall keeps getting faster and farther from God.

SPEAKER_02 13:01

Well, with Cain, maybe why he's saying that the punishment is more than he can bear because he he to a degree he does know what it's like to be in the presence of God. Yeah. And so then to not be, he has that, you know, I know what I was missing. Whereas Lamak seems to, he's never been in the presence of God.

SPEAKER_00 13:20

Yeah. And why? Because he's been raised in a self-sufficient place. Yeah. He'd been raised by uh generations before him that were like, I'm still not going to do it God's way. We talked about this about uh Cain being a fugitive and a vagabond where he might have to trust in God if he's wandering around. Instead, he parks in one place and builds a city and names it after his son's name. I would rather my name be on this place, this self-sufficient place. That's a long ways away from God's name being anywhere. Yeah. And who said we couldn't get anything out of a few verses in the Bible?

SPEAKER_03 13:59

And these are the type of verses right here that if you're not careful, you kind of skip over when it's all the generations. Look at what all is in here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:07

Yeah. There's a lot in here. There's a lot being said. Isn't it amazing with God's word, you can hear what the spirit has to say? That's awesome. I mean, it's the same thing that happened in Jesus' day when he is talking and they're like, why do you use parables? Because those who really want to hear what the spirit has to say, they'll hear it. They'll hear it. It's amazing. To have a relationship with God through his word is an awesome thing. I feel like I'm on repeat with that, but I get amazed every time. And you guys know the preparations that went into these episodes. We haven't talked, we've been recording one right after the other. There's a minute between. We're not talking about what we're going to encounter, it's wherever this text leads us, and we're having conversations about God speaking to us through his word, and you can hear it loud. It's awesome. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 15:02

In that I found myself since we've started this study uh thanking God for his word. I don't know that I've ever really, I mean, we've always had we've always had his word, but I've never really had a a thankfulness for it. But to get in a setting like this and just start talking about it and to feel the presence of God come in as we as we talk about his word. Um very much a thankfulness for that.

SPEAKER_00 15:33

Yeah. I don't discount anybody's uh methods of reading the word of God because I think God can use it and get glory out of any of it. But you're cheating yourself if you only do a surface-level reading of the word of God and you don't sit down and spend time in the text. I'm sorry, you're cheating yourself. And any believer in the Lord, I feel like, has a responsibility but ought to have a desire to do this. I hope and pray that whatever we're doing here will will only fuel that desire to sit down and and talk about what's really being said here. You could do this, you can repeat this in family devotions, you can repeat this with other friends in the faith. Sit down and and hear what God's saying through his word to us.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

And I think sometimes in the setting like this, just saying things that we've always thought, even though they were wrong, um, were misguided, if you will, I think there's there's something to that that helps to like get that out there to to other people, yeah, and then find out, oh, I've thought the same thing. And we don't really know why sometimes it's just kind of unconsciously what we've what we've picked up over the years, but but then kind of as you read it, you realize what's actually being said, and there's something to that.

SPEAKER_00 16:54

Yeah, there is being able to hear what's not being spoken. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Um, I think the reason why those walls are built is because we talked about this in one of our first studies around the first of the year. Just thinking that whatever there's only one way of interpretation that's right, or there's only one thing that God can be saying. I'm telling you, I've found it when you wrestle with this, it's like things keep unfolding. And if you if you read the Bible with motive to know God and to know how he reacts to humanity, you're gonna find stuff all over the place.

SPEAKER_02 17:32

Right.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

I wish I could remember now what Brother uh Russell Cheek said the other night uh about the gospels. Open any gospel, put your finger on any verse, it's gonna be talking about a man.

unknown 17:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

And that man's gonna be changing someone's life. He has a little routine, I've heard him say it several times, but oh my goodness, that's so powerful. It was. And when you read the text with that in mind, as how is God reacting to humanity? It's uh absolutely amazing.

SPEAKER_03 18:02

I think I found myself reading the text that I want to be able to read into it what you see into it or what someone else sees into it. And that's not what it's that's not what needs to happen.

SPEAKER_00 18:15

Yeah, how can I read this and understand it like brother so-and-so understands it?

SPEAKER_03 18:20

Yeah, I want to see exactly what he's seen. That that tells me I'm reading it correctly.

SPEAKER_00 18:24

Yeah, but the beauty of it is to be able to all three of us have saw different things out of this very passage that is what you've already said in our minds, kind of one of these rush over passages.

SPEAKER_03 18:37

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

And we've all heard God's voice in it.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

It's amazing. I think that's the most amazing part is God is telling us in these in these first four chapters, God is telling us who he is. And he's telling his people, this is who I am. Yeah. And you know, we find ourselves sometimes feeling so disconnected or not knowing God. But how many just life situations have we talked about already in these first four chapters? Yeah. Applicable to today's time, and it's God showing us who he really is.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

His revelation of himself over time to humans is a manifold revelation. So, in other words, what Adam knew about God, uh, that's probably not a fair comparison. What Abraham knew about God was one thing. Yeah, what Moses knew about God was another thing, right? But built off of the first thing, sure. Then what Israel knew about God through the law, through a relationship in the land of Canaan, was an unfolding revelation. But none of that took away from what Abraham knew. No. Then by the time you get to Christ, oh my word, it's like it just keeps unfolding. And if that's his nature in these throughout these thousands of years of time, what makes us think that in the age to come, on the heavenly side, like Paul would say, that in the ages to come he might reveal to us the the uh the riches of his grace. If that's the way he reveals himself to humans on this side, on the other side, in the age to come, it's gonna be a continual unfolding revelation. Compounds. Yeah. Where we're in bodies that can handle that. Yeah. Yeah, it's it's awesome. Well, we're in a very sad portion of scripture, and we've already skipped over to what's ahead for all of us that believe in Christ. But uh, the last two verses of this chapter are bookends to the chapter itself. As I said, if Adam and Eve saw the fallout of what's happened with Cain and Abel, and Abel was the righteous one, and the righteous one dies, it's all hopeless, right?

SPEAKER_02 20:52

Seems like it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:54

Is that not the storyline of the scripture? Righteous one dies, the righteous one suffers and sheds his blood and dies, and it's all hopeless, right? It would seem that way, except God always has an answer. And Adam knew his wife again, and she bare a son and called his name Seth. For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew. He's given me a substitute for Abel. There's a substitute. He's in the stead of. For the one that's gone, for the one that sinned.

SPEAKER_02 21:46

Oh, we s I mean we see it in the Old Testament with animal sacrifice for the blood of animals.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Yeah. And then Christ becomes our substitute. Yes. Here again, on crucifixion day. It would be that that's three days, but it's it's like you're sitting in those three days through these verses through chapter four, and Adam and Eve's wondering what in the world, what in the world can be done?

SPEAKER_03 22:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:12

How else do you think that Jesus could go back through the scriptures with those two on the road to Emmaus and beginning at Moses, which is the law? Right. First five books, and all the prophets, he expounded unto them the things in the scriptures concerning himself. Do you think that he put his finger on something like this? Don't you remember when it was all hopeless and it looked like the entire world had gone to the seed of the serpent, that God raised up another one?

unknown 22:43

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

The Lord hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew, and to Seth, to him also there was born a son, and he called his name Enos. Then began men to call upon the name of the Lord. Wow. These other guys are using God's name in vain. He'll give me protection. I'll take two wives. I'll kill two people. I'll get God's divine protection, vengeance, 70 times seven. And then all of a sudden the substitute comes in, and that substitute is someone who his seed line begins to call upon the name of the Lord. And it comes through the one that God appointed. God has given me this one. Not nothing that I've done. Imagine the hope that comes inside of Eve now. What's your thoughts?

SPEAKER_02 23:39

I think it's just something that I always have to tell myself for Cain and his descendants. It didn't have to be that way.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Right. That's exactly right. It did not have to be that way. And a little spoiler alert, even men in Seth's line, some of them chose not. Sure. It's all about a choice, whether you're going to be the seed of the serpent or the seed of the woman. It comes down to your choice, whether you're going to trust in God. But right here, seems like we got a lot of hope here at the end of the chapter. Right. We're doing good again.

SPEAKER_03 24:16

At what point time-wise, I wonder when this when Seth was born throughout all of all of this. Of Cain's line. Yeah, where where it's going, how the lines are continuing. How far down had the gener you know the generations fallen? Yeah. How far down were they when they see before Seth was born?

SPEAKER_00 24:40

Yeah. Yeah, it's a good question. It doesn't have to be like we read it like it's all chronological. Chronological. Yeah. But you know, there could be an overlap of both. I'm sure there is. Like I said, there's always more that we could do. And we didn't answer that question before we got started. That's a good question, though. Your closing thoughts?

SPEAKER_02 25:04

It's a daily choice, what seed line we are.

SPEAKER_00 25:08

Very true. Yeah, it is. Yep. And God doesn't take that choice away once we trust in his son. That's right. He didn't do it for Adam. He didn't do it for Cain. He's not going to do it for us. That's pretty sobering, isn't it? It is. That's the reason why Paul could say things like this. I fear less while I've preached to others, I myself become a castaway. Yes. Like I count not myself to have apprehended. There's times when you listen to him, it's like, man, we can do this. And then other times we're like, you know what? Let's not get too too braggadocious. Yeah. Absolutely. It's a daily walk. Yeah. What a challenge. Man, I really appreciate the discussion. I appreciate y'all's input. It's helped me. It really has. And I appreciate I appreciate the encounter with God. Yes. It's awesome. We'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Um this narrow road I've been traveling, and it gives me a purpose for my life. Jesus is my treasure. He's the reason that I'm still living. He's gonna be my reason. When I die, he's gonna be my reason. When I die